You have said in the past ((no Im not going to waste the time to go back and find your exact words..which is handy for you, as you'll no doubt have your "SEE YOU CANT FIND ANYTHING" locked and loaded)) that SOE will ruin this game just like SWG, yadda-yadda-fuck'n-yadda.
As for my remarks...it's only equivalently as lame as you're 'poor man's winston churchhill with a dry slice of humor' speeches are. Besides, It entertained ME..and that's all that matters as far as message boards go..savvy?
Well, it's entertaining me as well. Win/win for all involved, I guess.
And no, I never said SOE would ruin the game. Unless they do a piss poor job of marketing it, or use subpar servers. Any fault for the game itself lies squarely on the shoulders of Sigil.
And SWG was ruined by a team effort FWIW. And Jedi. Only thing I'd say that I could fault SOE for was the PoP expansion, and making some questionable customer service calls back in the day. Hell, they've done a rather good job of turning EQ2 around from launch.
It strikes me that you are a HUGE hypocrit. From what I can tell from some of your other posts, you are already in the Vanguard Beta, yet you persist in knocking it all over the forums. Further to that, the fact that you think EQ2 is "improving" speaks volumes. EQ2 is slowly turning into WoW, it is being systematically dumbed down. As SeriphinX said, if you dont like the way Vanguard is then you might as well leave because it's not changing. That's it, that's all!
Originally posted by Aethios I remember the days when playing an RPG was about the stories you walked away with, the adventures, the exploration, the BUILDING. Yes, we had items that BROKE and we made NEW ones. We also had BUILDINGS (and in some games, vehicles) which added another level of depth. People didn't kill monsters to level-up and "rox0rz!1!," they killed monsters because the monsters were fun to kill, or because there was something interesting on the other side.All this talk about "hardcore" carries the stench of people wanting a more brutally boring and mind-numbing game than WoW already is. It's a lose-lose situation, guys. It's time to start thinking for yourself now.
Exactly. All of my fond memories of the EQ days were about the world itself, and my interaction with it. Mainly, because it actually felt like a world. Might also have a good bit to do with it being my first 3d MMO as well.
I think the communities that developed on each server had alot to do with it also. At least until they added the Bazaar, and the instaport books in PoP. Auction houses, and mailboxes have done more to kill the sense of community in these games than any other feature. Being able to solo to max level hasn't helped much either, I'll grant you.
The people comprising the communities have changed as well. If I had to wager, I'd say many of the people that came to EQ initially came from either a MUD, or PnP roleplay background, or both. Whereas now, you have more console jockies playing MMOs, and doing so as if it were a single player game. And of course, you have guilds moving wholesale from game to game, so they stay in their self contained community, and don't interact much with the rest of the server at large. Yeah, you had to go out, and find a rogue, or a necro, or a cleric in EQ, but really, I don't think that did much to foster community. Of all the times I had to hire a necro, or cleric, it was usually a very brief, and business like affair. I don't think it made people any better players, either. There were plenty of people in their 50's and beyond that still had no clue what they were doing. Especially in dungeons.
I know there are a lot of people that want that feeling they had in EQ back. Hell, I do to. But I don't think it's possible to get it back, honestly. You can only lose your virginity once, or somesuch. You'll get no arguements from me that so called "ez mode" games like WoW do little to foster community, and while Azeroth itself is very pretty, and there were certainly some ooh ahh moments, it never had that "worldy" feeling that EQ had. But I don't think that increasing the death penalties is going to recreate it.
However, given that Sigil seem to be big on servers with different rulesets, I say they just do a "hardcore" server or two for those that think that doubling up on the current death penalties, which are fine as is, would make the game better. The rest can stick with the current death penalty, and everyone is happy. I suppose, if they were strapped for cash, they could throw in an EZcore server, and try to siphon off some subs from other games as well.
No thanks, WoW doesnt have "hardcore" servers. You are going to have to face the fact that Vanguard wont be a game for you given the opinions you have expressed.
