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So, I'm just checking in after a few months away, Do they have a worldbuilding MMO yet?
Denikin
Member Posts: 39
You know what I mean, crafting, cutting down trees, building towns, developing economies, meaningful PVP?
Basically, what some people call a "sandbox game", and others call a "virtual world"
Now, I assume the answer is still no, but... I figured, I may as well ask every few months, and maybe eventually, the answer will actually be a "yes"
Oh, and before anyone mentions it, Yes, I have tried EVE, it's pretty good, but ultimately not based on a realistic economy (ie, you can survive purely on having a tough ship, and going out and killing things and reprocessing the loot. Now, I have no problem with killing things online, but I'm still holding out for a game where the killing happens in relation to crafting and control of resources)
Comments
Oh, err... I didn't mean to post this in the beta forum. If a moderator can move it to the general forum, that would be great, thanks.
Check out Second Life, if you want a world building scene with the opportunity to make RL money from an inworld economy, and you have some kind of skills, you will do well here.
If by cutting trees, you mean mining and by building towns you mean building stations ... yes. EVE.
I would have said SWG at one point except for the PVP bit. It was there, but meaningful? Not in my opinion.
You want a REAL realistic economy with the ultimate sandbox you may want to look into secondlife if you haven't already, but that's more a virtual world then an mmo.
Only a few mmo's come to mind that work somewhat like this Shadowbane and Anarchy Online, both have battles for land SB has battles for resources. The crafting is pretty much just stockpile and dumb into a merchant and AO's crafting system leaves a lot to be desired. Both are free to play though.
I would like a newer game like those, but that doesn't seem to be happening anytime real soon.
Games Playing: Eve Online
Games Played: Name an MMO yup most likely!
SL bleh, A complete world building MMO, well , I dunno about an ACTUAL MMO with full world building capabilities, but one game thats coming out where you can almost quite literally build your world and play god is Spore. You should take a look at it if you haven't already.
link - City Building and Defense
Yeah, shadowbane was great for it's time.
Lots of flaws, of course, but really, considering that it's... what... 10 years old, it's not bad.
But... 10 years old... So... no...
I guess I can check out second life... I've seen adds for it, but I got the impression that
A) it was more of a design your own objects and whatnot kind of thing, as opposed to a realistic RPG/Simulation game.
The instanced city building areas makes me worry that, once implemented, it'll end up sucking. But, all in all I'm really looking forward to seeing if age of conan manages to come together in the end.
Yes SB is pretty old, but still surprisingly has a following and flow of dedicated players.. and it's free so that helps. Secondlife is A LOT of things... it's hard to put it into words exactly. There are of course like you said sex addicted freaks that like to whack off to pixels on there having sex with eachother, but there are a ton of other things to do.
Granted they just had to get rid of gambling which kinda sucks, but i am sure there's an underground for that going on lol Also CSI just got some sort of thing done inside SL where you can play out your CSI fun! There's an in game RPG called Everdark or something like that lol an MMO inside an MMO quite an interesting concept. Granted it's all based on an old engine and the graphics aren't the best out there muchless physics.
However, in the testing right now is the havok 4 engine so that's not too far off i'd imagine with many improvements to the game.
Granted either you spend real cash or you find a way to earn linden cash which now is boiled down to creating a unique fun game to play or interesting objects to sell etc... easy money is a thing in the past with SL
Games Playing: Eve Online
Games Played: Name an MMO yup most likely!
Now, that's pretty cool.The instanced city building areas makes me worry that, once implemented, it'll end up sucking. But, all in all I'm really looking forward to seeing if age of conan manages to come together in the end.
There are also the Border Kingdom area's where building are made by people, walls put up by people, set out how you like it - similar to SWG. Everything is destructable, Everything is player made - right down to siege weapons. Wood, Stone, Gold etc etc all cab be found for crafting.
You dont just have a couple of building that can be blown up - everything can be, you make your own siege weapons too, they arent just laying around for people to pick up.
PvE cities are instanced based against NPC's - Border Kingdom 'Battlekeeps' are OPEN against anyone during set periods, unlimited people.
