AOC = Just Another Raiding Treadmill

tgainey

I’m really disappointed with this bit of information.  IGN posted up an exclusive look at AoC’s PvP and Raiding yesterday.  In the article they talk about Raiding and PvP in the “end-game” or rather max level.  The first waves of disappointment came when I read this:

“If you want to get the best armor and weapons in Age of Conan, you’re going to have to raid, something you can’t actually engage in until you hit level 80. There’ll still be dungeons that players can band together and delve into before the cap, but for large-scale, 24-player encounters against enormous bosses that require highly coordinated attack patterns to defeat, you’ll have to wait until the end game.”

*sigh*  So basically it’s another treadmill of raid to get gear to raid to get better gear to raid to get gear.  I thought we left that crap behind in World of Warcraft?  I’m tired of having to spend hours every night raiding dungeons for a chance at loot.  I’m tired of being forced to find 23 other players to even have a chance at getting good items or seeing epic encounters.  It gets worse.  You would think that perhaps maybe PvPing would be an alternative.  Well it is, but not only does it sound incredibly difficult but the gear that you can get from PvP isn’t even better than the PvE gear and only the best PvPers are every going to see it.  Here is how hardcore their system sounds:

“It’s also possible to lose experience when killed. According to game director Gaute Godager, this won’t drop you from one level to another, but it is possible for your progress to be brought all the way down to zero for your level if you’re constantly getting killed. To further add to this mechanic’s hardcore nature, you only gain a fraction (somewhere between one half and one third) of the experience for a kill compared to the amount lost for a death. Yikes.

The whole point of the system is for only the most skilled players to rise to the top, instead of having everyone who put in enough time eventually get to the highest PvP level. Once you do get high enough, special equipment unlocks and becomes available for purchase, and the gear is supposed to be extremely powerful. It’ll be comparable to raid gear, though its statistical bonuses will benefit PvP play more than PvE. According to Gaute, raid gear will be more accessible than the high-level PvP gear.”    Read the rest here

Unknown

Funcoms aim all along for AoC has been mainstream, pc and console-based, casual gameplay. If a lot of the 'hardcore' people are expecting asherons call or ultima online or something like that freedom and pvp wise then stop reading the forums here and just go away because that is not Funcoms aim.



I hate to say it but Funcom has really been aiming for a WoW-like mainstream for AoC of variety of gameplay options and casual fun gameplay. Why wouldnt they? Why wouldnt they want millions of subscribers?

Kyero

I see nothing bad about this, You're prob thinking of WoW's Raids too much. I speak for many when I say that some raids can be fun to do.

Riker99

I see many people buying a second account to farm for PvP experience (kill their other character over and over). Or, simply having their friend with an equally leveled character let him kill him for a while.

They need some type of reduction if you kill the same person over and over, like WoW had.

I think the "hardcore" nature of the PvP system right now will be gone soon after the whiners get a taste of it.

Smikis

ye.. t2bad this isnt another forumfall.. i mean darkfall.. pvp only games wont last more than a year..

and ye you wont get ur full epics for pvp without g15 keyboard either it seems..

 

i wouldnt buy this game if it didnt had hardcore pve.. in it

oh btw. try some solo rpg games.. where those epic encounters feels like total crap.. and thats not epic in any case

Smikis

Originally posted by Riker99


I see many people buying a second account to farm for PvP experience (kill their other character over and over). Or, simply having their friend with an equally leveled character let him kill him for a while.
They need some type of reduction if you kill the same person over and over, like WoW had.
I think the "hardcore" nature of the PvP system right now will be gone soon after the whiners get a taste of it.

you start with 10k pvp exp.. im sure you cant loose more when you on zero ;O.. for first lvl you need 60k.. and there is like 10-15 no idea

fantaros

Originally posted by Riker99


I see many people buying a second account to farm for PvP experience (kill their other character over and over). Or, simply having their friend with an equally leveled character let him kill him for a while.
They need some type of reduction if you kill the same person over and over, like WoW had.
I think the "hardcore" nature of the PvP system right now will be gone soon after the whiners get a taste of it.

Nothing about this system is hardcore.

damian7

Originally posted by tgainey


I’m really disappointed with this bit of information.  IGN posted up an exclusive look at AoC’s PvP and Raiding yesterday.  In the article they talk about Raiding and PvP in the “end-game” or rather max level.  The first waves of disappointment came when I read this:

“If you want to get the best armor and weapons in Age of Conan, you’re going to have to raid, something you can’t actually engage in until you hit level 80. There’ll still be dungeons that players can band together and delve into before the cap, but for large-scale, 24-player encounters against enormous bosses that require highly coordinated attack patterns to defeat, you’ll have to wait until the end game.”

