I think the PvMP is a good thing. Now there will possibly never be a balancing issue. No one that I know of has complained about a balancing issue or one class or another needing to be nerfed. In the end PvMP is the best way to go for the least amount of complaints.
Watch when AoC comes out how many people will complain this class is better than that class, it needs a nerf. Mark my words.
In America I have bad teeth. If I lived in England my teeth would be perfect.
I hate posts like this. The guy is bringing up what he doesn't like about the game in a FORUM FOR DISCUSSION. Why is it whining? And for this particular IP, its cause for discussion because people like me, who love the LotR series wanted a meaningful game with PvP which DOES fit the IP, no matter what the devs say. I also hate posts where people talk about PvP'ers being homocidal maniacs that only want to gank people 20 levels below them. This is total bs. Most PvP'ers enjoy pvp because it is the only part of the game that does not involve "learning" the basics of the pathetically predictable AI of the mobs in a game like this. Would anyone who's played this argue that the AI is not very basic? It is worse than WOW.
The fanatics need to let people express their opinion, which is what the poster did.
On a side note, I love how the word "Carebear" gets people so worked up.....LOL.....
While I agree with you completely, I do believe the main issue is the OP posting blatantly incorrect and un-informed information for the purpose of putting down the game, NOT fostering actual discussion. The original post basically stated that 'Turbine sucks because you can't play evil races', which is completely false in every way. I agree the descent into 'PvP vs. Carebare' chaos was uncalled for, but this is topic often brings abotu heated debate - probably another goal of the OP...
I hate posts like this. The guy is bringing up what he doesn't like about the game in a FORUM FOR DISCUSSION. Why is it whining? And for this particular IP, its cause for discussion because people like me, who love the LotR series wanted a meaningful game with PvP which DOES fit the IP, no matter what the devs say. I also hate posts where people talk about PvP'ers being homocidal maniacs that only want to gank people 20 levels below them. This is total bs. Most PvP'ers enjoy pvp because it is the only part of the game that does not involve "learning" the basics of the pathetically predictable AI of the mobs in a game like this. Would anyone who's played this argue that the AI is not very basic? It is worse than WOW. If all PVPers want is the ability to fight someone that doesn't have poor AI then the game has that already in PVM. Like I said earlier the PVM system gives everyone the best parts of PVP. There is no reason that it doesn't give what you are asking for. The only thing the PVM system doesn't provide is the ability to GANK lower level characters. So how does the game not have meaningful PVP? The sytem allows you to gain infamy(rank) and destiny points(currency) to improve both your good character and your monster character. How is this not meaningful? They provide for Keep attacks where both the Creeps(player mobs) and Freeps(player characters) can battle over them. It allows for open PVP anywhere in the current PVP zone of Ettenmoor (which is not anything at all like Battlegrounds on WoW, the zone of Ettenmoor is a lot larger). And they have already stated that they will be adding more PVM zones as teh game goes along. The only prerequisite to doing PVM play is getting a player character to level 10, after that you never have to play your character again and instead can work exclusively on your mob.
The fanatics need to let people express their opinion, which is what the poster did.
On a side note, I love how the word "Carebear" gets people so worked up.....LOL.....
I see people wanting PVP talking about meaningful PVP or working on their character, but both of those are in the game currently. AS I have said previously the only thing lacking is the ability to attack lower level players with your higher level character in PVP. There are even quests that can be done with your MOB so that you can advance your character that way as well. So really what is lacking other then ganking?
I challenge someone to show me what else you are lacking from the current PVM system other then the ability to PVP in any zone (which will never ever be in the game, they have said they don't want hobbits getting ganked in the shire) or the ability to kill lower level characters?
Currently playing: LOTRO & WoW (not much WoW though because Mines of Moria rocks!!!!)
Looking Foward too: Bioware games (Dragon Age & Star Wars The Old Republic)
Did you read my post? PvMP is not the same as a playable character race. Yes, I did PvMP quite often. I had two signature PvMP monsters. PvMP is a joke. The monster characters are designed to not be able to solo any player characters. They are just broken gimps that are fodder for real player characters in the ettenmoors. Don't waste your time in PvMP.
Maybe if they made Uruk-Hai or men of the south playable races there would be meaningfull PvP. Not to mention that there were no wargs in the novels. There were warg riders. Wargs should have been mounts for the Uruk-Hai. Wtf is up with weavers or spiders? There was only one mentioned in the novels and it should be considered a Boss type mob.
PvMP is an afterthought haphazardly tacked onto the game. The Devs have admitted that there is no meaningfull PvP in LotRO.
Yeah because FFA PvP is very meaningful, you can get raped and lose all of your equipment. How meaningful.
PvMP is an enjoyable part of the LotRO universe.
And your suggestions for the game are not only pointless but they are quite absurd.
No it isn't the same as a playable character race, but you still play the friggin thing.
Currently Playing: Everything but MMORPGs Cancelled: L2, FFXI, VSoH, LotRO, WAR, WoW Looking Forward To: SW:TOR
Player vs. Player .... What is it you like about it, and how does this game not deliver it? Because as a previous poster said, the only thing I see lacking is that you can't take advantage of someone of a lower level (ie. ganking).
