I played it to 59 or so, 1 level from max and than i just relised. This game sucks The only reason i did not notice this earlier was because i was playing it with frindes but the last week it was like, hanging around and chatting only. The game is dull, really nothing to do and even if landsacape was pritty nice i hated character models and animations simply sucked plus non existant pvp. Thinking back of it i woulde't even give this game 2/10,
What did you play to level 59? If it was LoTRO, you must be playing a version that is not available to anyone else, because max level is 50. And based on that part of your analysis being wrong, I guess we can question the rest because it must be another game you played.
LOTRO isnt the problem, the MMO genre is the problem. LOTRO is simply an evolution, there hasn't been a revolution since EQ.
That being said, LOTRO is currently and for the near future the best MMO available. There is a very good chance as the story progresses, LOTRO will become amazing. LOTRO is perfect for the gamer who wants to play an MMO, but can not devote their LIFE to playing an MMO. The community is excellent, the developers are very skilled and player friendly. There is a very bright future for LOTRO.
I do understand complaints about depth, but the game has only been out a year, give it some time to evolve. I also understand the point of the world being too perfect, I too would love to take a troll and run around bashing in some hobbit skull. I know monster play, but its not the same.
LOTRO is lacking the fantasy that many enjoy, this is a result of trying to be too realistic and following the LOTR lore. I wish Turbine could open up the world a bit more and introduce more spells, magic, creatures such as dragons and such. I'm tired of beating pigs over the head with a stick.
LOTRO isnt the problem, the MMO genre is the problem. LOTRO is simply an evolution, there hasn't been a revolution since EQ.
Actually... I think the last true revolution in the MMORPG market would have been EvE Online. Albeit, I don't enjoy EvE, but it's definitely unique from the vast majority of MMORPG's out there.
LOTRO is lacking the fantasy that many enjoy, this is a result of trying to be too realistic and following the LOTR lore. I wish Turbine could open up the world a bit more and introduce more spells, magic, creatures such as dragons and such. I'm tired of beating pigs over the head with a stick.
Actually this is why the game is good. it is not a bastardization of fantasy conventions. It tries to portray, as much as possible, a more pure less ridiculous fantasy world.
Otherwise you get things like... frog races? Big cat people and lizard people with flying carpets and npc's with riciculous names.
Sorry but I for one am a bit tired of the no holds barred fantasy worlds with everything thrown in but the kitchen sink.
One night I was playing a bit of wow... do so for about 30 minutes or so and then I signed into LOTRO. It was like a breath of fresh air.
The problem is that players don't want to play in middle earth. They want a fantasy world with flying dragons and "uber" magic, etc.
There is no sense of boundaries, no sense of design other than to throw something in "just because".
Oh sure, there are way to many static mobs in LOTRO that are standing around to annoy me from getting to where I want to go because I have to constantly dismount to kill them or they are just there to "be killed' But when I am on my horse, riding through the misty mountains area in a blizzard and I see the faint glow of goblin fires in the distance I am reminded as to why I actually play LOTRO.
It feels clean and pure and less ridiculous than most other games out there. Even if it does have a variety of somewhat tired MMO cliches.
Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb."
I reconsider, you're right about the effect too much disconnected fantasy having a negative effect on LOTRO. If I saw a frog flying across the map on a magic carpet, it would be time to quit playing.
Although, what would be wrong with an elf flying across the map on an eagle?
LOTRO is lacking the fantasy that many enjoy, this is a result of trying to be too realistic and following the LOTR lore. I wish Turbine could open up the world a bit more and introduce more spells, magic, creatures such as dragons and such. I'm tired of beating pigs over the head with a stick.
Actually this is why the game is good. it is not a bastardization of fantasy conventions. It tries to portray, as much as possible, a more pure less ridiculous fantasy world.
Otherwise you get things like... frog races? Big cat people and lizard people with flying carpets and npc's with riciculous names.
Sorry but I for one am a bit tired of the no holds barred fantasy worlds with everything thrown in but the kitchen sink.
One night I was playing a bit of wow... do so for about 30 minutes or so and then I signed into LOTRO. It was like a breath of fresh air.
The problem is that players don't want to play in middle earth. They want a fantasy world with flying dragons and "uber" magic, etc.
There is no sense of boundaries, no sense of design other than to throw something in "just because".
Oh sure, there are way to many static mobs in LOTRO that are standing around to annoy me from getting to where I want to go because I have to constantly dismount to kill them or they are just there to "be killed' But when I am on my horse, riding through the misty mountains area in a blizzard and I see the faint glow of goblin fires in the distance I am reminded as to why I actually play LOTRO.
