So hopefully Vanguard get better performance with the expansion. If not, think the rest fo the players will go awway, exept the hardcore fans. For me it seems like in Horizons..
I paid for 2 copies of VSOH when it came out and my a$$ still hurts!
No sympathy for 2boxers...
If you bought one for friend/family then you have a little... I just can't get too worked up for people who bought this game cause ALL the warning signs were there, I got suspended for breaking NDA on these forums trying to warn people... and yet they gave a million dollars to those bastards anyway
Of all that is written, I love only what a person has written with his own blood. -Nietzsche
I understand WHAT you mean i just do not get especialy from you (who mostly does strike good examples though i don't always agree) is that you came up with such a failed company. Maybe its how i translate what i think maybe in the wrong way, but saying a company like Artifact Entertainment did not even wanted to use that engine doesn't actualy say anything, would be different if you was talking about a company that made succes with other projects/games instead of them choosing the Unreal engine. So again i understand what you mean but Artifact Entertainment as example that EVEN they did not want to use it, what does that say, well like i tried to explain actualy nothing. Hope you understand what i mean and hope i came clear in how i meant it.
Artifact is a failed company, so too is Sigil, they have that in common. I used Artifact as an example partly for emphasis, considering even another failed company was smart enough not to attempt seamlessness with the Unreal engine.
More importantly though, Artifact is probably one of the only other company period that experimented with seamlessness, which is how they came to find out the Unreal engine wasn't suitable for it.
There's no point in bringing up other successful companies like Funcom, NCSoft or Mythic; all heavy believers of instancing, zones and etc. Whoever made Wish could be brought up, another MMO that was meant to use seamless technology; but they had jack to do with the Unreal engine and that game sank before being able to release.
Anyway, point is, seamlessness with the Unreal engine turned out to be a dumb idea. Bringing up Lineage 2 and the fact that it used the Unreal engine was again, never indicative of any kind of success Vanguard itself could've had considering Lineage 2 didn't strive for seamlessness.
So using the Unreal engine for a MMO is a good idea; lotsa companies do it and Lineage 2 was one of the first to prove it can work. Using the engine for seamlessness though? Not such a good idea.
Originally posted by Reklaw And sure Lin2 might have worked great and Vanguard doesn't, had similair with pre-cu SWG with a memory of a great looking game , but realize that seeing it now it kinda could never have looked this good as then my system was 1800 or 2000 AMD with a 5700geforece card (at the time pretty high end..now low-end if you may even call it that). Besides i can play Splintercell Double Agent at Next Gen settings (yes its called that way in SC/DA) and thats the same Unreal build as what Vanguard uses, it even has AA and more cookies which Vanguard hasn't , should i now complain while Vanguard in many area's of this engine doesn't have that awesome performance as with SC/DA for me. Nah, like i said to many times already been a gamer for (far to long) so i know better. Oh let me be clear never agreed on the use of the Unreal engine as i keep saying that engine is much better suited towards sci-fi or a more " today's realistic " world then i feel it lends itself for Fantasy games. Again everyone has a right to complain about what ever they like, but atleast lets hear some realistic complaints already Like why my Ranger still kills a mob with a arrow that isn't even fired yet?
Using the Unreal Engine for a seamless world is a bad idea. Switching to Unreal 3.0 when Unreal 2.X didn't work out would only compound the problem. 'course with Brad gone the reality of that happening doesn't seem much possible. There's a realistic complaint for you though.
I just found out that an expansion is on the way, but is there any info on what it will actually contain?
Let me get this straight it hasnt even been out for a long period of time and there's an expansion coming out already? Dang that was a real quickie...It jsut made me feel glad that I quit this game early because what this game needs isnt a new expansion it needs to be completed before they even start the expansion...Haha i bet its going to cost another 50 buck for the expansion...
You know, I've not seen anything official to say that they are other than a random post here, and you just decided to bash the game based on that? Think about it.
WTF do you mean im bashing it? I played it from beta until May 14 and enjoyed it too but I quit with almost the same reason why others did, and I have a right to express my opinion as well as everyone else in this community, is it really worth another 30-50 dollars to buy an expansion when the original game isnt even completed? You should think that over.
I just found out that an expansion is on the way, but is there any info on what it will actually contain?
Let me get this straight it hasnt even been out for a long period of time and there's an expansion coming out already? Dang that was a real quickie...It jsut made me feel glad that I quit this game early because what this game needs isnt a new expansion it needs to be completed before they even start the expansion...Haha i bet its going to cost another 50 buck for the expansion...
You know, I've not seen anything official to say that they are other than a random post here, and you just decided to bash the game based on that? Think about it.
WTF do you mean im bashing it? I played it from beta until May 14 and enjoyed it too but I quit with almost the same reason why others did, and I have a right to express my opinion as well as everyone else in this community, is it really worth another 30-50 dollars to buy an expansion when the original game isnt even completed? You should think that over.Someone is mistaken. There's no way in hell they'd be working on an expansion. They don't even have endgame content yet. Perhaps the OP got his or her wires crossed. I've heard talk of a revamp or even a rerelease once this game gets in playable condition, but at this point there would be no reason to add-on to the current flat, unfinished world where there isn't a heck of a lot of stuff to do once you hit 30+.
I just found out that an expansion is on the way, but is there any info on what it will actually contain?
Let me get this straight it hasnt even been out for a long period of time and there's an expansion coming out already? Dang that was a real quickie...It jsut made me feel glad that I quit this game early because what this game needs isnt a new expansion it needs to be completed before they even start the expansion...Haha i bet its going to cost another 50 buck for the expansion...
You know, I've not seen anything official to say that they are other than a random post here, and you just decided to bash the game based on that? Think about it.
WTF do you mean im bashing it? I played it from beta until May 14 and enjoyed it too but I quit with almost the same reason why others did, and I have a right to express my opinion as well as everyone else in this community, is it really worth another 30-50 dollars to buy an expansion when the original game isnt even completed? You should think that over.Someone is mistaken. There's no way in hell they'd be working on an expansion. They don't even have endgame content yet. Perhaps the OP got his or her wires crossed. I've heard talk of a revamp or even a rerelease once this game gets in playable condition, but at this point there would be no reason to add-on to the current flat, unfinished world where there isn't a heck of a lot of stuff to do once you hit 30+.
How can you not understand the concept that this is SOE we are talking about here?
Expansion = Content that should have already been in
Expansion = Pay even more money to help us move into the next phase of beta
That's fine. I don't pretend to sugarcoat my thoughts and opinions.
