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Game companies not too bright lately...
Devony
Member Posts: 278
What are they thinking? All the major games are going to come out this fall (or in the case of Warhammer, February next year which was smart IMO) lets see... Pirates of the Burning Sea, Age of Conan, Tabula Rasa, Huxley, Gods and Heros... and more.
BUT NOW IS THE TIME!
In fall with this influx of games, we will be rolling in games to play. Sure, some will suck, or some we will just not like, but still the choices will finally be here. I am sure with all these games coming out at once, some won't be able to find enough of a playerbase.
I just think, if a game opened now and was half decent, people would flock to it like flies on a cow's bottom! For instance, me and my gamer friends are so desperate for an MMO (Now don't go telling me to get outside, this is all in the context of gaming. My entertainment is gaming, not television, or movies. I go outside all the time. Shush. OK, lets continue). we are "eagerly" waiting for friggin' Perfect World servers to come out in English. I am refreshing my inbox 24/7 in hopes of getting into one of the major betas.
Come on Game companies, these are the last despondent cries of frenzied gamers. Our gaming juices are flowing like never before, we need a fix, don't let us hang, release a game already! 
Get your coders on speed and/or dexadrine , get those comes out! 
Currently waiting for - Perfect World English, Age of Conan
How to play Perfect World in english
Currently messing with - Requiem Online
Comments
Please, if your gaming juices are flowing carry paper towels with you. Your mom will appreciate it.
but back to topic... yea it seems there are alot of highly anticipated games in the works.. many slated for release and at least open beta quite soon. I was feeling quite frustrated too until I checked mt in box two days ago.
Tend to agree. The current drought of decent MMORPGs is tiresome.
But, how many of those you listed do you foresee being 'put back' to further 'polish' and 'tweak' them to avoid the VGsoH nightmare? I reckon every single one will be even later than late.
I would imagine the sloppy launch of VGsoH caused hysteria amongst game publishers and developers. Maybe some will never be able to click that "release" button!
Tabula rasa and gods & heroes are scheduled to release in 2007?
Well, aoc has very different gameplay than potbs, or tabula rasa. And afaik, g&h doesn't have pvp, so kind of different targets for all these games. While they likely do have some overlap, it's not enaugh to release an unfinished game to beat competition.
You are correct that if say aoc released in one week, many people would buy it. But if the game isn't ready, would they stay? Mmos are more concerned with keeping subscribers rather than selling lots of boxes and then ending up with almost no players. Didn't vanguard sell something like 200k+ boxes? Yet it is considered a failure because it couldn't keep subscribers and in fact lost like 20% of it's population in about a months (accordign to their e3 presentation, from June to July) which forced them to merge rp server with none rp servers 9I think)
So, while releasing first definitely has it's advantages, companies are more concerned with releasing a stable game with good content. After all, if a game is good, subscribers will come, after they quit a "released first with no content" games. But if they release a piece of junk like vanguard, then subscribers will quit very fast, and newplayers likely won't come even if they do improve the game. Especialy with a number of mmos being released.
If you buy God and heroes (for the sake of argument, say it's released one month before others) and you realize it's missing tons of content and has lots of bugs, would you subscribe to it after first free month is gone or would you buy aoc or potbs or whatever instead?
I am sure if any of these companies had a release quality game, they would release it. The fact that they aren't releasing those games until their release time means that the games aren't ready, and if they were released anyway they'd just compete with vanguard for a failed mmo with interesting ideas.
The thing that ticks me off most about this 'gaming drought' isn't the fact that it's just MMORPG's.... If it was just them then it would be bearable but everywhere I go I either see crappy offline games coming out that aren't even worth the effort it takes to play them, or they're all coming out 'this summer' or 'next fall' it's sodding ridiculous and half the MMORPG's that come out now they quite obviously spend half their time making the trailers for them and not the actual game itself...... Bah... Counterstrike and Oblivion are the only things that seem to be holding my attention span for the moment.
Quoting people doesn't make you clever, in fact, it makes you all the more stupid for not bothering to read the quotes you post in the first place.
Perhaps the mmorpg genre simply sucks? Whats the point of putting all these people into 1 world when the gameplay is crappy?
and with the latency issues and stuff the gameplay inevidably turns out bad, thats why age of conan and stuff with good gameplay are moving towards instances.
/agree, just NOTHING TO PLAY lol am watching TV when bored, and like reading books, this can't go on, seriously! I really miss gaming, as sad as that maybe.
Currently waiting for - Perfect World English, Age of Conan
How to play Perfect World in english
Currently messing with - Requiem Online
I'm not holding my breath for any of these games to be released on time after all the delays we've already seen, so I don't expect a glut of new games this fall.