It feels clean and pure and less ridiculous than most other games out there. Even if it does have a variety of somewhat tired MMO cliches.
This is exactly how I feel. Very well put.
****************************** Brandywine Global LFF chan "/joinchannel glff"
I reconsider, you're right about the effect too much disconnected fantasy having a negative effect on LOTRO. If I saw a frog flying across the map on a magic carpet, it would be time to quit playing. Although, what would be wrong with an elf flying across the map on an eagle?
Because the eagles were "people" not mounts. There is actually a post in this forum that lists several quotes from the books where the eagles mention that they "are only doing this as a favor (to paraphrase).
And only one being ever rode an eagle and that was gandalf. The rest were carried in talons.
I mean, that's the thing, this is one of the first "fantasy" settings for contemorary popular culture and actually is drawn from many norse myths among others. The original source was very carefully put together.
But players of today have been exposed to just enough dungeons and dragons along with other fantasy sources that the content seems a bit too quaint for them to get their minds around at times. Or to at least appreciate on other levels.
It's like watching old movies. I mean "really" old movies. The scenes are handled in such a way that they are much longer than today's movies, more time is taken by the actors. In several cases a scene will take a bit of time to actually "get going" because a character is taking his time down the stairs or is doing something and then after what seems a while another character will start dialoque. Older movies are more comfortable with their silences.
But it made sense back then. Today it could seem a bit precious because of the acting and the voices used (elocution, elocution, elocution!) and the pacing might be off to someone who is used to today's fast paced movies. If you don't put yourself or allow yourself tobe in a certain mindset it might be lost on you.
That is why I believe LOTRO is not really fully understood or appreciated. Because of its setting it is less bombastic, and in my words less (seemingly) tacky then some other games.
Keep in mind I like other games that have a bit more effects or wild gear, etc. But if I put those games side by side with LOTRO I can sometimes feel the heavy handedness of their content. The "everything but the kitchen sink" feeling.
To me LOTRO feels very clean. And because is sticks closely to a literary source it feels like it is knit together very solidly. It all makes sense and the composition seems very tight.
But yes, as I've mentioned elsewhere it does have its issues.
Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb."
I played the trial and really gave i a go. I have to agree the graghics were fab but it also felt slightly too clean and pretty. Almost like playing your Avatar in a holiday post card. I can totally understand why people play this game but it wasn't for me either. However I think its an issue generally today with MMO's. Almost all of the gameplay is rinse, repeat, ding! Level up and rinse and repeat again. No game has really pulled me in big time but there are some I really enjoyed and some of the key elements I liked in those were:
Neocron - Gritty world and even the main city had graffiti on the walls and strip joints going on. The crappiest apartment looked like something from Blade Runner. It felt real and had an edge to it.
Jumpgate - I had some freaky moments in this game. There were times when I would finish mining and be heading to a gate when a player pirate would show on my scanner. Watching them get closer on the radar whilst trying not to collide with the jumpgate was pretty unreal.
EVE - I remember exploring a hidden base I had just found when a pirate had scanned my location and warped in on top of me. Jammed me up and if it wasn't for me drones I would have been dead.
These are just moments in time with some of the MMO's I played but it brought about a feeling that 'shit' could really hit the fan at anytime. MMO's that move me need to have an element that everything is not all right. Even Tabula Rasa with bases being overran by aliens changes the gameplay somewhat especially if you have a mission there.
I am playing AoC and I am hoping to see some of these elements. Either way Jumpgate Evo should be enough.
LOTRO isnt the problem, the MMO genre is the problem. LOTRO is simply an evolution, there hasn't been a revolution since EQ.
Actually... I think the last true revolution in the MMORPG market would have been EvE Online. Albeit, I don't enjoy EvE, but it's definitely unique from the vast majority of MMORPG's out there.
i'd kinda agree with that, but also add that eq was more on the devolution side, introducing classes/levels + raiding. two very nasty things for the mmo genre.
we need more UO, eve, pre-cu swg games.
could we please get correspondent writers and moderators, on the eve forum at mmorpg.com, who are well-versed on eve-online and aren't just passersby pushing buttons? pretty please?
I love LoTRO myself but can see where you are coming from in a way. As far as lore and magic my Lore Master rarely has to beat anything and I really think his fireballs and my minstrels shouts and "ghost swords" stretch the lore almost to the limit. Well past the limit of lore to be honest.
Bottom line LoTRO may not be perfect but it is the height of fantasy MMO's right now.
