of recycling a series of books that weren't in the least bit entertaining and turning them into a game.
A) you already know what happens
B)Even if they create there own new story based on Tolkien's old boring story it will still be a rehash. What is a rehash my good fellow? A rehash is garbage. C)This is not my opinion this is fact. Tolkien was a boring lunatic. You don't believe me? Just read LOTR. I forgot where but somewhere there is a fifteen page description of a rock, tree, and some wind. BORING!!! D) personally I would rather see an mmorpg made about something less symbolic of our own reality. Tolkies books were metaphors. It seems wrong to transpose a fantasy universe into a game that never really was intended to be a fantasy universe. It's like taking aesops fables and making a first person shooter. BORING!!
ROFL
Originally posted by Deathstrike2
In my opinion, you should learn the difference between fact and opinion. It's a fact that you're stating your opinion and not a fact.
LMAO
Originally posted by Coldmeat
It's not just Tolkien, though he's probably the most well known, and/or prolific. Most of the well known writers from the "good ol days" seem to be worlds apart from modern authors. Tolkien, C.S. Lewis, Vonnegut, Arthur C Clarke, Asimov, Heinlein, even Frank Herbert, though he's sort of teetering on being a modern author, and many others. Compare them to Hickman, Salvatore, and the rest of the current crop of fantasy/sci-fi authors. Which is not to say there aren't any decent modern authors. Clive Barker and Tad Williams come to mind. But they're few and far between. I think it's more of a change in the way the publishing industry is run, where back in the 40's and 50's, you actually had to be able to write a compelling story, whereas nowadays, and schmoe that can fire off a manuscript to a publisher can get their book out. Or even self publish.
Interesting... you forgot the father of Cyberpunk there - William Gibson - who coined interesting words like "cyberspace" and came up with the concept of virtual reality. A true visionary of the late 70's and early 80's.
I own and run a website for writers. Apart from self-publishing or paying a publisher up front, it's not easy to get your work in print. It still requires talent and a lot of luck, the same as it always has been. For any new author, the publishing industry is a very difficult one to break into, and few are successful after that.
of recycling a series of books that weren't in the least bit entertaining and turning them into a game.
A) you already know what happens
B)Even if they create there own new story based on Tolkien's old boring story it will still be a rehash. What is a rehash my good fellow? A rehash is garbage. C)This is not my opinion this is fact. Tolkien was a boring lunatic. You don't believe me? Just read LOTR. I forgot where but somewhere there is a fifteen page description of a rock, tree, and some wind. BORING!!! D) personally I would rather see an mmorpg made about something less symbolic of our own reality. Tolkies books were metaphors. It seems wrong to transpose a fantasy universe into a game that never really was intended to be a fantasy universe. It's like taking aesops fables and making a first person shooter. BORING!!
ROFL
Originally posted by Deathstrike2
In my opinion, you should learn the difference between fact and opinion. It's a fact that you're stating your opinion and not a fact.
LMAO
Originally posted by Coldmeat
It's not just Tolkien, though he's probably the most well known, and/or prolific. Most of the well known writers from the "good ol days" seem to be worlds apart from modern authors. Tolkien, C.S. Lewis, Vonnegut, Arthur C Clarke, Asimov, Heinlein, even Frank Herbert, though he's sort of teetering on being a modern author, and many others. Compare them to Hickman, Salvatore, and the rest of the current crop of fantasy/sci-fi authors. Which is not to say there aren't any decent modern authors. Clive Barker and Tad Williams come to mind. But they're few and far between. I think it's more of a change in the way the publishing industry is run, where back in the 40's and 50's, you actually had to be able to write a compelling story, whereas nowadays, and schmoe that can fire off a manuscript to a publisher can get their book out. Or even self publish.
Interesting... you forgot the father of Cyberpunk there - William Gibson - who coined interesting words like "cyberspace" and came up with the concept of virtual reality. A true visionary of the late 70's and early 80's. I own and run a website for writers. Apart from self-publishing or paying a publisher up front, it's not easy to get your work in print. It still requires talent and a lot of luck, the same as it always has been. For any new author, the publishing industry is a very difficult one to break into, and few are successful after that.
