LOL! and where do you get your facts from? hahahah! first off alot of games start out this way then the devs start nuking everything that made the game fun. Look at runescape... prior to all the excessive rules and downdates players had alot of freedoms and those freedoms kept them playing for YEARS. See when you go into a game that you can do anything and everything , I say you can do it doesn't mean you will do it. You don;t start out with all abilities, yes you have to work for them, but once you earn them you can use them . The ability to be able to do them all in time is why you would keep playing, I create all players on a game get bored with all of them and then leave. There would be an awesome community because like I said to be able to do anything and everything, that doesn;t mean anywhere on the game, just as long as it has some place to do it. For example for pvp areas pvp same level pvp any level, pvp multi combat, wars with eqipment that you can build and wars without. What I mean by everything is that you canb have non combat areas and combat zones. Be able to trade any item in the game, being able to enjoy personal freedoms and not play in an environment that is too restricted.
LOL! and where do you get your facts from? hahahah! first off alot of games start out this way then the devs start nuking everything that made the game fun. Look at runescape... prior to all the excessive rules and downdates players had alot of freedoms and those freedoms kept them playing for YEARS. See when you go into a game that you can do anything and everything , I say you can do it doesn't mean you will do it. You don;t start out with all abilities, yes you have to work for them, but once you earn them you can use them . The ability to be able to do them all in time is why you would keep playing, I create all players on a game get bored with all of them and then leave. There would be an awesome community because like I said to be able to do anything and everything, that doesn;t mean anywhere on the game, just as long as it has some place to do it. For example for pvp areas pvp same level pvp any level, pvp multi combat, wars with eqipment that you can build and wars without. What I mean by everything is that you canb have non combat areas and combat zones. Be able to trade any item in the game, being able to enjoy personal freedoms and not play in an environment that is too restricted.
Actually Most games start off with a set amount of limitations. If you notice even Runescape started going with limitations and rules. People are the ones who ask for this, its not always the devs who decide to do it. The reason people played Runescape for "years" is because its a free browser based game. But if you look around, even those players are looking for a new MMO.
UO has the same sort of system your talking about, allowing you to learn any skill you wish to have, essentially having 1 character/class type. PvP was pretty FFA for a long time (save for in towns) until a majority of people complained about it. Again, thats the reason why devs add so many rules and limitations, because players demand them. People psychologically crave rules and limitations, so long as they benefit from them. The devs only start 'nuking everything that made the game fun' because people complained about it. Players demanded the changes. And when people pay for something, they will demand even more than if it was something free because they feel if they are paying a subscription fee, they are entitled to play without fear of being ganked, fear of being kept out of all the good content, etc.
As for where did I get my facts? Look at any MMO Message board. You will see people crying nerf, calling for changes, complaining about mechanics. And take notice the posters names who are crying for these changes, because more times than not, they will be the ones complaining about the chages in the end when it affects them.
There are 3 types of people in the world. 1.) Those who make things happen 2.) Those who watch things happen 3.) And those who wonder "What the %#*& just happened?!"
Most people I knew on runescape were only f2p nonmembers for a very short time. All of my 600 player clan were paying players. Those players are looking for a new mmo because they had a lot of bad updates that took away all the player freedoms. Everyone I know that played and has now quit because of the bad dev decisions could care less if it is browser based or not. There are ways to "fix" the things that players complain about without killing the good content, just usually they go for the "quick fix" instead of working out a better one. Considering that most people who play these games are over 18 they need to stop catering to the kiddies who whine about everything and propose stupid ideas. There are good and bad ideas, and yes some limitations are necessary, just the amount of limitations being put into these games make it not feel like you are relaxing and playing a game, more like you are sitting through a church service. The trade limitations, removal of gambling, and removal of the pvp anything goes zones in runescape are the largest contributing factor that the PAYING MEMBERS are looking for other games to play for years. I think that people initially found the game because it was a browswer based and had a free section, but they kept playing it because of it's content. why not look at the actual posts in their forums before making a poor assessment of the game.
