EVERYONE should want a mmofps game.... why because it will get us out of your rpg's
First let me say I love fps but they get boring becuase they are static nothing really changes cept mods.
I play mmos mostly and ive mostly played fps mmos. Lets look at some of the games ive played.
First mmo was 10six a mmo fps/rts and one of the best games ever(at the start) because it had no rpg elements no levels, no crafting, no magic crap. What you did have was camps that you owned, built, and defended. You also had rovers that you could control to fight for you. Granted the world wasnt seemless but it the potential for a million people on 1 server and 32 per camp.
I played endlessages which was a real time mmofps/rpg. Now this was a mild rpg with fps combat and also had one of the best combat systems ive played in an rpg. There were levels and crafting but it was easy to get to a high enough lvl to fight quickly. It was a cheap game and no fluff but very sound design.
I played planetside which was an all out fps with no point. Planetside went the wrong direction with it if you could have owned the bases yourself or via guild it would have been so much better (and a money system and no free weapons).
i also played neocron but i wouldnt really call that a fps. I have played alot of rpgs like wow,l2,lotr, and even motor city online and autoassault. Every game is unique and I like to play as many as i can , but I prefer fps than click numbers. (gunz is not an mmo its a reg multiplayer fps with a database but it was kinda fun also)
So there is alot of ways to make a mmo and every person likes what they like theres enough stupid ass uo/eq/wow/lotr/vanguard games to kill a horse let there be new games!.
P.S. There is no point to levels in any game all it is used for is to kill time. Its like saying a 87 year old man can kick my ass cause hes been on earth longer..lol
You downies still on the MMORPG bandwagon will get your hybrid MMOFPS/RPG... but only AFTER the launch of a successful MMOFPS. You are a niche market; and niche markets are served AFTER a genre has established itself as a household name; not BEFORE.
Why do you think MMOFPS has failed to launch? Because tards can't separate the MMO from RPG when they see MMO in FPS; and are creating MMOFPS products that are completely ignorant of their largest initial market's needs and desires. They are also stupid enough to rely on the out-dated 10-15$ a month subscription scheme- again; bitch slapping their biggest potential customers in the face.
In-game advertising is on full blast now; and most FPS gamers generally don't give a shit about the immersiveness of their world; so long as the gameplay is there. An MMOFPS can be wildly profitable with a combination of in-game advertising and a 5 dollar monthly subscription; or perhaps even none at all.
MMORPG players, MMORPG companies, MMORPG thinking- have held back MMOFPS from a successful launch; I have absolutely no god damn doubts about it. None. It's the truth. If you can't see it, you're one of them.
Hope you got your things together. Hope you are quite prepared to die. Looks like we're in for nasty weather. ... There's a bad moon on the rise.
I played planetside which was an all out fps with no point. Planetside went the wrong direction with it if you could have owned the bases yourself or via guild it would have been so much better (and a money system and no free weapons).
I'll just point to what this guy said and rest my case about why MMORPG anything or anyone should have zero f'ing input on how to make a mainstream MMOFPS that will spawn the success other well established genre's enjoy.
Hope you got your things together. Hope you are quite prepared to die. Looks like we're in for nasty weather. ... There's a bad moon on the rise.
I think what most people hope for is an FPS game, lets say like Battlefield, or onslaught in UT, but it takes place in an MMO sized world, so you have all these battles going on that will eventually impact each other, and you can move between them to reinforce allies that need help, etc, like in a real war.
Think about like 20 CS games going on at once, but they are all connected to each other, if counter-terrorists lose in the south battlefield, the terrorists will move up and give them a big advantages in another battlefield, and the player can take a vehicle between them whenever he wants. No switching servers, and whether or not your side wins or loses has an impact on the gameplay, the slate doesn't just wipe clean with another round on a diffrent map.
Thats what people really want to see, an FPS game where your actions have a long lasting impact on the entire gaming community, an FPS game where a lose or a win actually makes a diffrence in the game, where it won't just start over all over making a win or a loss moot.
This is what we want; The problem is, adding RPG elements to this can either add more diversity to it, or completely ruin the entire point of an MMOFPS. Take planetside, good idea, but it ended up missing the whole point all together. I think we should atleast get a pure MMOFPS first WITHOUT ANY rpg elements, then they can add on to it later. Theres really no archetype for an MMOFPS yet, and the few times a company tries to make one, they never settle for just making a pure MMOFPS, they always have to throw in these random ass RPG elements that hurt the game more than anything.