Yes, there are mature PvPers. I enjoy a good bit of PvP myself. But not when it interferes with people's enjoyment of the game. I heartily believe in voluntary engagement only, and wont pay to play a game that is going to force me into a fight I don't want to be in because I'm at work, afk making dinner, or in the middle of a long quest series, escorting an NPC, or hell, just not in the mood for a fight.
The 'duel' function should be enough for your epeens and who-is-better-than-who. In addition there is the entire PvMP thing. If that's not enough for you, I ask, what is it you want? The ability to gank? Not here, no thanks, I'll not have this one ruined by kiddies too.
In all honesty, its an indisputable fact that the only people who want 'open' pvp are the people who play these games in order to boost their egos by preying on people unable to defend themselves. I really wish game developers would quit encouraging this sort of sociopathic tendency. Anyone with even minimal respect for their fellow players would not be asking for a system that allows them to abuse and exploit them.
Gaming? That's not gaming! That's just people sat 'round in costumes drinking...
Those of you that complain about the lack of adequate PvP in LOTRO are really beginning to behave and sound like nothing more than whining children that throw a temper tantrum when they don't get their way.
LOTRO pvp isn't good enough for you? Fine enough, move on to a game designed for PvP that you will enjoy. Try something like Warhammer or Age of Conan.
Just stop whining.
im not whining im just giving my opinion....i could go on to say that i see lotr players on alot of forums on this site bashing every game that isnt lotr..i would play war and age of conan but the only problem is that those games are not out till the end of the year....i was just giving my opinion on pvp and how seeing both sides of the war would make the game last longer and would probably sell more copies of the game....but i guess in a years time turbine will realise their mistake and add a more meaningful pvp system....lord of the rings is about a war not some silly 4 man instance...turbine have 2 of the greatest IP's in their hands and have failed to do anything more than mediocre with them....dungeons and dragons and lotr.....they should have made millions for each of them but their games are so badly developed and poor design decisions will make them 1/10 of what they could of made with these two monsterous IP's.
Those of you that complain about the lack of adequate PvP in LOTRO are really beginning to behave and sound like nothing more than whining children that throw a temper tantrum when they don't get their way.
LOTRO pvp isn't good enough for you? Fine enough, move on to a game designed for PvP that you will enjoy. Try something like Warhammer or Age of Conan.
Just stop whining.
im not whining im just giving my opinion....i could go on to say that i see lotr players on alot of forums on this site bashing every game that isnt lotr..i would play war and age of conan but the only problem is that those games are not out till the end of the year....i was just giving my opinion on pvp and how seeing both sides of the war would make the game last longer and would probably sell more copies of the game....but i guess in a years time turbine will realise their mistake and add a more meaningful pvp system....lord of the rings is about a war not some silly 4 man instance.
Don't count on it changing. The owner of the IP wanted a PVP system that fit within the Lore. And in the LORE there is no room for open PVP. As I have said before and will continue to Say the Monster Play system has everything that PVPers could want except there is no ganking of lower level players and no looting (but the no looting is pretty common today for all games). So until someone shows me what is lacking other then the ability to gank, I will continue to post how everyone complaining about PVM are gankers who are upset that they can't kill hobbits in the Shire.
Currently playing: LOTRO & WoW (not much WoW though because Mines of Moria rocks!!!!)
Looking Foward too: Bioware games (Dragon Age & Star Wars The Old Republic)
Those of you that complain about the lack of adequate PvP in LOTRO are really beginning to behave and sound like nothing more than whining children that throw a temper tantrum when they don't get their way.
LOTRO pvp isn't good enough for you? Fine enough, move on to a game designed for PvP that you will enjoy. Try something like Warhammer or Age of Conan.
Just stop whining.
im not whining im just giving my opinion....i could go on to say that i see lotr players on alot of forums on this site bashing every game that isnt lotr..i would play war and age of conan but the only problem is that those games are not out till the end of the year....i was just giving my opinion on pvp and how seeing both sides of the war would make the game last longer and would probably sell more copies of the game....but i guess in a years time turbine will realise their mistake and add a more meaningful pvp system....lord of the rings is about a war not some silly 4 man instance.
Don't count on it changing. The owner of the IP wanted a PVP system that fit within the Lore. And in the LORE there is no room for open PVP. As I have said before and will continue to Say the Monster Play system has everything that PVPers could want except there is no ganking of lower level players and no looting (but the no looting is pretty common today for all games). So until someone shows me what is lacking other then the ability to gank, I will continue to post how everyone complaining about PVM are gankers who are upset that they can't kill hobbits in the Shire.
maybe a battle like the battle that took place in lotr would change your idea of pvp..warhammer is taking a good route to get rid of low lvl ganking and with a bit of outside the box thinking they could easily make a pvp system that works for everyone...like once you enter the particular zone where the final battle in lotr took place, you are in the midst of a war but you dont have to enter this area if you do not want to...instead they took the easy option and made it pve because it takes less innovation and thought....monster play was done in everquest2 also, so its not new to lotr.