The problem with MMORPG's that they really aren't RGP's. If you thjink about itwhat made RPGing fun was the interaction with the NPC's an getting them to give you info, items and quests. Now, before you say they do that, think about this. What we get is a watered down version of roleplaying, not true roleplaying. The NPC's never say anything different or surprising or even react to what kind of person you are. We should have consequences when we do some good, bad or indifferent. We should have a reputation meter that govern how we will be received by NPC's. I know it would be costly to use actual people, but just imagine a totally immersive world where the NPC's were actual people. They could give misinformation, they could react to the way the person is acting towards them. It would make the replay value tremendous. Even if we can't have the ideal world we should play in something close to it. Move away from the old "RPG" style of gaming and do something innovative.
Most people I knew on runescape were only f2p nonmembers for a very short time. All of my 600 player clan were paying players. Those players are looking for a new mmo because they had a lot of bad updates that took away all the player freedoms. Everyone I know that played and has now quit because of the bad dev decisions could care less if it is browser based or not. There are ways to "fix" the things that players complain about without killing the good content, just usually they go for the "quick fix" instead of working out a better one. Considering that most people who play these games are over 18 they need to stop catering to the kiddies who whine about everything and propose stupid ideas. There are good and bad ideas, and yes some limitations are necessary, just the amount of limitations being put into these games make it not feel like you are relaxing and playing a game, more like you are sitting through a church service. The trade limitations, removal of gambling, and removal of the pvp anything goes zones in runescape are the largest contributing factor that the PAYING MEMBERS are looking for other games to play for years. I think that people initially found the game because it was a browswer based and had a free section, but they kept playing it because of it's content. why not look at the actual posts in their forums before making a poor assessment of the game.
Trust me, I have played Runescape and know people who still play it. I wasn't making poor assessments against the game. I was just stating that Players are the ones who ask/demand these changes. And it really has nothing to do with how old they are (yes, older players will whine just as much as the younger ones). People like to have things fit thier way. We live in a society that banned the word 'Fart' from appearing on TV for many years. When someone cries to get one rule passed, others will ask for another rule. Soon more rules and limits will be placed to help back up the other rules and limits. Its a never ending cycle. If a game is too hard for someone, they whine about it until something is done about it instead of just finding a game that fits them better.
The companies that make the games give into these cries/whines/demands because they fear losing players, which cost them revenue, be it through subscriptions or advertising. Look at WoW for example. In thier quest to have the largest sub base, Blizzard is constantly changing things back and fourth. Every patch brings another nerf to one class and a boost to another, nerf to one rule, adjustment to another. They know that as long as they flip flop as much as possible, they will retain more subs.
SWG is an extreme opposite. They didn't listen to anything the players said and released the NGE. Sure they might have attracted a few new subs, but a majority of the players were left reeling from the kick to the groin that SOE/LA dealt them.
There are 3 types of people in the world. 1.) Those who make things happen 2.) Those who watch things happen 3.) And those who wonder "What the %#*& just happened?!"
a lot,I'll go so far as to say most,companies don't want a "piece of the pie" they want the whole damn thing.And to try and get it the put in what they think is something for everyone
There is no be all end all game,Never has been and never will be,and the harder they try to make it the worse it seems to get.
Most if not all that are out or coming out aren't mmorpg's, they are mmog's,They have taken the depth of a rpg out to try and get more people,It worked for one game,and the rest seemed to fall inline behind it.
It pretty much boils down to greed.Case in point..The old standby to point out and bitch about,SWG, SOE/LA weren't satisfied with appox 28 million dollars a year profit,they wanted more,much,much more.And ended up with a lot less.
I don't think we're going to see much if any improvement until companies start going for a "piece of the pie" instead of all of it.
Interfaces could use some work in general I think. Often they are very static and generally overlooked. I haven't tried it and I know it may cause a digression but I've heard that WoW actually has a much more flexible system in place than is the norm. That is probably a good idea, I don't think that any static design is going to be able to present what is necessary while staying clean and intuitive.