- It performs great and looks good on almost any system
- balanced classes, all classes can solo or provide a valuable service to a group
- excelent community with a good customer base and friendly mature people
-has tons of content, good PvP ( PvMP)
-excellent crafting system
- a good housing system
-you can solo or group at any level
- player generated music system
- end game can be raid oriented or not. Your choice since crafted gear is just as good
- nice fluff with seasonal events, hobbies ( fishing) , live events etc
- continuous free expansions and a paid expansion coming up this summer
Now I can find flaws in each of those points and can point out games that have done some of the points better but take all these things and add them together and you cannot find a more complete fantasy MMORPG
I love LoTRO myself but can see where you are coming from in a way. As far as lore and magic my Lore Master rarely has to beat anything and I really think his fireballs and my minstrels shouts and "ghost swords" stretch the lore almost to the limit. Well past the limit of lore to be honest. Bottom line LoTRO may not be perfect but it is the height of fantasy MMO's right now. - It performs great and looks good on almost any system - balanced classes, all classes can solo or provide a valuable service to a group - excelent community with a good customer base and friendly mature people -has tons of content, good PvP ( PvMP) -excellent crafting system - a good housing system -you can solo or group at any level - player generated music system - end game can be raid oriented or not. Your choice since crafted gear is just as good - nice fluff with seasonal events, hobbies ( fishing) , live events etc - continuous free expansions and a paid expansion coming up this summer Now I can find flaws in each of those points and can point out games that have done some of the points better but take all these things and add them together and you cannot find a more complete fantasy MMORPG
I actually can forgive the "fireballs", "floating ghost swords and minstrel shouts because, though they do stretch the limits of what the lore stipulates, it really doesn't necessarily break it.
For instance, in the books (or movies for that matter) Gandalf or Elrond actually do "magic". It's not overused but it's there. It's almost as if it is so beyond the scope of "us" the reader (viewer) that it is not really necassary to go into the nitty gritty.
For instance, Elronds calling up the waters to wash the nazgul away and of course Gandalf's use of the phantamic horses.
That is magic. So, when a lore master calls into play his floating sword, what that says to me is that it is just a visual representation (done in an artful way) of what is going on.
Elrond is essentialy an "uber" lore master. The fireballs are science and his magic is a subtle one. It's just representation. I mean, who knows what effects Elrond or Gandalf actually see when they ply their art.
However, the real bending of the lore would be for example, the use of bree as a center for Elves, Humans and Hobbits and dwarves to meet and do therir thing. That is huge in breaking the lore. But the game makers recognize that there are some MMO conventions that need to be added in order to make it a successful "game". otherwise elves would never really come to certain parts of the world, same with dwarves.
This essentially is their best guess as to how to make the game functional without really messing the story elements up too much.
Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb."
Watch your Lore Master closely when you use a "Fireball". It almost looks like he's pulling a pinecone out of his pocket, setting it on fire, then throwing it at the target.
Watch your Lore Master closely when you use a "Fireball". It almost looks like he's pulling a pinecone out of his pocket, setting it on fire, then throwing it at the target.
Yeah I agree, and both of you guys are right. Lore had to be stretched a bit in order to accomplish good game play. Don't get me wrong I am not a similarian thumping lore preacher and always took the side of gameplay trumps lore all the way back to the MEO forums.
LOTRO isnt the problem, the MMO genre is the problem. LOTRO is simply an evolution, there hasn't been a revolution since EQ.
Actually... I think the last true revolution in the MMORPG market would have been EvE Online. Albeit, I don't enjoy EvE, but it's definitely unique from the vast majority of MMORPG's out there.
I would agree with this...EvE has changed the landscape...but also is a niche market
It is a proven fact that Fantasy MMO's are way more popular than Sci-Fi. Sales of Fantasy based MMO's certainly do much better...and the debate across the internet has raged as to why...
I think it has to do with "magic" or being magical...or someone or something you are not. EvE even though being futuristic, also has so many "realisms" about it, that people may not jump on that bandwagon.
I think the same problem has happened in LOTRO. Trying to go for a more realistic world has pulled many people away and to other more "Fantasy" like settings...and by keeping an almost copycat of mechanics has not helped either...
No revolution has happened yet in respects that all of the games out require the press your skill, watch your character hit...wait for skill refresh, hit again...Zzzz.
Lets hope some changes happen,....with AoC to start...as I would like a reason not to watch TV while I play the game...and maybe I can keep my attention on making sure I win a fight without falling asleep from the same skills over and over...
10/10 for the OP for posting this. It resumes the feeling i had playing LOTR. I never ever got the fun feeling i had on other mmo's when playing LOTR. I always had that empty, shallow feeling, playing lotr feels like working.