Gameplay wise its not a clone unlike some newer releases : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qFMoHGAUhCk
I think there is some weight for SecondLife considering the topic, also there is weight for metaverse upcoming from the mind of Ralph Koster and the talent with who he has surrounded himself. SWG was a good world builder, but the veterans of that game (ie, me) have pretty much done a superb job of making SOE feel like idiots (I know they are not, but the history speaks for itself on that one). There is always Entropia if you are rich and masochistic. It's a really bad bag to pull from at the moment. There are a couple of great games out there (perhaps 5/1000), but world building, or just simply building has been gimped from what I thought it would be by now. The success of WoW has somewhat diminished the ideas of what an MMO should be from 10 to 5 years ago. I am not bashing WoW, but I am bashing the games that felt the need to copy WoW, heck, I should even bash the games that decided to copy L2 for that matter. I nearly beat my head against a wall when I read the latest on Ryzom.
Played (more than a month): SWG, Second Life, Tabula Rasa, Lineage 2, Everquest 2, EvE, MxO, Ryzom.
Tried: WoW, Shadowbane, Anarchy Online, Everquest, WWII Online, Planetside
Beta: Lotro, Tabula Rasa, WAR.
I am waiting for an immersive/freeform MMORPG as well. Age of Conan is looking compelling but areas being instances sounds like it will take away from any immersion or feeling of being in a "virtual world" and instead just another addictive MMO. Maybe it will turn out well - we'll find out at the end of March hopefully.
I'm putting my money on AoC being the next great solution to the OP's search. I know I'm drooling heavily over it.
I guess part of the problem with the world-building thing, is that what with MMOs being really popular, you have to take into account the relative maturity levels of the players.
I mean, a sanbox game really isn't fun if only 10% of the players are interested in building and 90% of the players are interested in knocking stuff down for no better reason then greifing.
So, when you say that people are making clones of WOW, that's true, but I think everyone needs to take the lessons learned from WOW and apply them, even to games of a different nature.
And basically, what that means is that you have to have some system to keep the game running smoothly, otherwise you end up with a really realistic game that's absolutely no fun to play, because of the greifers and people who have no interest in participating in the worldbuilding, but in causing trouble.
Like, the fact that WOW is fun specifically because there is no death penalty, whereas, with the maturity level of WOW players (or MMO players in general nowadays), if there was a real death penalty, nobody would actually play the game cause death happens way too often for absolutely no reason.
So, yeah, you can't have a game where anything really goes. The question is, can anyone design a game where the worldbuilding takes center-stage, but is still fun to play and balanced.
Maybe Age of Conan can do that. They've had to abstact a lot of things sure, but again, it's because they're trying to make a game that's actually playable. The questin is, at the end of the day, will their playable game still be anything like a real world building game?
But EvE online takes forever to get to that point but yes it has allot of what you are looking for.
Playing: Everthing
Played: DAoC,AC2,EvE,SWG,WAR,MXO,CoX,EQ2,L2,LOTRO,SB,UO,WoW.
I have played every MMO that has ever come out.
Try wurm online www.wurmonline it is basicly all building and terraforming land to your likeing and comunity is friendly too.
http://www.speedtest.net/result/3845509852.png
SB came out in March 25, 2003
Playing: Everthing
Played: DAoC,AC2,EvE,SWG,WAR,MXO,CoX,EQ2,L2,LOTRO,SB,UO,WoW.
I have played every MMO that has ever come out.
The buildings and siege weapons in Age of Conan are placed in preset locations, you have some small choices of one preset plot vrs another but more or less its a scripted town. There are a limited number locations where you can build and those locations are always the same. You don't get any of the freedom you had in SWG to place things exactly where you want them, you couldn't just wander into the wilderness and say 'hey, this place looks cool, maybe ill build here'. So unless I was really drunk I wouldn't call it a worldbuilding MMO by any stretch of the imagination. Its more of a step back in mmo evolution in this area.
Now, that's pretty cool.The instanced city building areas makes me worry that, once implemented, it'll end up sucking. But, all in all I'm really looking forward to seeing if age of conan manages to come together in the end.
There are also the Border Kingdom area's where building are made by people, walls put up by people, set out how you like it - similar to SWG. Everything is destructable, Everything is player made - right down to siege weapons. Wood, Stone, Gold etc etc all cab be found for crafting.
You dont just have a couple of building that can be blown up - everything can be, you make your own siege weapons too, they arent just laying around for people to pick up.