Game system complexity for the classic MMORPG style gameplay could stand to be punched up several notches, in my opinion. I liked the number crunching in Anarchy Online, though it has a disagreeable amount of deliberate obfuscation (no markers on the agg/def bar, no real explanation of its impact) which ought to be done away with in future titles of similar complexity.
I think the writing and visual impact along important plot lines (when a game has them) needs to be improved. I often feel much more involved with single player games than with MMORPGs. Even in first person shooters (possibly because of the reliance on the first person perspective). Downtrodden masses in Half Life 2 feel more downtrodden (until they become rebels anyway). Soldiers in Call of Duty feel more like soldiers. The KOTORs were also more involving in my opinion, just to add an RPG to the mix.
A recent example for me was Tabula Rasa. The premise is that the Earth is destroyed, from what I gathered. The Earth is Destroyed. The human NPCs seem to regard this is a minor setback and fully intend to open a Costco-Sized can of whup-ass on the badguys. If anything, they remind me more of various video game incarnations of Omaha beach.
Basically I think that MMORPGs lack the visual and emotional atmosphere of a quality single player game for the most part. I don't know if its the floating camera angle or the necessity of minimizing voice over, or the preponderance of quests/mobs-to-kill, or what. That seems like an edge in the current market to me though.
Another facet that I think bears investigation for many newer games I've tried is the lack of even small diversions from the main thrust of the game. This doesn't have to be big, except with the possible exception of crafting, it just needs to be a step out of the usual. In fact, with respect to things like exploration they should be mostly without reinforcement or powerful rewards. TR and SOTNW did not have enough side achievements or minigames or whatever you want to call them for me to stick with them. The somewhat new ways of killing things felt like the only activities available.
"What do you think are some of the biggest problems in MMO's these days? Please feel free to list anything that you can think of that troubles MMO's , gamers and other people that are involved in MMOs in some way or another."
Big corporate round tables deciding what will be the "future" of MMO's. Big buisness is sucking the honesty out of MMO's just like they did to the music industry.
Brings me to my second, but having everything to do with the first-Copying the "Wow" format.
Also trying to cater to everyone on the planet when you design a game. Where's some variety in concepts and control? I am SICK of the same game with a different skin approach.
Hopefully some jems can still pop through the cracks.
I'm looking at Earthrise, Fallen Earth mostly.
Cryptic going it alone with Champions online looks interesting also.
In a nutshell, MMOs in the last 5 or 6 years have really done nothing new. They ALL stick to the same old forumla.
They are all linear level grinders, all combat centric, all stuck on the same "class" / progression concepts, all have become simplistic and unchallenging. Almost all have forsaken the virtual world approach. For the mostpart they have all pretty much stuck to the same theme, fantasy.
So really the basic problem is MMOs are really the same game being remade over and over with a new skin on them.
"What do you think are some of the biggest problems in MMO's these days? Please feel free to list anything that you can think of that troubles MMO's , gamers and other people that are involved in MMOs in some way or another."
Big corporate round tables deciding what will be the "future" of MMO's. Big buisness is sucking the honesty out of MMO's just like they did to the music industry. Brings me to my second, but having everything to do with the first-Copying the "Wow" format. Also trying to cater to everyone on the planet when you design a game. Where's some variety in concepts and control? I am SICK of the same game with a different skin approach. Hopefully some jems can still pop through the cracks. I'm looking at Earthrise, Fallen Earth mostly. Cryptic going it alone with Champions online looks interesting also.
It is more likely that the problem is that people just want to bitch about stuff.
You just named THREE significant effort in developing something significantly different from WOW. That indicates that there are significant effort in the industry to try new things. APB & The Agent are two more examples.
There is no problem about the industry copying WOW because it isn't. Sure some developers are. But as long as there are significant development out there that are not, I don't see there is a problem at all.
