Originally posted by fariq Bah....I will never join you rebel scum
Rofl stay on target --
______________________________ I usually picture the Career builder commercial with the room full of monkeys and upside down sales chart when thinking about the SOE/SWG decision making process..... SOE's John Blakely and Todd Fiala issued a warning: "Don't make our mistakes." Ref NGE Winner of the worst MMOS goes to.... the NGE and SWG..!!! http://www.mmorpg.com/showFeature.cfm?loadFeature=1034&bhcp=1
Originally posted by kyme Originally posted by Xcathdra Originally posted by kyme 30 mins into the episode 44 here. These guys are LOSERS and need to shut it! "Blah, Blah, Blah .... I can't believe there was lag, I can't believe they lied to us." These guys are clueless freak scares. Don't bother with this BULLSHIT!
Well you could jsut direct your comments to Fariq...
It is more of a public service announcement. Do not waste your time on this Fan-boi BULLSHIT!
Do not be mistaken, these guys are undecidedly pro-NGE!
Im sorry I must correct you on this--- if this was the case no way in Hell would they ask myself to talk on the show.
I am the farthest from anything easy in the game and the NGE -- crap I was banned because of it. So your statement is flawed.
I think at this point -- hearing peoples thoughts is the ONLY way this can get resolved.
______________________________ I usually picture the Career builder commercial with the room full of monkeys and upside down sales chart when thinking about the SOE/SWG decision making process..... SOE's John Blakely and Todd Fiala issued a warning: "Don't make our mistakes." Ref NGE Winner of the worst MMOS goes to.... the NGE and SWG..!!! http://www.mmorpg.com/showFeature.cfm?loadFeature=1034&bhcp=1
Originally posted by MX13 Originally posted by Shayde Originally posted by fariq We're so Pro-NGE we spent the first 30 minutes bitching about Restuss.
Restuss was just the latest symptom of the terminal disease we call the nge.
So really, at this point, bitching about Restuss is for us, finally having Robert Downey Jr. bitch that drugs are not living up to his expectations.
Wow, WAE.... Worst Analogy Ever
You usually have good ones, and even a few classics, but that was just horrid. We expect more from you. Foreshame, foreshame.... /shakesHead
If Robert Downey Jr. is wrong, I don't wanna be right!
Shayde - SWG (dead) Proud member of the Cabal.
It sounds great, so great in fact, I pitty those who canceled - Some deluded SWG fanboi who pities me. I don't like it when you say things. - A Vanguard fan who does too. 09f911029d74e35bd84156c5635688c0
Originally posted by kyme Originally posted by Xcathdra Originally posted by kyme 30 mins into the episode 44 here. These guys are LOSERS and need to shut it! "Blah, Blah, Blah .... I can't believe there was lag, I can't believe they lied to us." These guys are clueless freak scares. Don't bother with this BULLSHIT!
Well you could jsut direct your comments to Fariq...
It is more of a public service announcement. Do not waste your time on this Fan-boi BULLSHIT!
Do not be mistaken, these guys are undecidedly pro-NGE!
Dude you are talking to one of them and to shallow to even realize that . LMAO
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Originally posted by Shayde Originally posted by MX13 Originally posted by Shayde Originally posted by fariq We're so Pro-NGE we spent the first 30 minutes bitching about Restuss.
Restuss was just the latest symptom of the terminal disease we call the nge.
So really, at this point, bitching about Restuss is for us, finally having Robert Downey Jr. bitch that drugs are not living up to his expectations.
Wow, WAE.... Worst Analogy Ever
You usually have good ones, and even a few classics, but that was just horrid. We expect more from you. Foreshame, foreshame.... /shakesHead
If Robert Downey Jr. is wrong, I don't wanna be right!
You also realize we all think you look like Smed now...
I'll start my own SWG... with Black Jack... and Hookers!!!
Originally posted by Bob_Blawblaw It is interesting to hear fanbois wake up from their SOE induced stupor. Great quote: "A year ago, the future was coated in candy, now it's covered in shit!"
Yep -- but I still feel sorry for the people paying them, toughing it out or accepting the NGE for what it is. This is no different then accepting a 3 legged race horse that once had 4.
Some are adults, some are people I know that hate admiting it. When you ask them they almost get mad they are paying them let alone being asked why. Sooner or later the sub-par programing and results will make people quit to a level SOE has got to shut down some servers or somthing.
Right now what you see is people trying to defend what is left -- not what is coming or could be. Right now I have now seen new Jedi try to hold onto thier free Jedi they got, they know the NGE is what got them the Jedi and they do not want to lose all the time (while very little it is) they have had one. At least now they may feel just a hint of what long time Jedi felt when losing a hard earned one vs one for free even.
So many people have built up ONCE again what they could in this version of the game, only this time it is far far worse then ever and some of them are wise to know that change is coming and the chance to lose it all again or all of it period is almost embarassing.
If you ask some of the fans why they still play, it by all means is not the gameplay itself. Its the name and people... I am sorry but if that is what keeps people in a game then SOE has messed up on a large scale.
At one time people were proud to be in the game -- now, people just do not talk about it in other games. I did in COV and WoW --- Oh my.... your best not telling anyone you played the game.
______________________________ I usually picture the Career builder commercial with the room full of monkeys and upside down sales chart when thinking about the SOE/SWG decision making process..... SOE's John Blakely and Todd Fiala issued a warning: "Don't make our mistakes." Ref NGE Winner of the worst MMOS goes to.... the NGE and SWG..!!! http://www.mmorpg.com/showFeature.cfm?loadFeature=1034&bhcp=1
could you share with us ,if you have the time, on what you WANT swg to be like. I mean, what combat system, skill vs level, crafting..ect would you like to be in swg. Maybe if people could understand what exactly your vision is for swg they would know where you stood. Ive listened to almost every show..some great some not, but one thing for certain is the devs or management lends an ear to what you guys say. It would be benenficial in my opinion to share 'your' swg dream so players wouldnt be calling you fanbois or mocking you, because we all share a swg dream, and we could say "oh, he likes that part of the NGE", cause thats his ultimate swg mmo dream, not because your a fainboi ect.. P.S. you should not be defending the douchebag comment. It was wrong and you know it regardless of the circumstances. I hope you can understand why. Good luck in the future and i will be listening:)
Wow....what do I want SWG to be?