The point I was trying to convey, whether it was "professional" or not, is that it's ludicrous to plan expansion packs when the core of the game isn't even finely polished and perfected yet. Considering every expansion pack I've ever played has introduced new bugs to the game, I'd consider it important to have the original part of the game tweaked and fixed entirely. It was also a cheap shot at "The Vision", but I guess it missed it's mark.
I'm not going to preach about this Saga though; the numbers will speak for themselves.
That is a much better responce. I can dig that, and agree with you.
They shouldn't be talking about an expansion right now.
As they have licensed the Unreal Engine for the expansion - it just seems kinda odd if you ask me.
That is how i found out that an expansion actually exists. It has been listed together with some other MMO's at Epic as licensed games.
But as far as i know the game doesn't actually use the Unreal Engine?
unfortunately, they do use the Unreal Engine. Hence the very bad issues they are having with their code.
Has nothing to do with the engine.
Lineage 2 uses the unreal engine and runs just fine, as do many games. Totally unfair to blame an engine that is as popullar and well excepted in the video game industry as the UR engine.
Lineage 2 does not try and push the Unreal 2.x engine beyond it limits, VGSOH does and that is the problem... Unreal 2 engine was not designed for what VGSOH wants.
What VG is trying to do isn't a result of anything they are trying to make the engine do.
The way the are trying to load portals is something new, and I don't believe that the UR engine isn't capable of it. In fact, there isn't a thing they are trying to do that the UR engine can't handle.
Art optimization isn't the result of pushing the engine to do something it shoudln't either.
Lineage 2 also suffered the exact same problems that VG suffered/ suffers from.
Holes in the world, performance issues whith multiple character models, Memory leaks, graphical glitches. Actually just about every MMO suffers from this stuff.
It's not the engines fault. It's the fault of not having the personel and equipement for a proper QA team. TESTING is the reason the performance is bad. Not the engine or what the game does.
UR 2 engine is designed specifically for this sort of stuff. Ever played UR? Any of them?
That's fine. I don't pretend to sugarcoat my thoughts and opinions.
The point I was trying to convey, whether it was "professional" or not, is that it's ludicrous to plan expansion packs when the core of the game isn't even finely polished and perfected yet. Considering every expansion pack I've ever played has introduced new bugs to the game, I'd consider it important to have the original part of the game tweaked and fixed entirely. It was also a cheap shot at "The Vision", but I guess it missed it's mark.
I'm not going to preach about this Saga though; the numbers will speak for themselves.
It's funny, I've used this website for years now as a quick way to get good information on the industry: what games are upcoming, how people feel about them, only to find out YOU'RE a staff writer with so little knowledge of the industry you wish to speak of committing atrocities to.
All MMO's that have been coming out since EQ have had some level of planning of future expansions. If not what specific elements will exist in it for sure, the map is drawn and the ideas started from the conception of the retail game itself. It's simply prudent planning. At no point does Smedley state that an expansion is forthcoming next month, in the next few months or even this year. All he was stating was that an expansion may or may not be in the works, and that he wanted to manage expectations that people had for what would be in this current iteration of Vanguard that failed on launch. He is doing what Brad couldn't do, and that's detailing when certain features of the game will be released if soon, and if not, discussing the fact that they are on the backburner.
Secondly, did you even bother to read the Smedly quote posted earlier in this thread? At no point does he state that client stability improvements will take place in an EXPANSION PACK.
In the near future, performance, bugs, and issues that the community wants us to address. Longer term, we have a content plan which we're going to be outlining. In the next couple of weeks we will be putting up a plan on what we're going to be doing and when. So people can expect lots of free updates with their subscription.
People got the idea that performance issues would be handled in an expansion because they misread the question:
Shack: Do you have a rough idea of where Vanguard is headed in the future as far as content expansion?
So to reiterated, content expansion does not equal expansion pack. While Smed's does mention an expansion pack that is being planned for implementation down the road, as I covered above earlier that is just prudent, and he actually says that performance issues, bugs etc. will be a focus for the near future.He then goes on to say that there are even long term plans (so I'd assume for this year) for FREE content upgrades to get some of the missing content into the game. An expansion pack is a ways away, and in no way does that interview with Smedley show that they will be packaging everything that was supposed to be in retail and throwing it in an expansion pack, simply that there are a lot of features that people would want in future expansions.
As for features that were wanted on release, but never making it till an expansion, that isn't unheard of in the MMO industry. If Vanguard goes to an expansion as unpolished as it currently is, yeah there's a problem. If one or two features such as guild house's don't make it in till an expansion, that isn't the highway robbery you try to depict it as.
I wonder how many of the other 600+ posts you have are pure uninformed drivel. I'm not surprised you feel like shooting the messenger for stating a message you disagree with, seems to be a common trend these days when people don't have anything more relevant to say.
1) Industries involve time-tables, most of which work with a "When done with A, go on to B, then do C". Planning an expansion pack is downright mindless. Since I'm incredibly ignorant and infantile in my knowledge of the industry, allow me to humor you with a simple diagram. "When your game is broken (A), go on to fix the game to make it playable (B), and then make sure you've fleshed out enough content to keep your current player base happy (C)". The very last concern of SOE right now should be an expansion pack. How about figuring out how to retain subscriptions with your current product, before you begin brainstorming on new ideas? Call me crazy, but adding in new features and content should not even be discussed right now; fix what you've got, maintain 60,000 subscribers, plan an expansion pack from there.
2) I don't mind being quoted, however, when you misread the quote in a fit of rage, it is slightly amusing. At no point did I say that they would charge you for fix bugs in the expansion pack. If you're going to make a counter-point, at least make sure I said it first. I did, however, state that I found it ballsy to discuss an expansion pack, which are notorious for introducing more bugs into a game, and charging people for it when the core of the game's isn't even wholly functional yet.
3) That's fine. However, obviously, they're not doing a good enough job at bug-fixing. With an estimated mere 20% retention rate, people are obviously still displeased with the bugs/gameplay. Unless it's been adjusted recently, there are still leveling exploits in the game. Fix the content you've got right now; I'm not interested in the slightest in the introduction of buggier content, more exploits, and more chunking, thanks. Also, implying the near future, to me, that means within the next 6-8 months. Monitoring this game's progress in the past 6 months, I can't say that they've exactly earned my faith to ask for more money.
Final points I'd like to make; I don't think raid content has even hardly been introduced yet, has it? Are the player boats functioning much better than before, or are there still world-wide teleporters? Are the money-making/quick exp exploits vanquished thus far?