Those of you that complain about the lack of adequate PvP in LOTRO are really beginning to behave and sound like nothing more than whining children that throw a temper tantrum when they don't get their way.
LOTRO pvp isn't good enough for you? Fine enough, move on to a game designed for PvP that you will enjoy. Try something like Warhammer or Age of Conan.
Just stop whining.
im not whining im just giving my opinion....i could go on to say that i see lotr players on alot of forums on this site bashing every game that isnt lotr..i would play war and age of conan but the only problem is that those games are not out till the end of the year....i was just giving my opinion on pvp and how seeing both sides of the war would make the game last longer and would probably sell more copies of the game....but i guess in a years time turbine will realise their mistake and add a more meaningful pvp system....lord of the rings is about a war not some silly 4 man instance.
Don't count on it changing. The owner of the IP wanted a PVP system that fit within the Lore. And in the LORE there is no room for open PVP. As I have said before and will continue to Say the Monster Play system has everything that PVPers could want except there is no ganking of lower level players and no looting (but the no looting is pretty common today for all games). So until someone shows me what is lacking other then the ability to gank, I will continue to post how everyone complaining about PVM are gankers who are upset that they can't kill hobbits in the Shire.
maybe a battle like the battle that took place in lotr would change your idea of pvp..warhammer is taking a good route to get rid of low lvl ganking and with a bit of outside the box thinking they could easily make a pvp system that works for everyone...like once you enter the particular zone where the final battle in lotr took place, you are in the midst of a war but you dont have to enter this area if you do not want to...instead they took the easy option and made it pve because it takes less innovation and thought....monster play was done in everquest2 also, so its not new to lotr.
You can have massive battles in the Ettenmoors. They had them in closed beta between the creeps and the freeps.
So once again I ask for something that can't already be done in the Current PVM system.
Currently playing: LOTRO & WoW (not much WoW though because Mines of Moria rocks!!!!)
Looking Foward too: Bioware games (Dragon Age & Star Wars The Old Republic)
Agreed, agreed, agreed. I'm not sure why I'm wasting my time responding to this but I will. A discussion of PvP always disintegrates to Maniacs (rapists is completely retarded) vs. Carebears, and always completely wuss PvE vs. insane totally open FFA PvP.
Those are always the far ends of the spectrums. Most PvP'ers don't want completely open loose your loot die by anyone, anywhere PvP. We just want systems designed around the ideas, with rules and systems implemented so that a game uses its best resource for AI, ie other players. Monster play is just a tacked on last minute system they added because they were getting too much flak about having no PvP. Anyone who followed the game's development knows that. To say it's meaningful is absurd. The people saying it's meaningful are the people who won't even be involved in it and will happily grind away against the scary "dire boars" roaming the countryside.
The OP said it's not meaningful. He is right. It's too bad, if this game had had an evil faction to play it would have been really entertaining. Though this is hardly the least of this games shortcomings. I have actually played the game for a few months so I know them. I mean how can a game coming out several years after WOW's release, mimic it so fully yet have almost 0 innovation? How can the combat actually be slower and LESS responsive than the game it is copying when they have had years to develop it?? How can there actually be LESS character/class customization?
You PvE'ers have fun in your game. I'm sure this game will be modestly successful because it IS very polished. Fro the rest of you, see you in AoC and/or WAR, let the wars begin!
and how seeing both sides of the war would make the game last longer and would probably sell more copies of the game.....lord of the rings is about a war not some silly 4 man instance.
maybe a battle like the battle that took place in lotr would change your idea of pvp...and with a bit of outside the box thinking they could easily make a pvp system that works for everyone...like once you enter the particular zone where the final battle in lotr took place, you are in the midst of a war but you dont have to enter this area if you do not want to.. The problem is... you want to be part of the final battle in LotRO... and you can't be. That story has already been told, the players all have their part and you can't insert the rest of us into the fight.
Notice the sub-title to the game, Shadow of Angmar.... we're actually dealing with the issues in the Witch-King's former realm (I'm not quite explaining this right) and we have our own story to play...and being part of the overall LotRO battle story line isn't it.
So while we're in the same world, and may even interact with some off the characters from the original lore.... we are on our own, separate journey from them...
Its not called "Battlefield Middle-Earth" you know....
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Agreed, agreed, agreed. I'm not sure why I'm wasting my time responding to this but I will. A discussion of PvP always disintegrates to Maniacs (rapists is completely retarded) vs. Carebears, and always completely wuss PvE vs. insane totally open FFA PvP. Those are always the far ends of the spectrums. Most PvP'ers don't want completely open loose your loot die by anyone, anywhere PvP. We just want systems designed around the ideas, with rules and systems implemented so that a game uses its best resource for AI, ie other players. Monster play is just a tacked on last minute system they added because they were getting too much flak about having no PvP. Anyone who followed the game's development knows that. To say it's meaningful is absurd. The people saying it's meaningful are the people who won't even be involved in it and will happily grind away against the scary "dire boars" roaming the countryside.