Crafting - I would like that split and would like crafters to be able to choose the two crafting professions they would like to be. I've also toyed with the idea of crafting being a seconday skill set (or points) that a combat character could choose to go into. I like the Pre-CU era of beign able to be a Master Architech and Master TKA and being proficient enought in PVE and PVP to go out and fight. Sure you were not as effective as a double combat master but you could hang. You could give the people who choose to be pure crafters a bonus by say giving them the Merchant and Artisan skills that a combat person could not learn. Of course crafted items would be better then anything you could loot (whether it was the ability to make them higher damage or for the crafter to apply stat bonuses)
Entertainers - I think BF was the best thing to get people to interact with Entertainers. I also like the buffs that were added to the Entertainer profession during the CU. Now from some of the Entertainers I've talked to they did not BF. I thought that players resented them for having to get their BF healed. They would have perfered to have players come to Entertainers for bonuses not to heal necassry things like BF. Maybe combining the two would work.
Combat/Professions - Skill wheels suck. I want trees back. I even talked to one of the devs from LA and told him that I think there may have been less resistance to the NGE (I know wishfull thinking) if instead of skill wheels for the professions they would have put in place trees and gave players more choice in leveling up their toons. If I am a spy I should be able to pick if I want to level up in my stealth branch or if I want to work on leveling up my main attack. Maybe the Expertise tree will give us a little of that feel back. I do understand a bit about why they condensed the professions but I think I would have liked for them to get away from the "Iconic" professions and set it up a bit more like say you Master Marksman and from there you could specialize in Pistols, Rifleman, or Carbines. Same thing with Brawler and moving on to spcialize in TKA, Swords, or Pikeman. Maybe those could have been the expertise trees for say a Brawler profession? I'm really stuck on the combat style. If the game could handle it I think a FPS style combat system could be a lot of fun. Unfortunatly I do no think it can. Pre-CU combat was a friggin joke with buffs and Composite armor and while I liked CU combat I got a little bored. I think a hybred of the three would work the best. Bring the difficulty level of the most current NGE system and mix it with an easier to control combat (and for Christ sakes slow down the speed of the NPC's)
I just got off of work a few minutes ago and need a nap so sorry if this does not make sense. I reserve the right to add or change anything in this after I wake up
I would also like to know what your guys Ultimate SWG game would be like.
thanks for taking the time to post that. Doesnt sound much different than many people i know..execpt for the FPS style combat. To me the perfect starwars MMO would have to be Starwars..regardless of balance, regardless of carebears, regardless of hardcore power gamers. That would have to be the starting point, and the 'unbreakable rule'. If its not like that In starwars..its not like that in the game. From there i would keep all the little mini games that were there in pre-cu..crafting, Ch, bio, entertainer, ect.. Player run economy as it was pre-cu, and combat that looked as cool as pre-cu at least. I could go on and on, but i wont hehe.
See you in the dream.. The Fires from heaven, now as cold as ice. A rapid ascension tolls a heavy price.
I would also like to know what your guys Ultimate SWG game would be like.
I'll accept that challenge. Check back here regularly, this will take a few Edit Stages.
First, I will say I agree with you that a comination of all 3 systems would make the best game, however, in the case of the CU & the NGE I would say thier Concepts are valid, but not those Concepts Iplimintation. In other words, in theory the CU & NGE were good concpets, but they were absolute failures of execution by SOE. I will also add the NGE in it entirety was a mistake to even attempt for reason we all know only too well now.
What I will cover in this post:
Professions / Skills
Combat Style
Armor / Weapons
Non-Combat Rolls
GCW
Professions / Skills
Quite honestly, thses systems have been SWG's greatest strength as well as it's greatest weakness. The concept of the Pre-CU professions system was the best of them all in that it allow players to create their own identity, and change over time. However, they also created SWG Greatest Foe... Stacking Wars.
Quite honestly, the problem came from one key failure in the SWG Skill System. Skills are not Professions. What do I mean? Shooting a Rifle is a Skill, not a Profession. By treating Skills & Professions the same, it allowed players to combine Skills in unintended ways to create overpowered "Stacked" Templates. This was never the Dev's intention for this system, and it was a problem that was only fixable by "Capping" Stats, which in itself only continues the FotM Template race until everything is capped.
So what is the solution? Split Professions & Skills. Simply put, Bounty Hunting is a Profession, not shooting a Carbine while you're Bounty Hunting.
Splitting Professions & Skills would require creating Skill Points as well as Professions Points, using the old Trees.
To stop Stacking Wars, Professions would contain General Bonuses & the Skills would only have Skill Specific Bonuses. For eample:
The Bounty Hunter Profession may have +50 GRA/+50 GRS/+25GMA/+25GMS
The Rifles Skill may have +50 RA/+50RS
Therefore, a Bounty Hunter with the Rifles Skill could have +100 Speed & Acc with a Rifle, but only +50 with a Pistol. Using this type of system would turn the balancing focus to the Combat/Adventure Professions, which are much easier to balance against eachother than balancing ALL of the combinations of the Pre-CU system.
Certian Bonuses, like the Combat Medic Profession & the Medic Skill would not stack, allowing players to pick up a simple Skill without creating a Stacking War requiring the combo of the 2 to compete.
Here's how I view what the Professions & Skills should have been:
Professions- Ideally, you would recieve enough Professions Points to master 1 Profession.
