Random Bannings, I'm at a Complete Loss Now

shae

So I just got word that 6 people from our guild (of about 30+) received suspension notices this afternoon after trying to log on.

To give anyone who cares a general idea, 2 of these people I've known fairly well since Beta3 and the other 4 are two husband and wives couples that I have been friends with since we played EQ2 Beta and well into release. I would say we've known each other for 3+ years now.

It's all a bit convoluted ATM but from what I've gathered, upon logging in they've received a message which states they are in violation of the Terms of Service and Agreement that they agreed too on instalation of the game by purchasing in game products through 3rd party avenues. The message reads on to say something along the lines of this being a strict policy and there is a "Zero-Tolerance" policy in affect.

Now first I want to say that this did not happen to me nor have I seen this for myself, just your basic cut and paste jobs through Email, NOR am I naive enough to think you can always know what people do 100% of the time for absolute certain.

But as I say that, I can almost promise you that none of these people would never, ever, EVER buy products (I'm assuming this is coin) from a 3rd party to play in game. They are at best casual players who are completely more concerend with Role Playing then they are with leveling. For the most part, these people were all crafters and low levels and in reality had not even amassed that large a bank roll over the last 2 weeks.

What's more odd is that these people are all mature, older players who were all having a good time playing the game and not saying a peep about whatever issues would spring up here and there. About the only contact any of them  has had with GM's or the like was yesterday when one of the girls from the one of the couples I mentioned had her character get stuck yesterday, she put in a ticket and a couple of hours later she was out and playing for the evening again.

The only response that any of them have received when Mailing SOE support about the issue was this one reply which stated something along the lines of: "We do not and will not comment on any player suspensions made for purchasing currency or otherwise".

It's all very dissapointing and completely baffling, I've heard of a few issues here and there but this really has caught alot of us off guard. Like I said, there's no way of ever knowing what someone would or would not do for sure but I'd bet my own account any day of the week that these people would never do such a thing, especially not all 6 of them. For all I know, my account is banned, which I can't check until I get home tonight.

Anyone else had any issuess or has heard anything around the same lines?

matraque

that sucks if they haven't bought.  If they did, well... they knew Sigil policy i suppose.









Some people that i know bought money in other games and i never expected it.  Happens all the time.

TommyKHart

It sounds strange that 6 of 30 guild member would be band but not knowing the facts its hard to know the truth. Maybe the offline market is bigger than most would believe. I know i brought isk on eve and the amount of isk sold on ebay is huge. I wouldn't be suprised if theres alot of offline sale going on.

It sounds like sigill are making a point. I wouldn't of thought they would kick out the customers if they didn't have grounds to do so. Well i hope its not a witch hunt.

Samuraisword

Well SOE is involved and handling the support, what do you expect.

I am against gold and item selling for real money, and I do want game developers to be aggressive and proactive in combating it, but it's wrong to ban someone without  reasonable evidence and it's unjust not to present the proof.

I read somewhere that Sigil said they would target players who amassed wealth. I find that disturbing because many tradeskillers have large inventories of items and coin. As a soloer tradeskiller I would save huge amounts of coin in order to buy the tradeable raid/group drop items that I could not acquire myself.

Will these mates of yours be spending another $50 to play again? I hope they are not that stupid.

TommyKHart

I just read on tenton from a offical sigil guy that the reason there suspending (not banning) accounts is because they have more gold than seems visable for there lvl. There not banned there just suspending to investigate there accounts. There probally ppl with 20+ gold and arn't that high lvl.

Samuraisword

Originally posted by thomas.hart

I just read on tenton from a offical sigil guy that the reason there suspending (not banning) accounts is because they have more gold than seems visable for there lvl. There not banned there just suspending to investigate there accounts. There probally ppl with 20+ gold and arn't that high lvl.

Well keep in mind they are guild tradeskillers. Guilds will often sponsor their tradeskillers by feeding them coin and ingredients.

matraque

Originally posted by thomas.hart

I just read on tenton from a offical sigil guy that the reason there suspending (not banning) accounts is because they have more gold than seems visable for there lvl. There not banned there just suspending to investigate there accounts. There probally ppl with 20+ gold and arn't that high lvl.

What is teh conversion again?



Is it 100s for 1g ?

matraque

Originally posted by Samuraisword

Originally posted by thomas.hart

I just read on tenton from a offical sigil guy that the reason there suspending (not banning) accounts is because they have more gold than seems visable for there lvl. There not banned there just suspending to investigate there accounts. There probally ppl with 20+ gold and arn't that high lvl.

Well keep in mind they are guild tradeskillers. Guilds will often sponsor their tradeskillers by feeding them coin and ingredients.

Yeah, i just had to post that on our Guild board.  I don't want us to have any trouble so we will think of a strategy.... cause sending $ every now and then to our bank account will probably be tracked down.

Mysk

---

Originally posted by thomas.hart
I just read on tenton from a offical sigil guy that the reason there suspending (not banning) accounts is because they have more gold than seems visable for there lvl. There not banned there just suspending to investigate there accounts. There probally ppl with 20+ gold and arn't that high lvl.