Watch your Lore Master closely when you use a "Fireball". It almost looks like he's pulling a pinecone out of his pocket, setting it on fire, then throwing it at the target.
Yeah very much like when gandalf did that in the Hobbit when they were being chased by the orcs and wargs.
****************************** Brandywine Global LFF chan "/joinchannel glff"
LOTRO isnt the problem, the MMO genre is the problem. LOTRO is simply an evolution, there hasn't been a revolution since EQ.
Actually... I think the last true revolution in the MMORPG market would have been EvE Online. Albeit, I don't enjoy EvE, but it's definitely unique from the vast majority of MMORPG's out there.
I would agree with this...EvE has changed the landscape...but also is a niche market
It is a proven fact that Fantasy MMO's are way more popular than Sci-Fi. Sales of Fantasy based MMO's certainly do much better...and the debate across the internet has raged as to why...
I think it has to do with "magic" or being magical...or someone or something you are not. EvE even though being futuristic, also has so many "realisms" about it, that people may not jump on that bandwagon.
I think the same problem has happened in LOTRO. Trying to go for a more realistic world has pulled many people away and to other more "Fantasy" like settings...and by keeping an almost copycat of mechanics has not helped either...
No revolution has happened yet in respects that all of the games out require the press your skill, watch your character hit...wait for skill refresh, hit again...Zzzz.
Lets hope some changes happen,....with AoC to start...as I would like a reason not to watch TV while I play the game...and maybe I can keep my attention on making sure I win a fight without falling asleep from the same skills over and over...
Actually... I think the reason why fantasy MMO's are more popular than Sci-Fi MMO's is attributed to the quality of MMO's that have come out. Listing of Sci-Fi MMO's:
SWG: Pre-CU, the game was quite popular. However, over time the game was loosing subs due to the lack of adequate attention by the SWG devs to fix bugs nor add content. Then, the CU came around which added levels to the game. And, the NGE came, which bastardized the whole game into the attempt (failing one) at being a WoW clone. Despite having the "Star Wars" tag on the game, it still ended up failing thanks to the NGE.
Planetside: It's a PvP focused game, which means it automatically has less interest due to not everyone liking PvP. It's also a MMOFPS rather than MMORPG. And, it's devs killed the game through lack of attention at fixing bugs and adding things that were totally unnecessary (the giant robots for example). Hence, why the game is on semi-life support atm.
Matrix Online: The game was fubared even before SoE took the reins to it.
Tabula Rasa: It launched way too early, and is now playing catchup (some stating that the catchup is failing). The game is decent, but nowhere near the enticing factor as a lot of the other Fantasy MMORPG's.
RFOnline: It's a PvP focused game, which means it automatically has less interest due to not everyone liking PvP. Other than that, I do not know much else about the game except that it went from subscription to being a free MMO.
AO: It had, some argue, one of the worst launches ever. It's also an extremely complicated skill system compared to basically every other MMO out there. And, it hasn't had a graphics update since it was launched, which will change in the near future. Therefore, currently it is automatically ignored by the graphics lovers. But, despite being the oldest sci-fi MMO I can remember, it is still chugging a long as a niche game.
EvE: It's an FFA PvP game, which means it has automatically less interest due to not everyone liking PvP. However, it is popular due to it being a fall-back for people who also enjoy PvP and sandbox games. But, currently, it is the most popular sci-fi MMO around.
Now, after listing those, I believe the reason why Fantasy is more popular than Sci-Fi in the MMO market is because a lot of the Sci-Fi MMO games just plain suck compared to the main Fantasy MMO's: WoW, LotRO, EQ2.
WoW: Despite it being disliked by many past players, it has many things that makes it popular. Ease of use, all classes can solo pretty well, runs on a ton of computers, well-established end game (if you enjoy PvP and raiding), well-established lore, and tons of other players to play with. However, it still follows the class/level system.
LotRO: It's does follow a lot of things that WoW has done, but has enough that truly sets it apart from WoW. It is low-fantasy for one (which is refreshing). Another is that it has more realistic graphics than WoW, but still runs well on most machines. Also, majority of the landscapes are beautiful. And, it can run dx10 (for the Vista users). And, the game is solo-friendly, with a lot of very good quest story lines.
EQ2: EQ2 came out around the same time as WoW. The game first started out trying to emulate EQ. It fell very badly due to WoW draining tons of players away. However, SoE did a revamp of the game and made it more WoW'ish. Unlike their attempt with NGE on SWG, they actually succeeded this time. The game world is vast (probably more vast than WoW) and there's tons of class choices that have a lot of subtle differences from one another. The game also became solo friendly with a focus on raiding at the end-game. And, the game is high fantasy, with a well-established lore (due to EQ).
