Sadly the dramatic thread title does not surprise me. We are all hopefuls, hoping something new will come out and take the twiddling of our thumbs away. "Who else could possibly come and save the masses. Such great storytelling, such inventive and creative development teams..." .Bioware is a great company, fair enough. But doesn't this all sound so familiar? "Turbine...they created Asheron's Call, a great initial MMO that many fans adored, they know how to build a great game..." "Oh Vanguard...it will be the Everquest junkies homecoming...The creator GETS it, he just does." "Funcom, creator of the ever great Anarchy Online. Though it had a buggy start, it was a great salvation to many gamers...AOC will be so creative it can't fail." "Mythic...Ultima Online...DAOC...the WoW killer..." Highly condensed? Yes. But nonetheless these buzz sentences were overflowing in the MMO community for every game. I was one of the believers of almost everyone of them, even the games I didn't think interested me (WAR) I bought anyhow. Why? Because i'm looking to enjoy myself in an MMO like times past like so many other people. There is going to be a large black hole here for awhile, in a way we were very fortunate to have Lotro, Vanguard, Aoc, and WAR titles on the horizon. It gave us all hope for awhile that better days were to come. I guess what i'm saying is, if you don't have a sense of cynicism towards future MMO games..perhaps you should. I for one would like nothing more than a big juicy steak instead of the single-serving helpings we've been led to believe were something....otherwise. But we've all shelled out decent cash for something we played for 1 to 2 (if we had the patience) months. There's almost nothing else to look forward to, I get it. That doesn't translate into one single company being the savior of a bunch of bored folk. I'm just as afraid as anyone else, afraid that it won't turn out that romantic.
You sir, have hit the nail on the head. BioWare could fail as all the rest but compared to the others they also have the ability to succeed having not been tainted by the industry yet.
Most of us want so badly to recreate those first moments they stepped into a good MMO. Why is it that other games don't have this problem? Answer is competition and innovation. The tyrant must fall!!!!
I'm not liking the sound of this. A potential TV tie in and EA involvement makes this reek of dumbed down craptastic mediocrity the likes of which have never been seen before. If you had asked me without mentioning those things then I would said this was guarenteed win even though Bioware haven't made an mmorpg before.
EA is resurgent in the minds of gamers as of now. Go look at NeoGAF. I have never seen so many people absolutly praising EA before.
When did the change happen?
Well when BioWare's old boss John Ricaccelo was hired as head of EA things immediatly changed for the better. They are a great company now that has, under John, completely changed its image.
Plus BioWare will have the most creative freedom having their former Boss in charge of EA. Fear not!
I think the sad truth in my opinion that pretty much every MMO is mediocre. I play them, and I enjoy them to some extent, but there hasn't been a game in years that has kept my interest for more than a month. I don't know if the fate of the genre is up to Bioware, and I really don't care.I only hope Bioware makes a good game and lives up to their potential like they have in every single game that they've created.
I think the sad truth in my opinion that pretty much every MMO is mediocre. I play them, and I enjoy them to some extent, but there hasn't been a game in years that has kept my interest for more than a month. I don't know if the fate of the genre is up to Bioware, and I really don't care.I only hope Bioware makes a good game and lives up to their potential like they have in every single game that they've created.
* Life is not black or white, it's shades of grey. But, at it's best/worst, it hints at 32bit color. -Me (a.k.a. RuthlessTimes)
* I do not need to know how to make a better game than you. I just need to know how to cancel my subscription. -Antarious(a slight misquote but the sentiment remains)
A kotor mmo would be fun I guess but I more looking foward to Dragon Age Origins(even though it's room based) I loved Baldur's gate 1 and 2.
I am looking forward to DA:O as well. But that is made by BioWare Edmenton. BioWare Austin is developing the MMO and has been for 3 years. I read an article in EGM that was an interview of the BioWare Austin guys. They said they are using the Hero Engine for thier game and that it was playable. They even said they were having a blast playing it in the office. So that tells me that it is atleast feature complete. We might see late Alpha or early beta images on the 21st.
