Maybe people hate these game cause they suck 99.9999999% of the time.
The other 0.00000001% is the female avatar in char creation process.
Subscribtions: EVE, SWTOR WOW, WAR, DDO, VG, AOC, COV, FFXI, GW, RFO, Aion +plenty of F2P, betas, trials
Female Dwarf player: WOW, VG, WAR, DDO . Due to the recent economic crisis and spending cuts the light at the end of the tunnel was turned off. Sincerely, God.
Actually everquest did not feel like a grind, there was alot of sandbox options which took off the tedioum quite a bit and loads of content so many areas to level and your class skills truly shined in a group, there is so much to eq then grind, on top of that no one forces you to work hard at it, I played a bard as my main and it took me maybe 4 months to reach 56 and I loved the ride and never got bored and felt like it took to long, because I did alot of other things like play other classes help newbies out do quests, research spells and so on, hek I even helped a few raids with my aoe songs.
Yes that is sad but I doubt it was the game if these people have problems then there likely to feel this way towards something else if gaming isnt what they escape to they might find something else, my point is the addiction in gaming is better then some addictions out there and if its not games it will is very likely they will go to other forms of addiction whatever that may be.
Now I will admit some out there arent addicting to anything until they play a mmorpg but thats why it is there responsibility or the parents to help themselves quit and get better mature a little bit and be in control when they play in the future.
I refuse to play Korean mmos for these reasons: 1. Item shops. I would rather pay a monthly sub instead of play a game with an item shop. I would rather know i won a fight because I was the better player, not because I bought an item they didn't. Cash shops to me = scam.
Stop dreaming.
Search the web for "mmo gold" and "power leveling".
Do you really think it's any different in subscription based games? Sorry, but I have to lol hard. At least in cash shop games everyone knows the rules and has the same chances. People can play for free thanks to the people who purchase shop items, and those who want to get an advantage pay for it. So it's fair to everyone.
Your above point just shows once again that subscription based games are full of naive dreamers who get "scammed", to use your word.
Even the >first< week of AoC's launch I have seen guild leaders purchasing hundreds of gold to build their ingame cities in one shot and equip their people with horses, etc... It's the same in every other mmo.
Your the one who is dreaming, regardless of how free the game is there is always a point in the game where you have to spend real money to get any further, yea free for maybe a week until you realize your getting your butt kicked across the maps because the game is gear based and guess what you cant get it unless you spend real money gasp!
Your the one who is dreaming, regardless of how free the game is there is always a point in the game where you have to spend real money to get any further, yea free for maybe a week until you realize your getting your butt kicked across the maps because the game is gear based and guess what you cant get it unless you spend real money gasp!
You are missing the point. I never said this wasn't the case.
What I did however say, is that's it's the same situation in cash shop and subsciption based games, only that in game shop games you know the color right away.
Reason i dont like korean mmo's compared to american mmo's:
1. poor translations...not that i would expect gret translations, but it really does make the game feel poorly made, eeventhough it may not be.
2. Near impossibility to obtain max level, or obtain fantastic drops....never saw the need to reserve endgame and the best drops to botters or kids that grind a mob for 12 hours a day for a month.
3. Cash Shops, ruins balance and fairness..
4. Cash Shop craft systems....you know +1-3 cool +3-9 breaks w/o cs item...also slotting and breaking items...the killer is that the amount of grinding you need to regain the item you broke makes it really unfun.
5. Overboard on the asian theme, the music, the characters, the classes, the weapons....all of them are nice but i would like the ability to choose wheather i equip my toon in a samurai suit and kitana or plate armor and an axe. Or at least balance the classes, got no problem with asian themes but korean games tend to go a bit overboard with it. (yes i know its a cultural thing, but if you wonder why the west isnt huge on korean games mabey this is a small part)
6. Korean games come to america (sometimes we get the international version) and within a few days/weeks they are completely over run by gold farmers bots and hacks, staff is no where to be seen or simply toss their hands up and say "they come back 5min after i ban them so why bother" Sure all games have these problems but ive never seen it so crazy and lawless as in a korean game.
7. No Storyline, aside from the overall theme, theres really no point to what your doing, and if there is, its really not stressed through the quests.