Combat Adventure Focused:
Bounty Hunter
Content- PVP Hunting
Bonus Focus- Ranged Weapons
Faction Variations & Titles:
Rebel- Republic Marshal
Imperial- Imperial Inquisitor
Underworld- Man Hunter
Commando
Content- GCW
Bonus Focus- Ranged & Melee
Faction Variations & Titles:
Rebel- Republic Commando
Imperial- Storm Commando
Underworld- Hitman
Combat Engineer
Content- GCW
Bonus Focus- Special & Heavy Weapons
Trooper
Content- GCW
Bonus Focus- Ranged Weapons & Special Tactics
Faction Variations & Titles:
Rebel- Republic Tooper
Imperial- Stormtooper
Underworld- Mercenary
Sentinel (Melee Focused)
Content- Melee Combat
Bonus Focus- Melee Combat
Faction Variations & Titles:
Rebel- Republic Guard
Imperial- Imperial Guard
Underworld- Gladiator
Combat Medic
Content- GCW
Bonus Focus- Medical Use
Smuggler
Content- Smuggling
Bonus Focus- Tricks & Evasion
Faction Variations & Titles:
Rebel- Alliance Smuggler
Imperial-
Underworld- Gun Runner
Ranger
Content- Wilderness Adventuring
Bonus Focus- Wilderness Skills
Spec Op's
Content- Stealth & Evasion
Bonus Focus- Stealth & Evasion
Faction Variations & Titles:
Rebel- Alliance Operative
Imperial- Imperial Shadow
Underworld- Assasin
Creature Handler
Content- Creature Taming & Training
Bonus Focus- Creature Taming & Training
Non-Combat Focused:
Doctor (this includes BE)
Content- Medical Crafting, Bio-Engineering & Cybernetics
Bonus Focus- Medical Crafting, Bio-Engineering & Cybernetics
Merchant
Content- Crafting & Selling
Bonus Focus- Crafting & Selling
Entertainer
Content- Entertaining
Bonus Focus- Entertaining
Skills- Ideally, you would recieve enough Skill Points to Master 3 Skills.
Combat/Adventure Focused:
Pistols
Carbines
Rifles
Unarmed
Fencing
Swordsmanship
Pikes
Ranged Combat Tactics
Medic (Does not Stack with Doctor or Combat Medic)
Scout (Does not stack with Ranger)
Non-Combat Focused
Dancer
Musician
Image Designer
Armorsmith
Melee Weaponsmith
Ranged Weaponsmith
Droid Engineer
Mechanic- Vehical Focused
Engineer- Device Focused
Tailor
Jeweler
Spice Maker
Chef
Slicer- Slicing Focused
Architect
Shipwright
Businessman (a lesser Merchant)
Miner
Farmer
Politician
Spy (undercover informant)
OK, Breaktime...
I'll start my own SWG... with Black Jack... and Hookers!!!
Originally posted by MX13 Originally posted by fariq
I would also like to know what your guys Ultimate SWG game would be like.
I'll accept that challenge. Check back here regularly, this will take a few Edit Stages.
First, I will say I agree with you that a comination of all 3 systems would make the best game, however, in the case of the CU & the NGE I would say thier Concepts are valid, but not those Concepts Iplimintation. In other words, in theory the CU & NGE were good concpets, but they were absolute failures of execution by SOE.
What I will cover in this post:
Professions / Skills
Combat Style
Armor / Weapons
Bob-Combat Rolls
GCW
Professions / Skills
Quite honestly, thses systems have been SWG's greatest strength as well as it's greatest weakness. The concept of the Pre-CU professions system was the best of them all in that it allow players to create their own identity, and change over time. However, they also created SWG Greatest Foe... Stacking Wars.
kyme, a server with no upgrades, or enhancements over time will die. And to limit the access to the server is just plan wrong.
I also will share my vision of SWG with you guys, I have posted it on both the O-boards as well as on the TGR forums, as well as on the air on a number of occasions.
MY SWG:
I for one have always liked how skills are handled in EVE, everyone truly had a unique character based on their own playstyle, I was a dabler in pre-cu swg and while I am venomously against the non-combat professions becoming secondary professions, I do like how one poster here put it, split the professions from the skills, the skill pie has to be one of the worst in the industry, if not I hate to see what is.
I would also love to see a return of BF, I didnt mind it at all, but in defence of the entertainer profession I have to say this: give the poor souls complete songs to play, give them the option to make or remix songs as they get better in certain skills. I playede an entertainer for a short while pre-cu and I was driven almost batty witrh the same nine notes over and over again, the specials only remixed in three or four at most, not enough.
As for my beloved crafting profession, I have to say we need a return of being able to better the stats on what we craft and a moveing away from the dependence on loot, I dont mind quest rewards or loot from tough npcs, that makes going out and finding these guys worthwhile. But what we have now in ridiculous. I would also love to see a return to the creature harvest radial, this was put in place because before creatures were droping guns and other non-creature items, this also gave the scout a porpose in the game since they were the only ones who could harvest creatures. Now I got a ton of next to useless hides and bone and meat in some of my alts on my main server as well as other servers I "sometimes" play . I would also love to see a return of experimation XP, before the more complex the item was the more Xp it was worth. It made grinding the artisan profession interesting, and it gave the player a chance to see some kind of profit on items they crafted while grinding instead of just hitting the practice button.
With Space I dont see much wrong with it, except for escort missions, but who honestly likes those kind of missions lol? I do like how they have mining in space now, with the threat of pirates poping in it gives the player a distraction while sitting there poping asteroids.
Another option I loved pre-cu was the ability of players training other players, I helped out many new players in this area. I truely miss this option almost as much as the creatue radial and BF.
As with the combat I dont have enough knowlege in this area to really comment on it, but I do like the fact that the DEVs have brought back prone nd kneel, it may not effect combat much ( I hope they change that fact) but it does add a level of fun back into combat for me.
could you share with us ,if you have the time, on what you WANT swg to be like. I mean, what combat system, skill vs level, crafting..ect would you like to be in swg. Maybe if people could understand what exactly your vision is for swg they would know where you stood. Ive listened to almost every show..some great some not, but one thing for certain is the devs or management lends an ear to what you guys say. It would be benenficial in my opinion to share 'your' swg dream so players wouldnt be calling you fanbois or mocking you, because we all share a swg dream, and we could say "oh, he likes that part of the NGE", cause thats his ultimate swg mmo dream, not because your a fainboi ect.. P.S. you should not be defending the douchebag comment. It was wrong and you know it regardless of the circumstances. I hope you can understand why. Good luck in the future and i will be listening:)
Wow....what do I want SWG to be?
Crafting - I would like that split and would like crafters to be able to choose the two crafting professions they would like to be. I've also toyed with the idea of crafting being a seconday skill set (or points) that a combat character could choose to go into. I like the Pre-CU era of beign able to be a Master Architech and Master TKA and being proficient enought in PVE and PVP to go out and fight. Sure you were not as effective as a double combat master but you could hang. You could give the people who choose to be pure crafters a bonus by say giving them the Merchant and Artisan skills that a combat person could not learn. Of course crafted items would be better then anything you could loot (whether it was the ability to make them higher damage or for the crafter to apply stat bonuses)
We had more of this in the pre-cu era -- they fucked up and took out one of the best crafting games I have ever seen in any game going back to my Atari 2600 days -- Ti99 and so on. SO (Pre-CU for the win to get this back AS A STARTING POINT) 1.
