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"Blu-Ray Was Totally Worth It" - Kotaku Article
Nihilanth
Member Posts: 1,357
I didn't know PGR4 had to restrict itself because of limited space. That scares me, because it means 360 games in the future are probably going to have to do that more and more. If they can fit Mass Effect on one DVD, then I think we should be fine for a while into the future, but what about 2 years from now? I was among the nay-sayers originally with Sony adding a Blu-Ray player into the system. I thought it drove the price up too much for not enough benefit. Maybe I was wrong.
kotaku.com/gaming/after-pgr4-didn.t-fit-on-dvd-sony-says/blu+ray-was-totally-worth-it-284618.php
Schutzbar - Human Warrior - Windrunner Alliance - World of Warcraft
Nihilanth - Kerra Paladin - Blackburrow - EverQuest II
XBL Gamertag - Eagle15GT
Comments
Sony had it right. The past shows that developers are constantly asking for more space, and bluray provides that space.
Games like Heavenly Sword, Lair and Metal Gear Solid 4 would not be possble without the bluray. If you ask me, Xbox360 is current, Playstation 3 is the future.
I'm not sure if it was worth it. Just because a few companies like to stick more hours of cgi(or in game non playable footage ) than gameplay into a game doesnt mean in the grand scheme of things it will pay off. Ps3 is still very expensive
I agree Ps3 is the future, but in the next 4 to 5 years we'll discover how far in the future it is :P My guess is far far future when x box 720 comes out :P
I also think companies need to chill out a bit with the huge gaming budgets. Gears of War and games like it are setting too high of a standard ,and original and high quality (relitvly) game making is becoming too risky and expensive. Some lessons need to be taken from Wii's sucess.
More people should have your signature.
The PS3 will beat the 360 and we all know it, however it'll just take time :P First of all it needs good games and the start of those hopefully come out later on this year with MGS4 and Little Big Planet. Also the PS3 needs a good online and hopefully that'll start with Home and it seems much more accessible than Live because it'll attract everyone to come make a character, while girls wont really take to live.
Any good games on the 360 i can just buy for PC and the only good one coming out that isn't is Mass Effect, which will probally be on PC anyways a year after 360.
X-Box has its share of good games comin up in my opinion, but I do agree Ps3 will surpass it. Microsoft really dropped the ball a second time , first with x-box now with 360. They had a huge head start on the both its competitors and instead of turning out some great games they just went on easy mode. I partly blame the racism prevelant in asia that makes them turn a blind eye to american products but most of the blame falls on MS's shoulders alone.
MS really believed that they could capture the asian market with just a few games, and somehow also beleived their LIVE gameplay would simply clinch it for them in the west. Just plain dumb.
I agree that the PS3 will eventually beat out the Xbox360, but I think the Wii is going to smash both of them into the ground. I think the Wii has a good chance of catching up to the PS2 as the best selling console of all time. Look at all of the success Nintendo has had so far and all with argueably only one game that Gamers really wanted (Zelda). With Smash bros, Super Mario Galaxy, Mario Kart, Metroid etc all coming out I see the sales going up even higher.
Currently playing:
LOTRO & WoW (not much WoW though because Mines of Moria rocks!!!!)
Looking Foward too:
Bioware games (Dragon Age & Star Wars The Old Republic)
It's worth it on the PS3 but I'm sure as hell not going to go get a blu-ray player. It's a scam.
I dunno i doubt it very much it doesn't have any good games coming up and has nothing now : Nintendo will make a profit with it and made a smart move but i do believe when the dust settles that PS3 will be on top. Sure they have super smash and metroid prime and mario but i've seen all them games before and they wernt that good before.
I think PS3 is doing more innovative stuff aswel, i mean whocares about a controller that really does nothing to improve gameplay. PS3 will have a mod community, home and little big planet by the end of the year and in my mind thats nore innovative for a console than anything.
I dunno i doubt it very much it doesn't have any good games coming up and has nothing now : Nintendo will make a profit with it and made a smart move but i do believe when the dust settles that PS3 will be on top. Sure they have super smash and metroid prime and mario but i've seen all them games before and they wernt that good before.
I think PS3 is doing more innovative stuff aswel, i mean whocares about a controller that really does nothing to improve gameplay. PS3 will have a mod community, home and little big planet by the end of the year and in my mind thats nore innovative for a console than anything.
Who cares?
Not the general populace, thats for sure. Therefor the PS3 will not be the winner of this generation of games. I have said it dozens of times already, the PS3 and Xbox360 are non-existent in the general populaces eyes, nobody knows what it is or exactly what it does. All they know is "video game machine". On the other hand, people KNOW what the Wii is. It has garnered enough mass media attention and appeal to reach the level where the general populace does know what it is and does care about what it offers. Nintendo has become, in every sense of the word, the "iPod" of videogames.