8. Boring quests, and either too many pointless quests with little reward (usualy first 20-30 levels) or not enough quests (usualy mid to end game)
9. Customer support in game
10. Point and Click.....click a mob to attack, miss, charge the mob, agro nearby mobs, click to run....
11. Charater creation offering no choice of male/female on characters
all in all they do have kind of a bad reputation but every korean game i try i get bored with relativly quick. I think the biggest problem korea has with the mmo market is the seemingly cookie cutter titles and gameplay pumped out at a near factory assembly line pace. Its like in the period of 3 years 30 titles have come out, all of them seem to be half games compared to their westen competition, who only releases a few titles every few years.
If korea could just put out one really good title, combine their efforts, add lots of content, and add lots of setting choices (character settings, key movememt, graphics, ect) that game im sure would rock. But they need to mind the fact that if the want the west to be really pumped about it, they got to make a game thats culturally comfortable for everyone, not just asians. I mean they got the graphics on lockdown, they just need to work on everything else.
Reason i dont like korean mmo's compared to american mmo's: 3. Cash Shops, ruins balance and fairness..
As I said above, one more dreamer
It's no different in subsciption based games (-> search the web for mmo gold). Only in cash shop games your know it right away and you can play for free thanks to the people who purchase items. And if you feel the need to be one of the server's "superheroes" you are free to chose to purchase what you want.
Ya, EQ, my first MMO, I never made it past lvl 41 I think. Or maybe 36, either way, I played it for a year and the reason why I really did not get high is because of the social aspect and just randomly running around finding things and exploring the world. I really did not have a desire to level in that game until I got older (at the time, I was 15 when I started which would be 2000 or the release of the Ruins of Kunark expansion).
MMOs Played: I can no longer list them all in the 500 character limit.
I always wanted to give Koreans MMO's a try but they always screw up my system, and my system is my baby. They either can't be uninstalled the traditional way or HUGE memory leaks.
Poor programming, poor translation, and a big "Come Hack me" doesn't work for me anymore. I play anything with RPG in it's description so I've had my fair share of bad decisions trying these games out.
Last month was my last time ever trying Korean MMO's. They will never run as smooth or have the quality that I'm used to.
I always wanted to give Koreans MMO's a try but they always screw up my system, and my system is my baby. They either can't be uninstalled the traditional way or HUGE memory leaks. Poor programming, poor translation, and a big "Come Hack me" doesn't work for me anymore. I play anything with RPG in it's description so I've had my fair share of bad decisions trying these games out. Last month was my last time ever trying Korean MMO's. They will never run as smooth or have the quality that I'm used to.
Don't forget it is not only F2P from Korea but China as well. Korean F2P seemed to have had slightly better quality than China atm. China tries to dominate the market with Mass-Destructive F2P.
I have played both Korean and China made F2P. Since China has so strict control over the entire internet so I never feel comfortable to install any China software on my computers.
When I playing some F2P, I found the major population are mostly from Brasil, Poland, Greece, Bulgaria, Romania, it makes me wonder if F2P are made for them, It might be the reason to tell why F2P won't get popular in other countries like USA or some European countries. First because of item shop, second is those companies lack of credibility and reputation on the market.
Reason i dont like korean mmo's compared to american mmo's: 3. Cash Shops, ruins balance and fairness..
As I said above, one more dreamer
It's no different in subsciption based games (-> search the web for mmo gold). Only in cash shop games your know it right away and you can play for free thanks to the people who purchase items. And if you feel the need to be one of the server's "superheroes" you are free to chose to purchase what you want.
sorry its 100% diffrent
p2p everyone has all the games content and abilities avaliable
cash shop you must pay for less grind, crafting equipment
oh and dont tell me that cash shop games dont have like 500 times as much farmers, its free which allows thousands of gold farmers to flood the markets and clog up chat, you really dont see that in western mmo;s
of course theres cheaters everywhere its just theres a lot of them in your face in cash shop games
really you think an argument that a p2p and cash shop games are equal in terms of fairness is just crazy and naieve
anyway buying gold in p2p games can let you buy more things, but in a cash shop game not paying will prevent you from crafting, and in many games, hitting level cap without grinding your life away.
I got to stop you right there they are far from the same, a sub fee you know what your paying for espically if you know the company for example cox releases free expansions so does lotro but eq2 makes you pay for little crappy expansions instead of releasing them free they even have little maps you can download and pay for, in korean asian mmorpgs you have to spend more then 15 a month in many of those games its absurd im sorry, on top of that they dont manage there game as good as some companys or release more content, also many of them have poor server stability or lots of bugs.
