Again.. you just don't know the basics of accounting.
Look at the second quarter numbers. There are 3 lines I want you to find
Cash at beginning of period (march 1) 52M
Cash at end of period (june 30) 36M
Change in cash and cash equivalents - -18M
You see, you keep making a basic mistake of relating that 36M to revenues or profits. That 36M has NOTHING to do with revenues or profits. That 36M is ALL ABOUT CASHFLOW.
Funcom had negative cashflow of 18M in the second quarter.. which means they spent 18M of their bank. Now at the end of this period, they only had 36M left.. and they have been spending about 6M per month more then they have been bringing in. 36 divided by 6 = 6 month of cashflow left (from June 30th). Funcom will completely spend that bank by January.
Again, Revenues and profits only indirectly relate to that 36M .. if you want to follow what is happening to that 36M, you have to look at that -18M in cashflow that Funcom had in the second quarter.
I don't think Cobra/Orion/Ilovefuncom has any connection to Funcom.
If you read Avery, GG, or EE's posts, you can see that they know what they are talking about. The numbers that GG and EE used were factual, but misleading... and they used proper english. There was a certain intelligence about their spin.
Cobra/Orion/Ilovefuncom is more like the guy who just keeps yelling louder than everyone else thinking that means 'he won'. What he actually is saying doesn't make sense or in no way shows a thought process.. he just hopes that if he yells it enough times someone will pay attention to him.
It's all good though.. Just like the 'ILOVEFUNCOM' alt disappeared as soon as the PVP patch caused no real bump in subscribers.. cobra/orion will leave soon enough, and he'll come back with a new alt that has some other big 'reason' that AOC will grow.
Again.. you just don't know the basics of accounting. Look at the second quarter numbers. There are 3 lines I want you to find Cash at beginning of period (march 1) 52M
Cash at end of period (june 30) 36M
Change in cash and cash equivalents - -18M You see, you keep making a basic mistake of relating that 36M to revenues or profits. That 36M has NOTHING to do with revenues or profits. That 36M is ALL ABOUT CASHFLOW. Funcom had negative cashflow of 18M in the second quarter.. which means they spent 18M of their bank. Now at the end of this period, they only had 36M left.. and they have been spending about 6M per month more then they have been bringing in. 36 divided by 6 = 6 month of cashflow left (from June 30th). Funcom will completely spend that bank by January. Again, Revenues and profits only indirectly relate to that 36M .. if you want to follow what is happening to that 36M, you have to look at that -18M in cashflow that Funcom had in the second quarter.
Ohh my god YOU just don't know what you are talking about. -5.7(or your number -7) is the only one that mean anything as long as remaining cash that was used was turned into assets for the company. 32 M is still a tremendous amount of liquidity... Dude you talk like YOU don't know what you are talking about. You need Balance Sheet, Cashflow and Profit and losses to know what's going on. P&L on Q3 told us that result for FC in that quarter (which by the way they got any sub from) was -5.7 (or your number if you like). What you post above simply mean cash was transferred from Cash to fixed assets or inventory in the balance sheet. Stop it man, you are not fooling anyone here. As fare as your numbers 52 and 36 I don't remember if they are correct but still you stetements are wrong regardless of the numbers you call.
Again.. you just don't know the basics of accounting.
Give the guy a break. CobraSolidus asked his colleague at Funcom, who works in accounting, and clearly misunderstood what he said.
Don't give up, Cobra. There are still plenty of suckers out there. Just keep feeding them that propaganda about how AoC has become amazing in a couple of weeks and how you had some many unfortunate technical problems with WAR. Good luck.
Oops, I did it again. Another personal attack. I really hope I don't get banned for this...
Dude, Azrile and team decided to do the accountant test on someone that is familiar with it, thats all. There is no need to back down on something that I know quite a bit about (well I am sure there are people that know way more, but we are just touching on basics here).
So Einsteins.. What do you think about USD to NOK ratio went up from 5.0 to 6.4 since July. Let's see, thats is like a 28% rise. What do you think about that?
Also let me ask you what do you think happen when a company registered on the stock exchange market run out of cash? You monotonically say over and over again bankrupcy, bankrupcy.. which is idiotic really, FC is registered on the stock exchange market. Your word should rather be Emission, Emission.. Let me hear you talk some about that if you can. One thing is for sure, AoC gamers will never feel any of this even though you guys want to paint doom for the sake of trolling. I belive AoC has a great future and I see little reason to change on that view till possibly after all launches are done and Lionsgate Conan movie is out Q2 2009.