Lets face it, MMORPGs have not evoled one bit since WoW came out. The genre is now overflowing with clones and scams. What MMOs need now is a breath of fresh air. In comes BioWare. Arguably the best "story telling" RPG developer out there, BioWare is making a bold move by attempting to take on the MMO market. Sort of like another company that made only RTS games did years ago...cough....blizzard...cough. This gives BioWare the oportunity to revolutionize the industry and get us out of the wow clone fest we have today. Or they can fall in step behind blizzard and put out another clone dooming us to another 1000000 years of mediocrity. Hyperbole aside, we are at a pivotal point for MMOs. No established big wig of MMOdom will get thier heads out of blizzards arse long enough to make anything worthwhile so its up to a new comer to tow the line of change. Can BioWare do it.? They certainly can make some good RPGs but making an MMO interesting and engaging is a much harder a task. Plus Lucas Arts will be a part of the mix. Something I never thought BioWare would put up with again. Word is this might be a KoTOR MMO. Thats fine and dandy if done right. But I am really hoping that this new MMO ties into the new Star Wars live action tv show (not animated). I have heard rumors that this is the case and that you can watch the show and then hop on the game and visit the locations just explored in the show. Maybe even updates could coincide with showtimes so that after the show diologue could change "in game" to reflect what happened in the show. I am talking total integration of tv and games that has never been seen before. Hell the possiblities are endless and it would definately revolutionize the industry combined with BioWare's track record of good stroy telling. Or it could just be a KoTOR MMO.
If the last three "live" movies and the animated film were any indication of Lucas Arts ability to tell a story, or make a good film, I am afraid that bodes poorly for Bioware when it comes to a tie in with the series. Bioware is capable of making good games. but I think they would have been better off going with their own IP. Do they own mass effect? It seems like a very good lore to build upon.
Of course I am interested in another Star Wars MMO, but after what has been done to Star Wars over the past 8 years, I am starting to think they would have been better off leaving it a what if rather than a has been.
Played (more than a month): SWG, Second Life, Tabula Rasa, Lineage 2, Everquest 2, EvE, MxO, Ryzom.
BIOWARE IS NOT making a normal MMO. It WILL be a heavily instanced story driven game. I'm sure a vast majority of people would be surprised if it wasn't.
I've been saying this since the Kotor MMO hint a few months ago.
Kotor 3 will me Guildwars with lightsabers.
It will be a fanastic game just not the evolution you guys want.
Lets face it, MMORPGs have not evoled one bit since WoW came out. The genre is now overflowing with clones and scams. What MMOs need now is a breath of fresh air. In comes BioWare. Arguably the best "story telling" RPG developer out there, BioWare is making a bold move by attempting to take on the MMO market. Sort of like another company that made only RTS games did years ago...cough....blizzard...cough. This gives BioWare the oportunity to revolutionize the industry and get us out of the wow clone fest we have today. Or they can fall in step behind blizzard and put out another clone dooming us to another 1000000 years of mediocrity. Hyperbole aside, we are at a pivotal point for MMOs. No established big wig of MMOdom will get thier heads out of blizzards arse long enough to make anything worthwhile so its up to a new comer to tow the line of change. Can BioWare do it.? They certainly can make some good RPGs but making an MMO interesting and engaging is a much harder a task. Plus Lucas Arts will be a part of the mix. Something I never thought BioWare would put up with again. Word is this might be a KoTOR MMO. Thats fine and dandy if done right. But I am really hoping that this new MMO ties into the new Star Wars live action tv show (not animated). I have heard rumors that this is the case and that you can watch the show and then hop on the game and visit the locations just explored in the show. Maybe even updates could coincide with showtimes so that after the show diologue could change "in game" to reflect what happened in the show. I am talking total integration of tv and games that has never been seen before. Hell the possiblities are endless and it would definately revolutionize the industry combined with BioWare's track record of good stroy telling. Or it could just be a KoTOR MMO.
That's a pretty sound theory. As for me I do like the The Clone Wars series. So for me it won't matter KOTOR, Clone Wars, live action series, or even the civil wars again like Star Wars Galaxies. Its all good to me as long as it Star Wars. I think it might be cool if they do multiple Star Wars MMOs at the same time from different eras and wars from the Star Wars movies, tv shows, and video games. So everyone can be happy in their favorite part of the Star Wars Universe. I know it sounds like it would cost Lucas a lot of money, but he has been funding all of his own pet projects lately out of pocket.
When we get back from where we are going, we will return to where we were. I know people there!
