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No official forum community
linuxgamer
Member Posts: 126
I hope this game will be great and better than WoW, but 2 things concern me.
1. No official forum community
2. Same company that makes DAOC. I did not enjoy DAOC.
1. No official forum community
2. Same company that makes DAOC. I did not enjoy DAOC.
Comments
2 -- Some things will be similar and some way different. We will have to wait for open beta/release to make any hard decisions.
See, that's just not true because they have a company representitive on every message board.
And also, if you think of it from sociologicaly point of veiw, it's better this way: One message board would inspire group think amongst the community. With the community broken like this, there will be more diverse expectations for the game, and subcultures within the game.
Also, since they aren't paying for a message board, that's more work that can be put into the game.
"every message board."
lol now that is a relative term.
Devs will never see everything, because there are so many forums they have to keep track of. They have to divide their attention. This is already a problem if there is one official forum, but better manageable than having a zillion forums.
Originally posted by Distortion0
"One message board would inspire group think amongst the community."
Like the community is a very dangerous group of people that should be kept dispersed otherwise they get really dangerous.
One official forum does not kill diverse expectations. There is no way that a couple of people determine the expectations for the entire group. Like you can see on every forum there are enough people with an opinion of their own. If everybody would think alike there wouldn't be any discussions and that is obviously not the case.
Originally posted by Distortion0
"Also, since they aren't paying for a message board, that's more work that can be put into the game."
Like a forum could be the reason for a developer to cut on development. And they are developing a mmo. If bandwidth is already a problem, they are gonna have a hard time later on.
Besides they have different people for the community and so for managing a forum. These people are not designing the game, but making sure a healthy community is established.
No offence but you didn't make much of an arguement. So, they aren't covering EVERY message board. So there are two people who own their own forum chatting about the game somewhere. They cover the main ones, and that shows they care.
And my second point is simple sociology. Physical barriers divide people and people devided will be more diverse than people grouped. You could argue wether that's a good thing or a bad thing but then it's just an opinion war.
A forum doesn't cut money from the budget but it certianly does suck it up. I'd rather they use the money hiring people to get the game done or advertise. I mean, we already have our own message boards already. From every WAR message board I've been to the community is pretty good. It's the WoW idiots and people who don't post that worry me.
can i ask why you even thought of making this thread? :P
MMO, like WoW or WAR, do not have features like "includes forum for the community".
the game isnt made of forums, but the servers.
i seriously cant see why the GAME should become worse just because its missing a forum on a website, somewhere.
On average I see more posts from Mythic Reps in one day... then I see from WoW or Sony games in 1 day.
They do a good job of browsing the popular forums. And even some of the not so popular ones... AKA they post in this forum.
1 view is i like that were spread out but then it also sucks that we dont have 1 spot to congigate.
Yes, their motivations is that any and all official forums became a whine fest in 5 minutes, huge, bloated things from which it is hard at best to gather any form of useful information.
By having multiple forums they check with frequence, they can have smaller ones to manage, not so full of useless junk.
This in theory, but how well did it worked with DAoC? Not much. The IGN boards were the unofficial DAoC board and they were a total mess all the same...
AS for caring, I disagree. Mythic do care. Their devs are very active on many Message boards, this one included. (maybe not so active on this one as on more warhammer focused ones)
"If you give a man a fish, you feed him for a day, if you teach him how to fish, you feed him for a lifetime"
Which FF Character Are You?
Fansites like this because it increases the number of hits the get and the amount of money they get from Ads.
I've never seen a MMO that did "well" that didn't have a couple of awesome fansites to support it. Not having a offical forums saves Mtyhic money, and helps to support fansites by sending hits there way.
Looking at the WoW forums or the Sony forums (Sony has a offical forum for every game) I don't see them offering much benifit. They are just as messy and flaming as other forums, and info gets out to the public no faster really.
Im really sorry for not being able to make an argument. Here is my second attempt: (i'm aware of the fact that it will never become an argument in your eyes
I think it shows lack of care, because it is just plain easy to do it like this. You don't have to create your own forum and everything that comes with it.
And every time you post on the forum of a fansite, it is really good, because with most other games, devs post on their own forum and not on fansites. So it is extra special.
