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Are " dynamic " Control Points also instanced / is TR fake ? (YES)
Longd0ngjoe
Member Posts: 18
Hello 
One of the main aspects, that tabula rasa is promoted for, are those dynamic battles for control points.Richard Garriot said iirc something like : You never know how the world looks the next day you log back in, meaning that the bane can take back control points. At those control points are often shops, quest givers and more if i understood corectly.
However, I read quite alot about Tabula Rasa and read contrary informations about instancing. And i read the information that the outdoor maps are also instanced.
If this is true, tabula rasa would be fake, simple and plain. Control point taken, quest npcs gone ? No Problem, i just relog to another instance of the map ? 
Please tell me that this is not true , i would really like to play a new good scifi mmo 
Thank you if you take a moment and explain this to me.
Edit: For those who don't want to read the whole thread: The outside world of TR is also instanced. It seems that if one instance is filled with a certain Nr. of people another one opens.
This means, if you control a base in " your world ", its just fake because if you switch to another copy ( instance ) it might be taken by the bane.
Comments
The way you put it is kinda confusing, but I think I deciphered it. You're saying, "if there's multiple instances of a zone, then it's meaningless to have captured control points on one instance because it wouldn't be captured on other instances and therefore fake." I can see your logic here. I don't entirely agree with it because, in execution, I've still found it quite meaningful to have captured the control points of certain instances. All the instancing seems to have done is provide more opportunity to impact the game world by taking a specific copy of the control point.
However, I'm going to instead say, "They are and they're not." Here is why:
Currently, only Wilderness and the Divide have instances. The Wilderness has 10 and the Divide has 4. After that, it's looking pretty much like there's only one instance of each Battlezone. Will that dynamically adjust as player count increases? I don't know... but it's funny the numbers have stayed the same regardless of population over the past week.
On a final point, I must say that your name sucks. Grow the [expletive deleted] up.
Those are not instances, it's more like multiple world maps to combat LAG...An instance is for you and your party and no one else..
Currently they do have several maps for the first continent "wilderness" I think they do this to help people that may be getting lag. If your getting lag you can switch to a different map. I cant believe that this would be much of an issue for most folks but at peak times it can get quite busy in the starting zone.
BTW: This game is a blast I left my last game that I was deeply invloved with for over 2 1/2 yrs to go to this and I am not regretting it a single moment. Everyday I can not wait to log on. I recommend this game to everyone I see.
OK , my question is answered. The outdoor maps are also instanced to fight lag and that breaks the immersion to me pesonally. That is what i would call fake, so to speak.
I am going to say "probably". Here's the thing: Since launch, when I looked I see Wilderness has been at 10 instances, Divide has been at 4 instances, and the next zone (and all the other zones) have been at 1 instance. I'm thinking this is probably because there's a dynamic instance adjuster, but from the looks of things, it's also possible that the number of instances has been manually set. I wish I could give you a better answer here, but there you have it.
If it is manually set, then that's interesting, because it could mean that they're going to eventually scale everything back to 1 instance once they decide that the bloat in lower levels is taken care of.
There's one more thing to consider, and that is that there are special instanced zones for just you and your party just like there is in the WoW "(elite)" stuff. However, there's no capture points there - capture points take place on maps where everybody can be.
That is incorrect. The word instance, is to be take literally here, in that there is more than one occurrence, or instance of an area. Lots of games have instances that are accessible to more than a single party. In fact, most of the games that I have played work that way.
-----Zero Punctuation Eve Online Review-----
sounds very similar to guildwars districts and like you said, if you can easily switch between "instances" then yeah the whole CP fight is rather pointless.
No, you are an idiot, that is all but thanks for your reply
To geldonyetich :
Thanks for your answer but
Simple question to get it straight : Is EVERYTHING instanced ? If i understand correctly everything is intanced.
I will use WoW as an example because everyone knows it:
Lets say it like this : If TR was WoW , would Ironforge, Duskwood etc. etc. be instanced t oo ? I read it is and that those maps are limited to 300 players.
