I think you can QUICKLY tell a WoW (or maybe just a bad) player when you run across them in WAR. Conversations like the one the OP is talking about are just the tip fo the iceberg.
For instance, the other day, I'm in the first tier open RvR zone for Empire (Can't remember the name) on my Warrior Priest. I had just burned all my Righteous Fury healing, and I run up on the boat where one of the capture points are.
A birght wizard named Ubuntu is getting hammered on by a chaos Chosen. And he's damn near dead. So I run up to the tank and start beating on him to help build RF. All this time, the BW is just standing there, getting pounded. Not moving, not casting, nothing. He dies.
A few seconds later, I get a tell, "It would be nice if healers in this game acutally healed". My head asplode.
1) No RF, no Heals, jack. Why do you think I was hitting the tank? But go ahead and assume I never heal.
2) A cloth wearing caster class would be VERY hard pressed to survive a beating from a tank, let alone if they DON'T MOVE OR CAST. And let's not forget, WP heals are HOT. I didn't have the morale ability yet, and if I did, guess what I have to do to build morale?
3) So concerned about the game having healers? Go ROLL one.
... But I was so flabbergasted by the stupidity of it, I just said, "No RF, no heals. Quit bitching." I think WoW is the first game that ever taught players you can be wearing cloth, the other guy a tank in plate wielding a bigass sword, and you can stand there and take a beating. I am very confident he was not only a previous WoW player, but likely a bad one as well.
Newsflash, there was annoying people playing eq, uo, daoc etc. Long before wow ever existed, unless your now saying blizzard actually created annoying peopel in online games?. get a damn grip on reality.
Of course but WoW was THE bomb that made them spread everywhere. And having WoW as a first MMORPG spoiled many and destroyed their later views on games
DuraheLL, quit falling for Demz2 attept at baiting you, your falling for it hook line and sinker.
His very poor typing skills, constant bombardment of the phrase "get a grip on reality" are all just a bait for you to fall into so you say something stupid and he reports you and gets you banned.
EVERYONE knows what WoW has done to the MMO community and it's mindset as a whole.
Yes annoying players were in all games, however, UO, EQ, and DAoC were also group games, you did everything in those games as a group or at least in multiples.
WoW is what it is, time can't change it. It did really skew the view on solo vs group play as EVERYTHING in WoW with the exception of end game and 5 man instances can be done solo.
Even BG's require no team effort as your going to get your reward regardless.
Everyone knows this, to say otherwise... you just shouldn't
So quit falling into his trap he knows better, he just wants you to say something stupid.
take a deep breath, and calm down.
Your saying wow is not a group game?
lets see here
1) Dungeons
2)raids
3)premade BG
4)Arenas
5)Basic grinding with freinds
7)Leving up with frrinds.
8)Opening the gates to AQ was the biggest community effort probably in the history of mmos.
jesus any game can be solo or you can chose to group up, its your decision noone elses. All these games you speak of have these choices.
You are talking about lvl 70 GOD stop comparing end game content with t1-t2 because everyone still in these tier pretty much .
I think you can QUICKLY tell a WoW (or maybe just a bad) player when you run across them in WAR. Conversations like the one the OP is talking about are just the tip fo the iceberg.
For instance, the other day, I'm in the first tier open RvR zone for Empire (Can't remember the name) on my Warrior Priest. I had just burned all my Righteous Fury healing, and I run up on the boat where one of the capture points are.
A birght wizard named Ubuntu is getting hammered on by a chaos Chosen. And he's damn near dead. So I run up to the tank and start beating on him to help build RF. All this time, the BW is just standing there, getting pounded. Not moving, not casting, nothing. He dies.
A few seconds later, I get a tell, "It would be nice if healers in this game acutally healed". My head asplode.
1) No RF, no Heals, jack. Why do you think I was hitting the tank? But go ahead and assume I never heal. 2) A cloth wearing caster class would be VERY hard pressed to survive a beating from a tank, let alone if they DON'T MOVE OR CAST. And let's not forget, WP heals are HOT. I didn't have the morale ability yet, and if I did, guess what I have to do to build morale?
3) So concerned about the game having healers? Go ROLL one.
... But I was so flabbergasted by the stupidity of it, I just said, "No RF, no heals. Quit bitching." I think WoW is the first game that ever taught players you can be wearing cloth, the other guy a tank in plate wielding a bigass sword, and you can stand there and take a beating.
So what does being a wow player have to do with it? Like i said before this site just spews crap as if it was fact for a long time now. maybe he thought as a warrior priest you would heal him, did it occur to you it hasnt played a wp so dont know how they heal? hell I play Rp and ive neevr played wp so i have no idea how they heal.
Do you know for a fact this guy plays wow or ever played wow? Or maybe he played UO and you assume he played wow, because we all know there were no noobs in UO or any other game before wow. geta dman grip.
Newsflash, there was annoying people playing eq, uo, daoc etc. Long before wow ever existed, unless your now saying blizzard actually created annoying peopel in online games?. get a damn grip on reality.
Of course but WoW was THE bomb that made them spread everywhere. And having WoW as a first MMORPG spoiled many and destroyed their later views on games
DuraheLL, quit falling for Demz2 attept at baiting you, your falling for it hook line and sinker.
His very poor typing skills, constant bombardment of the phrase "get a grip on reality" are all just a bait for you to fall into so you say something stupid and he reports you and gets you banned.
EVERYONE knows what WoW has done to the MMO community and it's mindset as a whole.
Yes annoying players were in all games, however, UO, EQ, and DAoC were also group games, you did everything in those games as a group or at least in multiples.
WoW is what it is, time can't change it. It did really skew the view on solo vs group play as EVERYTHING in WoW with the exception of end game and 5 man instances can be done solo.
Even BG's require no team effort as your going to get your reward regardless.
Everyone knows this, to say otherwise... you just shouldn't
So quit falling into his trap he knows better, he just wants you to say something stupid.
take a deep breath, and calm down.
