Lemme explain the high end raider's frustration. I am one of this players competeing for worlwide firsts. We are top on our servers but lemme explain what has happened to us since the begining of the expansion.
Expansion comes out. we cant truly group with each other and explore the dungeons. Dungeon exp is horrible and not worth the effort. we can do 3 quests in 20 minutes solo that equals better exp then spending 2 hours to fight to the bottom of a buggy dungeon with named mobs that have a 10% chance to drop anything worth a crap.
We level up. We learn the encounters. 2 months in to the expansion without any notice or posting or NO WORDS AT ALL ON UPDATE OR TEST, they change 3 encounters. 2 of them are severely bugged. We assume, of course we couldnt get anyone to acknowledge if thats intended or not.
Couple patches later they fix it.
Then they announce avator contested are coming back to the game. They release them. some are extremely hard, some are basically impossible. They ones that were hard we figured out how to kill. Then next patch without any notice or hints or anything in patvh notes or anything they are upped MAJORLY and made near impossible.
The end mob in In VP has a 45k lifetap since release. We have been basically told they arent done with him and he will be avaiable to kill soon. Well with NO patch notes or any hints or anything NPU kills him serverwide first. WOW he was killable? How did NPU know? Noone else did....
Secondly this encounter was the one in the letter they got to beta test. GUESS WHAT! I have pulled this mob. It is the same as the letter. Yeah we are working on killing it but we have only gotten what 6 or so nights worth of trying to learn it. AFTER NPU kills it and lets everyone else know they took away the 45k lifetap.
This is getting old. NPU can actually petition or ask questions to figure out iif content is working as intended but they rest of us just struggle by wondering if stuff is working as intended.
A lot of the high end players are not happy because a lot of the content is just not fun. Avator fights where if you cast a beneficial spell you have a 25% chance of getting stunned/mezzed/rooted/feared for 20 seconds. Making you enable to play your character well over half the fight. Not playing your character from being mezzed is not very fun.
The loot in VP is not as good as the loot in the first tier of raids in expansion.
This issue is all over the internet and it is getting really old. Personally, I could care less if they are leaking information, that just means better resources for the rest of us. I don't understand why it is so important to have world firsts for mob kills. If one guild kills it before you, does that mean they are better? No, it just means they died more times.
I would completely understand 1000% if they raided these mobs on a normal ruleset server and transfered to PvP or exchange. It would be completely unfair to the rest of the players at that point. But on PvE, there is no player competition, so why care?
I was one of the people who actually believed that SOE had learned something from the PR fiascos of the past and over the last few years defended SOE here on multiple occasions.
Well this most recent mess has made me lost all the respect I had for them, and I for one will not give SOE my money anymore. It took me a while to realize it but SOE really is as badly run company as their reputation might indicate.
Also my change of mind doesn't really have to do with them leaking strats or anything like that but the general way they try run their community. Which to me shows their utter lack of will to engage in any kind of real communication between them and the whole community.
Well congrats SOE you managed to alienate another loyal customer.
But on PvE, there is no player competition, so why care?
Obviously that is not the case.
There is competition, to be the "first" to do, find or defeat something on each server, regardless of the ruleset. Sony itself encourages this by noting on the players site the names of individual players and guilds who have achieved these marks.
Now, you can argue that such a competition is silly or worthless. But to ignore that it exists and that it is a very important part of the game for some people is simply incorrect.
I am not a raider, nor do I pretend to understand the mindset of those who are hard-core raiders. But I do understand that within that mindset, they hold a set of values and goals that are different than mine in the game and that they are very much entitled to do so without prejudice.
And, this ain't over yet folks. Seems they found another example of a dev giving info out to his guild (this time it was a bug report from an unsuspecting player) and the dev encouraged his guildies to make use of the bug/exploit while he "turned his head" to the whole deal. This has been confirmed by the guild leader. Also, the same source claims that the dev told his guild to hurry, because the bug was in the process of being fixed.
I am a huge fan of EQ2. I am a casual player, and to that extent I lose little if indeed anything when one guild gets unfair help over another in raiding instances.
Nonetheless, it seems to me that unfair is unfair, and wrong is wrong, and there are no excuses in making the choice to cheat.
Of course, I realize that this is the internet, and the above might well be out-moded thinking these days.
Seems to me, the people that need to learn to keep their goddamned mouths shut are the ones that the GM's give these oppurtunities so people stop freaking out about NOTHING.
I have to face it, I guess. I have an outmoded way of thinking in an internet-dominated, pseudo-anonymous, us-versus-them, winning-is-the-only-thing kind of world.
I'll live with it.
And EQ2 is still the best MMO out there of it's kind, currently.
Seems to me, the people that need to learn to keep their goddamned mouths shut are the ones that the GM's give these oppurtunities so people stop freaking out about NOTHING.
Actually it's more along the lines of the people freaking out over nothing can't seem to figure out that they could be testing this stuff to.
NPU admitted before RoK came out that they beta test content just so that they can be the first to beat it when it goes live.
Those people that say that they are upset because they are competetive aren't as competetive as they think they are. Obviousely there is another group of players that are competetive enough to use test as a means of learning the encounters so that they can be better.
If some of you are really that competetive then why isn't your guild testing this stuff to?
Seems to me, the people that need to learn to keep their goddamned mouths shut are the ones that the GM's give these oppurtunities so people stop freaking out about NOTHING.
Actually it's more along the lines of the people freaking out over nothing can't seem to figure out that they could be testing this stuff to.
NPU admitted before RoK came out that they beta test content just so that they can be the first to beat it when it goes live.