The OP said it's not meaningful. He is right. It's too bad, if this game had had an evil faction to play it would have been really entertaining. Though this is hardly the least of this games shortcomings. I have actually played the game for a few months so I know them. I mean how can a game coming out several years after WOW's release, mimic it so fully yet have almost 0 innovation? How can the combat actually be slower and LESS responsive than the game it is copying when they have had years to develop it?? How can there actually be LESS character/class customization?
You PvE'ers have fun in your game. I'm sure this game will be modestly successful because it IS very polished. Fro the rest of you, see you in AoC and/or WAR, let the wars begin!
Blah Blah Blah. Once again I hear how it isn't meaningful. Or how it is just tacked on. Yet it has Keep raids, Town Raids, the ability to improve your Freep and Creep, multiple choices for your evil character, and other features.
I still have not heard a single thing that PVM doesn't provide that supposedly having a full evil faction would provide. So once again until I do hear something that actually doesn't involve ganking that is not and can not be provided in the future by the PVM system, then it is just whining because PVPers are upset they can't gank hobbits in the Shire. (Not sure what the PVPers have against Hobbits )
Currently playing: LOTRO & WoW (not much WoW though because Mines of Moria rocks!!!!)
Looking Foward too: Bioware games (Dragon Age & Star Wars The Old Republic)
Agreed, agreed, agreed. I'm not sure why I'm wasting my time responding to this but I will. A discussion of PvP always disintegrates to Maniacs (rapists is completely retarded) vs. Carebears, and always completely wuss PvE vs. insane totally open FFA PvP.
How is calling PvPer's rapists more completely retarded then calling non PvP'ers carebears?
Oh and for the record I am a PVP player. I have played PVP games since the start of MMOs. Including UO, AC Darktide, etc etc.
Currently the game I am subscribed to is Dark Age of Camelot.
So, as a PVPer I still would like to know what LOTRO's PVM system doesn't have that another PVP System does have?
About the only thing other then Ganking I can see missing is the PVE portion to level your evil character to 50. But I can't imagine that the Proclaimed PVPers are upset that they can't PVE with their evil characters.
Currently playing: LOTRO & WoW (not much WoW though because Mines of Moria rocks!!!!)
Looking Foward too: Bioware games (Dragon Age & Star Wars The Old Republic)
The main "problem" is that there is very little incentive for Freeps (player chars) to enter and participate there aside from the fun, whereas Monster characters are very dependant on that. Also, it ll take a good while till enough PvP-interested players have their chars on a level where they wont get slaughtered by the monsters, and where enough Freeps go there consistently to allow any sort of fun pvp. In beta there were a few servers/times where it worked, but we will have to see how that works out in retail. Beta communitites are almost always more inclined to play for fun, rather than to win.
The main "problem" is that there is very little incentive for Freeps (player chars) to enter and participate there aside from the fun, whereas Monster characters are very dependant on that. Also, it ll take a good while till enough PvP-interested players have their chars on a level where they wont get slaughtered by the monsters, and where enough Freeps go there consistently to allow any sort of fun pvp. In beta there were a few servers/times where it worked, but we will have to see how that works out in retail. Beta communitites are almost always more inclined to play for fun, rather than to win.
My understanding is there are quests that will send Freeps to the ettenmoors, as well as crafting nodes that can only be found in the ettenmoors, and some of the level appropriate content will be in those zones as well.
So we should see plenty of Freeps in the zone.
Currently playing: LOTRO & WoW (not much WoW though because Mines of Moria rocks!!!!)
Looking Foward too: Bioware games (Dragon Age & Star Wars The Old Republic)
The main "problem" is that there is very little incentive for Freeps (player chars) to enter and participate there aside from the fun, whereas Monster characters are very dependant on that. Also, it ll take a good while till enough PvP-interested players have their chars on a level where they wont get slaughtered by the monsters, and where enough Freeps go there consistently to allow any sort of fun pvp. In beta there were a few servers/times where it worked, but we will have to see how that works out in retail. Beta communitites are almost always more inclined to play for fun, rather than to win.
My understanding is there are quests that will send Freeps to the ettenmoors, as well as crafting nodes that can only be found in the ettenmoors, and some of the level appropriate content will be in those zones as well.
So we should see plenty of Freeps in the zone.
OMFG. How absolutely perfect. I had assumed that since you were continuing to post about how "Awesome" the PVM system was, that you had actually played the fricken game in Beta. How in the world can you argue a point about a game based on crap you've read on the LOTRO website??
Since you obviously have not played the game, let me explain this to you. The PVM is a cute little mini-game to spend some time if you are bored withe leveling your char or at the end of the game (where there is very little content - true that they will definitely add more, but there is very little now). I guess if you were basing your opinion off of what they tell you you can do, you might think it sounds fun. But once you've actually played it you see that it is very meaningless. It's interesting to play for a bit, but you see that you are confined to one zone where there is no meaning to the battles. Jesus, play the game before you go to war arguing points about it.