Your saying wow is not a group game?
lets see here
1) Dungeons
2)raids
3)premade BG
4)Arenas
5)Basic grinding with freinds
7)Leving up with frrinds.
8)Opening the gates to AQ was the biggest community effort probably in the history of mmos.
jesus any game can be solo or you can chose to group up, its your decision noone elses. All these games you speak of have these choices.
You are talking about lvl 70 GOD stop comparing end game content with t1-t2 because everyone still in these tier pretty much .
Lets see here
1)Dungeos at lowe levels-check
2)Questing at lower levels-check
3)Can enter BG at lower lvls-check
4_Can do grp quests at lower lvels- check
5)aq GATE OPENING WAS NOT UNIQUE TO LVL 60's
6)Questing with friends-.check
7) Grinding with friends.
NONE of these are unique to lvl 70
etc etc tec
Im not tlaking about lower level or higher level. Im syaing you can chose to solo or do group stuff in wow, its upto you. uNLESS YOUR HATRED FOR WOW IS SO DEEP YOU JUST CANNOT SEE THAT ITS YOUR DECISION.
I am not going to do a quote because they are getting long enough.
Since WoW is the #1 game in the world, and has the player base of 10 mmo's combined, odds are he was a WoW player. Even if he wasn't he was very stupid.
It is in a players best interest in a game to learn about all other allied classes and not just your own. If he had taken the time to learn what a warrior priest actually does he wouldn't have made such a dumbass comment.
This is another WoW mentality. Only class that matters is the one your currently playing, all other classes suck and learning anything about any of them is a waste of your time....
Not the smartest game tactics in a game such as WAR.
So what does being a wow player have to do with it? Like i said before this site just spews crap as if it was fact for a long time now. maybe he thought as a warrior priest you would heal him, did it occur to you it hasnt played a wp so dont know how they heal? hell I play Rp and ive neevr played wp so i have no idea how they heal.
Do you know for a fact this guy plays wow or ever played wow? Or maybe he played UO and you assume he played wow, because we all know there were no noobs in UO or any other game before wow. geta dman grip.
To start off, I played WoW. Was in closed beta of the orginal launch. Before that I played UO and DAoC. So, get that out of the way, I'm not bashing WoW. But..
"So what does being a wow player have to do with it?"
You can tell that certain mentatlities are carried over from that game that are not as prevelant in other MMO's.
First off, as I said before, WoW is one of the first MMO's I can recall where casters have a good deal of survivability against melee classes, at least to the extent the expect to be able to stand there, take a beating and survive. It may be found in other MMO's to lesser degrees, true, but statistically speaking, with 10 million players, odds are good they played WoW before, and THAT is where they're getting the idea from.
Secondly, again likely due to it's size, WoW is the first MMO I ever played where I recall this type of weapons-grade ignorance and self-entitlement not only common, but prevelent and embraced. Maybe on average the masses act this way, but WoW is where I felt it's presence felt first. Like I have an obligation to heal him because he's a BW, and I'm a WP, and that's my job, right? RIGHT? I MUST HELP HIM. And I clearly wasn't TRYING hard enough, because he DIED... COMPLETELY IGNORE the fact he let a tank beat on him, and he had no understanding of my class, but that's OK, because he KNOWS healers on Order NEVER HEAL. EVER!!11!
" ... did it occur to you it hasnt played a wp so dont know how they heal"
It did occur to me. Someone who has no idea how a class works telling a player of said class how they should play, and what they're doing wrong?
Yes, this type of arrogance and stupidity is seen everywhere, but since WoW has the biggest numbers where it can be seen far more commonly than anywhere else, statistically speaking, it's a safe bet.
Notice he didn't ASK me why I didn't heal him? ESPECIALLY if he didn't understand the class? No, I just never, ever heal.
"... UO.."
If they played UO post AoS, maybe, since resists aren't tied to material type anymore, possibly. Pre-AoS? I don't recall in the 4 years I remember playing when a caster in cloth would complain that a dexer in plate took them down quickly.
If you'd like, I'll send him a tell from an alt next time I see him online and ask him, and let you know the result. Anyone like to place bets?
I am not going to do a quote because they are getting long enough.
Since WoW is the #1 game in the world, and has the player base of 10 mmo's combined, odds are he was a WoW player. Even if he wasn't he was very stupid. It is in a players best interest in a game to learn about all other allied classes and not just your own. If he had taken the time to learn what a warrior priest actually does he wouldn't have made such a dumbass comment. This is another WoW mentality. Only class that matters is the one your currently playing, all other classes suck and learning anything about any of them is a waste of your time....
Not the smartest game tactics in a game such as WAR.
So your basically going on assumptions and stating them as fact?
Hell I will just start to make unfounded assumptions.
1) Warhamer is a singleplayer game
2)Warhammer has absolutley no rpg in the game.
3) Looking for a simple minded game, go play warhamer.
4)There is absolutley no need to communicate in warhammer.
5)PQ are another word for a grind.
7) The give me now ethos is greater in warhamemr than any other mmo.
8) I was under the assumption warhammer is not for noobs, my mistake.
Well i had some Witch Hunter bunnyhop and hit me at the same time repeatedly in T1 scenarios. I actually had to stop playing for a moment to really understand what he was actually doing by jumping around (I was actually laughing). So I'm on vent and ask my guildie what in the wide world of sports is he doing by bunny hopping. He said because that is how they play in WOW and a large portion of the guild I am in comes from WOW as well.
So what does being a wow player have to do with it? Like i said before this site just spews crap as if it was fact for a long time now. maybe he thought as a warrior priest you would heal him, did it occur to you it hasnt played a wp so dont know how they heal? hell I play Rp and ive neevr played wp so i have no idea how they heal.
Do you know for a fact this guy plays wow or ever played wow? Or maybe he played UO and you assume he played wow, because we all know there were no noobs in UO or any other game before wow. geta dman grip.
To start off, I played WoW. Was in closed beta of the orginal launch. Before that I played UO and DAoC. So, get that out of the way, I'm not bashing WoW. But..
"So what does being a wow player have to do with it?"
