Plus SOE gives out free "vet trials" about every three months. Plenty of opportunities to play the forum game without paying SOE a penny.
More like every six months (at best). Not that you can trust those vet trials to last as long as they say: I went in for one last month that claimed to be good for 30 days, but it shut down after 5 or 6 days. Maybe it was something (pretty innocuous) I said on the official forums?
Plus SOE gives out free "vet trials" about every three months. Plenty of opportunities to play the forum game without paying SOE a penny.
More like every six months (at best). Not that you can trust those vet trials to last as long as they say: I went in for one last month that claimed to be good for 30 days, but it shut down after 5 or 6 days. Maybe it was something (pretty innocuous) I said on the official forums?
Actually, mine was like clock work.
I had one in Dec. '06, Mar '07, May '07, Sept '07, and that was my last vet trial. I exected one in Dec/Jan but I never got it. I guess they figured 84 days in one year was enough for me.
They don't play for the most part. Sad fact is a good number of them keep the accounts active so they can piss and moan here on the boards while still crying over something that happened over two years ago on various other forums.
The NGE came and went. We're in a new version of the game in all reality. Right or not, no one got "screwed" unless they kept paying for a game they didn't enjoy and then they only one's "screwing" them was themselves.
It happened and it's done with. Move on or leave the game if you are unhappy with it the level most claim to be. The way some people still carry on to this day scares the hell out of me. God help you if something major does happen in your life...
This is going off the deep end? Sounds pretty reasonable, restrained, and accurate to me.
Telling customers to move on or leave the game if you're unhappy is never a good business tactic (nevermind being rude), particularily when it comes from someone who is supposed to be a community leader. Never open the door for a customer to leave.
I don't care really if that senator feels that way, just never say it. Rather, he should be finding ways to encourage you to stay.
He wasn't addressing "customers", he was addressing whiny "vets" who pay for their accounts just so they can bitch, moan, and groan about something that happened over two years ago. The funny part is, they're PAYING to bitch, moan, and groan. Which is cool: SOE gets money, the "vets" get put on /ignore by everyone else, and everyone is happy. Oh, except the "poor vets".
So unless you fit that description, I wouldn't worry.
Hmm, yeah that was out of line. I'll speak to Cigaran about it. Senators aren't allowed to attack players like that, and for what it's worth, I apologise for that post.
To what point.....
1. nothing will be done about it....
2. he will still be a senator...............
3. you will still be banging your head against a wall here, i dont speak for any but my self, ill never go back...
4. tell your masters fool me once shame on you, fool me twice shame on me, fool me three times and well you get the picture....
5. dude we were told to like it or quit, some like my self did try to like it but in the end we quit, we were exspendable and unwanted, no offence but HELL NO ill not let em forget.. it will be a cold day in hell the day i resub........................................................................
6. if the games growing so well now go play with the masses............................. lol
Hmm, yeah that was out of line. I'll speak to Cigaran about it. Senators aren't allowed to attack players like that, and for what it's worth, I apologise for that post.
While I still hate SOE, and all that jazz, I at least applaud you for being forward with an apology and being the first to admit that was wrong.
Perhaps if SOE would follow your line of thinking in regards to the customer...perhaps we'd never have this situation to begin with.
Hmm, yeah that was out of line. I'll speak to Cigaran about it. Senators aren't allowed to attack players like that, and for what it's worth, I apologise for that post.
While I still hate SOE, and all that jazz, I at least applaud you for being forward with an apology and being the first to admit that was wrong.
Perhaps if SOE would follow your line of thinking in regards to the customer...perhaps we'd never have this situation to begin with.
Never happen it would be very cool if it did but i dont see it happening...
They don't play for the most part. Sad fact is a good number of them keep the accounts active so they can piss and moan here on the boards while still crying over something that happened over two years ago on various other forums.
The NGE came and went. We're in a new version of the game in all reality. Right or not, no one got "screwed" unless they kept paying for a game they didn't enjoy and then they only one's "screwing" them was themselves.
It happened and it's done with. Move on or leave the game if you are unhappy with it the level most claim to be. The way some people still carry on to this day scares the hell out of me. God help you if something major does happen in your life...
This is going off the deep end? Sounds pretty reasonable, restrained, and accurate to me.
Telling customers to move on or leave the game if you're unhappy is never a good business tactic (nevermind being rude), particularily when it comes from someone who is supposed to be a community leader. Never open the door for a customer to leave.
I don't care really if that senator feels that way, just never say it. Rather, he should be finding ways to encourage you to stay.
He wasn't addressing "customers", he was addressing whiny "vets" who pay for their accounts just so they can bitch, moan, and groan about something that happened over two years ago. The funny part is, they're PAYING to bitch, moan, and groan. Which is cool: SOE gets money, the "vets" get put on /ignore by everyone else, and everyone is happy. Oh, except the "poor vets".
So unless you fit that description, I wouldn't worry.
Even if they were keeping their account active just to bitch never show your paying customers the door. Find ways to keep them, not piss them off further.
They don't play for the most part. Sad fact is a good number of them keep the accounts active so they can piss and moan here on the boards while still crying over something that happened over two years ago on various other forums.
The NGE came and went. We're in a new version of the game in all reality. Right or not, no one got "screwed" unless they kept paying for a game they didn't enjoy and then they only one's "screwing" them was themselves.
It happened and it's done with. Move on or leave the game if you are unhappy with it the level most claim to be. The way some people still carry on to this day scares the hell out of me. God help you if something major does happen in your life...
This is going off the deep end? Sounds pretty reasonable, restrained, and accurate to me.
Telling customers to move on or leave the game if you're unhappy is never a good business tactic (nevermind being rude), particularily when it comes from someone who is supposed to be a community leader. Never open the door for a customer to leave.
I don't care really if that senator feels that way, just never say it. Rather, he should be finding ways to encourage you to stay.