To me, as far as the attempts have gone so far, it be the same as if the very first car to ever be manufactured had all kinds of random crap on it like a back hoe, helicopter blades, a big shovel on the front, wings. Why can't they just make a regular damn car first, get the archetype down, then try adding things from diffrent genre's to it later on in diffrent games? It's a very new concept, and it's just recently started to become possible, so why someone can't just make a vanilla MMOFPS without trying to cross genre's and all kinds of other things that arn't going to work is beyond me. The very idea of it is pretty new, we have no plain archetype, and technology is just now getting to where it can work, why tweak something before its even in working condition or over complicated it?
I think the real question is, should an MMOFPS be the next level of FPS games, or should it combine MMORPGS and FPS games? The answer is so simple i just have to wonder why a good one hasn't been made yet; FPS != RPG, maybe you should actually get an FPS game to that next level before you start trying to combine MMORPGS with something that doesn't exist yet.
So goneglokin what is wrong with planetside then....cause it is a mmofps and failed. Its not the monthly fee becuase it has been "free" forever via trials and reserve. And still nobody plays it. ( i do agree that the 15 a month will be gone soon but its not an issue atm if the game is good)
In my opinion people need a reason to fight via money land or pride which planetside has none of the above. You cant win without being able to lose. You cant lose if there are no consequences. (like wow you kill the guy he comes back till he kills you, if he lost something he wouldnt be so quick to come back)
You guys are totally clueless. An initial successful MMOFPS that pioneers the genre will have ABSOLUTELY NOTHING TO DO WITH THE ORCS AND DORKS FOLKS THAT POPULATE THE MMORPG REALM. You know who's gonna make an MMOFPS successful? The 10 million + FPS gamers out there looking for the latest and greatest. Catching even a fraction of them means overnight success. Crafting? No. Stick to RPGs; and wait your turn; and quit holding back progress on the MMOFPS by sticking your nose where it does not belong.
I completely agree. Unfortunately I dont think huxley will be the one to change things because from what ive seen the fps combat seems to be nothing but spray and pray with rediculous quake-like weapons. All it comes down to to be better than your opponent in pvp is having played and grinded longer, and being a higher 'level' with more attacks to click on and watch...thats it! I personally cannot stand 99% of mmorpgs because theyre all the same magical fantasy rubbish which you could play with your eyes closed. But every time theres a major mmo title with great fps potential, the 'orcs and dorks' crowd come along and ruin it. MXO, STO and now stargate worlds which could have been the best ever mmofps are now filled with the wow type commuity which love their crafting and loot collecting...oh yeah and grinding! But one day there will be an mmofps which will blow these mmorpgs away, only question is when.
there is a kind of cross, counterstrike has a mod which allows you to earn abilities and that, though it isn't persistant(only lasting the game) and isn't MM. Then there is GunzOnline, which does have the persistant, you level up and you use the exp points on new weapons and that. Though, GunzOnline isn't MM either with it all set up in different lobbies. Warrock is the same as Gunzonline.
By the way on the left is WW2 Online which maybe worth looking at those people interested in that combo.
Personally i want an MMOFPS (not planetside though because of that cone firing system) with no RPG elements. I think one of those would sell REALLY well if it was well made. Who wouldnt want an counter-strike, unreal tournament, or Battlefield, with hundreds/thousands of players and a persistant world.??
What's so wrong with Planetside's cone of firing system? I can't think of a single FPS (other than Unreal) that doesn't have some kind of cone of fire bloom. It makes it more realitic, IMO.
MMO games played or tested: EQ, DAoC, Archlord, Auto Assault, CoH, CoV, EQ2, EVE, Guild Wars, Hellgate: London, Linneage II, LOTRO, MxO, Planetside, SWG, Sword of the New World, Tabula Rasa, Vanguard, WWIIOL, WOW, Age of Conan
IMO mechwarrior has to be the best setting for a mmofps
nothing has been done with the title for quite some time.
Use a galaxic map pretty much like the one in eve, you have the inner core where you would start as a newbie and the out edges would be partly control by the old clans. but basically player controlled.