You can tell that certain mentatlities are carried over from that game that are not as prevelant in other MMO's.
First off, as I said before, WoW is one of the first MMO's I can recall where casters have a good deal of survivability against melee classes, at least to the extent the expect to be able to stand there, take a beating and survive. It may be found in other MMO's to lesser degrees, true, but statistically speaking, with 10 million players, odds are good they played WoW before, and THAT is where they're getting the idea from.
Secondly, again likely due to it's size, WoW is the first MMO I ever played where I recall this type of weapons-grade ignorance and self-entitlement not only common, but prevelent and embraced. Maybe on average the masses act this way, but WoW is where I felt it's presence felt first. Like I have an obligation to heal him because he's a BW, and I'm a WP, and that's my job, right? RIGHT? I MUST HELP HIM. And I clearly wasn't TRYING hard enough, because he DIED...
" ... did it occur to you it hasnt played a wp so dont know how they heal"
It did occur to me. Someone who has no idea how a class works telling a player of said class how they should play, and what they're doing wrong?
Yes, this type of arrogance and stupidity is seen everywhere, but since WoW has the biggest numbers where it can be seen far more commonly than anywhere else, statistically speaking, it's a safe bet.
"... UO.."
If they played UO post AoS, maybe, since resists aren't tied to material type anymore, possibly. Pre-AoS? I don't recall in the 4 years I remember playing when a caster in cloth would complain that a dexer in plate took them down quickly.
If you'd like, I'll send him a tell from an alt next time I see him online and ask him, and let you know the result. Anyone like to place bets?
Well, you know he didnt play DAOC. Cloth casters died in umm I dunno....3 hits. heh.
I am not going to do a quote because they are getting long enough.
Since WoW is the #1 game in the world, and has the player base of 10 mmo's combined, odds are he was a WoW player. Even if he wasn't he was very stupid. It is in a players best interest in a game to learn about all other allied classes and not just your own. If he had taken the time to learn what a warrior priest actually does he wouldn't have made such a dumbass comment. This is another WoW mentality. Only class that matters is the one your currently playing, all other classes suck and learning anything about any of them is a waste of your time....
Not the smartest game tactics in a game such as WAR.
So your basically going on assumptions and stating them as fact?
Hell I will just start to make unfounded assumptions.
1) Warhamer is a singleplayer game
2)Warhammer has absolutley no rpg in the game.
3) Looking for a simple minded game, go play warhamer.
4)There is absolutley no need to communicate in warhammer.
5)PQ are another word for a grind.
7) The give me now ethos is greater in warhamemr than any other mmo.
8) I was under the assumption warhammer is not for noobs, my mistake.
these are some of my basless assumtions atm.
Well whatever you think there buddy. That is your opinion.
I didn't say it was a fact the guy was from wow, I said it was a safe bet.
However the "WoW Mentality Factor" is a fact. It has been that way since WoW began and even current wow players do not wear rose tinted glasses to bed will tell you this.
I do not have to defend what I say, the WoW community makes it all a reality for me.
Well i had some Witch Hunter bunnyhop and hit me at the same time repeatedly in T1 scenarios. I actually had to stop playing for a moment to really understand what he was actually doing by jumping around (I was actually laughing). So I'm on vent and ask my guildie what in the wide world of sports is he doing by bunny hopping. He said because that is how they play in WOW and a large portion of the guild I am in comes from WOW as well.
Yeah, you can notice the WoW players in pvp by the way they move through you over and over, but thanks to WAR collision on players it is amusing to watch. I am not bashing WoW players for this, in WoW it was a great tactic, even more so as a rogue. You could just run through someone and get a backstab off.
Ok here it goes again. If it was not AOC players coming around saying that bad reviews on forums killed their game now its annoying players or wow forced everyone to solo. This is starting to get insane here.
I have played several games, Wow, lotR, Aoc, Tabula, and now War. I have played them solo and in groups. Out of all of them I have grouped more in wow than have in any game. Infact I think War makes it far more easier to just solo all the quests. I have done several PQs and not once did I see the need to join a group. The players there fought and did what we had to do defeat the bosses that came up. To me I thought the whole idea of PQs was to not force you to group.
I have played wow for years and my mains have grouped up several times. I will say mostly with friends or guild mates. There many of times I group up with other people to do quests. The thing is once you lvled up several alts it easy to solo. Though I do not have high lvls in War, I went through one class to lvl to 8th to get the hang of it. Then I tried another class and I find it even easier to solo things besides PQs but even then to actually form a party I don't see the need. Those do Pqs at least on my server we work as a team some run around on their own but for the most part we work together with out needing to party up. PVP is almost the same. Whether open or scenarios we work together till we beaten to a pulp by destruction lol.
I think the more popular something gets the more "annoying people" it attracts. New games are a prime target for these type of people. Though I really believe "annoying" or elitist players force more people to solo than anything. I am sure the deeper one gets into war the more grouping you will start to see.
Well, you know he didnt play DAOC. Cloth casters died in umm I dunno....3 hits. heh.
Well, if they had a bladeturn going, especially a PBT, they might last a bit longer. Or with that ML ability Bodyguard (I think.. the one where the tank takes the damage if they stand close by.) But unprotected? Yeah, they were cannon fodder.
I agree with the OP. People whose first MMO was WoW have their perception of other games irreversibly changed. UO was my first MMO and I still compare other games to it.
A huge difference between me and them, though, is that I am 20 years old, and people whos first MMO was WoW are either too young to have been here earlier, or so deaf/dumb that they weren't aware such a thing existed until WoW.
These are the types of people where if you try to explain EVE or UO to them they are like, "No levels? No epic loot? No battlegrounds? No jumping? That's... fucking impossible!" And then their heads explode.
_______________________________ PM me when an MMO as good as UO was comes out.
The point of offering alternative methods of advancement is so that people can play the game in the way they want. I don't think this has a darn thing to do with wow. If that's the way they want to play (even if it is pretty ignorant), then more power to them.