Lets face it, MMORPGs have not evoled one bit since WoW came out. The genre is now overflowing with clones and scams. What MMOs need now is a breath of fresh air. In comes BioWare. Arguably the best "story telling" RPG developer out there, BioWare is making a bold move by attempting to take on the MMO market. Sort of like another company that made only RTS games did years ago...cough....blizzard...cough. This gives BioWare the oportunity to revolutionize the industry and get us out of the wow clone fest we have today. Or they can fall in step behind blizzard and put out another clone dooming us to another 1000000 years of mediocrity. Hyperbole aside, we are at a pivotal point for MMOs. No established big wig of MMOdom will get thier heads out of blizzards arse long enough to make anything worthwhile so its up to a new comer to tow the line of change. Can BioWare do it.? They certainly can make some good RPGs but making an MMO interesting and engaging is a much harder a task. Plus Lucas Arts will be a part of the mix. Something I never thought BioWare would put up with again. Word is this might be a KoTOR MMO. Thats fine and dandy if done right. But I am really hoping that this new MMO ties into the new Star Wars live action tv show (not animated). I have heard rumors that this is the case and that you can watch the show and then hop on the game and visit the locations just explored in the show. Maybe even updates could coincide with showtimes so that after the show diologue could change "in game" to reflect what happened in the show. I am talking total integration of tv and games that has never been seen before. Hell the possiblities are endless and it would definately revolutionize the industry combined with BioWare's track record of good stroy telling. Or it could just be a KoTOR MMO.
More than likely given their background of focusing on story telling, and the interviews with the lead developers of the game we will be getting another Lord of the rings online. A mmo that is basically as cookie cutter as you can get, but with a great storyline, and a few minor additions to seperate it it from the pack.
To be honest I dont know why people would get so hyped over Bioware, they make good RPGs, with Good storylines, they dont make hugely innovative, revolutionary games. They also seem to be a 1 trick pony, because although the storylines in their games are good the actual gameplay or anything else about the game is never really exceptional.
i think the only innovative thing they have ever done in RPGs was the full voice over work for KOTRO, I cant think of anything else they have done that I have not seen in games previous.
They are a lot like Blizzard, they do one or two things well, Blizzard has copy and pasting down to an art, with lots of polishing. And Bioware does great storylines, and from what I have seen they always release a reasonably well polished game. But like Blizzard they stick to what they are good at, rather than try to do something different, and interesting. Generally when I play one of their games I know exactly what I will get, and what I wont get.
So in that sense I think whatever they make will do well and most likely be a good game, but I also know that whatever they make will not change the industry in any meaningful way. Because more than likely they will play it safe, and as the interviews with the developers suggest that is exactly what they plan to do.
I'll ask this nicely..please..please! don't overhype this game, i am a fan of bioware also, but i'm just hoping for a fun game, i'm not making a wish list of things to be in it, i'm not thinking they will save the mmo world...just people need to control the hype machine better and not go overboard.
Look at all the games that have come out and have been overhyped...just seriously hope for a good game and don't set your expectations to high.
"The great thing about human language is that it prevents us from sticking to the matter at hand." - Lewis Thomas
You are kidding right? "only Bioware can save the MMO!! OOOooooOOooooOOO"
The truth is that more people than every before are playing MMOs, Millions more. The genre is in no need of saving. You are all like underground althetes whose "niche" sport became famous so now you are all angry and jaded. It's ok I used to be like, used to hate WoW for what "it did" to the community and the genre but I've gotten over it.
You know what would happen is someone made a game that was like UO, EQ or DAoC? People would flip the fuck out. Very few people would play it, people would claim "it's too hard to level", they are not enough quests." "why do I have to grind" The truth is that ALL MMO are a grind, they just are, that is the basic premise for an MMORPG, Recent games i.e. WoW, WAR, LOTRO. just hide that grind with lots of quests and funny looking graphics.
Can Bioware make a good MMO? You better believe they can.
Will they? who knows
Does the balance of life and death rest on the commercial success of their game? ...don't be stupid.
The fate of MMO's isn't up to any one game company. It is all in the hands of us as the players of the MMO genre. We complain day in and day out about cookie cutter,dumbed down and wow clones. Yet we go and buy these cookie cutter,dumbed down wow clones as soon as they are availble. We flock to stores to pre-order. We stand in lineups on opening day so we can get our copy of "new MMO"
There are only 2 ways for a genre to change. First is time. Given enough time it will slowly evolve and become what we are hoping for right now. Problem is that by that time our expectations for a game will also have changed.
The other way is for us as the gamer to force a change. If a company comes out with an unsatisfactory experience DON'T BUY IT. Do not pre order. Do not wait in line on the day the game goes live to scoop up your copy. This would be the fastest but hardest way to make a change. Hardest in that we as gamers are always wanting something fresh and new. Something different from what we are playing now, even if it is basically the same game just dressed up and named differently (I am guilty of this also). But if we the community as a whole literally boycotted gaming companies that regurgitate a clone,dress it up and call it innovative then we could force them to come out with actual fresh ideas. To actually make a game that is different from what is out there now. If game companies come out with game after game that flops because we aren't buying them then it will force their hands.
