I like to visit every area and witness all the features, but I don't really bother with the PvP stuff. The PvP area's of WoW are the busiest I've seen in any MMORPG that I've played. And there is always a load of off the cuff battles going on elsewhere. Infiltrations too. Duelling is also popular to refine your PvP skills or bench test a new system/respec/equipment load out. They have the battle grounds which are instanced arena's where similar levels play traditional team gametypes such as hamburger hill and capture the flag.
There is also a non instanced arena where rival teams of any faction and level compete for a treasure chest.
LMAO at the griefer who's PvP fun was ruined by the addition of "dishonorable kills". Please tell us what game you are now playing instead so that we can all avoid it.
though the battlegrounds have changed pvp, it also has its benifits, like armor / weapons for people who cant get into top guilds, or a quick place to find people. though the hours of time which used to be spent, at south shore and tauren mill were good. but bg's did not remove pvp from the game, you can still grab a group and go for fun.
Battlegrounds, Dishonorable Kills, heavy gear dependency and time required to get it have all made WoW PvP servers moot. Plans to now remove dishonorable kills just shows that they had no PvP server specific plans in the first place. Blizzard should just abandon PvP development and concentrate on the PvE game that WoW really is.
I play on a RP server and enjoy the PVP in WoW. Sure, it's heavily gear dependant, but how do you make a RPG that is not gear dependant? Make everyone strip to their undies and box?
That aside, gear can make it easier, but it doesn't mean instant win. I can take down people with better gear than I have and lose against others with lesser gear than I have one on one. It's like any other game...you have to know your class and their class and how to counter them.
1. it was open pvp instead of faction pvp. if i am a night elf and i want to kill another night elf then damn it i should be able to. And not in battlegrounds or any of that other instanced crap
2. there were consequences for pk'ing somebody. Ganking someone forty levels lower than you should be allowed but you'd better be putting something on the line for it (re: karma in Lineage2)
You can open pvp with your own faction in the Gurbashi Arena in Stranglethorn Vale (have been since inception I believe), and in the arena area by Dire Maul.
I agree there needs to be some consequence for ganking people way lower than you/griefing.
As with so many others, I walked away from WOW Pvp when the BG's and honor system came out. Tried PvE raiding for a year or so..but enough of that for me now....
Currently playing something other than WOW atm, and not really sure I want to go back after BC comes out.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Originally posted by Zuato I play on a RP server and enjoy the PVP in WoW. Sure, it's heavily gear dependant, but how do you make a RPG that is not gear dependant? Make everyone strip to their undies and box?
The key word here is 'heavily'. As for how to make WoW PvP LESS gear dependent, c'mon use your imagination. Of the top of my head here are some ways that I can think of:
1) When you zone into a battleground, your gear is replaced with a standard item set for your class, when you zone out you get your regular gear back.
2) Make raids easier, and faster.
3) Replace random boss drops with quest rewards so that a player does not have to rely on probability and statistics for their gear (ie. if you participate in killing a raid boss then get your epic item from your quest giver).
4) Remove item soulbinding from the game. As hardcore players move onto the next tier, they can sell their lower tier gear to the have nots.
That aside, gear can make it easier, but it doesn't mean instant win. I can take down people with better gear than I have and lose against others with lesser gear than I have one on one. It's like any other game...you have to know your class and their class and how to counter them.
No offense, but you're stating the obvious. The reality is that gear can be a SIGNIFICANT advantage in WoW. Yes there can be occasions where the better equipped player lacks skill or makes a mistake or simply loses due to bad rolls. However more often than not, the full purple geared group will trounce the green/blue PUG in the battlegrounds. IMO structuring gear dependency such that casual players expect to lose a PvP encounter with a better equipped player/group is bad MMO business.
The gear thing isn't unique to wow. A problem with most mmos is that gear progression is linear.
You start off with a rusty sword and you work your way up to a godly sword. The godly sword is really the only option once you can get it. Everyone at the level cap has the exact same sword because all other swords are inferior.
For example say you have two swords. One sword does 90 damage and another that does 100 damage. Which one do you use? The 100 damage one, of course. This is how almost all MMOs work.
A better system would be: one sword does 90 piercing damage and another does 100 slashing damage. Some enemies are weak to piercing damage, some are weak to slashing. Which one do you use? It depends on the circumstances. If the enemy is weak to piercing damage but resistant to slashing damage, you'd want the piercing one. If it was resistant to both equally you'd go for the slashing one.