Those stupid 10 million members, what where they thinking? This cannot be another WOW rip off? Just to make ourselves rich scheme? This is the best WOW clone ever to hit the shelves. Please go on telling how great the game is AND, I will see you in 6 months! When you are detoxing in Mom's basement!
Ok here it goes again. If it was not AOC players coming around saying that bad reviews on forums killed their game now its annoying players or wow forced everyone to solo. This is starting to get insane here. I have played several games, Wow, lotR, Aoc, Tabula, and now War. I have played them solo and in groups. Out of all of them I have grouped more in wow than have in any game. Infact I think War makes it far more easier to just solo all the quests. I have done several PQs and not once did I see the need to join a group. The players there fought and did what we had to do defeat the bosses that came up. To me I thought the whole idea of PQs was to not force you to group. I have played wow for years and my mains have grouped up several times. I will say mostly with friends or guild mates. There many of times I group up with other people to do quests. The thing is once you lvled up several alts it easy to solo. Though I do not have high lvls in War, I went through one class to lvl to 8th to get the hang of it. Then I tried another class and I find it even easier to solo things besides PQs but even then to actually form a party I don't see the need. Those do Pqs at least on my server we work as a team some run around on their own but for the most part we work together with out needing to party up. PVP is almost the same. Whether open or scenarios we work together till we beaten to a pulp by destruction lol. I think the more popular something gets the more "annoying people" it attracts. New games are a prime target for these type of people. Though I really believe "annoying" or elitist players force more people to solo than anything. I am sure the deeper one gets into war the more grouping you will start to see.
Well, what confuses the hell out of me....If you are 'working together to complete a PQ' or 'working together to beat a scenario' how is that not grouping? Is it just not grouping because they arn't in the group window talking in group chat. A GROUP of players working together to do anything is a group. When there are 100 people trying to take a keep, and you are helping them do it, you are part of a group of players working to beat an objective. I just don't really get it. You don't have to FORM a group of players to do something. You just walk up and become a part of one, and I think that offers an amazing chance to get to know people who will often ask you to do other things with them in the future.
I personally mostly do PQs and Scenarios. Why? I love scenarios. It's that simple, they are even battles that can be taken in 15 minute chunks and then you can go do something else in between. Why do I do pqs in between? Because i want cool looking gear with good stats so that I can do better in scenarios. I also do all the regular quests as well because i enjoy WAR lore, and I plan to do more world RvR when i can but sadly i outleveled most of my guild due to the ungodly ammount of xp you get from scenarios. (Got 22k plus victory bonus in one last night)
Well, what confuses the hell out of me....If you are 'working together to complete a PQ' or 'working together to beat a scenario' how is that not grouping? Is it just not grouping because they arn't in the group window talking in group chat. A GROUP of players working together to do anything is a group. When there are 100 people trying to take a keep, and you are helping them do it, you are part of a group of players working to beat an objective. I just don't really get it. You don't have to FORM a group of players to do something. You just walk up and become a part of one, and I think that offers an amazing chance to get to know people who will often ask you to do other things with them in the future.
I personally mostly do PQs and Scenarios. Why? I love scenarios. It's that simple, they are even battles that can be taken in 15 minute chunks and then you can go do something else in between. Why do I do pqs in between? Because i want cool looking gear with good stats so that I can do better in scenarios. I also do all the regular quests as well because i enjoy WAR lore, and I plan to do more world RvR when i can but sadly i outleveled most of my guild due to the ungodly ammount of xp you get from scenarios. (Got 22k plus victory bonus in one last night)
Anti-Sanctus Chaotica. This is Ranghar from The Phoenix Guard. We run into you guys quite often. See you destruction loving psychopaths on the battlefield =p
Ok here it goes again. If it was not AOC players coming around saying that bad reviews on forums killed their game now its annoying players or wow forced everyone to solo. This is starting to get insane here. I have played several games, Wow, lotR, Aoc, Tabula, and now War. I have played them solo and in groups. Out of all of them I have grouped more in wow than have in any game. Infact I think War makes it far more easier to just solo all the quests. I have done several PQs and not once did I see the need to join a group. The players there fought and did what we had to do defeat the bosses that came up. To me I thought the whole idea of PQs was to not force you to group. I have played wow for years and my mains have grouped up several times. I will say mostly with friends or guild mates. There many of times I group up with other people to do quests. The thing is once you lvled up several alts it easy to solo. Though I do not have high lvls in War, I went through one class to lvl to 8th to get the hang of it. Then I tried another class and I find it even easier to solo things besides PQs but even then to actually form a party I don't see the need. Those do Pqs at least on my server we work as a team some run around on their own but for the most part we work together with out needing to party up. PVP is almost the same. Whether open or scenarios we work together till we beaten to a pulp by destruction lol. I think the more popular something gets the more "annoying people" it attracts. New games are a prime target for these type of people. Though I really believe "annoying" or elitist players force more people to solo than anything. I am sure the deeper one gets into war the more grouping you will start to see.
Well, what confuses the hell out of me....If you are 'working together to complete a PQ' or 'working together to beat a scenario' how is that not grouping? Is it just not grouping because they arn't in the group window talking in group chat. A GROUP of players working together to do anything is a group. When there are 100 people trying to take a keep, and you are helping them do it, you are part of a group of players working to beat an objective. I just don't really get it. You don't have to FORM a group of players to do something. You just walk up and become a part of one, and I think that offers an amazing chance to get to know people who will often ask you to do other things with them in the future.
My point about PQs was in response to another post where he was complaining that people were not joining a party to do the PQ. My thought was that was the reason for the PQ so people did not have to party up. I like PQs and I like War just it promotes soloing just as much those who were complaining about wow.