Id like to potch the eve idealism in terms of mech loss and economy which was completely player driven.
And take the best from planetside, battlefield 2142 and ww2:online for tactical overlays and capture of citys/planets.
Carebears can make mechs and bases and run salvage and repair ops.
Clan vs Clan pvp for land.
NPCers can run missions on planets for clans etc.
and could even have the arena competitions from MW4:M
The HUGE ammount of room for character and mech/s customization.
IMO mechwarrior has to be the best setting for a mmofps
nothing has been done with the title for quite some time.
Use a galaxic map pretty much like the one in eve, you have the inner core where you would start as a newbie and the out edges would be partly control by the old clans. but basically player controlled.
Id like to potch the eve idealism in terms of mech loss and economy which was completely player driven.
And take the best from planetside, battlefield 2142 and ww2:online for tactical overlays and capture of citys/planets.
Carebears can make mechs and bases and run salvage and repair ops.
Clan vs Clan pvp for land.
NPCers can run missions on planets for clans etc.
and could even have the arena competitions from MW4:M
The HUGE ammount of room for character and mech/s customization.
Wow, your vision for Mechwarrior MMO made me gasm.
Don't forget to add Solaris, the arena combat world where players and spectators wager on the lives of the Mechwarriors.
In order for anything MMO to maintain state and progress beyond that, it is necessary for permanent advances in all facets of play. Skill, advanced by player practice. Territory, built up and established by players. Weapons, Arms and Vehicles, all built by players. A clear model of this can be seen in our human history, resources, training, logistics, all can be simulated in a game.
As a player of CS, Day of Defeat and SOCOM, I understand the thrill of this style of game, but at the same time, after a 3 hour stretch of what can only be remembered as, 'practice.' I am left feeling like I almost just wasted my time. In the single player aspects of FEAR etc, I atleast feel like I am approaching a goal will have some sort of ending.
In many MMOs, there is something to be experienced that no smaller framed game can produce. Instead of a small clan of 20-40 people, like many FPS games, you have 100s of people, that when arranged toward a common goal have so much more to unite them and fight for.
Shadowbane was a great example of this. Player built castles and shops with trainers etc. The stronger guilds had usually better gear among other advantages to being powerful. As a result they may become too hungry and as I experienced, began to conquer and destroy the work of many clans until they amassed land, and many subservant clans that joined them in fear of destruction. There was a clan I joined that would not bow down to this, so thru use of strategic positioning, we forced the by far larger army to fight us at a bottleneck that made our defense possible. Eventually, other clans joined our fight seeing it as a possible means and helped us destroy the clan that held 80% of the land.
I don't see how it would be impossible for the same battle to happen with replaced the weapons and setting.
In order for the current FPS player group to not frown highly upon this game, a certain realism would be required. First and foremost, levels are out of the question. A human life is equal to another it its chance of mortality, nothing will change this.
Skill progression for battle would be similar to Planet Side. You have a lesser amount of certifications you can choose at the start of you're character, and as you get more kills or other means of battlefield gain, you advance down the path you started. For example, you think you would like to be a sniper one day, so you start off with a rifle, eventually you're allowed to learn camo (real camo, not stealth-like crap), then sniper etc. Or you want to drive a tank one day, you begin with troop transports, after so many troops have been moved, you may move up to half tracks etc.
The battlefield must be entirely player built, and realm/clan controlled. The main resource would be money, gained by capturing enemy buildings and territory. Built by players who have chosen that as their field and progress in it by doing so.
There is a lot that would go into a game like this, and all facets must be entirely complete and well thought before it could succeed. The idea of making a car before we make a Lexus is not valid. The first two cars that were made are Planetside and any FPS, neither of them lasted because they were base cars.
The need for the Lexus model MMOFPS is required for it to have any chance among the current group of gamers. This game may appeal to the pure FPS market, but it should be designed for the MMORPG group, they seek a game much more than your basic FPS and will gladly pay 15 a month if the complete package is brought. This is finally becoming true as 90% of MMO players have grown disgusted by the current MMO market, and beyond their first or second experience in the genre, are no longer fooled by level grinds and autoattack combat. They seek something much more.