Entertainers - I think BF was the best thing to get people to interact with Entertainers. I also like the buffs that were added to the Entertainer profession during the CU. Now from some of the Entertainers I've talked to they did not BF. I thought that players resented them for having to get their BF healed. They would have perfered to have players come to Entertainers for bonuses not to heal necassry things like BF. Maybe combining the two would work.
BF in hindsight and known to us was very very important for the MMO, need and interdependency for others. This was a social aspect of the game you had to enjoy or at least use. Most of us had fun with it and made it part of the planning in combat and casual use of PvE as well. The buffs came after but were nice in thier own way -- again a social aspect of the experience. (SO ONCE AGAIN Pre-CU for the win and sad that we have to ask to be social again as a NEED factor in a MMO but we do.)
Combat/Professions - Skill wheels suck. I want trees back. I even talked to one of the devs from LA and told him that I think there may have been less resistance to the NGE (I know wishfull thinking) if instead of skill wheels for the professions they would have put in place trees and gave players more choice in leveling up their toons. If I am a spy I should be able to pick if I want to level up in my stealth branch or if I want to work on leveling up my main attack. Maybe the Expertise tree will give us a little of that feel back. I do understand a bit about why they condensed the professions but I think I would have liked for them to get away from the "Iconic" professions and set it up a bit more like say you Master Marksman and from there you could specialize in Pistols, Rifleman, or Carbines. Same thing with Brawler and moving on to spcialize in TKA, Swords, or Pikeman. Maybe those could have been the expertise trees for say a Brawler profession? I'm really stuck on the combat style. If the game could handle it I think a FPS style combat system could be a lot of fun. Unfortunatly I do no think it can. Pre-CU combat was a friggin joke with buffs and Composite armor and while I liked CU combat I got a little bored. I think a hybred of the three would work the best. Bring the difficulty level of the most current NGE system and mix it with an easier to control combat (and for Christ sakes slow down the speed of the NPC's)
Well I almost do not need to say this but once again Pre-CU for the win.. with fixes..AT LEAST THE PRE-CU was a starting point and the CU DID cure some of this -- I hated the UI in the CU , so if they did some work to fix this and leave the core changes alone, such as everything from TRAINING TO GET A SKILL BASED ON POINTS (Hmmmmmmmm like WE ONCE HAD!)... and made it a option to be social and ask to be trained or the option of paying a trainer LIKE WE HAD ONCE BEFORE -- simple things like this added to the game and MADE you earn a class, Sure there was some stupid stacking issues BUT FREAKING HELL look at the issues now???? What we thought was bad is nothing compared to this mess. So, once again -- I agree with you... So far what you asked for is somthing we ALREADY HAD and could have been built on, I am glad to see your input on the starting point.
Also note: This engine and game does not support the FPS crap, its a waste and not a MMO feel to it, speed is not the key -- looking and feeling REAL is, bring back the SIM combat more so then this Benny Hill crap. Fix Buffs and some balance issues that are present for sure.
ALSO go back to old school Jedi -- risk vs reward, make it hard and then make it harder -- not easier. What should have happend is no holos ever --- when we unlocked it should have stayed hard and risky making us rare.
Again the point is this, We had a better foundation then we do now and just about everyone can now see it. Or worse, it was ok -- BUT the NGE is SOOO bad that we would rather have the "OK" system in place lol.
I just got off of work a few minutes ago and need a nap so sorry if this does not make sense. I reserve the right to add or change anything in this after I wake up
I would also like to know what your guys Ultimate SWG game would be like.
Well its good to see your not far off from what we once had already as a foundation.
Too bad you could not have told this to Grants face at the Indy summit. He may have actually heard you.
I swear I just wanted to sit down there and drill him of how bad he fucked this up.
______________________________ I usually picture the Career builder commercial with the room full of monkeys and upside down sales chart when thinking about the SOE/SWG decision making process..... SOE's John Blakely and Todd Fiala issued a warning: "Don't make our mistakes." Ref NGE Winner of the worst MMOS goes to.... the NGE and SWG..!!! http://www.mmorpg.com/showFeature.cfm?loadFeature=1034&bhcp=1
Originally posted by MX13 Originally posted by Shayde Originally posted by MX13 Originally posted by Shayde Originally posted by fariq We're so Pro-NGE we spent the first 30 minutes bitching about Restuss.
Restuss was just the latest symptom of the terminal disease we call the nge.
So really, at this point, bitching about Restuss is for us, finally having Robert Downey Jr. bitch that drugs are not living up to his expectations.
Wow, WAE.... Worst Analogy Ever
You usually have good ones, and even a few classics, but that was just horrid. We expect more from you. Foreshame, foreshame.... /shakesHead
If Robert Downey Jr. is wrong, I don't wanna be right!
You also realize we all think you look like Smed now...
Now if only I COULD look like Smed.. I'd head to Austin and say to everyone "We're rolling it all back.. nge be damned!!!" while the real smed is in a pit in my basement getting barked at by a poodle.
Shayde - SWG (dead) Proud member of the Cabal.
It sounds great, so great in fact, I pitty those who canceled - Some deluded SWG fanboi who pities me. I don't like it when you say things. - A Vanguard fan who does too. 09f911029d74e35bd84156c5635688c0
i used to love to sit and craft on my alt while listening to podcast by Yivvits & MrBubble. but they too were way too lenient on SOE after the NGE. if you have a public forum, your voice might actually count for something. and i always felt it was irresponsible of them to not call SOE out for their bullshit.
the galaxy report was even worse...just seemed like a stupid joke to me. both of these groups should be ashamed of themselves for not speaking out more publicly against the NGE.
could you share with us ,if you have the time, on what you WANT swg to be like. I mean, what combat system, skill vs level, crafting..ect would you like to be in swg.
Everyone loaded and set? Good, then I'll just load up this clay pidgeon, and ... PULL!
A Proposed modification to Classic armor, clothing and buffs
The following assumes Classic crafting, except as noted.