He wasn't addressing "customers", he was addressing whiny "vets" who pay for their accounts just so they can bitch, moan, and groan about something that happened over two years ago. The funny part is, they're PAYING to bitch, moan, and groan. Which is cool: SOE gets money, the "vets" get put on /ignore by everyone else, and everyone is happy. Oh, except the "poor vets".
So unless you fit that description, I wouldn't worry.
Actually those vets keep getting free trial periods to re-try out the idiotic NGE they don't like (why SOE keeps doing this is beyond me), go on the forums post their displeasure and the quit.
Thus depriving SOE of any cash.
LOL. And the vets don't even need to do this. The vitrolic idiocy of that fourm (which they still allow the PUBLIC to see how bad their community really is) does enough to damage the public persona of SWG better than any other site.
Actually those vets keep getting free trial periods to re-try out the idiotic NGE they don't like (why SOE keeps doing this is beyond me), go on the forums post their displeasure and the quit.
Actually, I don't think you can post under a vet trial anymore. At frst you could, but they soon put a stop to that.
Hmm, yeah that was out of line. I'll speak to Cigaran about it. Senators aren't allowed to attack players like that, and for what it's worth, I apologise for that post.
While I still hate SOE, and all that jazz, I at least applaud you for being forward with an apology and being the first to admit that was wrong.
Perhaps if SOE would follow your line of thinking in regards to the customer...perhaps we'd never have this situation to begin with.
Never happen it would be very cool if it did but i dont see it happening...
I agree.
But we must always remember to congratulate that which is right with the same hand we break down was is bad. Most of us tout the need to "better" the industry by burning SOE alive (which I am one of). However positive reenforcement is also needed to showcase what is done right, and what we find acceptable.
By saying I approve of what Badger said, I show others how best to deal with situations like this in order to please a potential customer. Maybe others will take note of it.
Actually those vets keep getting free trial periods to re-try out the idiotic NGE they don't like (why SOE keeps doing this is beyond me), go on the forums post their displeasure and the quit.
Actually, I don't think you can post under a vet trial anymore. At frst you could, but they soon put a stop to that.
The truth does hurt and that is why SOE would rather not hear it. It is easier to silence the "minority" than to face the reality of how incompetent they are.
Of course you don't want me back. You $OE guys don't want players who demand complex gameplay, content, and a combat system that actually works. You definitely don't want players who laugh at the idea of bauble hunting as contentBauble hunting?, and who want to EARN their Jedi character. You don't want players who enjoy crawling through a nearly impossible NON INSTANCED dungeon like the DWBMate, theres lots of Million HP mobs in here, not to mention the fact that the Debs said the next thing they want to focus on is dungeons that are DWB-style, where you have to use brains to get through and survive,man you have to use your brains in the Heroics trust me, thats another reason why it wouldnt suit you coming back. where you CRAFT (not loot) some of the game's rarest items.Most of the top end loot from instances is crafted, though i would like to see the crafter having to actually go in with the team like the DWB You definitely don't want players who prefer that to a million HP instanced mob.Honestly, how many times have you ignored me proving you completely wrong over this? you have to admit defeat man. Nope, we aren't the players you are looking for. The problem that you have though is that no other players are looking for your game either. There is a glut of simplistic WOW clones out there. True, yours is the only one that has been hosed down with Star Wars juice (sort of), but it's also the least functional and buggiest of all WoW clones out there. Enjoy your existing populations. Don't think of them as low. They are at their peak.you wish They never again will be as high as they are today. A year from now (assuming SWG is still open) you guys will be looking back wistfully at the "huge" numbers you had in early 2008, and wondering how you can get all those people back.Oh, but it though you were sure it was going to shutdown early this year?? thats a surprise. And since they can only add and improve, and going by the trend of increasing population recently, id say there probably will be more people. Fact of the matter is, you guys don't want us back, and never have.Now you get it, so whats with your sig etc and every other post being "we are not coming back for you"? Unless we swallow the NGE as it is, shut up, and don't complain. Wish for that in one hand and crap in the other, and see which piles up first.
No, i dont want players like you who cant (*drumroll* we only say it because its true, not for any otherreason) get over it.
I see the fan bois are at it again.
Saay if you love the game so much what are you doing here wasting your time?
If you truly believe that the current star wars mmo (and I laugh at that term with the population they have) is that good then I wonder what drugs you are on.
I am not a fanboi - please dont label with that on no grounds, just because i tell someone to stop lying.("get over it" really means stop trying to fight this made up war and lying constantly, i 100% understand if you are upset about the NGE [i was at the time])
The "if you love the game so much.." stuff, whats with it? i by no means claim its the best game ever, far from it, but i do enjoy it even if it still needs to carry on improving. Regardless, i dont play MMOs 24/7 and i happened to be on a lunch break at work then so i couldnt exactly play it anyway. Im not wasting my time here, im here to correct and balance as much as possible and to discuss.
Hmm, yeah that was out of line. I'll speak to Cigaran about it. Senators aren't allowed to attack players like that, and for what it's worth, I apologise for that post.
While I still hate SOE, and all that jazz, I at least applaud you for being forward with an apology and being the first to admit that was wrong.
Perhaps if SOE would follow your line of thinking in regards to the customer...perhaps we'd never have this situation to begin with.
Never happen it would be very cool if it did but i dont see it happening...
I agree.
But we must always remember to congratulate that which is right with the same hand we break down was is bad. Most of us tout the need to "better" the industry by burning SOE alive (which I am one of). However positive reenforcement is also needed to showcase what is done right, and what we find acceptable.
By saying I approve of what Badger said, I show others how best to deal with situations like this in order to please a potential customer. Maybe others will take note of it.