I think this gives a good comparison between the Fantasy v. Sci-Fi MMO debate. However, I'd imagine that there's more games to compar, but my hands are tired from typing all of that.
I know in the first 6 - 8 weeks playing LOTRO, shortly after launch, I was ecstatic. To this day I think there hasnt been a more beautiful landscape than that of LOTRO. Every time they add a new place or things, I returned, played a while, and got bored after 2 weeks. Now, I have paused on purpose for about 4 weeks, partially to leave my main on level 45 to play in Forochel. To us Europeans Book 13 just came recently, so today I made my first trip into Forochel. By all means it looks great, and I am sure the stories behind the quests are interesting. But after playing LOTRO now with breaks long, I must say it never caught me like SWG, EQ2 or for a time even DAOC did. I cant say why, exactly. The world is gorgeous, the stories behind the quests are touching, I am a BIG LOTR fan, and still... I always feel that emptiness playing that game. One thing really pisses me off. Its that - sorry - WOW-mentality. ALWAYS people talking about splinter-mobs, crits, so many 10.000s mobs, so many 10.000 factions points. Gawd, its as if it were no funtime hobby, but a goddamn JOB! I know, maybe a Roleplayer server would have been better, but then I dont like hardcore roleplaying-nazis, always reminding me what is NO right in what I said/did. But there is a mentality only what is the next biggest mob, when to farm these and those points. WHY cant we just be some Elves/Hobbits/Dwarves/Men in Middle Earth for the love of mother and child!? I think what dissappoints me beyond this is that LOTRO is still a lightweight MMO for me. I dunno why. It certainly isnt that I am a hardcore player who wants harsh penalities or what. But *something* feels like it would be... hollow. And I cant rly say why. It feels like there is not... threat. No.... THING going on. It always cozy, comfortable places wanting some ... DELIVERY. I cant 100% put my finger on it, but it just does not catch me. Its all neat, cute places with delivery-problems. I dunno, sometimes I just wanted to stomp over all the neatness with a horde of ugly Trolls to shove my fist into the kind Hobbits, ethereal Elves and all the rest. What I loved in SWG was I could go into some fukked up cantina with scantly dressed dancers, some Stormtroopers harrassed me for my Papers, some bounty hunter jumped on me while I was ordering a drink and it was DARK and DIRTY and DANGEROUS. Despite the beauty, which also was there. Something along those lines. Ok, its Tolkien, I get it. Tolkien ppl dont use toilets and dont have sex, cause its clean. Right. Wow-ish clean. Fukk, maybe I should play AoC... despite the uber lag, at least some quest givers yell at me there. =P
Yep, yet another hate post by Elikal. Seriously mate, you should just give up on MMOs. Your posts are almost always "Why I dont like MMO X" or "This is what's wrong with MMO Y" or "I dont like the type of people who PLAY MMO Z". Its perfectly acceptable to voice your opinions about a game but we really dont need several meandering threads about how you dislike game X per forum. I really hope you find a game you enjoy but I suspect that unless some developer creates a game specifically designed for YOU, it wont be happening any time soon.
Comments
What did you play to level 59? If it was LoTRO, you must be playing a version that is not available to anyone else, because max level is 50. And based on that part of your analysis being wrong, I guess we can question the rest because it must be another game you played.
LOTRO isnt the problem, the MMO genre is the problem. LOTRO is simply an evolution, there hasn't been a revolution since EQ.
That being said, LOTRO is currently and for the near future the best MMO available. There is a very good chance as the story progresses, LOTRO will become amazing. LOTRO is perfect for the gamer who wants to play an MMO, but can not devote their LIFE to playing an MMO. The community is excellent, the developers are very skilled and player friendly. There is a very bright future for LOTRO.
I do understand complaints about depth, but the game has only been out a year, give it some time to evolve. I also understand the point of the world being too perfect, I too would love to take a troll and run around bashing in some hobbit skull. I know monster play, but its not the same.
LOTRO is lacking the fantasy that many enjoy, this is a result of trying to be too realistic and following the LOTR lore. I wish Turbine could open up the world a bit more and introduce more spells, magic, creatures such as dragons and such. I'm tired of beating pigs over the head with a stick.
Actually... I think the last true revolution in the MMORPG market would have been EvE Online. Albeit, I don't enjoy EvE, but it's definitely unique from the vast majority of MMORPG's out there.
Otherwise you get things like... frog races? Big cat people and lizard people with flying carpets and npc's with riciculous names.
Sorry but I for one am a bit tired of the no holds barred fantasy worlds with everything thrown in but the kitchen sink.