Originally posted by Sharkypal Originally posted by Coldmeat
Originally posted by SeriphinX You have said in the past ((no Im not going to waste the time to go back and find your exact words..which is handy for you, as you'll no doubt have your "SEE YOU CANT FIND ANYTHING" locked and loaded)) that SOE will ruin this game just like SWG, yadda-yadda-fuck'n-yadda. As for my remarks...it's only equivalently as lame as you're 'poor man's winston churchhill with a dry slice of humor' speeches are. Besides, It entertained ME..and that's all that matters as far as message boards go..savvy?
Well, it's entertaining me as well. Win/win for all involved, I guess. And no, I never said SOE would ruin the game. Unless they do a piss poor job of marketing it, or use subpar servers. Any fault for the game itself lies squarely on the shoulders of Sigil.
And SWG was ruined by a team effort FWIW. And Jedi. Only thing I'd say that I could fault SOE for was the PoP expansion, and making some questionable customer service calls back in the day. Hell, they've done a rather good job of turning EQ2 around from launch.
It strikes me that you are a HUGE hypocrit. From what I can tell from some of your other posts, you are already in the Vanguard Beta, yet you persist in knocking it all over the forums. Further to that, the fact that you think EQ2 is "improving" speaks volumes. EQ2 is slowly turning into WoW, it is being systematically dumbed down. As SeriphinX said, if you dont like the way Vanguard is then you might as well leave because it's not changing. That's it, that's all!
Yep, I'm a hypocrite, because I like some parts of a game, but feel that others detract, or increasing them would detract from the gameplay.
Yes, EQ2 has had parts made easier. My fault for not being specific, I guess. When I said improved I was thinking more along the lines of performance, and some of the more esoteric gameplay ideas, like not having healers be able to do run by heals/buffs while in a locked encounter. I haven't played in some while, so I'm partly going from what I've hear on the EQ2 forums here.
The changes to the spirit shards, and the xp debt are a mixed bag. I can live with xp debt caused by myself, or my group dieing. But when I get hit with xp debt because someone in the group died on the way back, from zones away? Not so much. And a lot of people didn't like that aspect of it. Now, you could argue that they nerfed the xp debt amounts too much, and I'd be inclined to agree for the most part. I don't mind xp debt, because you still make forward progress, albeit very slowly. XP loss, I don't care for, and deleveling is just silly, frankly.
I've heard that the new expansion is more like what the people expecting an actual sequel to EQ were expecting, but having not played it I don't know.
Out of curiousity, what else, besides the xp debt, do you feel they have done to make it more like WoW?
Aside from the changes to crafting? Which as a non crafter, I liked, but I understand why the crafting community hated them.
I remember the days when playing an RPG was about the stories you walked away with, the adventures, the exploration, the BUILDING. Yes, we had items that BROKE and we made NEW ones. We also had BUILDINGS (and in some games, vehicles) which added another level of depth. People didn't kill monsters to level-up and "rox0rz!1!," they killed monsters because the monsters were fun to kill, or because there was something interesting on the other side.
All this talk about "hardcore" carries the stench of people wanting a more brutally boring and mind-numbing game than WoW already is. It's a lose-lose situation, guys. It's time to start thinking for yourself now.
Exactly. All of my fond memories of the EQ days were about the world itself, and my interaction with it. Mainly, because it actually felt like a world. Might also have a good bit to do with it being my first 3d MMO as well.
I think the communities that developed on each server had alot to do with it also. At least until they added the Bazaar, and the instaport books in PoP. Auction houses, and mailboxes have done more to kill the sense of community in these games than any other feature. Being able to solo to max level hasn't helped much either, I'll grant you.
The people comprising the communities have changed as well. If I had to wager, I'd say many of the people that came to EQ initially came from either a MUD, or PnP roleplay background, or both. Whereas now, you have more console jockies playing MMOs, and doing so as if it were a single player game. And of course, you have guilds moving wholesale from game to game, so they stay in their self contained community, and don't interact much with the rest of the server at large. Yeah, you had to go out, and find a rogue, or a necro, or a cleric in EQ, but really, I don't think that did much to foster community. Of all the times I had to hire a necro, or cleric, it was usually a very brief, and business like affair. I don't think it made people any better players, either. There were plenty of people in their 50's and beyond that still had no clue what they were doing. Especially in dungeons.