Those people that say that they are upset because they are competetive aren't as competetive as they think they are. Obviousely there is another group of players that are competetive enough to use test as a means of learning the encounters so that they can be better.
If some of you are really that competetive then why isn't your guild testing this stuff to?
That is such a brilliant post, until you ACTUALLY READ the prior post. LOL. Seriously, pay attention here. Mobs put into the game BROKEN. Sometimes mistakenly, sometimes on purpose. IN GAME, live, ready to roll, NO BETA, in game, already active mobs walking around, waiting to die. A lot of times these "broken" things are very evident, 45k ae drains, 100k ae blasts, 50k melee double hits. Sometimes they are subtle, like adds multiplying exponentially, 2 adds, 4 adds, 8 adds, 16 adds, I saw people running away from 50 adds during (after) a contested fight. Or my favorite when the epic calls out everyone's name in the raid in about 30 seconds and one touch kills them instantly. Hey, at least there wasn't any doubt, lol.
Soooo, yes, we can hit the zone/contested every day and test whether anything is changed, OR wait for SOE to say in a patch "blah blah is changed or fixed" (never happens), OR have 3 devs IN my guild (they are members of the guild) to not only tell me he's fixed, but give me the EXACT strat to kill him.
"Granted thinking for yourself could be considered a timesink of shorter or longer duration depending on how smart..or how dumb you are."
The above was a PM (which is now posted on the EQ2 site itself) from an EQ2 Dev to his guild leader, quoting the text of a bug report that was sent to the dev by an unsuspecting user. By "look(ing) the other way" the dev is not only alerting his guild leader to the problem/bug/exploit but also saying that he will not do anything to stop them from using it nor will he fix it until they get their epics.
The above was a PM (which is now posted on the EQ2 site itself) from an EQ2 Dev to his guild leader, quoting the text of a bug report that was sent to the dev by an unsuspecting user. By "look(ing) the other way" the dev is not only alerting his guild leader to the problem/bug/exploit but also saying that he will not do anything to stop them from using it nor will he fix it until they get their epics. Wrong is wrong and cheating is cheating, people. At least it is in the country I was raised in. Your mileage, of course, may vary.
Tell me something... where in hell in that pm does the dev say that he will not do anything to stop them from using it nor will he fix it? Either you just posted part of the pm, or he didn't say that anywhere. What I see is a request to get the exploit fixed and that they will not take advantage of it even if other people do. Thats NOT cheating, its responsible behavior. So what are you smoking?
He's not saying that he's going to do nothing. He's pointing out what others are doing.
Holy crap you people are paranoid and desperate to spread the hate. Here's an idea... either protest WHERE IT BELONGS or don't bother protesting anything at all. Whining about it HERE isn't going to do anything at all other than get people riled up. You're upset about something? Go to the EQ2 forums.
Oh and just a thought... why don't you talk to the damned dev yourself, huh? You do know you can pm the devs are the EQ2 forums right? Or are you just here to stir up trouble because you don't have all the facts and find it amusing?
I'm honestly so tired of people coming in here and complaining when they should actually be going to the source. MMORPG can't do ANYTHING about your issues with a game. Not a single one of them can. If you have a problem, you need to go to the source of the problem.
its like checking into a hotel, having issues with your stay, but not complaining to the actual staff, instead you go to a completely different hotel and complain where they can't do anything. You have no right to complain if you're not going to do it to the people that can actually FIX IT.
totally agree so many people flaming and showing their anger for something they're not happy about... the forums here is filled with negative stuff about all games really...
MMORPG should remove all these postings it's just filling forum and really don't serve any purpose at all except getting people annoyed that people can't get over the fact that life is not spinning around them and it's actually they're spinning around life.
The above was a PM (which is now posted on the EQ2 site itself) from an EQ2 Dev to his guild leader, quoting the text of a bug report that was sent to the dev by an unsuspecting user. By "look(ing) the other way" the dev is not only alerting his guild leader to the problem/bug/exploit but also saying that he will not do anything to stop them from using it nor will he fix it until they get their epics. Wrong is wrong and cheating is cheating, people. At least it is in the country I was raised in. Your mileage, of course, may vary.
Tell me something... where in hell in that pm does the dev say that he will not do anything to stop them from using it nor will he fix it? Either you just posted part of the pm, or he didn't say that anywhere. What I see is a request to get the exploit fixed and that they will not take advantage of it even if other people do. Thats NOT cheating, its responsible behavior. So what are you smoking?
He's not saying that he's going to do nothing. He's pointing out what others are doing.
Holy crap you people are paranoid and desperate to spread the hate. Here's an idea... either protest WHERE IT BELONGS or don't bother protesting anything at all. Whining about it HERE isn't going to do anything at all other than get people riled up. You're upset about something? Go to the EQ2 forums.
Oh and just a thought... why don't you talk to the damned dev yourself, huh? You do know you can pm the devs are the EQ2 forums right? Or are you just here to stir up trouble because you don't have all the facts and find it amusing?
I'm honestly so tired of people coming in here and complaining when they should actually be going to the source. MMORPG can't do ANYTHING about your issues with a game. Not a single one of them can. If you have a problem, you need to go to the source of the problem.
its like checking into a hotel, having issues with your stay, but not complaining to the actual staff, instead you go to a completely different hotel and complain where they can't do anything. You have no right to complain if you're not going to do it to the people that can actually FIX IT.
