however there is an alternative nobody has tried yet. Alternative: MMORTS. Real Time Strategy. Take Medieval Total War for example, each unit has a captain and 40-150 units. You can play the captain, and your NPC's will be the equivalent to leveling, except better. Would you rather show of a castle and an army, or do emotes /flex in front of total strangers to show off your 1337 loot? Say for example in a MMORTS you run into another player that has twice the power of you (equivalent twice the level in an Everquest clone). You have 50 guys in your army, your enemy has 100. You most likely will not win the battle, but you can damage the resources of your enemy. There would be no ganking, because there would be immediate retribution in all PVP battles.
Boundless Planet
Beyond protocol
SAGA
Ballerium
Dreamlords
Mankind
Shattered Galaxy
Time of Defiance
Project Visitor
Just to name a few. Plenty of people have tried them. Now you can too
I haven't seen a single one of those games where the territories or "realms" aren't disjointed, where if you want to PVP you have to enter some sort of tournament like in Guild Wars. If territory is disjointed IT IS NOT a RTS.
oh I just alphabetically googled Boundless Planet, and Beyond protocol, they're not disjointed. Oh hehehehe, I might find a game to play. I liked MOO2, gonn alook at Beyond protocol.
LIST ONE GAME THAT HAS: Loot dead players (take the all stuff they are carring on their person) A housing system ( a place to put your stuff and to show off) FFAPVP (Can I fight all over the world, or just some stupid battle ground) More than 4 people playing at a time (I would like it to be a game that other people are playing, or there is really no point.)
Wurm Online is exactly what yu are looking for.
I have standards, and those standards aren't too high.
LIST ONE GAME THAT HAS: Loot dead players (take the all stuff they are carring on their person) A housing system ( a place to put your stuff and to show off) FFAPVP (Can I fight all over the world, or just some stupid battle ground) More than 4 people playing at a time (I would like it to be a game that other people are playing, or there is really no point.)
Wurm Online is exactly what yu are looking for.
I have standards, and those standards aren't too high.
I'm never going to understand.
Wurm Online is exactly what you are looking for, and it is also a player driven community where every item is crafted. But you don't play it because it's Java based with poor graphics? You sit here and complain there aren't enough of them, and when you have one right in front of your face you turn it down because of the way it looks?
Rediculous. I guess you're just begging for some instanced grinding, huh?
__________________________________________________ In memory of Laura "Taera" Genender. Passed away on Aug/13/08 - Rest In Peace; you will not be forgotten
I tried that wurm game. I couldn't get the free stuff to work and I am not paying for a game that I where I can't play a demo. Also it is a very unprofessional looking site, which means if I were going to pay for it, and I had a problem I don't feel confident that I would be able to get it resolved.
Do you work for the producers of wurm or are you just a fan?
[quote]IN MMO's a mage is a mage there is nothing to predict there,a tank is a tank once again nothing there,you pretty much know exactly what the other guy brings ,so there is no skills there. [/quote]
While i would love to agree, but there are players who actually go a different route in some games... take guildwars for example with its multiple classes and even DnD online, players can have a half half and litterally be a moderate class instead of just a Tank or just a nuker. I have played Guildwars with a few friends of mine and they dont just tank with warriors, they actaully have people thinking that they were tankers and were trying to protect me but they were actually the magicians, a neat trick to MMORPG's with the class differentials.
now, as for your other comment about RTS's well ok i can agree about this because in shattered galaxy it seems that each unit can be stronger than the other by equipment and level (sometimes pending on their upgrades) but another note is that TEAMWORK! is how you can defeat anyone, last night me and a another player on helike took down a lvl 22 with a full squad (12 units) of leviathons with AG(anti Ground) and AA (anti air) capabilities.
You say that it would be better flexing off your new armor and muscles in an mmo but i see that as arogance and begging someone to just waltz over and kick their ass with a regular character that he has no clue how to kill..