Watch the latest episode of "The Guild" and other Pwnage videos from around the net--also post your own: http://PwnerTV.com
It's a feeding frenzy, check out how sharks react to chum, yep...The companies are the chum and we're the sharks.
They don't care, they are just chum. Somewhere, sometime someone will come to your game from another.
Thats market trend.
Um, if the chum are there, but the sharks are full, all you'll get is a nudge or two
Currently waiting for - Perfect World English, Age of Conan
How to play Perfect World in english
Currently messing with - Requiem Online
The sad thing about MMORPGs is that if they get released on time, they tend to not be finished...
Praise delays!
It really has been a while since a good MMOG has come out. I even started trying out Free MMOGs. But for me it is actually a good thing because I am taking college courses and MMOGs are bad for grades. This fall though there are plenty of games for me to play, BioShock, Gears of War PC, Unreal Tournament 3, Heavenly sword PS3, etc... So it is not really important to me if Age of Conan, Warhammer, or Hero's Journey do not come out until 2008.
I think MMOG companies are actually getting smarter (after Vanguard). They realize that creating a loyal and happy playerbase from the beginning is very important, so a lot rides on the launch. People tend to not give an MMOG a second chance and bad news spreads quickly over the internet.
World Builder GM
Hero's Journey
Yes, but, they should have planned for an earlier release.. right now it's like everyone hanging in slow motion. And BTW, AOC is supposed to come out end of October.
If it doesn't, they will lose a lot to Warhammer subscribers.
Currently waiting for - Perfect World English, Age of Conan
How to play Perfect World in english
Currently messing with - Requiem Online
No they aren't. This same story repeats itself with each new batch of MMo's that come out. The same thing that happened with VG happened with EQ2 and MXO, SB to name a few.
Game companies never learn. They mostly have champagne dreams on water budgets. The devs try and try...the big wigs supplying the money get tired of dishing money out with no return, and force the game out so they can recap their money.
Look how long its taken for EQ2 to turn around. From what I hear the game is tons better than it was at release, and not as retardedly group dependent as it use to be...but I'll still never try it again, no matter how good it gets.
The industry will never learn until they screw themselves out of house and home.
D.
A lot of companies seem to be delaying their game so I dunno if what your sayings entirely true.
They always delay their games. This is pretty much how it goes:
company announces their new revolutionary mmo. They publish an expected release date of..we'll say january 2009. Sounds reasonable, about a year and a half or so until release. January 2009 will come and go with no game released. Most likely there will have been no press about the game not releasing. Several months will pass, then they will announce a new release date, citing some internal reasons for delay. This will usually continue until you have been following the game about 3 years or so..then the game will either release or turn into vaporware.
Seriously...almost EVERY MMO I have ever followed has followed this format. They always WAAAAY underestimate how long development is going to be. Ask anyone that has been following MMO's since UO and EQ days.
D.
Microsoft also released the XBox 360 a year before Nintendo released the Wii and Sony released the Playstation. What's the failure rate on XBox 360s? Something like 33%? That's such a huge problem they had to extend their warranty period by an additional 2 years. Microsoft released early because they wanted to try and get that jump on the competition. Yes, they've released some pretty good games but the losses Microsoft has suffered because of rushing the console out the door is quite prevalent. Far too many games are rushed out the door just to start making money. I have more respect for developers that hold onto their MMOs for a while longer to make sure it comes out in a completed state that is actually playable. If that means they come out a bit after one of the rushed titles, so be it. When people see the game is a quality title that actually works, they will pick it up and play it.
Daelnor, Dark Age of Camelot actually came out when Mythic announced it. It's about the only game though.
Yeah, DAOC rocked too. I agree with you about releasing early. Look at games like EQ2..they cut their own foot off releasing a crappy game too early, trying to beat WoW out the gate. The game runs much better now and has more user friendly content..but people shun it like the plague.
D.
First impressions are huge in this industry. If your game is broken or unfinished when you release it, the likelyhood it will ever be successful is slim. Anarchy Online is a prime candidate for this. Star Wars Galaxies also can fit in here, though it was somewhat successful upon release. It was still quite problematic and bug ridden. Vanguard is the poster boy, though the problems here are more than just being rushed out the door. D&D: Online also fits in here, no matter how improved it is, it won't ever pull in great numbers. Shadowbane is another good example here. It released broken and as such hasn't ever pulled in great numbers. Auto Assault is closing down in just under 2 weeks. Dark and Light is probably the runner up for Poster Boy.