PvE cities are instanced based against NPC's - Border Kingdom 'Battlekeeps' are OPEN against anyone during set periods, unlimited people.
Gameplay wise its not a clone unlike some newer releases : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qFMoHGAUhCk
oh yay a post flaming WAR you are so cool..... a clone you say Its mythic their is no cloning there.
Go AoC Fanboi go you i wish i could be just like you.
Do your research.
Oh and ill probaly get banned cause they think i am flaming you! Its okay tho.
Playing: Everthing
Played: DAoC,AC2,EvE,SWG,WAR,MXO,CoX,EQ2,L2,LOTRO,SB,UO,WoW.
I have played every MMO that has ever come out.
Now, that's pretty cool.The instanced city building areas makes me worry that, once implemented, it'll end up sucking. But, all in all I'm really looking forward to seeing if age of conan manages to come together in the end.
There are also the Border Kingdom area's where building are made by people, walls put up by people, set out how you like it - similar to SWG. Everything is destructable, Everything is player made - right down to siege weapons. Wood, Stone, Gold etc etc all cab be found for crafting.
You dont just have a couple of building that can be blown up - everything can be, you make your own siege weapons too, they arent just laying around for people to pick up.
PvE cities are instanced based against NPC's - Border Kingdom 'Battlekeeps' are OPEN against anyone during set periods, unlimited people.
Gameplay wise its not a clone unlike some newer releases : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qFMoHGAUhCk
oh yay a post flaming WAR you are so cool..... a clone you say Its mythic their is no cloning there.
Go AoC Fanboi go you i wish i could be just like you.
Do your research.
Hows it a flame??? Its my opinion that its a clone the proof is in the video for me - dont like then thats your problem. The OP asks about meaningful PvP - war doesnt have that imo - stuff is found laying around on the floor for you to use - nothing meaningful player made - cities are all static - and you have scripted NPC help in PvP with A.I. unknown and not proven yet - game looks like WoW and plays like WoW.
The OP talkes about world building and crafting too - something AoC can offer in a small similar way. The buildings are pretty much just like SWG's way - you can walk into the Border Kingdom and build a guild PvP City anywhere the layout is like SWG's capacity to place too. Economy will be great because crafting is not exp based hence its not a job for life, you progress tiers via 'destiny quests'. creating further meaning for your character in development. I made a suggestion to him. I offered my opinion like everyone else has, im sure the OP can make his own mind up.
Pay the troll no mind lionexx... hes been going from WAR thread to WAR thread for days posting that flame link trying to stir up trouble. Typical behavior for AoC fans. I think hes upset that an AoC beta tester revealed this morning that the game was nothing like what the devs have claimed it to be. All smoke and mirrors. A pity the thread got deleted, a lot of people need to know the real state of the game, not the bullshit that the devs pass unto the community.
And how are you not a troll by baiting??? and posting untrue information - you speak like its factual? obviously you know more.. Look at your post history and tell me you practice what you preach.
The instanced city building areas makes me worry that, once implemented, it'll end up sucking. But, all in all I'm really looking forward to seeing if age of conan manages to come together in the end.
There are also the Border Kingdom area's where building are made by people, walls put up by people, set out how you like it - similar to SWG. Everything is destructable, Everything is player made - right down to siege weapons. Wood, Stone, Gold etc etc all cab be found for crafting.
You dont just have a couple of building that can be blown up - everything can be, you make your own siege weapons too, they arent just laying around for people to pick up.
PvE cities are instanced based against NPC's - Border Kingdom 'Battlekeeps' are OPEN against anyone during set periods, unlimited people.
Gameplay wise its not a clone unlike some newer releases : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qFMoHGAUhCk
oh yay a post flaming WAR you are so cool..... a clone you say Its mythic their is no cloning there.
Go AoC Fanboi go you i wish i could be just like you.
Do your research.
Oh and ill probaly get banned cause they think i am flaming you! Its okay tho.
I had to read through his post three times to find him calling anything a clone. Besides, he put a little comment calling WAR a clone under seven (1,2,3,4,5,6,7) lines of him explaining AoC's system. Yet you put in a whole post dedicated to calling him a flamer, if you don't see the irony there I'm not going to point it out. But to the topic at hand.Let's face it, WAR does share a lot of things with WoW, and the typical defense to this would be either "No it doesn't, it's just different" or "WoW didn't do it first, so there's no copying WoW here". To start with, I may defend AoC a lot, but that's because it takes a pretty bad bashing and I have a tendency to side with the underdog; I'm actually still trying to decide which game I am going to buy, but sticking with my trend of defending AoC whilst attacking the other posters game of choice, here we go.
