Billing Issues? Ya Right. Scam More Like It.

Valkanisar

all these problems with billing and hacked server is sickening. this bowman character was always a bit shady.
looks like this was a quick way to gain some cash fast then worry about the chargebacks later. just this EI's actions and non-actions spell out SCAMMED. It development companies like this that make it really hard for the "little guys" to get any where in the mmorpg business.

I mean how dumb can people be to know how to program and design the code for a billing system but not know that info is over secure lines only? Such BS if you ask me. "oops lets us bill you 3 times today cause bob forgot to buy donuts for the office."

Luckily for me i left this game quickly after beta. it was so obvious where this was heading after release and they went bankrupt. To tell you the truth, spite all the bugs and content that was not in release there was still something about this game that i liked. though i would never give out my info to these #*@(*&;(
"thanks for using our unsecure lines, we promise it was criminals who did the hacking, not us."

Wonder if they went and dumped all that cash into some stocks. what ever it is that was done, no matter what they say, this was all planned in advance. looks too smooth.... cough cough, ya right....

Zorvan

Yep, even if Tulga was responsible, EI still knew what was happening and did nothing. I'd say that maybe Bowman and the rest did have something to do with it, but then EI said "hell, we'll just blame it all on Tulga and Bowman. Free money!! Don't fix it 'til we have to!" Personally, I'm waiting to see what comes out from the Attorney General investigation. I really hope some arrest are made so anyone else will think twice before pulling this crap.

RageMonster

Well I for one really appreciated the expose' that this web site did on EI.  Loved the way they held Ed Andercheck accountable for his blatent spindoctoring and the announcement the next week after that they were being investigated was icing on the cake.

I wish they EI folks would sell the game to the fans and let the thing go F2P as shadowbane and other games have gone.  There are people who can develope the game and grow it better, even on a shoestring budget.

JelloB2000

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Originally posted by skitzdout
all these problems with billing and hacked server is sickening.(...)

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There was no hacking because there was nothing to hack, no security at all.
Just shows to beware games with a bad history where you need to use a credit-card.

MCH-Spartan

How did you stop the billing? , there site says ive got no current subscriptions so it wont let me cancel it. yet there still billing me

Zorvan

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Originally posted by MCH-Spartan
How did you stop the billing? , there site says ive got no current subscriptions so it wont let me cancel it. yet there still billing me

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If you get no answer from customer service, contact The Better Business Bureau to let them know and then contact the Atlanta Attorney General's Office, as they already have an investigation going.

Ankua

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Originally posted by Zorvan




Originally posted by MCH-Spartan
How did you stop the billing? , there site says ive got no current subscriptions so it wont let me cancel it. yet there still billing me

If you get no answer from customer service, contact The Better Business Bureau to let them know and then contact the Atlanta Attorney General's Office, as they already have an investigation going.

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Billing Issues

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We understand the frustration some are having with billing and other related issues. We would like to ask players to keep communications about billing off the forums and instead go directly to EI. You can contact myself, Amadan, or Nagafen on the boards and PM us with your problems, you can email us at support@istaria.com .

Some issues are outside of our ability to influence altogether and you will need to contact PayByTouch. They can be reached at

customerservice@paybytouch.com
1-866-729-2986 (US)
0800 032 6048 (UK)
http://paybytouch.com/contact/index.html

Here is how to cancel.

Zorvan

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Originally posted by Ankua
Originally posted by Zorvan Originally posted by MCH-SpartanHow did you stop the billing? , there site says ive got no current subscriptions so it wont let me cancel it. yet there still billing me

If you get no answer from customer service, contact The Better Business Bureau to let them know and then contact the Atlanta Attorney General's Office, as they already have an investigation going.

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Billing Issues

We understand the frustration some are having with billing and other related issues. We would like to ask players to keep communications about billing off the forums and instead go directly to EI. You can contact myself, Amadan, or Nagafen on the boards and PM us with your problems, you can email us at support@istaria.com .Some issues are outside of our ability to influence altogether and you will need to contact PayByTouch. They can be reached at customerservice@paybytouch.com 1-866-729-2986 (US) 0800 032 6048 (UK)http://paybytouch.com/contact/index.html

Here is how to cancel.

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I always love that part. Why don't they just come out and say "Don't let the other players know that you are getting fleeced the same as them. Talk to us directly so we can ignore you, continue to bill you, and still try to look good to people who don't know."

RageMonster

 


We understand the frustration some are having with billing and other related issues. We would like to ask players to keep communications about billing off the forums and instead go directly to EI. You can contact myself, Amadan, or Nagafen on the boards and PM us with your problems, you can email us at support@istaria.com .

Some issues are outside of our ability to influence altogether and you will need to contact PayByTouch. They can be reached at

 <snip>
 
 
lol... Yes please don't any of YOU from the "vocal minority" try to warn anyone else that we are going to rip you off.  Controling PayByTouch directly they can't do, but let me tell you what they could have done:
 
1. Don't offer a free trial on the front page of your business web site that really is not free.  If you know that a lot of your potential customers are going to get charged immediately you need to take the free offer down until PayByTouch gets it right.
 