Tabula Rasa tried to break the mold and look what happend to that game...
I think the MMO market is generally broken into two camps....those that like to PvE more than anything else and those that like to PvP more than anything else. Both systems conflict with eachother and is one of the toughest issues for game developers to balance.....second to class balancing.
Game companies that focus one one aspect of the game miss out on a large portion of the playerbase....which means they miss out on a large portion of the dollars. Darkfall (in concept) is most PvPer's dream but it can't get the financial backing from the EA's of the world because of all the resources involved in developing and maintaining the game for only a small portion of the MMO market doesn't make much cents.
PvE games generally have a little more success, just because there are more PvErs in the mix, but eventually crash and burn when competing agianst the likes of WOW.
So the answer is to please everyone and no one, ala WOW. Create a system that appeals to the entier MMO spectrum....but due to the conflicts that exist between the PvE and PvP systems (and limited allocation of resources to both) you dumb it down so you have less variables to balance.
I just don't know what else you can do on a practicle level to "break the mold"....still keep it a MMO....and not scare off all the big game publishers by alienating half of the playerbase.
BIOWARE IS NOT making a normal MMO. It WILL be a heavily instanced story driven game. I'm sure a vast majority of people would be surprised if it wasn't.
I've been saying this since the Kotor MMO hint a few months ago.
Kotor 3 will me Guildwars with lightsabers.
It will be a fanastic game just not the evolution you guys want.
Sadly, this is probably true. Actually, this is the major reason why I've never really been that excited about this MMO. Will it be a quality MMO? More than likely. Will it be a return to the more "worldly" MMO? Probably not.
It's really up to us players to change the MMO industry really. I've tried quite a few MMOs and the most different and original one is defenatly EVE. Currently I play FFXI and EQ2 as the PVE is fun in FFXI and PVP fun in EQ2.
Really, it's sad that so many people rise WoW upon a piedestal. It's not a bad game and it's good if you consider why and how they made it. They made is fairly simplistic, easy and easy to learn to attract more players. After all, the more players that play, the more money for them. It's only natural that other mmorpgs follows the trend and aim to make simplistic games too.
I don't care what most gamejournalists game, WoW did NOT revolutionate the MMO genre, but it did introduce it to alot more players. And I wish they would stop claiming it made a revolution. Once we can get past that, maybe we can start demanding more dynamic type of games with more interesting and better fights. What we lack the most is dynamic and good fights along with an actual *story*. Bioware is certanly good at making stories.
yeah anything that has to do with star wars im game. I never got to play SWG before it was destroyed and i was told to run from the burning ship. I love bioware and lucasarts and if they can make a lightsaber appear on my screen ill be playing the game. I cant wait for Oct. 21.
In a sense, WoW did revolutionize the genre by making it more accessible to casual people. I remember when i first played EQ i played for 7 months, 7 months and i did not even reach max level which at the time was 65. The casual MMO person does not have this amount of time on their hands to play one game and not see barely any results in game.
As far as new MMO IP's coming out; people are going to try things that are new, thats just the way it is. As a previous post said, people should not pre-order or stand out in lines but most people will still preorder and still wait in lines because it's something new and everyone wants to start a MMO at release so they are on equal ground with everyone else. In the grand scheme of things, people that read or even post on boards like these for the most part represent the hardcore people. Their are still millions of casuals that just want to try something new.
When a new MMO comes out, if it interests me, you best believe i am going to buy it. I am looking forward to the Bioware MMO whatever it is because of the name Bioware. Some things i just know i will like and Bioware is one of those things, they have not let me down yet and barring just a horrible looking and received game i will probably buy that one on release.
The thing with KOTOR, is that it's basically a proven brand name. Both of them sold well over a million copies. That helped WoW, it built on the popularity of Warcraft.
On the downside though, the game mostly sold on the original Xbox, to console gamers. (I know there was a PC version, but it sold far less). So it might make more sense to keep KOTOR on consoles, and come up with a new brand for the PC MMORPG.