1) WAR combat, it works, some people like it, and it is exactly like what is in most games (Not a big deal, but I prefer AoC's system). (WoW + 0)
2) WAR quests, same as every other game, with the exceptions being pretty small (public quests [everyone does it at the same time, rewards are modified to meet the difference, biggest stretch from the norm], kill counters [Starts counting from before you start killing], Christmas quests [Just a reward, basically like finding a treasure chest]) (WoW + 0.5)
3) WAR World, split up into sectioned off zones, looks like there will be load times. Actually a step down from WoW in my opinion. Segregated PvP and PvE areas. Linear zone progression (Every other game as well). Etcetera. (WoW - 0.5)
4) WAR PvP, PvP zones, and PvP Battlegrounds (Except with NPC guards). Difference being that you get experience and loot from PvP directly, and pushing control between three zones. (WoW + 1)
5) WAR class customization, decent. Allows for a good amount of difference in tactics, and moral abilities; Outside of that though, there doesn't seem to be any. (WoW + 1)
So this isn't even WoW 2, it's WoW 1.4.
I'll edit in something that goes against AoC or for WAR later, but I have to do something.
Okay, Okay, no need to get too worked up over this stuff.
Just remember, they're only games, and when it comes down to it, none of them are going to be as good as we hope anyway.
As far as WAR is concerned, I'm going to check it out because I'm a Warhammer fan. Even if it's a WOW clone of Warhammer, I won't be disappointed as long as it captures the look and feel of the Warhammer world (which is really no easy task, and which I'm afraid they really won't manage to do)
What I already know is that it isn't going to be a world building game, so I guess I'm looking to AofC for that... even if I don't know if the'll be able to pull it all together in a way that I actually find engaging.
The instanced city building areas makes me worry that, once implemented, it'll end up sucking. But, all in all I'm really looking forward to seeing if age of conan manages to come together in the end.
There are also the Border Kingdom area's where building are made by people, walls put up by people, set out how you like it - similar to SWG. Everything is destructable, Everything is player made - right down to siege weapons. Wood, Stone, Gold etc etc all cab be found for crafting.
You dont just have a couple of building that can be blown up - everything can be, you make your own siege weapons too, they arent just laying around for people to pick up.
PvE cities are instanced based against NPC's - Border Kingdom 'Battlekeeps' are OPEN against anyone during set periods, unlimited people.
Gameplay wise its not a clone unlike some newer releases : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qFMoHGAUhCk
oh yay a post flaming WAR you are so cool..... a clone you say Its mythic their is no cloning there.
Go AoC Fanboi go you i wish i could be just like you.
Do your research.
Hows it a flame??? Its my opinion that its a clone the proof is in the video for me - dont like then thats your problem. The OP asks about meaningful PvP - war doesnt have that imo - stuff is found laying around on the floor for you to use - nothing meaningful player made - cities are all static - and you have scripted NPC help in PvP with A.I. unknown and not proven yet - game looks like WoW and plays like WoW.
The OP talkes about world building and crafting too - something AoC can offer in a small similar way. The buildings are pretty much just like SWG's way - you can walk into the Border Kingdom and build a guild PvP City anywhere the layout is like SWG's capacity to place too. Economy will be great because crafting is not exp based hence its not a job for life, you progress tiers via 'destiny quests'. creating further meaning for your character in development. I made a suggestion to him. I offered my opinion like everyone else has, im sure the OP can make his own mind up.
How does it play like WoW When you have never played WoW.. Like i said do your research the game is not a clone. Have you ever played DAoC? just a random question.
Playing: Everthing
Played: DAoC,AC2,EvE,SWG,WAR,MXO,CoX,EQ2,L2,LOTRO,SB,UO,WoW.
I have played every MMO that has ever come out.
It is a clone. You're kidding yourself if you think it's not.. I have read nothing innovative about Warhammer Online other than the PvP realms, which doesn't look that impressive... far too linear. Oh well have fun.