And saying that MMOrpger's have no place in this discussion is just foolish. No gamer of any genre has an effect on what product is released in any genre. If you are satisfied by simple FPSs in which you do nothing but round after round for a year, then this game is not for you. This game would require people who allow themselves to be drawn into a game so deeply that life outside is almost non existent, and while away from the game, are thinking about the war they should be fighting. FPS is not like this.
Now I'm off to play Day of Defeat for a few hours until my dream game comes out. /spam off
Ive always felt that for a "mmo+fps" to really feel like and bring out the mmo feel to it it needs/has to do something different from other games which are all just grinds to be frank i dont know exactly what the perfect balance is. but i dont want to see another exp/lvl = skills points/unlocks like in battlefield or planetside.
Something between eve's time based lvl system and (teheh) dungon siege. using the eve time based system stops ppl respecing cookie cutter and dungon siege where you had to phyically use different combat pools magic, melee, archery etc to lvl up the relative skills.
so going back to the mechwarrior mmofps for example. different weapon pools ie lazers missles and kenitic aswell as senors reading mech driving skills tonnage skills the list goes on. Where in a game like eve you could max out scenific skills with out ever stepping into a lab. In furture mmofps you have to do the learning and then apply practical experience to the learning to get to the next lvl.
It shouldnt be a grind at all and to begin with is quite general but as you head down a certain path you notice its progression takes longer and longer to the point where you would pick up a new skill tree to complement.
This thread is a sea of ignorance; and every time I make a thread; explaining in plain english; how to make the first wildly successful MMOFPS; it gets buried because it's too long to read.
I can literally write a book an inch thick on this subject.
I'll just say this and then be done with it. MMO means Massive Multiplayer Online. It does not mean levels. It does not mean elves and trolls. It does not mean RPG. Get that shit out of your head.
Hope you got your things together. Hope you are quite prepared to die. Looks like we're in for nasty weather. ... There's a bad moon on the rise.
This thread is a sea of ignorance; and every time I make a thread; explaining in plain english; how to make the first wildly successful MMOFPS; it gets buried because it's too long to read. I can literally write a book an inch thick on this subject. I'll just say this and then be done with it. MMO means Massive Multiplayer Online. It does not mean levels. It does not mean elves and trolls. It does not mean RPG. Get that shit out of your head.
I haven't seen one piece of constructive input from you. You must have been raped by an Orc played by a dork to spout such senseless bs over and over.
Take a page out of your 1" book and share your apparently vast amount of knowledge with us. Before you do, remove the lame ideas of who should and shouldnt work on a game of this type. It will obviously need people from both gameplay types.
with the lag ill use the mechwarrior example (hey, im fixed on the idear =P) in terms of story most raids you could expect 1-3 maybe 4 drop ships with 4 mechs a piece, 4 being an extermely large assault force of 16 mechs. the defenders in most cases would have only ever have 1/3 to 1/2 of the ammount of defenders and firepower as newer/younger and failed officers were used to defend outlying worlds.
basically if you where to delopy your clan in full force on one planet no doubt you would capture it but how many countless worlds would you lose along the flanks as they are undefended.
16vs16 match wouldnt be to bad at all in terms of lag. mechwarrior isnt cs where you can jump around corner and die because some lpb owned you.
The only places i think lag is really going to effect you in mmofps is roles like sniper fights. If one shot kills and both snipers know where each other is every spilt second counts and if your a hpb and hes a lpb and you both have even reaction times your will die 80% (<-- pulled this out of my ass) of the time.
16vs16 match wouldnt be to bad at all in terms of lag. mechwarrior isnt cs where you can jump around corner and die because some lpb owned you.
The only places i think lag is really going to effect you in mmofps is roles like sniper fights. If one shot kills and both snipers know where each other is every spilt second counts and if your a hpb and hes a lpb and you both have even reaction times your will die 80% (<-- pulled this out of my ass) of the time.
Have you guys tried Space Cowboy Online? I am not saying it is the perfect game. It has done many things wrong. But, it has done many things right. It is a massively multiplayer arcade style science fiction flight combat game. Daily there are fights as small as 1vs1 and as large as 100vs100 or greater. So, it is easily possible to make combat possible between hundreds of players. I have been in many SCO wars where the combatants easily exceeded 500 players. A few times a month SCO has mothership raids where the entire game population defends or attacks the motherships. So, do not set your sights on low population wars. Make large population wars feasable! It is a good game(with some shortcomings). Check it out. It is a free game and want to kill some time with open pvp between factions.