I know there are a lot of people that want that feeling they had in EQ back. Hell, I do to. But I don't think it's possible to get it back, honestly. You can only lose your virginity once, or somesuch. You'll get no arguements from me that so called "ez mode" games like WoW do little to foster community, and while Azeroth itself is very pretty, and there were certainly some ooh ahh moments, it never had that "worldy" feeling that EQ had. But I don't think that increasing the death penalties is going to recreate it.
However, given that Sigil seem to be big on servers with different rulesets, I say they just do a "hardcore" server or two for those that think that doubling up on the current death penalties, which are fine as is, would make the game better. The rest can stick with the current death penalty, and everyone is happy. I suppose, if they were strapped for cash, they could throw in an EZcore server, and try to siphon off some subs from other games as well.
well you touched on something earlier..and I'll be fair with ya..you spoke of bring in something that's challenging that doesn't necessarily constitute time sink or harsh death penalty..My question is, unless you got people thinking WAAAY outside the box..it's gonna be hard to get that challenge in any other form. Age of Conan sounds pretty neat in that you actually have some type of free movement of your weapon which sounds intriqueing. But other than that..theres not much there in challenge in MMO's really..I mean, look at what we got..a more powerfull mob usually means the age old formula of: More HP + More Damage it can do + More damage it can absorb=hard mob. And it isn't like games like WoW all of a sudden change the whole landscape..they use the exact same template as everyone else.
For originality I tell ya what I'd like to see..is an mmo that has humor in it..I don't mean the accidental kind...but its a comedy-fantasy mmorpg..Heck one of the specials a mob could have is it searches for the weakest member of the team and starts dribbling them like a basketball until the tank can gain its interest again..Wouldn't you love to see a gnome getting dribbled in an out of some huge Ogre's legs like he used to play for the Miami Heat?
We'll be hardpressed to find mmo's in this poorly managed society where you feel drawn in, the combat feels perfect and the mobs seem interesting and challenging without causing you to have to foreclose on your house just to get a cleric to rezz you. I understand some people's pain on not wanting harsh death. But to phrase George Carlin "this is the best we can do folks...garbage in...garbage out" And if playing something a little different than WoW means enduring hard penalties..Sure, I'll give it a go..didn't bother me before, it shouldn't bother me now.
You have said in the past ((no Im not going to waste the time to go back and find your exact words..which is handy for you, as you'll no doubt have your "SEE YOU CANT FIND ANYTHING" locked and loaded)) that SOE will ruin this game just like SWG, yadda-yadda-fuck'n-yadda.
As for my remarks...it's only equivalently as lame as you're 'poor man's winston churchhill with a dry slice of humor' speeches are. Besides, It entertained ME..and that's all that matters as far as message boards go..savvy?
Well, it's entertaining me as well. Win/win for all involved, I guess.
And no, I never said SOE would ruin the game. Unless they do a piss poor job of marketing it, or use subpar servers. Any fault for the game itself lies squarely on the shoulders of Sigil.
And SWG was ruined by a team effort FWIW. And Jedi. Only thing I'd say that I could fault SOE for was the PoP expansion, and making some questionable customer service calls back in the day. Hell, they've done a rather good job of turning EQ2 around from launch.
It strikes me that you are a HUGE hypocrit. From what I can tell from some of your other posts, you are already in the Vanguard Beta, yet you persist in knocking it all over the forums. Further to that, the fact that you think EQ2 is "improving" speaks volumes. EQ2 is slowly turning into WoW, it is being systematically dumbed down. As SeriphinX said, if you dont like the way Vanguard is then you might as well leave because it's not changing. That's it, that's all!
Yep, I'm a hypocrite, because I like some parts of a game, but feel that others detract, or increasing them would detract from the gameplay.
Yes, EQ2 has had parts made easier. My fault for not being specific, I guess. When I said improved I was thinking more along the lines of performance, and some of the more esoteric gameplay ideas, like not having healers be able to do run by heals/buffs while in a locked encounter. I haven't played in some while, so I'm partly going from what I've hear on the EQ2 forums here.
The changes to the spirit shards, and the xp debt are a mixed bag. I can live with xp debt caused by myself, or my group dieing. But when I get hit with xp debt because someone in the group died on the way back, from zones away? Not so much. And a lot of people didn't like that aspect of it. Now, you could argue that they nerfed the xp debt amounts too much, and I'd be inclined to agree for the most part. I don't mind xp debt, because you still make forward progress, albeit very slowly. XP loss, I don't care for, and deleveling is just silly, frankly.