Couple things:
First and foremost he should never have posted a bug report to anyone outside of Sony. There is a strict rule on what you are allowed to tell people outside the company and what you are not allowed to tell them. Bug reports that show game breaking information, or encounter breaking information are one of those things he should not have given them. If he was worried about them using the bug, then he should have explained to them there was situations with the encounter that can cause bugs and warn them that if they come across it NOT to use it.
You don't give someone who doesn't know about the bug, a sheet that explains a step by step process on how to recreate it. That is just asking for abuse. If when I was at SCE we had posted a bug report to users on a ps2/psp/ps3 game I had been working on that helped them pass content a tester had sent me I would have been fired. No questions asked. When you start working there, you have certain rights and responsibilities, and one of those is to protect not only the integrity of the game, but the companies ability to keep that game making money which in turn pays your check. If players are not confident that you are protecting the enviornment in which they play, and that users are getting "a leg up" because a dev is in their guild, this can turn into a mass exodus of players leaving the game which detracts from your check, and everyone elses check and bonuses at the end of the year.
Second, people post here because A) its not moderated against negative feedback like soe forums are, and they like the site. If you don't want to read threads like this, there is the old saying of "don't click the link"
The people that are trying to make the world worse never take a day off , why should I. Light up the darkness Bob Marley
I love how all the fanboyz and SOE bootlickers come out of the woodwork when someone bashes SOE....Even when presented with undeniable evidence that SOE Devs did leak strats and exploits to NPU and other guilds they take up the cause and tell us it's OK that they did it because "It's SOE and they are GOD"
they cheated you...and you don't care...No other guild will ever be able to get the world wide firsts across ALL of EQ2 that NPU did and they cheated to do it...That could have been your guild...but it can't be now....You PAY to have the same chance as everyone else that pays to play...
If this were a free game I would say you have no gripe....but your money is now wasted because SOE Devs cheated you out of it...
What else have they cheated you out of? Moving entire guilds from Test server with gear and items intact...TEST server where double experience is the norm? They didn't EARN those level 80 characters like you did...but SOE had no problem moving them to a live PVE server now did they?
SOE is pathetic, they have zero customer input, there is no method to complain if something is wrong with your class...."working as intended" is their mantra and they don't give a rat's a$$ if you are not happy...because there are enough fan boys and boot lickers playing EQ2 that worship SOE...
Tell me something... where in hell in that pm does the dev say that he will not do anything to stop them from using it nor will he fix it?
How about the part where the developer says: "If we try this I can look the other way in the name of epics"? The fact of the matter is that he did not fix it, instead he alerted his guild leader that the bug/exploit was available. This has been confirmed by the guild leader himself. Either you just posted part of the pm, or he didn't say that anywhere. What I see is a request to get the exploit fixed and that they will not take advantage of it even if other people do. Thats NOT cheating, its responsible behavior. So what are you smoking?Actually, I don't smoke. I think you're reading the message incorrectly. Let me try to summarize it for you: 1.) Dev (his name is at the left on the email) gets bug/exploit report from a user of the game (the body of the email). 2.) Said developer sends his guild leader a message (the text at the top of the email) alerting him to the existence of this bug/exploit and saying that if the guild wants to "try" this bug/exploit then the developer will "look the other way". He is stating that rather than do what he should (which I assume is to report the bug immediately and not spread the knowledge of its existence) he instead will give his guild a chance to take advantage of the bug/exploit by "look(ing) the other way). Really, if you take the time to read it, it is pretty clear.He's not saying that he's going to do nothing. He's pointing out what others are doing.Actually, he (the developer) says that he will "look the other way" if and when his guild wants to use the bug/exploit. "Holy crap you people are paranoid and desperate to spread the hate. Here's an idea... either protest WHERE IT BELONGS or don't bother protesting anything at all. Whining about it HERE isn't going to do anything at all other than get people riled up. You're upset about something? Go to the EQ2 forums." Unfortunately, you are incorrect here as well. First off, I am probably one of the biggest EQ2 fanois around here. I love the game, still play and consider it still the finest MMO of its kind. However, as I have stated several times before, wrong is wrong and cheating is cheating. There is obviously a problem at SOE, and they need to fix it. The reason I post here is because this is a forum concerning issues surrounding EQ2, and the issue is perfectly applicable to the topic here (which I did not start, by the way). Are you willing to tell the folks who run MMORPG that since this topic somehow disturbs or frightens you, I should not be allowed to post the facts? Let me know how that works out for you. "Oh and just a thought... why don't you talk to the damned dev yourself, huh?" You know, if there is any "hate" here ( as you've accused me of harboring) it seems it is not coming from me. This is a legitimate discussion of a serious issue with a game we play and enjoy. Why would you not want other users to know that there is a problem? Why would you keep that information from them? Why would you rather no one speaks of it here? Just why are you so "deperate" to keep a lid on this? (See how easily it can be turned around?) "You do know you can pm the devs are the EQ2 forums right? Or are you just here to stir up trouble because you don't have all the facts and find it amusing?" How do you know that I haven't? You assume much. The facts are posted on Sony's EQ2 website and the EQ2flames website. Please, if having to deal with these facts upsets you so much, feel free to look them up for yourself. In the meantime, I am happy to discuss the issue with anyone, and will continue to do so until MMORPG decides otherwise. "I'm honestly so tired of people coming in here and complaining when they should actually be going to the source. MMORPG can't do ANYTHING about your issues with a game. Not a single one of them can. If you have a problem, you need to go to the source of the problem." I did not post here to alert MMORPG to the problem, I posted to alert EQ2 users who use MMORPG in the manner it was intended, of the problem. Again, one has to wonder why an open and honest discussion of the facts causes you such pain and frustration? "its like checking into a hotel, having issues with your stay, but not complaining to the actual staff, instead you go to a completely different hotel and complain where they can't do anything. You have no right to complain if you're not going to do it to the people that can actually FIX IT." No, actually it is more like complaining to the hotel directly, and then going online to a hotel discussion website and alerting others who have an interest in staying in hotels about your experience. Somehow, you've simply assumed that I (and many, many others) have not written to Sony about this and that I came here to cause some kind of "trouble". While I am a fanboi and I love the game, I am also an adult and am capable of hearing and dealing with the truth, whether it be good or bad, about a company whose service I purchase. If you cannot, and this topic causes you so much anger and frustration, please feel free to put me on ignore. Good luck to you.