I have no problem with that or you doing it but from my years with swg and $oes record all i can say is lol
Of course you don't want me back. You $OE guys don't want players who demand complex gameplay, content, and a combat system that actually works. You definitely don't want players who laugh at the idea of bauble hunting as contentBauble hunting?, and who want to EARN their Jedi character. You don't want players who enjoy crawling through a nearly impossible NON INSTANCED dungeon like the DWBMate, theres lots of Million HP mobs in here, not to mention the fact that the Debs said the next thing they want to focus on is dungeons that are DWB-style, where you have to use brains to get through and survive,man you have to use your brains in the Heroics trust me, thats another reason why it wouldnt suit you coming back. where you CRAFT (not loot) some of the game's rarest items.Most of the top end loot from instances is crafted, though i would like to see the crafter having to actually go in with the team like the DWB You definitely don't want players who prefer that to a million HP instanced mob.Honestly, how many times have you ignored me proving you completely wrong over this? you have to admit defeat man. Nope, we aren't the players you are looking for. The problem that you have though is that no other players are looking for your game either. There is a glut of simplistic WOW clones out there. True, yours is the only one that has been hosed down with Star Wars juice (sort of), but it's also the least functional and buggiest of all WoW clones out there. Enjoy your existing populations. Don't think of them as low. They are at their peak.you wish They never again will be as high as they are today. A year from now (assuming SWG is still open) you guys will be looking back wistfully at the "huge" numbers you had in early 2008, and wondering how you can get all those people back.Oh, but it though you were sure it was going to shutdown early this year?? thats a surprise. And since they can only add and improve, and going by the trend of increasing population recently, id say there probably will be more people. Fact of the matter is, you guys don't want us back, and never have.Now you get it, so whats with your sig etc and every other post being "we are not coming back for you"? Unless we swallow the NGE as it is, shut up, and don't complain. Wish for that in one hand and crap in the other, and see which piles up first.
No, i dont want players like you who cant (*drumroll* we only say it because its true, not for any otherreason) get over it.
I see the fan bois are at it again.
Saay if you love the game so much what are you doing here wasting your time?
If you truly believe that the current star wars mmo (and I laugh at that term with the population they have) is that good then I wonder what drugs you are on.
I am not a fanboi - please dont label with that on no grounds, just because i tell someone to stop lying.("get over it" really means stop trying to fight this made up war and lying constantly, i 100% understand if you are upset about the NGE [i was at the time])
The "if you love the game so much.." stuff, whats with it? i by no means claim its the best game ever, far from it, but i do enjoy it even if it still needs to carry on improving. Regardless, i dont play MMOs 24/7 and i happened to be on a lunch break at work then so i couldnt exactly play it anyway. Im not wasting my time here, im here to correct and balance as much as possible and to discuss.
Dude as far as lying. if you aren't the pot calling the kettle black then lol ...........
Of course you don't want me back. You $OE guys don't want players who demand complex gameplay, content, and a combat system that actually works. You definitely don't want players who laugh at the idea of bauble hunting as contentBauble hunting?, and who want to EARN their Jedi character. You don't want players who enjoy crawling through a nearly impossible NON INSTANCED dungeon like the DWBMate, theres lots of Million HP mobs in here, not to mention the fact that the Debs said the next thing they want to focus on is dungeons that are DWB-style, where you have to use brains to get through and survive,man you have to use your brains in the Heroics trust me, thats another reason why it wouldnt suit you coming back. where you CRAFT (not loot) some of the game's rarest items.Most of the top end loot from instances is crafted, though i would like to see the crafter having to actually go in with the team like the DWB You definitely don't want players who prefer that to a million HP instanced mob.Honestly, how many times have you ignored me proving you completely wrong over this? you have to admit defeat man. Nope, we aren't the players you are looking for. The problem that you have though is that no other players are looking for your game either. There is a glut of simplistic WOW clones out there. True, yours is the only one that has been hosed down with Star Wars juice (sort of), but it's also the least functional and buggiest of all WoW clones out there. Enjoy your existing populations. Don't think of them as low. They are at their peak.you wish They never again will be as high as they are today. A year from now (assuming SWG is still open) you guys will be looking back wistfully at the "huge" numbers you had in early 2008, and wondering how you can get all those people back.Oh, but it though you were sure it was going to shutdown early this year?? thats a surprise. And since they can only add and improve, and going by the trend of increasing population recently, id say there probably will be more people. Fact of the matter is, you guys don't want us back, and never have.Now you get it, so whats with your sig etc and every other post being "we are not coming back for you"? Unless we swallow the NGE as it is, shut up, and don't complain. Wish for that in one hand and crap in the other, and see which piles up first.
No, i dont want players like you who cant (*drumroll* we only say it because its true, not for any otherreason) get over it.
I see the fan bois are at it again.
Saay if you love the game so much what are you doing here wasting your time?
If you truly believe that the current star wars mmo (and I laugh at that term with the population they have) is that good then I wonder what drugs you are on.
I am not a fanboi - please dont label with that on no grounds, just because i tell someone to stop lying.("get over it" really means stop trying to fight this made up war and lying constantly, i 100% understand if you are upset about the NGE [i was at the time])
The "if you love the game so much.." stuff, whats with it? i by no means claim its the best game ever, far from it, but i do enjoy it even if it still needs to carry on improving. Regardless, i dont play MMOs 24/7 and i happened to be on a lunch break at work then so i couldnt exactly play it anyway. Im not wasting my time here, im here to correct and balance as much as possible and to discuss.
you are not a fanboi saay you are a fanbot. you say the same thing over and over again about swg nge that it is good. you lie and tell people who have never played the game that it is good and that $OE has done a good job with the game.
and if you love the game so much you would be wanting the pre-cu back as well. and once we get that back or a shutdown then the people who really do care about the game will be happy.
"The nonstop crying over who was getting what and the temper tantrums that where thrown over not getting a Racial Respec was what killed off Origins. The community has themselves to thank for that one."
I just love how the senators foster a sense of community in the NGE. It's a beautiful thing to see...
Sure, berate the few who still pay for this dead horse. Actually beyond dead, it's stinking so bad the flies aren't interested anymore.
This is why Badgerbanger doesn't stand out so much any more, over time, the "senate" has been filled to overflowing with people who will support anything SOE does. Not even the ones who's professions are being destroyed by the current "revamp" cycle are standing up for themselves.