Generally, subpar (as in "It's not my taste", because I like lots of quests, good grouping tools, western types of themes, certain features, less lag, etc.)... I find that these are valid reasons...
But, Cash Shops!?... I don't know guys, I've never paid for any cash shop games except Guild Wars? I'd say Guild Wars is cash shop, except you have to pay upfront for the game (and you can't honestly say the jackass community is any better than free to play games.). However, I think in the near future, the Guild Wars paying model is the best way to go, as it doesn't look like people consider it to be cash shop. And who's look forward to Guild Wars 2? (I know I am, because it sounds like it may be good, but the payment model is a given that it will be similar to Guild Wars; and that is just like cash shop)
Edit: I think you guys just have a misplaced hatred on Cash Shops over other gameplay issues, such as grinding, crafting w/ the +1 until it breaks, or whatever... If there's items that can't be obtained in game, even though I don't know the price of it, I doubt it's really all that expensive ( no more than the $100+ to be competitive in Guild Wars, or initial game + subscription + expansions?)...
I refuse to play Korean mmos for these reasons: 1. Item shops. I would rather pay a monthly sub instead of play a game with an item shop. I would rather know i won a fight because I was the better player, not because I bought an item they didn't. Cash shops to me = scam. 2. account security. I do not feel "safe" using my credit card information with Korean mmos, the same laws that apply here do not apply there, and for me to try and take some korean company to court would be much more difficult than taking a US company to court if something should go wrong. Not to mention having your game account stolen after you put all that work into it. 3. Some of these games aren't even translated into English, or even if they are the players aren't speaking English. If I can't understand the game or the community why would I want to play it? 4. bots, gold sellers, and gold spammers.. they seem to be accepted in many korean mmos, I would rather play without all that BS. It is one thing to play a game for fun, it is another to ruin the game with bots that never speak to anyone, or gold sellers that only spam gold and are not really playing the game for fun. I play to have fun and with a community like that it isn;t fun. Fix all of these things and give me an american server, with american laws, with good customer service, and the ability to take them to an american court if needed, and i will consider it.
1. Part of that is true however, not everyone has money nor a CC to pay a monthly fee. They can't be a scam to the people that buy from them, it's their money.
2. You pay a US company and usually through Paypal, even so you can dispute the charge with the CC comapny. Also, some of them have cards you can buy at Target and Walmart for in game points.
3. Usually this happens for SEA games where they cater to Singapore, Malaysia and Philippians. Thus you have english, singlish, engrish, tagalog, and taglish. Or if they are in the states, for some reason lots of people from Brazil and Europe play on the servers.
4. They aren't so much accepted as the people that run the game won't do anything about it. Which can be seen as the same as accepting it.
If anything Korean MMOs tend to be the same. You have the Cute, the PVP, the Lineage, and the ripoff. I haven't found many that deviate from this. True there are a few innovative ones, however those are few and far between.
Comments
Maybe people hate these game cause they suck 99.9999999% of the time.
PLaying: EvE, Ryzom
Waiting For: Earthrise, Perpetuum
The other 0.00000001% is the female avatar in char creation process.
Subscribtions: EVE, SWTOR WOW, WAR, DDO, VG, AOC, COV, FFXI, GW, RFO, Aion
+plenty of F2P, betas, trials
Female Dwarf player: WOW, VG, WAR, DDO
.
Due to the recent economic crisis and spending cuts the light at the end of the tunnel was turned off. Sincerely, God.
Actually everquest did not feel like a grind, there was alot of sandbox options which took off the tedioum quite a bit and loads of content so many areas to level and your class skills truly shined in a group, there is so much to eq then grind, on top of that no one forces you to work hard at it, I played a bard as my main and it took me maybe 4 months to reach 56 and I loved the ride and never got bored and felt like it took to long, because I did alot of other things like play other classes help newbies out do quests, research spells and so on, hek I even helped a few raids with my aoe songs.
Yes that is sad but I doubt it was the game if these people have problems then there likely to feel this way towards something else if gaming isnt what they escape to they might find something else, my point is the addiction in gaming is better then some addictions out there and if its not games it will is very likely they will go to other forms of addiction whatever that may be.