Therefore it is also easier for devs to ignore certain discussions, because they are not obliged to post. It is not the dev's own forum and people will understand that the dev just didn't see it.
Btw if developers think it is really important to post on the forums of their fansites, they can still do it while having an official forum.
My main problem though is that i also have to keep track of multiple forums to know what the active discussions are. Usually all announcements and active discussions are on the official forum. One central place where you check all important stuff. In this case it is all spread over the major fansites. I don't have the time to scan them all.
Another thing is that it is gonna be hard for mythic to know who are devoted members of their community. This could be important when the beta starts. The chance is big that a lot of people get invited who are not really involved.
and btw fansites don't exist for money and if they did it would not be a good thing.
EDIT: Nice to know the "Default" selection for the background color doesn't work.
---------------------------------------------
I live to fight, and fight to live.
I didn't say "MAKE MONEY" as in profit. I said get money. Every fansite I ever been to has had some advertisments. Often the money they get from Ads isn't enough to cover bandwidth and they still ask for donations.
Also understand... there is a big difference from Mods and developers. Mods are required to read forums as there job and keep things in order, developers aren't, so even if Mythic had Offical forums it would be a moot point. Mods also aren't up to date on things happening in the game... they are just Mods. And the question remains, why pay people to Mod for you when you could have a fansite host forums and get volunteers to Mod. A volunteers system won't work on Offical forms because one false statement could cause a ton of damage, but if on a fansite if a volunteer Mod mispeaks mythic can just say they were wrong.
The best you can hope for is a community relations specialist. Which get paid to frequent forums, and fansites and otherwise interact with the community. Why? To try to keep the community happey and to protect the game. I think Sayna from DAoC is the best example ever.
As an example look at this post
here
Some buthole posted on these very forums that beta testing was already underway. A Mythic Rep promptly responsed and set the story straight. If they Mythic Rep didn't catch that post, the lie could have expanded and ended up hurting the games Rep. I don't think you can ask for more then that. Very few companies have Reps out and about like that IMO.
I'm not trying to argue they shouldn't have offical forums (thought they already said they would not). I'm just saying I don't see the needs as Mytic IMO already has one of the best Community relation setups I've seen and at the same time they don't have to waste extra money to pay people to scroll around locking threads all day. They already have proved "they care" and have a working system. So, fears of the company not caring are unfounded.
Don't say that i have not given reasons to have an official forum. So im not repeating myself. And reasons for not liking to not have an official forum are reasons for liking to have an official forum imho.
In your story there are quite some links in getting all the announcements and information distributed to the community. An official site and forum make this a lot easier. And i partially blame Mythic for this. They are refusing to take responsibility. Imo this distribution of information is part of a good promotion campaign.
Lotteries are not picking the most devoted members of the community. And the people of Mythic are not going to hand pick devoted members of the fansite forums or wherever they will look for em. And those application processes are easily faked. A forum stores statistics of the activity on the forum. This is very usable for selecting beta testers.
You mention there is a possibility they are going to set up a forum for the beta testers. So there will be an official forum afterall. Beta only probably but still.
to Bent:
Game developers don't hire extra people for modding a forum. They already have (at least i hope) a community team which will do this kind of work. In mythic's case they are camping fansites and in other cases they visit the official forum. And of course organizing interviews, organizing contests and spreading new content (like teasers, concept art) to big game sites like mmorpg.com, etc. So these people will already be there and it won't make a difference.
But i understand that at the end there will be a central forum which becomes the most important. I rest my case.
It's different from all other(very many atleast) games, and I really like that.
"What's a cocksmoker?"
No, we will never have Official forums.
Many of the reasons why have already been repeated above by many others.
1) I am the WAR Community Coordinator, I am active on every "active" fansite for the game in existance. I may not post on all of them every day, but really, this far out, there isn't much I can say anyway.
2) I also frequent a couple different IRC channels devoted to the game.
3) No important announcement from Mythic will ever be posted on a message board anywhere, that is what the Herald is for.
4) Every "Official" forum for any game I've ever visited has only been marginally above what I'd classify as a cesspit.