The main "problem" is that there is very little incentive for Freeps (player chars) to enter and participate there aside from the fun, whereas Monster characters are very dependant on that. Also, it ll take a good while till enough PvP-interested players have their chars on a level where they wont get slaughtered by the monsters, and where enough Freeps go there consistently to allow any sort of fun pvp. In beta there were a few servers/times where it worked, but we will have to see how that works out in retail. Beta communitites are almost always more inclined to play for fun, rather than to win.
My understanding is there are quests that will send Freeps to the ettenmoors, as well as crafting nodes that can only be found in the ettenmoors, and some of the level appropriate content will be in those zones as well.
So we should see plenty of Freeps in the zone.
OMFG. How absolutely perfect. I had assumed that since you were continuing to post about how "Awesome" the PVM system was, that you had actually played the fricken game in Beta. How in the world can you argue a point about a game based on crap you've read on the LOTRO website??
Since you obviously have not played the game, let me explain this to you. The PVM is a cute little mini-game to spend some time if you are bored withe leveling your char or at the end of the game (where there is very little content - true that they will definitely add more, but there is very little now). I guess if you were basing your opinion off of what they tell you you can do, you might think it sounds fun. But once you've actually played it you see that it is very meaningless. It's interesting to play for a bit, but you see that you are confined to one zone where there is no meaning to the battles. Jesus, play the game before you go to war arguing points about it.
Classic.
Actually I have been playing the game since Alpha. And there is nothing that I have posted that either myself or a RL friend of mine didn't participate in during Beta.
Currently playing: LOTRO & WoW (not much WoW though because Mines of Moria rocks!!!!)
Looking Foward too: Bioware games (Dragon Age & Star Wars The Old Republic)
What is it you like about it, and how does this game not deliver it?
Because as a previous poster said, the only thing I see lacking is that you can't take advantage of someone of a lower level (ie. ganking). Yes, there are mature PvPers. I enjoy a good bit of PvP myself.
But not when it interferes with people's enjoyment of the game.
I heartily believe in voluntary engagement only, and wont pay to play a game that is going to force me into a fight I don't want to be in because I'm at work, afk making dinner, or in the middle of a long quest series, escorting an NPC, or hell, just not in the mood for a fight. The 'duel' function should be enough for your epeens and who-is-better-than-who.
In addition there is the entire PvMP thing.
If that's not enough for you, I ask, what is it you want?
The ability to gank? Not here, no thanks, I'll not have this one ruined by kiddies too.
In all honesty, its an indisputable fact that the only people who want 'open' pvp are the people who play these games in order to boost their egos by preying on people unable to defend themselves. I really wish game developers would quit encouraging this sort of sociopathic tendency. Anyone with even minimal respect for their fellow players would not be asking for a system that allows them to abuse and exploit them.
Worth.
Less.
Waste.
Of.
Life.
Pfft. Go play a single player game, or better yet, Second Life. "Sociopathic tendancy"? Im proud of it. In game, in life, we are the predators - poor YOU
Implement FULL PvP, with FULL looting, within the confines of RACIAL combat. Orcs would not spare some level one hobbit because "it wouldnt be a challenge". There would be screams, tearing of meat, and consuming of halfling-whilst-kicking. Deal with it.
Monster play. What a joke. "Lets play a Level 50 mob, so we can REALLY get massacred by Level 50 PCs. Oh, and lets make sure I didnt have to bust my ass building this evil monster, or having to be intelligent to MAKE it this far amongst other evil monsters. I never had to devote an ounce of thought into my CHARACTER, ill just possess this spawn right quick."
...Gawd. Spanish Flu, hit the devs of this game. PLEASE.
I think the point that carebears are missing from the PvPers. PvPers like true competition wich is why we choose other players to play against. LotRO does not offer true competition because the level 50 monsters are gimped and can not solo player characters level 46 or higher (this is true for any rank monster). It is not fun to play at a distinct disadvantage.
We PvPers realize LotRO will never be a PvP game. It is a carebear PvE quest game. I cannot deny it is a very good carebear PvE quest game. It is just not what I want. There are plenty of PvP games coming out soom. I'll wait for WAR, AoC, Huxley, Tabula Rasa, Exteel, TCoS, or Fury.
But, the reason this thread started was that it would be fun to imagine a different LotRO where the monsters were real playable characters with a realm war setup. That would be more appealing to PvPers than the current LotRO.
I think the point that carebears are missing from the PvPers. PvPers like true competition wich is why we choose other players to play against. AI does not offer a challenge. LotRO does not offer true competition because the level 50 monsters are gimped and can not solo player characters level 46 or higher (this is true for any rank monster). So if one side has a distinct advantage what is the point in playing?
That question is why I don't bother much with PvP in MMORPGs and can't take it all that seriously.
I think the point that carebears are missing from the PvPers. PvPers like true competition wich is why we choose other players to play against. LotRO does not offer true competition because the level 50 monsters are gimped and can not solo player characters level 46 or higher (this is true for any rank monster). It is not fun to play at a distinct disadvantage.