Ok here it goes again. If it was not AOC players coming around saying that bad reviews on forums killed their game now its annoying players or wow forced everyone to solo. This is starting to get insane here. I have played several games, Wow, lotR, Aoc, Tabula, and now War. I have played them solo and in groups. Out of all of them I have grouped more in wow than have in any game. Infact I think War makes it far more easier to just solo all the quests. I have done several PQs and not once did I see the need to join a group. The players there fought and did what we had to do defeat the bosses that came up. To me I thought the whole idea of PQs was to not force you to group. I have played wow for years and my mains have grouped up several times. I will say mostly with friends or guild mates. There many of times I group up with other people to do quests. The thing is once you lvled up several alts it easy to solo. Though I do not have high lvls in War, I went through one class to lvl to 8th to get the hang of it. Then I tried another class and I find it even easier to solo things besides PQs but even then to actually form a party I don't see the need. Those do Pqs at least on my server we work as a team some run around on their own but for the most part we work together with out needing to party up. PVP is almost the same. Whether open or scenarios we work together till we beaten to a pulp by destruction lol. I think the more popular something gets the more "annoying people" it attracts. New games are a prime target for these type of people. Though I really believe "annoying" or elitist players force more people to solo than anything. I am sure the deeper one gets into war the more grouping you will start to see.
Well, what confuses the hell out of me....If you are 'working together to complete a PQ' or 'working together to beat a scenario' how is that not grouping? Is it just not grouping because they arn't in the group window talking in group chat. A GROUP of players working together to do anything is a group. When there are 100 people trying to take a keep, and you are helping them do it, you are part of a group of players working to beat an objective. I just don't really get it. You don't have to FORM a group of players to do something. You just walk up and become a part of one, and I think that offers an amazing chance to get to know people who will often ask you to do other things with them in the future.
My point about PQs was in response to another post where he was complaining that people were not joining a party to do the PQ. My thought was that was the reason for the PQ so people did not have to party up. I like PQs and I like War just it promotes soloing just as much those who were complaining about wow.
And I was saying to me that is grouping. But, 90% of the time there is an open warband at the PQs you can join. Just hit the 'open parties list' then hit 'join party' and you are in one. You are right about it being the point, It allows you to complete an objective without sitting around in the capital and begging for a party for an hour. If you want small team parties go do the dungeons. I don't really care for dungeons, but try doing them without a group, hah.
EDIT: Forced grouping leaves some players out. I remember in DAOC that a lot of people didn't get invited to RvR groups for whatever reason. Being able to take part by just 'showing up' is a good thing, not a problem. It doesn't mean you shouldn't socialize, it just means you don't have to rely on other people to have a good time.
Agreed the community is the worst part of the game so far. Solo mind set is unreal in this game.
Hell people won't even form a party in a PQ when they are all doing the same shit anyway. It is craziness how everyone seems to think that soloing is this game is the right path.
WAR wasn't designed for solo play, it was designed for large scale team play and warbands.
Oh well.... back to the drawing board I guess.
The solo-only mindset doesn't surprise me at all... It's what most of the post-WoW mmo players were demanding/crying/whining/begging for in every MMO I've followed since WoW came out.
There goes your console/single-player "beat the game by yourself" mindset, come to full fruition.
I've seen it unfolding since WoW launched and could see where it was going. I said as much and was flamed back then. Looks like I was more right than wrong. That doesn't make me special... It was right out in the open and one needed only pay attention to how things were progressing to see where it was all heading.
It's gone like this:
- First players didn't want grouping to be necessary for all of the content on the way to end game. They wanted *some* soloability to fill in when they couldn't or didn't want to find groups.
They got it, and it was good enough for them. For a while.
- Before long, they complained of not having enough soloable content and the idea of some of the more "key" content requiring a group suddenly became offensive to them. They demanded it be more soloable, or more soloable alternatives be added.
They got it, and it was good enough for them. For a while.
- After a while, people started complaining if there was *any* group-centric content in the game. They argued that they should be able to solo to end-game if they so chose, and felt that only raids should require a group.
They mostly got their way and it was good enough for them. For a while.
- Not too long ago, I saw people actually beginning to argue for raid content to be more soloable because it's unfair to be forced to group to take on an epic battle like that.
We might be seeing the beginnings of that being delivered with public quests.
It's to the point now where you can log in, never say a word to another player if you don't want to and still do just fine.
And now the backlash begins... Those who actually do enjoy grouping - at least some of the time - are wondering what the hell happened to parties and why so many people seem to solo all the time.
In a nutshell... the post-WoW community got what they asked for. And now it's become a bitter pill to swallow for some.
"If you just step away for a sec you will clearly see all the pot holes in the road, and the cash shop selling asphalt..." - Mimzel on F2P/Cash Shops
Comments
I think you can QUICKLY tell a WoW (or maybe just a bad) player when you run across them in WAR. Conversations like the one the OP is talking about are just the tip fo the iceberg.
For instance, the other day, I'm in the first tier open RvR zone for Empire (Can't remember the name) on my Warrior Priest. I had just burned all my Righteous Fury healing, and I run up on the boat where one of the capture points are.
A birght wizard named Ubuntu is getting hammered on by a chaos Chosen. And he's damn near dead. So I run up to the tank and start beating on him to help build RF. All this time, the BW is just standing there, getting pounded. Not moving, not casting, nothing. He dies.
A few seconds later, I get a tell, "It would be nice if healers in this game acutally healed". My head asplode.
1) No RF, no Heals, jack. Why do you think I was hitting the tank? But go ahead and assume I never heal.
2) A cloth wearing caster class would be VERY hard pressed to survive a beating from a tank, let alone if they DON'T MOVE OR CAST. And let's not forget, WP heals are HOT. I didn't have the morale ability yet, and if I did, guess what I have to do to build morale?
3) So concerned about the game having healers? Go ROLL one.
... But I was so flabbergasted by the stupidity of it, I just said, "No RF, no heals. Quit bitching." I think WoW is the first game that ever taught players you can be wearing cloth, the other guy a tank in plate wielding a bigass sword, and you can stand there and take a beating. I am very confident he was not only a previous WoW player, but likely a bad one as well.
Of course but WoW was THE bomb that made them spread everywhere. And having WoW as a first MMORPG spoiled many and destroyed their later views on games
DuraheLL, quit falling for Demz2 attept at baiting you, your falling for it hook line and sinker.