The reason I mentioned SCO is that it is a step in the right direction for a Massively Multiplayer Shooter(but it is a low budget title and it shows). I wish a AAA quality developer would play SCO, Auto Assault, and Planetside. Then come up with a AAA quality MMO Shooter. Here is hoping Huxley, Tabula Rasa, Cronicles of Spellbourne, Darkfall, Fury, or Exteel get it right or at least step in the right direction.
My opinion is when devs think MMOFPS they automatically think and design to the lowest common denominator, yet your target audience is really neither of these things. This is where they go wrong, they try to pound in the the worst parts of FPS gameplay and RPG gameplay into one game and it misses everyone.
You guys are thinking about this all wrong; and the OP is just assuming FPS = Player Skill over Character Development based on PvP. Also your thinking solely based on Fantasy vs War games.
But think about playing a ranger in EQ or WoW; imagine that class alone is controlled the same as a FPS (eg Counter-Strike)
Now think about playing a caster, in FPS mode... and by this I dont mean in First Person View... I mean having to aim, and actually having a difference on where you hit the target.
So you have to point and click (twitch) and be accurate against NPCs; but also give the hack-n-slash crowd the Fighters (hopefully AoC will revolutionize the concept of Real-Time Combat).
We need a combination of Real-Time Fighting Fantasy, with First Person Shooter PvE.
This way you can include Character Development (Progression based on EXP, skills, stats, ect), yet still feel that you have uber-leet micro.
Comments
EVERYONE should want a mmofps game.... why because it will get us out of your rpg's
First let me say I love fps but they get boring becuase they are static nothing really changes cept mods.
I play mmos mostly and ive mostly played fps mmos. Lets look at some of the games ive played.
First mmo was 10six a mmo fps/rts and one of the best games ever(at the start) because it had no rpg elements no levels, no crafting, no magic crap. What you did have was camps that you owned, built, and defended. You also had rovers that you could control to fight for you. Granted the world wasnt seemless but it the potential for a million people on 1 server and 32 per camp.
I played endlessages which was a real time mmofps/rpg. Now this was a mild rpg with fps combat and also had one of the best combat systems ive played in an rpg. There were levels and crafting but it was easy to get to a high enough lvl to fight quickly. It was a cheap game and no fluff but very sound design.
I played planetside which was an all out fps with no point. Planetside went the wrong direction with it if you could have owned the bases yourself or via guild it would have been so much better (and a money system and no free weapons).
i also played neocron but i wouldnt really call that a fps. I have played alot of rpgs like wow,l2,lotr, and even motor city online and autoassault. Every game is unique and I like to play as many as i can , but I prefer fps than click numbers. (gunz is not an mmo its a reg multiplayer fps with a database but it was kinda fun also)
So there is alot of ways to make a mmo and every person likes what they like theres enough stupid ass uo/eq/wow/lotr/vanguard games to kill a horse let there be new games!.
P.S. There is no point to levels in any game all it is used for is to kill time. Its like saying a 87 year old man can kick my ass cause hes been on earth longer..lol
Own, Mine, Defend, Attack, 24/7
You downies still on the MMORPG bandwagon will get your hybrid MMOFPS/RPG... but only AFTER the launch of a successful MMOFPS. You are a niche market; and niche markets are served AFTER a genre has established itself as a household name; not BEFORE.
Why do you think MMOFPS has failed to launch? Because tards can't separate the MMO from RPG when they see MMO in FPS; and are creating MMOFPS products that are completely ignorant of their largest initial market's needs and desires. They are also stupid enough to rely on the out-dated 10-15$ a month subscription scheme- again; bitch slapping their biggest potential customers in the face.
In-game advertising is on full blast now; and most FPS gamers generally don't give a shit about the immersiveness of their world; so long as the gameplay is there. An MMOFPS can be wildly profitable with a combination of in-game advertising and a 5 dollar monthly subscription; or perhaps even none at all.
MMORPG players, MMORPG companies, MMORPG thinking- have held back MMOFPS from a successful launch; I have absolutely no god damn doubts about it. None. It's the truth. If you can't see it, you're one of them.
