Originally posted by Ryanz I understand that Warhammer has been around long before WoW...but what does that have to do with the Warhammer Online game looking like WoW? Do you mean to tell me that back at the very creation of Warhammer, the monsters and characters look like they do in WAR? Just pointing this out. I could care less what looks like what.
as a matter of fact yes... and yes WAR is being made from art taken directly from the warhammer art world.
Originally posted by Shogie Originally posted by Ryanz I understand that Warhammer has been around long before WoW...but what does that have to do with the Warhammer Online game looking like WoW? Do you mean to tell me that back at the very creation of Warhammer, the monsters and characters look like they do in WAR? Just pointing this out. I could care less what looks like what.
as a matter of fact yes... and yes WAR is being made from art taken directly from the warhammer art world.
Cool, didn't know that. Anyways...like I said...doesn't matter either way. I don't think anyone copied the other.
Originally posted by Nimuel A bit Off topic, but...
Every time i see the expression Intellectual Property i laugh... I mean isn't the concept just plain stupid? 'i thought of this first so you're not allowed to think about it'... Or more likeöy, 'i claim to have thought about this first...' ... or even more likely 'I was the first to get a piece of paper that says that i claim to be the first...' ...
Laws like that are going to send us back to the stone age sooner or later :P
Well, since I'm trying to be a lawyer (Haven't started on that path yet BTW). Its not like I thought of this first so you can't think of it. As long as you have like soild basses on the IP then it can't be copied. Like say music for example you can't copywrite the cord progressions (Because they are so limited) but you copywrite the lyrics. The fact that people can't be sued for Orcs or other mythilogical beings is aside from making up your own thing there is only so many creatures you can pick from.
Personaly I wouldn't want someone taking my story and claming it as my own. Or the MMO/RPG that I'm currently writing and designing base concepts too. But virutally its just copy writing the story nothing more then that. Most things are going to be the same otherwise. Mostly fighting systems, and maybe some lose designs.
Siehst du mich Erkennst du mich Ganz tief in meinem Herz ist noch ein Platz f?r dich Ich suche dich Ich sehne mich nach dem was ich geliebt hab doch ich find es nicht
Originally posted by Kyoruto Originally posted by Nimuel A bit Off topic, but...
Every time i see the expression Intellectual Property i laugh... I mean isn't the concept just plain stupid? 'i thought of this first so you're not allowed to think about it'... Or more likeöy, 'i claim to have thought about this first...' ... or even more likely 'I was the first to get a piece of paper that says that i claim to be the first...' ...
Laws like that are going to send us back to the stone age sooner or later :P
Well, since I'm trying to be a lawyer (Haven't started on that path yet BTW). Its not like I thought of this first so you can't think of it. As long as you have like soild basses on the IP then it can't be copied. Like say music for example you can't copywrite the cord progressions (Because they are so limited) but you copywrite the lyrics. The fact that people can't be sued for Orcs or other mythilogical beings is aside from making up your own thing there is only so many creatures you can pick from.
Personaly I wouldn't want someone taking my story and claming it as my own. Or the MMO/RPG that I'm currently writing and designing base concepts too. But virutally its just copy writing the story nothing more then that. Most things are going to be the same otherwise. Mostly fighting systems, and maybe some lose designs.
I'm all too aware of how it works in reality. So who draws the line between what's copyrighted or not? Exactly how far is one allowed to go? If i tell the story of, oh, i dont know.. say The DaVinci code, but in my own way, and sell that (as it is, inspired by the original DaVinciCode by Brown) It would in most courts be ruled as IP theft (unless it's a parody, then it's allowed (WTF?)). But is it really all that simple? The story was after all originally inspired from historical stories, items and myths? The very notion that you can own an idea, a thought, a sequence of words is stupyfying.
I know it's a cynical way to look at it, but my view is that copyright laws are completly dependant on how much money there is backing your side of the story...
If two people have the same ideas, completly unknowning of the other, but one finishes first, the other guy is then comitting a crime? (Fuck me, Graham Bell was a pirate!?) We should be glad today's Copyright laws didnt exist some hundred years ago... There would only be one Firm making cars, only one firm making airplanes... Computers would probably not even exist, and forget anything you know about iPod's or cellphones...
