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WOW Eastern mmorpg market is weird...
scaramoosh
Member Posts: 3,424
Speaking to some Chinese guy who can't speak very good english but he was telling me:
- Easter mmorpg market don't play for fun
- They don't play for gameplay
- Or character customisation
- They only care about PVP and beating other people
- People spending 24 hours+ to just get some rare loot
- People trading cars/their life for in game items
- Murders over in game items
- How they wont play any online game with a subscription because it's too expensive (lol but they'd trade their car)
- How they spend weeks grinding on the same mob just to get to gain levels and be better than everyone else :S
etc etc.
Now this got me thinking, the western world seem to play for fun and to play with guilds and eachother and enjoy doing quests etc etc. We enjoy character customisation and taking our time! We're not as mad over there!
So WOW was made for the eastern market with enough for the western market to keep it popular there! He basically described WOW with me but quests put in for us 
lol.
SO i was thinking why don't developers just make mmorpgs for the western market in mind? SWG had sooo much customisation, why don't we get more games like this instead of grindfest no customisation levels?
I wonder what EVE online would do over there? "you scammed me i'll kill you in RL"
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Don't click here...no2
Comments
They're finding out right now
Chinese Beta for EVE.
I live in the Philippines, which is one fo the most westernized countries in Asia, but yeah what the OP says is rather true. MMOs only caught on over here like 3 years ago. Before that 90% of FIlipino gamers were playing Counter-Strike. So, yeah, haha. Character appearance is low priority, RPing is nil. Emphasis is on bragging rights (phat loot) and killing your enemies dead. Prolly why all we play over here are free-to-play Korean PVP grindfests (ugh).
That said, I'd say the social aspect in MMOs is very strong. Most gamers here wouldn't play a game by themselves, they'd only do so w/ friends. Who they most probably know IRL too. Playing games is like going to the mall or grabbing a drink, something you do with friends you know.
I don''t really know when Humankind will die out but i''m guessing about 6 years before WOW.
-BarCrow
Yeh it's weird he's mad on CS but hasn't heard of CSS and say he knows noone who's heard of it! I asked has he played HL2 and he said they don't like them kinda games where u run on your own and not much story.
Also says anything Blizzard is massive over there like diablo and Wacraft but theres only a few western games he knows
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Don't click here...no2
You talked to a chinese guy and I'm george bush. you sure this isn't another one of your fake posts again, Scaramoosh?
Because your wrong. dead wrong.
murder over ingame item? that happened once in japan over Legend of Mir 3.
Asians don't play to have fun, ofcourse not. the are forced to play those games
True, he indeed backed up that people murder each other for items, they trade cars for items, asians don't play to have fun, and more of Scaramoosh crap. people spending 24 hours to get loot (which doesn't happen over here, because Molten core drops all epic equipment at 100% drop rate)they also don't pay for their mmorpgs, because Lineage 2 and WoW, the most succesful mmorpgs in the east, are free to play [/sarcasm]
I confirm here right now that Scara is making things up again.
Yeh at my work theres an chinese guy who does the cleaning lol, he said he's there for education and part time job and he goes back to china in like a year.
And yes he said all that to me :S
It's not hard to belive seeing as you hear about i happening anyways lol.
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Don't click here...no2
In War - Victory.
In Peace - Vigilance.
In Death - Sacrifice.
After being alive for almost four decades I've noticed changes in myself. One of them is that when I was younger I used to take a kind of sinister pleasure watching fools, but now I suppose that I've mellowed, and now I simply can't stand to see, especially young people, made into fools.
With that said, I'd like to remind people, again, that there is no skill involved in beating another person in most MMORPGs (unless they are your equal in numbers, then maybe you thought more quickly in the fight). A battle is nothing more than a hopeless contest between the high level and low level player. There's nothing that can be done to win from the lower level position. The character can't pull a secret trick or even run away in most cases. So, there is no achievement in the winning of a battle at all.
Asian people please realise that most MMORPGs are nothing more that a capitalist trick to steal money from you. Your time spent playing is not rewarded in any real way if the games don't have a good story. The battles are reduced to a math problem in the games, but a good story can always be a surprise and that's what we should all look for.
I'm well aware of the Asian idea of personal honor, and we have it in the west too, and I'm shocked that so many people would allow themselves to be made fools by the developers of these games. Shame!
Also, I'm a psychologists (that mostly deals with criminals) and so I know a BS hustle when I see it, and most MMORPGs out there are just that.
