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General: MMOGCharts Update
Dana
Member Posts: 2,415
Bruce "SirBruce" Woodcock has updated his MMORPG subscription tracking site MMOGCharts.com. The most interesting news to come from this is that his first estimate of NCSoft's Auto Assault places the game just over 10,000 subscribers, hardly what NCSoft would have been hoping for.
| Version 21.0 is now available! This version has updated subscriber numbers for several games, most notably World of Warcraft, several of SOEs titles, and the recently launched Auto Assault. Ive also expanded the mid-range chart a bit; eventually Im going to have to implement a dynamic graphing system. |
You can check out the full charts over at MMOGCharts.com.
Dana Massey
Formerly of MMORPG.com
Currently Lead Designer for Bit Trap Studios
Comments
I wish you guys wouldn't post when he updates.
The 'info' he provides is speculative at best!
It does seem like alot of organizations recognize what he is doing. Therefore I do take the numbers he puts out as a good guage of how each of the games is doing (he does also specifies when data is missing and/or to the creditbility of his sources).
However, you are welcome to prove otherwise, i'd be interested to see the arguments against his numbers.
Think of it like polling data. Should the media not report polls because technically they're not always accurate?
Dana Massey
Formerly of MMORPG.com
Currently Lead Designer for Bit Trap Studios
You guys are set in your ways, and I'll respect that.
I'm not so easily convinced.
Take care
Dana Massey
Formerly of MMORPG.com
Currently Lead Designer for Bit Trap Studios
Until the guy can provide factual data to backup his claims he is no better than any other blogger out there.
You guys might know the guy but anyone of us could make a "best guess" on any of these numbers.
http://www.greycouncil.org/
Until the guy can provide factual data to backup his claims he is no better than any other blogger out there.
You guys might know the guy but anyone of us could make a "best guess" on any of these numbers.
FFS the guy is not making 'Best Guesses'. There is a reason he has ratings on the accuracy of his numbers.
From his FAQ:
This indicates that the vast majority of the data points shown come from either
official announcements by the companies involved or reliable inside
sources. The numbers can be considered
reliable, although a few of the data points may be incorrect.
B –
This indicates that while some of the data points shown may be official, a
substantial number come from press articles, unproven inside sources, or other
indirect means. The numbers may not be
exact for the MMOG in question, but are certainly in the ballpark.
C –
D – ThisThis indicates that most or all of the data points provided are merely industry
“best guesses” or are otherwise questionable.
Usually, I will not chart MMOGs that rate C or lower. Their numbers should be taken with a large
grain of salt.
indicates that no data is available for this game at this time, but I expect to
get something chart-worthy on it in the future.
If you don't agree with his numbers that's fine, but if you're only supporting evidence against his numbers is that you don't think they are accurate, then you really don't have a leg to stand on.
It's on the internet, it must be true! -- Craig Ferguson
When he posts his data, where it came from with ways to back up the claims, not just numbers, I'll put more stock in his charts.
http://www.greycouncil.org/
It's on the internet, it must be true! -- Craig Ferguson
When he posts his data, where it came from with ways to back up the claims, not just numbers, I'll put more stock in his charts.
did you not see that?
his numbers are as close to the real deal we will get.
Until I see official numbers from the different game companies, I will not believe anything about subscription-numbers, and ESPECIALLY not from his site.
Of course, people are free to mean what they want on this issue.
It's on the internet, it must be true! -- Craig Ferguson
When he posts his data, where it came from with ways to back up the claims, not just numbers, I'll put more stock in his charts.
Yes and how many of the games were rated C for accuracy? Exactly 2, DAoC and SWG for the exact reason that he can't get better figures. It also states above that he doesn't usually list games with a rating of C or lower BECAUSE the information is too sparse. Both of the games on there are only listed because up until now he was getting better info. You'd know that if you actually took the time to read the analysis section (the whole 5 minutes that would take), but we all know you have no intention of doing that, it's so much easier to sound convincing when you don't know wtf you are talking about.
You'd also see that he has an excel sheet available for download that contains all of the numerical data that he's recieved and includes all of the formula's that make up the graphs.
He is not some joe blow off the street, developers in the MMO industry DO look at and use the info that he has gathered and it's the ONLY information available to the general public in regards the state of the industry.
Whoo SOE games EQ2 and SWG has the same market share %1,4. I played the both , you all know the story of SWG , one is wrong in my opinion. I know more then 10 guilds gived a try to EQ2 after NGE. I dont play both of the games right now. SO I cant say anything whats going on over there.