5) No, I can't hit EVERY message board created everywhere on the net that remotely relates to the game, but I hit quite a few, and as the communities in others grow, I'll have a presence there as well.
6) Yes, it DOES cost the company money to create/maintain/host their own forums. That in Mythic's opinion is money better spent on the development/maintenance of the actual game.
7) As stated above, rather than making everyone come to us, we go to you, in the communities you feel most comfortable in. You like the forums here on MMORPG.com but hate the ones on VN? Cool, stay here then, and I'll be here to read your discussions. Love the WHA forums but don't like these or VN? I'll be there too... Don't like any of them and want to start your own fansite? Assuming you have an active community, I'll be there as well.
I challenge you to find any Community Manager/Coordinator for any other game/company who posts as much on their Official forums (or any forums) as I do on fansite forums.
Richard J. Cox
"There were much of the beautiful, much of the wanton, much of the bizarre, something of the terrible, and not a little of that which might have excited disgust."
Herald, grab bag, etc fills the needs very well for announcements. Especially grab bags which go into depth about the game mechanics and updates (even though some stealth fixes/nerfs always make it through).
http://kompaniet.mine.nu :+: #kompaniet @ QuakeNet
well, Richard, you are right in saying that it is hard to find another manager community/coordinator that posts more than you, that is why i know you guys care for the community.
I also see your point of view, but there is another point in having an official forum: they are for customers only (usually). Here? any pal can come around, make an account, and start whining on this or that, on an official forum, only people with accounts, IE. that are paying for the game, can express their opinions.
I believe there might be a measure of positive in that.
Now you have EA backing yourself up, surely you do have the resources to host forums and what not, after all EA DOES have their own forums, like here: http://www.electronicarts.co.uk/pages/3696/ for UK and here: http://forums.ea.com/mboards/index.jspa?sls=2 for US.
So, bottom line? Everybody in the industry does it, even your own parent company. You have all the right to keep your own counsel but realize when the game release, will happen that one major forum will be selected as the "unofficial" WAR forum and will become almost a cesspit as you mentioned. the difference? you have no control over it
Regardless, I'll be there in WAR when it get released... and in the forums, unoffical or not
Have a nice day
Volkmar
PS: Checkthis500: I'm honored by your comments *sniff* *sniff*
EDIT: after further research, it results UO also do not have an official forum of their own, so invalidating half my point. advanced studies for the win
"If you give a man a fish, you feed him for a day, if you teach him how to fish, you feed him for a lifetime"
I can understand people wanting an official place to get together and post after release. However I am quite happy with how things will be. There are already a few good forums out there. Probably more then I am subscribed to but I don't really feel the need to subscribe to all of them. The ones I do subscribe to are fairly run, and the community is kind to new comers and believe it or not, also to flamers. We allow the mods of the forums to do what they do best and take care of things before they blow up out of control. We all talk about how things will change before and after release when more people arrive. Our happy little home on the net COULD become a nightmare, then again maybe not. Being that the forums are privately run, the rules can be a bit more strict. Yes I know all about freedom of speech etc, but some fail to realise that freedom of speech has nothing to do with freedom to act like a complete idiot online. I'm sure there will be forums to suit all types of posters. But I can guarentee that the two forums I visit won't become full of one line flames like stfu! l2p! l2r! Can I have your stuff? Which is what many official forums end up like. The private owners don't have to worry about stepping on the toes of their customers. They don't have to worry about the backlash of hate they might receive. They can ban those that misbehave and those that are banned are free to look elsewhere for somewhere to post about the game. Hopefully with a lesson learned, though probably not in some cases :P Could Mythic do this? Sure. But why have the extra headache? It isn't even about money really.
So, anyone in doubt feel free to join one of the forums already out there or if you can't find one that suites your tastes, create one of your own! Mythic has a list of fansites, some of which have forums, on the main Warhammer Online page. Perhaps you can see for yourself that we are already building a pretty strong community both in forums and on irc where yes, Richard Mythic does frequent as well as a dev or two. Mythic is definately NOT without representation within the growing WAR community, they do indeed care and they do post and they do chat on IRC sometimes.