Fantasy Armor

Dreneth

Greetings all,

I am curious about what some of you may think about armor in your fantasy adventure MMORPG's.  Personally, I prefer realism and believability over total "anything goes" fantasy when it comes to things like armor.  I firmly believe that if a character is going to wear a chainmail bra and panty set for armor, they should not benefit from it.  There is no functional purpose to a chainmail bra & panty set.  And cloth armor...  that's not armor... that's called clothing.  I don't know what sort of clothes game developers buy, but my bathrobe offers me no protection from an arrow whatsoever.  Maybe I need to shop at a different store?

Now... I understand that one must follow the line of thought that is "suspension of disbelief" to truly get into a completely fictional game, but I always found it difficult to completely shed the idea that it is ridiculous for a female character wearing a chainmail bra & panty set to get the same level of protection as a male character in full chainmail armor.  It's just silly.

While I personally prefer realism when it comes to armor and clothing...  what do you folks prefer?

[ edit ] - BAH!!  I cancelled the poll... dunno why it is still showing up in there.  /sigh

JWPike

That is where the whole idea of AC comes in. It is not just that the armor protects from blows it also represents thinks like dodging and getting out of the way. Besides who does not want to see a hot girl in almost nothing?

Dreneth

Originally posted by JWPike

That is where the whole idea of AC comes in. It is not just that the armor protects from blows it also represents thinks like dodging and getting out of the way. Besides who does not want to see a hot girl in almost nothing?

If I want to see a hot girl in almost nothing...  it isn't going to be in a video game.  And while I understand your point about AC, there should be absolutely no benifit to wearing armor which does not actually cover much or is too weak to offer much resistance such as cloth.

Unknown

I perfer the more realistic armor for my fantasy games, and the more skimpy armor for my sci-fi games. If you are into fantasy MMORPGs you will probably really like the armor that EQ2 has, its the realistic covers you in head to toe type platemail.

I also think part of it depends on how you view being open about sexuality and revealing clothing, and also how you view the MMORPG, if its just a game or if its supposed to be a life simulation of sorts. Obviously more people would be alright with being dressed in a skimpy outfit in something they view as just a game where their character is nothing more then a game piece.

War_Dancer

I much prefer realistic looking armor that actualy looks like it's capable of doing its job.

JWPike

Then there should also be penalties to speed, swimming, etc if you really want it to be realistic. You should also have a lot higher repair too becasue that would be more real as well.

Dreneth

Originally posted by JWPike

Then there should also be penalties to speed, swimming, etc if you really want it to be realistic. You should also have a lot higher repair too becasue that would be more real as well.

I agree with you 100%.

Of course, some of those aspects don't make it into games due to concerns that the game would be "too real".  I personally wouldn't have an issue with overcoming the challenges of having to cross a river in game while wearing full plate.  That would be somewhat interesting.

Also... I'm not really saying "Get rid of revealing armor" or anything like that.  If someone wants to run around in something skimpy, good for them!  I am simply questioning why such armor would be given the same stats as something which properly covers the wearer.

War_Dancer

Originally posted by JWPike

Then there should also be penalties to speed, swimming, etc if you really want it to be realistic. You should also have a lot higher repair too becasue that would be more real as well.

I didn't say I wanted the GAME to be realistic, I said I wanted the ARMOR to look realistic. I'm not intrested in runing around in a game in armored lingerie as a part of a male fantasy or running around in armor with huge big spiked shoulder pads. In the first case It doesn't appeal to me personaly and in the second case it doesn't appeal  to my artistic taste. You prefer either of those to armor that actualy looks like realistic armor? fine but that doesn't invalidate my prefereance.

JWPike

And I am not invalidating your opinion. It is a fantasy people want to see things that they would not see in the real world. Games normally cater to the crowds. Most people I have met want their armorweps to stand out and "look cool" so they want something that does not look so real.  I guess to me sounded as if you wanted your cake and to eat it too and that is not how things work in real life or in games. Honestly why does a game have a busty hot girl running around in almost nothing? Why in movies do they do the same thing? People like to look at sexy women real or not. I agree with you that it might be nice to have more realistic armor but I think 95% of others would not and that is what devs are going for the 95% market.