His very poor typing skills, constant bombardment of the phrase "get a grip on reality" are all just a bait for you to fall into so you say something stupid and he reports you and gets you banned.
EVERYONE knows what WoW has done to the MMO community and it's mindset as a whole.
Yes annoying players were in all games, however, UO, EQ, and DAoC were also group games, you did everything in those games as a group or at least in multiples.
WoW is what it is, time can't change it. It did really skew the view on solo vs group play as EVERYTHING in WoW with the exception of end game and 5 man instances can be done solo.
Even BG's require no team effort as your going to get your reward regardless.
Everyone knows this, to say otherwise... you just shouldn't
So quit falling into his trap he knows better, he just wants you to say something stupid.
take a deep breath, and calm down.
Your saying wow is not a group game?
lets see here
1) Dungeons
2)raids
3)premade BG
4)Arenas
5)Basic grinding with freinds
7)Leving up with frrinds.
8)Opening the gates to AQ was the biggest community effort probably in the history of mmos.
jesus any game can be solo or you can chose to group up, its your decision noone elses. All these games you speak of have these choices.
You are talking about lvl 70 GOD stop comparing end game content with t1-t2 because everyone still in these tier pretty much .
So what does being a wow player have to do with it? Like i said before this site just spews crap as if it was fact for a long time now. maybe he thought as a warrior priest you would heal him, did it occur to you it hasnt played a wp so dont know how they heal? hell I play Rp and ive neevr played wp so i have no idea how they heal.
Do you know for a fact this guy plays wow or ever played wow? Or maybe he played UO and you assume he played wow, because we all know there were no noobs in UO or any other game before wow. geta dman grip.
Of course but WoW was THE bomb that made them spread everywhere. And having WoW as a first MMORPG spoiled many and destroyed their later views on games
DuraheLL, quit falling for Demz2 attept at baiting you, your falling for it hook line and sinker.
His very poor typing skills, constant bombardment of the phrase "get a grip on reality" are all just a bait for you to fall into so you say something stupid and he reports you and gets you banned.
EVERYONE knows what WoW has done to the MMO community and it's mindset as a whole.
Yes annoying players were in all games, however, UO, EQ, and DAoC were also group games, you did everything in those games as a group or at least in multiples.
WoW is what it is, time can't change it. It did really skew the view on solo vs group play as EVERYTHING in WoW with the exception of end game and 5 man instances can be done solo.
Even BG's require no team effort as your going to get your reward regardless.
Everyone knows this, to say otherwise... you just shouldn't
So quit falling into his trap he knows better, he just wants you to say something stupid.
take a deep breath, and calm down.
Your saying wow is not a group game?
lets see here
1) Dungeons
2)raids
3)premade BG
4)Arenas
5)Basic grinding with freinds
7)Leving up with frrinds.
8)Opening the gates to AQ was the biggest community effort probably in the history of mmos.
jesus any game can be solo or you can chose to group up, its your decision noone elses. All these games you speak of have these choices.
You are talking about lvl 70 GOD stop comparing end game content with t1-t2 because everyone still in these tier pretty much .
Lets see here
1)Dungeos at lowe levels-check
2)Questing at lower levels-check
3)Can enter BG at lower lvls-check
4_Can do grp quests at lower lvels- check
5)aq GATE OPENING WAS NOT UNIQUE TO LVL 60's
6)Questing with friends-.check
7) Grinding with friends.
NONE of these are unique to lvl 70
etc etc tec
Im not tlaking about lower level or higher level. Im syaing you can chose to solo or do group stuff in wow, its upto you. uNLESS YOUR HATRED FOR WOW IS SO DEEP YOU JUST CANNOT SEE THAT ITS YOUR DECISION.
I am not going to do a quote because they are getting long enough.
Since WoW is the #1 game in the world, and has the player base of 10 mmo's combined, odds are he was a WoW player. Even if he wasn't he was very stupid.
It is in a players best interest in a game to learn about all other allied classes and not just your own. If he had taken the time to learn what a warrior priest actually does he wouldn't have made such a dumbass comment.
This is another WoW mentality. Only class that matters is the one your currently playing, all other classes suck and learning anything about any of them is a waste of your time....
Not the smartest game tactics in a game such as WAR.
To start off, I played WoW. Was in closed beta of the orginal launch. Before that I played UO and DAoC. So, get that out of the way, I'm not bashing WoW. But..
"So what does being a wow player have to do with it?"
You can tell that certain mentatlities are carried over from that game that are not as prevelant in other MMO's.
First off, as I said before, WoW is one of the first MMO's I can recall where casters have a good deal of survivability against melee classes, at least to the extent the expect to be able to stand there, take a beating and survive. It may be found in other MMO's to lesser degrees, true, but statistically speaking, with 10 million players, odds are good they played WoW before, and THAT is where they're getting the idea from.
Secondly, again likely due to it's size, WoW is the first MMO I ever played where I recall this type of weapons-grade ignorance and self-entitlement not only common, but prevelent and embraced. Maybe on average the masses act this way, but WoW is where I felt it's presence felt first. Like I have an obligation to heal him because he's a BW, and I'm a WP, and that's my job, right? RIGHT? I MUST HELP HIM. And I clearly wasn't TRYING hard enough, because he DIED... COMPLETELY IGNORE the fact he let a tank beat on him, and he had no understanding of my class, but that's OK, because he KNOWS healers on Order NEVER HEAL. EVER!!11!
" ... did it occur to you it hasnt played a wp so dont know how they heal"
It did occur to me. Someone who has no idea how a class works telling a player of said class how they should play, and what they're doing wrong?
Yes, this type of arrogance and stupidity is seen everywhere, but since WoW has the biggest numbers where it can be seen far more commonly than anywhere else, statistically speaking, it's a safe bet.
Notice he didn't ASK me why I didn't heal him? ESPECIALLY if he didn't understand the class? No, I just never, ever heal.
"... UO.."