Thanks for your time.
I'll just assume that your first language isn't english and let you slide. but you certainly know how resort to personal attacks.
TR isn't "fake". It's a game and it's releaased. Are you asking if the advertising is false? because that's alot different.
No, you are an idiot, that is all but thanks for your reply
To geldonyetich :
Thanks for your answer but
Simple question to get it straight : Is EVERYTHING instanced ? If i understand correctly everything is intanced.
I will use WoW as an example because everyone knows it:
Lets say it like this : If TR was WoW , would Ironforge, Duskwood etc. etc. be instanced t oo ? I read it is and that those maps are limited to 300 players.
Thanks for your time.
I'll just assume that your first language isn't english and let you slide. but you certainly know how resort to personal attacks.
TR isn't "fake". It's a game and it's releaased. Are you asking if the advertising is false? because that's alot different.
Is english your first language? He is attacking that guy because he was being sarcastic and un helpful.His question was, is TR instanced. I.E. If I go to Crossroads and the bane have taken the camp, can I switch instances and turn in my quests instead of fighting. The answer was yes, there are multiple instances. The question remains on whether you can switch or not.
This does break immersion as, your not fighting for your planet, your fighting for planet #1, while planet #2 and 4 are secure, and 3,5,6,7and 8 are over run.
Kind of makes your fight seem meaningless.
Mithrandolir The question is answered by people who were able to undersand my posting.
Thanks for your time.
That is incorrect. The word instance, is to be take literally here, in that there is more than one occurrence, or instance of an area. Lots of games have instances that are accessible to more than a single party. In fact, most of the games that I have played work that way.
I agree. * Nods *
But do you know Anarchy Online for example ? Guilds can build bases there (outdoors, on the world map). And those bases can be attacked by other players. Funcom got a map showing who got which bases on their website.The outside world is not instanced and if you log out and log back the next day, you really dont know how your world ( and not an instance of it ) looks like ! And i love that in theory. However AO has alot other problems hehe.
No, you are an idiot, that is all but thanks for your reply
To geldonyetich :
Thanks for your answer but
Simple question to get it straight : Is EVERYTHING instanced ? If i understand correctly everything is intanced.
I will use WoW as an example because everyone knows it:
Lets say it like this : If TR was WoW , would Ironforge, Duskwood etc. etc. be instanced t oo ? I read it is and that those maps are limited to 300 players.
Thanks for your time.
I'll just assume that your first language isn't english and let you slide. but you certainly know how resort to personal attacks.
TR isn't "fake". It's a game and it's releaased. Are you asking if the advertising is false? because that's alot different.
Is english your first language? He is attacking that guy because he was being sarcastic and un helpful.His question was, is TR instanced. I.E. If I go to Crossroads and the bane have taken the camp, can I switch instances and turn in my quests instead of fighting. The answer was yes, there are multiple instances. The question remains on whether you can switch or not.
This does break immersion as, your not fighting for your planet, your fighting for planet #1, while planet #2 and 4 are secure, and 3,5,6,7and 8 are over run.
Kind of makes your fight seem meaningless.
Exactly, it's instanced all to hell and the control points and other parts of the game that would have an effect on the gameworld in a MMORPG are utterly meaningless when you can just switch instances and the effect is gone.
It's totally immersion breaking.
You might be surprised how significant it still is even with instancing. I get a lot of broadcasts like, "help us defend landing zone 5!" Many players seem to love garrison duty, going across multiple instances just for more action.
No, you are an idiot, that is all but thanks for your reply
To geldonyetich :
Thanks for your answer but
Simple question to get it straight : Is EVERYTHING instanced ? If i understand correctly everything is intanced.
I will use WoW as an example because everyone knows it:
Lets say it like this : If TR was WoW , would Ironforge, Duskwood etc. etc. be instanced t oo ? I read it is and that those maps are limited to 300 players.
Thanks for your time.