totally agree so many people flaming and showing their anger for something they're not happy about... the forums here is filled with negative stuff about all games really... MMORPG should remove all these postings it's just filling forum and really don't serve any purpose at all except getting people annoyed that people can't get over the fact that life is not spinning around them and it's actually they're spinning around life.
Mr. Grimwell (or are you gnorbin?)
you might moderate your community forums with men in black, trained to hunt down and delete anything even slightly negative about EQ2 or SOE...But other forums are not beholding to you gestapo style of moderation. Where we can't simply go to teh SOE official forums and demand to know why a SOE dev gave this information to high level raiding guilds so they can cheat...we CAN and WILL post this information so that players can make their own informed choice on wether they want to continue to play a game loaded with cheaters OR start playing a game loaded with CHEATERS...
So yes, this information serves a very strong purpose...we can bypass your MIB moderators and STILL get the word out to your customer who you have cheated....
totally agree so many people flaming and showing their anger for something they're not happy about... the forums here is filled with negative stuff about all games really... MMORPG should remove all these postings it's just filling forum and really don't serve any purpose at all except getting people annoyed that people can't get over the fact that life is not spinning around them and it's actually they're spinning around life.
Mr. Grimwell (or are you gnorbin?)
you might moderate your community forums with men in black, trained to hunt down and delete anything even slightly negative about EQ2 or SOE...But other forums are not beholding to you gestapo style of moderation. Where we can't simply go to teh SOE official forums and demand to know why a SOE dev gave this information to high level raiding guilds so they can cheat...we CAN and WILL post this information so that players can make their own informed choice on wether they want to continue to play a game loaded with cheaters OR start playing a game loaded with CHEATERS...
So yes, this information serves a very strong purpose...we can bypass your MIB moderators and STILL get the word out to your customer who you have cheated....
You're quite funny guy actually.. Amuses me to see the low activty in the inner circle. This is not about removing negative stuff about EQ2 or SOE in particular it goes for all games as for my consern.
As for your claim about cheaters you find them in all games there is not one out there which don't have people cheating or exploting weaknesses in the game mechanics which is basically cheating light if you want so don't even try give me that crap.
I actually liked one of the japan game server that specifically blocked players from XXX because players from XXX is renowned for doing everything they can to find weaknesses to exploit.
And the 1st one to call cheaters is usally a player from XXX.. it's sad really that players gives the whole country such a reputation.
If people want to play a game without encoutering cheating/exploit of some sort then mmo is not your best choice.
Maybe some board games or a LAN game with your friends is a better option then you can at least be sure that the level of cheating is zero unless you got a bunch of friends that cheats, then solitare might be the right game for you so you don't get cheated by others.
This thread on the while IMO is very re;evant to the game of EQ2,the source of the trouble has most certainly soured my feelings towards the integrity of the game and as this is a public forum its very nessacery to bring these matters up when they occur.
What does amazed me over at the official forums the mods have let a thread dedicated to this very subject run and run where normally they lock and ban threads they dont like with frightening regularity and thats why this sort of thread turns up on here and thats the way it should be.
I love how all the fanboyz and SOE bootlickers come out of the woodwork when someone bashes SOE....Even when presented with undeniable evidence that SOE Devs did leak strats and exploits to NPU and other guilds they take up the cause and tell us it's OK that they did it because "It's SOE and they are GOD"
they cheated you...and you don't care...No other guild will ever be able to get the world wide firsts across ALL of EQ2 that NPU did and they cheated to do it...That could have been your guild...but it can't be now....You PAY to have the same chance as everyone else that pays to play...
If this were a free game I would say you have no gripe....but your money is now wasted because SOE Devs cheated you out of it...
What else have they cheated you out of? Moving entire guilds from Test server with gear and items intact...TEST server where double experience is the norm? They didn't EARN those level 80 characters like you did...but SOE had no problem moving them to a live PVE server now did they?
SOE is pathetic, they have zero customer input, there is no method to complain if something is wrong with your class...."working as intended" is their mantra and they don't give a rat's a$$ if you are not happy...because there are enough fan boys and boot lickers playing EQ2 that worship SOE...
You are all a bunch of sheeple....
When you stop calling me a "bootlicker" like a five year old, you'll get a better reaction. Grow up please.
I love how all the fanboyz and SOE bootlickers come out of the woodwork when someone bashes SOE....Even when presented with undeniable evidence that SOE Devs did leak strats and exploits to NPU and other guilds they take up the cause and tell us it's OK that they did it because "It's SOE and they are GOD"
they cheated you...and you don't care...No other guild will ever be able to get the world wide firsts across ALL of EQ2 that NPU did and they cheated to do it...That could have been your guild...but it can't be now....You PAY to have the same chance as everyone else that pays to play...
If this were a free game I would say you have no gripe....but your money is now wasted because SOE Devs cheated you out of it...