*sigh*  So basically it’s another treadmill of raid to get gear to raid to get better gear to raid to get gear.  I thought we left that crap behind in World of Warcraft?  I’m tired of having to spend hours every night raiding dungeons for a chance at loot.  I’m tired of being forced to find 23 other players to even have a chance at getting good items or seeing epic encounters.  It gets worse.  You would think that perhaps maybe PvPing would be an alternative.  Well it is, but not only does it sound incredibly difficult but the gear that you can get from PvP isn’t even better than the PvE gear and only the best PvPers are every going to see it.  Here is how hardcore their system sounds:

“It’s also possible to lose experience when killed. According to game director Gaute Godager, this won’t drop you from one level to another, but it is possible for your progress to be brought all the way down to zero for your level if you’re constantly getting killed. To further add to this mechanic’s hardcore nature, you only gain a fraction (somewhere between one half and one third) of the experience for a kill compared to the amount lost for a death. Yikes.

The whole point of the system is for only the most skilled players to rise to the top, instead of having everyone who put in enough time eventually get to the highest PvP level. Once you do get high enough, special equipment unlocks and becomes available for purchase, and the gear is supposed to be extremely powerful. It’ll be comparable to raid gear, though its statistical bonuses will benefit PvP play more than PvE. According to Gaute, raid gear will be more accessible than the high-level PvP gear.”    Read the rest here

 

quit playing around, everything you quoted was taken straight from blizzard and IS about wow.

AmazingAvery

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V0OAu09STn4

• All raids take place at LvL 80, because of the effort it takes to organise.
• People would out level raid structuce if they were added earlier on in the game.

• All raids will be 24 man groups (4 full groups)
• All raids are in Instanced Dungeons
• At game launch there will be 8 Raid Dungeons for launch, May 20th
• There will be 19 major Raid encounters (one boss or many bosses)
• Raids are divided into 3 tiers ( 3 different levels of difficulty)
• Progressive system - need to do the easier ones to get to the harder ones
• Currently set to one member in the Raid can progress the group along (subject to change)
• There will be safe zones
• Lots of mobs in Dungeons that Do Not respawn
• They aim for it to be one Dungeon run straight thru and not time taken up fighting alot of respawns if you die
• Once a week to finalize a Raid Dungeon, If you clear it out before a week it will remain empty till one week timer is up.
• 2  to 2 1/2hrs playtime for each of them ( IF you know what you are doing!! )
• Once everything is unlocked from the 8 raid dungeons leaving tier 3 stuff, there will be enough content to happily raid each week.
• New people joining your group who are first time raiders will experience where you are up to, so if you have cleared a dungeon they will see this too, until it resets after a week.

http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/173475

 Once again you are not forced to raid, this discussion has had DOZENS of threads here. ITs there to appeal to those that like it.

The dragon in my sig is a raid, I want to fight it! Dont care about gear.

damian7

Originally posted by Battlekruse


Funcoms aim all along for AoC has been mainstream, pc and console-based, casual gameplay. If a lot of the 'hardcore' people are expecting asherons call or ultima online or something like that freedom and pvp wise then stop reading the forums here and just go away because that is not Funcoms aim.



I hate to say it but Funcom has really been aiming for a WoW-like mainstream for AoC of variety of gameplay options and casual fun gameplay. Why wouldnt they? Why wouldnt they want millions of subscribers?

raiding...mainstream... less than one half of one percent of wow's players actually raid. (which is why wow is slowly, but steadily, moving away from the stupidity that is raiding).

10,000,000.  let's see, 1% of that is um, 100,000? half of one percent is 50,000.  so, by mainstream, funcom is shooting to hit the massive less-than-50,000-raider-playerbase which is in wow?

 

sounds rather idiotic.

Ascension08

Raiding is fun until you do it more than 10 times. Then it gets repetitive and stale. No matter how good the game is...unless, of course, raids were somehow dynamic and they changed every time you did them.

Celestian

---

Originally posted by Kyero
I see nothing bad about this, You're prob thinking of WoW's Raids too much. I speak for many when I say that some raids can be fun to do.