FPS's ok yes they all work, but theres also the wonderous of BOTS and HACKS, people use them all the freaking time and it takes the fun out of that genre just as much as anyone else. Also the fact that people modify the game servers in just about every game makes it even more so annoying instead of playing by the default standards of the game.
anyways, back onto the topic...
MMO game that is 10 years old and carries the same standards of FFAPVP, more than likely everyone has said it and yes the game would be Ultima Online (though some proclaim it as horrible) it was a wonderful game, it felt like a real MMO and how it should be in my opinon. Games like that were fun because you actually had to maintane your characters points carefully where you wanted them to be such as a crafter, caster, warrior, or a varied person. The most ingenius thing that UO had going for it was the food system in the game where you actually had to feed your character to keep stamina high and even keep your character from getting sick or anything else, top it off they had plenty of other features in the game that made it fun such as the spirit speak function where you could talk to killed players, that game was awsome..
most games now... its just kill or be killed, spawn, kill or be killed, respawn... Rinse repeat for 100000 times.
I tried that wurm game. I couldn't get the free stuff to work and I am not paying for a game that I where I can't play a demo. Also it is a very unprofessional looking site, which means if I were going to pay for it, and I had a problem I don't feel confident that I would be able to get it resolved. Do you work for the producers of wurm or are you just a fan?
Just a fan. I play casually, I just love their original design.
Also, how can you not get the free stuff to work? It's extremely simple.....
AS for the site; it's an indy game. You better get used to it, indy devs are the onyl one who will make the games with the features you said.
__________________________________________________ In memory of Laura "Taera" Genender. Passed away on Aug/13/08 - Rest In Peace; you will not be forgotten
People are praising WAR at the moment but let me tell you that Guild Wars 2 and Kotor MMO will be 100 times better than what we have now. They will botth be well polished and will be more fun to play.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
LIST ONE GAME THAT HAS: Loot dead players (take the all stuff they are carring on their person) A housing system ( a place to put your stuff and to show off) FFAPVP (Can I fight all over the world, or just some stupid battle ground) More than 4 people playing at a time (I would like it to be a game that other people are playing, or there is really no point.)
Wurm Online is exactly what yu are looking for.
I have standards, and those standards aren't too high.
I'm never going to understand.
Wurm Online is exactly what you are looking for, and it is also a player driven community where every item is crafted. But you don't play it because it's Java based with poor graphics? You sit here and complain there aren't enough of them, and when you have one right in front of your face you turn it down because of the way it looks?
Rediculous. I guess you're just begging for some instanced grinding, huh?
It's not the graphics that turned me off, it's watching the video of the animations, and it looks like packets are received like every 1.5 seconds like in UO.
Before you jump in and start yelling at me because of the title of this form take a minute to consider the following. PVP in most MMO's today is unrewarding and frankly pretty boring after a couple of years, months, weeks, or days depending on your attention span and how long you can put up with being unrewarded. I make the contention that in the current environment that you could switch from playing an mmo to an fps and get the same reward. To give you a little bit of my history... I played Ultima Online(UO) about a million years ago. To be more specific I played in '98 and '99 on a few servers (Pacific, Abyss, and Siege Perilous). For those of you who played UO, I had many characters as well ranging from a 7x-GM perma red to a pack mule miner/smith. I played non-stop PVP for hours and hours, and for those of you who didn't play UO, I made tons of in-game cash. UO, when I played, allowed you to loot bodies of anyone weather you killed them or not, you could steal from other players backpacks, you could loot houses, you could have a guild war in town, and you could do those dungeon crawls and do all that PVM (PVE) stuff. Now games don't allow for you to make your own decisions about how you are going to play. They have put on the little kid gloves and now there isn't a game that I have found that would be fun for me. EA has ruined ultima and no one seems to have put out a game. I challenge you to name a game that allows true Free For All Player vs Player (FFAPVP) with loot. I can go play Call of Duty 4 for an hour if I want to just kill other players. I can play Civ 4 for 8 hours if I want to build something better than someone else. I can't find an MMO that is good. CHALLENGE: LIST ONE GAME THAT HAS: Loot dead players (take the all stuff they are carring on their person) A housing system ( a place to put your stuff and to show off) FFAPVP (Can I fight all over the world, or just some stupid battle ground) More than 4 people playing at a time (I would like it to be a game that other people are playing, or there is really no point.)