What else have they cheated you out of? Moving entire guilds from Test server with gear and items intact...TEST server where double experience is the norm? They didn't EARN those level 80 characters like you did...but SOE had no problem moving them to a live PVE server now did they?
SOE is pathetic, they have zero customer input, there is no method to complain if something is wrong with your class...."working as intended" is their mantra and they don't give a rat's a$$ if you are not happy...because there are enough fan boys and boot lickers playing EQ2 that worship SOE...
You are all a bunch of sheeple....
When you stop calling me a "bootlicker" like a five year old, you'll get a better reaction. Grow up please.
Yes, there is cheating in all games and people from CHINA (for those of you who are too politically correct to say so) are the largest contributor to the cheating that goes on. it appears that they enjoy the game by trying anything and everything they can to exploit it for RMT...
BUT I Play (or did) EQ2 I don't (or didn't) care about cheating in other games....and this wasn't some outsider exploiting game mechanics or selling in game coin...These were SOE EMPLOYEES...the same people you supply a pay check to every week with YOUR hard earned money. And yet you turn a blind eye to it, think it's OK or ignore it and go on in your little world where SOE could not possibly do anything wrong....
Yeah why help guilds when they can put the encounter on a test realm for a month, have GMs observe the raids + death touch the bosses / give out the tactics ?
Then all the loot will be up for everyone to see and we can know all the loot tables before even being able to play the raid...
So by the time the content is live it's already "old".
Bosses beaten, complete list of loot known...We're already prepared for it...
Then...As soon as it hits live we just form up our raid, go there and use our known tactic to get loot we already know it's there...
Ofc then we can post the FULL tactic on a popular site with info on raid setup / tactics + gear needed with extreme detail so EVERY SINGLE PLAYER can do that kill considering they execute the tactic in an adequate way...
So it's all so interesting for people who ain't that hardcore...lol..
Which is what happens in the best selling MMORPG atm and in that game "it's alright" and it's no "insult to our subscriptions".
Yeah why help guilds when they can put the encounter on a test realm for a month, have GMs observe the raids + death touch the bosses / give out the tactics ? Then all the loot will be up for everyone to see and we can know all the loot tables before even being able to play the raid...
So by the time the content is live it's already "old". Bosses beaten, complete list of loot known...We're already prepared for it... Then...As soon as it hits live we just form up our raid, go there and use our known tactic to get loot we already know it's there... Ofc then we can post the FULL tactic on a popular site with info on raid setup / tactics + gear needed with extreme detail so EVERY SINGLE PLAYER can do that kill considering they execute the tactic in an adequate way... So it's all so interesting for people who ain't that hardcore...lol.. Which is what happens in the best selling MMORPG atm and in that game "it's alright" and it's no "insult to our subscriptions".
But this is ? Seriously.... lol...Made my day For one, I don't see any difference...
Comments
Lemme explain the high end raider's frustration. I am one of this players competeing for worlwide firsts. We are top on our servers but lemme explain what has happened to us since the begining of the expansion.
Expansion comes out. we cant truly group with each other and explore the dungeons. Dungeon exp is horrible and not worth the effort. we can do 3 quests in 20 minutes solo that equals better exp then spending 2 hours to fight to the bottom of a buggy dungeon with named mobs that have a 10% chance to drop anything worth a crap.
We level up. We learn the encounters. 2 months in to the expansion without any notice or posting or NO WORDS AT ALL ON UPDATE OR TEST, they change 3 encounters. 2 of them are severely bugged. We assume, of course we couldnt get anyone to acknowledge if thats intended or not.
Couple patches later they fix it.
Then they announce avator contested are coming back to the game. They release them. some are extremely hard, some are basically impossible. They ones that were hard we figured out how to kill. Then next patch without any notice or hints or anything in patvh notes or anything they are upped MAJORLY and made near impossible.
The end mob in In VP has a 45k lifetap since release. We have been basically told they arent done with him and he will be avaiable to kill soon. Well with NO patch notes or any hints or anything NPU kills him serverwide first. WOW he was killable? How did NPU know? Noone else did....
Secondly this encounter was the one in the letter they got to beta test. GUESS WHAT! I have pulled this mob. It is the same as the letter. Yeah we are working on killing it but we have only gotten what 6 or so nights worth of trying to learn it. AFTER NPU kills it and lets everyone else know they took away the 45k lifetap.
This is getting old. NPU can actually petition or ask questions to figure out iif content is working as intended but they rest of us just struggle by wondering if stuff is working as intended.
A lot of the high end players are not happy because a lot of the content is just not fun. Avator fights where if you cast a beneficial spell you have a 25% chance of getting stunned/mezzed/rooted/feared for 20 seconds. Making you enable to play your character well over half the fight. Not playing your character from being mezzed is not very fun.
The loot in VP is not as good as the loot in the first tier of raids in expansion.
This issue is all over the internet and it is getting really old. Personally, I could care less if they are leaking information, that just means better resources for the rest of us. I don't understand why it is so important to have world firsts for mob kills. If one guild kills it before you, does that mean they are better? No, it just means they died more times.
I would completely understand 1000% if they raided these mobs on a normal ruleset server and transfered to PvP or exchange. It would be completely unfair to the rest of the players at that point. But on PvE, there is no player competition, so why care?
I was one of the people who actually believed that SOE had learned something from the PR fiascos of the past and over the last few years defended SOE here on multiple occasions.
Well this most recent mess has made me lost all the respect I had for them, and I for one will not give SOE my money anymore. It took me a while to realize it but SOE really is as badly run company as their reputation might indicate.