If they played UO post AoS, maybe, since resists aren't tied to material type anymore, possibly. Pre-AoS? I don't recall in the 4 years I remember playing when a caster in cloth would complain that a dexer in plate took them down quickly.
If you'd like, I'll send him a tell from an alt next time I see him online and ask him, and let you know the result. Anyone like to place bets?
So your basically going on assumptions and stating them as fact?
Hell I will just start to make unfounded assumptions.
1) Warhamer is a singleplayer game
2)Warhammer has absolutley no rpg in the game.
3) Looking for a simple minded game, go play warhamer.
4)There is absolutley no need to communicate in warhammer.
5)PQ are another word for a grind.
7) The give me now ethos is greater in warhamemr than any other mmo.
8) I was under the assumption warhammer is not for noobs, my mistake.
these are some of my basless assumtions atm.
I find it funny that Demz is complaining about the forums, and then doing exactly what he is complaining about.
Good job trolling.
Well i had some Witch Hunter bunnyhop and hit me at the same time repeatedly in T1 scenarios. I actually had to stop playing for a moment to really understand what he was actually doing by jumping around (I was actually laughing). So I'm on vent and ask my guildie what in the wide world of sports is he doing by bunny hopping. He said because that is how they play in WOW and a large portion of the guild I am in comes from WOW as well.
To start off, I played WoW. Was in closed beta of the orginal launch. Before that I played UO and DAoC. So, get that out of the way, I'm not bashing WoW. But..
"So what does being a wow player have to do with it?"
You can tell that certain mentatlities are carried over from that game that are not as prevelant in other MMO's.
First off, as I said before, WoW is one of the first MMO's I can recall where casters have a good deal of survivability against melee classes, at least to the extent the expect to be able to stand there, take a beating and survive. It may be found in other MMO's to lesser degrees, true, but statistically speaking, with 10 million players, odds are good they played WoW before, and THAT is where they're getting the idea from.
Secondly, again likely due to it's size, WoW is the first MMO I ever played where I recall this type of weapons-grade ignorance and self-entitlement not only common, but prevelent and embraced. Maybe on average the masses act this way, but WoW is where I felt it's presence felt first. Like I have an obligation to heal him because he's a BW, and I'm a WP, and that's my job, right? RIGHT? I MUST HELP HIM. And I clearly wasn't TRYING hard enough, because he DIED...
" ... did it occur to you it hasnt played a wp so dont know how they heal"
It did occur to me. Someone who has no idea how a class works telling a player of said class how they should play, and what they're doing wrong?
Yes, this type of arrogance and stupidity is seen everywhere, but since WoW has the biggest numbers where it can be seen far more commonly than anywhere else, statistically speaking, it's a safe bet.
"... UO.."
If they played UO post AoS, maybe, since resists aren't tied to material type anymore, possibly. Pre-AoS? I don't recall in the 4 years I remember playing when a caster in cloth would complain that a dexer in plate took them down quickly.
If you'd like, I'll send him a tell from an alt next time I see him online and ask him, and let you know the result. Anyone like to place bets?
Well, you know he didnt play DAOC. Cloth casters died in umm I dunno....3 hits. heh.
Ranghar LoD
Lords of Death
So your basically going on assumptions and stating them as fact?
Hell I will just start to make unfounded assumptions.
1) Warhamer is a singleplayer game
2)Warhammer has absolutley no rpg in the game.
3) Looking for a simple minded game, go play warhamer.
4)There is absolutley no need to communicate in warhammer.
5)PQ are another word for a grind.
7) The give me now ethos is greater in warhamemr than any other mmo.
8) I was under the assumption warhammer is not for noobs, my mistake.
these are some of my basless assumtions atm.
Well whatever you think there buddy. That is your opinion.
I didn't say it was a fact the guy was from wow, I said it was a safe bet.
However the "WoW Mentality Factor" is a fact. It has been that way since WoW began and even current wow players do not wear rose tinted glasses to bed will tell you this.
I do not have to defend what I say, the WoW community makes it all a reality for me.
but whatever to each their own I guess.
Yeah, you can notice the WoW players in pvp by the way they move through you over and over, but thanks to WAR collision on players it is amusing to watch. I am not bashing WoW players for this, in WoW it was a great tactic, even more so as a rogue. You could just run through someone and get a backstab off.
Ranghar LoD
Lords of Death
Ok here it goes again. If it was not AOC players coming around saying that bad reviews on forums killed their game now its annoying players or wow forced everyone to solo. This is starting to get insane here.
I have played several games, Wow, lotR, Aoc, Tabula, and now War. I have played them solo and in groups. Out of all of them I have grouped more in wow than have in any game. Infact I think War makes it far more easier to just solo all the quests. I have done several PQs and not once did I see the need to join a group. The players there fought and did what we had to do defeat the bosses that came up. To me I thought the whole idea of PQs was to not force you to group.
I have played wow for years and my mains have grouped up several times. I will say mostly with friends or guild mates. There many of times I group up with other people to do quests. The thing is once you lvled up several alts it easy to solo. Though I do not have high lvls in War, I went through one class to lvl to 8th to get the hang of it. Then I tried another class and I find it even easier to solo things besides PQs but even then to actually form a party I don't see the need. Those do Pqs at least on my server we work as a team some run around on their own but for the most part we work together with out needing to party up. PVP is almost the same. Whether open or scenarios we work together till we beaten to a pulp by destruction lol.
I think the more popular something gets the more "annoying people" it attracts. New games are a prime target for these type of people. Though I really believe "annoying" or elitist players force more people to solo than anything. I am sure the deeper one gets into war the more grouping you will start to see.
Well, if they had a bladeturn going, especially a PBT, they might last a bit longer. Or with that ML ability Bodyguard (I think.. the one where the tank takes the damage if they stand close by.) But unprotected? Yeah, they were cannon fodder.
I agree with the OP. People whose first MMO was WoW have their perception of other games irreversibly changed. UO was my first MMO and I still compare other games to it.