No, I'm stand by what I said earlier, I take it as a slap in the face to even be hearing talks of an expansion pack right now. You present me a stable, fun, functional game with a steady client-base, and THEN worry about charging me for the implementation of content. I've played Smed's games in the past, so promises of what they hope to accomplish and what might become don't hold much weight with me.
I won't retort with flaming though, I made my points in a civilized manner.
Waiting for something fresh to arrive on the MMO scene...
I don't think there is anything fundamentally wrong with planning an expansion at this point, despite the long list of things that absolutely must come first. Planning the next to-be-developed set of content and engine features may be useful for prioritizing what needs to be fixed now. If there's a choice between two piles of doody code to work on, where only one can be fixed really well, and the other has to make do with the software equivalent of paper clips and rubber bands, it helps to know which one will be more needed for the new content and engine features.
There's a military adage that may apply: Planning is everything; The Plan is nothing. In this sense, planning is essential to understanding what one's capabilities are, while plans are only the milestone products that provide goals to motivate planning.
So if we look to Smed's actual quote, he said nothing about scheduling an expansion when asked about the content, but did indicate that planning it was an item on the agenda. As with all Smedish utterances, I take this with a bag of salt regarding its indication of future events. The thing that is very clear to me from the quote is that he very clearly denied any feature or schedule decisions regarding any expansion. So the bulk of this entire thread comes down to people reading into a quote their own misinterpretations and assumptions, and then ascribing those misinterpretations and assumptions to SOE.
There are a few respondents who actually get it, and those I admire. For the rest of you, duh!
That's fine. I don't pretend to sugarcoat my thoughts and opinions.
The point I was trying to convey, whether it was "professional" or not, is that it's ludicrous to plan expansion packs when the core of the game isn't even finely polished and perfected yet. Considering every expansion pack I've ever played has introduced new bugs to the game, I'd consider it important to have the original part of the game tweaked and fixed entirely. It was also a cheap shot at "The Vision", but I guess it missed it's mark.
I'm not going to preach about this Saga though; the numbers will speak for themselves.
It's funny, I've used this website for years now as a quick way to get good information on the industry: what games are upcoming, how people feel about them, only to find out YOU'RE a staff writer with so little knowledge of the industry you wish to speak of committing atrocities to.
All MMO's that have been coming out since EQ have had some level of planning of future expansions. If not what specific elements will exist in it for sure, the map is drawn and the ideas started from the conception of the retail game itself. It's simply prudent planning. At no point does Smedley state that an expansion is forthcoming next month, in the next few months or even this year. All he was stating was that an expansion may or may not be in the works, and that he wanted to manage expectations that people had for what would be in this current iteration of Vanguard that failed on launch. He is doing what Brad couldn't do, and that's detailing when certain features of the game will be released if soon, and if not, discussing the fact that they are on the backburner.
Secondly, did you even bother to read the Smedly quote posted earlier in this thread? At no point does he state that client stability improvements will take place in an EXPANSION PACK.
In the near future, performance, bugs, and issues that the community wants us to address. Longer term, we have a content plan which we're going to be outlining. In the next couple of weeks we will be putting up a plan on what we're going to be doing and when. So people can expect lots of free updates with their subscription.
People got the idea that performance issues would be handled in an expansion because they misread the question:
Shack: Do you have a rough idea of where Vanguard is headed in the future as far as content expansion?
So to reiterated, content expansion does not equal expansion pack. While Smed's does mention an expansion pack that is being planned for implementation down the road, as I covered above earlier that is just prudent, and he actually says that performance issues, bugs etc. will be a focus for the near future.He then goes on to say that there are even long term plans (so I'd assume for this year) for FREE content upgrades to get some of the missing content into the game. An expansion pack is a ways away, and in no way does that interview with Smedley show that they will be packaging everything that was supposed to be in retail and throwing it in an expansion pack, simply that there are a lot of features that people would want in future expansions.
As for features that were wanted on release, but never making it till an expansion, that isn't unheard of in the MMO industry. If Vanguard goes to an expansion as unpolished as it currently is, yeah there's a problem. If one or two features such as guild house's don't make it in till an expansion, that isn't the highway robbery you try to depict it as.
I wonder how many of the other 600+ posts you have are pure uninformed drivel.I'm not surprised you feel like shooting the messenger for stating a message you disagree with, seems to be a common trend these days when people don't have anything more relevant to say.
1) Industries involve time-tables, most of which work with a "When done with A, go on to B, then do C". Planning an expansion pack is downright mindless. Since I'm incredibly ignorant and infantile in my knowledge of the industry, allow me to humor you with a simple diagram. "When your game is broken (A), go on to fix the game to make it playable (B), and then make sure you've fleshed out enough content to keep your current player base happy (C)". The very last concern of SOE right now should be an expansion pack. How about figuring out how to retain subscriptions with your current product, before you begin brainstorming on new ideas? Call me crazy, but adding in new features and content should not even be discussed right now; fix what you've got, maintain 60,000 subscribers, plan an expansion pack from there.
2) I don't mind being quoted, however, when you misread the quote in a fit of rage, it is slightly amusing. At no point did I say that they would charge you for fix bugs in the expansion pack. If you're going to make a counter-point, at least make sure I said it first. I did, however, state that I found it ballsy to discuss an expansion pack, which are notorious for introducing more bugs into a game, and charging people for it when the core of the game's isn't even wholly functional yet.
3) That's fine. However, obviously, they're not doing a good enough job at bug-fixing. With an estimated mere 20% retention rate, people are obviously still displeased with the bugs/gameplay. Unless it's been adjusted recently, there are still leveling exploits in the game. Fix the content you've got right now; I'm not interested in the slightest in the introduction of buggier content, more exploits, and more chunking, thanks. Also, implying the near future, to me, that means within the next 6-8 months. Monitoring this game's progress in the past 6 months, I can't say that they've exactly earned my faith to ask for more money.
Final points I'd like to make; I don't think raid content has even hardly been introduced yet, has it? Are the player boats functioning much better than before, or are there still world-wide teleporters? Are the money-making/quick exp exploits vanquished thus far?
No, I'm stand by what I said earlier, I take it as a slap in the face to even be hearing talks of an expansion pack right now. You present me a stable, fun, functional game with a steady client-base, and THEN worry about charging me for the implementation of content. I've played Smed's games in the past, so promises of what they hope to accomplish and what might become don't hold much weight with me.
I won't retort with flaming though, I made my points in a civilized manner.