Personally, I would love to see a game that mirrors reality and finds everyone with fairly close stats on their physical body with armor, or what have you, being the only way to be better than another. So, if we are all in clothes we are all equally killable (stategy, weapons and reaction would then make a difference). However, if I buy a tank and you buy kevlar armor, then I win. I would have to earn the money for the tank and so I would feel good about that and if my tank got destroyed, then I would have to deal with being normal again.
When someone invents a fair MMORPG with these simple rules, then I will spend time and money on it.
[quote]Originally posted by scaramoosh
[b]Speaking to some Chinese guy who can't speak very good english but he was telling me:
[list]
(...)
[*]People spending 24 hours+ to just get some rare loot
(...)
[*]Murders over in game items
(...)
[/list](...)[/b][/quote]
3 people have died from dehydration/heart failure while spending 48h or something in that lenght playing a mmorpg or some other online game. (This was the main argument for the chinese government for limiting online-cafes & online-gaming severly).
There are two seperate murder cases due to ingame-looting/stealing . (1 was Everquest other was some small (russian made?) mmorpg).
You can search gamespot & other gamesites for those news-articles.
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In memory of Laura "Taera" Genender. Passed away on August 13, 2008.
I believe that no matter who the OP spoke to or didn't he still makes good points. As mentioned I believe that most MMORPG and "capitalist tricks" designed to provide a false sense of adventure and personal achievement designed to get mostly young people to waste their money.
1. If you step back for a second and ask yourself if you really "won" in PVP, did you, or what?
2. What have you learned? Was there a thought provoking or uplifting story?
3. Have you stressed out or gotten angry at the game for being slow/tedious/or for making you deal with bad people?
For 2 and 3 I'll tell you that stress is physically not good for you as stress related chemicals actually break down your heart and other muscle tissue. Also, the stress induced by a game can carry over into other aspects of your life (like a job can) and affect your relationships with others. So, think about that.
I must admit that I have had some very happy moments, especially with a team, in PVE combat. The game that I'm thinking of did have mild story elements and so after tracking down the main bad guy, and beating him, good feelings were had.
So, these kind of games aren't all bad, but I suspect (really know) that the current business model is to get people to spend money through a boring grind with promise of good things to come that really don't. The best example of this is City of Heroes in that, although there are story elements, the player is constantly looking to level to get the cool new powers, and they are good ones, but by the time the player gets all of his powers then there's nothing to do and the game is over.
One person doesn't speak for all.
Obivously there are lots of hardcore gamers for PvP only here in the west too.
A few rare murdering cases don't really have anything to do with the rest of them just like has nothing to do with you.
Well if that guy plays 24 hours a day, that means he doesn't have a job. Probably still feed by parents.
Someone has mentioned seperated server and cost of montly fee.
Well Nothing stops Chinese players play on US or European servers, unless the servers block Chinese IP addresses. Which western game server has blocked Chinese IP address? It's only the other way around.
Also as the matter of fact, some Chinese Lineage 2 players on NA servers claim the reason is Chinese server monthly fee is higher.
Notice how in that first post he says "I confirm here right now that Scara is making things up again." And then in a later post he writes...
Originally posted by Gameloading
there were 3 murders. A japanese player murdered his friend when his friend sold his Legend of Mir 3 weapon on Ebay for a lot of money.
In his first post he had said Scaramoosh was "making things up again." If he was making things up again, how was it that later Gameloading was able to find proof of these murders and how they related to Asian mmo's for his second posting? Well, the proof was found because he did some research afterwards. And like I've mentioned in other threads, it's always better to post having done some research first than to just base a post off of emotions or beliefs, without evidence to back it up. That's probably what he should have done prior to saying Scaramoosh was "making things up again" even if Scaramoosh has made things up in the past or not. Also, the specific number of murders is irrelevant here, but the fact of murders occuring over these games is not. Scaramoosh had only commented about what another player had told him, and then Gameloading went ahead and actually proved Scaramoosh was NOT making it up, by the information which he discovered and then posted in regards to it having been 3 murders. It's clearly evident that Gameloading is passionate about defending Asian mmo's and that he does not like people bashing those games, but it will happen whether he likes it or not...just like every game gets bashed or praised. Everyone is entitled to an opinion. If their opinion happens to differentiate from his does not make either of them wrong or right. Lastly, if someone chooses to believe or disbelieve what another person has posted...without taking the time to do their own research and to confirm or deny it to themselves...then they deserve to be misinformed. However, if someone really wants to know about what is posted then they'll do the research on it to find out, but if they're not interested or just too lazy...then why worry?
I am from an eastern asian country, and the thing is nobody enjoys grind... Somehow its something we come to embrace becase it is the only games made available to us. Basically the Koreans supply most of the mmorpg games for the eastern market, and since each company sees the other as not doing anything wrong, they continue with the grindfest type.