---

I just noticed some of these posts, myself, and apparently there's a bug on a PVP server that's causing people to receive this message.

http://forums.station.sony.com/vg/posts/list.m?start=15&topic_id=2815

... is a quick copy/paste of what I'm reading at the moment.

Good luck to your pals. :-/

edit: for reference, one of the ten ton hammer posts: http://forums.tentonhammer.com/showthread.php?p=66297&posted=1#post66297

~Mysk

snapp69

This is happening to the majority of accounts that have a mule character that they feed gold to due to not have a bank near by. Most of them appear to be on PVP servers as well since people do not want to loose coin from being killed in PVP. Also accounts that have mules being used as Guild banks since actual Guild banks are not yet implemented. I would make a point to call Sigil and speak with someone rather then do it through email as something always gets lost in text translations.



I support this action they are taking but not the means they are doing it, there should be a warning and a in game conversation with a GM before suspension is done to investigate. Atleast a email notification prior to the suspension.

Amathe

Originally posted by shae


 They are at best casual players who are completely more concerend with Role Playing then they are with leveling.

And yet their pockets are stuffed with gold.

Every banned account has a sob story on how they were clean as the driven snow. Ban the cheaters!

MX13

There are 4 main reasons players have been getting banned / suspended from what I've gathered:

1) Exploiting for Leveling / XP Purposes. If your friends are LVL30+, this may be the reason. Even if they only did it very little. Sigil said about a week ago they were reviewing logs to see if some were Exploiting bugs for Leveling Purposes.

2) Gold Selling / Gold Buying. This one is easy to find. A monitoring program probably watches for Keywords / Phrases on the Chat Servers, and bumps questionable conversations to GM's.

3) Gold Farming. There are some groups that are Farming Gold. Not all are selling it though, and this seems to be the main issue. I myself know of someone who was Banned for Farming Work-Orders for Coin (which pay EXTREAMLY well as you go higher). They were a fairly advanced Crafing Level and got there doing NOTHING but Work-Orders. They had only basic Clothes, made no other items, were Harvesting Level 50 (VERY low) & were Combat Level 5. They also had almost NO Coin in thier Bank, meaning they were transfering it to someone else, from what I heard.

4) Griefing. Some MUCH higher Level Toons have been camping Low Level Dungeons for Loot, not allowing some to finish thier Quest Requirements. I've seen this myself. There are other Griefing actions I've seen as well, such as Scamming Coin on Sale Items, which someone did to a friend of mine.

Now, I'm not saying any of these folks were doing these things, but if they could have done something to even come close to these actions, that may be why they've been Suspended / Banned.

I have a LARGE amount of Gold through legit means, and so far have not had an issue. If they were to look into how I got that Gold, they would easily see how I've built my Mini-Fortune, and it is by completely Legit-Play means. There are several in my guild with the same position as well, and none of us has been Suspended / Banned.

Gweyr

Originally posted by thomas.hart

I just read on tenton from a offical sigil guy that the reason there suspending (not banning) accounts is because they have more gold than seems visable for there lvl. There not banned there just suspending to investigate there accounts. There probally ppl with 20+ gold and arn't that high lvl.

So, if I am  in a large guild and we get pissed at someone, we can all email them a bit of money and get them Banned? The problem with anti-exploit policies are if they are not well thought out, you get people exploiting the anti-exploits.

smg77

Originally posted by MX13



4) Griefing. Some MUCH higher Level Toons have been camping Low Level Dungeons for Loot, not allowing some to finish thier Quest Requirements. I've seen this myself. There are other Griefing actions I've seen as well, such as Scamming Coin on Sale Items, which someone did to a friend of mine.

This absolutely cracks me up. What did they expect would happen by not making these instanced dungeons? OMG this game gets lamer and lamer every day.

smg77

Originally posted by Amathe



And yet their pockets are stuffed with gold.
Every banned account has a sob story on how they were clean as the driven snow. Ban the cheaters!

An excellent example of the Vanguard community--so helpful and caring!

sololoco

No one can really say what happen with these people, that's probably true.  But, you have to assume the people behind the game know more then you do and if these people were chosen then other then it being a mistake on Sigil's part, then something is up and only those involved know the truth.

I doubt people who haven't done anything would be chosen just for the hell of it.  But then again, it's possible it is a mistake, anything is possible.

matraque

Originally posted by smg77

Originally posted by MX13



4) Griefing. Some MUCH higher Level Toons have been camping Low Level Dungeons for Loot, not allowing some to finish thier Quest Requirements. I've seen this myself. There are other Griefing actions I've seen as well, such as Scamming Coin on Sale Items, which someone did to a friend of mine.

This absolutely cracks me up. What did they expect would happen by not making these instanced dungeons? OMG this game gets lamer and lamer every day.

Cute

redelf07

Its a bug.