A "good" MMORPG? For me a good MMORPG focus in character development and provides immersive content. What is good for you, is not good or bad for me though.
Well I am going to try an offline UO shard. I have played these before in the past and my issue is they typically don't have many people playing at any one time. I am going to try it out to see if I like it. I am trying to keep an open mind, but I have a feeling that I am going to be disappointed. If you are intrested in checking it out try http://www.preuor.com/ They even have an EA Link for the UO client on their download.
Hey everyone, I tried that game and I found it to be exactly what I thought it would be. Unfortunatly I can't have fun in an MMORPG that I am playing by myself. I don't know there are other offline UO servers that are PRE-UOR, but I don't think I am going to play any of those either. I forgot how terrible a program the UO client was and I don't know that it is a good fit for me anymore...
Actually the problem isn't that "games" are better or worse than 10 years ago, it's rather that there is only 1 playable game with a meaningful playerbase nowaday. And yes, i mean WoW. There is a total lack of variety in playable games.
Reminds of of WIndows pretty much: each version is better than the last, yet the people and the press keep bashing it.
Anyway, don't expect a good MMO until maybe the Ramanayan project from Sony, and that's not due before 3-4 years from now...
My addiction History: >> EQ1 2000-2004 - Shaman/Bard/Wizard/Monk - nolife raid-whore >> WoW 2004-2009 + Cataclysm for 2 months - hardcore casual >> Current status : done with MMO, too old for that crap.
They haven't progressed one bit, they may be prettier but thats just about it. With the exception of WoW being one of the very few to have a little more polish, MMO's are just as bad today as they were 10 years ago. Still playing the same classes killing the same mobs using the same level system and following the same old quests. Yup nothings changed.
SWG pre-CU and EVE stand out the most for trying to break the mould, but if you want all that crap FFA-pvp and player looting perhaps you should return to MUDs most of them are more complex than what we have in that released games list on the left, and you'll' find one that will match your needs exactly right down to the theme. Try looking on the MUD Connector.
So, let me get this straight. You want to have a game with full PVP and full looting so you can go out, roll people and then take everything they have and leave them bleeding and/or dead in a ditch. Someone just make GTA into an MMO and call it a day please. Me personally I do not see the difference between jumping a computer controlled NPC and taking all their stuff and jumping a player and taking all their stuff save that the player whines and cries more than the NPC. Wait, is that it....do we need an AI that whines and complains, sends you a few messages calling you camper or a newb or a ganker. Is it the validation only the suffering of another brings that your damaged ego needs?
I mean, ok, this is part flippant and sarcastic but honestly there is a real question here. Why is it some subset of the gamer population only seems to be happy if they are actually screwing and making life hell for some other shlub and usually starting some long cycle of hate fueled retaliation and vengeance as each tries to constantly destroy everything the other builds up. Why do your gains seem to lack meaning unless they come from the loss of another and thus in turn can be suddenly lost by you, despite all your effort to stay on top of the heap? It sounds too much like real life for me, in say some third world dictatorship where power rules until someone kills them and takes that power, etc etc. ad infinitum.
I just do not get the appeal of wanting to simulate that level of paranoia, hatred, violence and loss. Admittedly, what you seem to desire in a game is what ruins it for folks like me. I love EVE for example, great game, good skill ups and development, gorgeous space vistas and ships...but it is totally ruined for me when that shiny new ship I just bought and outfitted is blown to splinters by some random yahoo "for the lulz" I would love EVE without the PVP, but I also know that would bore the hell out of other players who need the conflict and the vicarious thrills of living life on the edge. Me personally, if I want that kind of thrill I will go for a walk in certain neighborhoods at 1 am, not to my computer.