I'll just assume that your first language isn't english and let you slide. but you certainly know how resort to personal attacks.
TR isn't "fake". It's a game and it's releaased. Are you asking if the advertising is false? because that's alot different.
Is english your first language? He is attacking that guy because he was being sarcastic and un helpful.His question was, is TR instanced. I.E. If I go to Crossroads and the bane have taken the camp, can I switch instances and turn in my quests instead of fighting. The answer was yes, there are multiple instances. The question remains on whether you can switch or not.
This does break immersion as, your not fighting for your planet, your fighting for planet #1, while planet #2 and 4 are secure, and 3,5,6,7and 8 are over run.
Kind of makes your fight seem meaningless.
Yeah, I was the guy being attacked, see?
The first poster is a she, not a he and she specifically said "If so than TR is fake".
I was joking with my intial reply, if that wasn't painfully obvious than I would like to apologize to the original poster. It was totally tongue in cheek and absolutely playful. The attack back at me was unwarranted in my mind, because I knew that I was kidding. Obviously she didn't know this and therefore I apologize for my second outburst to her as well.
I am pretty sure that only the newbie areas (Wilderness and Divide) are instanced like that with the CP zones.
I appreciate the effort Mith, but it's not worth arguing. If you've got the concept affixed in your brain, "Instancing = Fake" then the argument is already over. If they can't break outside that box, it's game over, and you can't force them out of their boxes, they need to transcend it themselves.
True, but she didn't deserve my response either, especially if she thought it malicious.
You are correct though, you can tell by some of the replies that people are reaching really far to find faults with the game now, almost on a comical level, which is actually a great sign
Anybody playing the game knows how popular it is right now, and how much fun it is as well. And if not, at least they came to those conclusions based on personal experience.
No, thats not how it is. Getting past the first continent, there are not "instances". There is only one selectable server. And you do have to actively recapture Control Points. Today I've had to capture the same control point in Incline at least three times to gain access to it .
Only a few zones after wilderness actually have multiple "instances". After that, they are all limited to one.
That's what I meant by "only the newby zones" being instanced like that.
You dont get that last stand mentality or feeling cause... its not your last stand... its last stand #1
If its by design then I retract my former flames and agree its a good deal.
There are a number of instances for each map.
TBH I see this as a good thing. You keep switching instances to fight for more control points, isnt that more fun?
From my beta experience it seems almost as if its one world... but infact I found this instancing GREAT.
That's how it is in the first few zones, because the game just launched and the entire playerbase is focused in the first couple of maps. The further into the game you get, the fewer of those instances there are. My guess is, after the game's been out a few months, there won't be a need for multiple instances. The one danger I see is that, as the playerbase eventually matures into the top levels, the high-end game will become saturated and there won't be any way to avoid opening multiple instances of those top tier maps. If that's the case, then the concerns are well-founded.
That said, I think it only becomes a serious problem if you let it. If you're the type of player who'd switch instances just because it's easier, well...that's on you. I tend to pick a map instance when I log in and stay there until I log out. I don't hop around based on who's in control of what. If it becomes a serious problem as things advance, though, I don't see why they couldn't just add in a "cooldown" timer for instance hopping.
The first few zones are instances simply because the majority of the population is still in there, and alleviate some of the lag.
However, I can not promise that as the population shifts towards high end content, extra severs will be added to the higher end zones.
But as of now, nothing put the first three areas or so have more than one zone.
You dont get that last stand mentality or feeling cause... its not your last stand... its last stand #1
That's true for the first couple of zones, but not past that point. I don;t feel like this takes away from the game at all, especially as you are very much at a "learning curve" point in the game right there, and overcrowding would not be a great thing at that moment.
Do you really think that this is a downside to the game? I'm simply asking you sincerely here. Once you are out of the newbie zones, this goes away as far as I know. (Newbie zone being Wilderness and divide)
I never saw any instances of higher level areas in beta, although I didn't get much past the mid 20's with any characters, so you may very well have more experience with this than myself.