1) Game isn't, nor was it ever, broken. The player base is still playing through the content. I'm not sure what your expectations are here, or exactly what you mean.
Don't like diplomacy? Ok, but that's content you don't have in another game; you could just ignore it like it never existed and it doesn't effect the content part of the game one way or the other.
Let's just work off of crafting, adventuring, and harvesting.
Not everyone is going to like to craft. In fact a smaller percentage of players will be pure crafters then adventurers, and possibly harvesters. Crafting is a niche thing that few people, over all, have the tolerance for. More people are casaul crafters then pure I think. VG crafting isn't tailored to the casual crafter though. I'm a casual crafter, and I can say I don't like the crafting in VG, but then I don't like it in any game. It's boreing, tedious, and time consuming. Not what I want to do in a game. That's every MMO, not just VG.
Harvesting? You chop down a tree, collect rocks, or pick plants. No dif. then most MMO's. I haven't played another MMO that actually lets me cut down a tree though. I do that in VG. I also chop up treants; maybe you do that in another MMO, I haven't seen it yet though. Harvesting can be done with a group of people. I'm a harvester, as close to a pure harvester as it gets. That's what I do when I play, and one of the reason I have to play a PvP game. Harvesting is boring; PvP gives it life. Wish there were more trees and rocks to harvest though. That's my only complaint. As long as there is a demand for harvested goods. Boats and housing require harvested mats, and they will be implementing guild housing soon; that's going to need mats as well.
Adventuring? You do quests. Lot's of quests. Over and over again. Same thing I do in every MMO. There are quests, and they have implemented others, and will continue to implement more. They've stated that every patch will contain content, and I would assume that means adventuring content as well as crafting and diplomacy. There are solo quests, group quests, and they are working on raid content now. Didn't enjoy the combat? Then complain about WoW, EQ2, L2, CoX, AO, blah, blah, blah. It's the same basic system in every game. It's not FPS, it's not revolutionary. Nothing was ever promised to be inovative here. it does have some depth and a little complexity to it, more then some games, and maybe a little less then others. No false promises about combat, or hype in this area. It is what it is, and I don't really see them completely changing it. It works.
I've been trying to find an official source for sub numbers because I keep seeing numbers thrown out. Can you direct me to were you got the 60k from? Obviously they are consolidating servers to improve grouping, but that isn't an indicator of an exact number of players. The number of servers they have is to much to support even 150k subs at all times to provide adiquate numbers for grouping with the time it takes to travel and the world size. A lot of players still haven't figured out how to summon thier corpse, I wouldn't dought if they haven't figured out how to configure thier chat channells or use the LFG tool.
2) Care to explain that in a little more detail? What part isn't functional yet? Raiding? Isn't a core part of the game, nor promised for release. Mounts? They work and are in the game. Ships? There and working. Combat? Works. Harvesting? Works. Crafting? Works. I'm not sure what you mean by the core of the game? The engine works. They keep saying it, the art needs to be optimized.
3) How isn't it obviouse that bugs are being fixed. The patch notes are available for anyone to read and each one adresses bugs. How do you come to the conclusion that bugs aren't being fixed? No MMO is bug free, and I haven't seen any more bugs in VG then in any other MMO that hasn't had 2 to 3 years to get situated. You can't compare it to EQ2 or WoW, not CoH or L2. Those games have been around long enough now that they should be working. VG wasn't that much worse, and a little better then a couple of MMO's at release. Mem leaks are pretty common problems in persistant world games. They get fixed over time. Some take longer then others, but eventually they get worked out. In 6 months the devs have made great strides in clearing up bugs and broken quests. Exploits get fixed. The gold dup was fixed, and level exploits have been taken care of. Unfortunetly there is always someone out there that finds new ways. These things, like mem. leaks happen in these games. In fact WoW has far more exploits in it then VG does.
What in the content needs fixing? Crafting sucks, but I've already gone throught that. Personally I think they need to make the complications not occur so often. Could you provide an explanation for this? What needs to be fixed exactly? Vague, over-exagerated statements aren't very fair; not to mention you're a writer, you should be able to explain yourself better then that.
Let's be a little reasonable here. 6-8 months would put the game into over a year after release. One year is pretty fair for an expansion, even WoW originally stated one a year, but couldn't live up to it. A bigger judge of SoE would be actually releasing one in that amount of time. Personally I think they should have squashed all talk of an xpac and made th focus the game today. The mention of an xpac tends to take the focus off of issues at hand and some people get critical. Case in point, this thread.
You begin by invoking the feeling that BarazWI wrote with an air of anger, or as you put it, a fit of rage. You then present a write up of your opinion, wich you critisized BarazWI for giving, with misleading, over-exagerated, and vague statements. All wrapped up in a kind of passive agressive flamer type post.
I'll be impressed if someone actually reads all of this. Didn't expect it to get so long. Sorry.
P.S. I'm not proof reading so deal with the errors
What VG is trying to do isn't a result of anything they are trying to make the engine do. The way the are trying to load portals is something new, and I don't believe that the UR engine isn't capable of it. In fact, there isn't a thing they are trying to do that the UR engine can't handle. Art optimization isn't the result of pushing the engine to do something it shoudln't either. Lineage 2 also suffered the exact same problems that VG suffered/ suffers from. Holes in the world, performance issues whith multiple character models, Memory leaks, graphical glitches. Actually just about every MMO suffers from this stuff. It's not the engines fault. It's the fault of not having the personel and equipement for a proper QA team. TESTING is the reason the performance is bad. Not the engine or what the game does. UR 2 engine is designed specifically for this sort of stuff. Ever played UR? Any of them?
No one is faulting the engine. It is a simple and well known fact that SIgil modded the UR 2.x engine too heavily. How can you say that they "arent doing anything the engine cant do" when the LIST of what they changed is RIGHT in this thread?
Go to some Unreal dev forums. Ive seen many long threads about how much modification Sigil did and how much of it was ill advised in discussions between Unreal devs on what the heck went wrong there.
The other poster is 100% correct. Sigil tried to do things with the engine that the engine wasnt meant to do and now they are paying a price for it. Its AMAZING that this is such a contraversial statement that it needs to be challenged down to the smallest minutiae. What is your point exactly? That the Unreal engine CAN be used just fine to do all of the things Sigil is trying to do, that they didnt really mod anything, and that all of the problems are just because they cant implmenent an OUT OF BOX engine?
If thats your actual contention, I can tell you you're wrong. It wouldnt even make sense. Sigil openly discusses their modification of the engine. WHY would they either modify it if they didnt have to? Why would they lie about modifying it? Lastly, the features of that engine are well published by Epic and those things Brad listed are NOT on them.
