Gianthold, Necropolis, and Desert Oasis are small camping areas or at best perhaps a small village as is the case for Desert Oasis. Just because they added a bank/vendors doesn't change the fact that they are extremely minute in size and explorability when compared to what I was expecting out of this game, or even when compared to the size of Stormreach!! They're really just suburbs of Stormreach that take no actual travel time to get to. I stick by my original comments.
um...tavern, auction house, bank, vendors, mailboxes, quest givers. Yes, smaller than the primary city, but with the exact same amenities.
If you really want to travel around go play another game. For the people who enjoy this game, NOT having to do that is a real benefit.
um...tavern, auction house, bank, vendors, mailboxes, quest givers. Yes, smaller than the primary city, but with the exact same amenities.
If you really want to travel around go play another game. For the people who enjoy this game, NOT having to do that is a real benefit.
btw, I fixed that for you...
Lol, touche....
Having the same amenities of a city without the physical size is like saying New York City and my city (Oshkosh, WI) are the equivalent because they both have a McDonalds and Grocery store.
Stormreach is a very cool city. But in order for this game to be worth 14.99/mo. there needs to be more than just one city to explore. As I said in my original post, the quests were awesome, but they need to become more inventive with quests OUTSIDE of a dungeon setting.
All I have to say, is look at the subscription numbers. If you honestly believe that I'm the only person who left the game due to this issue, you're blind. The subscription numbers spiked when the game was released (as do most games upon release), then slowly declined over the next year, then upon the enhancement changes and the problems they experienced with their WBW's, the numbers dropped like a lead balloon.
If you enjoy the game, that's awesome, I'm not hating on you, or anyone else that actually enjoys this game. In fact, I was an avid supporter of the game for a long time and I still think it's one of the better games out there in terms of character customization and game play. I'm just trying to answer the poll with my opinion and backing it up with information about the game that supports my opinion.
1. Turbine has never released anything, ever on subscription numbers...although I'd agree they dipped from launch, I actually think they've remained steady or even increasing for the last 4-6 months simply based on server pops and playtime.
2. I would LOVE to see another Stormreach sized city in the future...don't get me wrong. My ideal for this, however, would be to do it in a paid expansion complete with significant ad buy.
3. Quests/Dungeon Crawling...here I don't agree so much. I think that the quest immersion and experience in DDO far surpasses the average quest quality of every other MMO on the market currently. Sure, I would love to see more Stormcleave style quests...but also understand that for every Stormcleave the devs create, they probably could have created 5 dungeon crawls.
A friend talked me into buying it and playing with him directly after launch, even though I had vowed not to. I still didn't care for it.
I returned once again early in '07 as I had read about some changes to the game that I thought might make it more palatable. Nope. It was still not fun.
I finally realized that there's something about the combat that irritates me. I still can't put my finger on it exactly, but it's as if the whole system seems good in theory but doesn't pan out in the execution. I think it has to do with the way they've tried to translate the D&D magic and feat systems into online play. Further, the whole resting mechanism is outright annoying.
So no, even though the quests and dungeons are brilliantly designed, I cannot reccomend this game due to sub-par gameplay.
I finally realized that there's something about the combat that irritates me. I still can't put my finger on it exactly, but it's as if the whole system seems good in theory but doesn't pan out in the execution.
LOL...now that's a first. I've yet to hear someone complain about the combat system, short of WoW players who are used to click and forget combat.
in fact, I'd argue that the combat system is 100 times as good as any other MMO out.
I tried the game a while back on a free trial and initially I liked the game, but after a couple of levels you are pretty much forced to group to get through dungeons, unless you play a tank calss then you could probably get through a few more before you have to group. The problem is, is that every dungeon is instanced IIRC and once you complete it there is no reason to go back unless you are close to leveling. So this IMO drives a wedge between the players in that it can be very hard to get help on a mission as in you can stand in the main areas spamming LFG for hours to no avail especially if you are fairly new to the game. So if you have limited time to play the game it can be rough to advance because there is not alot you can do to advance after those first few levels. As said before if you plan on playing either talk a couple of friend into playing or get to know some players so you have someone to group with. Also to me the game felt kind of comfined as in when I tried it all the missions I did were in the city sewers and dungeons so there was really no travel, but keep in mind that I was on the 10 day trial too with semi-limited time to play too. I just found the game not to my tastes.
Originally posted by KohenTrask Also, to the guy above who plays but doesn't think its worth 15 a month...why do you play?