What I wish, is that the developers of these games would stop trying to put casual gamers and PVPers together in the same environment. There are a lot of both types playing so why not have a server for one group and a server for the other, even on the good PVP engines insteading to trying to please both styles of player with just the one shared setting. It would almost be two totally unique games.
JadedDragon, casuals enjoy EVE Online even if they do not PVP because they realize it is the high turnover of goods that keeps them in business. Due to the high turnover of goods, crafters enjoy a rich market.
Just like real life. What happens to the economy when war breaks out? It surges! Because the government has to spend money on the military goods. This provides more jobs to the industrail sector.
This high turnover helps fuels EVE's economy.
If I never lost my ship- then trust me I would never need a crafter to sell me anything but only once EVER! Becausde I've been flying the same ship type for a year now. If this never gotten blown up, then the economy would suck like other games whereas adventurers rarely need crafted goods
That is beauty of EVE and it is so well thought out, Veterans even need items produced by newbies
EVE is one community on one universe, no shards. When I run into another EVE player in real life we can actually play together. This is 50x better then having to worry about server transfers and all that nonsense.
So this is why casuals and hardcore exist on one server.
I only skimmed over the pages but im surprised noone mentioned Darkfall Online although alot of people think its vaporware i am very confident that it will come out soon, it also sounds like the perfect game for you IamMike and they just released a kick ass gameplay video
Comments
Boundless Planet
Beyond protocol
SAGA
Ballerium
Dreamlords
Mankind
Shattered Galaxy
Time of Defiance
Project Visitor
Just to name a few. Plenty of people have tried them. Now you can too
I haven't seen a single one of those games where the territories or "realms" aren't disjointed, where if you want to PVP you have to enter some sort of tournament like in Guild Wars. If territory is disjointed IT IS NOT a RTS.
oh I just alphabetically googled Boundless Planet, and Beyond protocol, they're not disjointed. Oh hehehehe, I might find a game to play. I liked MOO2, gonn alook at Beyond protocol.
Wurm Online is exactly what yu are looking for.
I have standards, and those standards aren't too high.
Wurm Online is exactly what yu are looking for.
I have standards, and those standards aren't too high.
I'm never going to understand.
Wurm Online is exactly what you are looking for, and it is also a player driven community where every item is crafted. But you don't play it because it's Java based with poor graphics? You sit here and complain there aren't enough of them, and when you have one right in front of your face you turn it down because of the way it looks?
Rediculous. I guess you're just begging for some instanced grinding, huh?
__________________________________________________
In memory of Laura "Taera" Genender. Passed away on Aug/13/08 - Rest In Peace; you will not be forgotten
I tried that wurm game. I couldn't get the free stuff to work and I am not paying for a game that I where I can't play a demo. Also it is a very unprofessional looking site, which means if I were going to pay for it, and I had a problem I don't feel confident that I would be able to get it resolved.
Do you work for the producers of wurm or are you just a fan?
While i would love to agree, but there are players who actually go a different route in some games... take guildwars for example with its multiple classes and even DnD online, players can have a half half and litterally be a moderate class instead of just a Tank or just a nuker. I have played Guildwars with a few friends of mine and they dont just tank with warriors, they actaully have people thinking that they were tankers and were trying to protect me but they were actually the magicians, a neat trick to MMORPG's with the class differentials.
now, as for your other comment about RTS's well ok i can agree about this because in shattered galaxy it seems that each unit can be stronger than the other by equipment and level (sometimes pending on their upgrades) but another note is that TEAMWORK! is how you can defeat anyone, last night me and a another player on helike took down a lvl 22 with a full squad (12 units) of leviathons with AG(anti Ground) and AA (anti air) capabilities.
You say that it would be better flexing off your new armor and muscles in an mmo but i see that as arogance and begging someone to just waltz over and kick their ass with a regular character that he has no clue how to kill..