"The nonstop crying over who was getting what and the temper tantrums that where thrown over not getting a Racial Respec was what killed off Origins. The community has themselves to thank for that one."
I just love how the senators foster a sense of community in the NGE. It's a beautiful thing to see...
The senator program is a farce. Fanbois in need of constant validation from $OE and are happy to spout the company line at every opportunity. It has no need of independent thinkers that value quality and ethics. A parrot would do the job as well, and at least show respect to the paying players, even if they are (and rightfully so) vocally dissatisfied.
The NGE came and went. We're in a new version of the game in all reality. Right or not, no one got "screwed" unless they kept paying for a game they didn't enjoy and then they only one's "screwing" them was themselves.
I love that line. Fact of the matter though is that we did pay, more people paid for a few years before the NGE for a game we all very much enjoyed.....then they changed it, changed it to something a lot less people pay for and now they said we screw ourselves?
Not to mention that $OE NGE'd the game and refused to refund the remaining months people had remaining on their subscriptions. Those people were certainly "screwed".
If $OE had screwed me out of $100+ per acct, and that happened to several guildmates of mine, I'd be holding a bigger grudge than I am now. Those other people had BOTH their game taken away from them and no refund on their remaining time (which was a HUGE PR mistake, among many, that $OE has made).
I was one of those in that camp. I paid for one year at a time every year since the game launched. And I did the same in July of 2005. So when November came and the NGE was spewed onto my lap, I found myself stuck with 8 months remaining on for two accounts.
SOE refused to refund my two accounts and the remaining 8 months. I also didnt qualify for the expansion refund (which had strict requirements) for both accounts. SOE stole $250 from me.
And lets not forget they also took our subscription money for several months and used it to build the NGE engine. While they lied to our faces on the forums about fixes and revamps coming for our professions, they used our money for an entirely new game. The NGE was in the works BEFORE Smedley's statement that the CU was here to say.....LIER. Thats another 6 months or $90 stolen from me.
I'll certainly come back to SWG right after they send me a check for $340, fire Smedley, and apologize for lying and stealing my money.
This looks like a lesson in life, if nothing else. You chose to pay for a 1 year sub to an
EVER CHANGING ENVIROMENT.
All MMORPG's clearly state, whether it be in the TOS, EULA or on the loading splash screen, that the game is liable to change. When you people finally come to the realisation that no matter how big a fan of the genre or licence, Star Wars in this case, you do not have ANY ownership of it. You have no say in the future direction chosen by the owners of that game. You pay to make use of the SERVICE they provide.
The only case of any "theft" I can see is the possible fraudulant sale of the expansion packs that became almost redundant within weeks of release, hence the refunds. If you failed to meet the criteria for eligibility, I do not know what these were, then that's a matter for you and SOE.
They did not "steal $90" from you or anyone else for that matter by allegedly using that money to develop changes and content you dislike, any more than Macdonalds would be stealing my money if they used it to change the recipie of their hamburgers.
But...but...what if you paid upfront for a years worth of burgers?!?!?!?oneone... Well, Macdonalds would have done exactly what MMORPGS do, warn you that the recipie can change at any point!
I played SWG at release, I enjoyed it for a while. The powers that be felt that their game needed changing, they did it. The only ones to have any cause for grief are they, and they alone.
If you ever needed proof that the "senators" are nothing but yes-men...
Here's the text of the message since he's already edited it:
They don't play for the most part. Sad fact is a good number of them keep the accounts active so they can piss and moan here on the boards while still crying over something that happened over two years ago on various other forums.
The NGE came and went. We're in a new version of the game in all reality. Right or not, no one got "screwed" unless they kept paying for a game they didn't enjoy and then they only one's "screwing" them was themselves.
It happened and it's done with. Move on or leave the game if you are unhappy with it the level most claim to be. The way some people still carry on to this day scares the hell out of me. God help you if something major does happen in your life...
Originally posted by nikoliath Originally posted by admriker4 Originally posted by Burntvet Originally posted by rashhero The NGE came and went. We're in a new version of the game in all reality. Right or not, no one got "screwed" unless they kept paying for a game they didn't enjoy and then they only one's "screwing" them was themselves.
I love that line. Fact of the matter though is that we did pay, more people paid for a few years before the NGE for a game we all very much enjoyed.....then they changed it, changed it to something a lot less people pay for and now they said we screw ourselves?
Not to mention that $OE NGE'd the game and refused to refund the remaining months people had remaining on their subscriptions. Those people were certainly "screwed". If $OE had screwed me out of $100+ per acct, and that happened to several guildmates of mine, I'd be holding a bigger grudge than I am now. Those other people had BOTH their game taken away from them and no refund on their remaining time (which was a HUGE PR mistake, among many, that $OE has made).
I was one of those in that camp. I paid for one year at a time every year since the game launched. And I did the same in July of 2005. So when November came and the NGE was spewed onto my lap, I found myself stuck with 8 months remaining on for two accounts. SOE refused to refund my two accounts and the remaining 8 months. I also didnt qualify for the expansion refund (which had strict requirements) for both accounts. SOE stole $250 from me. And lets not forget they also took our subscription money for several months and used it to build the NGE engine. While they lied to our faces on the forums about fixes and revamps coming for our professions, they used our money for an entirely new game. The NGE was in the works BEFORE Smedley's statement that the CU was here to say.....LIER. Thats another 6 months or $90 stolen from me. I'll certainly come back to SWG right after they send me a check for $340, fire Smedley, and apologize for lying and stealing my money. This looks like a lesson in life, if nothing else. You chose to pay for a 1 year sub to an
EVER CHANGING ENVIROMENT.
All MMORPG's clearly state, whether it be in the TOS, EULA or on the loading splash screen, that the game is liable to change. When you people finally come to the realisation that no matter how big a fan of the genre or licence, Star Wars in this case, you do not have ANY ownership of it. You have no say in the future direction chosen by the owners of that game. You pay to make use of the SERVICE they provide. The only case of any "theft" I can see is the possible fraudulant sale of the expansion packs that became almost redundant within weeks of release, hence the refunds. If you failed to meet the criteria for eligibility, I do not know what these were, then that's a matter for you and SOE.