I play because I do like having something to do for a couple of hours every so often & the longer quests are fun. I don't think its worth the 15 dollars simply because only questing and some minor exploration through 'outdoor' areas are not enough to equal 15 dollars to me atleast for 15 dollars in most other games you have other things you can do when you don't feel like questing, grouping, or wandering around. Its great for casual play but for me (being an old schooler with mmos) I do like to have more options on what to do with my game time and I guess its part of the less casual side of my game needs that call for it. But for the time being it serves the purpose of entertaining me when I have free time.
If they had crafting (which D&D PnP does have!) I'd be happier to pay the 15 dollars because it would give me something else to do on days when I don't feel like questing but I still want to be in game to socialize.
If you like a game enough you pay the money required regardless of whether you truely deeply feel its worth it.
BTW I'm not a guy...try using names
Please Refer to Doom Cat with all conspiracies & evil corporation complaints. He'll give you the simple explination of..WE"RE ALL DOOMED!
I finally realized that there's something about the combat that irritates me. I still can't put my finger on it exactly, but it's as if the whole system seems good in theory but doesn't pan out in the execution.
LOL...now that's a first. I've yet to hear someone complain about the combat system, short of WoW players who are used to click and forget combat.
in fact, I'd argue that the combat system is 100 times as good as any other MMO out.
Argue it all you want, but no system with auto-attack is really that great.
Even so, auto-attack is not a complete deal-breaker for me, so there is something else about it that's just not working for me.
(I used to think DDO combat was great, by the way. Only in my last venture into the game did I realize that I only like the system in theory, not in practice.)
I tried the game a while back on a free trial and initially I liked the game, but after a couple of levels you are pretty much forced to group to get through dungeons, unless you play a tank calss then you could probably get through a few more before you have to group. The problem is, is that every dungeon is instanced IIRC and once you complete it there is no reason to go back unless you are close to leveling. So this IMO drives a wedge between the players in that it can be very hard to get help on a mission as in you can stand in the main areas spamming LFG for hours to no avail especially if you are fairly new to the game. So if you have limited time to play the game it can be rough to advance because there is not alot you can do to advance after those first few levels. Also to me the game felt kind of comfined as in when I tried it all the missions I did were in the city sewers and dungeons so there was really no travel, but keep in mind that I was on the 10 day trial too with semi-limited time to play too. I just found the game not to my tastes.
1. Yes, DDO is about grouping...just like D&D. In fact, their entire launch ad campaign was "Friends don't let friends play solo". Even so, now almost every dungeon through 5th level now has a "Solo Setting" for this very reason.
2. You don't "spam LFG"...you're either listed as LFG or not. Regardless, looking at the LFM panel...or actually starting a group...is going to get you a lot further. As to the availability of groups? Not an issue post merge, at all...for any level.
3. The reasons to repeat a quest are favor, doing them solo/normal/hard/elite...if you want to. If you don't, repetition of quests isn't required until you get close to the level cap of 14 in order to get enough exp to level.
4. If you have limited play time and just want to go kill some stuff, get some loot, and get some exp...cool, they now have the Adventure Areas where you can do just that...and don't need a group at all.
5. If you only played quests primarily in the City Sewers you were only playing about the four quests at the lowest of levels (sewer rescue, waterworks, etc.)...and even those are all in different sewers completely.
I guess my biggest gripe with people criticizing DDO for things like "no travel" and "forced grouping" is that it'd be like going to a Mexican Restaurant and complaining you couldn't get spaghetti and meatballs. If you want those things, or PVP and robust crafting...DDO isn't that game. They never claimed to be, they didn't want to be.
Argue it all you want, but no system with auto-attack is really that great.
Even so, auto-attack is not a complete deal-breaker for me, so there is something else about it that's just not working for me. (I used to think DDO combat was great, by the way. Only in my last venture into the game did I realize that I only like the system in theory, not in practice.)
well...I can tell you what wasn't working for you...the fact you were using auto attack LOL!
I don't know a single player that left that on past their first day...
p.s. Once players get past the learning curve of the real time/active combat (and this can often take 8 or 9 levels or more) is when it gets interesting. Learning to actually click attack, swap to block, physically move out of the way of enemy blows, etc. I know I can't find another MMO that lets a rogue backstab with a click, backflip out of the way of the next attack with a different click, and then land a 4 attack combination...with four more clicks...wielding a weapon in each hand.
Argue it all you want, but no system with auto-attack is really that great.