Yeah, I forgot Gibson, as well as Sterling, Huxley, and Stephenson. Also Philip K Dick. And probably a heaping teaspoonful of others. Burroughs, Thompson, Kerouac, et all.
I'm probably gonna get my cyberpunk license revoked for missing them, sadly.
I will atone by watching every episode of GitS:SAC.
As for the publishing thing, my friend request box on myspace is telling me a different story, but I'll take your word on it. I was going for hyperbole more than anything.
Originally posted by Ciredric Not sure what kind of literature you like, but I think you will find that the vast majority find the books far from boring. I have to wonder if you even read them, because just don't believe anyone could call them boring.
I was around 9 or so when I originally read The Hobbit, and the trilogy. I liked them just fine at the time. Subsequent attempts to reread the trilogy have failed, as I just find them to be a dull read overall.
Oh come on! not one comment about stuffing books down someone throat and shoving starving bookworms up their ass. That is classic Tolstoi "The one thing that is necessary, in life as in art, is to tell the truth." Nothing more truthful the starving bookworms up your ass. Jezz, kids today, nothing shocks them. Since this OP with it's trolling (I still stand by that) has turned into a serious discussion on literature.
Novaseeker, "Professional interest in linguistics" what? Tolkien started his creations of languages as a child not a professional interest but an inevitable job choice for one who likes to create languages. Also a sign of dementia.
Coldmeat, some of the names you mention in particular (Asimov, Herbert, Clark,) make Tolkien feel like a rollercoaster ride. in comparison to these boring long winded writers. Of course in my opinion, which is know to be fact. You doubt my opinon is fact? Then just check Wikipedia.
Killerwig, you mention Gibson, yea... yea... coined this coined that bla... bla... The camera obscura ,which goes back to Aristotle around 350 b.c., was really where the concept of "virtual reality" begins, not with Gibson. However I am with you in spirit.
However Coldmeat, out of nowhere drops the bullet to his wifes head, (not sure coldmeat is married, do not want to be to personnel, and do not suggest he would ever shot someone in the head) in his mix mash of "cyber punksters" mentions William S. Burroughs (Kerouac can bite my big butt... reminder to self, it is my pants that make my butt look big not that fact i got a big ass) now that is genius! I love how a crap attempt at insulting fans of LOTR and LOTRO can turn into a stimulating romp around the mmorpg, cyberpunk, sci-fi genres. Now a Naked Lunch mmorpg made by Turbine written Richard Garriott (Lord British) based on The Simlarion with character creation inspired by the DOA girls (jiggly boobs) set on Tatooine., is a product I could get behind! As long as it is pre-nge!
Originally posted by eccoton Oh come on! not one comment about stuffing books down someone throat and shoving starving bookworms up their ass. That is classic Tolstoi "The one thing that is necessary, in life as in art, is to tell the truth." Nothing more truthful the starving bookworms up your ass. Jezz, kids today, nothing shocks them. Since this OP with it's trolling (I still stand by that) has turned into a serious discussion on literature. Novaseeker, "Professional interest in linguistics" what? Tolkien started his creations of languages as a child not a professional interest but an inevitable job choice for one who likes to create languages. Also a sign of dementia. Coldmeat, some of the names you mention in particular (Asimov, Herbert, Clark,) make Tolkien feel like a rollercoaster ride. in comparison to these boring long winded writers. Of course in my opinion, which is know to be fact. You doubt my opinon is fact? Then just check Wikipedia. Killerwig, you mention Gibson, yea... yea... coined this coined that bla... bla... The camera obscura ,which goes back to Aristotle around 350 b.c., was really where the concept of "virtual reality" begins, not with Gibson. However I am with you in spirit. However Coldmeat, out of nowhere drops the bullet to his wifes head, (not sure coldmeat is married, do not want to be to personnel, and do not suggest he would ever shot someone in the head) in his mix mash of "cyber punksters" mentions William S. Burroughs (Kerouac can bite my big butt... reminder to self, it is my pants that make my butt look big not that fact i got a big ass) now that is genius! I love how a crap attempt at insulting fans of LOTR and LOTRO can turn into a stimulating romp around the mmorpg, cyberpunk, sci-fi genres. Now a Naked Lunch mmorpg made by Turbine written Richard Garriott (Lord British) based on The Simlarion with character creation inspired by the DOA girls (jiggly boobs) set on Tatooine., is a product I could get behind! As long as it is pre-nge!