Publishers see that people will buy unfinished games though, so they force developers to release early. This actually goes as far back as Everquest with the Scars of Vellious expansion, followed by the unfinished Shadows of Luclin expansion, and the Planes of Power expansion. In fact, it was so bad in the Planes of Power that the elemental planes weren't even accessible for months until SOE had finished programming them. It's like I posted in the AoC thread with the abnormally long title, if we as consumers continue to pay for broken, unfinished games then publishers will keep pushing them down our throats. Until we as consumers are willing to tell publishers to stuff it by not buying these games, we can count on seeing more and more titles released in an unfinished state.
I think the biggest problem is that it takes so long to develop an MMO.
5 to 7 years is so long that by the time the game comes out, the graphics and gaming engine is outdated compared to what the new computers can handle.
Then, with a few exceptions, people play a year or less and move on to something else. Kind of hard to recoup a 7-year investment in 1 year.
It may be that they need to switch to a development model something like Second Life, which is in kind of permanent development.
Watch the latest episode of "The Guild" and other Pwnage videos from around the net--also post your own: http://PwnerTV.com
First impressions are very important, but there is a fine balance between release and polish. The problem here, as pointed out by the OP, is that there a many decent titles slated for release in within a similar time line.
I'm sure many people out there have a gaming budget,do not like to play multiple games at once or have other reasons to concentrate on one title. So it is important for a game to get the oppertunity to give someone that first impression and hook that new customer. Sure each title will have it's own following but at this moment in time there seems to be an ever growing number of people looking for a new and GOOD MMORPG to play.
As we all know, or should know, MMORPGs simply can not be finished prior to release. So the question is, what do you, or they, consider "finished"? Bugs, nearly all software goes live with bugs and the more complex the software, the greater the number and potencey of those bugs, look at Windows! If developers try to quash ALL bugs and 'finish' their product before going live then there is the chance they may never release.
As for my hard earned cash, it will probably go to the first of one of the listed titles to go live.
I think companies should shut their mouths until the game is pretty much ready for open beta. Then they don't hype it up too much too early, but can build up the excitement..then RELEASE it while everyone is still all hawt for it.
WoW pretty much did that..you heard a little bit about it..then there was a huge closed beta(at which time the game played like a finished product.) Straight into open beta and release...very fast overall for an MMO. That I believe is a large part of its success...they didn't tell anyone about it until it was almost done.
D.
To attempt some insight here, possibly...
This year's early release of one of the most "hyped" MMO's in history definitely has scared the companies that have releases scheduled. I'm even thinking that it's not so much that they fear their game is not ready, but that general gaming public is just getting too critical and the pressure to release a game that is, in some way, a groundbreaking new approach to questing. I believe they push back their dates in hopes that the competition will release first and they observe what the market's reaction is to the new game.
Remember, however, not too long after release of Vanguard came the very successful and smooth release of LOTRo. This particular game has done very well, it seems for the past several months that it has been on the open market.
Nonetheless, we have several companies that are holding back their release. It's a "cat and mouse" chess game here. Unfortunately, what they have done now is back themselves into a corner. There is going to be a "bottlenecking" effect soon as these companies will eventually have to release their product due to cost overruns and other financial reasons. How will this effect the consumer? Wait and see, friends. Due to the "Vanguard Effect", this cluster of new games will be battling to eek out some sort of survival amonst the consumer base. I can predict, I feel sure, that we'll see a gaming hype to buy these products the likes of which we've never seen for this type of gaming product. Much will be written about this upcoming "Battle of the Uber Game" in the months ahead. When the dust settles by next December, 2008, only one or two games may survive. This phenomenon may change the industry altogether. How? All we can do is wait and see... It may cause a type of low ebb in this genre's market base until the companies actually do begin developing new MMO's that incorporate more cutting edge, high tech philosophy. All you young techies out there with wonderful and creative ideas may have an opportunity in a couple of years...companies may "clean house" and new thinking and appraoches to gaming design will be sought in the near future, folks. All this because of the upcoming influx of gaming product/content. None of which really offers anything very groundbreaking or cutting edge.
Hold onto you hats, ladies and gentlemen and watch the forums of each of the major upcoming releases. It's gunna be a "slobber knocker" to be sure...
All I want is the truth
Just gimme some truth
John Lennon
First impressions are very important, but there is a fine balance between release and polish. The problem here, as pointed out by the OP, is that there a many decent titles slated for release in within a similar time line.
