EvE -vs- POTBS, winner is....

Hi-Five

I have to give credit to POTBS for trying, but it's not 2003. Most of us EVE players are very disappointed with POTBS, because we thought that this game will compete against CCP's EVE. Capitalism and competitions will drive better products. In this war between the two products, there was no fight, no brawl, no punches, and no kicking... After many Beta suggestions by us (EVE Members), POTBS designers still refuse to make the changes, so I will be the first to say, POTBS is the clear winner...POTBS is right, it is not about competing against EVE. Congratulation for that victory......... but my 14.95 subscription fee will go to EVE.

 

Recommendation:

 1. Level is too easy.

EVE Members:  This game is waaaaay too easy, you can reach half of your character’s max level within a week.

POTBS: "It's not an empire building game...” ---got it, you win!!

 

2. Fix chat and the social community.

EvE Members: You have to make it easier for people to communicate with each other.  

POTBS:   "Chat is great." --- Roger that, you win!!!

 

3. The economy.

EVE Online:   Everyone said the "economy is great," but can I do day trading?

POTBS: “Economy is not broken and it is simple” ---good to go.. You win again!!!

4. On Crafting.

EVE Online: Adding manual crafting will increase more subscribers toward that kind of game play… most of the EVE’s asteroid miners are great craftmen.

POTBS: Since, POTBS doesn't use manual collection of resources, "crafting is great" ---Amazing, no augment from me, you win again!!!

 

The lesson learned is that POTBS is a great game…. But most of us EVE players will not be cancelling our subscription fee, we know what we like. Since POTBS are all perfect, I think this debate is over. The Winner is POTBS!!

batolemaeus

I endorse this post.

No, really. Potbs was never a competition for Eve. It is in a whole other niche.

Pyrostasis

yeah I got potbs hoping it would be "eve light" ... was rather disapointed.

Its a good game in its own right just not for me.

majoch

Eve hands down..

Evelknievel

Originally posted by majoch


Eve hands down..

I agree so far, but Eve has been out for how long? Since 2003 and it wasnt a bowl of cherrys when it came out. It matured in a very deep and complex game that certain type of players love to this day.

I started playing Eve Around the same time SWG was released, I was more attracted to that type of space content compared to JTL and fell in love with the game.

To this day, not all are going to like Eve Online as well as PotBS. But both will have a strong following.

darkraptor

 

Originally posted by HiGHPLaiNS


 
Originally posted by majoch


Eve hands down..

 

I agree so far, but Eve has been out for how long? Since 2003 and it wasnt a bowl of cherrys when it came out. It matured in a very deep and complex game that certain type of players love to this day.

I started playing Eve Around the same time SWG was released, I was more attracted to that type of space content compared to JTL and fell in love with the game.

To this day, not all are going to like Eve Online as well as PotBS. But both will have a strong following.

 

You know, every game has its niche. I hate to diss it, but I can't say I've even been remotely impressed with POTBS.  Even random chinese MMO's have more substance than this game. Graphically, showcasing water with fantastic textures does not automagically make a great game.

It doesn't compare to even, not really.  

 

/edit: flyff is in my xfire since I used to play it when xfire was up...haven't checked it in years though.  I don't endorse that game from any perspective anymore, but it was fun to play with people of all nationalities previously...that was its niche.

Xasapis

... both, unless you're a shareholder of either company. A gamer will always win when there is more variety out there. It may not be your cup of tea, or mine, but when somebody is having fun, it's all that matters.

Kill_trolls

Originally posted by Hi-Five



 1. Level is too easy.

(I understand the rest of your post but I disagree with this)

Levels are for newbie PvErs in their teens (or unemployed) who have nothing else to do in their life but grind some numbers. Levels are NOT a PvP concept. Levels are for those without skill, for those that are too dumb to win with skill so they need grind to help them.

 

I cannot figgure out why this is mentioned as a negative side of PotBS unless you're Lineage fan.

 

Look at Guild Wars. All PvP chars start at lvl20, instantly. Did that hurt PvP? No, it's the best PvP out there that I have seen. The rest is just grind-PvP.

Domenicus

People have a hard time to understand the difference between difficult and hard-work. Grinding is not difficult at all, its just hard-work... Lineage is not difficult, its hard-work, mind numbing... And both are equally easy. Pobs also uses grind as the best way to improve level (therefore its a grind game, as very well put from a fan, who told me that the best way to improve the game is to kill, mindless, the ships on open sea, just like any good grind game outside), but its less hard-work than mostly oriental games, althought is easy and simple as those to level.