Yeah, the sentence about Burroughs was out of place. It took a few whacks to line up all the nested quotes, so it ended up a wee squirrelly. For some reason the editor likes to delete BBML commands at random.
Originally posted by eccoton Novaseeker, "Professional interest in linguistics" what? Tolkien started his creations of languages as a child not a professional interest but an inevitable job choice for one who likes to create languages.
Fair point. My own point was that his love for (and professional expertise with) languages helped make Middle Earth into a much more credible, real alternative reality than has been the case in many subsequent efforts.
Originally posted by eccoton Novaseeker, "Professional interest in linguistics" what? Tolkien started his creations of languages as a child not a professional interest but an inevitable job choice for one who likes to create languages.
Fair point. My own point was that his love for (and professional expertise with) languages helped make Middle Earth into a much more credible, real alternative reality than has been the case in many subsequent efforts.
You are right, I agree with you and coldmeat. Just having a little fun since the thread took an interesting twist. Seriously Tolkien can get a tad long but his world of Middle Earth whether you like Tolkien or not, does indeed make a great world for an mmo. This dispite the reasons Tolkien, (or how the readers interpret the books) had behind the creation of the books. roadwarrior Tolkiens writings do make a great mmo. HELLO! it is a game! One mans rehash is anothers mmorpg. No need to put fans of LOTRO down for liking it or the books. In fact that is what you were trying to do with your OP. By the way Aesop's Fables would make a great shooter. I heard rumors that Cliffie B. up at Epic is developing a new Unreal based on Aesop's fable The Town Mouse and The Country Mouse. SOE is going to put it on their station pass. Can't be any worst then Vanguard.
of recycling a series of books that weren't in the least bit entertaining and turning them into a game.
A) you already know what happens
B)Even if they create there own new story based on Tolkien's old boring story it will still be a rehash. What is a rehash my good fellow? A rehash is garbage. C)This is not my opinion this is fact. Tolkien was a boring lunatic. You don't believe me? Just read LOTR. I forgot where but somewhere there is a fifteen page description of a rock, tree, and some wind. BORING!!! D) personally I would rather see an mmorpg made about something less symbolic of our own reality. Tolkies books were metaphors. It seems wrong to transpose a fantasy universe into a game that never really was intended to be a fantasy universe. It's like taking aesops fables and making a first person shooter. BORING!!
how old are you?
Not old enough to apreiciate a true masterpiece of literature.
of recycling a series of books that weren't in the least bit entertaining and turning them into a game.
A) you already know what happens
B)Even if they create there own new story based on Tolkien's old boring story it will still be a rehash. What is a rehash my good fellow? A rehash is garbage. C)This is not my opinion this is fact. Tolkien was a boring lunatic. You don't believe me? Just read LOTR. I forgot where but somewhere there is a fifteen page description of a rock, tree, and some wind. BORING!!! D) personally I would rather see an mmorpg made about something less symbolic of our own reality. Tolkies books were metaphors. It seems wrong to transpose a fantasy universe into a game that never really was intended to be a fantasy universe. It's like taking aesops fables and making a first person shooter. BORING!!
how old are you?
Not old enough to apreiciate a true masterpiece of literature.
It is not about age. It is about brain matter. So your question should be more like: How much brain matter do you have?
From a gamer's perspective, the point can be many: time-killer alternative, fan of the series, MMO lovers who want to try something new...the list goes on.
But the real point?
To milk a potentially busty cash cow.
You already have an established fan-base from the books.
The customer demographics have an EXTREMELY broad range.
The movies were huge box-office hits (hence the 2 million Legolasszzx13 running around in every online game you see).
Moderately low R&D cost because you already have: 1. Turbine's established gaming engine, 2. Sufficient capital raised from previous MMO ventures, 3. Precedents from previous successful MMOs.
