When some one releases a solid, polished, AAA, sandbox style MMO, then we'll see how much potential they have. Until that point, theres no way anyone can back up the claim that a sandbox MMO wont sell. I mean, you would think that, since all of the WOW clones have failed to meet expectations we might be past the idea that linear, theme park style MMOs are "it".
Originally posted by elvenangel i dont know how anyone can be inspired by second life...most of it looks like crap since everything except the basics is player made, there's no continuity between the areas, there's alot of porn freaks, Goons, and everything else skulking around. Its just a bunch of player made areas jammed together full of porn or people trying to make RL money off you. Its a Virtual World that hides behind the F2P tag despite RL money being needed to buy property / items / sexual organs/ etc in the world. Its not a game...its a set of virtual chat rooms...full of all the weird obsessive folks. Atleast UO was a game...you were able to take on whatever role you wanted..even if it meant you played a dead carcass most of the time. But you were still apart of the UO world..everything 'fit' together (until they trammelized it).
SL is not a popular topic around here I always try to avoid bringing it up. much what you say about SL is true but there is some interesting sims in there. I enjoyed visiting Midgar city (final fantasy entire CITY) for a minute
I was disappointed by some of the adult sims there I'm not interested in role playing out some sort of virtual romance or dating. I was mostly fascinated by the various entertaining sims people made that wasnt rated XXX
edit- In midgair city people roleplay as Shinra or Rebels. They fight creatures and level up. Theres a few other mini-RPGs in there as well. [edit2] it should be noted the creatures might be players and they all just doing RP so dont go d/l SL thinking is FF7 or something
SL doesnt feel gamey enough for me but I think if this idea was evolved it could be really huge. There is really a lot of different ways this model can be drastically refined (like developer only provides the toys etc)
developer only making the toys would destroy any hopeful of competing with second life, you'd really would just be another chat program(not to say it couldn't be sucessful) that is stuck expensivly making amusements for the player base every week or so. The only reason people are drawn to it is because they can do what they want exactly how they want it. This pretty much requires a stupid simple creating method, even though developers would think it makes more sense to do otherwise it doesn't.
This is from the closest thing you'd see to a second life fanboy on these forums, and even then I'd jump boat to the next second life that offers nice creation tools with only half a thought. But it won't make a dent anyways since I have more interesting projects to work on, the chat program only being something to chill out and show off now type thing (you can show off IT skills without alienating yourself by being a nerd, or being intimidating by having people think you're smarter than them. people are actually interested in what you do it's kinda nice to be able to actively talk about something you've worked on for a few hours or up to a week depending on the scope).
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now back on topic, sand boxes out right now suck really really bad. or after playing one(wurmonline) devotely for two years you don't want to play anymore, you really can't expect the few sandbox games that are compatible with you to stay so forever.
I find it amazing that by 2020 first world countries will be competing to get immigrants.
Originally posted by paulscott developer only making the toys would destroy any hopeful of competing with second life, you'd really would just be another chat program(not to say it couldn't be sucessful) that is stuck expensivly making amusements for the player base every week or so. The only reason people are drawn to it is because they can do what they want exactly how they want it. This pretty much requires a stupid simple creating method, even though developers would think it makes more sense to do otherwise it doesn't. This is from the closest thing you'd see to a second life fanboy on these forums, and even then I'd jump boat to the next second life that offers nice creation tools with only half a thought. But it won't make a dent anyways since I have more interesting projects to work on, the chat program only being something to chill out and show off now type thing (you can show off IT skills without alienating yourself by being a nerd, or being intimidating by having people think you're smarter than them. people are actually interested in what you do it's kinda nice to be able to actively talk about something you've worked on for a few hours or up to a week depending on the scope).
__________________________edit_________________ now back on topic, sand boxes out right now suck really really bad. or after playing one(wurmonline) devotely for two years you don't want to play anymore, you really can't expect the few sandbox games that are compatible with you to stay so forever.
SL is a trendsetter (or alpha if you prefer). You dont go after an alpha unless you are vastly superior or way different.
There is some interesting ways to knockdown the top dog. SL is very, very un-gamey... Some of the mini-worlds I visited felt more like hacks how they tried to introduce combat... Maybe they were poorly conceived but I checked out quite a few
Along these lines, I think a lot of people are really over looking the potential of something like Metaplace. I havent been keeping up with them much lately, but Im really hoping they can pull it off, theres just tons of potential there. I mean, if it turns out to be a solid, accessible toolset, theres really not limit to what we might see. Not to mention, Raphs new MMO will be built with Metaplace...
V (OP), I note from your posts in this thread that your saying that a true sandbox game has nothing that has not been created by you, "if EVE sandbox then you should start on an Asteriod in empty space" I believe was your line.