Still, I think the KOTOR setting, versus the setting of the upcoming live action series is better suited for a game. For one, there were a lot of Jedi, which is part of the appeal of playing a Star Wars game (since that's what sets it apart from other space opera settings). But also because there were a lot of Sith. There's also a lot more room for making stuff up
You know what the next WoW killer will be? Not a WoW Clone, but the game that takes WoW's philosophy of "Take the best ideas and dumb them down". I swear to you...with all these failed games...if one company took all of the best parts and put them into one game...you would have the next WoW killer. Don't copy what WoW is now. Do what WoW 2 would do.
lets face it this has some truth to it.
after all wow did copy EQ but improved on it .so the next big thing will probably improve on WOW.I think if WAR improved their end game pve they could have done it
I dont really care if it's a WoW killer or not, I am just psyched for a Bioware MMO. Whether it was in the Star Wars universe or the Mass Effect universe, I would play it either way.
A Baldur's Gate MMO would be good too, now that I think of it.
Odds are it'll be the same level based donkey-spank that's being churned out by an industry entrenched in the Blizzard Doctrine. I've tried being optimistic with the recent releases moving away from the "ride a rail content" from one area to the next level based "level for cookies" forumla. AAA companies aren't interested in doing that, though.
So, yeah, I'll watch on the 21st or whatever day it is the information gets released. I can say that when (not if) I see that it is "more of the same" with levels and such and just an overall focus on the same game mechanics that get beaten like a dead horse over and over, at that point I'll just pull up a seat and what and get a kick out of people blowing a gasket over how it's a "WoW clone", as if a AAA company today has the stones to go any other route and emulate the progression of say Ultima Online at it's launch or Star Wars Galaxies in the beginning.
Nope, "I have a bad feeling about this" and that feeling is a level-based Jedi sausage fest grind from 1 to level cap.
"Many nights, my friend... Many nights I've put a blade to your throat while you were sleeping. Glad I never killed you, Steve. You're alright..."
Lets face it, MMORPGs have not evoled one bit since WoW came out. The genre is now overflowing with clones and scams. What MMOs need now is a breath of fresh air. In comes BioWare. Arguably the best "story telling" RPG developer out there, BioWare is making a bold move by attempting to take on the MMO market. Sort of like another company that made only RTS games did years ago...cough....blizzard...cough. This gives BioWare the oportunity to revolutionize the industry and get us out of the wow clone fest we have today. Or they can fall in step behind blizzard and put out another clone dooming us to another 1000000 years of mediocrity. Hyperbole aside, we are at a pivotal point for MMOs. No established big wig of MMOdom will get thier heads out of blizzards arse long enough to make anything worthwhile so its up to a new comer to tow the line of change. Can BioWare do it.? They certainly can make some good RPGs but making an MMO interesting and engaging is a much harder a task. Plus Lucas Arts will be a part of the mix. Something I never thought BioWare would put up with again. Word is this might be a KoTOR MMO. Thats fine and dandy if done right. But I am really hoping that this new MMO ties into the new Star Wars live action tv show (not animated). I have heard rumors that this is the case and that you can watch the show and then hop on the game and visit the locations just explored in the show. Maybe even updates could coincide with showtimes so that after the show diologue could change "in game" to reflect what happened in the show. I am talking total integration of tv and games that has never been seen before. Hell the possiblities are endless and it would definately revolutionize the industry combined with BioWare's track record of good stroy telling. Or it could just be a KoTOR MMO.
Well to be perfectly fair, there haven't really been any evolutions from the original 4 mmos. I am talking Ultima Online, Meridian 59, EverQuest and AOL's Neverwinter Nights. Sure the graphics have evolved, and the systems have been refined but there is nothing evolutionary out there, and WOW sure as heck wasn't a revolutionary game. SWG was the closest thing to revolutionary that I have seen and it fell flat on its face, and some would argue that Second Life, A Tale in the Desert, and Eve are revolutionary, but again, they are just refinements upon that which came before.
Can BioWare make a revolutionary game? I dunno. The definately know how to take an existing genre and expand it greatly. They have many of the original dev team from SWG but I think that they may bring a heck of a lot more of the single player game into the mmo and I am not sure that that is where the genre needs to or should go. Time will tell, 2 weeks until the announcement? Hope to see some gameplay vids
Comments
You sir, have hit the nail on the head. BioWare could fail as all the rest but compared to the others they also have the ability to succeed having not been tainted by the industry yet.
Most of us want so badly to recreate those first moments they stepped into a good MMO. Why is it that other games don't have this problem? Answer is competition and innovation. The tyrant must fall!!!!
Playing: Tera, BF3, ME3
Waiting on: Guild Wars 2
EA is resurgent in the minds of gamers as of now. Go look at NeoGAF. I have never seen so many people absolutly praising EA before.
When did the change happen?