2. You picked PayByTouch to handle your billing, your players did not have any say in this.  Don't have people like Ed Andercheck on staff that will enrage your customer base by saying it is the players fault or deny there even is a problem and imply that anyone whole complains about being billed over and over for a service they don't want, is a troublemaker.  If you pick a service that is harming your customers then you have to either get them to wake up or you have to move your business to another billing service.
 
3. Be available to help.  When I was hit for the charge and the free that resulted for going over the limit I found it extreemely difficult to contact anyone in the organization, and obvoiusly if you look at the fact the BBB has them listed as "unable to locate" I know there a lot of others that ran into the same problem.  I went to the EI web page and email everyone who had anything to do with the company that had an email address listed and most of them bounced.  All it would have taken in the begining is for someone to email me back and help me get a refund for what was a seroius mistake on their part.  Ignore the customer and it will only get worse.
 
4. Don't immediately ban anyone with an oposing viewpoint that posts on the official forums.  Use this as a chance to contact the customer and work things out.  In fact, this would be a great time to post to them with assurance that the problem will be resolved and after you fix it (you really have to help them for this to work) you can post again and let them and everyone else know that you took care of them.  If you nuke anyone that questions your shady business practices it will have a giant impact on what those that are left will think of you. 
 
5. In every decision you make and every communication you post remember one thing...  the player is the entire reason you have the game.  They are your paying customer and you need to ensure your actions are aimed at retaining their business and generating new business on a daily basis.  If any part of your business is not focused on this basic strategy, you need to change.  There are things that have been done that goes against this principal and that is what the problem truly is. 
 
Don't post and say "keep any comment that exposes what we do off the public forum" and instead take responsibility and hold yourself accountable for what you have caused.  Own it brother and then fix it and you will be on the road to gaining creditability whit the gaming community.  In fact let me help you.
 
Next time say something like this:
 
"We apologize for OUR billing issues and customer non-service we have been subjecting you, the loyal customers and new customers to.  We ask that in addition to posting to public forums you also give us the chance to fix our mistakes and make things right with you.  You can also feel free to post on our forums again and we can use this as a place to get your feedback and make the game a better experience for you.  Call us toll free at xxx-xxx-xxxx or email us at blahblahblah@istara.com and we will have a real person with our company resolve the problem.  Really we will this time!  And it won't be Ed so don't worry.  If your problem is related to your bill don't call PayByTouch directly.  When we are working with you to get the problem resolved, we will get full information and I personally assure you, I will have a conversation with the person at PayByTouch that has the power to solve the problem.  I am not going to pass the buck.  We have chosen this billing company and WE are their customer.  I am going to hold them accountable for what they have done to our business and ultimately to you, our customer.  If they are not willing to do this then I am going to refund your money then I will go after them for that plus a fee, and we will be going with a new billing service that has their act together.  Once again, sorry for the trouble."
 
lol... ok maybe not exactly like that but you get the point.  You guys have to get off the idea that it is the customers fault this are going poorly and look at your business practices.  Get right or be gone.
 
 

Geeky

I used to love HZ...I HATE EII.

 

These mother F'ers stole money from me.  I haven't subscribed to HZ since last April.  I check my account this past month and guess what?  Your right, they have been charging me.  The didn't charge me in May, or June, or July, or August, but I got charged in September somehow and in October somehow.  I haven't reactivated my accoutn or even attempted to log into the game.  These bastards are criminals.

Danger

  You seem to be one of many.  To top it all off the sleeze balls changed the company name to free them of any debt.  

MW2K

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Originally posted by Danger
You seem to be one of many. To top it all off the sleeze balls changed the company name to free them of any debt.

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How does that free you of debt? Maybe my understanding of US business law isn't all there, but that's fraud, IMHO.

Hadesprime

the sale to PME was just another legal dodge that all Horizons developers are famous for.

They basically moved themselves to a state where the officers of a company cannot be legally held liable for the actions of the corporation.

right now they are under investigation by the Montana AG for wire fraud and several other issues related to the rather crooked billing system they have in place. If they had stayed as EII based where they would People like Ed Anderchuck and Mr Rask could personally be held responsible and LIABLE for those charges. Now the best that can happen is that the company PME can be held but that would absolve Anderchuck and Rask from their persona decisions during this all. hey are trying to avoid personal legal persecution should it come to that.

However some say that doesnt matter.

Pietoro

Originally posted by Danger

  You seem to be one of many.  To top it all off the sleeze balls changed the company name to free them of any debt.  

Just like what Tulga did? My gawd, hasn't this game and it's community been abused enough?!



=(

Danger

Originally posted by Pietoro

Originally posted by Danger

  You seem to be one of many.  To top it all off the sleeze balls changed the company name to free them of any debt.  

Just like what Tulga did? My gawd, hasn't this game and it's community been abused enough?!



=(   I was only with Tulga for a few months.   Trust me, From what I had seen, the Tulga team were angels compared to these guys.   They are businessmen looking to make a buck at any cost.  There are no developers, no programmers, no real community interaction,  and the forums are ruled with an iron fist.  Their maintenance consists of rebooting the servers.  It's just a matter of time before a major problems comes up that they can't rely on rebooting the server to fix.  Anyone who says it's a matter of taste in gaming, needs their head checked or has some other motive for publicly supporting the game.