---

You speak for a microscopic amount of the player base. Even Blizzard has said that the amount of people that have even SEEN some of the raid zones is tiny, on the scale of 5% of their player base!

I can't see any part of these options that will appeal to a casual player frankly but we'll see. I'm just glad I got WAR to look forward to because after this information I hardly think I'll be interested in it for long.

FreddyNoNose

Originally posted by fantaros


 
Originally posted by Riker99


I see many people buying a second account to farm for PvP experience (kill their other character over and over). Or, simply having their friend with an equally leveled character let him kill him for a while.
They need some type of reduction if you kill the same person over and over, like WoW had.
I think the "hardcore" nature of the PvP system right now will be gone soon after the whiners get a taste of it.

 

Nothing about this system is hardcore.

Just the hardcore forum criers.

damian7

Originally posted by AmazingAvery


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V0OAu09STn4

All raids take place at LvL 80, because of the effort it takes to organise.
People would out level raid structuce if they were added earlier on in the game.


All raids will be 24 man groups (4 full groups)
All raids are in Instanced Dungeons
At game launch there will be 8 Raid Dungeons for launch, May 20th
There will be 19 major Raid encounters (one boss or many bosses)
Raids are divided into 3 tiers ( 3 different levels of difficulty)
Progressive system - need to do the easier ones to get to the harder ones
Currently set to one member in the Raid can progress the group along (subject to change)
There will be safe zones
Lots of mobs in Dungeons that Do Not respawn
They aim for it to be one Dungeon run straight thru and not time taken up fighting alot of respawns if you die
Once a week to finalize a Raid Dungeon, If you clear it out before a week it will remain empty till one week timer is up.
2  to 2 1/2hrs playtime for each of them ( IF you know what you are doing!! )
Once everything is unlocked from the 8 raid dungeons leaving tier 3 stuff, there will be enough content to happily raid each week.
New people joining your group who are first time raiders will experience where you are up to, so if you have cleared a dungeon they will see this too, until it resets after a week.

http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/173475
 Once again you are not forced to raid, this discussion has had DOZENS of threads here.

 

once again, most people who pay a monthly sub for games, WANT to be able to get the best gear.

lots of people have no problem with spending hour upon hour upon hour, doing non-fun bullshit "work" in a game in order to GET the good gear.

judging from the incredibly huge silent majority - they don't like spending that time with 20-40 other people.

 

no reason to have dozens of threads where people don't comprehend these, incredibly accurate, points i've just made.

Mordria

I don't know what you are all upset about. They have made very clear for a long time what their intentions are with this game.

You all want an mmo like battlefield, or halo.. I really don't see that happening because they want to create a living world not a mass chaotic war zone.

AmazingAvery

Raid drops will be good for raiding, crafting will produce the best items for PvP from what I can tell, you can mod your crafted items with some rare drops (gems) for raids dependant on what type of stats you want your PvP gear to have. There is no guarentee that the gem you might get from a raid and use in a PvP weapon will make it the best for that situation.

Ascension08

Originally posted by Mordria


I don't know what you are all upset about. They have made very clear for a long time what their intentions are with this game.
You all want an mmo like battlefield, or halo.. I really don't see that happening because they want to create a living world not a mass chaotic war zone.

No they want to create a heavily story-driven RPG based MMO. Hence the end game raiding

Mordria

Originally posted by Ascension08

Originally posted by Mordria


I don't know what you are all upset about. They have made very clear for a long time what their intentions are with this game.
You all want an mmo like battlefield, or halo.. I really don't see that happening because they want to create a living world not a mass chaotic war zone.

No they want to create a heavily story-driven RPG based MMO. Hence the end game raiding

What does end game raiding have to do with it? I think it's just there as an option. You don't HAVE to participate in raiding. I've played EQ2 for over 4 years and have never been on a raid..

I guess I'm just not understanding what you're getting at.

Katashi-kun

Originally posted by Mordria


 
I've played EQ2 for over 4 years
 
 

Yet its only been out for 3.5!  Lovely...

tgainey

 

Originally posted by AmazingAvery


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V0OAu09STn4

All raids take place at LvL 80, because of the effort it takes to organise.
People would out level raid structuce if they were added earlier on in the game.