Armor would be as per Classic era, in materials, AR1, resists, and encumbrance*. Each piece of armor would add its own bit to encumbrance*. The difference is in the type of encumbrance: not the suppressed sub-stats of Classic, but the reduced attack speed, accuracy and movement of CU. But unlike the CU, there would not be any mitigations; actually, the system already has mitigations in place - the increased attack speed and accuracy from combat skills, and burstrun. Doctor buffs would have no effect on this encumbrance. You will need to talk to your armorsmith about the balance of resists vs encumbrance that you want. CRAFTING CHANGE: the effects of BE tissues added to armor components should appear in the finished armor.
An addition to clothing: armor cloth. CRAFTING CHANGE: clothing should have a number of optional armor slots equal to the number of armor locations covered: hands and feet (unless the CU change of making these non-targettable is adopted), head, legs, torso, left and right biceps, and left and right forearms. Only identical armor segments (of appropriate number) go into these slots. Tailors cannot experiment the armor value, they just add the segment's resists to the clothing. Making armored short pants is questionable, but armored hot pants is just silly.
Effects of armor cloth: NO encumbrance, but the cloth is AR0 (no 50% reduction of AP0 attacks). Armor cloth takes attack damage just like regular armor. The resists of armor cloth do not stack with real armor or other clothing: if your shirt and jacket are armor cloth, you get the highest resists from both, but they don't add together. But if your shirt has a resist that your armor breastplate lacks, the shirt's resist applies so you are not vulnerable to that damage type.
Doctor buffs were already so high that it made Composite, the heaviest armor in SWG, into the most common type by negating its encumbrance. With armor having no restraining effect at all on sub-stats, doc buff effects would be even more extreme. So certain doc buffs should be dialed back (food and spice can take up some of the slack). CRAFTING CHANGE: Garrmorl is boosted into line with Accarragm and Vasarian Brandy. Doctor buffs get a duration bonus depending on their level: A is longer than B is longer than C is longer than D. The power of buffs is not changed. Health and Action pool buffs are unchanged. Buff packs C and D for drain stats and buff pack D for regen stats are removed from the system. Buff pack B for drain stats and buff pack C for regen stats are only available as limited-use looted schematics. Schematics for the remaining sub-stat buffs would be available later in the doctor's crafting tree.
Originally posted by Shayde Originally posted by MX13 Originally posted by Shayde Originally posted by MX13 Originally posted by Shayde Originally posted by fariq We're so Pro-NGE we spent the first 30 minutes bitching about Restuss.
Restuss was just the latest symptom of the terminal disease we call the nge.
So really, at this point, bitching about Restuss is for us, finally having Robert Downey Jr. bitch that drugs are not living up to his expe ctations.
Wow, WAE.... Worst Analogy Ever
You usually have good ones, and even a few classics, but that was just horrid. We expect more from you. Foreshame, foreshame.... /shakesHead
If Robert Downey Jr. is wrong, I don't wanna be right!
You also realize we all think you look like Smed now...
Now if only I COULD look like Smed.. I'd head to Austin and say to everyone "We're rolling it all back.. nge be damned!!!" while the real smed is in a pit in my basement getting barked at by a poodle.
/shivers.....
I just got the mental image from the Silence of the Lambs... I can picture you saying "Its puts the lotion on the body or it gets the hose..."
WTF Buffalo Bill...
Having access to a billion $ IP - Billions of dollars.. Having access to a massive fan base of said IP - Even more Billons... Singly handedly alienating them due to stupidity - Priceless.
Comments
Rofl stay on target --
______________________________
I usually picture the Career builder commercial with the room full of monkeys and upside down sales chart when thinking about the SOE/SWG decision making process.....
SOE's John Blakely and Todd Fiala issued a warning: "Don't make our mistakes." Ref NGE
Winner of the worst MMOS goes to.... the NGE and SWG..!!! http://www.mmorpg.com/showFeature.cfm?loadFeature=1034&bhcp=1
It is more of a public service announcement. Do not waste your time on this Fan-boi BULLSHIT!
Do not be mistaken, these guys are undecidedly pro-NGE!
Im sorry I must correct you on this--- if this was the case no way in Hell would they ask myself to talk on the show.
I am the farthest from anything easy in the game and the NGE -- crap I was banned because of it. So your statement is flawed.
I think at this point -- hearing peoples thoughts is the ONLY way this can get resolved.
______________________________
I usually picture the Career builder commercial with the room full of monkeys and upside down sales chart when thinking about the SOE/SWG decision making process.....
SOE's John Blakely and Todd Fiala issued a warning: "Don't make our mistakes." Ref NGE
Winner of the worst MMOS goes to.... the NGE and SWG..!!! http://www.mmorpg.com/showFeature.cfm?loadFeature=1034&bhcp=1
So really, at this point, bitching about Restuss is for us, finally having Robert Downey Jr. bitch that drugs are not living up to his expectations.
Wow, WAE.... Worst Analogy Ever
You usually have good ones, and even a few classics, but that was just horrid. We expect more from you. Foreshame, foreshame.... /shakesHead
If Robert Downey Jr. is wrong, I don't wanna be right!
Shayde - SWG (dead)
Proud member of the Cabal.
It sounds great, so great in fact, I pitty those who canceled
I don't like it when you say things. - A Vanguard fan who does too.
09f911029d74e35bd84156c5635688c0
It is interesting to hear fanbois wake up from their SOE induced stupor.
Great quote:
"A year ago, the future was coated in candy, now it's covered in shit!"
It is more of a public service announcement. Do not waste your time on this Fan-boi BULLSHIT!
Do not be mistaken, these guys are undecidedly pro-NGE!
Dude you are talking to one of them and to shallow to even realize that . LMAO
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
So really, at this point, bitching about Restuss is for us, finally having Robert Downey Jr. bitch that drugs are not living up to his expectations.
Wow, WAE.... Worst Analogy Ever
You usually have good ones, and even a few classics, but that was just horrid. We expect more from you. Foreshame, foreshame.... /shakesHead
If Robert Downey Jr. is wrong, I don't wanna be right!
You also realize we all think you look like Smed now...
I'll start my own SWG... with Black Jack... and Hookers!!!
In fact, forget the SWG!!!!
Yep -- but I still feel sorry for the people paying them, toughing it out or accepting the NGE for what it is. This is no different then accepting a 3 legged race horse that once had 4.