Every game is pretty much the same, except for art. All have levels, combat, chat systems, crafting, stupid quests, too much running. I'd like to see something different than what we have now, but Warhammer and AoC are not that. Now what I'm looking for is probably years away. And I probably will play Warhammer and AoC, but that doesn't mean I can't dream.
"What do you think are some of the biggest problems in MMO's these days? Please feel free to list anything that you can think of that troubles MMO's , gamers and other people that are involved in MMOs in some way or another."
Big corporate round tables deciding what will be the "future" of MMO's. Big buisness is sucking the honesty out of MMO's just like they did to the music industry. Brings me to my second, but having everything to do with the first-Copying the "Wow" format. Also trying to cater to everyone on the planet when you design a game. Where's some variety in concepts and control? I am SICK of the same game with a different skin approach. Hopefully some jems can still pop through the cracks. I'm looking at Earthrise, Fallen Earth mostly. Cryptic going it alone with Champions online looks interesting also.
It is more likely that the problem is that people just want to bitch about stuff.
You just named THREE significant effort in developing something significantly different from WOW. That indicates that there are significant effort in the industry to try new things. APB & The Agency are two more examples.
There is no problem about the industry copying WOW because it isn't. Sure some developers are. But as long as there are significant development out there that are not, I don't see there is a problem at all.
This is true, there are significant efforts to do something different now....after 4 or 5 years of all these dev teams trying to do the same thing.
Thats why I still hold out for this genre of gaming...although its slow, it is coming along. We just need to endure about 2 more years of residual WoW models spawning.
Most of those titles are recent announcements except for APB (which I first read about in 2003) and Fallen Earth which has been vaporing around for 4 or 5 years now.
The biggest problem are the people, no doubt. The games are actually far better designed. But the people, even those of us who have been around since before UO make these games far worse. Not me, but we know the whiney type. Some vets just shouldn't be playing anymore, because games have evolved past what they found fun. Then there are the people who should'nt be playing this genre at all. They aren't cut out for it. The play style just isn't for them. We know those types as well.
Earlier MMOs had far bigger problems than the games of today. I say this because vets who bitch about every tiny little tech issue must've had their memories erased from 8 or 9 years back, because UO, EQ and AC were tech & balance nightmares. People bitch about not enough content, yet those games had nada, zero, nothing. You sat around and camped spawn points or type in a chat bar. That was it. Players were far more forgiving and understanding or perhaps were so darn happy to playing a MMO at all, anything was good enough. Not in todays market.
Those sayng MMOs are supposed to be virtual worlds are living in some fantasy alternate reality because the gamey MMOs have always been more popular and succesful. EQ blew away UO and EQ isn't any more a virtual world than WOW or LOTR is now.
Theres nothing wrong with newer MMOs. Its the people that are the biggest problem.
I think the hardest part is trying to appeal the game to casual and hardcore gamers, while bringing in a storyline that is demanding and hard on the individual. Developers also need to think about balancing the grind with other aspects of the game, (if they decide to have one).
The biggest problem are the people, no doubt. The games are actually far better designed. But the people, even those of us who have been around since before UO make these games far worse. Not me, but we know the whiney type. Some vets just shouldn't be playing anymore, because games have evolved past what they found fun. Then there are the people who should'nt be playing this genre at all. They aren't cut out for it. The play style just isn't for them. We know those types as well. Earlier MMOs had far bigger problems than the games of today. I say this because vets who bitch about every tiny little tech issue must've had their memories erased from 8 or 9 years back, because UO, EQ and AC were tech & balance nightmares. People bitch about not enough content, yet those games had nada, zero, nothing. You sat around and camped spawn points or type in a chat bar. That was it. Players were far more forgiving and understanding or perhaps were so darn happy to playing a MMO at all, anything was good enough. Not in todays market. Those sayng MMOs are supposed to be virtual worlds are living in some fantasy alternate reality because the gamey MMOs have always been more popular and succesful. EQ blew away UO and EQ isn't any more a virtual world than WOW or LOTR is now. Theres nothing wrong with newer MMOs. Its the people that are the biggest problem.