I've heard that the new expansion is more like what the people expecting an actual sequel to EQ were expecting, but having not played it I don't know.
Out of curiousity, what else, besides the xp debt, do you feel they have done to make it more like WoW?
Aside from the changes to crafting? Which as a non crafter, I liked, but I understand why the crafting community hated them.
I guess you've played EoF? Thats what drove me to quit my guild and limit my time in EQ2. Obviously they fecked the crafting over (much the same way as they did in SWG). The entire concept of the Raiding end game does not appeal to me at all. I definitely prefer the sandbox of games like post NGE SWG and Vanguard. I like to be able to log in and do something with a couple of friends. EQ2 is very limiting, they promised alot of things in EoF and one of them was a lot of small group and single player content. There is some , but for the most part it's crap and ridiculously easy. I think the major thing that EQ2 and WoW are missing that EQ definitely did have was that sense of "adventuring". While this may not be something that everyone appreciates, it is the number one reason I play MMOs and Vanguard seems to be trying to capture that aspect in no small measure.
Originally posted by Sharkypal I guess you've played EoF? Thats what drove me to quit my guild and limit my time in EQ2. Obviously they fecked the crafting over (much the same way as they did in SWG). The entire concept of the Raiding end game does not appeal to me at all. I definitely prefer the sandbox of games like post NGE SWG and Vanguard. I like to be able to log in and do something with a couple of friends. EQ2 is very limiting, they promised alot of things in EoF and one of them was a lot of small group and single player content. There is some , but for the most part it's crap and ridiculously easy. I think the major thing that EQ2 and WoW are missing that EQ definitely did have was that sense of "adventuring". While this may not be something that everyone appreciates, it is the number one reason I play MMOs and Vanguard seems to be trying to capture that aspect in no small measure.
Nope, never played EoF. After beta, I played about 6 months after release, and left after a month or so. Came back between the 1st and 2nd expansion. The gameplay was ok, and I had fun, but it's definitely a group-centric game, and at that point, it was difficult to find a group, particularly for things like the Adventure packs.
I'd love to have a game that brought back the urge to actually adventure, a world to get lost in, or whatever you want to call it. Some of the elements are there, to be sure, but they still have a lot of blank spots to fill in, I think.
And yes, I would get a kick out of being dribbled by some giant ogre I'd try to steal aggro, just so I could get dribbled. Especially, if it turned the screen upside down, or whatever.
And since SWG has been brought up quite a bit, I loved the game up until the holocron craze, which I sadly got sucked into as well. The vast amount of customization you could do with your character was great, as was the sandbox style of gameplay, lack of levels, and classes. And the fact that it was a sci-fi game was just icing on the cake. I'm not a crafter type, so I can't speak to that, but it did seem like they had a pretty innovative system.
My only complaints with the game would be the sterility of the world(s) They looked really good, and there was some cool stuff to find, but the worlds just felt empty. "Class balance" in PvP was completely screwy. Other than that, there were a few things that just seemed to be only half realized, like the tapes for clothing. Itemization was a bit wonky to nonexistent as well. Shame what they did to the game with the NGE, though. I tried it out while I had the station pass, and... it made me sad . JtL was still pretty fun, though, as long as you didn't pay attention to the leveling part.
I guess you've played EoF? Thats what drove me to quit my guild and limit my time in EQ2. Obviously they fecked the crafting over (much the same way as they did in SWG). The entire concept of the Raiding end game does not appeal to me at all. I definitely prefer the sandbox of games like post NGE SWG and Vanguard. I like to be able to log in and do something with a couple of friends. EQ2 is very limiting, they promised alot of things in EoF and one of them was a lot of small group and single player content. There is some , but for the most part it's crap and ridiculously easy. I think the major thing that EQ2 and WoW are missing that EQ definitely did have was that sense of "adventuring". While this may not be something that everyone appreciates, it is the number one reason I play MMOs and Vanguard seems to be trying to capture that aspect in no small measure.