How can you not understand the concept that this is SOE we are talking about here? Expansion = Content that should have already been in Expansion = Pay even more money to help us move into the next phase of beta Expansion = LOL@U gaming community! Signed, SOE
Good job ignoring the thread and instead launching into an ideological rant against a company. I never understand folks with such a clear, and strangely personal, axe to grind. Look at it this way.... If you got your wish and SOE went out of business tomorrow, WHAT would you post about?
What VG is trying to do isn't a result of anything they are trying to make the engine do. The way the are trying to load portals is something new, and I don't believe that the UR engine isn't capable of it. In fact, there isn't a thing they are trying to do that the UR engine can't handle. Art optimization isn't the result of pushing the engine to do something it shoudln't either. Lineage 2 also suffered the exact same problems that VG suffered/ suffers from. Holes in the world, performance issues whith multiple character models, Memory leaks, graphical glitches. Actually just about every MMO suffers from this stuff. It's not the engines fault. It's the fault of not having the personel and equipement for a proper QA team. TESTING is the reason the performance is bad. Not the engine or what the game does. UR 2 engine is designed specifically for this sort of stuff. Ever played UR? Any of them?
No one is faulting the engine. It is a simple and well known fact that SIgil modded the UR 2.x engine too heavily. How can you say that they "arent doing anything the engine cant do" when the LIST of what they changed is RIGHT in this thread?
Go to some Unreal dev forums. Ive seen many long threads about how much modification Sigil did and how much of it was ill advised in discussions between Unreal devs on what the heck went wrong there.
The other poster is 100% correct. Sigil tried to do things with the engine that the engine wasnt meant to do and now they are paying a price for it. Its AMAZING that this is such a contraversial statement that it needs to be challenged down to the smallest minutiae. What is your point exactly? That the Unreal engine CAN be used just fine to do all of the things Sigil is trying to do, that they didnt really mod anything, and that all of the problems are just because they cant implmenent an OUT OF BOX engine?
If thats your actual contention, I can tell you you're wrong. It wouldnt even make sense. Sigil openly discusses their modification of the engine. WHY would they either modify it if they didnt have to? Why would they lie about modifying it? Lastly, the features of that engine are well published by Epic and those things Brad listed are NOT on them.
Care to explain what it is that they are trying to do that the engine can't?
Art optimization is the issue with the game for the most part. The chunking issue has to do with the portals loading, and a big part of what Sigil did to the UR engine. It's also capable of doing what they did because it's doing it, and it'll do it even better with time.
Sigil didn't openly discuss what they did to the engine.
I don't program. I only know what I can read, and what I've read, as well as played says that the engine they put together is working. I can say that I have a very basic understanding, thanks to conversations with personal friends and familly that program for a living, of how game engines work. My basic understanding is that the engine is just a complex system of directions telling DX what it's supposed to do. (My exptremely simplified explanation based on my limited understanding).
Care to delve into exactly what it is that they have done to the engine that it isn't able to do? Can you explain wich parts of the game aren't working correctly and exactly how they tie into the game engine or changes to it? What exactly is it doing that it can't or isn't supposed to do.
One of the things I've read over the years about the UR engine is that it's a very versitle, powerfull engine. UR didn't put it out to just be used as is, it's the frame work for larger things. If you can push it and make it doing something new, like Sigil did with the portals from what I understand, then you're doing something good.
And can you provide a link to these threads you mention? Just in case I'm not able to find them myself.
Comments
I brought up that very idea in this thread:
http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/gameid/17/setview/forums/post/1462947#1462947
No sympathy for 2boxers...
If you bought one for friend/family then you have a little... I just can't get too worked up for people who bought this game cause ALL the warning signs were there, I got suspended for breaking NDA on these forums trying to warn people... and yet they gave a million dollars to those bastards anyway
Of all that is written, I love only what a person has written with his own blood. -Nietzsche
I guess that would mean there are enough players to warrant it.
Wouldn't be to hastily carving that tombstone yet.
Of course no matter how a game is, it's going to have its silly little whiners isn't it?
Raven
I guess that would mean there are enough players to warrant it.
Wouldn't be to hastily carving that tombstone yet.
SOE would make an Xpack for a 2 week old egg salad sandwich that contained 4 day old sushi...
Don't get your hopes up whiner
Of all that is written, I love only what a person has written with his own blood. -Nietzsche
More importantly though, Artifact is probably one of the only other company period that experimented with seamlessness, which is how they came to find out the Unreal engine wasn't suitable for it.
There's no point in bringing up other successful companies like Funcom, NCSoft or Mythic; all heavy believers of instancing, zones and etc. Whoever made Wish could be brought up, another MMO that was meant to use seamless technology; but they had jack to do with the Unreal engine and that game sank before being able to release.
Anyway, point is, seamlessness with the Unreal engine turned out to be a dumb idea. Bringing up Lineage 2 and the fact that it used the Unreal engine was again, never indicative of any kind of success Vanguard itself could've had considering Lineage 2 didn't strive for seamlessness.
So using the Unreal engine for a MMO is a good idea; lotsa companies do it and Lineage 2 was one of the first to prove it can work. Using the engine for seamlessness though? Not such a good idea.
Using the Unreal Engine for a seamless world is a bad idea. Switching to Unreal 3.0 when Unreal 2.X didn't work out would only compound the problem. 'course with Brad gone the reality of that happening doesn't seem much possible. There's a realistic complaint for you though.
You know, I've not seen anything official to say that they are other than a random post here, and you just decided to bash the game based on that? Think about it.
WTF do you mean im bashing it? I played it from beta until May 14 and enjoyed it too but I quit with almost the same reason why others did, and I have a right to express my opinion as well as everyone else in this community, is it really worth another 30-50 dollars to buy an expansion when the original game isnt even completed? You should think that over.
You know, I've not seen anything official to say that they are other than a random post here, and you just decided to bash the game based on that? Think about it.
WTF do you mean im bashing it? I played it from beta until May 14 and enjoyed it too but I quit with almost the same reason why others did, and I have a right to express my opinion as well as everyone else in this community, is it really worth another 30-50 dollars to buy an expansion when the original game isnt even completed? You should think that over.Someone is mistaken. There's no way in hell they'd be working on an expansion. They don't even have endgame content yet. Perhaps the OP got his or her wires crossed. I've heard talk of a revamp or even a rerelease once this game gets in playable condition, but at this point there would be no reason to add-on to the current flat, unfinished world where there isn't a heck of a lot of stuff to do once you hit 30+.