LOL......... i almost thought i wrote this....hehe.
Instances and Zoning!!!! I'm starting a revolution against both of these if anyone would like to join!!
Zoning I can do without. Most good MMO has no (or limited) zoning anyway. WOW is a good example.
Instances, OTOH, is another story. I really don't want to camp the same mobs in the same dungeon with 50 other guys. Instances is a must to reduce camping, as well as doing scripted events. I think it is one of the best features in modern MMOs.
I remember when Funcom, creator of Anarchy Online, announced that they where adding interactive billboards featuring advertisements for Toyota etc.. I’m not sure whatever to laugh or just cry at a game developer trying to sell in-game adverts as a feature, hah. I however understand that this isn’t the first off the wall ad placed and the game is free to play and this a way to generate income, but please spare me the speech that supposed to get me excited about it. Honest, I dont think companies should be allowed to advertising in mmo´s. Just take a look on Matrix Online.
Having never paid for a minute of my time in Anarchy Online, I have to say that advertising on the billboards never upset me in the slightest. I would feel very differently if I was subscribing.
I hate boring grinds. Give me interesting stories! How about a game where I can complete the quest in many different ways? Where the decisions I make along the way affect whether I am successful or fail? If you have to make this in an instance, then fine... just don't bore me with more collect 12 orc ear quests.
I thought PVP would be my answer, you know, live people would make for more strategy? Hell, if anything I find that even more boring. Nothing like a bunch of people who just want to kill you to get your stuff. That's even less fun.
I want to at least feel like I'm in my own story, not following every other Jane down the same trodden path, collecting the same stupid things, with nothing but killing monsters and gaining levels. Ug. I want an MMORPG... rpg... you know? Role Playing game... with lots of people. Not this watered down grind and linear crap.
When I say roleplaying, I'm not talking about standing around and talking like an elf or something... I mean I want an adventure! I want escapism. I want to BE Frodo and I've got to destroy the ring of power, I want to feel like I'm in a real story.
Comments
LOL! and where do you get your facts from? hahahah! first off alot of games start out this way then the devs start nuking everything that made the game fun. Look at runescape... prior to all the excessive rules and downdates players had alot of freedoms and those freedoms kept them playing for YEARS. See when you go into a game that you can do anything and everything , I say you can do it doesn't mean you will do it. You don;t start out with all abilities, yes you have to work for them, but once you earn them you can use them . The ability to be able to do them all in time is why you would keep playing, I create all players on a game get bored with all of them and then leave. There would be an awesome community because like I said to be able to do anything and everything, that doesn;t mean anywhere on the game, just as long as it has some place to do it. For example for pvp areas pvp same level pvp any level, pvp multi combat, wars with eqipment that you can build and wars without. What I mean by everything is that you canb have non combat areas and combat zones. Be able to trade any item in the game, being able to enjoy personal freedoms and not play in an environment that is too restricted.
UO has the same sort of system your talking about, allowing you to learn any skill you wish to have, essentially having 1 character/class type. PvP was pretty FFA for a long time (save for in towns) until a majority of people complained about it. Again, thats the reason why devs add so many rules and limitations, because players demand them. People psychologically crave rules and limitations, so long as they benefit from them. The devs only start 'nuking everything that made the game fun' because people complained about it. Players demanded the changes. And when people pay for something, they will demand even more than if it was something free because they feel if they are paying a subscription fee, they are entitled to play without fear of being ganked, fear of being kept out of all the good content, etc.
As for where did I get my facts? Look at any MMO Message board. You will see people crying nerf, calling for changes, complaining about mechanics. And take notice the posters names who are crying for these changes, because more times than not, they will be the ones complaining about the chages in the end when it affects them.
There are 3 types of people in the world.