Nope, never played EoF. After beta, I played about 6 months after release, and left after a month or so. Came back between the 1st and 2nd expansion. The gameplay was ok, and I had fun, but it's definitely a group-centric game, and at that point, it was difficult to find a group, particularly for things like the Adventure packs.
I'd love to have a game that brought back the urge to actually adventure, a world to get lost in, or whatever you want to call it. Some of the elements are there, to be sure, but they still have a lot of blank spots to fill in, I think.
And yes, I would get a kick out of being dribbled by some giant ogre I'd try to steal aggro, just so I could get dribbled. Especially, if it turned the screen upside down, or whatever.
And since SWG has been brought up quite a bit, I loved the game up until the holocron craze, which I sadly got sucked into as well. The vast amount of customization you could do with your character was great, as was the sandbox style of gameplay, lack of levels, and classes. And the fact that it was a sci-fi game was just icing on the cake. I'm not a crafter type, so I can't speak to that, but it did seem like they had a pretty innovative system.
My only complaints with the game would be the sterility of the world(s) They looked really good, and there was some cool stuff to find, but the worlds just felt empty. "Class balance" in PvP was completely screwy. Other than that, there were a few things that just seemed to be only half realized, like the tapes for clothing. Itemization was a bit wonky to nonexistent as well. Shame what they did to the game with the NGE, though. I tried it out while I had the station pass, and... it made me sad . JtL was still pretty fun, though, as long as you didn't pay attention to the leveling part.
Well, it seems like we have more in common than I thought. I really wouldn't sweat the down time/time sinks, death runs etc. At the end of the day they can be great fun and definitely help groups to bond effectively. You feel like you are actually going through something. I found DAoC a lot like that as well sometimes. Anyway, I hope you stick it out and give Vanguard a chance. It sounds as though there may be something there for you. Sorry if I was a bit harsh, just too many people beating on this game. I think it has some of us old timers on the defensive
Oh, I'm having fun playing, to be sure, despite my grousing here and there. Too much fighting with people that want lvl 50 aggro mobs wandering around newb areas, I guess.
Comments
Well, it's entertaining me as well. Win/win for all involved, I guess.
And no, I never said SOE would ruin the game. Unless they do a piss poor job of marketing it, or use subpar servers. Any fault for the game itself lies squarely on the shoulders of Sigil.
And SWG was ruined by a team effort FWIW. And Jedi. Only thing I'd say that I could fault SOE for was the PoP expansion, and making some questionable customer service calls back in the day. Hell, they've done a rather good job of turning EQ2 around from launch.
It strikes me that you are a HUGE hypocrit. From what I can tell from some of your other posts, you are already in the Vanguard Beta, yet you persist in knocking it all over the forums. Further to that, the fact that you think EQ2 is "improving" speaks volumes. EQ2 is slowly turning into WoW, it is being systematically dumbed down. As SeriphinX said, if you dont like the way Vanguard is then you might as well leave because it's not changing. That's it, that's all!
Exactly. All of my fond memories of the EQ days were about the world itself, and my interaction with it. Mainly, because it actually felt like a world. Might also have a good bit to do with it being my first 3d MMO as well.
I think the communities that developed on each server had alot to do with it also. At least until they added the Bazaar, and the instaport books in PoP. Auction houses, and mailboxes have done more to kill the sense of community in these games than any other feature. Being able to solo to max level hasn't helped much either, I'll grant you.
The people comprising the communities have changed as well. If I had to wager, I'd say many of the people that came to EQ initially came from either a MUD, or PnP roleplay background, or both. Whereas now, you have more console jockies playing MMOs, and doing so as if it were a single player game. And of course, you have guilds moving wholesale from game to game, so they stay in their self contained community, and don't interact much with the rest of the server at large. Yeah, you had to go out, and find a rogue, or a necro, or a cleric in EQ, but really, I don't think that did much to foster community. Of all the times I had to hire a necro, or cleric, it was usually a very brief, and business like affair. I don't think it made people any better players, either. There were plenty of people in their 50's and beyond that still had no clue what they were doing. Especially in dungeons.