You know, I've not seen anything official to say that they are other than a random post here, and you just decided to bash the game based on that? Think about it.
WTF do you mean im bashing it? I played it from beta until May 14 and enjoyed it too but I quit with almost the same reason why others did, and I have a right to express my opinion as well as everyone else in this community, is it really worth another 30-50 dollars to buy an expansion when the original game isnt even completed? You should think that over.Someone is mistaken. There's no way in hell they'd be working on an expansion. They don't even have endgame content yet. Perhaps the OP got his or her wires crossed. I've heard talk of a revamp or even a rerelease once this game gets in playable condition, but at this point there would be no reason to add-on to the current flat, unfinished world where there isn't a heck of a lot of stuff to do once you hit 30+.
How can you not understand the concept that this is SOE we are talking about here?
Expansion = Content that should have already been in
Expansion = Pay even more money to help us move into the next phase of beta
Expansion = LOL@U gaming community! Signed, SOE
Of all that is written, I love only what a person has written with his own blood. -Nietzsche
That is a much better responce. I can dig that, and agree with you.
They shouldn't be talking about an expansion right now.
Wish Darkfall would release.
Has nothing to do with the engine.
Lineage 2 uses the unreal engine and runs just fine, as do many games. Totally unfair to blame an engine that is as popullar and well excepted in the video game industry as the UR engine.
Lineage 2 does not try and push the Unreal 2.x engine beyond it limits, VGSOH does and that is the problem... Unreal 2 engine was not designed for what VGSOH wants.What VG is trying to do isn't a result of anything they are trying to make the engine do.
The way the are trying to load portals is something new, and I don't believe that the UR engine isn't capable of it. In fact, there isn't a thing they are trying to do that the UR engine can't handle.
Art optimization isn't the result of pushing the engine to do something it shoudln't either.
Lineage 2 also suffered the exact same problems that VG suffered/ suffers from.
Holes in the world, performance issues whith multiple character models, Memory leaks, graphical glitches. Actually just about every MMO suffers from this stuff.
It's not the engines fault. It's the fault of not having the personel and equipement for a proper QA team. TESTING is the reason the performance is bad. Not the engine or what the game does.
UR 2 engine is designed specifically for this sort of stuff. Ever played UR? Any of them?
Wish Darkfall would release.
All MMO's that have been coming out since EQ have had some level of planning of future expansions. If not what specific elements will exist in it for sure, the map is drawn and the ideas started from the conception of the retail game itself. It's simply prudent planning. At no point does Smedley state that an expansion is forthcoming next month, in the next few months or even this year. All he was stating was that an expansion may or may not be in the works, and that he wanted to manage expectations that people had for what would be in this current iteration of Vanguard that failed on launch. He is doing what Brad couldn't do, and that's detailing when certain features of the game will be released if soon, and if not, discussing the fact that they are on the backburner.
Secondly, did you even bother to read the Smedly quote posted earlier in this thread? At no point does he state that client stability improvements will take place in an EXPANSION PACK.
People got the idea that performance issues would be handled in an expansion because they misread the question:
So to reiterated, content expansion does not equal expansion pack. While Smed's does mention an expansion pack that is being planned for implementation down the road, as I covered above earlier that is just prudent, and he actually says that performance issues, bugs etc. will be a focus for the near future. He then goes on to say that there are even long term plans (so I'd assume for this year) for FREE content upgrades to get some of the missing content into the game. An expansion pack is a ways away, and in no way does that interview with Smedley show that they will be packaging everything that was supposed to be in retail and throwing it in an expansion pack, simply that there are a lot of features that people would want in future expansions.
As for features that were wanted on release, but never making it till an expansion, that isn't unheard of in the MMO industry. If Vanguard goes to an expansion as unpolished as it currently is, yeah there's a problem. If one or two features such as guild house's don't make it in till an expansion, that isn't the highway robbery you try to depict it as.
I wonder how many of the other 600+ posts you have are pure uninformed drivel. I'm not surprised you feel like shooting the messenger for stating a message you disagree with, seems to be a common trend these days when people don't have anything more relevant to say.
1) Industries involve time-tables, most of which work with a "When done with A, go on to B, then do C". Planning an expansion pack is downright mindless. Since I'm incredibly ignorant and infantile in my knowledge of the industry, allow me to humor you with a simple diagram. "When your game is broken (A), go on to fix the game to make it playable (B), and then make sure you've fleshed out enough content to keep your current player base happy (C)". The very last concern of SOE right now should be an expansion pack. How about figuring out how to retain subscriptions with your current product, before you begin brainstorming on new ideas? Call me crazy, but adding in new features and content should not even be discussed right now; fix what you've got, maintain 60,000 subscribers, plan an expansion pack from there.
2) I don't mind being quoted, however, when you misread the quote in a fit of rage, it is slightly amusing. At no point did I say that they would charge you for fix bugs in the expansion pack. If you're going to make a counter-point, at least make sure I said it first. I did, however, state that I found it ballsy to discuss an expansion pack, which are notorious for introducing more bugs into a game, and charging people for it when the core of the game's isn't even wholly functional yet.
3) That's fine. However, obviously, they're not doing a good enough job at bug-fixing. With an estimated mere 20% retention rate, people are obviously still displeased with the bugs/gameplay. Unless it's been adjusted recently, there are still leveling exploits in the game. Fix the content you've got right now; I'm not interested in the slightest in the introduction of buggier content, more exploits, and more chunking, thanks. Also, implying the near future, to me, that means within the next 6-8 months. Monitoring this game's progress in the past 6 months, I can't say that they've exactly earned my faith to ask for more money.
Final points I'd like to make; I don't think raid content has even hardly been introduced yet, has it? Are the player boats functioning much better than before, or are there still world-wide teleporters? Are the money-making/quick exp exploits vanquished thus far?
No, I'm stand by what I said earlier, I take it as a slap in the face to even be hearing talks of an expansion pack right now. You present me a stable, fun, functional game with a steady client-base, and THEN worry about charging me for the implementation of content. I've played Smed's games in the past, so promises of what they hope to accomplish and what might become don't hold much weight with me.
I won't retort with flaming though, I made my points in a civilized manner.
Waiting for something fresh to arrive on the MMO scene...
I don't think there is anything fundamentally wrong with planning an expansion at this point, despite the long list of things that absolutely must come first. Planning the next to-be-developed set of content and engine features may be useful for prioritizing what needs to be fixed now. If there's a choice between two piles of doody code to work on, where only one can be fixed really well, and the other has to make do with the software equivalent of paper clips and rubber bands, it helps to know which one will be more needed for the new content and engine features.