1.) Those who make things happen
2.) Those who watch things happen
3.) And those who wonder "What the %#*& just happened?!"
Most people I knew on runescape were only f2p nonmembers for a very short time. All of my 600 player clan were paying players. Those players are looking for a new mmo because they had a lot of bad updates that took away all the player freedoms. Everyone I know that played and has now quit because of the bad dev decisions could care less if it is browser based or not. There are ways to "fix" the things that players complain about without killing the good content, just usually they go for the "quick fix" instead of working out a better one. Considering that most people who play these games are over 18 they need to stop catering to the kiddies who whine about everything and propose stupid ideas. There are good and bad ideas, and yes some limitations are necessary, just the amount of limitations being put into these games make it not feel like you are relaxing and playing a game, more like you are sitting through a church service. The trade limitations, removal of gambling, and removal of the pvp anything goes zones in runescape are the largest contributing factor that the PAYING MEMBERS are looking for other games to play for years. I think that people initially found the game because it was a browswer based and had a free section, but they kept playing it because of it's content. why not look at the actual posts in their forums before making a poor assessment of the game.
It's not just MMO games, but any in general. Its rushing a game out before its even ready.
The problem with MMORPG's that they really aren't RGP's. If you thjink about itwhat made RPGing fun was the interaction with the NPC's an getting them to give you info, items and quests. Now, before you say they do that, think about this. What we get is a watered down version of roleplaying, not true roleplaying. The NPC's never say anything different or surprising or even react to what kind of person you are. We should have consequences when we do some good, bad or indifferent. We should have a reputation meter that govern how we will be received by NPC's. I know it would be costly to use actual people, but just imagine a totally immersive world where the NPC's were actual people. They could give misinformation, they could react to the way the person is acting towards them. It would make the replay value tremendous. Even if we can't have the ideal world we should play in something close to it. Move away from the old "RPG" style of gaming and do something innovative.
there all the same..................................?
HOGG4LIFE
The companies that make the games give into these cries/whines/demands because they fear losing players, which cost them revenue, be it through subscriptions or advertising. Look at WoW for example. In thier quest to have the largest sub base, Blizzard is constantly changing things back and fourth. Every patch brings another nerf to one class and a boost to another, nerf to one rule, adjustment to another. They know that as long as they flip flop as much as possible, they will retain more subs.
SWG is an extreme opposite. They didn't listen to anything the players said and released the NGE. Sure they might have attracted a few new subs, but a majority of the players were left reeling from the kick to the groin that SOE/LA dealt them.
There are 3 types of people in the world.
1.) Those who make things happen
2.) Those who watch things happen
3.) And those who wonder "What the %#*& just happened?!"
a lot,I'll go so far as to say most,companies don't want a "piece of the pie" they want the whole damn thing.And to try and get it the put in what they think is something for everyone
There is no be all end all game,Never has been and never will be,and the harder they try to make it the worse it seems to get.
Most if not all that are out or coming out aren't mmorpg's, they are mmog's,They have taken the depth of a rpg out to try and get more people,It worked for one game,and the rest seemed to fall inline behind it.
It pretty much boils down to greed.Case in point..The old standby to point out and bitch about,SWG, SOE/LA weren't satisfied with appox 28 million dollars a year profit,they wanted more,much,much more.And ended up with a lot less.
I don't think we're going to see much if any improvement until companies start going for a "piece of the pie" instead of all of it.
Interfaces could use some work in general I think. Often they are very static and generally overlooked. I haven't tried it and I know it may cause a digression but I've heard that WoW actually has a much more flexible system in place than is the norm. That is probably a good idea, I don't think that any static design is going to be able to present what is necessary while staying clean and intuitive.
Game system complexity for the classic MMORPG style gameplay could stand to be punched up several notches, in my opinion. I liked the number crunching in Anarchy Online, though it has a disagreeable amount of deliberate obfuscation (no markers on the agg/def bar, no real explanation of its impact) which ought to be done away with in future titles of similar complexity.