Hope you got your things together. Hope you are quite prepared to die. Looks like we're in for nasty weather. ... There's a bad moon on the rise.
I'll just point to what this guy said and rest my case about why MMORPG anything or anyone should have zero f'ing input on how to make a mainstream MMOFPS that will spawn the success other well established genre's enjoy.
Hope you got your things together. Hope you are quite prepared to die. Looks like we're in for nasty weather. ... There's a bad moon on the rise.
Think about like 20 CS games going on at once, but they are all connected to each other, if counter-terrorists lose in the south battlefield, the terrorists will move up and give them a big advantages in another battlefield, and the player can take a vehicle between them whenever he wants. No switching servers, and whether or not your side wins or loses has an impact on the gameplay, the slate doesn't just wipe clean with another round on a diffrent map.
Thats what people really want to see, an FPS game where your actions have a long lasting impact on the entire gaming community, an FPS game where a lose or a win actually makes a diffrence in the game, where it won't just start over all over making a win or a loss moot.
This is what we want; The problem is, adding RPG elements to this can either add more diversity to it, or completely ruin the entire point of an MMOFPS. Take planetside, good idea, but it ended up missing the whole point all together. I think we should atleast get a pure MMOFPS first WITHOUT ANY rpg elements, then they can add on to it later. Theres really no archetype for an MMOFPS yet, and the few times a company tries to make one, they never settle for just making a pure MMOFPS, they always have to throw in these random ass RPG elements that hurt the game more than anything.
To me, as far as the attempts have gone so far, it be the same as if the very first car to ever be manufactured had all kinds of random crap on it like a back hoe, helicopter blades, a big shovel on the front, wings. Why can't they just make a regular damn car first, get the archetype down, then try adding things from diffrent genre's to it later on in diffrent games? It's a very new concept, and it's just recently started to become possible, so why someone can't just make a vanilla MMOFPS without trying to cross genre's and all kinds of other things that arn't going to work is beyond me. The very idea of it is pretty new, we have no plain archetype, and technology is just now getting to where it can work, why tweak something before its even in working condition or over complicated it?
I think the real question is, should an MMOFPS be the next level of FPS games, or should it combine MMORPGS and FPS games? The answer is so simple i just have to wonder why a good one hasn't been made yet; FPS != RPG, maybe you should actually get an FPS game to that next level before you start trying to combine MMORPGS with something that doesn't exist yet.
So goneglokin what is wrong with planetside then....cause it is a mmofps and failed. Its not the monthly fee becuase it has been "free" forever via trials and reserve. And still nobody plays it. ( i do agree that the 15 a month will be gone soon but its not an issue atm if the game is good)
In my opinion people need a reason to fight via money land or pride which planetside has none of the above. You cant win without being able to lose. You cant lose if there are no consequences. (like wow you kill the guy he comes back till he kills you, if he lost something he wouldnt be so quick to come back)
Own, Mine, Defend, Attack, 24/7
I completely agree. Unfortunately I dont think huxley will be the one to change things because from what ive seen the fps combat seems to be nothing but spray and pray with rediculous quake-like weapons. All it comes down to to be better than your opponent in pvp is having played and grinded longer, and being a higher 'level' with more attacks to click on and watch...thats it! I personally cannot stand 99% of mmorpgs because theyre all the same magical fantasy rubbish which you could play with your eyes closed. But every time theres a major mmo title with great fps potential, the 'orcs and dorks' crowd come along and ruin it. MXO, STO and now stargate worlds which could have been the best ever mmofps are now filled with the wow type commuity which love their crafting and loot collecting...oh yeah and grinding! But one day there will be an mmofps which will blow these mmorpgs away, only question is when.
there is a kind of cross, counterstrike has a mod which allows you to earn abilities and that, though it isn't persistant(only lasting the game) and isn't MM.
Then there is GunzOnline, which does have the persistant, you level up and you use the exp points on new weapons and that. Though, GunzOnline isn't MM either with it all set up in different lobbies.
Warrock is the same as Gunzonline.
By the way on the left is WW2 Online which maybe worth looking at those people interested in that combo.