Also my change of mind doesn't really have to do with them leaking strats or anything like that but the general way they try run their community. Which to me shows their utter lack of will to engage in any kind of real communication between them and the whole community.
Well congrats SOE you managed to alienate another loyal customer.
Obviously that is not the case.
There is competition, to be the "first" to do, find or defeat something on each server, regardless of the ruleset. Sony itself encourages this by noting on the players site the names of individual players and guilds who have achieved these marks.
Now, you can argue that such a competition is silly or worthless. But to ignore that it exists and that it is a very important part of the game for some people is simply incorrect.
I am not a raider, nor do I pretend to understand the mindset of those who are hard-core raiders. But I do understand that within that mindset, they hold a set of values and goals that are different than mine in the game and that they are very much entitled to do so without prejudice.
And, this ain't over yet folks. Seems they found another example of a dev giving info out to his guild (this time it was a bug report from an unsuspecting player) and the dev encouraged his guildies to make use of the bug/exploit while he "turned his head" to the whole deal. This has been confirmed by the guild leader. Also, the same source claims that the dev told his guild to hurry, because the bug was in the process of being fixed.
I am a huge fan of EQ2. I am a casual player, and to that extent I lose little if indeed anything when one guild gets unfair help over another in raiding instances.
Nonetheless, it seems to me that unfair is unfair, and wrong is wrong, and there are no excuses in making the choice to cheat.
Of course, I realize that this is the internet, and the above might well be out-moded thinking these days.
LINK: www.eq2flames.com/general-gameplay/22820-back-you-soe.html
Seems to me, the people that need to learn to keep their goddamned mouths shut are the ones that the GM's give these oppurtunities so people stop freaking out about NOTHING.
Yup.
I have to face it, I guess. I have an outmoded way of thinking in an internet-dominated, pseudo-anonymous, us-versus-them, winning-is-the-only-thing kind of world.
I'll live with it.
And EQ2 is still the best MMO out there of it's kind, currently.
Good luck, everyone.
NPU admitted before RoK came out that they beta test content just so that they can be the first to beat it when it goes live.
Those people that say that they are upset because they are competetive aren't as competetive as they think they are. Obviousely there is another group of players that are competetive enough to use test as a means of learning the encounters so that they can be better.
If some of you are really that competetive then why isn't your guild testing this stuff to?
Wish Darkfall would release.
NPU admitted before RoK came out that they beta test content just so that they can be the first to beat it when it goes live.
Those people that say that they are upset because they are competetive aren't as competetive as they think they are. Obviousely there is another group of players that are competetive enough to use test as a means of learning the encounters so that they can be better.
If some of you are really that competetive then why isn't your guild testing this stuff to?
That is such a brilliant post, until you ACTUALLY READ the prior post. LOL. Seriously, pay attention here. Mobs put into the game BROKEN. Sometimes mistakenly, sometimes on purpose. IN GAME, live, ready to roll, NO BETA, in game, already active mobs walking around, waiting to die. A lot of times these "broken" things are very evident, 45k ae drains, 100k ae blasts, 50k melee double hits. Sometimes they are subtle, like adds multiplying exponentially, 2 adds, 4 adds, 8 adds, 16 adds, I saw people running away from 50 adds during (after) a contested fight. Or my favorite when the epic calls out everyone's name in the raid in about 30 seconds and one touch kills them instantly. Hey, at least there wasn't any doubt, lol.
Soooo, yes, we can hit the zone/contested every day and test whether anything is changed, OR wait for SOE to say in a patch "blah blah is changed or fixed" (never happens), OR have 3 devs IN my guild (they are members of the guild) to not only tell me he's fixed, but give me the EXACT strat to kill him.
"Granted thinking for yourself could be considered a timesink of shorter or longer duration depending on how smart..or how dumb you are."
The above was a PM (which is now posted on the EQ2 site itself) from an EQ2 Dev to his guild leader, quoting the text of a bug report that was sent to the dev by an unsuspecting user. By "look(ing) the other way" the dev is not only alerting his guild leader to the problem/bug/exploit but also saying that he will not do anything to stop them from using it nor will he fix it until they get their epics.
Wrong is wrong and cheating is cheating, people.
At least it is in the country I was raised in.
Your mileage, of course, may vary.
Tell me something... where in hell in that pm does the dev say that he will not do anything to stop them from using it nor will he fix it? Either you just posted part of the pm, or he didn't say that anywhere. What I see is a request to get the exploit fixed and that they will not take advantage of it even if other people do. Thats NOT cheating, its responsible behavior. So what are you smoking?
He's not saying that he's going to do nothing. He's pointing out what others are doing.
Holy crap you people are paranoid and desperate to spread the hate. Here's an idea... either protest WHERE IT BELONGS or don't bother protesting anything at all. Whining about it HERE isn't going to do anything at all other than get people riled up. You're upset about something? Go to the EQ2 forums.
Oh and just a thought... why don't you talk to the damned dev yourself, huh? You do know you can pm the devs are the EQ2 forums right? Or are you just here to stir up trouble because you don't have all the facts and find it amusing?
I'm honestly so tired of people coming in here and complaining when they should actually be going to the source. MMORPG can't do ANYTHING about your issues with a game. Not a single one of them can. If you have a problem, you need to go to the source of the problem.
its like checking into a hotel, having issues with your stay, but not complaining to the actual staff, instead you go to a completely different hotel and complain where they can't do anything. You have no right to complain if you're not going to do it to the people that can actually FIX IT.
totally agree so many people flaming and showing their anger for something they're not happy about... the forums here is filled with negative stuff about all games really...