They did not "steal $90" from you or anyone else for that matter by allegedly using that money to develop changes and content you dislike, any more than Macdonalds would be stealing my money if they used it to change the recipie of their hamburgers. But...but...what if you paid upfront for a years worth of burgers?!?!?!?oneone... Well, Macdonalds would have done exactly what MMORPGS do, warn you that the recipie can change at any point!
I played SWG at release, I enjoyed it for a while. The powers that be felt that their game needed changing, they did it. The only ones to have any cause for grief are they, and they alone.
The EULA, as a non-negotiated contract between parties, only goes up to what would be a reasonable person's expectations about changes. It is impossible to defend that the NGE was within a reasonable person's standard.
The NGE came and went. We're in a new version of the game in all reality. Right or not, no one got "screwed" unless they kept paying for a game they didn't enjoy and then they only one's "screwing" them was themselves.
I love that line. Fact of the matter though is that we did pay, more people paid for a few years before the NGE for a game we all very much enjoyed.....then they changed it, changed it to something a lot less people pay for and now they said we screw ourselves?
Not to mention that $OE NGE'd the game and refused to refund the remaining months people had remaining on their subscriptions. Those people were certainly "screwed".
If $OE had screwed me out of $100+ per acct, and that happened to several guildmates of mine, I'd be holding a bigger grudge than I am now. Those other people had BOTH their game taken away from them and no refund on their remaining time (which was a HUGE PR mistake, among many, that $OE has made).
I was one of those in that camp. I paid for one year at a time every year since the game launched. And I did the same in July of 2005. So when November came and the NGE was spewed onto my lap, I found myself stuck with 8 months remaining on for two accounts.
SOE refused to refund my two accounts and the remaining 8 months. I also didnt qualify for the expansion refund (which had strict requirements) for both accounts. SOE stole $250 from me.
And lets not forget they also took our subscription money for several months and used it to build the NGE engine. While they lied to our faces on the forums about fixes and revamps coming for our professions, they used our money for an entirely new game. The NGE was in the works BEFORE Smedley's statement that the CU was here to say.....LIER. Thats another 6 months or $90 stolen from me.
I'll certainly come back to SWG right after they send me a check for $340, fire Smedley, and apologize for lying and stealing my money.
This looks like a lesson in life, if nothing else. You chose to pay for a 1 year sub to an
EVER CHANGING ENVIROMENT.
All MMORPG's clearly state, whether it be in the TOS, EULA or on the loading splash screen, that the game is liable to change. When you people finally come to the realisation that no matter how big a fan of the genre or licence, Star Wars in this case, you do not have ANY ownership of it. You have no say in the future direction chosen by the owners of that game. You pay to make use of the SERVICE they provide.
The only case of any "theft" I can see is the possible fraudulant sale of the expansion packs that became almost redundant within weeks of release, hence the refunds. If you failed to meet the criteria for eligibility, I do not know what these were, then that's a matter for you and SOE.
They did not "steal $90" from you or anyone else for that matter by allegedly using that money to develop changes and content you dislike, any more than Macdonalds would be stealing my money if they used it to change the recipie of their hamburgers.
But...but...what if you paid upfront for a years worth of burgers?!?!?!?oneone... Well, Macdonalds would have done exactly what MMORPGS do, warn you that the recipie can change at any point!
I played SWG at release, I enjoyed it for a while. The powers that be felt that their game needed changing, they did it. The only ones to have any cause for grief are they, and they alone.
The EULA, as a non-negotiated contract between parties, only goes up to what would be a reasonable person's expectations about changes. It is impossible to defend that the NGE was within a reasonable person's standard.
My thoughts are similar to Fishers. From another thread:
"You understand that we may update or otherwise enhance the Game and/or the Software at any time..."
This has been quoted to justify the NGE, among other things.
I ask you if any reasonable person would interpret the following actions of SOE as examples of updating or enhancing the game:
deletion of over 20 professions,
rendering people completely unable to move or chat,
making heal abilities heal enemies,
advertising and selling items and features in an expansion, and then announcing their deletion the day after payment was received--fraud allegation,
rendering people unable to interact with virtual pets,
deletion of in some cases two years worth of quest progress, along with deletion of the quest content from the game,
rendering items in the previous paid for expansion, Rage of the Wookies, relatively useless by deleting the professions they were made for."
Now about the hamburger example. If a restaurant sold tickets for a roast beef dinner, you bought a ticket, and then after you paid for it you were given a spinach salad and told to eat it or leave, people would get all their money back and the restaurant could be charged with fraud. People that paid for roast beef would be right to be irate seeing the money they spent being used to feed someone else salad. Your hambuger example misses this point entirely.
Comments
More like every six months (at best). Not that you can trust those vet trials to last as long as they say: I went in for one last month that claimed to be good for 30 days, but it shut down after 5 or 6 days. Maybe it was something (pretty innocuous) I said on the official forums?
More like every six months (at best). Not that you can trust those vet trials to last as long as they say: I went in for one last month that claimed to be good for 30 days, but it shut down after 5 or 6 days. Maybe it was something (pretty innocuous) I said on the official forums?
Actually, mine was like clock work.
I had one in Dec. '06, Mar '07, May '07, Sept '07, and that was my last vet trial. I exected one in Dec/Jan but I never got it. I guess they figured 84 days in one year was enough for me.
This is going off the deep end? Sounds pretty reasonable, restrained, and accurate to me.
Telling customers to move on or leave the game if you're unhappy is never a good business tactic (nevermind being rude), particularily when it comes from someone who is supposed to be a community leader. Never open the door for a customer to leave.
I don't care really if that senator feels that way, just never say it. Rather, he should be finding ways to encourage you to stay.