Well when BioWare's old boss John Ricaccelo was hired as head of EA things immediatly changed for the better. They are a great company now that has, under John, completely changed its image.
Plus BioWare will have the most creative freedom having their former Boss in charge of EA. Fear not!
Playing: Tera, BF3, ME3
Waiting on: Guild Wars 2
I think the sad truth in my opinion that pretty much every MMO is mediocre. I play them, and I enjoy them to some extent, but there hasn't been a game in years that has kept my interest for more than a month. I don't know if the fate of the genre is up to Bioware, and I really don't care.I only hope Bioware makes a good game and lives up to their potential like they have in every single game that they've created.
A kotor mmo would be fun I guess but I more looking foward to Dragon Age Origins(even though it's room based) I loved Baldur's gate 1 and 2.
* Life is not black or white, it's shades of grey. But, at it's best/worst, it hints at 32bit color. -Me (a.k.a. RuthlessTimes)
* I do not need to know how to make a better game than you. I just need to know how to cancel my subscription. -Antarious(a slight misquote but the sentiment remains)
I am looking forward to DA:O as well. But that is made by BioWare Edmenton. BioWare Austin is developing the MMO and has been for 3 years. I read an article in EGM that was an interview of the BioWare Austin guys. They said they are using the Hero Engine for thier game and that it was playable. They even said they were having a blast playing it in the office. So that tells me that it is atleast feature complete. We might see late Alpha or early beta images on the 21st.
Playing: Tera, BF3, ME3
Waiting on: Guild Wars 2
If the last three "live" movies and the animated film were any indication of Lucas Arts ability to tell a story, or make a good film, I am afraid that bodes poorly for Bioware when it comes to a tie in with the series. Bioware is capable of making good games. but I think they would have been better off going with their own IP. Do they own mass effect? It seems like a very good lore to build upon.
Of course I am interested in another Star Wars MMO, but after what has been done to Star Wars over the past 8 years, I am starting to think they would have been better off leaving it a what if rather than a has been.
Played (more than a month): SWG, Second Life, Tabula Rasa, Lineage 2, Everquest 2, EvE, MxO, Ryzom.
Tried: WoW, Shadowbane, Anarchy Online, Everquest, WWII Online, Planetside
Beta: Lotro, Tabula Rasa, WAR.
I've been saying this since the Kotor MMO hint a few months ago.
Kotor 3 will me Guildwars with lightsabers.
It will be a fanastic game just not the evolution you guys want.
Playing: Nothing
Looking forward to: Nothing
That's a pretty sound theory. As for me I do like the The Clone Wars series. So for me it won't matter KOTOR, Clone Wars, live action series, or even the civil wars again like Star Wars Galaxies. Its all good to me as long as it Star Wars. I think it might be cool if they do multiple Star Wars MMOs at the same time from different eras and wars from the Star Wars movies, tv shows, and video games. So everyone can be happy in their favorite part of the Star Wars Universe. I know it sounds like it would cost Lucas a lot of money, but he has been funding all of his own pet projects lately out of pocket.
When we get back from where we are going, we will return to where we were. I know people there!
More than likely given their background of focusing on story telling, and the interviews with the lead developers of the game we will be getting another Lord of the rings online. A mmo that is basically as cookie cutter as you can get, but with a great storyline, and a few minor additions to seperate it it from the pack.
To be honest I dont know why people would get so hyped over Bioware, they make good RPGs, with Good storylines, they dont make hugely innovative, revolutionary games. They also seem to be a 1 trick pony, because although the storylines in their games are good the actual gameplay or anything else about the game is never really exceptional.
i think the only innovative thing they have ever done in RPGs was the full voice over work for KOTRO, I cant think of anything else they have done that I have not seen in games previous.
They are a lot like Blizzard, they do one or two things well, Blizzard has copy and pasting down to an art, with lots of polishing. And Bioware does great storylines, and from what I have seen they always release a reasonably well polished game. But like Blizzard they stick to what they are good at, rather than try to do something different, and interesting. Generally when I play one of their games I know exactly what I will get, and what I wont get.
So in that sense I think whatever they make will do well and most likely be a good game, but I also know that whatever they make will not change the industry in any meaningful way. Because more than likely they will play it safe, and as the interviews with the developers suggest that is exactly what they plan to do.
Blizzard is working on a "Next Gen MMO" as from what I read on their site, and from what I hear, Bethesta is working on an MMO.
Either of those companies can break the mold.
And I know a lot of people will not agree with me, so:
1, 2, 3, GO
Groovy.