I'm sure many people out there have a gaming budget,do not like to play multiple games at once or have other reasons to concentrate on one title. So it is important for a game to get the oppertunity to give someone that first impression and hook that new customer. Sure each title will have it's own following but at this moment in time there seems to be an ever growing number of people looking for a new and GOOD MMORPG to play.
As we all know, or should know, MMORPGs simply can not be finished prior to release. So the question is, what do you, or they, consider "finished"? Bugs, nearly all software goes live with bugs and the more complex the software, the greater the number and potencey of those bugs, look at Windows! If developers try to quash ALL bugs and 'finish' their product before going live then there is the chance they may never release.
As for my hard earned cash, it will probably go to the first of one of the listed titles to go live.
A finished MMO is this:
Servers are stable and don't crash. Players can actually play the game as intended. No severe lag due to things outside the player's control, such as taking 10 seconds to start attacking a mob or taking 2 minutes before you can loot a mob you just killed.
No major game breaking bugs that can be exploited. Yes, all software has bugs. But do they release software that crashes because of said bugs and expect people to still pay for it? Is it fair for a game to release with such a huge exploit that people are literally leveling five to ten times faster than was originally intended and take 2 months to fix said exploit? Anarchy Online suffered from this on release.
There is enough content to keep players satisfied for 6-9 months? And not just a level grind, but actual content. LotRO is suffering from this now. Many players are complaining about being bored because there just isn't enough content to keep them interested.
Advertised features are fully implemented and in good, working order. Nothing worse than getting into a game because you are very interested in a specific feature only to find out it either isn't working correctly or it was omitted for inclusion at a later date. If you are advertising a feature in your game, it had better be in the game and it had better be working. If you don't have time to include an advertised feature, remove it from your description and advertisements!! World of Warcraft's Hero classes is a perfect example of this. If they knew they wouldn't get to it and not sure if they'd ever be able to, tell the freaking playerbase. "We apologize, but due to constraints on both time and resources, we've had to exclude feature X. If, in the future, things change we will be sure to let you know right away." Can you imagine how far that would have gone in appeasing the player base in World of Warcraft if Blizzard had said that up front, rather than dragging the player base along for months and months with the promise of a feature the game may never see?
If a game can achieve all of these, then it will have a very good first impression and will most likely bring in solid enough numbers to keep it growing to continue developing content, finish polishing it up, make adjustments to game content, and have happy players enjoy playing the game. Video games are and should be first and foremost about having fun. If you can't play on a server because it keeps crashing and rolling back the last hour you spent working up your character, that's not fun. If there are bugs that people are exploiting to get an unfair advantage, especially in a competitive game such as one focusing on PvP, there is a huge problem right there. If you run out of things to do in the first three months of playing (not counting the super powergamers that log 8+ hours a day), there is a very big problem. You focused too much on other things and forgot to actually put a game in your MMO. If you advertise a feature as being revolutionary and ground breaking but then forget to actually include it, huge problem. If you advertise a feature as being revolutionary and ground breaking, but don't actually implement as advertised because you will "get to it later", also a huge problem.
To Alyndale:
With all due respect...what is going on with the industry is nothing new. It has been going on since people began to vaguely realize that MMO's were becoming an industry.
What happened with VAnguard won't change the industry...its the same exact thing that happened with EQ2, its the same exact thing that happened with Shadowbane, its the same exact thing that happened with Dark and light, and with Mourning, and probably with countless others that I can't remember right now. It's not a cat and mouse game between publishers so much as a cat and mouse game between devs and producers cutting funding. When the guy supplying the money says" this game is a money pit, put it out or you're fired" or something like that, the game gets put out unfinished, and the money guy hopes to recoup his money from box sales.
D.
Now, however, we have a vast "ocean" of gamers out there with high expectations. I do not debate one way or the other. I simply point out that we are are most likely going to see the inevitable "bottlenecking" of many new games within the next year. History will record this time in gaming as the end of one generation and the time of new development . It won't die, as such, but there most likely will be flux. Most of the upcoming games, in my opinion, are playing it as safe as possible to succeed in this highly competitive market.
But, you do see this "cat and mouse gamesmanship I am talking about for sure. Watch the marketing strategies these companies will use in the upcoming months as they go open beta. Should be interesting, I should think.
I have this feeling that, because there are so many new gamers out there that seem to want a certain type and style of game, many may become disillusioned when the dust settles late next year after this soon-to-be battle for supremacy of the MMO market. How will this effect the market? I'm not a sage or soothsayer, to be sure, but just a gut feeling that it may take a bit of a dive. This could be an overall positive effect if new thought is allowed to germinate...
/bows humbly to daelnor...
All I want is the truth
Just gimme some truth
John Lennon