Even so, auto-attack is not a complete deal-breaker for me, so there is something else about it that's just not working for me. (I used to think DDO combat was great, by the way. Only in my last venture into the game did I realize that I only like the system in theory, not in practice.)
well...I can tell you what wasn't working for you...the fact you were using auto attack LOL!
I don't know a single player that left that on past their first day...
p.s. Once players get past the learning curve of the real time/active combat (and this can often take 8 or 9 levels or more) is when it gets interesting. Learning to actually click attack, swap to block, physically move out of the way of enemy blows, etc. I know I can't find another MMO that lets a rogue backstab with a click, backflip out of the way of the next attack with a different click, and then land a 4 attack combination...with four more clicks...wielding a weapon in each hand.
I have to get to level 8 or 9 before it gets interesting? Out of a max level of what, 14?
I have to get to level 8 or 9 before it gets interesting? Out of a max level of what, 14?
You don't see something wrong with this picture?
No...you get have to get past the learning curve. Meaning if you're WoW born and bred and used to completely mindless combat...it may take some time. If you're a moron...it may take some time. It varies from person to person...SOME people may have to earn 8 or 9 levels on their first character before they learn it.
p.s. If you still had on Auto attack after a fair amount of play...well...that may be a whole, new special category...
I cannot imagine having a group of friends on 40 hours a week. That is insane. The great thing about DDO's instance based 'dungeon' world is that it does not require such an investment to have a satisfying experience.
Comments
um...tavern, auction house, bank, vendors, mailboxes, quest givers. Yes, smaller than the primary city, but with the exact same amenities.
If you really want to travel around go play another game. For the people who enjoy this game, NOT having to do that is a real benefit.
btw, I fixed that for you...
Having the same amenities of a city without the physical size is like saying New York City and my city (Oshkosh, WI) are the equivalent because they both have a McDonalds and Grocery store.
Stormreach is a very cool city. But in order for this game to be worth 14.99/mo. there needs to be more than just one city to explore. As I said in my original post, the quests were awesome, but they need to become more inventive with quests OUTSIDE of a dungeon setting.
All I have to say, is look at the subscription numbers. If you honestly believe that I'm the only person who left the game due to this issue, you're blind. The subscription numbers spiked when the game was released (as do most games upon release), then slowly declined over the next year, then upon the enhancement changes and the problems they experienced with their WBW's, the numbers dropped like a lead balloon.
If you enjoy the game, that's awesome, I'm not hating on you, or anyone else that actually enjoys this game. In fact, I was an avid supporter of the game for a long time and I still think it's one of the better games out there in terms of character customization and game play. I'm just trying to answer the poll with my opinion and backing it up with information about the game that supports my opinion.
Well, few things.
1. Turbine has never released anything, ever on subscription numbers...although I'd agree they dipped from launch, I actually think they've remained steady or even increasing for the last 4-6 months simply based on server pops and playtime.
2. I would LOVE to see another Stormreach sized city in the future...don't get me wrong. My ideal for this, however, would be to do it in a paid expansion complete with significant ad buy.
3. Quests/Dungeon Crawling...here I don't agree so much. I think that the quest immersion and experience in DDO far surpasses the average quest quality of every other MMO on the market currently. Sure, I would love to see more Stormcleave style quests...but also understand that for every Stormcleave the devs create, they probably could have created 5 dungeon crawls.
I played beta and didn't care for it.
A friend talked me into buying it and playing with him directly after launch, even though I had vowed not to. I still didn't care for it.
I returned once again early in '07 as I had read about some changes to the game that I thought might make it more palatable. Nope. It was still not fun.
I finally realized that there's something about the combat that irritates me. I still can't put my finger on it exactly, but it's as if the whole system seems good in theory but doesn't pan out in the execution. I think it has to do with the way they've tried to translate the D&D magic and feat systems into online play. Further, the whole resting mechanism is outright annoying.
So no, even though the quests and dungeons are brilliantly designed, I cannot reccomend this game due to sub-par gameplay.
LOL...now that's a first. I've yet to hear someone complain about the combat system, short of WoW players who are used to click and forget combat.
in fact, I'd argue that the combat system is 100 times as good as any other MMO out.