The whole "this game ROXX play it now" or "this game sux waste of time" discussion is completely moot. Open-beta exists for a reason: try it and see for yourself.
Sure, there's nothing truly innovative in this game, and my initial "wow" moments in WoW during its beta still exceeds LOTRO. But what do people truly expect when they scream "WE WANT SOMETHING NEW!!" It's utterly hypocritical.
Why? I've never seen anyone, in the context of gaming, provide any useful suggestions or potential game-breaking ideas for their lamentations. "Oh this has been done", "that idea was stolen", "this game is a clone"...ok, if the complaints are so plentiful, why not try to come up with ideas that YOU would like implemented? Crying about dissatisfaction yet never giving any input on what needs to be done is the epitome of immaturity. Note that complains != innovative ideas.
LOTRO gets a big fat, well, maybe not 0, but close to 0, if i were to give it a score based on innovation. But think about it...Turbine is a corporation that has been around for a while. Any firm will take advantage of whatever the market-trend is and cater to them, thus designing a game that takes the good from other successful MMOs and compiling it into something with a new title.
Is it innovative? Hell no.
Is it feasible and smart (in terms of business)? Hell yes.
Commercialized and standardized mainstream MMOs are successful for a reason,afterall, they have millions of subscribers. Thus originality may not always be a good choice if you do not have the capital and/or human resources to back it up.
Besides...what's innovative in society nowadays? Almost nothing. In a gaming industry where the subjectivity of content is so high (people's demands spread across toooooo broad of a spectrum), it's almost impossible to: 1. Find customer needs and demands and, 2. Satisfy everyone because someone out there will always be unhappy about something, vice versa.
Play it if you enjoy the beta, don't play it if you don't. It's really simple. Reviews are always biased because we all have varying tastes in our gaming preferences.
Comments
ROFL
LMAO
Interesting... you forgot the father of Cyberpunk there - William Gibson - who coined interesting words like "cyberspace" and came up with the concept of virtual reality. A true visionary of the late 70's and early 80's.
I own and run a website for writers. Apart from self-publishing or paying a publisher up front, it's not easy to get your work in print. It still requires talent and a lot of luck, the same as it always has been. For any new author, the publishing industry is a very difficult one to break into, and few are successful after that.
Yeah, I forgot Gibson, as well as Sterling, Huxley, and Stephenson. Also Philip K Dick. And probably a heaping teaspoonful of others. Burroughs, Thompson, Kerouac, et all.
I'm probably gonna get my cyberpunk license revoked for missing them, sadly.
I will atone by watching every episode of GitS:SAC.
As for the publishing thing, my friend request box on myspace is telling me a different story, but I'll take your word on it. I was going for hyperbole more than anything.
I was around 9 or so when I originally read The Hobbit, and the trilogy. I liked them just fine at the time. Subsequent attempts to reread the trilogy have failed, as I just find them to be a dull read overall.
Oh come on! not one comment about stuffing books down someone throat and shoving starving bookworms up their ass. That is classic Tolstoi "The one thing that is necessary, in life as in art, is to tell the truth." Nothing more truthful the starving bookworms up your ass. Jezz, kids today, nothing shocks them. Since this OP with it's trolling (I still stand by that) has turned into a serious discussion on literature.
Novaseeker, "Professional interest in linguistics" what? Tolkien started his creations of languages as a child not a professional interest but an inevitable job choice for one who likes to create languages. Also a sign of dementia.
Coldmeat, some of the names you mention in particular (Asimov, Herbert, Clark,) make Tolkien feel like a rollercoaster ride. in comparison to these boring long winded writers. Of course in my opinion, which is know to be fact. You doubt my opinon is fact? Then just check Wikipedia.
Killerwig, you mention Gibson, yea... yea... coined this coined that bla... bla... The camera obscura ,which goes back to Aristotle around 350 b.c., was really where the concept of "virtual reality" begins, not with Gibson. However I am with you in spirit.