We PvPers realize LotRO will never be a PvP game. It is a carebear PvE quest game. I cannot deny it is a very good carebear PvE quest game. It is just not what I want. There are plenty of PvP games coming out soom. I'll wait for WAR, AoC, Huxley, Tabula Rasa, Exteel, TCoS, or Fury.
But, the reason this thread started was that it would be fun to imagine a different LotRO where the monsters were real playable characters with a realm war setup. That would be more appealing to PvPers than the current LotRO.
I PvP from time to time. The difference between me and the other so-called PvPers is that:
1). I don't feel the need to insult others who dislike PvP.
2). I don't feel the obssesive need to make every game a PvP game.
Yes, there are plenty of PvP games on the horizon. Good. Enjoy them. I personally will stick with WWII Online for my PvP fix (where real PvP skills and not phat loot / uber levels determines your success)
_____________________________ Currently Playing: LOTRO; DDO Played: AC2, AO, Auto Assault, CoX, DAoC, DDO, Earth&Beyond, EQ1, EQ2, EVE, Fallen Earth, Jumpgate, Roma Victor, Second Life, SWG, V:SoH, WoW, World War II Online.
Games I'm watching: Infinity: The Quest for Earth, Force of Arms.
I personally will stick with WWII Online for my PvP fix (where real PvP skills and not phat loot / uber levels determines your success)
Yeah, WW2OL is the only MMO with true PvP out there. All the others are mainly BvB (Build vs Build) and require a tiny fraction of the skill that WW2OL demands.
It's a great game, much underrated, and its players are a breed apart.
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-Currently looking forward to FFXIV
-Currently playing EvE and Global Agenda
I think the PvMP is a good thing. Now there will possibly never be a balancing issue. No one that I know of has complained about a balancing issue or one class or another needing to be nerfed. In the end PvMP is the best way to go for the least amount of complaints.
Watch when AoC comes out how many people will complain this class is better than that class, it needs a nerf. Mark my words.
In America I have bad teeth. If I lived in England my teeth would be perfect.
When scary things get scared, that's bad...
I see people wanting PVP talking about meaningful PVP or working on their character, but both of those are in the game currently. AS I have said previously the only thing lacking is the ability to attack lower level players with your higher level character in PVP. There are even quests that can be done with your MOB so that you can advance your character that way as well. So really what is lacking other then ganking?
I challenge someone to show me what else you are lacking from the current PVM system other then the ability to PVP in any zone (which will never ever be in the game, they have said they don't want hobbits getting ganked in the shire) or the ability to kill lower level characters?
Currently playing:
LOTRO & WoW (not much WoW though because Mines of Moria rocks!!!!)
Looking Foward too:
Bioware games (Dragon Age & Star Wars The Old Republic)
Yeah because FFA PvP is very meaningful, you can get raped and lose all of your equipment. How meaningful.
PvMP is an enjoyable part of the LotRO universe.
And your suggestions for the game are not only pointless but they are quite absurd.
No it isn't the same as a playable character race, but you still play the friggin thing.
Currently Playing: Everything but MMORPGs
Cancelled: L2, FFXI, VSoH, LotRO, WAR, WoW
Looking Forward To: SW:TOR
Player vs. Player ....
What is it you like about it, and how does this game not deliver it?
Because as a previous poster said, the only thing I see lacking is that you can't take advantage of someone of a lower level (ie. ganking).
Yes, there are mature PvPers. I enjoy a good bit of PvP myself.
But not when it interferes with people's enjoyment of the game.
I heartily believe in voluntary engagement only, and wont pay to play a game that is going to force me into a fight I don't want to be in because I'm at work, afk making dinner, or in the middle of a long quest series, escorting an NPC, or hell, just not in the mood for a fight.
The 'duel' function should be enough for your epeens and who-is-better-than-who.
In addition there is the entire PvMP thing.
If that's not enough for you, I ask, what is it you want?
The ability to gank? Not here, no thanks, I'll not have this one ruined by kiddies too.
In all honesty, its an indisputable fact that the only people who want 'open' pvp are the people who play these games in order to boost their egos by preying on people unable to defend themselves. I really wish game developers would quit encouraging this sort of sociopathic tendency. Anyone with even minimal respect for their fellow players would not be asking for a system that allows them to abuse and exploit them.
Gaming? That's not gaming!
That's just people sat 'round in costumes drinking...
Don't count on it changing. The owner of the IP wanted a PVP system that fit within the Lore. And in the LORE there is no room for open PVP. As I have said before and will continue to Say the Monster Play system has everything that PVPers could want except there is no ganking of lower level players and no looting (but the no looting is pretty common today for all games). So until someone shows me what is lacking other then the ability to gank, I will continue to post how everyone complaining about PVM are gankers who are upset that they can't kill hobbits in the Shire.
Currently playing:
LOTRO & WoW (not much WoW though because Mines of Moria rocks!!!!)