The reason for this being that monthly fees from these games tend to be cheaper and only cost half than what western games cost us. Monthly fees i.e. ragnarok, only costs us $5 USD, for us $15 is already something very expensive... Remember guys, not all of the asian countries are in a very good financial status.
Yes there are people who kills because of the game, or buys in game items... but dont you guys realise that there are sweatshops in china because westerners buy virtual items for real money through ebay??? Other people I know, when mmorpg first hit our country it was like we got introduced to something very foreign.. and we did everything we could to be better at it.. now that the gaming scene in our country has matured, i know a lot of people who regret what they did in the past, and stopped playing such games because it was not worth our time... whats left are the botters and those seious gamers... which of course, can be found anywhere around the world.
In my country FPS games were popular: rogue spear, CS, Quake, etc... those that doesnt need monthly fees. RTS are also big hits: warcraft, starcraft, C&C, etc.... This is because internet cafes are popular in this country, mainly because not everybody here can afford a good gaming PC, that includes consoles(expensive as they come), and basically because a home internet line is expensive... playing in cafes which costs $0.30 cents an hour is waaaaaaay cheaper... (although yes if you translate this 24/7 it becomes obviously expensive, but we only used to play for an average of 16 hours a week, which in totaly costs us $20 per month... compared to a $50 per month for the cheapest DSL line we can get...
My friends play guildwars, which was a very good thing for us because it had no monthly fee.. compared to other games which cost a fortune to play...(i.e. WoW).. and we love it because theres no grind, we have our guild that we can be proud of... and we get to put our strategies into place.
If only we were as lucky as you guys, in terms of economy.. then mmorpg around the world would be pretty much the same. So please stop with the stereotyping
i~ku~ra
True. Some people like to use extreme cases to represent one entire group.
If you look closer, people from all over the world aren't that much different in most things.
but only if you get to be ina multicultural group(my friends come from all over the world now that im here in the uk) you would realise that we all think the same... we have the same emotions, feelings.. and although we differ in opinions and personality.. when you think of it... we are all the same!
i~ku~ra
The title of your post, as well as your final paragraph, mentions that there is alot of stereotyping in this thread and that it should stop. Your first paragraph also mentions how because the Koreans supply most of the Asian mmo market...and that since they don't see any companies doing anything wrong...that they continue with the grindfest type. Don't you realize that you just stereotyped right there by saying "they CONTINUE with the grindfest type"? If they are continuing a design, then they'll certainly all appear to be the same. Hence, the grindfest clones.
It was a good point you made though about the Internet cafe's. I guess that those with home computers can afford more time to flesh out a character and work within a storyline, so that is perhaps why the majority of western mmorpg's are more varied and innovative, when compared to the majority of Asian mmo's. If those at internet cafe's don't have the luxury to spend as much time developing a character and guilds the way that we do in the comfort of our homes, then I guess that might also contribute to games with lesser substance to them. Again, let me reiterate that I'm referring to the MAJORITY of the Asian mmo's that we get here in the United States. God forbid that the defenders of these games come back and say "don't stereotype."
What is a stereotype anyway? As far as the stereotype of mmo's are concerned, it is an idea without originality. Well then, if these companies choose to continue with the grindfest types of games (just like you said), instead of producing fresh and innovative games...then what are we left with but the stereotype? We all know that it's not nice to stereotype because it throws everything into one mold, but if these companies are only producing more clones of one another, with the same monotonous mechanics disguised by different graphics engines and whatnot, then this will naturally lead people to stereotype Asian mmo's as nothing more than grindfests with pretty graphics. Granted, it may not apply to all Asian mmo's, as there are always exceptions. However, a "stereotype" applies to the majority, not a minority. So if no one likes Asian games to be stereotyped then perhaps the Asian companies should design more games which do NOT CONTINUE the grindfest trend. But when they choose to follow the Asian market and continue to make games which only appeal to those who use internet cafe's, or to those who do not have alot of time, money, and care to devote to a game at one sitting, then what do you expect them to do? They'll continue making the same kinds of games, just like you've mentioned. If there is a stereotype among Asian mmo's, who is to blame for making it that way? The companies are making the clones; we're just customers here. We don't make the games, we just play them.
Heh... never played eq1 eh? It was "common" for people to camp literally days at a time to get items they wanted. Killing over online items, eh thats a bit much, although I'd have been more than willing to deliver a good ass beating to more than a few people in those days.
In reality people in asia play for a myriad of reasons just like people in any other part of the world, some do it as a job, some do it as a hobby, some do it as an ego boost, etc.
Shadus