MMORPG should remove all these postings it's just filling forum and really don't serve any purpose at all except getting people annoyed that people can't get over the fact that life is not spinning around them and it's actually they're spinning around life.
Tell me something... where in hell in that pm does the dev say that he will not do anything to stop them from using it nor will he fix it? Either you just posted part of the pm, or he didn't say that anywhere. What I see is a request to get the exploit fixed and that they will not take advantage of it even if other people do. Thats NOT cheating, its responsible behavior. So what are you smoking?
He's not saying that he's going to do nothing. He's pointing out what others are doing.
Holy crap you people are paranoid and desperate to spread the hate. Here's an idea... either protest WHERE IT BELONGS or don't bother protesting anything at all. Whining about it HERE isn't going to do anything at all other than get people riled up. You're upset about something? Go to the EQ2 forums.
Oh and just a thought... why don't you talk to the damned dev yourself, huh? You do know you can pm the devs are the EQ2 forums right? Or are you just here to stir up trouble because you don't have all the facts and find it amusing?
I'm honestly so tired of people coming in here and complaining when they should actually be going to the source. MMORPG can't do ANYTHING about your issues with a game. Not a single one of them can. If you have a problem, you need to go to the source of the problem.
its like checking into a hotel, having issues with your stay, but not complaining to the actual staff, instead you go to a completely different hotel and complain where they can't do anything. You have no right to complain if you're not going to do it to the people that can actually FIX IT.
Couple things:
First and foremost he should never have posted a bug report to anyone outside of Sony. There is a strict rule on what you are allowed to tell people outside the company and what you are not allowed to tell them. Bug reports that show game breaking information, or encounter breaking information are one of those things he should not have given them. If he was worried about them using the bug, then he should have explained to them there was situations with the encounter that can cause bugs and warn them that if they come across it NOT to use it.
You don't give someone who doesn't know about the bug, a sheet that explains a step by step process on how to recreate it. That is just asking for abuse. If when I was at SCE we had posted a bug report to users on a ps2/psp/ps3 game I had been working on that helped them pass content a tester had sent me I would have been fired. No questions asked. When you start working there, you have certain rights and responsibilities, and one of those is to protect not only the integrity of the game, but the companies ability to keep that game making money which in turn pays your check. If players are not confident that you are protecting the enviornment in which they play, and that users are getting "a leg up" because a dev is in their guild, this can turn into a mass exodus of players leaving the game which detracts from your check, and everyone elses check and bonuses at the end of the year.
Second, people post here because A) its not moderated against negative feedback like soe forums are, and
they like the site. If you don't want to read threads like this, there is the old saying of "don't click the link"
The people that are trying to make the world worse never take a day off , why should I. Light up the darkness Bob Marley
I love how all the fanboyz and SOE bootlickers come out of the woodwork when someone bashes SOE....Even when presented with undeniable evidence that SOE Devs did leak strats and exploits to NPU and other guilds they take up the cause and tell us it's OK that they did it because "It's SOE and they are GOD"
they cheated you...and you don't care...No other guild will ever be able to get the world wide firsts across ALL of EQ2 that NPU did and they cheated to do it...That could have been your guild...but it can't be now....You PAY to have the same chance as everyone else that pays to play...
If this were a free game I would say you have no gripe....but your money is now wasted because SOE Devs cheated you out of it...
What else have they cheated you out of? Moving entire guilds from Test server with gear and items intact...TEST server where double experience is the norm? They didn't EARN those level 80 characters like you did...but SOE had no problem moving them to a live PVE server now did they?
SOE is pathetic, they have zero customer input, there is no method to complain if something is wrong with your class...."working as intended" is their mantra and they don't give a rat's a$$ if you are not happy...because there are enough fan boys and boot lickers playing EQ2 that worship SOE...
You are all a bunch of sheeple....
"Holy crap you people are paranoid and desperate to spread the hate. Here's an idea... either protest WHERE IT BELONGS or don't bother protesting anything at all. Whining about it HERE isn't going to do anything at all other than get people riled up. You're upset about something? Go to the EQ2 forums."
Unfortunately, you are incorrect here as well. First off, I am probably one of the biggest EQ2 fanois around here. I love the game, still play and consider it still the finest MMO of its kind. However, as I have stated several times before, wrong is wrong and cheating is cheating. There is obviously a problem at SOE, and they need to fix it.
The reason I post here is because this is a forum concerning issues surrounding EQ2, and the issue is perfectly applicable to the topic here (which I did not start, by the way). Are you willing to tell the folks who run MMORPG that since this topic somehow disturbs or frightens you, I should not be allowed to post the facts? Let me know how that works out for you.
"Oh and just a thought... why don't you talk to the damned dev yourself, huh?"
You know, if there is any "hate" here ( as you've accused me of harboring) it seems it is not coming from me. This is a legitimate discussion of a serious issue with a game we play and enjoy. Why would you not want other users to know that there is a problem? Why would you keep that information from them? Why would you rather no one speaks of it here? Just why are you so "deperate" to keep a lid on this? (See how easily it can be turned around?)
"You do know you can pm the devs are the EQ2 forums right? Or are you just here to stir up trouble because you don't have all the facts and find it amusing?"
How do you know that I haven't? You assume much.
The facts are posted on Sony's EQ2 website and the EQ2flames website. Please, if having to deal with these facts upsets you so much, feel free to look them up for yourself. In the meantime, I am happy to discuss the issue with anyone, and will continue to do so until MMORPG decides otherwise.