Dreneth

95% of the market?  Do you really think so?  Or do you think it is more a matter of developers creating what they like, rather than what might be enjoyed by the masses?  Or much like in real life, crap products are sold with hot half naked chicks on the box to take people's eyes off the problems with the product?

War_Dancer

Originally posted by JWPike

And I am not invalidating your opinion. It is a fantasy people want to see things that they would not see in the real world. Games normally cater to the crowds. Most people I have met want their armorweps to stand out and "look cool" so they want something that does not look so real.  I guess to me sounded as if you wanted your cake and to eat it too and that is not how things work in real life or in games. Honestly why does a game have a busty hot girl running around in almost nothing? Why in movies do they do the same thing? People like to look at sexy women real or not. I agree with you that it might be nice to have more realistic armor but I think 95% of others would not and that is what devs are going for the 95% market.

Personaly I think I can look sexy in full realistic looking armor instead of lingerie and I tend not to watch movies where women are running around in almost nothing and I watch a fair amount of movies. MMOs are different to movies though because the fantasy setting is still such a male fantasy and along with that comes things like the chainmail bikini. It might appeal to men but well I'm not one so I'm sticking with not caring for it. Do I think that will make any difference to MMO developers? no, I'm just stating my opinion.

 

JWPike

No offense but why state an opinon that is not going to be acted upon. I understand your point 100%.  I am just stating that devs are not going to change it as those in with your opinion ( And I am partly one of them) are in the minority and so devs do not care and are not going to act on it. they want the cash cow which is how can they rope most of the market.

Dreneth

Originally posted by War_Dancer


Personaly I think I can look sexy in full realistic looking armor instead of lingerie and I tend not to watch movies where women are running around in almost nothing and I watch a fair amount of movies. MMOs are different to movies though because the fantasy setting is still such a male fantasy and along with that comes things like the chainmail bikini. It might appeal to men but well I'm not one so I'm sticking with not caring for it. Do I think that will make any difference to MMO developers? no, I'm just stating my opinion. 

I'm a guy... and I would rather not see chainmail bikinis either.  I would much rather see a realistic environment than a playboy mansion party with a midieval theme.  Besides...  I could never get past the fact that the "hot chick" in the chainmail bikini is probably a 40 year old man in his underwear.

War_Dancer

Originally posted by JWPike

No offense but why state an opinon that is not going to be acted upon. I understand your point 100%.  I am just stating that devs are not going to change it as those in with your opinion ( And I am partly one of them) are in the minority and so devs do not care and are not going to act on it. they want the cash cow which is how can they rope most of the market.

Just to answer the question another player asked really. Maybe I played SWG too long but I don't expect developers to listen to what your saying at all even if it is on their forums, let alone an independant site like this.

 

JWPike

I agree with you on that.  Smae reason that 1 900 numbers still work. When you call "candy" and she says she is a gorgeuous 22 year old built ut of this world and she is an ugly old crack ho who even with super beer gogles you would not touch her. I agree with you but you gotta cater to the masses and the masses are morans.

War_Dancer

Originally posted by Dreneth

Originally posted by War_Dancer

Personaly I think I can look sexy in full realistic looking armor instead of lingerie and I tend not to watch movies where women are running around in almost nothing and I watch a fair amount of movies. MMOs are different to movies though because the fantasy setting is still such a male fantasy and along with that comes things like the chainmail bikini. It might appeal to men but well I'm not one so I'm sticking with not caring for it. Do I think that will make any difference to MMO developers? no, I'm just stating my opinion. 

I'm a guy... and I would rather not see chainmail bikinis either.  I would much rather see a realistic environment than a playboy mansion party with a midieval theme.  Besides...  I could never get past the fact that the "hot chick" in the chainmail bikini is probably a 40 year old man in his underwear.

 

I did say might cause I know not all men would agree but didn't seem like an arguement I could get into with any proof

Dreneth

Originally posted by JWPike

No offense but why state an opinon that is not going to be acted upon. I understand your point 100%.  I am just stating that devs are not going to change it as those in with your opinion ( And I am partly one of them) are in the minority and so devs do not care and are not going to act on it. they want the cash cow which is how can they rope most of the market.

