look as much as i love wow and been playing it a lonng time, i have recently reaslised im bored with it now... its the same thing over and over, i hope after a short break i can return to it and love it again ><
that is another way to see it Nova and I do agree actually.
I was an endgame raider and I say so many people come in to raid guilds thinking that they could play in the raid the same way they did as a solo player then I never really thought of it from the same point of view.
You are very right though, the two games are very different and clash horribly. Even in the expansion with the heroics and the new 10 man "epic" raid it is still a huge clash in play styles.
that is another way to see it Nova and I do agree actually.
I was an endgame raider and I say so many people come in to raid guilds thinking that they could play in the raid the same way they did as a solo player then I never really thought of it from the same point of view.
You are very right though, the two games are very different and clash horribly. Even in the expansion with the heroics and the new 10 man "epic" raid it is still a huge clash in play styles.
Yeah I think we're seeing the same issue I think.
It's hard because so many people simply solo all the way to level cap -- the game makes it slightly more difficult to do that because you end up skipping all the instance quests with their nice gear upgrades and generous XP rewards, but it's still very manageable. And then you have these folks trying to jump from that to the hardest group content the game has to offer without ever really having played their character in a group, or having viewed their playtime as something to adjust to the demands of a group play dynamic. So it just basically is a trainwreck, and that's why PUGs for endgame instances just really suck.
I think it was more or less okay for raiders prior to TBC because at least they had their stable raid guilds with good players in them. Now the messing with the raid sizes has really thrown that for a loop, and I honestly don't think Blizzard saw that coming. i think they honestly thought that lowering the size would make raiding more accessible to a greater number of guilds, but what has happened is that the raid guilds are breaking up over it and these same group of players are simply raiding in smaller raid guilds. Net/net I don't think it's really brought more people into raiding who weren't into it before, and it has upset the applecart of the raiding guilds as they existed before the change, so it doesn't seem like a particularly well-thought-out change, to be honest.
I've played wow since release. I must say, this game is mostly great. I'm not a big fan of raid, but I think 5men instance are fun as I'm a casual player. But I quit because I can't stand rogues. I might sound stupid, but I just hate the idea of not being able to drink or eat because there are always some idiot rogues ganking me. I'd be very interested to try a similar game that is rogue free.
I've played wow since release. I must say, this game is mostly great. I'm not a big fan of raid, but I think 5men instance are fun as I'm a casual player. But I quit because I can't stand rogues. I might sound stupid, but I just hate the idea of not being able to drink or eat because there are always some idiot rogues ganking me. I'd be very interested to try a similar game that is rogue free.
check out Warhammer: online
no stealth classes in the game. Won't be out for awhile, but looks like it could be a great game.
Don't get me wrong, WoW is a great game. I was sick of starting new games only to do the same treadmill grind I have done in countless others. WoW's was a much easier grind and they did an awesome job of masking it with endless amounts of quests.
I played all the way from beta until the expansion and hit 70 in the expansion. I raided at 60 and had a blast doing it all. Then the expansion comes out and I grind again to 70. I got all the rep I needed to do every Heroic and my Karazhan key. Had my frustration at times, but all in all the journey was a good one.
So, here I am today. I have a great guild, full of great people, but one problem. We were not on the cutting edge of content when the expansion hit. We were farming BWL weekly and were working on the Twin Emps in AQ40 when the expansion hit.
So we take our 40 man raid force and take a shot at Gruul's lair. It did not go well so the guild decided to focus on Karazhan until people can get better gear. So our 40 man raid is now cut to 10 man and people are constantly fighting over raid spots.
I was fine sitting out of Karazhan, but then soon discovered that trying to run a heroic group while a raid was happening was damn near impossible. (We had 2 Kara groups) All the tanks and healers ended up being in the Kara raids.
Now PUG's and Heroics don't mix well. I had friends in other guilds that would invite me along, but I found myself logging in to sit around grinding mobs hoping either to get in Kara or have enough of the right people log on to get a heroic together.
Ultimately I ended up being bored and just canceled my account. I have been trying to find a reason to stay, but the game has just lost its luster for me. It is sad really since my son is now playing the Warcraft 3 expansion and seeing the old story and heroes is still awesome.
I guess the thing that ultimately hurt WoW was the grind was too damn easy and most people could not understand their roll in groups, because it was so damn easy to solo to cap level.
So, while I loved that the grind was easy and I thought it was one of WoW's greatest strengths, it is ultimately also is biggest weakness.
This is a spot-on description of the problem with WoW in it's current state. I might add a few things:
End-game requires the raid to use potions. Not just one or two simple potions, no, there are encounters that really requires the whole raid to use basically all potions/foods available. This adds the need for endless hours of farming potions/food for a few hours of raid. Fun? Take a guess. Of course you have the option to go for chinese money and buy it from AH, but really, come on...