However Coldmeat, out of nowhere drops the bullet to his wifes head, (not sure coldmeat is married, do not want to be to personnel, and do not suggest he would ever shot someone in the head) in his mix mash of "cyber punksters" mentions William S. Burroughs (Kerouac can bite my big butt... reminder to self, it is my pants that make my butt look big not that fact i got a big ass) now that is genius! I love how a crap attempt at insulting fans of LOTR and LOTRO can turn into a stimulating romp around the mmorpg, cyberpunk, sci-fi genres. Now a Naked Lunch mmorpg made by Turbine written Richard Garriott (Lord British) based on The Simlarion with character creation inspired by the DOA girls (jiggly boobs) set on Tatooine., is a product I could get behind! As long as it is pre-nge!
Yeah, the sentence about Burroughs was out of place. It took a few whacks to line up all the nested quotes, so it ended up a wee squirrelly. For some reason the editor likes to delete BBML commands at random.
You are right, I agree with you and coldmeat. Just having a little fun since the thread took an interesting twist. Seriously Tolkien can get a tad long but his world of Middle Earth whether you like Tolkien or not, does indeed make a great world for an mmo. This dispite the reasons Tolkien, (or how the readers interpret the books) had behind the creation of the books. roadwarrior Tolkiens writings do make a great mmo. HELLO! it is a game! One mans rehash is anothers mmorpg. No need to put fans of LOTRO down for liking it or the books. In fact that is what you were trying to do with your OP. By the way Aesop's Fables would make a great shooter. I heard rumors that Cliffie B. up at Epic is developing a new Unreal based on Aesop's fable The Town Mouse and The Country Mouse. SOE is going to put it on their station pass. Can't be any worst then Vanguard.
how old are you?
Not old enough to apreiciate a true masterpiece of literature.
______________________________
WAR looks AWESOME!
Give Blood....Play Rugby!
how old are you?
Not old enough to apreiciate a true masterpiece of literature.
It is not about age. It is about brain matter. So your question should be more like: How much brain matter do you have?But the real point?
To milk a potentially busty cash cow.
You already have an established fan-base from the books.
The customer demographics have an EXTREMELY broad range.
The movies were huge box-office hits (hence the 2 million Legolasszzx13 running around in every online game you see).
Moderately low R&D cost because you already have: 1. Turbine's established gaming engine, 2. Sufficient capital raised from previous MMO ventures, 3. Precedents from previous successful MMOs.
The whole "this game ROXX play it now" or "this game sux waste of time" discussion is completely moot. Open-beta exists for a reason: try it and see for yourself.
Sure, there's nothing truly innovative in this game, and my initial "wow" moments in WoW during its beta still exceeds LOTRO. But what do people truly expect when they scream "WE WANT SOMETHING NEW!!" It's utterly hypocritical.
Why? I've never seen anyone, in the context of gaming, provide any useful suggestions or potential game-breaking ideas for their lamentations. "Oh this has been done", "that idea was stolen", "this game is a clone"...ok, if the complaints are so plentiful, why not try to come up with ideas that YOU would like implemented? Crying about dissatisfaction yet never giving any input on what needs to be done is the epitome of immaturity. Note that complains != innovative ideas.
LOTRO gets a big fat, well, maybe not 0, but close to 0, if i were to give it a score based on innovation. But think about it...Turbine is a corporation that has been around for a while. Any firm will take advantage of whatever the market-trend is and cater to them, thus designing a game that takes the good from other successful MMOs and compiling it into something with a new title.
Is it innovative? Hell no.
Is it feasible and smart (in terms of business)? Hell yes.
Commercialized and standardized mainstream MMOs are successful for a reason,afterall, they have millions of subscribers. Thus originality may not always be a good choice if you do not have the capital and/or human resources to back it up.
Besides...what's innovative in society nowadays? Almost nothing. In a gaming industry where the subjectivity of content is so high (people's demands spread across toooooo broad of a spectrum), it's almost impossible to: 1. Find customer needs and demands and, 2. Satisfy everyone because someone out there will always be unhappy about something, vice versa.
Play it if you enjoy the beta, don't play it if you don't. It's really simple. Reviews are always biased because we all have varying tastes in our gaming preferences.