I know there are a lot of people that want that feeling they had in EQ back. Hell, I do to. But I don't think it's possible to get it back, honestly. You can only lose your virginity once, or somesuch. You'll get no arguements from me that so called "ez mode" games like WoW do little to foster community, and while Azeroth itself is very pretty, and there were certainly some ooh ahh moments, it never had that "worldy" feeling that EQ had. But I don't think that increasing the death penalties is going to recreate it.
However, given that Sigil seem to be big on servers with different rulesets, I say they just do a "hardcore" server or two for those that think that doubling up on the current death penalties, which are fine as is, would make the game better. The rest can stick with the current death penalty, and everyone is happy. I suppose, if they were strapped for cash, they could throw in an EZcore server, and try to siphon off some subs from other games as well.
No thanks, WoW doesnt have "hardcore" servers. You are going to have to face the fact that Vanguard wont be a game for you given the opinions you have expressed.
Well, it's entertaining me as well. Win/win for all involved, I guess.
And no, I never said SOE would ruin the game. Unless they do a piss poor job of marketing it, or use subpar servers. Any fault for the game itself lies squarely on the shoulders of Sigil.
And SWG was ruined by a team effort FWIW. And Jedi. Only thing I'd say that I could fault SOE for was the PoP expansion, and making some questionable customer service calls back in the day. Hell, they've done a rather good job of turning EQ2 around from launch.
It strikes me that you are a HUGE hypocrit. From what I can tell from some of your other posts, you are already in the Vanguard Beta, yet you persist in knocking it all over the forums. Further to that, the fact that you think EQ2 is "improving" speaks volumes. EQ2 is slowly turning into WoW, it is being systematically dumbed down. As SeriphinX said, if you dont like the way Vanguard is then you might as well leave because it's not changing. That's it, that's all!
Yep, I'm a hypocrite, because I like some parts of a game, but feel that others detract, or increasing them would detract from the gameplay.
Yes, EQ2 has had parts made easier. My fault for not being specific, I guess. When I said improved I was thinking more along the lines of performance, and some of the more esoteric gameplay ideas, like not having healers be able to do run by heals/buffs while in a locked encounter. I haven't played in some while, so I'm partly going from what I've hear on the EQ2 forums here.
The changes to the spirit shards, and the xp debt are a mixed bag. I can live with xp debt caused by myself, or my group dieing. But when I get hit with xp debt because someone in the group died on the way back, from zones away? Not so much. And a lot of people didn't like that aspect of it. Now, you could argue that they nerfed the xp debt amounts too much, and I'd be inclined to agree for the most part. I don't mind xp debt, because you still make forward progress, albeit very slowly. XP loss, I don't care for, and deleveling is just silly, frankly.
I've heard that the new expansion is more like what the people expecting an actual sequel to EQ were expecting, but having not played it I don't know.
Out of curiousity, what else, besides the xp debt, do you feel they have done to make it more like WoW?
Aside from the changes to crafting? Which as a non crafter, I liked, but I understand why the crafting community hated them.
Exactly. All of my fond memories of the EQ days were about the world itself, and my interaction with it. Mainly, because it actually felt like a world. Might also have a good bit to do with it being my first 3d MMO as well.
I think the communities that developed on each server had alot to do with it also. At least until they added the Bazaar, and the instaport books in PoP. Auction houses, and mailboxes have done more to kill the sense of community in these games than any other feature. Being able to solo to max level hasn't helped much either, I'll grant you.
The people comprising the communities have changed as well. If I had to wager, I'd say many of the people that came to EQ initially came from either a MUD, or PnP roleplay background, or both. Whereas now, you have more console jockies playing MMOs, and doing so as if it were a single player game. And of course, you have guilds moving wholesale from game to game, so they stay in their self contained community, and don't interact much with the rest of the server at large. Yeah, you had to go out, and find a rogue, or a necro, or a cleric in EQ, but really, I don't think that did much to foster community. Of all the times I had to hire a necro, or cleric, it was usually a very brief, and business like affair. I don't think it made people any better players, either. There were plenty of people in their 50's and beyond that still had no clue what they were doing. Especially in dungeons.
I know there are a lot of people that want that feeling they had in EQ back. Hell, I do to. But I don't think it's possible to get it back, honestly. You can only lose your virginity once, or somesuch. You'll get no arguements from me that so called "ez mode" games like WoW do little to foster community, and while Azeroth itself is very pretty, and there were certainly some ooh ahh moments, it never had that "worldy" feeling that EQ had. But I don't think that increasing the death penalties is going to recreate it.