Bottom line, Pobs is a grind game like Lineage, but is not that hard to level.

Netzoko

Originally posted by Hi-Five


I have to give credit to POTBS for trying, but it's not 2003. Most of us EVE players are very disappointed with POTBS, because we thought that this game will compete against CCP's EVE. Capitalism and competitions will drive better products. In this war between the two products, there was no fight, no brawl, no punches, and no kicking... After many Beta suggestions by us (EVE Members), POTBS designers still refuse to make the changes, so I will be the first to say, POTBS is the clear winner...POTBS is right, it is not about competing against EVE. Congratulation for that victory......... but my 14.95 subscription fee will go to EVE.
 
Recommendation:
 1. Level is too easy.
EVE Members:  This game is waaaaay too easy, you can reach half of your character’s max level within a week.
POTBS: "It's not an empire building game...” ---got it, you win!!
 
2. Fix chat and the social community.
EvE Members: You have to make it easier for people to communicate with each other.  
POTBS:   "Chat is great." --- Roger that, you win!!!
 

3. The economy.
EVE Online:   Everyone said the "economy is great," but can I do day trading?
POTBS: “Economy is not broken and it is simple” ---good to go.. You win again!!!


4. On Crafting.
EVE Online: Adding manual crafting will increase more subscribers toward that kind of game play… most of the EVE’s asteroid miners are great craftmen.
POTBS: Since, POTBS doesn't use manual collection of resources, "crafting is great" ---Amazing, no augment from me, you win again!!!
 
The lesson learned is that POTBS is a great game…. But most of us EVE players will not be cancelling our subscription fee, we know what we like. Since POTBS are all perfect, I think this debate is over. The Winner is POTBS!!

I laugh whenever I see these comparison threads...

Sure, EVE and PotBS have a few minor things in common, but they're so different it's impossible to compare them.

The main thing that got me is that you compared leveling to EVE. How can you compare a time based skill system to a general level/XP system and say one is worse? Pirates is about end-game for most, people level to participate in PvP, and things like that. I'd rather have fast leveling than a grind like the EQ clones. Regardless, in about 6 months, everyone will be level 50 in PotBS. What happens when a new player joins? He has to catch up, and a fast grind makes that easier. Most would rather have that than sit AFK in station for a real life year to get to a skill level capable of participating in something worthy in EVE.

I find it interesting how you think PotBS should copy the asteroid mining gameplay. Most people don't have hours a day to sit AFK while your ship shoots lasers at a rock. It's not fun, and most don't bother.

olepi

Originally posted by Domenicus


People have a hard time to understand the difference between difficult and hard-work. Grinding is not difficult at all, its just hard-work... Lineage is not difficult, its hard-work, mind numbing... And both are equally easy. Pobs also uses grind as the best way to improve level (therefore its a grind game, as very well put from a fan, who told me that the best way to improve the game is to kill, mindless, the ships on open sea, just like any good grind game outside), but its less hard-work than mostly oriental games, althought is easy and simple as those to level.
Bottom line, Pobs is a grind game like Lineage, but is not that hard to level.

Be careful with that term, "level". In WoW, and most MMO;'s, level implies more hit points, etc. A level 10 can never hit or damage a level 50, and the 50 sees the 10 as a "gray",. ie: worthless and harmless. This is not true in EvE or PoTBS.

In these two games, you make money and buy a ship. Your level of training limits the type of ship you can buy. A level 50 player in a beginner ship is almost as weak as a levrel 5 in a beginner ship. Your skills are what differentiates you from the others, and your ship. Not your level.

As noted, the grind to level is pretty quick and easy. It is the ships that matter. And those are all player made ...

surlybird

 Where did you see that the game was being made for EvE players? I can't find that mentioned anywhere but here. Thank the gods they are different.

batolemaeus

---

Originally posted by surlybird
 Where did you see that the game was being made for EvE players? I can't find that mentioned anywhere but here. Thank the gods they are different.

---

It was all over the forums.."potbs will draw players from Eve" and "potbs will be so much better than eve" etc.
It was expected to be a competition for eve. A game doing the same sandbox aproach to directly attack Eve.

Sadly, it coult not satisfy that.

Arclan

Someone explain the whole sandbox thing.  It's being used as often as teabag was used a couple years ago.