Some are adults, some are people I know that hate admiting it. When you ask them they almost get mad they are paying them let alone being asked why. Sooner or later the sub-par programing and results will make people quit to a level SOE has got to shut down some servers or somthing.
Right now what you see is people trying to defend what is left -- not what is coming or could be. Right now I have now seen new Jedi try to hold onto thier free Jedi they got, they know the NGE is what got them the Jedi and they do not want to lose all the time (while very little it is) they have had one. At least now they may feel just a hint of what long time Jedi felt when losing a hard earned one vs one for free even.
So many people have built up ONCE again what they could in this version of the game, only this time it is far far worse then ever and some of them are wise to know that change is coming and the chance to lose it all again or all of it period is almost embarassing.
If you ask some of the fans why they still play, it by all means is not the gameplay itself. Its the name and people... I am sorry but if that is what keeps people in a game then SOE has messed up on a large scale.
At one time people were proud to be in the game -- now, people just do not talk about it in other games. I did in COV and WoW --- Oh my.... your best not telling anyone you played the game.
______________________________
I usually picture the Career builder commercial with the room full of monkeys and upside down sales chart when thinking about the SOE/SWG decision making process.....
SOE's John Blakely and Todd Fiala issued a warning: "Don't make our mistakes." Ref NGE
Winner of the worst MMOS goes to.... the NGE and SWG..!!! http://www.mmorpg.com/showFeature.cfm?loadFeature=1034&bhcp=1
That was a pretty good Galaxy Report. Thank you for posting the report MX and thank you everyone for your time.
Damn byotch dat aint no friggn moon fool, dat be a friggn space station byotch.
Crafting - I would like that split and would like crafters to be able to choose the two crafting professions they would like to be. I've also toyed with the idea of crafting being a seconday skill set (or points) that a combat character could choose to go into. I like the Pre-CU era of beign able to be a Master Architech and Master TKA and being proficient enought in PVE and PVP to go out and fight. Sure you were not as effective as a double combat master but you could hang. You could give the people who choose to be pure crafters a bonus by say giving them the Merchant and Artisan skills that a combat person could not learn. Of course crafted items would be better then anything you could loot (whether it was the ability to make them higher damage or for the crafter to apply stat bonuses)
Entertainers - I think BF was the best thing to get people to interact with Entertainers. I also like the buffs that were added to the Entertainer profession during the CU. Now from some of the Entertainers I've talked to they did not BF. I thought that players resented them for having to get their BF healed. They would have perfered to have players come to Entertainers for bonuses not to heal necassry things like BF. Maybe combining the two would work.
Combat/Professions - Skill wheels suck. I want trees back. I even talked to one of the devs from LA and told him that I think there may have been less resistance to the NGE (I know wishfull thinking) if instead of skill wheels for the professions they would have put in place trees and gave players more choice in leveling up their toons. If I am a spy I should be able to pick if I want to level up in my stealth branch or if I want to work on leveling up my main attack. Maybe the Expertise tree will give us a little of that feel back. I do understand a bit about why they condensed the professions but I think I would have liked for them to get away from the "Iconic" professions and set it up a bit more like say you Master Marksman and from there you could specialize in Pistols, Rifleman, or Carbines. Same thing with Brawler and moving on to spcialize in TKA, Swords, or Pikeman. Maybe those could have been the expertise trees for say a Brawler profession? I'm really stuck on the combat style. If the game could handle it I think a FPS style combat system could be a lot of fun. Unfortunatly I do no think it can. Pre-CU combat was a friggin joke with buffs and Composite armor and while I liked CU combat I got a little bored. I think a hybred of the three would work the best. Bring the difficulty level of the most current NGE system and mix it with an easier to control combat (and for Christ sakes slow down the speed of the NPC's)
I just got off of work a few minutes ago and need a nap so sorry if this does not make sense. I reserve the right to add or change anything in this after I wake up
I would also like to know what your guys Ultimate SWG game would be like.
See you in the dream..
The Fires from heaven, now as cold as ice. A rapid ascension tolls a heavy price.
I'll accept that challenge. Check back here regularly, this will take a few Edit Stages.
First, I will say I agree with you that a comination of all 3 systems would make the best game, however, in the case of the CU & the NGE I would say thier Concepts are valid, but not those Concepts Iplimintation. In other words, in theory the CU & NGE were good concpets, but they were absolute failures of execution by SOE. I will also add the NGE in it entirety was a mistake to even attempt for reason we all know only too well now.
What I will cover in this post:
Professions / Skills
Quite honestly, thses systems have been SWG's greatest strength as well as it's greatest weakness. The concept of the Pre-CU professions system was the best of them all in that it allow players to create their own identity, and change over time. However, they also created SWG Greatest Foe... Stacking Wars.
Quite honestly, the problem came from one key failure in the SWG Skill System. Skills are not Professions. What do I mean? Shooting a Rifle is a Skill, not a Profession. By treating Skills & Professions the same, it allowed players to combine Skills in unintended ways to create overpowered "Stacked" Templates. This was never the Dev's intention for this system, and it was a problem that was only fixable by "Capping" Stats, which in itself only continues the FotM Template race until everything is capped.
So what is the solution? Split Professions & Skills. Simply put, Bounty Hunting is a Profession, not shooting a Carbine while you're Bounty Hunting.
Splitting Professions & Skills would require creating Skill Points as well as Professions Points, using the old Trees.
To stop Stacking Wars, Professions would contain General Bonuses & the Skills would only have Skill Specific Bonuses. For eample:
Therefore, a Bounty Hunter with the Rifles Skill could have +100 Speed & Acc with a Rifle, but only +50 with a Pistol. Using this type of system would turn the balancing focus to the Combat/Adventure Professions, which are much easier to balance against eachother than balancing ALL of the combinations of the Pre-CU system.
Certian Bonuses, like the Combat Medic Profession & the Medic Skill would not stack, allowing players to pick up a simple Skill without creating a Stacking War requiring the combo of the 2 to compete.
Here's how I view what the Professions & Skills should have been:
Professions- Ideally, you would recieve enough Professions Points to master 1 Profession.
Skills- Ideally, you would recieve enough Skill Points to Master 3 Skills.
OK, Breaktime...
I'll start my own SWG... with Black Jack... and Hookers!!!
In fact, forget the SWG!!!!