Now I will admit some out there arent addicting to anything until they play a mmorpg but thats why it is there responsibility or the parents to help themselves quit and get better mature a little bit and be in control when they play in the future.
Stop dreaming.
Search the web for "mmo gold" and "power leveling".
Do you really think it's any different in subscription based games? Sorry, but I have to lol hard. At least in cash shop games everyone knows the rules and has the same chances. People can play for free thanks to the people who purchase shop items, and those who want to get an advantage pay for it. So it's fair to everyone.
Your above point just shows once again that subscription based games are full of naive dreamers who get "scammed", to use your word.
Even the >first< week of AoC's launch I have seen guild leaders purchasing hundreds of gold to build their ingame cities in one shot and equip their people with horses, etc... It's the same in every other mmo.
MMO gold farming is a $500 million industry for 400k people: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/7575902.stm
Your the one who is dreaming, regardless of how free the game is there is always a point in the game where you have to spend real money to get any further, yea free for maybe a week until you realize your getting your butt kicked across the maps because the game is gear based and guess what you cant get it unless you spend real money gasp!
You are missing the point. I never said this wasn't the case.
What I did however say, is that's it's the same situation in cash shop and subsciption based games, only that in game shop games you know the color right away.
Reason i dont like korean mmo's compared to american mmo's:
1. poor translations...not that i would expect gret translations, but it really does make the game feel poorly made, eeventhough it may not be.
2. Near impossibility to obtain max level, or obtain fantastic drops....never saw the need to reserve endgame and the best drops to botters or kids that grind a mob for 12 hours a day for a month.
3. Cash Shops, ruins balance and fairness..
4. Cash Shop craft systems....you know +1-3 cool +3-9 breaks w/o cs item...also slotting and breaking items...the killer is that the amount of grinding you need to regain the item you broke makes it really unfun.
5. Overboard on the asian theme, the music, the characters, the classes, the weapons....all of them are nice but i would like the ability to choose wheather i equip my toon in a samurai suit and kitana or plate armor and an axe. Or at least balance the classes, got no problem with asian themes but korean games tend to go a bit overboard with it. (yes i know its a cultural thing, but if you wonder why the west isnt huge on korean games mabey this is a small part)
6. Korean games come to america (sometimes we get the international version) and within a few days/weeks they are completely over run by gold farmers bots and hacks, staff is no where to be seen or simply toss their hands up and say "they come back 5min after i ban them so why bother" Sure all games have these problems but ive never seen it so crazy and lawless as in a korean game.
7. No Storyline, aside from the overall theme, theres really no point to what your doing, and if there is, its really not stressed through the quests.
8. Boring quests, and either too many pointless quests with little reward (usualy first 20-30 levels) or not enough quests (usualy mid to end game)
9. Customer support in game
10. Point and Click.....click a mob to attack, miss, charge the mob, agro nearby mobs, click to run....
11. Charater creation offering no choice of male/female on characters
all in all they do have kind of a bad reputation but every korean game i try i get bored with relativly quick. I think the biggest problem korea has with the mmo market is the seemingly cookie cutter titles and gameplay pumped out at a near factory assembly line pace. Its like in the period of 3 years 30 titles have come out, all of them seem to be half games compared to their westen competition, who only releases a few titles every few years.
If korea could just put out one really good title, combine their efforts, add lots of content, and add lots of setting choices (character settings, key movememt, graphics, ect) that game im sure would rock. But they need to mind the fact that if the want the west to be really pumped about it, they got to make a game thats culturally comfortable for everyone, not just asians. I mean they got the graphics on lockdown, they just need to work on everything else.
As I said above, one more dreamer
It's no different in subsciption based games (-> search the web for mmo gold). Only in cash shop games your know it right away and you can play for free thanks to the people who purchase items. And if you feel the need to be one of the server's "superheroes" you are free to chose to purchase what you want.
Ya, EQ, my first MMO, I never made it past lvl 41 I think. Or maybe 36, either way, I played it for a year and the reason why I really did not get high is because of the social aspect and just randomly running around finding things and exploring the world. I really did not have a desire to level in that game until I got older (at the time, I was 15 when I started which would be 2000 or the release of the Ruins of Kunark expansion).
MMOs Played: I can no longer list them all in the 500 character limit.
I always wanted to give Koreans MMO's a try but they always screw up my system, and my system is my baby. They either can't be uninstalled the traditional way or HUGE memory leaks.