BTW, I do get the sarcasm from the OP.  You think POBS is lacking; I get it.  I agree in some ways.  What Pobs REALLY needs to get from Eve is the ability to set buy orders.  hauling stuff in Eve was actually fun because you could see actual Buy orders in one area of space for, say, foodstuffs, at 30 credits.  And you can see sell orders in an entirely different area of space for the same goods at 15 credits.  You simply need to go to point A and buy the goods for 15 credits each, then have the cargo capacity to haul it to point B and double your money.

In POBS, it is MUCH crappier.

If this were POBS, you could see that at Point B, someone recently paid $30 for that good.  And you can see that someone at Point A recently sold it for $15.  So you sail all the way to Point A and find that your auction of $15 isn't beeing accepted, and in fact the item is not for sale at $15; the gouger now wants $25.  Ok so you decide to go for it, and pay the $25.  You then sail all the way to point B and list your stuff for sale and HOPE that someone buys it at your price.

The two systems, frankly, could not be more different.  And as much as I criticize Eve (for profanity, boring combat, etc.) I will say the economy in Eve is FAR superior to that in pobs.  The more you think of it, the more you realize it's pretty pathetic in POBS.

Orphes

Originally posted by batolemaeus


 

Originally posted by surlybird

 Where did you see that the game was being made for EvE players? I can't find that mentioned anywhere but here. Thank the gods they are different.

 

It was all over the forums.."potbs will draw players from Eve" and "potbs will be so much better than eve" etc.

It was expected to be a competition for eve. A game doing the same sandbox aproach to directly attack Eve.

Sadly, it coult not satisfy that.

Who of you two are right?

olddaddy

Originally posted by Hi-Five


I have to give credit to POTBS for trying, but it's not 2003. Most of us EVE players are very disappointed with POTBS, because we thought that this game will compete against CCP's EVE. Capitalism and competitions will drive better products. In this war between the two products, there was no fight, no brawl, no punches, and no kicking... After many Beta suggestions by us (EVE Members), POTBS designers still refuse to make the changes, so I will be the first to say, POTBS is the clear winner...POTBS is right, it is not about competing against EVE. Congratulation for that victory......... but my 14.95 subscription fee will go to EVE.
 
Recommendation:
 1. Level is too easy.
EVE Members:  This game is waaaaay too easy, you can reach half of your character’s max level within a week.
POTBS: "It's not an empire building game...” ---got it, you win!!

Keep in mind that EVE is open ended. In POTBS when one of the nations wins, the game is over. That means the server restarts the game, and all the players start off new characters at level one. No characters carry over into the new game. Nada carries over. 
Different concept. In POTBS you don't have forever to level up.  

2. Fix chat and the social community.
EvE Members: You have to make it easier for people to communicate with each other.  
POTBS:   "Chat is great." --- Roger that, you win!!!

Chat is not used much in POTBS because the societies are on ventrillo. Matter of fact, most societies require ventrillo to join. Non ventrillo chat is similiar to EQ 2, you can send a player a tell, right click on their ship/avatar to send them a tell, chat in general to all players in an area, nation, etc. Probably the limiting factor in chat over EQ 2 is that to understand other nationalities in chat, you have to use a leveling experience point for language. Agree/like it or not, this is by design.  


3. The economy.

EVE Online:   Everyone said the "economy is great," but can I do day trading?

POTBS: “Economy is not broken and it is simple” ---good to go.. You win again!!!
Once again, POTBS has an end game. The goal is not to be an economic simulator, but to create enough of a challenge for even non-PvP players to enjoy the game and support their nation in reaching the end game. No matter how well you build up your character to be an economic powerhouse, no matter how much gold you acquire, or buy off of Chinese gold farmers, when the end game occurs, and one side wins, everything resets to zero. So, those hundreds of thousands of gold you bought off the Chinese farmers become worth exactly nothing.



4. On Crafting.
EVE Online: Adding manual crafting will increase more subscribers toward that kind of game play… most of the EVE’s asteroid miners are great craftmen.

POTBS: Since, POTBS doesn't use manual collection of resources, "crafting is great" ---Amazing, no augment from me, you win again!!!
Once again, POTBS has an endgame when everything on the server will rest to zero.  