I'll accept that challenge. Check back here regularly, this will take a few Edit Stages.
First, I will say I agree with you that a comination of all 3 systems would make the best game, however, in the case of the CU & the NGE I would say thier Concepts are valid, but not those Concepts Iplimintation. In other words, in theory the CU & NGE were good concpets, but they were absolute failures of execution by SOE.
What I will cover in this post:
Professions / Skills
Quite honestly, thses systems have been SWG's greatest strength as well as it's greatest weakness. The concept of the Pre-CU professions system was the best of them all in that it allow players to create their own identity, and change over time. However, they also created SWG Greatest Foe... Stacking Wars.
- PRE-CU
- NO UPDATES/UPGRADES/GAME ENCHANCEMENTS
- CURRENT NGE PLAYERS NOT WELCOMED
kyme, a server with no upgrades, or enhancements over time will die. And to limit the access to the server is just plan wrong.
I also will share my vision of SWG with you guys, I have posted it on both the O-boards as well as on the TGR forums, as well as on the air on a number of occasions.
MY SWG:
I for one have always liked how skills are handled in EVE, everyone truly had a unique character based on their own playstyle, I was a dabler in pre-cu swg and while I am venomously against the non-combat professions becoming secondary professions, I do like how one poster here put it, split the professions from the skills, the skill pie has to be one of the worst in the industry, if not I hate to see what is.
I would also love to see a return of BF, I didnt mind it at all, but in defence of the entertainer profession I have to say this: give the poor souls complete songs to play, give them the option to make or remix songs as they get better in certain skills. I playede an entertainer for a short while pre-cu and I was driven almost batty witrh the same nine notes over and over again, the specials only remixed in three or four at most, not enough.
As for my beloved crafting profession, I have to say we need a return of being able to better the stats on what we craft and a moveing away from the dependence on loot, I dont mind quest rewards or loot from tough npcs, that makes going out and finding these guys worthwhile. But what we have now in ridiculous. I would also love to see a return to the creature harvest radial, this was put in place because before creatures were droping guns and other non-creature items, this also gave the scout a porpose in the game since they were the only ones who could harvest creatures. Now I got a ton of next to useless hides and bone and meat in some of my alts on my main server as well as other servers I "sometimes" play
. I would also love to see a return of experimation XP, before the more complex the item was the more Xp it was worth. It made grinding the artisan profession interesting, and it gave the player a chance to see some kind of profit on items they crafted while grinding instead of just hitting the practice button.
With Space I dont see much wrong with it, except for escort missions, but who honestly likes those kind of missions lol? I do like how they have mining in space now, with the threat of pirates poping in it gives the player a distraction while sitting there poping asteroids.
Another option I loved pre-cu was the ability of players training other players, I helped out many new players in this area. I truely miss this option almost as much as the creatue radial and BF.
As with the combat I dont have enough knowlege in this area to really comment on it, but I do like the fact that the DEVs have brought back prone nd kneel, it may not effect combat much ( I hope they change that fact) but it does add a level of fun back into combat for me.
Wow....what do I want SWG to be?
Crafting - I would like that split and would like crafters to be able to choose the two crafting professions they would like to be. I've also toyed with the idea of crafting being a seconday skill set (or points) that a combat character could choose to go into. I like the Pre-CU era of beign able to be a Master Architech and Master TKA and being proficient enought in PVE and PVP to go out and fight. Sure you were not as effective as a double combat master but you could hang. You could give the people who choose to be pure crafters a bonus by say giving them the Merchant and Artisan skills that a combat person could not learn. Of course crafted items would be better then anything you could loot (whether it was the ability to make them higher damage or for the crafter to apply stat bonuses)
We had more of this in the pre-cu era -- they fucked up and took out one of the best crafting games I have ever seen in any game going back to my Atari 2600 days -- Ti99 and so on. SO (Pre-CU for the win to get this back AS A STARTING POINT) 1.
Entertainers - I think BF was the best thing to get people to interact with Entertainers. I also like the buffs that were added to the Entertainer profession during the CU. Now from some of the Entertainers I've talked to they did not BF. I thought that players resented them for having to get their BF healed. They would have perfered to have players come to Entertainers for bonuses not to heal necassry things like BF. Maybe combining the two would work.
BF in hindsight and known to us was very very important for the MMO, need and interdependency for others. This was a social aspect of the game you had to enjoy or at least use. Most of us had fun with it and made it part of the planning in combat and casual use of PvE as well. The buffs came after but were nice in thier own way -- again a social aspect of the experience. (SO ONCE AGAIN Pre-CU for the win and sad that we have to ask to be social again as a NEED factor in a MMO but we do.)
Combat/Professions - Skill wheels suck. I want trees back. I even talked to one of the devs from LA and told him that I think there may have been less resistance to the NGE (I know wishfull thinking) if instead of skill wheels for the professions they would have put in place trees and gave players more choice in leveling up their toons. If I am a spy I should be able to pick if I want to level up in my stealth branch or if I want to work on leveling up my main attack. Maybe the Expertise tree will give us a little of that feel back. I do understand a bit about why they condensed the professions but I think I would have liked for them to get away from the "Iconic" professions and set it up a bit more like say you Master Marksman and from there you could specialize in Pistols, Rifleman, or Carbines. Same thing with Brawler and moving on to spcialize in TKA, Swords, or Pikeman. Maybe those could have been the expertise trees for say a Brawler profession? I'm really stuck on the combat style. If the game could handle it I think a FPS style combat system could be a lot of fun. Unfortunatly I do no think it can. Pre-CU combat was a friggin joke with buffs and Composite armor and while I liked CU combat I got a little bored. I think a hybred of the three would work the best. Bring the difficulty level of the most current NGE system and mix it with an easier to control combat (and for Christ sakes slow down the speed of the NPC's)
Well I almost do not need to say this but once again Pre-CU for the win.. with fixes..AT LEAST THE PRE-CU was a starting point and the CU DID cure some of this -- I hated the UI in the CU , so if they did some work to fix this and leave the core changes alone, such as everything from TRAINING TO GET A SKILL BASED ON POINTS (Hmmmmmmmm like WE ONCE HAD!)... and made it a option to be social and ask to be trained or the option of paying a trainer LIKE WE HAD ONCE BEFORE -- simple things like this added to the game and MADE you earn a class, Sure there was some stupid stacking issues BUT FREAKING HELL look at the issues now???? What we thought was bad is nothing compared to this mess. So, once again -- I agree with you... So far what you asked for is somthing we ALREADY HAD and could have been built on, I am glad to see your input on the starting point.