He wasn't addressing "customers", he was addressing whiny "vets" who pay for their accounts just so they can bitch, moan, and groan about something that happened over two years ago. The funny part is, they're PAYING to bitch, moan, and groan. Which is cool: SOE gets money, the "vets" get put on /ignore by everyone else, and everyone is happy. Oh, except the "poor vets".
So unless you fit that description, I wouldn't worry.
1. nothing will be done about it....
2. he will still be a senator...............
3. you will still be banging your head against a wall here, i dont speak for any but my self, ill never go back...
4. tell your masters fool me once shame on you, fool me twice shame on me, fool me three times and well you get the picture....
5. dude we were told to like it or quit, some like my self did try to like it but in the end we quit, we were exspendable and unwanted, no offence but HELL NO ill not let em forget.. it will be a cold day in hell the day i resub........................................................................
6. if the games growing so well now go play with the masses............................. lol
While I still hate SOE, and all that jazz, I at least applaud you for being forward with an apology and being the first to admit that was wrong.
Perhaps if SOE would follow your line of thinking in regards to the customer...perhaps we'd never have this situation to begin with.
While I still hate SOE, and all that jazz, I at least applaud you for being forward with an apology and being the first to admit that was wrong.
Perhaps if SOE would follow your line of thinking in regards to the customer...perhaps we'd never have this situation to begin with.
Never happen it would be very cool if it did but i dont see it happening...
This is going off the deep end? Sounds pretty reasonable, restrained, and accurate to me.
Telling customers to move on or leave the game if you're unhappy is never a good business tactic (nevermind being rude), particularily when it comes from someone who is supposed to be a community leader. Never open the door for a customer to leave.
I don't care really if that senator feels that way, just never say it. Rather, he should be finding ways to encourage you to stay.
He wasn't addressing "customers", he was addressing whiny "vets" who pay for their accounts just so they can bitch, moan, and groan about something that happened over two years ago. The funny part is, they're PAYING to bitch, moan, and groan. Which is cool: SOE gets money, the "vets" get put on /ignore by everyone else, and everyone is happy. Oh, except the "poor vets".
So unless you fit that description, I wouldn't worry.
Even if they were keeping their account active just to bitch never show your paying customers the door. Find ways to keep them, not piss them off further.
This is going off the deep end? Sounds pretty reasonable, restrained, and accurate to me.
Telling customers to move on or leave the game if you're unhappy is never a good business tactic (nevermind being rude), particularily when it comes from someone who is supposed to be a community leader. Never open the door for a customer to leave.
I don't care really if that senator feels that way, just never say it. Rather, he should be finding ways to encourage you to stay.
He wasn't addressing "customers", he was addressing whiny "vets" who pay for their accounts just so they can bitch, moan, and groan about something that happened over two years ago. The funny part is, they're PAYING to bitch, moan, and groan. Which is cool: SOE gets money, the "vets" get put on /ignore by everyone else, and everyone is happy. Oh, except the "poor vets".
So unless you fit that description, I wouldn't worry.
Actually those vets keep getting free trial periods to re-try out the idiotic NGE they don't like (why SOE keeps doing this is beyond me), go on the forums post their displeasure and the quit.
Thus depriving SOE of any cash.
LOL. And the vets don't even need to do this. The vitrolic idiocy of that fourm (which they still allow the PUBLIC to see how bad their community really is) does enough to damage the public persona of SWG better than any other site.
Actually, I don't think you can post under a vet trial anymore. At frst you could, but they soon put a stop to that.
While I still hate SOE, and all that jazz, I at least applaud you for being forward with an apology and being the first to admit that was wrong.
Perhaps if SOE would follow your line of thinking in regards to the customer...perhaps we'd never have this situation to begin with.
Never happen it would be very cool if it did but i dont see it happening...
I agree.
But we must always remember to congratulate that which is right with the same hand we break down was is bad. Most of us tout the need to "better" the industry by burning SOE alive (which I am one of). However positive reenforcement is also needed to showcase what is done right, and what we find acceptable.
By saying I approve of what Badger said, I show others how best to deal with situations like this in order to please a potential customer. Maybe others will take note of it.
Actually, I don't think you can post under a vet trial anymore. At frst you could, but they soon put a stop to that.
The truth does hurt and that is why SOE would rather not hear it. It is easier to silence the "minority" than to face the reality of how incompetent they are.
No, i dont want players like you who cant (*drumroll* we only say it because its true, not for any otherreason) get over it.
I see the fan bois are at it again.Saay if you love the game so much what are you doing here wasting your time?
If you truly believe that the current star wars mmo (and I laugh at that term with the population they have) is that good then I wonder what drugs you are on.
I am not a fanboi - please dont label with that on no grounds, just because i tell someone to stop lying.("get over it" really means stop trying to fight this made up war and lying constantly, i 100% understand if you are upset about the NGE [i was at the time])The "if you love the game so much.." stuff, whats with it? i by no means claim its the best game ever, far from it, but i do enjoy it even if it still needs to carry on improving. Regardless, i dont play MMOs 24/7 and i happened to be on a lunch break at work then so i couldnt exactly play it anyway. Im not wasting my time here, im here to correct and balance as much as possible and to discuss.
While I still hate SOE, and all that jazz, I at least applaud you for being forward with an apology and being the first to admit that was wrong.
Perhaps if SOE would follow your line of thinking in regards to the customer...perhaps we'd never have this situation to begin with.
Never happen it would be very cool if it did but i dont see it happening...
I agree.
But we must always remember to congratulate that which is right with the same hand we break down was is bad. Most of us tout the need to "better" the industry by burning SOE alive (which I am one of). However positive reenforcement is also needed to showcase what is done right, and what we find acceptable.
By saying I approve of what Badger said, I show others how best to deal with situations like this in order to please a potential customer. Maybe others will take note of it.
I have no problem with that or you doing it but from my years with swg and $oes record all i can say is lol
No, i dont want players like you who cant (*drumroll* we only say it because its true, not for any otherreason) get over it.
I see the fan bois are at it again.Saay if you love the game so much what are you doing here wasting your time?