Can I direct your attention to a window please... the real world is sandbox (please agree) and yet I am not alone in a desert. People have been here before us, and have built quite a bit. Sandbox permits me to go and knock down their creations and/or have me make new stuff of my own.
I think this is part of the prob. many of you have stated that we have no 'AAA' sandbox games, as a modest (ability rather than behaviour) developer I must highlight the complexity in building a Sandbox-RPG, but even more must be done to populate this world so that folk dont end up in a desert or a lonley asteriod (unless they go and find these environments beyond the populated areas).
In short, I have a dream, a game which will incorporate all that we want, and be of the genre that we're looking for (lets not forget we all want something different)... but its just a matter of time.
Its easier to build WOW clones than 'the dream game', and for now at least many developers are trying to push back the envelope... but its a race between how much they can do and when their investors want a return, hence small steps....
Comments
When some one releases a solid, polished, AAA, sandbox style MMO, then we'll see how much potential they have. Until that point, theres no way anyone can back up the claim that a sandbox MMO wont sell. I mean, you would think that, since all of the WOW clones have failed to meet expectations we might be past the idea that linear, theme park style MMOs are "it".
SL is not a popular topic around here I always try to avoid bringing it up. much what you say about SL is true but there is some interesting sims in there. I enjoyed visiting Midgar city (final fantasy entire CITY) for a minute
I was disappointed by some of the adult sims there I'm not interested in role playing out some sort of virtual romance or dating. I was mostly fascinated by the various entertaining sims people made that wasnt rated XXX
edit- In midgair city people roleplay as Shinra or Rebels. They fight creatures and level up. Theres a few other mini-RPGs in there as well. [edit2] it should be noted the creatures might be players and they all just doing RP so dont go d/l SL thinking is FF7 or something
SL doesnt feel gamey enough for me but I think if this idea was evolved it could be really huge. There is really a lot of different ways this model can be drastically refined (like developer only provides the toys etc)
developer only making the toys would destroy any hopeful of competing with second life, you'd really would just be another chat program(not to say it couldn't be sucessful) that is stuck expensivly making amusements for the player base every week or so. The only reason people are drawn to it is because they can do what they want exactly how they want it. This pretty much requires a stupid simple creating method, even though developers would think it makes more sense to do otherwise it doesn't.
This is from the closest thing you'd see to a second life fanboy on these forums, and even then I'd jump boat to the next second life that offers nice creation tools with only half a thought. But it won't make a dent anyways since I have more interesting projects to work on, the chat program only being something to chill out and show off now type thing (you can show off IT skills without alienating yourself by being a nerd, or being intimidating by having people think you're smarter than them. people are actually interested in what you do it's kinda nice to be able to actively talk about something you've worked on for a few hours or up to a week depending on the scope).
__________________________edit_________________
now back on topic, sand boxes out right now suck really really bad. or after playing one(wurmonline) devotely for two years you don't want to play anymore, you really can't expect the few sandbox games that are compatible with you to stay so forever.
I find it amazing that by 2020 first world countries will be competing to get immigrants.
SL is a trendsetter (or alpha if you prefer). You dont go after an alpha unless you are vastly superior or way different.
There is some interesting ways to knockdown the top dog. SL is very, very un-gamey... Some of the mini-worlds I visited felt more like hacks how they tried to introduce combat... Maybe they were poorly conceived but I checked out quite a few
Along these lines, I think a lot of people are really over looking the potential of something like Metaplace. I havent been keeping up with them much lately, but Im really hoping they can pull it off, theres just tons of potential there. I mean, if it turns out to be a solid, accessible toolset, theres really not limit to what we might see. Not to mention, Raphs new MMO will be built with Metaplace...
V (OP), I note from your posts in this thread that your saying that a true sandbox game has nothing that has not been created by you, "if EVE sandbox then you should start on an Asteriod in empty space" I believe was your line.
Can I direct your attention to a window please... the real world is sandbox (please agree) and yet I am not alone in a desert. People have been here before us, and have built quite a bit. Sandbox permits me to go and knock down their creations and/or have me make new stuff of my own.
I think this is part of the prob. many of you have stated that we have no 'AAA' sandbox games, as a modest (ability rather than behaviour) developer I must highlight the complexity in building a Sandbox-RPG, but even more must be done to populate this world so that folk dont end up in a desert or a lonley asteriod (unless they go and find these environments beyond the populated areas).
In short, I have a dream, a game which will incorporate all that we want, and be of the genre that we're looking for (lets not forget we all want something different)... but its just a matter of time.
Its easier to build WOW clones than 'the dream game', and for now at least many developers are trying to push back the envelope... but its a race between how much they can do and when their investors want a return, hence small steps....