But still under this circumstances, its really hard to belive both games has the same amount of players.
Cheers
EVERYONE on the internet is 'just joe blow off the street. The fact is, if he does research - even just as a hobby - then he knows more than you or I.
The fact that it's on the internet doesn't mean it's not true.
So what you're saying is that you won't believe sources who DON'T have a vested interest in game companies, and you're more than prepared to believe a source that DOES have a vested interest in hyping its figures.
Hmmm. I'll bet you're a sucker for overhyped Hollywood blockbusters too. After all, if it gets lots of commercial screentime it must be good, right? The critics? What do they know!
Yeah, right.
There's no reason to add access pass numbers NOR the free trials.
Shayde - SWG (dead)
Proud member of the Cabal.
It sounds great, so great in fact, I pitty those who canceled
I don't like it when you say things. - A Vanguard fan who does too.
09f911029d74e35bd84156c5635688c0
As long as I have a group of people to play with and I enjoy the game that's good enough for me.
I'm a CoXer FYI, I also subscribe to autoassault, but I may cancel as I don't play often. If NC would give discounts t omultiple game subscribers I might keep on paying.
Dana Massey
Formerly of MMORPG.com
Currently Lead Designer for Bit Trap Studios
Yea Bruce is waay of on the SOE numbers. By doing /whos on some of the low pop servers in EQ2 you know there are alot more people on those servers than the SWG servers. Considering that SOE does not release subscriber numbers like.....ever. I'm not surprised that his info on those games are f'ed. Also wow is only like 100k from reaching 7mil. Though, I think Blizzard is more open with their numbers. I also don't think that Square's numbers have only dropped 150K Since the peak of FFXI.....I'm going to be honest. Alot of those numbers are....alright guesses, some are factual i'm sure. It's definately a site you need to read, and not just look at the charts, because honeslty the information on the charts is really misleading to anyone that's too lazy to read the site.
Another thing, about 4 or 5 months ago SOE had a post on their launcher that EQ2 had Reached 300K Subscribers. That number isn't even on the charts. Also Sirbruce is very bias against games he doesn't like. So i don't really take the chart seriously.
You know the thing is here I don't play WoW but I do have active accounts in CoX and EQ (untill they both run out next summer as I get ready for DC online heroes and STO) and there are a crapload of people playing CoX from what I can see, and last time I logged onto EQ (early last week) there are a crapload of people on the preogressive servers, the live server I have all my toons on over there is noticeably depleted.
Here's a thought too btw, Someone mentioned same numbers for EQ and SWG (unless I got that jumbled, it's early) keep in mind there's station pass for SoE.
Now I have heard FFXI numbers have rissen from alot of friends playing it via the Xbox360 (an I dea I am toying with still to this day to get away from the cpu and endles upgrades)
I have my doubts as to the accuracy of the charts.
SWG has 200k subscribers? Riiiiiight.
SWG has more subscirbers than CoX? Again, I find that very hard to believe as there are a lot of people playing CoX right now (least on my server). I work late so when I play is definately offpeak times, yet never have problems finding people online to team with.
I remember an article I read a while back that said SOE inflates its subscriber numbers to make their games look more prosperous. Basically, anyone who subscribed at any time is still being counted as "a subscriber". So, I left EQ shortly after Planes of Power, but they are still counting me as A Subscriber because well I *did* subscribe at one point I guess....
The chart also shows EQ1 having vastly higher subscribers than the newer games, which can't be right since EQ1 had to MERGE servers in 2005. You do not do that if you have 500k subscribers, you do that when a server is a barren wasteland and you have players screaming for someone, ANYONE, to group with.
*Edited for typos*
We provide Bruce regularly with numbers ourselves for EVE and I know a number of other developers that supply him directly. A lot of people in the industry have followed his numbers through the years and he's about the best baseline you can get.
If you read through all his FAQ and background data you will see all the caveats, but as long as you are aware of those and don't simply look at the bare numbers in the graphs, you'll have something adequately accurate compared to what else is out there. Nobody is claiming it's accurate, but it's far from guesstimates.
Double post :P
I just find it funny how he does not represent Lineage 1 or 2 in the Asian market. And if this charts hold true didn't NCsoft also claim 14 mil Subscribers world wide for Lineage backs that does not show up on his time line.
So in other words who really knows!