FPS's ok yes they all work, but theres also the wonderous of BOTS and HACKS, people use them all the freaking time and it takes the fun out of that genre just as much as anyone else. Also the fact that people modify the game servers in just about every game makes it even more so annoying instead of playing by the default standards of the game.
anyways, back onto the topic...
MMO game that is 10 years old and carries the same standards of FFAPVP, more than likely everyone has said it and yes the game would be Ultima Online (though some proclaim it as horrible) it was a wonderful game, it felt like a real MMO and how it should be in my opinon. Games like that were fun because you actually had to maintane your characters points carefully where you wanted them to be such as a crafter, caster, warrior, or a varied person. The most ingenius thing that UO had going for it was the food system in the game where you actually had to feed your character to keep stamina high and even keep your character from getting sick or anything else, top it off they had plenty of other features in the game that made it fun such as the spirit speak function where you could talk to killed players, that game was awsome..
most games now... its just kill or be killed, spawn, kill or be killed, respawn... Rinse repeat for 100000 times.
WoW that was the hardest read I had ever seen, I just could not finish !!
Anyway Warhammer
He said Good MMO, not "When is the next Clone coming out "
Tried: LotR, CoH, AoC, WAR, Jumpgate Classic
Played: SWG, Guild Wars, WoW
Playing: Eve Online, Counter-strike
Loved: Star Wars Galaxies
Waiting for: Earthrise, Guild Wars 2, anything sandbox.
Just a fan. I play casually, I just love their original design.
Also, how can you not get the free stuff to work? It's extremely simple.....
AS for the site; it's an indy game. You better get used to it, indy devs are the onyl one who will make the games with the features you said.
__________________________________________________
In memory of Laura "Taera" Genender. Passed away on Aug/13/08 - Rest In Peace; you will not be forgotten
People are praising WAR at the moment but let me tell you that Guild Wars 2 and Kotor MMO will be 100 times better than what we have now. They will botth be well polished and will be more fun to play.
If EVE isn't your cup of tea, then no, right now there are no games that fit the OP's criteria for fun.
As mentioned, several games are on the horizon that might fit the bill, but until they get a bit closer to release we really won't know.
Next year sometime is probably the soonest you can hope for at this time.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Wurm Online is exactly what yu are looking for.
I have standards, and those standards aren't too high.
I'm never going to understand.
Wurm Online is exactly what you are looking for, and it is also a player driven community where every item is crafted. But you don't play it because it's Java based with poor graphics? You sit here and complain there aren't enough of them, and when you have one right in front of your face you turn it down because of the way it looks?
Rediculous. I guess you're just begging for some instanced grinding, huh?
It's not the graphics that turned me off, it's watching the video of the animations, and it looks like packets are received like every 1.5 seconds like in UO.
Hey check out Space Civilizations, the standard named game looks like it will be fun like Master of Orion. I just went through the tutorial.
A "good" MMORPG? For me a good MMORPG focus in character development and provides immersive content. What is good for you, is not good or bad for me though.
Well I am going to try an offline UO shard. I have played these before in the past and my issue is they typically don't have many people playing at any one time. I am going to try it out to see if I like it. I am trying to keep an open mind, but I have a feeling that I am going to be disappointed. If you are intrested in checking it out try http://www.preuor.com/ They even have an EA Link for the UO client on their download.
Hey everyone, I tried that game and I found it to be exactly what I thought it would be. Unfortunatly I can't have fun in an MMORPG that I am playing by myself. I don't know there are other offline UO servers that are PRE-UOR, but I don't think I am going to play any of those either. I forgot how terrible a program the UO client was and I don't know that it is a good fit for me anymore...
Actually the problem isn't that "games" are better or worse than 10 years ago, it's rather that there is only 1 playable game with a meaningful playerbase nowaday. And yes, i mean WoW. There is a total lack of variety in playable games.
Reminds of of WIndows pretty much: each version is better than the last, yet the people and the press keep bashing it.
Anyway, don't expect a good MMO until maybe the Ramanayan project from Sony, and that's not due before 3-4 years from now...