If you truly believe that the current star wars mmo (and I laugh at that term with the population they have) is that good then I wonder what drugs you are on.
I am not a fanboi - please dont label with that on no grounds, just because i tell someone to stop lying.("get over it" really means stop trying to fight this made up war and lying constantly, i 100% understand if you are upset about the NGE [i was at the time])The "if you love the game so much.." stuff, whats with it? i by no means claim its the best game ever, far from it, but i do enjoy it even if it still needs to carry on improving. Regardless, i dont play MMOs 24/7 and i happened to be on a lunch break at work then so i couldnt exactly play it anyway. Im not wasting my time here, im here to correct and balance as much as possible and to discuss.
Dude as far as lying. if you aren't the pot calling the kettle black then lol ...........
No, i dont want players like you who cant (*drumroll* we only say it because its true, not for any otherreason) get over it.
I see the fan bois are at it again.Saay if you love the game so much what are you doing here wasting your time?
If you truly believe that the current star wars mmo (and I laugh at that term with the population they have) is that good then I wonder what drugs you are on.
I am not a fanboi - please dont label with that on no grounds, just because i tell someone to stop lying.("get over it" really means stop trying to fight this made up war and lying constantly, i 100% understand if you are upset about the NGE [i was at the time])The "if you love the game so much.." stuff, whats with it? i by no means claim its the best game ever, far from it, but i do enjoy it even if it still needs to carry on improving. Regardless, i dont play MMOs 24/7 and i happened to be on a lunch break at work then so i couldnt exactly play it anyway. Im not wasting my time here, im here to correct and balance as much as possible and to discuss.
you are not a fanboi saay you are a fanbot. you say the same thing over and over again about swg nge that it is good. you lie and tell people who have never played the game that it is good and that $OE has done a good job with the game.and if you love the game so much you would be wanting the pre-cu back as well. and once we get that back or a shutdown then the people who really do care about the game will be happy.
Senator Cigaran strikes again!
http://forums.station.sony.com/swg/posts/preList.m?topic_id=649264&post_id=7077506
"The nonstop crying over who was getting what and the temper tantrums that where thrown over not getting a Racial Respec was what killed off Origins. The community has themselves to thank for that one."
I just love how the senators foster a sense of community in the NGE. It's a beautiful thing to see...
"Senator" = "Superfanboi".
Sure, berate the few who still pay for this dead horse. Actually beyond dead, it's stinking so bad the flies aren't interested anymore.
This is why Badgerbanger doesn't stand out so much any more, over time, the "senate" has been filled to overflowing with people who will support anything SOE does. Not even the ones who's professions are being destroyed by the current "revamp" cycle are standing up for themselves.
The senator program is a farce. Fanbois in need of constant validation from $OE and are happy to spout the company line at every opportunity. It has no need of independent thinkers that value quality and ethics. A parrot would do the job as well, and at least show respect to the paying players, even if they are (and rightfully so) vocally dissatisfied.
Not to mention that $OE NGE'd the game and refused to refund the remaining months people had remaining on their subscriptions. Those people were certainly "screwed".
If $OE had screwed me out of $100+ per acct, and that happened to several guildmates of mine, I'd be holding a bigger grudge than I am now. Those other people had BOTH their game taken away from them and no refund on their remaining time (which was a HUGE PR mistake, among many, that $OE has made).
I was one of those in that camp. I paid for one year at a time every year since the game launched. And I did the same in July of 2005. So when November came and the NGE was spewed onto my lap, I found myself stuck with 8 months remaining on for two accounts.
SOE refused to refund my two accounts and the remaining 8 months. I also didnt qualify for the expansion refund (which had strict requirements) for both accounts. SOE stole $250 from me.
And lets not forget they also took our subscription money for several months and used it to build the NGE engine. While they lied to our faces on the forums about fixes and revamps coming for our professions, they used our money for an entirely new game. The NGE was in the works BEFORE Smedley's statement that the CU was here to say.....LIER. Thats another 6 months or $90 stolen from me.
I'll certainly come back to SWG right after they send me a check for $340, fire Smedley, and apologize for lying and stealing my money.
This looks like a lesson in life, if nothing else. You chose to pay for a 1 year sub to an
EVER CHANGING ENVIROMENT.
All MMORPG's clearly state, whether it be in the TOS, EULA or on the loading splash screen, that the game is liable to change. When you people finally come to the realisation that no matter how big a fan of the genre or licence, Star Wars in this case, you do not have ANY ownership of it. You have no say in the future direction chosen by the owners of that game. You pay to make use of the SERVICE they provide.
The only case of any "theft" I can see is the possible fraudulant sale of the expansion packs that became almost redundant within weeks of release, hence the refunds. If you failed to meet the criteria for eligibility, I do not know what these were, then that's a matter for you and SOE.
They did not "steal $90" from you or anyone else for that matter by allegedly using that money to develop changes and content you dislike, any more than Macdonalds would be stealing my money if they used it to change the recipie of their hamburgers.
But...but...what if you paid upfront for a years worth of burgers?!?!?!?oneone... Well, Macdonalds would have done exactly what MMORPGS do, warn you that the recipie can change at any point!
I played SWG at release, I enjoyed it for a while. The powers that be felt that their game needed changing, they did it. The only ones to have any cause for grief are they, and they alone.
I can't possibly imagine paying and playing the NGE for a year. That notion is absurd. HOW can anyone on this planet think that is fun?
Tecmo Bowl.
shows how much a fanboi knows about gaming.
So 2 years latter it's the same old same old? lol
Not to mention that $OE NGE'd the game and refused to refund the remaining months people had remaining on their subscriptions. Those people were certainly "screwed".
If $OE had screwed me out of $100+ per acct, and that happened to several guildmates of mine, I'd be holding a bigger grudge than I am now. Those other people had BOTH their game taken away from them and no refund on their remaining time (which was a HUGE PR mistake, among many, that $OE has made).