The lesson learned is that POTBS is a great game…. But most of us EVE players will not be cancelling our subscription fee, we know what we like. Since POTBS are all perfect, I think this debate is over. The Winner is POTBS!!
This is just a ludicrous statement. These are two different and distinct types of games. EVE has no endgame, you character is your character for as long as you play, indefinately. POTBS has an endgame, when one nation wins the game is over and the server resets to play again. To allow players to import their level 50 characters into the new game is simply not part of the game model. Thus, POTBS can attract new players into server resets that will not feel they are unfairly competing with level 50 characters from day one. Whereas it remains to be seen how many players from the completed games will be willing to restart on the reset server, games like Civilization, which is also not like EVE, have shown replayability value (Civ 5 anyone). Thus, I think in the long run POTBS is nicely positioned to continue and grow.
POTBS is not EVE, though similiar to EVE, it is a different type of game.
 
 

 

Kyleran

Once again, POTBS has an end game. The goal is not to be an economic simulator, but to create enough of a challenge for even non-PvP players to enjoy the game and support their nation in reaching the end game. No matter how well you build up your character to be an economic powerhouse, no matter how much gold you acquire, or buy off of Chinese gold farmers, when the end game occurs, and one side wins, everything resets to zero. So, those hundreds of thousands of gold you bought off the Chinese farmers become worth exactly nothing.



Once again, POTBS has an endgame when everything on the server will rest to zero.  

 

Is this really true?  I've never heard this before and can't believe that I've never read a post about someone who didn't like it.  I can't imagine a major game where the players will accept a full reset to zero, where all their previous time and effort invested goes right out the window.

 

olddaddy

 

Originally posted by Kyleran


 



Once again, POTBS has an end game. The goal is not to be an economic simulator, but to create enough of a challenge for even non-PvP players to enjoy the game and support their nation in reaching the end game. No matter how well you build up your character to be an economic powerhouse, no matter how much gold you acquire, or buy off of Chinese gold farmers, when the end game occurs, and one side wins, everything resets to zero. So, those hundreds of thousands of gold you bought off the Chinese farmers become worth exactly nothing.



Once again, POTBS has an endgame when everything on the server will rest to zero.  

 

 

Is this really true?  I've never heard this before and can't believe that I've never read a post about someone who didn't like it.  I can't imagine a major game where the players will accept a full reset to zero, where all their previous time and effort invested goes right out the window.

 

 

That is why this is a new type of game. This is like the old PBM games, once endgame occurred the server reset, and a new PBM game started from scratch. For example, Graff Simulations used to run a Central American dictatorship PBM game called El Mythico, when somebody won, the game restarted, and the players played again from scratch. Midnight Games, formerly out of Medford, Oregon, ran the same thing with their Legends series. If you play Civilization, Age of Empires, Company of Heroes, when victory conditions are achieved, the game ends, and you start the next game from scratch.

This is not a new business model. All it does is combine the old PBM business model with online gaming. Rather than mail/upload your turn to a company and wait for them to run the results, now you get to play live. Read the EULA, you do not own your character, ships, or items, they do.

That is why there is no raiding in POTBS. That sword of uberness, that armor of nerdiness, and all those other items of bragging rights do not exist because at the endgame they would become part of the ether, lost forever. You are fighting for bragging rights that you were on the winning side. In some PBM games the winning side was awarded a free setup in the next game, perhaps FLS is planning on doing something like that, or maybe letting the winning players carry over a ship or something.

Not letting characters, ships, items carryover to the reset server allows FLS to attract new players that have the expectation that they can start off at least even with the veteran players, and everything after that is up to their own skills and abilities. They don't have to worry about being a level one noob with 200 level 50's in level 50 ships on day one of the reset game. Is it that important to players to carry over stuff to the reset server so they can lord it over the noobs?

 

eris0023

Originally posted by olddaddy


 
Originally posted by Kyleran


 



Once again, POTBS has an end game. The goal is not to be an economic simulator, but to create enough of a challenge for even non-PvP players to enjoy the game and support their nation in reaching the end game. No matter how well you build up your character to be an economic powerhouse, no matter how much gold you acquire, or buy off of Chinese gold farmers, when the end game occurs, and one side wins, everything resets to zero. So, those hundreds of thousands of gold you bought off the Chinese farmers become worth exactly nothing.



Once again, POTBS has an endgame when everything on the server will rest to zero.  

 

 

Is this really true?  I've never heard this before and can't believe that I've never read a post about someone who didn't like it.  I can't imagine a major game where the players will accept a full reset to zero, where all their previous time and effort invested goes right out the window.