Poor programming, poor translation, and a big "Come Hack me" doesn't work for me anymore. I play anything with RPG in it's description so I've had my fair share of bad decisions trying these games out.
Last month was my last time ever trying Korean MMO's. They will never run as smooth or have the quality that I'm used to.
try lineage 2.
March on! - Lets Invade Pekopon
Don't forget it is not only F2P from Korea but China as well. Korean F2P seemed to have had slightly better quality than China atm. China tries to dominate the market with Mass-Destructive F2P.
I have played both Korean and China made F2P. Since China has so strict control over the entire internet so I never feel comfortable to install any China software on my computers.
When I playing some F2P, I found the major population are mostly from Brasil, Poland, Greece, Bulgaria, Romania, it makes me wonder if F2P are made for them, It might be the reason to tell why F2P won't get popular in other countries like USA or some European countries. First because of item shop, second is those companies lack of credibility and reputation on the market.
As I said above, one more dreamer
It's no different in subsciption based games (-> search the web for mmo gold). Only in cash shop games your know it right away and you can play for free thanks to the people who purchase items. And if you feel the need to be one of the server's "superheroes" you are free to chose to purchase what you want.
sorry its 100% diffrent
p2p everyone has all the games content and abilities avaliable
cash shop you must pay for less grind, crafting equipment
oh and dont tell me that cash shop games dont have like 500 times as much farmers, its free which allows thousands of gold farmers to flood the markets and clog up chat, you really dont see that in western mmo;s
of course theres cheaters everywhere its just theres a lot of them in your face in cash shop games
really you think an argument that a p2p and cash shop games are equal in terms of fairness is just crazy and naieve
anyway buying gold in p2p games can let you buy more things, but in a cash shop game not paying will prevent you from crafting, and in many games, hitting level cap without grinding your life away.
I have reasons to dislike MMO on both sides of the Atlantic.
Korean MMO, in general, have cash shops, are point and click and don't have a lot of storylines to tell.
The point and click and birds eye view is what annoys me the most though.
I got to stop you right there they are far from the same, a sub fee you know what your paying for espically if you know the company for example cox releases free expansions so does lotro but eq2 makes you pay for little crappy expansions instead of releasing them free they even have little maps you can download and pay for, in korean asian mmorpgs you have to spend more then 15 a month in many of those games its absurd im sorry, on top of that they dont manage there game as good as some companys or release more content, also many of them have poor server stability or lots of bugs.
Generally, subpar (as in "It's not my taste", because I like lots of quests, good grouping tools, western types of themes, certain features, less lag, etc.)... I find that these are valid reasons...
But, Cash Shops!?... I don't know guys, I've never paid for any cash shop games except Guild Wars? I'd say Guild Wars is cash shop, except you have to pay upfront for the game (and you can't honestly say the jackass community is any better than free to play games.). However, I think in the near future, the Guild Wars paying model is the best way to go, as it doesn't look like people consider it to be cash shop. And who's look forward to Guild Wars 2? (I know I am, because it sounds like it may be good, but the payment model is a given that it will be similar to Guild Wars; and that is just like cash shop)
Edit: I think you guys just have a misplaced hatred on Cash Shops over other gameplay issues, such as grinding, crafting w/ the +1 until it breaks, or whatever... If there's items that can't be obtained in game, even though I don't know the price of it, I doubt it's really all that expensive ( no more than the $100+ to be competitive in Guild Wars, or initial game + subscription + expansions?)...
1. Part of that is true however, not everyone has money nor a CC to pay a monthly fee. They can't be a scam to the people that buy from them, it's their money.
2. You pay a US company and usually through Paypal, even so you can dispute the charge with the CC comapny. Also, some of them have cards you can buy at Target and Walmart for in game points.
3. Usually this happens for SEA games where they cater to Singapore, Malaysia and Philippians. Thus you have english, singlish, engrish, tagalog, and taglish. Or if they are in the states, for some reason lots of people from Brazil and Europe play on the servers.
4. They aren't so much accepted as the people that run the game won't do anything about it. Which can be seen as the same as accepting it.
If anything Korean MMOs tend to be the same. You have the Cute, the PVP, the Lineage, and the ripoff. I haven't found many that deviate from this. True there are a few innovative ones, however those are few and far between.