MMO games played or tested: EQ, DAoC, Archlord, Auto Assault, CoH, CoV, EQ2, EVE, Guild Wars, Hellgate: London, Linneage II, LOTRO, MxO, Planetside, SWG, Sword of the New World, Tabula Rasa, Vanguard, WWIIOL, WOW, Age of Conan
nothing has been done with the title for quite some time.
Use a galaxic map pretty much like the one in eve, you have the inner core where you would start as a newbie and the out edges would be partly control by the old clans. but basically player controlled.
Id like to potch the eve idealism in terms of mech loss and economy which was completely player driven.
And take the best from planetside, battlefield 2142 and ww2:online for tactical overlays and capture of citys/planets.
Carebears can make mechs and bases and run salvage and repair ops.
Clan vs Clan pvp for land.
NPCers can run missions on planets for clans etc.
and could even have the arena competitions from MW4:M
The HUGE ammount of room for character and mech/s customization.
Don't forget to add Solaris, the arena combat world where players and spectators wager on the lives of the Mechwarriors.
In order for anything MMO to maintain state and progress beyond that, it is necessary for permanent advances in all facets of play. Skill, advanced by player practice. Territory, built up and established by players. Weapons, Arms and Vehicles, all built by players. A clear model of this can be seen in our human history, resources, training, logistics, all can be simulated in a game.
As a player of CS, Day of Defeat and SOCOM, I understand the thrill of this style of game, but at the same time, after a 3 hour stretch of what can only be remembered as, 'practice.' I am left feeling like I almost just wasted my time. In the single player aspects of FEAR etc, I atleast feel like I am approaching a goal will have some sort of ending.
In many MMOs, there is something to be experienced that no smaller framed game can produce. Instead of a small clan of 20-40 people, like many FPS games, you have 100s of people, that when arranged toward a common goal have so much more to unite them and fight for.
Shadowbane was a great example of this. Player built castles and shops with trainers etc. The stronger guilds had usually better gear among other advantages to being powerful. As a result they may become too hungry and as I experienced, began to conquer and destroy the work of many clans until they amassed land, and many subservant clans that joined them in fear of destruction. There was a clan I joined that would not bow down to this, so thru use of strategic positioning, we forced the by far larger army to fight us at a bottleneck that made our defense possible. Eventually, other clans joined our fight seeing it as a possible means and helped us destroy the clan that held 80% of the land.
I don't see how it would be impossible for the same battle to happen with replaced the weapons and setting.
In order for the current FPS player group to not frown highly upon this game, a certain realism would be required. First and foremost, levels are out of the question. A human life is equal to another it its chance of mortality, nothing will change this.
Skill progression for battle would be similar to Planet Side. You have a lesser amount of certifications you can choose at the start of you're character, and as you get more kills or other means of battlefield gain, you advance down the path you started. For example, you think you would like to be a sniper one day, so you start off with a rifle, eventually you're allowed to learn camo (real camo, not stealth-like crap), then sniper etc. Or you want to drive a tank one day, you begin with troop transports, after so many troops have been moved, you may move up to half tracks etc.
The battlefield must be entirely player built, and realm/clan controlled. The main resource would be money, gained by capturing enemy buildings and territory. Built by players who have chosen that as their field and progress in it by doing so.
There is a lot that would go into a game like this, and all facets must be entirely complete and well thought before it could succeed. The idea of making a car before we make a Lexus is not valid. The first two cars that were made are Planetside and any FPS, neither of them lasted because they were base cars.
The need for the Lexus model MMOFPS is required for it to have any chance among the current group of gamers. This game may appeal to the pure FPS market, but it should be designed for the MMORPG group, they seek a game much more than your basic FPS and will gladly pay 15 a month if the complete package is brought. This is finally becoming true as 90% of MMO players have grown disgusted by the current MMO market, and beyond their first or second experience in the genre, are no longer fooled by level grinds and autoattack combat. They seek something much more.
And saying that MMOrpger's have no place in this discussion is just foolish. No gamer of any genre has an effect on what product is released in any genre. If you are satisfied by simple FPSs in which you do nothing but round after round for a year, then this game is not for you. This game would require people who allow themselves to be drawn into a game so deeply that life outside is almost non existent, and while away from the game, are thinking about the war they should be fighting. FPS is not like this.