 

 

That is why this is a new type of game. This is like the old PBM games, once endgame occurred the server reset, and a new PBM game started from scratch. For example, Graff Simulations used to run a Central American dictatorship PBM game called El Mythico, when somebody won, the game restarted, and the players played again from scratch. Midnight Games, formerly out of Medford, Oregon, ran the same thing with their Legends series. If you play Civilization, Age of Empires, Company of Heroes, when victory conditions are achieved, the game ends, and you start the next game from scratch.

This is not a new business model. All it does is combine the old PBM business model with online gaming. Rather than mail/upload your turn to a company and wait for them to run the results, now you get to play live. 

That is why there is no raiding in POTBS. That sword of uberness, that armor of nerdiness, and all those other items of bragging rights do not exist because at the endgame they would become part of the ether, lost forever. You are fighting for bragging rights that you were on the winning side. In some PBM games the winning side was awarded a free setup in the next game, perhaps FLS is plannijng on doing something like that.

Not letting charcters, ships, items carryover to the reset server allows FLS to attract new players that have the expectation that they can start off at least even with the veteran players, and everything after that is up to their own skills and abilities. They don't have to worry about being a level one noob with 200 level 50's in level 50 ships on day one of the reset game.

 

I have NEVER heard this before and i highly doubt most potbs players are aware of this. Is it not the point of an MMO to have a connection with you character, to build fame and make friends and enjoy it. If its going to reset wtf is the point.

Either your wrong or POTBS is the WORST idea ever ever ever ever ever ever ever...............

Vincenz

Originally posted by eris0023


 

I have NEVER heard this before and i highly doubt most potbs players are aware of this. Is it not the point of an MMO to have a connection with you character, to build fame and make friends and enjoy it. If its going to reset wtf is the point.

 

Either your wrong or POTBS is the WORST idea ever ever ever ever ever ever ever...............

+1...he's posted this a couple times now, and either he's jumping out in front to defend a HORRIBLE decision coming down the pike from FLS...or he's just wrong.  I really hope for this game's sake it's the second one.

eris0023

Did I mention that if he is not wrong it is the worst idea EVER EVER EVER EVER EVER EVER EVER EVER EVER EVER EVER EVEREVER EVER EVER EVER EVER EVEREVER EVER EVER EVER EVER EVEREVER EVER EVER EVER EVER EVEREVER EVER EVER EVER EVER EVEREVER EVER EVER EVER EVER EVEREVER EVER EVER EVER EVER EVEREVER EVER EVER EVER EVER EVEREVER EVER EVER EVER EVER EVEREVER EVER EVER EVER EVER EVEREVER EVER EVER EVER EVER EVEREVER EVER EVER EVER EVER EVEREVER EVER EVER EVER EVER EVER

Vincenz

I will say this, if he's right about server resets...

 

he's certainly right about there being an END GAME.

eris0023

Yes, Yes he is.

babac

OMG this can't be the truth, can it ? Such a horrible idea . What's the point playing this game then, when your char will be wiped out every 1 month or so..

Vincenz

Wow...after a search on the main forums, it appears this very well may be true (at least other people are assuming there will be complete server resets as well).

This makes the CU/NGE look like sheer genius in retrospect.

 

Welcome to the Burning Seas, Population 0.

Linthead4504

Originally posted by Kyleran


 



Once again, POTBS has an end game. The goal is not to be an economic simulator, but to create enough of a challenge for even non-PvP players to enjoy the game and support their nation in reaching the end game. No matter how well you build up your character to be an economic powerhouse, no matter how much gold you acquire, or buy off of Chinese gold farmers, when the end game occurs, and one side wins, everything resets to zero. So, those hundreds of thousands of gold you bought off the Chinese farmers become worth exactly nothing.



Once again, POTBS has an endgame when everything on the server will rest to zero.  

 

 

Is this really true?  I've never heard this before and can't believe that I've never read a post about someone who didn't like it.  I can't imagine a major game where the players will accept a full reset to zero, where all their previous time and effort invested goes right out the window.

 

This is wrong.... they reset MOST of the ports back to the original owners... MOST not ALL. Chars stay the same, they keep all their goods, winners get a certificate to buy better ships and stuff like that, the losers get more ports so it's easier for them to win the next time.

 

Chars stay the same... it's a shame when people make stuff up about a game just because it is not their cup of tea. If you don't like it that's fine, you don't like it... no point in lying about it to make you feel better.