A huge difference between me and them, though, is that I am 20 years old, and people whos first MMO was WoW are either too young to have been here earlier, or so deaf/dumb that they weren't aware such a thing existed until WoW.
These are the types of people where if you try to explain EVE or UO to them they are like, "No levels? No epic loot? No battlegrounds? No jumping? That's... fucking impossible!" And then their heads explode.
_______________________________
PM me when an MMO as good as UO was comes out.
The point of offering alternative methods of advancement is so that people can play the game in the way they want. I don't think this has a darn thing to do with wow. If that's the way they want to play (even if it is pretty ignorant), then more power to them.
Those stupid 10 million members, what where they thinking? This cannot be another WOW rip off? Just to make ourselves rich scheme? This is the best WOW clone ever to hit the shelves. Please go on telling how great the game is AND, I will see you in 6 months! When you are detoxing in Mom's basement!
Well, what confuses the hell out of me....If you are 'working together to complete a PQ' or 'working together to beat a scenario' how is that not grouping? Is it just not grouping because they arn't in the group window talking in group chat. A GROUP of players working together to do anything is a group. When there are 100 people trying to take a keep, and you are helping them do it, you are part of a group of players working to beat an objective. I just don't really get it. You don't have to FORM a group of players to do something. You just walk up and become a part of one, and I think that offers an amazing chance to get to know people who will often ask you to do other things with them in the future.
Ranghar LoD
Lords of Death
I personally mostly do PQs and Scenarios. Why? I love scenarios. It's that simple, they are even battles that can be taken in 15 minute chunks and then you can go do something else in between. Why do I do pqs in between? Because i want cool looking gear with good stats so that I can do better in scenarios. I also do all the regular quests as well because i enjoy WAR lore, and I plan to do more world RvR when i can but sadly i outleveled most of my guild due to the ungodly ammount of xp you get from scenarios. (Got 22k plus victory bonus in one last night)
*Nods in agreement.*
Anti-Sanctus Chaotica. This is Ranghar from The Phoenix Guard. We run into you guys quite often. See you destruction loving psychopaths on the battlefield =p
Ranghar LoD
Lords of Death
Well, what confuses the hell out of me....If you are 'working together to complete a PQ' or 'working together to beat a scenario' how is that not grouping? Is it just not grouping because they arn't in the group window talking in group chat. A GROUP of players working together to do anything is a group. When there are 100 people trying to take a keep, and you are helping them do it, you are part of a group of players working to beat an objective. I just don't really get it. You don't have to FORM a group of players to do something. You just walk up and become a part of one, and I think that offers an amazing chance to get to know people who will often ask you to do other things with them in the future.
My point about PQs was in response to another post where he was complaining that people were not joining a party to do the PQ. My thought was that was the reason for the PQ so people did not have to party up. I like PQs and I like War just it promotes soloing just as much those who were complaining about wow.
Well, what confuses the hell out of me....If you are 'working together to complete a PQ' or 'working together to beat a scenario' how is that not grouping? Is it just not grouping because they arn't in the group window talking in group chat. A GROUP of players working together to do anything is a group. When there are 100 people trying to take a keep, and you are helping them do it, you are part of a group of players working to beat an objective. I just don't really get it. You don't have to FORM a group of players to do something. You just walk up and become a part of one, and I think that offers an amazing chance to get to know people who will often ask you to do other things with them in the future.
My point about PQs was in response to another post where he was complaining that people were not joining a party to do the PQ. My thought was that was the reason for the PQ so people did not have to party up. I like PQs and I like War just it promotes soloing just as much those who were complaining about wow.
And I was saying to me that is grouping. But, 90% of the time there is an open warband at the PQs you can join. Just hit the 'open parties list' then hit 'join party' and you are in one. You are right about it being the point, It allows you to complete an objective without sitting around in the capital and begging for a party for an hour. If you want small team parties go do the dungeons. I don't really care for dungeons, but try doing them without a group, hah.
EDIT: Forced grouping leaves some players out. I remember in DAOC that a lot of people didn't get invited to RvR groups for whatever reason. Being able to take part by just 'showing up' is a good thing, not a problem. It doesn't mean you shouldn't socialize, it just means you don't have to rely on other people to have a good time.
Ranghar LoD
Lords of Death
The solo-only mindset doesn't surprise me at all... It's what most of the post-WoW mmo players were demanding/crying/whining/begging for in every MMO I've followed since WoW came out.
There goes your console/single-player "beat the game by yourself" mindset, come to full fruition.
I've seen it unfolding since WoW launched and could see where it was going. I said as much and was flamed back then. Looks like I was more right than wrong. That doesn't make me special... It was right out in the open and one needed only pay attention to how things were progressing to see where it was all heading.
It's gone like this:
- First players didn't want grouping to be necessary for all of the content on the way to end game. They wanted *some* soloability to fill in when they couldn't or didn't want to find groups.
They got it, and it was good enough for them. For a while.
- Before long, they complained of not having enough soloable content and the idea of some of the more "key" content requiring a group suddenly became offensive to them. They demanded it be more soloable, or more soloable alternatives be added.
They got it, and it was good enough for them. For a while.
- After a while, people started complaining if there was *any* group-centric content in the game. They argued that they should be able to solo to end-game if they so chose, and felt that only raids should require a group.
They mostly got their way and it was good enough for them. For a while.
- Not too long ago, I saw people actually beginning to argue for raid content to be more soloable because it's unfair to be forced to group to take on an epic battle like that.
We might be seeing the beginnings of that being delivered with public quests.
It's to the point now where you can log in, never say a word to another player if you don't want to and still do just fine.
And now the backlash begins... Those who actually do enjoy grouping - at least some of the time - are wondering what the hell happened to parties and why so many people seem to solo all the time.
In a nutshell... the post-WoW community got what they asked for. And now it's become a bitter pill to swallow for some.
and the cash shop selling asphalt..." - Mimzel on F2P/Cash Shops
If WoW wasn't created, and WAR still came out, then WAR would be a completely different game. Truth be dat.
Oh ya, and that completely different game would probably be 1000x better.