Now I'm off to play Day of Defeat for a few hours until my dream game comes out. /spam off
Something between eve's time based lvl system and (teheh) dungon siege. using the eve time based system stops ppl respecing cookie cutter and dungon siege where you had to phyically use different combat pools magic, melee, archery etc to lvl up the relative skills.
so going back to the mechwarrior mmofps for example. different weapon pools ie lazers missles and kenitic aswell as senors reading mech driving skills tonnage skills the list goes on. Where in a game like eve you could max out scenific skills with out ever stepping into a lab. In furture mmofps you have to do the learning and then apply practical experience to the learning to get to the next lvl.
It shouldnt be a grind at all and to begin with is quite general but as you head down a certain path you notice its progression takes longer and longer to the point where you would pick up a new skill tree to complement.
This thread is a sea of ignorance; and every time I make a thread; explaining in plain english; how to make the first wildly successful MMOFPS; it gets buried because it's too long to read.
I can literally write a book an inch thick on this subject.
I'll just say this and then be done with it. MMO means Massive Multiplayer Online. It does not mean levels. It does not mean elves and trolls. It does not mean RPG. Get that shit out of your head.
Hope you got your things together. Hope you are quite prepared to die. Looks like we're in for nasty weather. ... There's a bad moon on the rise.
I myself do not want or need mmo/fps crossovers.
If I wanted them, I wouldn't even be here in the first place.
I enjoy MMO's. Fantasy ones mainly. I like the playstyle.
I enjoy FPS's too. I see no need for a crossover. BF2142 etc. easily give me my short fix.
I have no idea how they will fix the lag in an MMOFPS. Especially for Australians who are usually forced to play on American based servers.
Currently Playing: Everything but MMORPGs
Cancelled: L2, FFXI, VSoH, LotRO, WAR, WoW
Looking Forward To: SW:TOR
I haven't seen one piece of constructive input from you. You must have been raped by an Orc played by a dork to spout such senseless bs over and over.
Take a page out of your 1" book and share your apparently vast amount of knowledge with us. Before you do, remove the lame ideas of who should and shouldnt work on a game of this type. It will obviously need people from both gameplay types.
with the lag ill use the mechwarrior example (hey, im fixed on the idear =P) in terms of story most raids you could expect 1-3 maybe 4 drop ships with 4 mechs a piece, 4 being an extermely large assault force of 16 mechs. the defenders in most cases would have only ever have 1/3 to 1/2 of the ammount of defenders and firepower as newer/younger and failed officers were used to defend outlying worlds.
basically if you where to delopy your clan in full force on one planet no doubt you would capture it but how many countless worlds would you lose along the flanks as they are undefended.
16vs16 match wouldnt be to bad at all in terms of lag. mechwarrior isnt cs where you can jump around corner and die because some lpb owned you.
The only places i think lag is really going to effect you in mmofps is roles like sniper fights. If one shot kills and both snipers know where each other is every spilt second counts and if your a hpb and hes a lpb and you both have even reaction times your will die 80% (<-- pulled this out of my ass) of the time.
The reason I mentioned SCO is that it is a step in the right direction for a Massively Multiplayer Shooter(but it is a low budget title and it shows). I wish a AAA quality developer would play SCO, Auto Assault, and Planetside. Then come up with a AAA quality MMO Shooter. Here is hoping Huxley, Tabula Rasa, Cronicles of Spellbourne, Darkfall, Fury, or Exteel get it right or at least step in the right direction.
My opinion is when devs think MMOFPS they automatically think and design to the lowest common denominator, yet your target audience is really neither of these things. This is where they go wrong, they try to pound in the the worst parts of FPS gameplay and RPG gameplay into one game and it misses everyone.
But think about playing a ranger in EQ or WoW; imagine that class alone is controlled the same as a FPS (eg Counter-Strike)
Now think about playing a caster, in FPS mode... and by this I dont mean in First Person View... I mean having to aim, and actually having a difference on where you hit the target.
So you have to point and click (twitch) and be accurate against NPCs; but also give the hack-n-slash crowd the Fighters (hopefully AoC will revolutionize the concept of Real-Time Combat).
We need a combination of Real-Time Fighting Fantasy, with First Person Shooter PvE.
This way you can include Character Development (Progression based on EXP, skills, stats, ect), yet still feel that you have uber-leet micro.