Why hold an opinion back?  Holding one's tongue certainly isn't going to get anyone anywhere. 

It's too bad that so many people are willing to buy into pixel-naughty rather than look past it and realize the lack of quality content in most games.  I suppose it is easier giving people fluff content than actually having to work at making a game good.

JWPike

I agree as I have said already but I am just saying you can want in one hand crap in the other and see which fills faster. Devs are going to go with the masses as that is where the money is.

War_Dancer

Originally posted by JWPike

I agree as I have said already but I am just saying you can want in one hand crap in the other and see which fills faster. Devs are going to go with the masses as that is where the money is.

Yeah but I'm not stating my opinion with the expectation that anything changes because I did. I'm just stating it as my opinion and even with the expectation that this will change nothing, isn't it better to say when you disagree with something instead of just saying nothing and leaving everyone to think no one disagrees?

Dreneth

Originally posted by JWPike

I agree as I have said already but I am just saying you can want in one hand crap in the other and see which fills faster. Devs are going to go with the masses as that is where the money is.

I doubt there has been a serious market study to see if people would rather have realistic armor (or at the very least realistic mitigation based on how much protection it could realistically provide) or if people would rather have naughty armor.

Here's an interesting set of questions...

If MMORPG's are dominated by male players... is that due to a lack of concern for female player's preferences?  How many more women would play these games if they felt the market wasn't full of "titties & beer" folk based on how the females are portrayed in these games?  How much revenue is being lost because dev's think scantily clad virtual women are hot?  lol

I'd love to see some market research proving that it is more financially viable to provide slutwear over realistic armor.

And as I said before...  at least give the naughty armor appropriate damage mitigation based on the amount of functional protection it would realistically give.

JWPike

Anyone who thinks that becasue somone does not say something beleives all agree is not that bright. You will never get 100% of people to agree on anything no matter what it is. People will always disagree for a myriad of reasons. I guess with me if it is not going to cause change then why?

Dreneth

Originally posted by JWPike

Anyone who thinks that becasue somone does not say something beleives all agree is not that bright. You will never get 100% of people to agree on anything no matter what it is. People will always disagree for a myriad of reasons. I guess with me if it is not going to cause change then why?

Everything starts with a discussion.

Besides... who says things won't change?  Some people will agree, some won't, but the simple fact remains that I have yet to see a study about whether or not it would be more financially viable for a gaming company to produce a game with realistic armor and damage mitigation over skimpy armor and unrealistic damage mitigation.

War_Dancer

Originally posted by JWPike

Anyone who thinks that becasue somone does not say something beleives all agree is not that bright. You will never get 100% of people to agree on anything no matter what it is. People will always disagree for a myriad of reasons. I guess with me if it is not going to cause change then why?

 

If it is about something that they never considered then they might never have stoped to think if anyone disagrees. Assumptions can be stupid but people still make them.

We're very different on "why post is it is not going to cause change". Kinda like the difference between an optamist and a pessamist, you think the developers listen and might even listen here and I don't think they listen even on their own forums, if I only posted about things I thought my opinion might change I doubt I'd post on any forum anywhere 

But specificaly in this thread I posted because someone asked showing an intrest in what others thought and the conversation itself has so far been entertaining.

Devildog1

I voted some what realistic because Fantasy games are just that fantasy, but if we were to talk bout a game that takes place during an actual time period in history, or is supposed to, then I whole heartedly agree with you that the armor should be proper armor.

Dreneth

Originally posted by Devildog1

I voted some what realistic because Fantasy games are just that fantasy, but if we were to talk bout a game that takes place during an actual time period in history, or is supposed to, then I whole heartedly agree with you that the armor should be proper armor.

While I understand that fantasy games are fictional, and suspension of disbelief is needed to play them, I can't help but feel that accepting skimpy armor as just as valid as a realistic set is akin to saying "Nuh uh!" when your friend shoots you with his toy gun in a game of "cops & robbers" in the backyard. 

I guess justifying chainmail bikini by attributing some sort of magical property to it and using the term "fantasy" to attempt at making it all sound viable sounds like the guy who came up with that idea doesn't get out enough.

isurus

As much as i love chain mail panties, i am too much of a proponent of realism to vote for them.  I am sorry panties....