There's a military adage that may apply: Planning is everything; The Plan is nothing. In this sense, planning is essential to understanding what one's capabilities are, while plans are only the milestone products that provide goals to motivate planning.
So if we look to Smed's actual quote, he said nothing about scheduling an expansion when asked about the content, but did indicate that planning it was an item on the agenda. As with all Smedish utterances, I take this with a bag of salt regarding its indication of future events. The thing that is very clear to me from the quote is that he very clearly denied any feature or schedule decisions regarding any expansion. So the bulk of this entire thread comes down to people reading into a quote their own misinterpretations and assumptions, and then ascribing those misinterpretations and assumptions to SOE.
There are a few respondents who actually get it, and those I admire. For the rest of you, duh!
All MMO's that have been coming out since EQ have had some level of planning of future expansions. If not what specific elements will exist in it for sure, the map is drawn and the ideas started from the conception of the retail game itself. It's simply prudent planning. At no point does Smedley state that an expansion is forthcoming next month, in the next few months or even this year. All he was stating was that an expansion may or may not be in the works, and that he wanted to manage expectations that people had for what would be in this current iteration of Vanguard that failed on launch. He is doing what Brad couldn't do, and that's detailing when certain features of the game will be released if soon, and if not, discussing the fact that they are on the backburner.
Secondly, did you even bother to read the Smedly quote posted earlier in this thread? At no point does he state that client stability improvements will take place in an EXPANSION PACK.
People got the idea that performance issues would be handled in an expansion because they misread the question:
So to reiterated, content expansion does not equal expansion pack. While Smed's does mention an expansion pack that is being planned for implementation down the road, as I covered above earlier that is just prudent, and he actually says that performance issues, bugs etc. will be a focus for the near future. He then goes on to say that there are even long term plans (so I'd assume for this year) for FREE content upgrades to get some of the missing content into the game. An expansion pack is a ways away, and in no way does that interview with Smedley show that they will be packaging everything that was supposed to be in retail and throwing it in an expansion pack, simply that there are a lot of features that people would want in future expansions.
As for features that were wanted on release, but never making it till an expansion, that isn't unheard of in the MMO industry. If Vanguard goes to an expansion as unpolished as it currently is, yeah there's a problem. If one or two features such as guild house's don't make it in till an expansion, that isn't the highway robbery you try to depict it as.
I wonder how many of the other 600+ posts you have are pure uninformed drivel.I'm not surprised you feel like shooting the messenger for stating a message you disagree with, seems to be a common trend these days when people don't have anything more relevant to say.
1) Industries involve time-tables, most of which work with a "When done with A, go on to B, then do C". Planning an expansion pack is downright mindless. Since I'm incredibly ignorant and infantile in my knowledge of the industry, allow me to humor you with a simple diagram. "When your game is broken (A), go on to fix the game to make it playable (B), and then make sure you've fleshed out enough content to keep your current player base happy (C)". The very last concern of SOE right now should be an expansion pack. How about figuring out how to retain subscriptions with your current product, before you begin brainstorming on new ideas? Call me crazy, but adding in new features and content should not even be discussed right now; fix what you've got, maintain 60,000 subscribers, plan an expansion pack from there.
2) I don't mind being quoted, however, when you misread the quote in a fit of rage, it is slightly amusing. At no point did I say that they would charge you for fix bugs in the expansion pack. If you're going to make a counter-point, at least make sure I said it first. I did, however, state that I found it ballsy to discuss an expansion pack, which are notorious for introducing more bugs into a game, and charging people for it when the core of the game's isn't even wholly functional yet.
3) That's fine. However, obviously, they're not doing a good enough job at bug-fixing. With an estimated mere 20% retention rate, people are obviously still displeased with the bugs/gameplay. Unless it's been adjusted recently, there are still leveling exploits in the game. Fix the content you've got right now; I'm not interested in the slightest in the introduction of buggier content, more exploits, and more chunking, thanks. Also, implying the near future, to me, that means within the next 6-8 months. Monitoring this game's progress in the past 6 months, I can't say that they've exactly earned my faith to ask for more money.
Final points I'd like to make; I don't think raid content has even hardly been introduced yet, has it? Are the player boats functioning much better than before, or are there still world-wide teleporters? Are the money-making/quick exp exploits vanquished thus far?
No, I'm stand by what I said earlier, I take it as a slap in the face to even be hearing talks of an expansion pack right now. You present me a stable, fun, functional game with a steady client-base, and THEN worry about charging me for the implementation of content. I've played Smed's games in the past, so promises of what they hope to accomplish and what might become don't hold much weight with me.
I won't retort with flaming though, I made my points in a civilized manner.
1) Game isn't, nor was it ever, broken. The player base is still playing through the content. I'm not sure what your expectations are here, or exactly what you mean.
Don't like diplomacy? Ok, but that's content you don't have in another game; you could just ignore it like it never existed and it doesn't effect the content part of the game one way or the other.
Let's just work off of crafting, adventuring, and harvesting.
Not everyone is going to like to craft. In fact a smaller percentage of players will be pure crafters then adventurers, and possibly harvesters. Crafting is a niche thing that few people, over all, have the tolerance for. More people are casaul crafters then pure I think. VG crafting isn't tailored to the casual crafter though. I'm a casual crafter, and I can say I don't like the crafting in VG, but then I don't like it in any game. It's boreing, tedious, and time consuming. Not what I want to do in a game. That's every MMO, not just VG.
Harvesting? You chop down a tree, collect rocks, or pick plants. No dif. then most MMO's. I haven't played another MMO that actually lets me cut down a tree though. I do that in VG. I also chop up treants; maybe you do that in another MMO, I haven't seen it yet though. Harvesting can be done with a group of people. I'm a harvester, as close to a pure harvester as it gets. That's what I do when I play, and one of the reason I have to play a PvP game. Harvesting is boring; PvP gives it life. Wish there were more trees and rocks to harvest though. That's my only complaint. As long as there is a demand for harvested goods. Boats and housing require harvested mats, and they will be implementing guild housing soon; that's going to need mats as well.