However, given that Sigil seem to be big on servers with different rulesets, I say they just do a "hardcore" server or two for those that think that doubling up on the current death penalties, which are fine as is, would make the game better. The rest can stick with the current death penalty, and everyone is happy. I suppose, if they were strapped for cash, they could throw in an EZcore server, and try to siphon off some subs from other games as well.
well you touched on something earlier..and I'll be fair with ya..you spoke of bring in something that's challenging that doesn't necessarily constitute time sink or harsh death penalty..My question is, unless you got people thinking WAAAY outside the box..it's gonna be hard to get that challenge in any other form. Age of Conan sounds pretty neat in that you actually have some type of free movement of your weapon which sounds intriqueing. But other than that..theres not much there in challenge in MMO's really..I mean, look at what we got..a more powerfull mob usually means the age old formula of: More HP + More Damage it can do + More damage it can absorb=hard mob. And it isn't like games like WoW all of a sudden change the whole landscape..they use the exact same template as everyone else.
For originality I tell ya what I'd like to see..is an mmo that has humor in it..I don't mean the accidental kind...but its a comedy-fantasy mmorpg..Heck one of the specials a mob could have is it searches for the weakest member of the team and starts dribbling them like a basketball until the tank can gain its interest again..Wouldn't you love to see a gnome getting dribbled in an out of some huge Ogre's legs like he used to play for the Miami Heat?
We'll be hardpressed to find mmo's in this poorly managed society where you feel drawn in, the combat feels perfect and the mobs seem interesting and challenging without causing you to have to foreclose on your house just to get a cleric to rezz you. I understand some people's pain on not wanting harsh death. But to phrase George Carlin "this is the best we can do folks...garbage in...garbage out" And if playing something a little different than WoW means enduring hard penalties..Sure, I'll give it a go..didn't bother me before, it shouldn't bother me now.
Well, it's entertaining me as well. Win/win for all involved, I guess.
And no, I never said SOE would ruin the game. Unless they do a piss poor job of marketing it, or use subpar servers. Any fault for the game itself lies squarely on the shoulders of Sigil.
And SWG was ruined by a team effort FWIW. And Jedi. Only thing I'd say that I could fault SOE for was the PoP expansion, and making some questionable customer service calls back in the day. Hell, they've done a rather good job of turning EQ2 around from launch.
It strikes me that you are a HUGE hypocrit. From what I can tell from some of your other posts, you are already in the Vanguard Beta, yet you persist in knocking it all over the forums. Further to that, the fact that you think EQ2 is "improving" speaks volumes. EQ2 is slowly turning into WoW, it is being systematically dumbed down. As SeriphinX said, if you dont like the way Vanguard is then you might as well leave because it's not changing. That's it, that's all!
Yep, I'm a hypocrite, because I like some parts of a game, but feel that others detract, or increasing them would detract from the gameplay.
Yes, EQ2 has had parts made easier. My fault for not being specific, I guess. When I said improved I was thinking more along the lines of performance, and some of the more esoteric gameplay ideas, like not having healers be able to do run by heals/buffs while in a locked encounter. I haven't played in some while, so I'm partly going from what I've hear on the EQ2 forums here.
The changes to the spirit shards, and the xp debt are a mixed bag. I can live with xp debt caused by myself, or my group dieing. But when I get hit with xp debt because someone in the group died on the way back, from zones away? Not so much. And a lot of people didn't like that aspect of it. Now, you could argue that they nerfed the xp debt amounts too much, and I'd be inclined to agree for the most part. I don't mind xp debt, because you still make forward progress, albeit very slowly. XP loss, I don't care for, and deleveling is just silly, frankly.
I've heard that the new expansion is more like what the people expecting an actual sequel to EQ were expecting, but having not played it I don't know.
Out of curiousity, what else, besides the xp debt, do you feel they have done to make it more like WoW?
Aside from the changes to crafting? Which as a non crafter, I liked, but I understand why the crafting community hated them.