All raids will be 24 man groups (4 full groups)
All raids are in Instanced Dungeons
At game launch there will be 8 Raid Dungeons for launch, May 20th
There will be 19 major Raid encounters (one boss or many bosses)
Raids are divided into 3 tiers ( 3 different levels of difficulty)
Progressive system - need to do the easier ones to get to the harder ones
Currently set to one member in the Raid can progress the group along (subject to change)
There will be safe zones
Lots of mobs in Dungeons that Do Not respawn
They aim for it to be one Dungeon run straight thru and not time taken up fighting alot of respawns if you die
Once a week to finalize a Raid Dungeon, If you clear it out before a week it will remain empty till one week timer is up.
2  to 2 1/2hrs playtime for each of them ( IF you know what you are doing!! )
Once everything is unlocked from the 8 raid dungeons leaving tier 3 stuff, there will be enough content to happily raid each week.
New people joining your group who are first time raiders will experience where you are up to, so if you have cleared a dungeon they will see this too, until it resets after a week.

http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/173475
 Once again you are not forced to raid, this discussion has had DOZENS of threads here. ITs there to appeal to those that like it.
The dragon in my sig is a raid, I want to fight it! Dont care about gear.

I honestly can't blame you for being so Gung-Ho about Age of Conan considering ...

 

http://mmolab.com/2008/01/25/age-of-conan-instance-run-video

So, how was your trip to Norway?

Now let's be frank this has to skew your otherwise unbiased opinions greatly. I was wondering why I kept constantly seeing Acolyte guild banners in the sigs of all these people who were so quick to defend legitmate concerns with AoC.

As Lord Acton said ....

"Power tends to corrupt, and absolute power corrupts absolutely. Great men are almost always bad men."   - Lord Acton

Mordria

Originally posted by Katashi-kun

Originally posted by Mordria


 
I've played EQ2 for over 4 years
 
 

Yet its only been out for 3.5!  Lovely...

If you say so.. I got the 4 year vet reward about 2 months ago

Ascension08

Originally posted by Mordria


 
Originally posted by Ascension08

Originally posted by Mordria


I don't know what you are all upset about. They have made very clear for a long time what their intentions are with this game.
You all want an mmo like battlefield, or halo.. I really don't see that happening because they want to create a living world not a mass chaotic war zone.

No they want to create a heavily story-driven RPG based MMO. Hence the end game raiding

What does end game raiding have to do with it? I think it's just there as an option. You don't HAVE to participate in raiding. I've played EQ2 for over 4 years and have never been on a raid..

 

I guess I'm just not understanding what you're getting at.

Well, just think about it. Every good story has an epic ending, right? If you follow it all the way to the end, then it leaves you hanging, that's pretty lame. Raiding is a great way to put in the climax, such as fighting the main antagonist(s). You've heard about him in the lore...now fight him for real...it's got an appeal to it. You don't HAVE to, yes, but where most companies make the mistake is putting the best gear in those raids. Fanbois say crafted gear that's used for PvP will be just as good; there's no way to determine that now. If indeed they're wrong and it turns out raiding gear is better, people will feel like they HAVE to raid if they want to be the best. Honestly, if there was a way raids could change...once you cleared it, those guys are gone; maybe more bad guys move in and spice things up a little...I'd enjoy it 100% more.

Ascension08

Originally posted by Mordria

Originally posted by Katashi-kun

Originally posted by Mordria


 
I've played EQ2 for over 4 years
 
 

Yet its only been out for 3.5!  Lovely...

If you say so.. I got the 4 year vet reward about 2 months ago

Maybe you were in a 6+ month beta?

Katashi-kun

Originally posted by Mordria

Originally posted by Katashi-kun

Originally posted by Mordria


 
I've played EQ2 for over 4 years
 
 

Yet its only been out for 3.5!  Lovely...

If you say so.. I got the 4 year vet reward about 2 months ago

  EQ2 was released in Nov 2004!   Thats 3.5 yrs...Sony once again can't do anything right if they're giving out 4 yr vet rewards almost a yr in advance...LOL

fantaros

If they make raid gear better for pvp than crafted or pvp obtained there system is gonna be the worst in the whole history of mmo. I hope no company is that dumb especially if like FC they have tried the best they could to keep PvE and PvP as seperate as possible.

 

Back on subject, if u dont want to raid OP i m sure there will be plenty of other things to do, i mean wth have 8m people being doing playing WoW for so long?

Isane

Raid Endgames are just poor poor design very lazy, looks like this will be just another LOTRO buy game play until 1st subscription comes up and cancel.

DAMN... Why will people never learn I need a game that will hold my attention for more than a month.