But no, game developers keep humping the linear model. And why not? Most players are too preocupied with elf bewbs to care about game mechanics. They keep shelling out the fifteen dollars a month for the same old crap because they can't think for themselves and just don't know any better.
Originally posted by trigger190 Balanced or not, I think World of Warcraft PVP sucked ever since they added battlegrounds and dishonorable kills.
End of thread...
------------------------------ You see, every mammal on this planet instinctively develops a natural equilibrium with their surrounding environment, but you humans do not. You spread to an area, and you multiply, and you multiply, until every natural resource is consumed. The only way you can survive is to spread to another area. There is another organism on this planet that follows the same pattern. Do you know what it is? A virus. Human beings are a disease, a cancer of this planet.-Mr.Smith
Originally posted by Zuato I play on a RP server and enjoy the PVP in WoW. Sure, it's heavily gear dependant, but how do you make a RPG that is not gear dependant? Make everyone strip to their undies and box?
There are already games out that aren't heavily gear dependent. It's really simple: you don't use gear as a means of character advancement, and at the level cap you change the advancement system from vertical advancement to horizontal.
My best pvp experiences in WOW were pre Bgs and a honor system. famous battles outside of Tarren Mill, Southshore.. Or raids to Menethil, IF,Ogrimmar, Crossroads had some very good battles as well. Now that was pvp. Now days Pvp in WOW is for the grinders/botters. In fact guilds send in scouts to bgs first to see if they can win quickly or wait out for the next one. WOW PVP sucks these days. Why I went back to DAOC. DAOC is still the best pvp experience around!
It would be more fun if it were more... I don't know... War-like. It's boring for me, and the Horde always owns. The Alliance never even stands a chance.
The honor system has been completely re-vamped... there is no more ranks and honor any more, people get to keep their own ranks for "fun" basically but it is meaningless. As of patch 2.0, everything changes in regards to the old "honor grind". You get special titles now, not ranks. And titles if you are exhaulted with an area.
Personally I find world pvp fun as hell, and never go into battlegrounds. its cool now with the cross-realm system but I always found BG's boring and frusterating and unecessary. I can't tell you how many meaningless high ranks I've killed in my time like nothing, I think people lose skill playing bg's all day wehn it comes to one on one lol.
Originally posted by abbaba It's not horrible, it's not fantastic either. At least they keep improving and adding to it.
ERm some of their current "improvements" consist of removing or altering former "improvements" that everyone hated almost instantly and they took over a year to make that change. For example DKs and the honor system.
Originally posted by gestalt11 Originally posted by abbaba It's not horrible, it's not fantastic either. At least they keep improving and adding to it.
ERm some of their current "improvements" consist of removing or altering former "improvements" that everyone hated almost instantly and they took over a year to make that change. For example DKs and the honor system. They're always adding new battlegrounds, and apparently in the next patch there's going to be some sort of world pvp system and a team dueling system.
Gearing out a level 19, 29, 39... to the max to fight players who are still wearing greens and grays is not PvP.
WoW Bg's are a huge joke. Quite frankly, I salute all under-geared players who give it a go, knowing full well their life span is the equivilent of two hits by anything glowing.
Players have been suggesting stat and gear caps for BG's for over a year - hoping to encourage true PvP, but their suggestions went ignored. Those are the players I would have loved to have played against; the ones who wanted to win by skill, not by gear. Until skill is a factor (mod free), PvP does not exist. In fact it should be called "GvG, Gear vs Gear" as calling it PvP is really a discredit to the true PvP'r.
Just thinking about it makes me miss good old Felucca, when the best anyone could have was a vanq sword.
Those of you who missed out on the good old fashioned PvP and grew up in a world of uber leet gear really did miss out on seriouse gaming fun. I'd have sympathy for you, but unfortunately, someone has allready whipped out an epic sword of emotion stealing, so I have none to give.
Comments
I tend to avoid PvP in all RPG's.
I like to visit every area and witness all the features, but I don't really bother with the PvP stuff. The PvP area's of WoW are the busiest I've seen in any MMORPG that I've played. And there is always a load of off the cuff battles going on elsewhere. Infiltrations too. Duelling is also popular to refine your PvP skills or bench test a new system/respec/equipment load out. They have the battle grounds which are instanced arena's where similar levels play traditional team gametypes such as hamburger hill and capture the flag.