I think the writing and visual impact along important plot lines (when a game has them) needs to be improved. I often feel much more involved with single player games than with MMORPGs. Even in first person shooters (possibly because of the reliance on the first person perspective). Downtrodden masses in Half Life 2 feel more downtrodden (until they become rebels anyway). Soldiers in Call of Duty feel more like soldiers. The KOTORs were also more involving in my opinion, just to add an RPG to the mix.
A recent example for me was Tabula Rasa. The premise is that the Earth is destroyed, from what I gathered. The Earth is Destroyed. The human NPCs seem to regard this is a minor setback and fully intend to open a Costco-Sized can of whup-ass on the badguys. If anything, they remind me more of various video game incarnations of Omaha beach.
Basically I think that MMORPGs lack the visual and emotional atmosphere of a quality single player game for the most part. I don't know if its the floating camera angle or the necessity of minimizing voice over, or the preponderance of quests/mobs-to-kill, or what. That seems like an edge in the current market to me though.
Another facet that I think bears investigation for many newer games I've tried is the lack of even small diversions from the main thrust of the game. This doesn't have to be big, except with the possible exception of crafting, it just needs to be a step out of the usual. In fact, with respect to things like exploration they should be mostly without reinforcement or powerful rewards. TR and SOTNW did not have enough side achievements or minigames or whatever you want to call them for me to stick with them. The somewhat new ways of killing things felt like the only activities available.
"What do you think are some of the biggest problems in MMO's these days? Please feel free to list anything that you can think of that troubles MMO's , gamers and other people that are involved in MMOs in some way or another."
Big corporate round tables deciding what will be the "future" of MMO's. Big buisness is sucking the honesty out of MMO's just like they did to the music industry.
Brings me to my second, but having everything to do with the first-Copying the "Wow" format.
Also trying to cater to everyone on the planet when you design a game. Where's some variety in concepts and control? I am SICK of the same game with a different skin approach.
Hopefully some jems can still pop through the cracks.
I'm looking at Earthrise, Fallen Earth mostly.
Cryptic going it alone with Champions online looks interesting also.
SHOHADAKU
The biggest problems?
In a nutshell, MMOs in the last 5 or 6 years have really done nothing new. They ALL stick to the same old forumla.
They are all linear level grinders, all combat centric, all stuck on the same "class" / progression concepts, all have become simplistic and unchallenging. Almost all have forsaken the virtual world approach. For the mostpart they have all pretty much stuck to the same theme, fantasy.
So really the basic problem is MMOs are really the same game being remade over and over with a new skin on them.
Can you write us a document showing math proof demonstrating balance for a game which is significantly skill based.
It is more likely that the problem is that people just want to bitch about stuff.
You just named THREE significant effort in developing something significantly different from WOW. That indicates that there are significant effort in the industry to try new things. APB & The Agent are two more examples.
There is no problem about the industry copying WOW because it isn't. Sure some developers are. But as long as there are significant development out there that are not, I don't see there is a problem at all.
Every game is pretty much the same, except for art. All have levels, combat, chat systems, crafting, stupid quests, too much running. I'd like to see something different than what we have now, but Warhammer and AoC are not that. Now what I'm looking for is probably years away. And I probably will play Warhammer and AoC, but that doesn't mean I can't dream.
It is more likely that the problem is that people just want to bitch about stuff.
You just named THREE significant effort in developing something significantly different from WOW. That indicates that there are significant effort in the industry to try new things. APB & The Agency are two more examples.
There is no problem about the industry copying WOW because it isn't. Sure some developers are. But as long as there are significant development out there that are not, I don't see there is a problem at all.
This is true, there are significant efforts to do something different now....after 4 or 5 years of all these dev teams trying to do the same thing.Thats why I still hold out for this genre of gaming...although its slow, it is coming along. We just need to endure about 2 more years of residual WoW models spawning.
Most of those titles are recent announcements except for APB (which I first read about in 2003) and Fallen Earth which has been vaporing around for 4 or 5 years now.