TBC also changed the setup of a normal raid from being moderately flexible at lvl 60 to a more or less strict raid setup at lvl 70. An example: who needs hunters anymore? They're not the best DPS, nor the best utility. They're now simply in the raid for one thing: the pull. And they're not even very useful in heroics because of their limited abilities to cc.
Heroic is almost impossible to PUG due to the dungeon's massively sharp spike in it's difficulty. A trash mob that used to hit you for 1000-1500 at most in the normal dungeon will probably 1-2 shot you for over 3-4K dmg a hit in heroic. It's mean to be done by a very experienced, well geared and solid group of players. My friends who can easily breeze thru Tempest Keep normal for example are dying about 8 times per average on a heroic run. So yeah trying to do PUG heroics is like trying to run PUG naxxramas @ 60, its painful and obscene.
In the past few months I have noticed a lot of people that I know have been quitting wow left and right. At least 30 people that I have known have announced that they are quitting (publicly) or suddenly stopped login in. I am wondering if WoW TBC has been "played" out in just 3 months after release. Personally I'm starting to get bored, after grinding all my rep to revered, there's not much else to do except grind heroic instances for that elusive epic drop and heroic tokens. Of course if you're a raider you'll have a ton of raid content to do however if you're a casual player the game pretty much "stops" dead flat once you have mastered the heroic intances and get your epic flying mount. What are you opinions here?
It's just a game, people start playing and people stop playing. I'm sure right now there are people playing for the first time.
Don't think your mindset represents anyone but yourself. Sure others may feel the same, but others also will feel the opposite.
Stopped playing when I realized that the endgame at 70 was the same as it was at 60. Been there done that...don't feel like doing it again. Not to mention that I'd have to sell my first born child to ever experience the higher end raids...so why bother?
Yep I agree 100%. BC did not change a thing, the end game is still strictly raiding.
been playing since release and I don't think I want to bother leveling another alt, but Iwill continue to play as long as my friends are there, but they are also starting to get bored. None of us are interested in devoting the time it takes to raid. That is literally crazy to have to devote that much time to a game. It would not be too bad if the instances did not require you gather a host of mats to do them.
In my opinion the raiding game now is beyond absurd, it is more of a job, where is the fun in that?
Comments
I was an endgame raider and I say so many people come in to raid guilds thinking that they could play in the raid the same way they did as a solo player then I never really thought of it from the same point of view.
You are very right though, the two games are very different and clash horribly. Even in the expansion with the heroics and the new 10 man "epic" raid it is still a huge clash in play styles.
It's hard because so many people simply solo all the way to level cap -- the game makes it slightly more difficult to do that because you end up skipping all the instance quests with their nice gear upgrades and generous XP rewards, but it's still very manageable. And then you have these folks trying to jump from that to the hardest group content the game has to offer without ever really having played their character in a group, or having viewed their playtime as something to adjust to the demands of a group play dynamic. So it just basically is a trainwreck, and that's why PUGs for endgame instances just really suck.
I think it was more or less okay for raiders prior to TBC because at least they had their stable raid guilds with good players in them. Now the messing with the raid sizes has really thrown that for a loop, and I honestly don't think Blizzard saw that coming. i think they honestly thought that lowering the size would make raiding more accessible to a greater number of guilds, but what has happened is that the raid guilds are breaking up over it and these same group of players are simply raiding in smaller raid guilds. Net/net I don't think it's really brought more people into raiding who weren't into it before, and it has upset the applecart of the raiding guilds as they existed before the change, so it doesn't seem like a particularly well-thought-out change, to be honest.
Now I need something to play until AoC though >_>.
no stealth classes in the game. Won't be out for awhile, but looks like it could be a great game.
This is a spot-on description of the problem with WoW in it's current state. I might add a few things:
End-game requires the raid to use potions. Not just one or two simple potions, no, there are encounters that really requires the whole raid to use basically all potions/foods available. This adds the need for endless hours of farming potions/food for a few hours of raid. Fun? Take a guess. Of course you have the option to go for chinese money and buy it from AH, but really, come on...
TBC also changed the setup of a normal raid from being moderately flexible at lvl 60 to a more or less strict raid setup at lvl 70. An example: who needs hunters anymore? They're not the best DPS, nor the best utility. They're now simply in the raid for one thing: the pull. And they're not even very useful in heroics because of their limited abilities to cc.
It's just a game, people start playing and people stop playing. I'm sure right now there are people playing for the first time.
Don't think your mindset represents anyone but yourself. Sure others may feel the same, but others also will feel the opposite.
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Life sucks, buy a helmet.
Yep I agree 100%. BC did not change a thing, the end game is still strictly raiding.
been playing since release and I don't think I want to bother leveling another alt, but Iwill continue to play as long as my friends are there, but they are also starting to get bored. None of us are interested in devoting the time it takes to raid. That is literally crazy to have to devote that much time to a game. It would not be too bad if the instances did not require you gather a host of mats to do them.
In my opinion the raiding game now is beyond absurd, it is more of a job, where is the fun in that?