As for Blu Ray. . . are you seriously telling me that after about 10-20 hours worth of gameplay I'll have to get up, walk over to my 360 and put in an entirely separate DVD? No freakin way. . . say no more, I have already listed my 360 on eBay. The thought of actually having to get off my couch to switch DVDs makes me sick. I guess Blu Ray is the only way for me now. . .
Eternally mine,
Keebs
The MMO gaming blog I write for.
Jesus Christ! so you're saying the 360 is going to fail because during the many hours of gameplay you will need to.... gasp! get up! my god... Hmmm yeah because wii all know that a console that makes you move at all will fail...
Swapping CDs out on a PC game is fine but on a console its annoying. Hey if they can fit more data on the blu-ray the thats cool with me.
I'll just wait until next year to grab a PS3 with the DVR, Final Fantasy XIII should be out by then in the U.S.
Don't be terrorized! You're more likely to die of a car accident, drowning, fire, or murder! More people die every year from prescription drugs than terrorism LOL!
Swapping CDs out on a PC game is fine but on a console its annoying. Hey if they can fit more data on the blu-ray the thats cool with me.
Yes, but is it really worth the extra few hundred dollars just so you'll save a few calories and get fatter?
In defense of the 360 here, swaping out disk in the middle of a game is nothing new. Have any of you ever heard of FF7, FF8, FF9, Legend of Dragoon, Metal Gear Solid, Lunar, Brave Fencer Mushasi (sp)...? Just because a system is "next gen" dosent exclude it from technological limitations. Its inevitable, and depending on how fast Sony can get dual layer Blu-Ray out, we might even see a 2 disk PS3 game, could even be something comming out really soon like FFXIII. The Wii however will be ok with its 8.7GB disk (around there), since the games dont use High-resolution textures, that slims file size down majorly.
"There's no star system Slave I can't reach, and there's no planet I can't find. There's nowhere in the Galaxy for you to run. Might as well give up now."
Boba Fett
I plan to buy an xbox360 mostly because it has free software for independent developers to make games for both the PC and xbox360. Neither the wii or PS3 can claim that. As I said the problem with the xbox360 is it has overheating problems which hopefully will be fixed with the new CPU. At the moment it has the best game library out of the three consoles. The price will be dropping to 250, 350, and 400 respectively for the different xbox360 consoles. I feel it's sales will pickup after the price drop and the new system is released that is supposedly called falcon. PS3 is very expensive and not many people have a TV capable of taking advantage of blueray at the moment. It's only a very small market. Unless high definition LCDs drop in price sometime soon I don't see it as an advantage. Microsoft is always changing the insides of their system so down the road they may make a version that include built in HD-DVD.
XNA is a fun hobby, I suggest it highly (XNA is the development tool). And yeah the new 65nm CPU will fix all those problems, and they re completely re-designing the setup cm by cm to make sure they fix the problems. It has a huge library and just had a price drop. And yeah yeah MS has a history of changing ubrubtly, so a built-in HD-DVD player I wouldn't rule out.
XNA is a fun hobby, I suggest it highly (XNA is the development tool). And yeah the new 65nm CPU will fix all those problems, and they re completely re-designing the setup cm by cm to make sure they fix the problems. It has a huge library and just had a price drop. And yeah yeah MS has a history of changing ubrubtly, so a built-in HD-DVD player I wouldn't rule out.
I've played around with XNA for making PC games and it's pretty neat. Unfortunately it's still a lot of coding as it doesn't have graphical interface tools like Never Winter Nights toolset, but it's still easier then directx as it sets up the game loop for you as well as making it easier to add pictures and models. I really hope this does well as it could be a way for indie developers to make cheap games that don't have to appeal to the mainstream market.
Second, disc swapping is not necessarily always a good option, and not just because it's annoying to change discs. First, as with PGR4, they're only having to cut out a bit. They would never make an entirely separate DVD just for day/night cycles, so they cut it. That's not a huge deal when it's something like that, but what about when they just go barely over the edge with an entire gameplay or online feature. There's not enough to stick just that on a whole new disc, but it won't fit on just one. Guess what happens? It gets cut. Also, creating multiple discs is not cost-effective for developers/publishers. It costs them a lot of money to add a second disc to the package, and it can really drive down profits if they want to keep it at $60 (and you know people won't want to pay more than that). One extra disc doesn't seem like a lot, but when you're printing a couple million copies and you have to change the manufacture cycle to put 2 (again, doesn't sound like a big change, but it can be) instead of one into the box, the money adds up pretty quickly. That's why developers/publishers don't like to do it when they don't ABSOLUTELY have to.