There is also a non instanced arena where rival teams of any faction and level compete for a treasure chest.
LMAO at the griefer who's PvP fun was ruined by the addition of "dishonorable kills". Please tell us what game you are now playing instead so that we can all avoid it.
That aside, gear can make it easier, but it doesn't mean instant win. I can take down people with better gear than I have and lose against others with lesser gear than I have one on one. It's like any other game...you have to know your class and their class and how to counter them.
1. it was open pvp instead of faction pvp. if i am a night elf and i want to kill another night elf then damn it i should be able to. And not in battlegrounds or any of that other instanced crap
2. there were consequences for pk'ing somebody. Ganking someone forty levels lower than you should be allowed but you'd better be putting something on the line for it (re: karma in Lineage2)
I agree there needs to be some consequence for ganking people way lower than you/griefing.
As with so many others, I walked away from WOW Pvp when the BG's and honor system came out. Tried PvE raiding for a year or so..but enough of that for me now....
Currently playing something other than WOW atm, and not really sure I want to go back after BC comes out.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
You start off with a rusty sword and you work your way up to a godly sword. The godly sword is really the only option once you can get it. Everyone at the level cap has the exact same sword because all other swords are inferior.
For example say you have two swords. One sword does 90 damage and another that does 100 damage. Which one do you use? The 100 damage one, of course. This is how almost all MMOs work.
A better system would be: one sword does 90 piercing damage and another does 100 slashing damage. Some enemies are weak to piercing damage, some are weak to slashing. Which one do you use? It depends on the circumstances. If the enemy is weak to piercing damage but resistant to slashing damage, you'd want the piercing one. If it was resistant to both equally you'd go for the slashing one.
But no, game developers keep humping the linear model. And why not? Most players are too preocupied with elf bewbs to care about game mechanics. They keep shelling out the fifteen dollars a month for the same old crap because they can't think for themselves and just don't know any better.
------------------------------
You see, every mammal on this planet instinctively develops a natural equilibrium with their surrounding environment, but you humans do not. You spread to an area, and you multiply, and you multiply, until every natural resource is consumed. The only way you can survive is to spread to another area. There is another organism on this planet that follows the same pattern. Do you know what it is? A virus. Human beings are a disease, a cancer of this planet.-Mr.Smith
Hello there, adventurer!
The honor system has been completely re-vamped... there is no more ranks and honor any more, people get to keep their own ranks for "fun" basically but it is meaningless. As of patch 2.0, everything changes in regards to the old "honor grind". You get special titles now, not ranks. And titles if you are exhaulted with an area.
Personally I find world pvp fun as hell, and never go into battlegrounds. its cool now with the cross-realm system but I always found BG's boring and frusterating and unecessary. I can't tell you how many meaningless high ranks I've killed in my time like nothing, I think people lose skill playing bg's all day wehn it comes to one on one lol.
No risks, no rewards
Zerg's and BG FTW
=! fun IMO.
ERm some of their current "improvements" consist of removing or altering former "improvements" that everyone hated almost instantly and they took over a year to make that change. For example DKs and the honor system.
They're always adding new battlegrounds, and apparently in the next patch there's going to be some sort of world pvp system and a team dueling system.
Naw. WoW's PvP died the day they included dishonorable kills...
I used to have so much fun sieging towns - now if you, or one of your party, targets a 'civilian', you stand to loose days of honor.
WoW BG's = PvP?
Absolutely not.
Gearing out a level 19, 29, 39... to the max to fight players who are still wearing greens and grays is not PvP.
WoW Bg's are a huge joke. Quite frankly, I salute all under-geared players who give it a go, knowing full well their life span is the equivilent of two hits by anything glowing.
Players have been suggesting stat and gear caps for BG's for over a year - hoping to encourage true PvP, but their suggestions went ignored. Those are the players I would have loved to have played against; the ones who wanted to win by skill, not by gear. Until skill is a factor (mod free), PvP does not exist. In fact it should be called "GvG, Gear vs Gear" as calling it PvP is really a discredit to the true PvP'r.
Just thinking about it makes me miss good old Felucca, when the best anyone could have was a vanq sword.
Those of you who missed out on the good old fashioned PvP and grew up in a world of uber leet gear really did miss out on seriouse gaming fun. I'd have sympathy for you, but unfortunately, someone has allready whipped out an epic sword of emotion stealing, so I have none to give.
-Ashyn