I'll ask this nicely..please..please! don't overhype this game, i am a fan of bioware also, but i'm just hoping for a fun game, i'm not making a wish list of things to be in it, i'm not thinking they will save the mmo world...just people need to control the hype machine better and not go overboard.
Look at all the games that have come out and have been overhyped...just seriously hope for a good game and don't set your expectations to high.
"The great thing about human language is that it prevents us from sticking to the matter at hand."
- Lewis Thomas
It will be another clone, or even worse.
You are kidding right? "only Bioware can save the MMO!! OOOooooOOooooOOO"
The truth is that more people than every before are playing MMOs, Millions more. The genre is in no need of saving. You are all like underground althetes whose "niche" sport became famous so now you are all angry and jaded. It's ok I used to be like, used to hate WoW for what "it did" to the community and the genre but I've gotten over it.
You know what would happen is someone made a game that was like UO, EQ or DAoC? People would flip the fuck out. Very few people would play it, people would claim "it's too hard to level", they are not enough quests." "why do I have to grind" The truth is that ALL MMO are a grind, they just are, that is the basic premise for an MMORPG, Recent games i.e. WoW, WAR, LOTRO. just hide that grind with lots of quests and funny looking graphics.
Can Bioware make a good MMO? You better believe they can.
Will they? who knows
Does the balance of life and death rest on the commercial success of their game? ...don't be stupid.
The fate of MMO's isn't up to any one game company. It is all in the hands of us as the players of the MMO genre. We complain day in and day out about cookie cutter,dumbed down and wow clones. Yet we go and buy these cookie cutter,dumbed down wow clones as soon as they are availble. We flock to stores to pre-order. We stand in lineups on opening day so we can get our copy of "new MMO"
There are only 2 ways for a genre to change. First is time. Given enough time it will slowly evolve and become what we are hoping for right now. Problem is that by that time our expectations for a game will also have changed.
The other way is for us as the gamer to force a change. If a company comes out with an unsatisfactory experience DON'T BUY IT. Do not pre order. Do not wait in line on the day the game goes live to scoop up your copy. This would be the fastest but hardest way to make a change. Hardest in that we as gamers are always wanting something fresh and new. Something different from what we are playing now, even if it is basically the same game just dressed up and named differently (I am guilty of this also). But if we the community as a whole literally boycotted gaming companies that regurgitate a clone,dress it up and call it innovative then we could force them to come out with actual fresh ideas. To actually make a game that is different from what is out there now. If game companies come out with game after game that flops because we aren't buying them then it will force their hands.
Tabula Rasa tried to break the mold and look what happend to that game...
I think the MMO market is generally broken into two camps....those that like to PvE more than anything else and those that like to PvP more than anything else. Both systems conflict with eachother and is one of the toughest issues for game developers to balance.....second to class balancing.
Game companies that focus one one aspect of the game miss out on a large portion of the playerbase....which means they miss out on a large portion of the dollars. Darkfall (in concept) is most PvPer's dream but it can't get the financial backing from the EA's of the world because of all the resources involved in developing and maintaining the game for only a small portion of the MMO market doesn't make much cents.
PvE games generally have a little more success, just because there are more PvErs in the mix, but eventually crash and burn when competing agianst the likes of WOW.
So the answer is to please everyone and no one, ala WOW. Create a system that appeals to the entier MMO spectrum....but due to the conflicts that exist between the PvE and PvP systems (and limited allocation of resources to both) you dumb it down so you have less variables to balance.
I just don't know what else you can do on a practicle level to "break the mold"....still keep it a MMO....and not scare off all the big game publishers by alienating half of the playerbase.
I've been saying this since the Kotor MMO hint a few months ago.
Kotor 3 will me Guildwars with lightsabers.
It will be a fanastic game just not the evolution you guys want.
Sadly, this is probably true. Actually, this is the major reason why I've never really been that excited about this MMO. Will it be a quality MMO? More than likely. Will it be a return to the more "worldly" MMO? Probably not.
It's really up to us players to change the MMO industry really. I've tried quite a few MMOs and the most different and original one is defenatly EVE. Currently I play FFXI and EQ2 as the PVE is fun in FFXI and PVP fun in EQ2.
Really, it's sad that so many people rise WoW upon a piedestal. It's not a bad game and it's good if you consider why and how they made it. They made is fairly simplistic, easy and easy to learn to attract more players. After all, the more players that play, the more money for them. It's only natural that other mmorpgs follows the trend and aim to make simplistic games too.