"Religion is fundamentally opposed to everything I hold in veneration - courage, clear thinking, honesty, fairness, and, above all, love of the truth." - Henry Mencken
"With or without religion, you would have good people doing good things and evil people doing evil things. But for good people to do evil things, that takes religion." - Steven Weinberg
"And what would you do with a brain if you had one?" - Wizard of Oz
Originally posted by meab Who ever keeps on saying that should be shot. WoW came out like 2 years ago Warhammer has been out since late 80's. The tabletop pieces look exactly like the ingame char's in the pics. If u say it looks like WoW you should be shot period.
Warhammer has been out since the EARLY 80's.... 1983 t be exact !
Warhammer came to the world first and though it Warcraft was born; because of this, the 2 games will obviously have a similar design. I can only hope the gameplay of WAR is close to WOW since I like the wow interface and i'm sure you all do too.
The difference between the games is that WAR should be (and i'm hoping it's true) dark, gritty and bloody. The WAR toons, as i've read, are supposed to have better emotes (similar to SWGs, /happy /sad /angry). The armor in WAR is supposed to be customizable (including drawf skulls on your pauldrons) Your combat profession can be a hybrid one. Think of it like this: WoW is the easter bunny and WAR is the easter bunny if it had rabies.
IMHO: I hope they get the player housing running soon after release (another feature not in WoW). I hope the crafted items in WAR are useful (WoW's crafted items are mostly worthless) I hope there is no epic loot nonsense or 40 man raid group BS found in WOW. I hope that items decay into junk so you need to get a replacement. I hope that WAR has the life/community that is missing from WoW (I think that player housing and the emotes will help in that direction)
"The liberties and resulting economic prosperity that YOU take for granted were granted by those "dead guys"
I have been ranting about games ditching the 90034058345 man guilds run by 12 year olds who hold all the power because the end game is nothing but 40 man raids and unless you are in an uber guild you can't play the game anymore....
for a loooooooong time.. especially after getting the black war ram PVP reward in WoW and realising what it took to get there and that I had nothing left to do cus I can't compete with chinese gold farming peeps etc.. running characters 24/7 so they can sell em on EBAY and people who bought their character can say their character is better than mine...
AND I always play with my gf, bro, first cousin, best friend .. so our little personal 5 person guild will never be able to do BWL or whatever by ourselves...
We do. however.. kick ass in a group since we make characters that work with each other and play together all the time
I think you can make raids a MAX of something like.. 15 peeps.. assuming a party size is something like 5 people.. which I think they should be..
so about 3 parties.. after that .. you can make it challenging in different ways than just taking 93405834 people to take the MOB down..
Coincidentally.. well actually.. no coincidentally.. but for EXACTLY those reasons.. (plus some more) we all obviously quit WoW long ago .. thanks be to god
Although i have to say up to the point you hit lvl 60 it's a pretty good game. Uber RAIDS KILL EVERY GAME!! 15..ish Person Raids are OK .. they are interesting to do here and there.. challenging in more than a "this MOB take a million people to take down" kinda way.. and It is RELATIVELY easy to get 3 groups together... beyond that.. it's just stupid ..
Ahh.. i feel a lil better now Here is hoping WAR turns out GREAT!
If this game has Warhammer content, thats all that matters. The short cartoony graphics are just how the characters looked on the table top game, Mythic is just honoring that.
IMHO: I hope they get the player housing running soon after release (another feature not in WoW). I hope the crafted items in WAR are useful (WoW's crafted items are mostly worthless) I hope there is no epic loot nonsense or 40 man raid group BS found in WOW. I hope that items decay into junk so you need to get a replacement. I hope that WAR has the life/community that is missing from WoW (I think that player housing and the emotes will help in that direction)
IMHO: I hope they get the player housing running soon after release (another feature not in WoW). I hope the crafted items in WAR are useful (WoW's crafted items are mostly worthless) I hope there is no epic loot nonsense or 40 man raid group BS found in WOW. I hope that items decay into junk so you need to get a replacement. I hope that WAR has the life/community that is missing from WoW (I think that player housing and the emotes will help in that direction)
I personally hope there will be some epic content, but it should be random, not something that can be camped, or a speciffic mob that drops it. But occasionally a long lost relic turns up on a mob, that would be nice i think ) ofcourse these items shouldnt be too uber anyway, just a cool looking rare weapon with stats that makes it worth using :P you know, ultrarare stuff :P
"Religion is fundamentally opposed to everything I hold in veneration - courage, clear thinking, honesty, fairness, and, above all, love of the truth." - Henry Mencken
"With or without religion, you would have good people doing good things and evil people doing evil things. But for good people to do evil things, that takes religion." - Steven Weinberg
"And what would you do with a brain if you had one?" - Wizard of Oz
OMGZ WHAT U SAID and what i stole even if i am a tabletop fan but to lazy to write..Originally posted by Morskittar Dodgy? As a negative? Warcraft is nothing more than Warhammer-lite. Both have the same creation story, the same metaphysics, and similar themes (no absolute good and evil). Warcraft just has an infinitely shallower take on the whole deal.