Instances and Zoning!!!!
I'm starting a revolution against both of these if anyone would like to join!!
The biggest problem are the people, no doubt. The games are actually far better designed. But the people, even those of us who have been around since before UO make these games far worse. Not me, but we know the whiney type. Some vets just shouldn't be playing anymore, because games have evolved past what they found fun. Then there are the people who should'nt be playing this genre at all. They aren't cut out for it. The play style just isn't for them. We know those types as well.
Earlier MMOs had far bigger problems than the games of today. I say this because vets who bitch about every tiny little tech issue must've had their memories erased from 8 or 9 years back, because UO, EQ and AC were tech & balance nightmares. People bitch about not enough content, yet those games had nada, zero, nothing. You sat around and camped spawn points or type in a chat bar. That was it. Players were far more forgiving and understanding or perhaps were so darn happy to playing a MMO at all, anything was good enough. Not in todays market.
Those sayng MMOs are supposed to be virtual worlds are living in some fantasy alternate reality because the gamey MMOs have always been more popular and succesful. EQ blew away UO and EQ isn't any more a virtual world than WOW or LOTR is now.
Theres nothing wrong with newer MMOs. Its the people that are the biggest problem.
I think the hardest part is trying to appeal the game to casual and hardcore gamers, while bringing in a storyline that is demanding and hard on the individual. Developers also need to think about balancing the grind with other aspects of the game, (if they decide to have one).
LOL......... i almost thought i wrote this....hehe.
What's wrong with Instances? How would you have believable epic encounters in games without them?
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im to lazy too use grammar or punctuation good
Zoning I can do without. Most good MMO has no (or limited) zoning anyway. WOW is a good example.
Instances, OTOH, is another story. I really don't want to camp the same mobs in the same dungeon with 50 other guys. Instances is a must to reduce camping, as well as doing scripted events. I think it is one of the best features in modern MMOs.
Trying to make me play something I don't want by giving better rewards in this unworthy setting.
I just want to solo/group in PvE. Putting any rewards outside of this = biggest problem...and why I stay clear of most games-o-lack.
The best grouper on the server, it has to be a grouper. No debate, no argument, no nonsense. Best groupers are groupers.
- "If I understand you well, you are telling me until next time. " - Ren
I remember when Funcom, creator of Anarchy Online, announced that they where adding interactive billboards featuring advertisements for Toyota etc.. I’m not sure whatever to laugh or just cry at a game developer trying to sell in-game adverts as a feature, hah. I however understand that this isn’t the first off the wall ad placed and the game is free to play and this a way to generate income, but please spare me the speech that supposed to get me excited about it. Honest, I dont think companies should be allowed to advertising in mmo´s. Just take a look on Matrix Online.
Link: http://www.mmomatrix.com/home/advertising
Having never paid for a minute of my time in Anarchy Online, I have to say that advertising on the billboards never upset me in the slightest. I would feel very differently if I was subscribing.
I hate boring grinds. Give me interesting stories! How about a game where I can complete the quest in many different ways? Where the decisions I make along the way affect whether I am successful or fail? If you have to make this in an instance, then fine... just don't bore me with more collect 12 orc ear quests.
I thought PVP would be my answer, you know, live people would make for more strategy? Hell, if anything I find that even more boring. Nothing like a bunch of people who just want to kill you to get your stuff. That's even less fun.
I want to at least feel like I'm in my own story, not following every other Jane down the same trodden path, collecting the same stupid things, with nothing but killing monsters and gaining levels. Ug. I want an MMORPG... rpg... you know? Role Playing game... with lots of people. Not this watered down grind and linear crap.
When I say roleplaying, I'm not talking about standing around and talking like an elf or something... I mean I want an adventure! I want escapism. I want to BE Frodo and I've got to destroy the ring of power, I want to feel like I'm in a real story.
Sadly, I can't find this anywhere. Anyone?