One night I was playing a bit of wow... do so for about 30 minutes or so and then I signed into LOTRO. It was like a breath of fresh air.
The problem is that players don't want to play in middle earth. They want a fantasy world with flying dragons and "uber" magic, etc.
There is no sense of boundaries, no sense of design other than to throw something in "just because".
Oh sure, there are way to many static mobs in LOTRO that are standing around to annoy me from getting to where I want to go because I have to constantly dismount to kill them or they are just there to "be killed' But when I am on my horse, riding through the misty mountains area in a blizzard and I see the faint glow of goblin fires in the distance I am reminded as to why I actually play LOTRO.
It feels clean and pure and less ridiculous than most other games out there. Even if it does have a variety of somewhat tired MMO cliches.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
I reconsider, you're right about the effect too much disconnected fantasy having a negative effect on LOTRO. If I saw a frog flying across the map on a magic carpet, it would be time to quit playing.
Although, what would be wrong with an elf flying across the map on an eagle?
Otherwise you get things like... frog races? Big cat people and lizard people with flying carpets and npc's with riciculous names.
Sorry but I for one am a bit tired of the no holds barred fantasy worlds with everything thrown in but the kitchen sink.
One night I was playing a bit of wow... do so for about 30 minutes or so and then I signed into LOTRO. It was like a breath of fresh air.
The problem is that players don't want to play in middle earth. They want a fantasy world with flying dragons and "uber" magic, etc.
There is no sense of boundaries, no sense of design other than to throw something in "just because".
Oh sure, there are way to many static mobs in LOTRO that are standing around to annoy me from getting to where I want to go because I have to constantly dismount to kill them or they are just there to "be killed' But when I am on my horse, riding through the misty mountains area in a blizzard and I see the faint glow of goblin fires in the distance I am reminded as to why I actually play LOTRO.
It feels clean and pure and less ridiculous than most other games out there. Even if it does have a variety of somewhat tired MMO cliches.
This is exactly how I feel. Very well put.
******************************
Brandywine Global LFF chan "/joinchannel glff"
Because the eagles were "people" not mounts. There is actually a post in this forum that lists several quotes from the books where the eagles mention that they "are only doing this as a favor (to paraphrase).
And only one being ever rode an eagle and that was gandalf. The rest were carried in talons.
I mean, that's the thing, this is one of the first "fantasy" settings for contemorary popular culture and actually is drawn from many norse myths among others. The original source was very carefully put together.
But players of today have been exposed to just enough dungeons and dragons along with other fantasy sources that the content seems a bit too quaint for them to get their minds around at times. Or to at least appreciate on other levels.
It's like watching old movies. I mean "really" old movies. The scenes are handled in such a way that they are much longer than today's movies, more time is taken by the actors. In several cases a scene will take a bit of time to actually "get going" because a character is taking his time down the stairs or is doing something and then after what seems a while another character will start dialoque. Older movies are more comfortable with their silences.
But it made sense back then. Today it could seem a bit precious because of the acting and the voices used (elocution, elocution, elocution!) and the pacing might be off to someone who is used to today's fast paced movies. If you don't put yourself or allow yourself tobe in a certain mindset it might be lost on you.
That is why I believe LOTRO is not really fully understood or appreciated. Because of its setting it is less bombastic, and in my words less (seemingly) tacky then some other games.
Keep in mind I like other games that have a bit more effects or wild gear, etc. But if I put those games side by side with LOTRO I can sometimes feel the heavy handedness of their content. The "everything but the kitchen sink" feeling.
To me LOTRO feels very clean. And because is sticks closely to a literary source it feels like it is knit together very solidly. It all makes sense and the composition seems very tight.
But yes, as I've mentioned elsewhere it does have its issues.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
I played the trial and really gave i a go. I have to agree the graghics were fab but it also felt slightly too clean and pretty. Almost like playing your Avatar in a holiday post card. I can totally understand why people play this game but it wasn't for me either. However I think its an issue generally today with MMO's. Almost all of the gameplay is rinse, repeat, ding! Level up and rinse and repeat again. No game has really pulled me in big time but there are some I really enjoyed and some of the key elements I liked in those were:
Neocron - Gritty world and even the main city had graffiti on the walls and strip joints going on. The crappiest apartment looked like something from Blade Runner. It felt real and had an edge to it.
Jumpgate - I had some freaky moments in this game. There were times when I would finish mining and be heading to a gate when a player pirate would show on my scanner. Watching them get closer on the radar whilst trying not to collide with the jumpgate was pretty unreal.
EVE - I remember exploring a hidden base I had just found when a pirate had scanned my location and warped in on top of me. Jammed me up and if it wasn't for me drones I would have been dead.