Also note: This engine and game does not support the FPS crap, its a waste and not a MMO feel to it, speed is not the key -- looking and feeling REAL is, bring back the SIM combat more so then this Benny Hill crap. Fix Buffs and some balance issues that are present for sure.
ALSO go back to old school Jedi -- risk vs reward, make it hard and then make it harder -- not easier. What should have happend is no holos ever --- when we unlocked it should have stayed hard and risky making us rare.
Again the point is this, We had a better foundation then we do now and just about everyone can now see it. Or worse, it was ok -- BUT the NGE is SOOO bad that we would rather have the "OK" system in place lol.
I just got off of work a few minutes ago and need a nap so sorry if this does not make sense. I reserve the right to add or change anything in this after I wake up
I would also like to know what your guys Ultimate SWG game would be like.
Well its good to see your not far off from what we once had already as a foundation.
Too bad you could not have told this to Grants face at the Indy summit. He may have actually heard you.
I swear I just wanted to sit down there and drill him of how bad he fucked this up.
______________________________
I usually picture the Career builder commercial with the room full of monkeys and upside down sales chart when thinking about the SOE/SWG decision making process.....
SOE's John Blakely and Todd Fiala issued a warning: "Don't make our mistakes." Ref NGE
Winner of the worst MMOS goes to.... the NGE and SWG..!!! http://www.mmorpg.com/showFeature.cfm?loadFeature=1034&bhcp=1
So really, at this point, bitching about Restuss is for us, finally having Robert Downey Jr. bitch that drugs are not living up to his expectations.
Wow, WAE.... Worst Analogy Ever
You usually have good ones, and even a few classics, but that was just horrid. We expect more from you. Foreshame, foreshame.... /shakesHead
If Robert Downey Jr. is wrong, I don't wanna be right!
You also realize we all think you look like Smed now...
Now if only I COULD look like Smed.. I'd head to Austin and say to everyone "We're rolling it all back.. nge be damned!!!" while the real smed is in a pit in my basement getting barked at by a poodle.
Shayde - SWG (dead)
Proud member of the Cabal.
It sounds great, so great in fact, I pitty those who canceled
I don't like it when you say things. - A Vanguard fan who does too.
09f911029d74e35bd84156c5635688c0
i used to love to sit and craft on my alt while listening to podcast by Yivvits & MrBubble. but they too were way too lenient on SOE after the NGE. if you have a public forum, your voice might actually count for something. and i always felt it was irresponsible of them to not call SOE out for their bullshit.
the galaxy report was even worse...just seemed like a stupid joke to me. both of these groups should be ashamed of themselves for not speaking out more publicly against the NGE.
SWG ADDICT...clean since the NGE
A Proposed modification to Classic armor, clothing and buffs
The following assumes Classic crafting, except as noted.
Armor would be as per Classic era, in materials, AR1, resists, and encumbrance*. Each piece of armor would add its own bit to encumbrance*. The difference is in the type of encumbrance: not the suppressed sub-stats of Classic, but the reduced attack speed, accuracy and movement of CU. But unlike the CU, there would not be any mitigations; actually, the system already has mitigations in place - the increased attack speed and accuracy from combat skills, and burstrun. Doctor buffs would have no effect on this encumbrance. You will need to talk to your armorsmith about the balance of resists vs encumbrance that you want. CRAFTING CHANGE: the effects of BE tissues added to armor components should appear in the finished armor.
An addition to clothing: armor cloth. CRAFTING CHANGE: clothing should have a number of optional armor slots equal to the number of armor locations covered: hands and feet (unless the CU change of making these non-targettable is adopted), head, legs, torso, left and right biceps, and left and right forearms. Only identical armor segments (of appropriate number) go into these slots. Tailors cannot experiment the armor value, they just add the segment's resists to the clothing. Making armored short pants is questionable, but armored hot pants is just silly.
Effects of armor cloth: NO encumbrance, but the cloth is AR0 (no 50% reduction of AP0 attacks). Armor cloth takes attack damage just like regular armor. The resists of armor cloth do not stack with real armor or other clothing: if your shirt and jacket are armor cloth, you get the highest resists from both, but they don't add together. But if your shirt has a resist that your armor breastplate lacks, the shirt's resist applies so you are not vulnerable to that damage type.
Doctor buffs were already so high that it made Composite, the heaviest armor in SWG, into the most common type by negating its encumbrance. With armor having no restraining effect at all on sub-stats, doc buff effects would be even more extreme. So certain doc buffs should be dialed back (food and spice can take up some of the slack). CRAFTING CHANGE: Garrmorl is boosted into line with Accarragm and Vasarian Brandy. Doctor buffs get a duration bonus depending on their level: A is longer than B is longer than C is longer than D. The power of buffs is not changed. Health and Action pool buffs are unchanged. Buff packs C and D for drain stats and buff pack D for regen stats are removed from the system. Buff pack B for drain stats and buff pack C for regen stats are only available as limited-use looted schematics. Schematics for the remaining sub-stat buffs would be available later in the doctor's crafting tree.
So really, at this point, bitching about Restuss is for us, finally having Robert Downey Jr. bitch that drugs are not living up to his expe
ctations.
Wow, WAE.... Worst Analogy Ever
You usually have good ones, and even a few classics, but that was just horrid. We expect more from you. Foreshame, foreshame.... /shakesHead
If Robert Downey Jr. is wrong, I don't wanna be right!
You also realize we all think you look like Smed now...
Now if only I COULD look like Smed.. I'd head to Austin and say to everyone "We're rolling it all back.. nge be damned!!!" while the real smed is in a pit in my basement getting barked at by a poodle.
/shivers.....
I just got the mental image from the Silence of the Lambs... I can picture you saying "Its puts the lotion on the body or it gets the hose..."
WTF Buffalo Bill...
Having access to a billion $ IP - Billions of dollars..
Having access to a massive fan base of said IP - Even more Billons...
Singly handedly alienating them due to stupidity - Priceless.
nvm
MMO History: 2528 days in SW:G