Warcraft "lore" feels like a comic book or anime. Every few years there's a New Menace to Everything That Must Be Stopped. First, orcs from another world. Then it turns out these orcs were duped by Chaos (or... Chaos-lite, from their warp-lite), so they can be good guys (Quicksilver and the Scarlet Witch OLOLOL!!!11), because there's an EVILER EVIL that Must Be Stopped If It's The Last Thing We Do. Oh, and they have Elric/Aenarion/Vader on their side. Who's tragic, by the way. Really. Then, that's finished up and it moves on to Bug People.
It's the same villian-of-the-season format that Yu-gi-oh! follows: building up to the next "OMG BIG REVEAL!!!11" but there's not a lot of substance.
Warhammer, on the other hand, follows the form of a history class. Like a book that combines a hybrid of Moorcock's Chaos with Lovecraft, then sticks that in 16th century pre/early-Reformation Germany. It's convoluted, contradictory, thouroughly fascinating, and it doesn't change (much); just like real-life history. It borrows from original sources and finds depth there. There's always more detail to be discovered, new revelations, and established things to debate.
For me, the psuedo-historical/classic swords-and-sorcery style of Warhammer is infinitely more engaging than a lighter, fluffier version. It's like a steak compared to a hamburger, or triple-fermented unfiltered belgian compared to Budweiser. Classic versus mass-market.
We'll see if they pull off the PvP, but when it comes to story, imagery, and graphics, Warhammer is leagues ahead. there we go..
Comments
Cool, didn't know that. Anyways...like I said...doesn't matter either way. I don't think anyone copied the other.
Personaly I wouldn't want someone taking my story and claming it as my own. Or the MMO/RPG that I'm currently writing and designing base concepts too. But virutally its just copy writing the story nothing more then that. Most things are going to be the same otherwise. Mostly fighting systems, and maybe some lose designs.
Siehst du mich
Erkennst du mich
Ganz tief in meinem Herz
ist noch ein Platz f?r dich
Ich suche dich
Ich sehne mich
nach dem was ich geliebt hab
doch ich find es nicht
Personaly I wouldn't want someone taking my story and claming it as my own. Or the MMO/RPG that I'm currently writing and designing base concepts too. But virutally its just copy writing the story nothing more then that. Most things are going to be the same otherwise. Mostly fighting systems, and maybe some lose designs.
I'm all too aware of how it works in reality. So who draws the line between what's copyrighted or not? Exactly how far is one allowed to go? If i tell the story of, oh, i dont know.. say The DaVinci code, but in my own way, and sell that (as it is, inspired by the original DaVinciCode by Brown) It would in most courts be ruled as IP theft (unless it's a parody, then it's allowed (WTF?)). But is it really all that simple? The story was after all originally inspired from historical stories, items and myths? The very notion that you can own an idea, a thought, a sequence of words is stupyfying.
I know it's a cynical way to look at it, but my view is that copyright laws are completly dependant on how much money there is backing your side of the story...
If two people have the same ideas, completly unknowning of the other, but one finishes first, the other guy is then comitting a crime? (Fuck me, Graham Bell was a pirate!?) We should be glad today's Copyright laws didnt exist some hundred years ago... There would only be one Firm making cars, only one firm making airplanes... Computers would probably not even exist, and forget anything you know about iPod's or cellphones...
"Religion is fundamentally opposed to everything I hold in veneration - courage, clear thinking, honesty, fairness, and, above all, love of the truth." - Henry Mencken
"With or without religion, you would have good people doing good things and evil people doing evil things. But for good people to do evil things, that takes religion." - Steven Weinberg
"And what would you do with a brain if you had one?" - Wizard of Oz
Warcraft was born around 1994.
Warhammer was born around 1983.
Warhammer came to the world first and though it Warcraft was born; because of this, the 2 games will obviously have a similar design. I can only hope the gameplay of WAR is close to WOW since I like the wow interface and i'm sure you all do too.