These are just moments in time with some of the MMO's I played but it brought about a feeling that 'shit' could really hit the fan at anytime. MMO's that move me need to have an element that everything is not all right. Even Tabula Rasa with bases being overran by aliens changes the gameplay somewhat especially if you have a mission there.
I am playing AoC and I am hoping to see some of these elements. Either way Jumpgate Evo should be enough.
Actually... I think the last true revolution in the MMORPG market would have been EvE Online. Albeit, I don't enjoy EvE, but it's definitely unique from the vast majority of MMORPG's out there.
i'd kinda agree with that, but also add that eq was more on the devolution side, introducing classes/levels + raiding. two very nasty things for the mmo genre.
we need more UO, eve, pre-cu swg games.
could we please get correspondent writers and moderators, on the eve forum at mmorpg.com, who are well-versed on eve-online and aren't just passersby pushing buttons? pretty please?
I love LoTRO myself but can see where you are coming from in a way. As far as lore and magic my Lore Master rarely has to beat anything and I really think his fireballs and my minstrels shouts and "ghost swords" stretch the lore almost to the limit. Well past the limit of lore to be honest.
Bottom line LoTRO may not be perfect but it is the height of fantasy MMO's right now.
- It performs great and looks good on almost any system
- balanced classes, all classes can solo or provide a valuable service to a group
- excelent community with a good customer base and friendly mature people
-has tons of content, good PvP ( PvMP)
-excellent crafting system
- a good housing system
-you can solo or group at any level
- player generated music system
- end game can be raid oriented or not. Your choice since crafted gear is just as good
- nice fluff with seasonal events, hobbies ( fishing) , live events etc
- continuous free expansions and a paid expansion coming up this summer
Now I can find flaws in each of those points and can point out games that have done some of the points better but take all these things and add them together and you cannot find a more complete fantasy MMORPG
I miss DAoC
For instance, in the books (or movies for that matter) Gandalf or Elrond actually do "magic". It's not overused but it's there. It's almost as if it is so beyond the scope of "us" the reader (viewer) that it is not really necassary to go into the nitty gritty.
For instance, Elronds calling up the waters to wash the nazgul away and of course Gandalf's use of the phantamic horses.
That is magic. So, when a lore master calls into play his floating sword, what that says to me is that it is just a visual representation (done in an artful way) of what is going on.
Elrond is essentialy an "uber" lore master. The fireballs are science and his magic is a subtle one. It's just representation. I mean, who knows what effects Elrond or Gandalf actually see when they ply their art.
However, the real bending of the lore would be for example, the use of bree as a center for Elves, Humans and Hobbits and dwarves to meet and do therir thing. That is huge in breaking the lore. But the game makers recognize that there are some MMO conventions that need to be added in order to make it a successful "game". otherwise elves would never really come to certain parts of the world, same with dwarves.
This essentially is their best guess as to how to make the game functional without really messing the story elements up too much.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
Watch your Lore Master closely when you use a "Fireball". It almost looks like he's pulling a pinecone out of his pocket, setting it on fire, then throwing it at the target.
Yeah I agree, and both of you guys are right. Lore had to be stretched a bit in order to accomplish good game play. Don't get me wrong I am not a similarian thumping lore preacher and always took the side of gameplay trumps lore all the way back to the MEO forums.
I miss DAoC
Actually... I think the last true revolution in the MMORPG market would have been EvE Online. Albeit, I don't enjoy EvE, but it's definitely unique from the vast majority of MMORPG's out there.
I would agree with this...EvE has changed the landscape...but also is a niche marketIt is a proven fact that Fantasy MMO's are way more popular than Sci-Fi. Sales of Fantasy based MMO's certainly do much better...and the debate across the internet has raged as to why...
I think it has to do with "magic" or being magical...or someone or something you are not. EvE even though being futuristic, also has so many "realisms" about it, that people may not jump on that bandwagon.
I think the same problem has happened in LOTRO. Trying to go for a more realistic world has pulled many people away and to other more "Fantasy" like settings...and by keeping an almost copycat of mechanics has not helped either...
No revolution has happened yet in respects that all of the games out require the press your skill, watch your character hit...wait for skill refresh, hit again...Zzzz.
Lets hope some changes happen,....with AoC to start...as I would like a reason not to watch TV while I play the game...and maybe I can keep my attention on making sure I win a fight without falling asleep from the same skills over and over...
10/10 for the OP for posting this. It resumes the feeling i had playing LOTR. I never ever got the fun feeling i had on other mmo's when playing LOTR. I always had that empty, shallow feeling, playing lotr feels like working.