My addiction History:
>> EQ1 2000-2004 - Shaman/Bard/Wizard/Monk - nolife raid-whore
>> WoW 2004-2009 + Cataclysm for 2 months - hardcore casual
>> Current status : done with MMO, too old for that crap.
They haven't progressed one bit, they may be prettier but thats just about it. With the exception of WoW being one of the very few to have a little more polish, MMO's are just as bad today as they were 10 years ago. Still playing the same classes killing the same mobs using the same level system and following the same old quests. Yup nothings changed.
SWG pre-CU and EVE stand out the most for trying to break the mould, but if you want all that crap FFA-pvp and player looting perhaps you should return to MUDs most of them are more complex than what we have in that released games list on the left, and you'll' find one that will match your needs exactly right down to the theme. Try looking on the MUD Connector.
Mke I sent you a private message with a list of games. Besides the PM I sent, closest mainsteam game to your list is EVE like others listed.
So, let me get this straight. You want to have a game with full PVP and full looting so you can go out, roll people and then take everything they have and leave them bleeding and/or dead in a ditch. Someone just make GTA into an MMO and call it a day please. Me personally I do not see the difference between jumping a computer controlled NPC and taking all their stuff and jumping a player and taking all their stuff save that the player whines and cries more than the NPC. Wait, is that it....do we need an AI that whines and complains, sends you a few messages calling you camper or a newb or a ganker. Is it the validation only the suffering of another brings that your damaged ego needs?
I mean, ok, this is part flippant and sarcastic but honestly there is a real question here. Why is it some subset of the gamer population only seems to be happy if they are actually screwing and making life hell for some other shlub and usually starting some long cycle of hate fueled retaliation and vengeance as each tries to constantly destroy everything the other builds up. Why do your gains seem to lack meaning unless they come from the loss of another and thus in turn can be suddenly lost by you, despite all your effort to stay on top of the heap? It sounds too much like real life for me, in say some third world dictatorship where power rules until someone kills them and takes that power, etc etc. ad infinitum.
I just do not get the appeal of wanting to simulate that level of paranoia, hatred, violence and loss. Admittedly, what you seem to desire in a game is what ruins it for folks like me. I love EVE for example, great game, good skill ups and development, gorgeous space vistas and ships...but it is totally ruined for me when that shiny new ship I just bought and outfitted is blown to splinters by some random yahoo "for the lulz" I would love EVE without the PVP, but I also know that would bore the hell out of other players who need the conflict and the vicarious thrills of living life on the edge. Me personally, if I want that kind of thrill I will go for a walk in certain neighborhoods at 1 am, not to my computer.
What I wish, is that the developers of these games would stop trying to put casual gamers and PVPers together in the same environment. There are a lot of both types playing so why not have a server for one group and a server for the other, even on the good PVP engines insteading to trying to please both styles of player with just the one shared setting. It would almost be two totally unique games.
JadedDragon, casuals enjoy EVE Online even if they do not PVP because they realize it is the high turnover of goods that keeps them in business. Due to the high turnover of goods, crafters enjoy a rich market.
Just like real life. What happens to the economy when war breaks out? It surges! Because the government has to spend money on the military goods. This provides more jobs to the industrail sector.
This high turnover helps fuels EVE's economy.
If I never lost my ship- then trust me I would never need a crafter to sell me anything but only once EVER! Becausde I've been flying the same ship type for a year now. If this never gotten blown up, then the economy would suck like other games whereas adventurers rarely need crafted goods
That is beauty of EVE and it is so well thought out, Veterans even need items produced by newbies
EVE is one community on one universe, no shards. When I run into another EVE player in real life we can actually play together. This is 50x better then having to worry about server transfers and all that nonsense.
So this is why casuals and hardcore exist on one server.
I only skimmed over the pages but im surprised noone mentioned Darkfall Online although alot of people think its vaporware i am very confident that it will come out soon, it also sounds like the perfect game for you IamMike and they just released a kick ass gameplay video