Lastly, some things simply can't be fixed with splitting a game into two discs. Most of what takes up space on a disc is art and graphics, and they can and are getting to the point where simply making two DVDs won't fix the problem. You sometimes have to have a certain number of images/textures/models ready to load on the disc when you're playing a game, especially the newer ones, and they can't have you switching discs in the middle of a fight because they couldn't cram them all onto one disc. Imagine a game like Mass Effect where you have entire galaxy to explore. The reason they got away with putting that game onto one disc is because they ultra-compressed the textures, and the game is not incredible long by RPG standards (approx. 20 hours according to the developers). Even then, that game just barely fit. If they added basically ANYTHING else, it would have pushed them overboard. Imagine flying to a planet..*insert disc 2*...woops I forgot something on the last thing...*insert disc 1*...right now gotta go back *insert disc 2*....quest sends me to yet another planet *insert disc 1* See where I'm going here? DVD swapping is an option, but it's by absolutely no means a solution.
DVD swapping is not a perfect solution. It works sometimes, but it has some serious problems and always has limitations.
Schutzbar - Human Warrior - Windrunner Alliance - World of Warcraft
Nihilanth - Kerra Paladin - Blackburrow - EverQuest II
XBL Gamertag - Eagle15GT
Easy solution for Xbox360 is to just add a larger HD to offset the smaller disks. Game comes on 2 disks then you just install it and run it off the HD. Now it runs faster and loads faster then a game off of disk.
Currently playing:
LOTRO & WoW (not much WoW though because Mines of Moria rocks!!!!)
Looking Foward too:
Bioware games (Dragon Age & Star Wars The Old Republic)
If you get the HD-DVD player for the sXbox, it can fit plenty of information. The players are starting to go on sale so maybe Microsoft will start pushing it for the newer games. Even then, they could do like PC games now and have a DVD and HD-DVD verstion of games, one with multi disks and one with a single. (except with PC it's CD and DVD, but whatev)
This is possible on the Playstation 3 (In fact, its already happening, some games, such as Ninja Gaiden Sigma and Resistance fall of man are already installing a part of the game on the Hard drive to reduce loading times), but it wouldn't be possible on the Xbox360 because not every Xbox360 has a hard drive.
I think it would be possible. You would just have to put a requirement similar to a PC. For instance Windows Vista required. You just slap hard drive required on the back of the box. Who would get an xbox360 without a hard drive anyway? The memory card cost 30-40 dollars. The hard drive costs 100-160 dollars. The core system really makes no sense at all to buy since you can't use xbox live for anything. The core system must be there to entice people of lesser intelligence to buy the system after which they will realize they need a hard drive and spend another 100 dollars.
This is possible on the Playstation 3 (In fact, its already happening, some games, such as Ninja Gaiden Sigma and Resistance fall of man are already installing a part of the game on the Hard drive to reduce loading times), but it wouldn't be possible on the Xbox360 because not every Xbox360 has a hard drive.
Of course it doesn't matter if PS3 has it as well because the fact that it can be done negates one of the advantages of the blu ray and having higher capacity.
Currently playing:
LOTRO & WoW (not much WoW though because Mines of Moria rocks!!!!)
Looking Foward too:
Bioware games (Dragon Age & Star Wars The Old Republic)
Honestly WTF, what do you think would hurt a company more day/night cycles in a game or a console that costs hundreds of more dolars?
When the new system come out im sure it will have more storage space around the time when its needed.......
If only i could find a troll with a tin foil hat. =(
You know, I will agree with you here 100%. Changing a disc really doesn't kill me. I've been doing it for years on my PC and PS2. I will, however, point out that from a "green friendly" standpoint, the less discs pressed the better in my eyes. That's not necessarily a point in my eyes for Blu-ray as it is for larger format discs. In truth, Dual Layer HD-DVD at 30GB will be fine for a LONG time. I'd just like to see us pumping out as few pieces of plastic as possible.
Oddly enough, the thing *I* have the hardest time with in gaming and retro-gaming isn't the changing disc issue...it's going back to games that had very little, no, or horrible voice acting after playing their suquels that included voice acting (FFX was the beginning for the FF series...and while I LOVE FF1 and 2 on my PSP it sucks going back to all written text. Resident Evil is a series that changed too and don't get me started on playing Metal Gear...yeah...that's right...the old 2d). Totally off-topic, I know, but it seems to be my pet peive with gaming right now.
"What is it I have against Microsoft, you ask? Well, you know how you feel when you wait for an MMO to come out and when it does you feel like you've paid to play it's beta test for another 6-9 months before anything even thinks of working the way it should? Being a network engineer you feel that way about anything Microsoft puts out."
For those that do not yet know, this story was proven to be false. The PGR4 devloper , Bizzare Creations, came out and said that this was not the case and that the story was mainly spread by rumours and fanboys. . .
DVD4Life yo. . .
http://www.bizarrecreations.com/article.php?article_id=5257
Enjoy.
Eternally mine,
Keebs
The MMO gaming blog I write for.