Looking Foward too:
Bioware games (Dragon Age & Star Wars The Old Republic)
Don't count on it changing. The owner of the IP wanted a PVP system that fit within the Lore. And in the LORE there is no room for open PVP. As I have said before and will continue to Say the Monster Play system has everything that PVPers could want except there is no ganking of lower level players and no looting (but the no looting is pretty common today for all games). So until someone shows me what is lacking other then the ability to gank, I will continue to post how everyone complaining about PVM are gankers who are upset that they can't kill hobbits in the Shire.
maybe a battle like the battle that took place in lotr would change your idea of pvp..warhammer is taking a good route to get rid of low lvl ganking and with a bit of outside the box thinking they could easily make a pvp system that works for everyone...like once you enter the particular zone where the final battle in lotr took place, you are in the midst of a war but you dont have to enter this area if you do not want to...instead they took the easy option and made it pve because it takes less innovation and thought....monster play was done in everquest2 also, so its not new to lotr.Don't count on it changing. The owner of the IP wanted a PVP system that fit within the Lore. And in the LORE there is no room for open PVP. As I have said before and will continue to Say the Monster Play system has everything that PVPers could want except there is no ganking of lower level players and no looting (but the no looting is pretty common today for all games). So until someone shows me what is lacking other then the ability to gank, I will continue to post how everyone complaining about PVM are gankers who are upset that they can't kill hobbits in the Shire.
maybe a battle like the battle that took place in lotr would change your idea of pvp..warhammer is taking a good route to get rid of low lvl ganking and with a bit of outside the box thinking they could easily make a pvp system that works for everyone...like once you enter the particular zone where the final battle in lotr took place, you are in the midst of a war but you dont have to enter this area if you do not want to...instead they took the easy option and made it pve because it takes less innovation and thought....monster play was done in everquest2 also, so its not new to lotr.You can have massive battles in the Ettenmoors. They had them in closed beta between the creeps and the freeps.
So once again I ask for something that can't already be done in the Current PVM system.
Currently playing:
LOTRO & WoW (not much WoW though because Mines of Moria rocks!!!!)
Looking Foward too:
Bioware games (Dragon Age & Star Wars The Old Republic)
Agreed, agreed, agreed. I'm not sure why I'm wasting my time responding to this but I will. A discussion of PvP always disintegrates to Maniacs (rapists is completely retarded) vs. Carebears, and always completely wuss PvE vs. insane totally open FFA PvP.
Those are always the far ends of the spectrums. Most PvP'ers don't want completely open loose your loot die by anyone, anywhere PvP. We just want systems designed around the ideas, with rules and systems implemented so that a game uses its best resource for AI, ie other players. Monster play is just a tacked on last minute system they added because they were getting too much flak about having no PvP. Anyone who followed the game's development knows that. To say it's meaningful is absurd. The people saying it's meaningful are the people who won't even be involved in it and will happily grind away against the scary "dire boars" roaming the countryside.
The OP said it's not meaningful. He is right. It's too bad, if this game had had an evil faction to play it would have been really entertaining. Though this is hardly the least of this games shortcomings. I have actually played the game for a few months so I know them. I mean how can a game coming out several years after WOW's release, mimic it so fully yet have almost 0 innovation? How can the combat actually be slower and LESS responsive than the game it is copying when they have had years to develop it?? How can there actually be LESS character/class customization?
You PvE'ers have fun in your game. I'm sure this game will be modestly successful because it IS very polished. Fro the rest of you, see you in AoC and/or WAR, let the wars begin!
correction: "diseased boretusk" (or somethign equally ridiculous, I can't remember now)
Notice the sub-title to the game, Shadow of Angmar.... we're actually dealing with the issues in the Witch-King's former realm (I'm not quite explaining this right) and we have our own story to play...and being part of the overall LotRO battle story line isn't it.
So while we're in the same world, and may even interact with some off the characters from the original lore.... we are on our own, separate journey from them...
Its not called "Battlefield Middle-Earth" you know....
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Blah Blah Blah. Once again I hear how it isn't meaningful. Or how it is just tacked on. Yet it has Keep raids, Town Raids, the ability to improve your Freep and Creep, multiple choices for your evil character, and other features.
I still have not heard a single thing that PVM doesn't provide that supposedly having a full evil faction would provide. So once again until I do hear something that actually doesn't involve ganking that is not and can not be provided in the future by the PVM system, then it is just whining because PVPers are upset they can't gank hobbits in the Shire. (Not sure what the PVPers have against Hobbits
)
Currently playing:
LOTRO & WoW (not much WoW though because Mines of Moria rocks!!!!)
Looking Foward too:
Bioware games (Dragon Age & Star Wars The Old Republic)
-Currently looking forward to FFXIV
-Currently playing EvE and Global Agenda
Oh and for the record I am a PVP player. I have played PVP games since the start of MMOs. Including UO, AC Darktide, etc etc.
Currently the game I am subscribed to is Dark Age of Camelot.
So, as a PVPer I still would like to know what LOTRO's PVM system doesn't have that another PVP System does have?
About the only thing other then Ganking I can see missing is the PVE portion to level your evil character to 50. But I can't imagine that the Proclaimed PVPers are upset that they can't PVE with their evil characters.