Adventuring? You do quests. Lot's of quests. Over and over again. Same thing I do in every MMO. There are quests, and they have implemented others, and will continue to implement more. They've stated that every patch will contain content, and I would assume that means adventuring content as well as crafting and diplomacy. There are solo quests, group quests, and they are working on raid content now. Didn't enjoy the combat? Then complain about WoW, EQ2, L2, CoX, AO, blah, blah, blah. It's the same basic system in every game. It's not FPS, it's not revolutionary. Nothing was ever promised to be inovative here. it does have some depth and a little complexity to it, more then some games, and maybe a little less then others. No false promises about combat, or hype in this area. It is what it is, and I don't really see them completely changing it. It works.
I've been trying to find an official source for sub numbers because I keep seeing numbers thrown out. Can you direct me to were you got the 60k from? Obviously they are consolidating servers to improve grouping, but that isn't an indicator of an exact number of players. The number of servers they have is to much to support even 150k subs at all times to provide adiquate numbers for grouping with the time it takes to travel and the world size. A lot of players still haven't figured out how to summon thier corpse, I wouldn't dought if they haven't figured out how to configure thier chat channells or use the LFG tool.
2) Care to explain that in a little more detail? What part isn't functional yet? Raiding? Isn't a core part of the game, nor promised for release. Mounts? They work and are in the game. Ships? There and working. Combat? Works. Harvesting? Works. Crafting? Works. I'm not sure what you mean by the core of the game? The engine works. They keep saying it, the art needs to be optimized.
3) How isn't it obviouse that bugs are being fixed. The patch notes are available for anyone to read and each one adresses bugs. How do you come to the conclusion that bugs aren't being fixed? No MMO is bug free, and I haven't seen any more bugs in VG then in any other MMO that hasn't had 2 to 3 years to get situated. You can't compare it to EQ2 or WoW, not CoH or L2. Those games have been around long enough now that they should be working. VG wasn't that much worse, and a little better then a couple of MMO's at release. Mem leaks are pretty common problems in persistant world games. They get fixed over time. Some take longer then others, but eventually they get worked out. In 6 months the devs have made great strides in clearing up bugs and broken quests. Exploits get fixed. The gold dup was fixed, and level exploits have been taken care of. Unfortunetly there is always someone out there that finds new ways. These things, like mem. leaks happen in these games. In fact WoW has far more exploits in it then VG does.
What in the content needs fixing? Crafting sucks, but I've already gone throught that. Personally I think they need to make the complications not occur so often. Could you provide an explanation for this? What needs to be fixed exactly? Vague, over-exagerated statements aren't very fair; not to mention you're a writer, you should be able to explain yourself better then that.
Let's be a little reasonable here. 6-8 months would put the game into over a year after release. One year is pretty fair for an expansion, even WoW originally stated one a year, but couldn't live up to it. A bigger judge of SoE would be actually releasing one in that amount of time. Personally I think they should have squashed all talk of an xpac and made th focus the game today. The mention of an xpac tends to take the focus off of issues at hand and some people get critical. Case in point, this thread.
You begin by invoking the feeling that BarazWI wrote with an air of anger, or as you put it, a fit of rage. You then present a write up of your opinion, wich you critisized BarazWI for giving, with misleading, over-exagerated, and vague statements. All wrapped up in a kind of passive agressive flamer type post.
I'll be impressed if someone actually reads all of this. Didn't expect it to get so long. Sorry.
P.S. I'm not proof reading so deal with the errors
Wish Darkfall would release.
Urdig, I read it.
No one is faulting the engine. It is a simple and well known fact that SIgil modded the UR 2.x engine too heavily. How can you say that they "arent doing anything the engine cant do" when the LIST of what they changed is RIGHT in this thread?
Go to some Unreal dev forums. Ive seen many long threads about how much modification Sigil did and how much of it was ill advised in discussions between Unreal devs on what the heck went wrong there.
The other poster is 100% correct. Sigil tried to do things with the engine that the engine wasnt meant to do and now they are paying a price for it. Its AMAZING that this is such a contraversial statement that it needs to be challenged down to the smallest minutiae. What is your point exactly? That the Unreal engine CAN be used just fine to do all of the things Sigil is trying to do, that they didnt really mod anything, and that all of the problems are just because they cant implmenent an OUT OF BOX engine?
If thats your actual contention, I can tell you you're wrong. It wouldnt even make sense. Sigil openly discusses their modification of the engine. WHY would they either modify it if they didnt have to? Why would they lie about modifying it? Lastly, the features of that engine are well published by Epic and those things Brad listed are NOT on them.
No one is faulting the engine. It is a simple and well known fact that SIgil modded the UR 2.x engine too heavily. How can you say that they "arent doing anything the engine cant do" when the LIST of what they changed is RIGHT in this thread?
Go to some Unreal dev forums. Ive seen many long threads about how much modification Sigil did and how much of it was ill advised in discussions between Unreal devs on what the heck went wrong there.
The other poster is 100% correct. Sigil tried to do things with the engine that the engine wasnt meant to do and now they are paying a price for it. Its AMAZING that this is such a contraversial statement that it needs to be challenged down to the smallest minutiae. What is your point exactly? That the Unreal engine CAN be used just fine to do all of the things Sigil is trying to do, that they didnt really mod anything, and that all of the problems are just because they cant implmenent an OUT OF BOX engine?
If thats your actual contention, I can tell you you're wrong. It wouldnt even make sense. Sigil openly discusses their modification of the engine. WHY would they either modify it if they didnt have to? Why would they lie about modifying it? Lastly, the features of that engine are well published by Epic and those things Brad listed are NOT on them.
Care to explain what it is that they are trying to do that the engine can't?
Art optimization is the issue with the game for the most part. The chunking issue has to do with the portals loading, and a big part of what Sigil did to the UR engine. It's also capable of doing what they did because it's doing it, and it'll do it even better with time.
Sigil didn't openly discuss what they did to the engine.
I don't program. I only know what I can read, and what I've read, as well as played says that the engine they put together is working. I can say that I have a very basic understanding, thanks to conversations with personal friends and familly that program for a living, of how game engines work. My basic understanding is that the engine is just a complex system of directions telling DX what it's supposed to do. (My exptremely simplified explanation based on my limited understanding).
Care to delve into exactly what it is that they have done to the engine that it isn't able to do? Can you explain wich parts of the game aren't working correctly and exactly how they tie into the game engine or changes to it? What exactly is it doing that it can't or isn't supposed to do.
One of the things I've read over the years about the UR engine is that it's a very versitle, powerfull engine. UR didn't put it out to just be used as is, it's the frame work for larger things. If you can push it and make it doing something new, like Sigil did with the portals from what I understand, then you're doing something good.
And can you provide a link to these threads you mention? Just in case I'm not able to find them myself.
Wish Darkfall would release.