I tried the game a while back on a free trial and initially I liked the game, but after a couple of levels you are pretty much forced to group to get through dungeons, unless you play a tank calss then you could probably get through a few more before you have to group. The problem is, is that every dungeon is instanced IIRC and once you complete it there is no reason to go back unless you are close to leveling. So this IMO drives a wedge between the players in that it can be very hard to get help on a mission as in you can stand in the main areas spamming LFG for hours to no avail especially if you are fairly new to the game. So if you have limited time to play the game it can be rough to advance because there is not alot you can do to advance after those first few levels. As said before if you plan on playing either talk a couple of friend into playing or get to know some players so you have someone to group with. Also to me the game felt kind of comfined as in when I tried it all the missions I did were in the city sewers and dungeons so there was really no travel, but keep in mind that I was on the 10 day trial too with semi-limited time to play too. I just found the game not to my tastes.
If they had crafting (which D&D PnP does have!) I'd be happier to pay the 15 dollars because it would give me something else to do on days when I don't feel like questing but I still want to be in game to socialize.
If you like a game enough you pay the money required regardless of whether you truely deeply feel its worth it.
BTW I'm not a guy...try using names
Please Refer to Doom Cat with all conspiracies & evil corporation complaints. He'll give you the simple explination of..WE"RE ALL DOOMED!
LOL...now that's a first. I've yet to hear someone complain about the combat system, short of WoW players who are used to click and forget combat.
in fact, I'd argue that the combat system is 100 times as good as any other MMO out.
Argue it all you want, but no system with auto-attack is really that great.Even so, auto-attack is not a complete deal-breaker for me, so there is something else about it that's just not working for me.
(I used to think DDO combat was great, by the way. Only in my last venture into the game did I realize that I only like the system in theory, not in practice.)
1. Yes, DDO is about grouping...just like D&D. In fact, their entire launch ad campaign was "Friends don't let friends play solo". Even so, now almost every dungeon through 5th level now has a "Solo Setting" for this very reason.
2. You don't "spam LFG"...you're either listed as LFG or not. Regardless, looking at the LFM panel...or actually starting a group...is going to get you a lot further. As to the availability of groups? Not an issue post merge, at all...for any level.
3. The reasons to repeat a quest are favor, doing them solo/normal/hard/elite...if you want to. If you don't, repetition of quests isn't required until you get close to the level cap of 14 in order to get enough exp to level.
4. If you have limited play time and just want to go kill some stuff, get some loot, and get some exp...cool, they now have the Adventure Areas where you can do just that...and don't need a group at all.
5. If you only played quests primarily in the City Sewers you were only playing about the four quests at the lowest of levels (sewer rescue, waterworks, etc.)...and even those are all in different sewers completely.
I guess my biggest gripe with people criticizing DDO for things like "no travel" and "forced grouping" is that it'd be like going to a Mexican Restaurant and complaining you couldn't get spaghetti and meatballs. If you want those things, or PVP and robust crafting...DDO isn't that game. They never claimed to be, they didn't want to be.
well...I can tell you what wasn't working for you...the fact you were using auto attack LOL!
I don't know a single player that left that on past their first day...
p.s. Once players get past the learning curve of the real time/active combat (and this can often take 8 or 9 levels or more) is when it gets interesting. Learning to actually click attack, swap to block, physically move out of the way of enemy blows, etc. I know I can't find another MMO that lets a rogue backstab with a click, backflip out of the way of the next attack with a different click, and then land a 4 attack combination...with four more clicks...wielding a weapon in each hand.
well...I can tell you what wasn't working for you...the fact you were using auto attack LOL!
I don't know a single player that left that on past their first day...
p.s. Once players get past the learning curve of the real time/active combat (and this can often take 8 or 9 levels or more) is when it gets interesting. Learning to actually click attack, swap to block, physically move out of the way of enemy blows, etc. I know I can't find another MMO that lets a rogue backstab with a click, backflip out of the way of the next attack with a different click, and then land a 4 attack combination...with four more clicks...wielding a weapon in each hand.
I have to get to level 8 or 9 before it gets interesting? Out of a max level of what, 14?You don't see something wrong with this picture?
No...you get have to get past the learning curve. Meaning if you're WoW born and bred and used to completely mindless combat...it may take some time. If you're a moron...it may take some time. It varies from person to person...SOME people may have to earn 8 or 9 levels on their first character before they learn it.
p.s. If you still had on Auto attack after a fair amount of play...well...that may be a whole, new special category...
TOEE was off the charts good. Right up there on top10 of all time.
It wasnt as good as baulders gate, but it was still great.
I cannot imagine having a group of friends on 40 hours a week. That is insane. The great thing about DDO's instance based 'dungeon' world is that it does not require such an investment to have a satisfying experience.