Lidane

Originally posted by MX13



4) Griefing. Some MUCH higher Level Toons have been camping Low Level Dungeons for Loot, not allowing some to finish thier Quest Requirements. I've seen this myself.

For what it's worth, this is precisely why instanced dungeons are a good thing. When your group goes in, they're the only ones who will be getting the particular quest requirements and/or loot that might spawn while there. This prevents the high level player from being a jackass by keeping lower level players from advancing.



Sure, a lot of the "uber-hardcore" gamers don't like instanced dungeons, but at the same time, instances ensure that this sort of griefing is eliminated entirely, so in the long run, the benefits outweigh the drawbacks.

MX13

Originally posted by smg77

Originally posted by MX13



4) Griefing. Some MUCH higher Level Toons have been camping Low Level Dungeons for Loot, not allowing some to finish thier Quest Requirements. I've seen this myself. There are other Griefing actions I've seen as well, such as Scamming Coin on Sale Items, which someone did to a friend of mine.

This absolutely cracks me up. What did they expect would happen by not making these instanced dungeons? OMG this game gets lamer and lamer every day.It happens in EVERY game. At least Sigil gives a damn.

smg77

Originally posted by MX13

Originally posted by smg77

Originally posted by MX13



4) Griefing. Some MUCH higher Level Toons have been camping Low Level Dungeons for Loot, not allowing some to finish thier Quest Requirements. I've seen this myself. There are other Griefing actions I've seen as well, such as Scamming Coin on Sale Items, which someone did to a friend of mine.

This absolutely cracks me up. What did they expect would happen by not making these instanced dungeons? OMG this game gets lamer and lamer every day.It happens in EVERY game. At least Sigil gives a damn.



It doesn't happen in games with instanced dungeons. Maybe Sigil didn't know how to code them...

uncus

Originally posted by snapp69

This is happening to the majority of accounts that have a mule character that they feed gold to due to not have a bank near by. Most of them appear to be on PVP servers as well since people do not want to loose coin from being killed in PVP. Also accounts that have mules being used as Guild banks since actual Guild banks are not yet implemented. I would make a point to call Sigil and speak with someone rather then do it through email as something always gets lost in text translations.



I support this action they are taking but not the means they are doing it, there should be a warning and a in game conversation with a GM before suspension is done to investigate. Atleast a email notification prior to the suspension.

So the PvP'ers complain about "carebear" players, but they email their gold to alts so that when they get ganked, they don't lose it!?!  Priceless!   Sounds like an exploit - trying to get around a PvP death penalty.

I feel for the Guilds.  Maybe the Guild Leader should contact a CS in advance, informing them of the guild-mules name and account?  Then again, a guild giving a level 1 player 10g looks the same as a gold farmer/seller doing it....and probably has the same effect on the in-game economy.

Hats off to Sigil/SOE - you've managed to kill off another game!  And in record time!  [Ok, it ain't dead yet...but how many people besides myself are now going to have even more reasons not to buy it!]

anarchyart

Originally posted by smg77

Originally posted by Amathe



And yet their pockets are stuffed with gold.
Every banned account has a sob story on how they were clean as the driven snow. Ban the cheaters!

An excellent example of the Vanguard community--so helpful and caring!

He doesn't even play Vanguard. Another excellent example of people juding the Vanguard community based on misinformation.

To Shae,

So sorry to hear your in game friends got banned. I would bet my account you are right about them too. I am hopeful that it is just a VERY short term suspension while the devs use their information to catch real cheaters.

I do admire Vanguard's staunch policy against gold sellers, just a shame when honest people have to suffer.

Mogwa

LOL now this is funny, ban the very few players you have because they have a lil coin. Most of the people pissed about this are people who were mailing thier coin to a guild leader who was saving for a guild city. ROLF. GL sigil.



M

Sceptix

This is a side effect of the zero tolerence policy combined with way to many exploits and bugs to take advantage of.



The problem with trying to get rid of a crime polluted population, is out of 20 people you catch, one or two will probably be innocent.



Zero Tolerance=no leeway whatsoever, no matter the circumstances.



Ive never bought gold in my life and yet i got banned from lineage 2 for having multiple accounts and alts i switched gold with constantly between accounts. This was a mistake on their part and it took me months of emailing them to finally check the logs and get everything straightened out.



So dont expect your situation to get fixed right away. True its a different company, but with so many ways to cheat right now, its going to be hard for them to take your word for it, and i dont think they have enough staff to check the logs of every single player, its a rush job most times. If anything the mistake will be rectified, just not right away like you expect.

Umbrood

Well, I have allready cancelled so I do not really care what they do with my characters beyond that but..

Given the state of the game the ONLY thing I have been able to do consistently is craft, and I have not bothered to lvl either, I hit a lvl were I could comfortably do jute bags and I have been pumping them out like there is no tomorrow.

Allthough I do not have 20 gold I am fairly close and I am 14 Adventure 12 crafter.

Should I take precautions?

I mean giving the gold away to friends who have decided to stay could mean I got them banned, I would not want that.