I guess you've played EoF? Thats what drove me to quit my guild and limit my time in EQ2. Obviously they fecked the crafting over (much the same way as they did in SWG). The entire concept of the Raiding end game does not appeal to me at all. I definitely prefer the sandbox of games like post NGE SWG and Vanguard. I like to be able to log in and do something with a couple of friends. EQ2 is very limiting, they promised alot of things in EoF and one of them was a lot of small group and single player content. There is some , but for the most part it's crap and ridiculously easy. I think the major thing that EQ2 and WoW are missing that EQ definitely did have was that sense of "adventuring". While this may not be something that everyone appreciates, it is the number one reason I play MMOs and Vanguard seems to be trying to capture that aspect in no small measure.
Nope, never played EoF. After beta, I played about 6 months after release, and left after a month or so. Came back between the 1st and 2nd expansion. The gameplay was ok, and I had fun, but it's definitely a group-centric game, and at that point, it was difficult to find a group, particularly for things like the Adventure packs.
I'd love to have a game that brought back the urge to actually adventure, a world to get lost in, or whatever you want to call it. Some of the elements are there, to be sure, but they still have a lot of blank spots to fill in, I think.
And yes, I would get a kick out of being dribbled by some giant ogre
I'd try to steal aggro, just so I could get dribbled. Especially, if it turned the screen upside down, or whatever.
And since SWG has been brought up quite a bit, I loved the game up until the holocron craze, which I sadly got sucked into as well. The vast amount of customization you could do with your character was great, as was the sandbox style of gameplay, lack of levels, and classes. And the fact that it was a sci-fi game was just icing on the cake. I'm not a crafter type, so I can't speak to that, but it did seem like they had a pretty innovative system.
My only complaints with the game would be the sterility of the world(s) They looked really good, and there was some cool stuff to find, but the worlds just felt empty. "Class balance" in PvP was completely screwy. Other than that, there were a few things that just seemed to be only half realized, like the tapes for clothing. Itemization was a bit wonky to nonexistent as well. Shame what they did to the game with the NGE, though. I tried it out while I had the station pass, and... it made me sad
. JtL was still pretty fun, though, as long as you didn't pay attention to the leveling part.
Nope, never played EoF. After beta, I played about 6 months after release, and left after a month or so. Came back between the 1st and 2nd expansion. The gameplay was ok, and I had fun, but it's definitely a group-centric game, and at that point, it was difficult to find a group, particularly for things like the Adventure packs.
I'd love to have a game that brought back the urge to actually adventure, a world to get lost in, or whatever you want to call it. Some of the elements are there, to be sure, but they still have a lot of blank spots to fill in, I think.
And yes, I would get a kick out of being dribbled by some giant ogre
I'd try to steal aggro, just so I could get dribbled. Especially, if it turned the screen upside down, or whatever.
And since SWG has been brought up quite a bit, I loved the game up until the holocron craze, which I sadly got sucked into as well. The vast amount of customization you could do with your character was great, as was the sandbox style of gameplay, lack of levels, and classes. And the fact that it was a sci-fi game was just icing on the cake. I'm not a crafter type, so I can't speak to that, but it did seem like they had a pretty innovative system.
My only complaints with the game would be the sterility of the world(s) They looked really good, and there was some cool stuff to find, but the worlds just felt empty. "Class balance" in PvP was completely screwy. Other than that, there were a few things that just seemed to be only half realized, like the tapes for clothing. Itemization was a bit wonky to nonexistent as well. Shame what they did to the game with the NGE, though. I tried it out while I had the station pass, and... it made me sad
. JtL was still pretty fun, though, as long as you didn't pay attention to the leveling part.
Well, it seems like we have more in common than I thought. I really wouldn't sweat the down time/time sinks, death runs etc. At the end of the day they can be great fun and definitely help groups to bond effectively. You feel like you are actually going through something. I found DAoC a lot like that as well sometimes. Anyway, I hope you stick it out and give Vanguard a chance. It sounds as though there may be something there for you. Sorry if I was a bit harsh, just too many people beating on this game. I think it has some of us old timers on the defensive
Oh, I'm having fun playing, to be sure, despite my grousing here and there. Too much fighting with people that want lvl 50 aggro mobs wandering around newb areas, I guess.