"I'm honestly so tired of people coming in here and complaining when they should actually be going to the source. MMORPG can't do ANYTHING about your issues with a game. Not a single one of them can. If you have a problem, you need to go to the source of the problem."
I did not post here to alert MMORPG to the problem, I posted to alert EQ2 users who use MMORPG in the manner it was intended, of the problem. Again, one has to wonder why an open and honest discussion of the facts causes you such pain and frustration?
"its like checking into a hotel, having issues with your stay, but not complaining to the actual staff, instead you go to a completely different hotel and complain where they can't do anything. You have no right to complain if you're not going to do it to the people that can actually FIX IT."
No, actually it is more like complaining to the hotel directly, and then going online to a hotel discussion website and alerting others who have an interest in staying in hotels about your experience. Somehow, you've simply assumed that I (and many, many others) have not written to Sony about this and that I came here to cause some kind of "trouble". While I am a fanboi and I love the game, I am also an adult and am capable of hearing and dealing with the truth, whether it be good or bad, about a company whose service I purchase. If you cannot, and this topic causes you so much anger and frustration, please feel free to put me on ignore.
Good luck to you.
you might moderate your community forums with men in black, trained to hunt down and delete anything even slightly negative about EQ2 or SOE...But other forums are not beholding to you gestapo style of moderation. Where we can't simply go to teh SOE official forums and demand to know why a SOE dev gave this information to high level raiding guilds so they can cheat...we CAN and WILL post this information so that players can make their own informed choice on wether they want to continue to play a game loaded with cheaters OR start playing a game loaded with CHEATERS...
So yes, this information serves a very strong purpose...we can bypass your MIB moderators and STILL get the word out to your customer who you have cheated....
you might moderate your community forums with men in black, trained to hunt down and delete anything even slightly negative about EQ2 or SOE...But other forums are not beholding to you gestapo style of moderation. Where we can't simply go to teh SOE official forums and demand to know why a SOE dev gave this information to high level raiding guilds so they can cheat...we CAN and WILL post this information so that players can make their own informed choice on wether they want to continue to play a game loaded with cheaters OR start playing a game loaded with CHEATERS...
So yes, this information serves a very strong purpose...we can bypass your MIB moderators and STILL get the word out to your customer who you have cheated....
You're quite funny guy actually..
Amuses me to see the low activty in the inner circle. This is not about removing negative stuff about EQ2 or SOE in particular it goes for all games as for my consern.
As for your claim about cheaters you find them in all games there is not one out there which don't have people cheating or exploting weaknesses in the game mechanics which is basically cheating light if you want so don't even try give me that crap.
I actually liked one of the japan game server that specifically blocked players from XXX because players from XXX is renowned for doing everything they can to find weaknesses to exploit.
And the 1st one to call cheaters is usally a player from XXX.. it's sad really that players gives the whole country such a reputation.
If people want to play a game without encoutering cheating/exploit of some sort then mmo is not your best choice.
Maybe some board games or a LAN game with your friends is a better option then you can at least be sure that the level of cheating is zero unless you got a bunch of friends that cheats, then solitare might be the right game for you so you don't get cheated by others.
This thread on the while IMO is very re;evant to the game of EQ2,the source of the trouble has most certainly soured my feelings towards the integrity of the game and as this is a public forum its very nessacery to bring these matters up when they occur.
What does amazed me over at the official forums the mods have let a thread dedicated to this very subject run and run where normally they lock and ban threads they dont like with frightening regularity and thats why this sort of thread turns up on here and thats the way it should be.
When you stop calling me a "bootlicker" like a five year old, you'll get a better reaction. Grow up please.
When you stop calling me a "bootlicker" like a five year old, you'll get a better reaction. Grow up please.
Yes, there is cheating in all games and people from CHINA (for those of you who are too politically correct to say so) are the largest contributor to the cheating that goes on. it appears that they enjoy the game by trying anything and everything they can to exploit it for RMT...
BUT I Play (or did) EQ2 I don't (or didn't) care about cheating in other games....and this wasn't some outsider exploiting game mechanics or selling in game coin...These were SOE EMPLOYEES...the same people you supply a pay check to every week with YOUR hard earned money. And yet you turn a blind eye to it, think it's OK or ignore it and go on in your little world where SOE could not possibly do anything wrong....
Like I said...sheeple
<modedit>
i would like to say BAN CCP....the devs there corrupted the economy with BPOs and ruined it for those who were striving fairly as well!!!!
(this is hysterical btw.....sad sad people)
QFE
"If we don't attack them, they will attack us first. So we'd better retaliate before they have a chance to strike"
Yeah why help guilds when they can put the encounter on a test realm for a month, have GMs observe the raids + death touch the bosses / give out the tactics ?
Then all the loot will be up for everyone to see and we can know all the loot tables before even being able to play the raid...
So by the time the content is live it's already "old".
Bosses beaten, complete list of loot known...We're already prepared for it...
Then...As soon as it hits live we just form up our raid, go there and use our known tactic to get loot we already know it's there...
Ofc then we can post the FULL tactic on a popular site with info on raid setup / tactics + gear needed with extreme detail so EVERY SINGLE PLAYER can do that kill considering they execute the tactic in an adequate way...
So it's all so interesting for people who ain't that hardcore...lol..
Which is what happens in the best selling MMORPG atm and in that game "it's alright" and it's no "insult to our subscriptions".
But this is ?
Seriously.... lol...Made my day
For one, I don't see any difference...
Exactly.
But corruption is bad..M'kay? :P