The difference between the games is that WAR should be (and i'm hoping it's true) dark, gritty and bloody. The WAR toons, as i've read, are supposed to have better emotes (similar to SWGs, /happy /sad /angry). The armor in WAR is supposed to be customizable (including drawf skulls on your pauldrons) Your combat profession can be a hybrid one. Think of it like this: WoW is the easter bunny and WAR is the easter bunny if it had rabies.
IMHO: I hope they get the player housing running soon after release (another feature not in WoW). I hope the crafted items in WAR are useful (WoW's crafted items are mostly worthless) I hope there is no epic loot nonsense or 40 man raid group BS found in WOW. I hope that items decay into junk so you need to get a replacement. I hope that WAR has the life/community that is missing from WoW (I think that player housing and the emotes will help in that direction)
"The liberties and resulting economic prosperity that YOU take for granted were granted by those "dead guys"
I have been ranting about games ditching the 90034058345 man guilds run by 12 year olds who hold all the power because the end game is nothing but 40 man raids and unless you are in an uber guild you can't play the game anymore....
for a loooooooong time.. especially after getting the black war ram PVP reward in WoW and realising what it took to get there and that I had nothing left to do cus I can't compete with chinese gold farming peeps etc.. running characters 24/7 so they can sell em on EBAY and people who bought their character can say their character is better than mine...
AND I always play with my gf, bro, first cousin, best friend .. so our little personal 5 person guild will never be able to do BWL or whatever by ourselves...
We do. however.. kick ass in a group since we make characters that work with each other and play together all the time
I think you can make raids a MAX of something like.. 15 peeps.. assuming a party size is something like 5 people.. which I think they should be..
so about 3 parties.. after that .. you can make it challenging in different ways than just taking 93405834 people to take the MOB down..
Coincidentally.. well actually.. no coincidentally.. but for EXACTLY those reasons.. (plus some more) we all obviously quit WoW long ago .. thanks be to god
Although i have to say up to the point you hit lvl 60 it's a pretty good game. Uber RAIDS KILL EVERY GAME!! 15..ish Person Raids are OK .. they are interesting to do here and there.. challenging in more than a "this MOB take a million people to take down" kinda way.. and It is RELATIVELY easy to get 3 groups together... beyond that.. it's just stupid ..
Ahh.. i feel a lil better now
Here is hoping WAR turns out GREAT!
In WAR i want to be a Necro----err Plague Monk
With a cute scabby tale and one torn ear 
With Plague breath of course.
"Religion is fundamentally opposed to everything I hold in veneration - courage, clear thinking, honesty, fairness, and, above all, love of the truth." - Henry Mencken
"With or without religion, you would have good people doing good things and evil people doing evil things. But for good people to do evil things, that takes religion." - Steven Weinberg
"And what would you do with a brain if you had one?" - Wizard of Oz
Dodgy? As a negative? Warcraft is nothing more than Warhammer-lite. Both have the same creation story, the same metaphysics, and similar themes (no absolute good and evil). Warcraft just has an infinitely shallower take on the whole deal.
Warcraft "lore" feels like a comic book or anime. Every few years there's a New Menace to Everything That Must Be Stopped. First, orcs from another world. Then it turns out these orcs were duped by Chaos (or... Chaos-lite, from their warp-lite), so they can be good guys (Quicksilver and the Scarlet Witch OLOLOL!!!11), because there's an EVILER EVIL that Must Be Stopped If It's The Last Thing We Do. Oh, and they have Elric/Aenarion/Vader on their side. Who's tragic, by the way. Really. Then, that's finished up and it moves on to Bug People.
It's the same villian-of-the-season format that Yu-gi-oh! follows: building up to the next "OMG BIG REVEAL!!!11" but there's not a lot of substance.
Warhammer, on the other hand, follows the form of a history class. Like a book that combines a hybrid of Moorcock's Chaos with Lovecraft, then sticks that in 16th century pre/early-Reformation Germany. It's convoluted, contradictory, thouroughly fascinating, and it doesn't change (much); just like real-life history. It borrows from original sources and finds depth there. There's always more detail to be discovered, new revelations, and established things to debate.
For me, the psuedo-historical/classic swords-and-sorcery style of Warhammer is infinitely more engaging than a lighter, fluffier version. It's like a steak compared to a hamburger, or triple-fermented unfiltered belgian compared to Budweiser. Classic versus mass-market.
We'll see if they pull off the PvP, but when it comes to story, imagery, and graphics, Warhammer is leagues ahead.
there we go..