Currently playing:
LOTRO & WoW (not much WoW though because Mines of Moria rocks!!!!)
Looking Foward too:
Bioware games (Dragon Age & Star Wars The Old Republic)
My understanding is there are quests that will send Freeps to the ettenmoors, as well as crafting nodes that can only be found in the ettenmoors, and some of the level appropriate content will be in those zones as well.
So we should see plenty of Freeps in the zone.
Currently playing:
LOTRO & WoW (not much WoW though because Mines of Moria rocks!!!!)
Looking Foward too:
Bioware games (Dragon Age & Star Wars The Old Republic)
My understanding is there are quests that will send Freeps to the ettenmoors, as well as crafting nodes that can only be found in the ettenmoors, and some of the level appropriate content will be in those zones as well.
So we should see plenty of Freeps in the zone.
OMFG. How absolutely perfect. I had assumed that since you were continuing to post about how "Awesome" the PVM system was, that you had actually played the fricken game in Beta. How in the world can you argue a point about a game based on crap you've read on the LOTRO website??
Since you obviously have not played the game, let me explain this to you. The PVM is a cute little mini-game to spend some time if you are bored withe leveling your char or at the end of the game (where there is very little content - true that they will definitely add more, but there is very little now). I guess if you were basing your opinion off of what they tell you you can do, you might think it sounds fun. But once you've actually played it you see that it is very meaningless. It's interesting to play for a bit, but you see that you are confined to one zone where there is no meaning to the battles. Jesus, play the game before you go to war arguing points about it.
Classic.
My understanding is there are quests that will send Freeps to the ettenmoors, as well as crafting nodes that can only be found in the ettenmoors, and some of the level appropriate content will be in those zones as well.
So we should see plenty of Freeps in the zone.
OMFG. How absolutely perfect. I had assumed that since you were continuing to post about how "Awesome" the PVM system was, that you had actually played the fricken game in Beta. How in the world can you argue a point about a game based on crap you've read on the LOTRO website??
Since you obviously have not played the game, let me explain this to you. The PVM is a cute little mini-game to spend some time if you are bored withe leveling your char or at the end of the game (where there is very little content - true that they will definitely add more, but there is very little now). I guess if you were basing your opinion off of what they tell you you can do, you might think it sounds fun. But once you've actually played it you see that it is very meaningless. It's interesting to play for a bit, but you see that you are confined to one zone where there is no meaning to the battles. Jesus, play the game before you go to war arguing points about it.
Classic.
Actually I have been playing the game since Alpha. And there is nothing that I have posted that either myself or a RL friend of mine didn't participate in during Beta.Currently playing:
LOTRO & WoW (not much WoW though because Mines of Moria rocks!!!!)
Looking Foward too:
Bioware games (Dragon Age & Star Wars The Old Republic)
Worth.
Less.
Waste.
Of.
Life.
Pfft. Go play a single player game, or better yet, Second Life. "Sociopathic tendancy"? Im proud of it. In game, in life, we are the predators - poor YOU
Implement FULL PvP, with FULL looting, within the confines of RACIAL combat. Orcs would not spare some level one hobbit because "it wouldnt be a challenge". There would be screams, tearing of meat, and consuming of halfling-whilst-kicking. Deal with it.
Monster play. What a joke. "Lets play a Level 50 mob, so we can REALLY get massacred by Level 50 PCs. Oh, and lets make sure I didnt have to bust my ass building this evil monster, or having to be intelligent to MAKE it this far amongst other evil monsters. I never had to devote an ounce of thought into my CHARACTER, ill just possess this spawn right quick."
...Gawd. Spanish Flu, hit the devs of this game. PLEASE.
We PvPers realize LotRO will never be a PvP game. It is a carebear PvE quest game. I cannot deny it is a very good carebear PvE quest game. It is just not what I want. There are plenty of PvP games coming out soom. I'll wait for WAR, AoC, Huxley, Tabula Rasa, Exteel, TCoS, or Fury.
But, the reason this thread started was that it would be fun to imagine a different LotRO where the monsters were real playable characters with a realm war setup. That would be more appealing to PvPers than the current LotRO.
I PvP from time to time. The difference between me and the other so-called PvPers is that:
1). I don't feel the need to insult others who dislike PvP.
2). I don't feel the obssesive need to make every game a PvP game.
Yes, there are plenty of PvP games on the horizon. Good. Enjoy them. I personally will stick with WWII Online for my PvP fix (where real PvP skills and not phat loot / uber levels determines your success)
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Currently Playing: LOTRO; DDO
Played: AC2, AO, Auto Assault, CoX, DAoC, DDO, Earth&Beyond, EQ1, EQ2, EVE, Fallen Earth, Jumpgate, Roma Victor, Second Life, SWG, V:SoH, WoW, World War II Online.
Games I'm watching: Infinity: The Quest for Earth, Force of Arms.
Find the Truth: http://www.factcheck.org/
It's a great game, much underrated, and its players are a breed apart.