I was one of those in that camp. I paid for one year at a time every year since the game launched. And I did the same in July of 2005. So when November came and the NGE was spewed onto my lap, I found myself stuck with 8 months remaining on for two accounts.
SOE refused to refund my two accounts and the remaining 8 months. I also didnt qualify for the expansion refund (which had strict requirements) for both accounts. SOE stole $250 from me.
And lets not forget they also took our subscription money for several months and used it to build the NGE engine. While they lied to our faces on the forums about fixes and revamps coming for our professions, they used our money for an entirely new game. The NGE was in the works BEFORE Smedley's statement that the CU was here to say.....LIER. Thats another 6 months or $90 stolen from me.
I'll certainly come back to SWG right after they send me a check for $340, fire Smedley, and apologize for lying and stealing my money.
This looks like a lesson in life, if nothing else. You chose to pay for a 1 year sub to an
EVER CHANGING ENVIROMENT.
All MMORPG's clearly state, whether it be in the TOS, EULA or on the loading splash screen, that the game is liable to change. When you people finally come to the realisation that no matter how big a fan of the genre or licence, Star Wars in this case, you do not have ANY ownership of it. You have no say in the future direction chosen by the owners of that game. You pay to make use of the SERVICE they provide.
The only case of any "theft" I can see is the possible fraudulant sale of the expansion packs that became almost redundant within weeks of release, hence the refunds. If you failed to meet the criteria for eligibility, I do not know what these were, then that's a matter for you and SOE.
They did not "steal $90" from you or anyone else for that matter by allegedly using that money to develop changes and content you dislike, any more than Macdonalds would be stealing my money if they used it to change the recipie of their hamburgers.
But...but...what if you paid upfront for a years worth of burgers?!?!?!?oneone... Well, Macdonalds would have done exactly what MMORPGS do, warn you that the recipie can change at any point!
I played SWG at release, I enjoyed it for a while. The powers that be felt that their game needed changing, they did it. The only ones to have any cause for grief are they, and they alone.
The EULA, as a non-negotiated contract between parties, only goes up to what would be a reasonable person's expectations about changes. It is impossible to defend that the NGE was within a reasonable person's standard.
fishermage.blogspot.com
Not to mention that $OE NGE'd the game and refused to refund the remaining months people had remaining on their subscriptions. Those people were certainly "screwed".
If $OE had screwed me out of $100+ per acct, and that happened to several guildmates of mine, I'd be holding a bigger grudge than I am now. Those other people had BOTH their game taken away from them and no refund on their remaining time (which was a HUGE PR mistake, among many, that $OE has made).
I was one of those in that camp. I paid for one year at a time every year since the game launched. And I did the same in July of 2005. So when November came and the NGE was spewed onto my lap, I found myself stuck with 8 months remaining on for two accounts.
SOE refused to refund my two accounts and the remaining 8 months. I also didnt qualify for the expansion refund (which had strict requirements) for both accounts. SOE stole $250 from me.
And lets not forget they also took our subscription money for several months and used it to build the NGE engine. While they lied to our faces on the forums about fixes and revamps coming for our professions, they used our money for an entirely new game. The NGE was in the works BEFORE Smedley's statement that the CU was here to say.....LIER. Thats another 6 months or $90 stolen from me.
I'll certainly come back to SWG right after they send me a check for $340, fire Smedley, and apologize for lying and stealing my money.
This looks like a lesson in life, if nothing else. You chose to pay for a 1 year sub to an
EVER CHANGING ENVIROMENT.
All MMORPG's clearly state, whether it be in the TOS, EULA or on the loading splash screen, that the game is liable to change. When you people finally come to the realisation that no matter how big a fan of the genre or licence, Star Wars in this case, you do not have ANY ownership of it. You have no say in the future direction chosen by the owners of that game. You pay to make use of the SERVICE they provide.
The only case of any "theft" I can see is the possible fraudulant sale of the expansion packs that became almost redundant within weeks of release, hence the refunds. If you failed to meet the criteria for eligibility, I do not know what these were, then that's a matter for you and SOE.
They did not "steal $90" from you or anyone else for that matter by allegedly using that money to develop changes and content you dislike, any more than Macdonalds would be stealing my money if they used it to change the recipie of their hamburgers.
But...but...what if you paid upfront for a years worth of burgers?!?!?!?oneone... Well, Macdonalds would have done exactly what MMORPGS do, warn you that the recipie can change at any point!
I played SWG at release, I enjoyed it for a while. The powers that be felt that their game needed changing, they did it. The only ones to have any cause for grief are they, and they alone.
The EULA, as a non-negotiated contract between parties, only goes up to what would be a reasonable person's expectations about changes. It is impossible to defend that the NGE was within a reasonable person's standard.
My thoughts are similar to Fishers. From another thread:
"You understand that we may update or otherwise enhance the Game and/or the Software at any time..."
This has been quoted to justify the NGE, among other things.
I ask you if any reasonable person would interpret the following actions of SOE as examples of updating or enhancing the game:
deletion of over 20 professions,
rendering people completely unable to move or chat,
making heal abilities heal enemies,
advertising and selling items and features in an expansion, and then announcing their deletion the day after payment was received--fraud allegation,
rendering people unable to interact with virtual pets,
deletion of in some cases two years worth of quest progress, along with deletion of the quest content from the game,
rendering items in the previous paid for expansion, Rage of the Wookies, relatively useless by deleting the professions they were made for."
Now about the hamburger example. If a restaurant sold tickets for a roast beef dinner, you bought a ticket, and then after you paid for it you were given a spinach salad and told to eat it or leave, people would get all their money back and the restaurant could be charged with fraud. People that paid for roast beef would be right to be irate seeing the money they spent being used to feed someone else salad. Your hambuger example misses this point entirely.
You do know that "Senators" are just player volunteers picked to bring player gripes/concerns/suggestions to the devs right?
You are correct though..they should dump them all because they're pretty useless.
Until you cancel your subscription, you are only helping to continue the cycle of mediocrity.