I don't care what most gamejournalists game, WoW did NOT revolutionate the MMO genre, but it did introduce it to alot more players. And I wish they would stop claiming it made a revolution. Once we can get past that, maybe we can start demanding more dynamic type of games with more interesting and better fights. What we lack the most is dynamic and good fights along with an actual *story*. Bioware is certanly good at making stories.
yeah anything that has to do with star wars im game. I never got to play SWG before it was destroyed and i was told to run from the burning ship. I love bioware and lucasarts and if they can make a lightsaber appear on my screen ill be playing the game. I cant wait for Oct. 21.
In a sense, WoW did revolutionize the genre by making it more accessible to casual people. I remember when i first played EQ i played for 7 months, 7 months and i did not even reach max level which at the time was 65. The casual MMO person does not have this amount of time on their hands to play one game and not see barely any results in game.
As far as new MMO IP's coming out; people are going to try things that are new, thats just the way it is. As a previous post said, people should not pre-order or stand out in lines but most people will still preorder and still wait in lines because it's something new and everyone wants to start a MMO at release so they are on equal ground with everyone else. In the grand scheme of things, people that read or even post on boards like these for the most part represent the hardcore people. Their are still millions of casuals that just want to try something new.
When a new MMO comes out, if it interests me, you best believe i am going to buy it. I am looking forward to the Bioware MMO whatever it is because of the name Bioware. Some things i just know i will like and Bioware is one of those things, they have not let me down yet and barring just a horrible looking and received game i will probably buy that one on release.
The thing with KOTOR, is that it's basically a proven brand name. Both of them sold well over a million copies. That helped WoW, it built on the popularity of Warcraft.
On the downside though, the game mostly sold on the original Xbox, to console gamers. (I know there was a PC version, but it sold far less). So it might make more sense to keep KOTOR on consoles, and come up with a new brand for the PC MMORPG.
Still, I think the KOTOR setting, versus the setting of the upcoming live action series is better suited for a game. For one, there were a lot of Jedi, which is part of the appeal of playing a Star Wars game (since that's what sets it apart from other space opera settings). But also because there were a lot of Sith. There's also a lot more room for making stuff up
R.I.P. City of Heroes and my 17 characters there
lets face it this has some truth to it.
after all wow did copy EQ but improved on it .so the next big thing will probably improve on WOW.I think if WAR improved their end game pve they could have done it
I dont really care if it's a WoW killer or not, I am just psyched for a Bioware MMO. Whether it was in the Star Wars universe or the Mass Effect universe, I would play it either way.
A Baldur's Gate MMO would be good too, now that I think of it.
Odds are it'll be the same level based donkey-spank that's being churned out by an industry entrenched in the Blizzard Doctrine. I've tried being optimistic with the recent releases moving away from the "ride a rail content" from one area to the next level based "level for cookies" forumla. AAA companies aren't interested in doing that, though.
So, yeah, I'll watch on the 21st or whatever day it is the information gets released. I can say that when (not if) I see that it is "more of the same" with levels and such and just an overall focus on the same game mechanics that get beaten like a dead horse over and over, at that point I'll just pull up a seat and what and get a kick out of people blowing a gasket over how it's a "WoW clone", as if a AAA company today has the stones to go any other route and emulate the progression of say Ultima Online at it's launch or Star Wars Galaxies in the beginning.
Nope, "I have a bad feeling about this" and that feeling is a level-based Jedi sausage fest grind from 1 to level cap.
"Many nights, my friend... Many nights I've put a blade to your throat while you were sleeping. Glad I never killed you, Steve. You're alright..."
Chavez y Chavez
Well to be perfectly fair, there haven't really been any evolutions from the original 4 mmos. I am talking Ultima Online, Meridian 59, EverQuest and AOL's Neverwinter Nights. Sure the graphics have evolved, and the systems have been refined but there is nothing evolutionary out there, and WOW sure as heck wasn't a revolutionary game. SWG was the closest thing to revolutionary that I have seen and it fell flat on its face, and some would argue that Second Life, A Tale in the Desert, and Eve are revolutionary, but again, they are just refinements upon that which came before.
Can BioWare make a revolutionary game? I dunno. The definately know how to take an existing genre and expand it greatly. They have many of the original dev team from SWG but I think that they may bring a heck of a lot more of the single player game into the mmo and I am not sure that that is where the genre needs to or should go. Time will tell, 2 weeks until the announcement? Hope to see some gameplay vids
http://www.speedtest.net/result/7300033012