Yeah very much like when gandalf did that in the Hobbit when they were being chased by the orcs and wargs.
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Brandywine Global LFF chan "/joinchannel glff"
Actually... I think the last true revolution in the MMORPG market would have been EvE Online. Albeit, I don't enjoy EvE, but it's definitely unique from the vast majority of MMORPG's out there.
I would agree with this...EvE has changed the landscape...but also is a niche marketIt is a proven fact that Fantasy MMO's are way more popular than Sci-Fi. Sales of Fantasy based MMO's certainly do much better...and the debate across the internet has raged as to why...
I think it has to do with "magic" or being magical...or someone or something you are not. EvE even though being futuristic, also has so many "realisms" about it, that people may not jump on that bandwagon.
I think the same problem has happened in LOTRO. Trying to go for a more realistic world has pulled many people away and to other more "Fantasy" like settings...and by keeping an almost copycat of mechanics has not helped either...
No revolution has happened yet in respects that all of the games out require the press your skill, watch your character hit...wait for skill refresh, hit again...Zzzz.
Lets hope some changes happen,....with AoC to start...as I would like a reason not to watch TV while I play the game...and maybe I can keep my attention on making sure I win a fight without falling asleep from the same skills over and over...
Actually... I think the reason why fantasy MMO's are more popular than Sci-Fi MMO's is attributed to the quality of MMO's that have come out. Listing of Sci-Fi MMO's:
SWG: Pre-CU, the game was quite popular. However, over time the game was loosing subs due to the lack of adequate attention by the SWG devs to fix bugs nor add content. Then, the CU came around which added levels to the game. And, the NGE came, which bastardized the whole game into the attempt (failing one) at being a WoW clone. Despite having the "Star Wars" tag on the game, it still ended up failing thanks to the NGE.
Planetside: It's a PvP focused game, which means it automatically has less interest due to not everyone liking PvP. It's also a MMOFPS rather than MMORPG. And, it's devs killed the game through lack of attention at fixing bugs and adding things that were totally unnecessary (the giant robots for example). Hence, why the game is on semi-life support atm.
Matrix Online: The game was fubared even before SoE took the reins to it.
Tabula Rasa: It launched way too early, and is now playing catchup (some stating that the catchup is failing). The game is decent, but nowhere near the enticing factor as a lot of the other Fantasy MMORPG's.
RFOnline: It's a PvP focused game, which means it automatically has less interest due to not everyone liking PvP. Other than that, I do not know much else about the game except that it went from subscription to being a free MMO.
AO: It had, some argue, one of the worst launches ever. It's also an extremely complicated skill system compared to basically every other MMO out there. And, it hasn't had a graphics update since it was launched, which will change in the near future. Therefore, currently it is automatically ignored by the graphics lovers. But, despite being the oldest sci-fi MMO I can remember, it is still chugging a long as a niche game.
EvE: It's an FFA PvP game, which means it has automatically less interest due to not everyone liking PvP. However, it is popular due to it being a fall-back for people who also enjoy PvP and sandbox games. But, currently, it is the most popular sci-fi MMO around.
Now, after listing those, I believe the reason why Fantasy is more popular than Sci-Fi in the MMO market is because a lot of the Sci-Fi MMO games just plain suck compared to the main Fantasy MMO's: WoW, LotRO, EQ2.
WoW: Despite it being disliked by many past players, it has many things that makes it popular. Ease of use, all classes can solo pretty well, runs on a ton of computers, well-established end game (if you enjoy PvP and raiding), well-established lore, and tons of other players to play with. However, it still follows the class/level system.
LotRO: It's does follow a lot of things that WoW has done, but has enough that truly sets it apart from WoW. It is low-fantasy for one (which is refreshing). Another is that it has more realistic graphics than WoW, but still runs well on most machines. Also, majority of the landscapes are beautiful. And, it can run dx10 (for the Vista users). And, the game is solo-friendly, with a lot of very good quest story lines.
EQ2: EQ2 came out around the same time as WoW. The game first started out trying to emulate EQ. It fell very badly due to WoW draining tons of players away. However, SoE did a revamp of the game and made it more WoW'ish. Unlike their attempt with NGE on SWG, they actually succeeded this time. The game world is vast (probably more vast than WoW) and there's tons of class choices that have a lot of subtle differences from one another. The game also became solo friendly with a focus on raiding at the end-game. And, the game is high fantasy, with a well-established lore (due to EQ).
I think this gives a good comparison between the Fantasy v. Sci-Fi MMO debate. However, I'd imagine that there's more games to compar, but my hands are tired from typing all of that.
S