You don't think a company can file for bankruptcy because it is listed on the stock market? Have you not been watching the US stock market at all the past two weeks?
Again, you are using financial terms, but using them totally out of context. Reminds me of that line from the Princess Bride " I don't think that word means what you think it means".
You don't think a company can file for bankruptcy because it is listed on the stock market? Have you not been watching the US stock market at all the past two weeks? Again, you are using financial terms, but using them totally out of context. Reminds me of that line from the Princess Bride " I don't think that word means what you think it means".
Dude you keep saying bankrupcy too much only, thats why I start to suspect that you don't know about Emission which is the typical way to refinance companies out of cash.
And yes I have been watching the stockmarket but with a smile, because my pennies are in the bank. Anyway, stockmarket is down doesn't mean all companies are bankrupt. Stock market is down partially becasue of bankrupcy in the bank sector, but that is something else. Anyway hope you and your stocks are fine, but gamingwise AoC is fine. I'll join in on a discussion like this again summer 2009:)
You don't think a company can file for bankruptcy because it is listed on the stock market? Have you not been watching the US stock market at all the past two weeks? Again, you are using financial terms, but using them totally out of context. Reminds me of that line from the Princess Bride " I don't think that word means what you think it means".
Dude you keep saying bankrupcy too much only, thats why I start to suspect that you don't know about Emission which is the typical way to refinance companies out of cash.
And yes I have been watching the stockmarket but with a smile, because my pennies are in the bank. Anyway, stockmarket is down doesn't mean all companies are bankrupt. Stock market is down partially becasue of bankrupcy in the bank sector, but that is something else. Anyway hope you and your stocks are fine, but gamingwise AoC is fine. I'll join in on a discussion like this again summer 2009:)
I don't know what emission means in the context you are using it (you are welcome to educate me, a google search just brings up results based on my normal understanding of emision that has nothing to do with finance) but if funcom burn through the 36mill in cash and are losing a couple of mill a month with no realistic hope of turning that around then refinancing is not a solution, that will just mean they lose more money and be back in the same situation again slightly later.
You don't think a company can file for bankruptcy because it is listed on the stock market? Have you not been watching the US stock market at all the past two weeks? Again, you are using financial terms, but using them totally out of context. Reminds me of that line from the Princess Bride " I don't think that word means what you think it means".
Dude you keep saying bankrupcy too much only, thats why I start to suspect that you don't know about Emission which is the typical way to refinance companies out of cash.
And yes I have been watching the stockmarket but with a smile, because my pennies are in the bank. Anyway, stockmarket is down doesn't mean all companies are bankrupt. Stock market is down partially becasue of bankrupcy in the bank sector, but that is something else. Anyway hope you and your stocks are fine, but gamingwise AoC is fine. I'll join in on a discussion like this again summer 2009:)
I have no clue what Emission is either. Again, I think you heard the word somewhere and are now trying to use it in a sentence... which seems to be similar to what you do with most of your financial 'words'. All I know is if there was the secret 'emission' program going on.. companies like Lehman brothers would have known enough to use it instead of filing for bankruptcy.
Have you had your car inspected recently? Maybe that is where you heard the word emission?
So here is your chance to prove us wrong. Point us to a wiki or similar device where it explains how Funcom can be saved by using emissions. Please.. plaster inn us with your knowlege LOL
You don't think a company can file for bankruptcy because it is listed on the stock market? Have you not been watching the US stock market at all the past two weeks? Again, you are using financial terms, but using them totally out of context. Reminds me of that line from the Princess Bride " I don't think that word means what you think it means".
Dude you keep saying bankrupcy too much only, thats why I start to suspect that you don't know about Emission which is the typical way to refinance companies out of cash.
And yes I have been watching the stockmarket but with a smile, because my pennies are in the bank. Anyway, stockmarket is down doesn't mean all companies are bankrupt. Stock market is down partially becasue of bankrupcy in the bank sector, but that is something else. Anyway hope you and your stocks are fine, but gamingwise AoC is fine. I'll join in on a discussion like this again summer 2009:)
I have no clue what Emission is either. Again, I think you heard the word somewhere and are now trying to use it in a sentence... which seems to be similar to what you do with most of your financial 'words'. All I know is if there was the secret 'emission' program going on.. companies like Lehman brothers would have known enough to use it instead of filing for bankruptcy.
Have you had your car inspected recently? Maybe that is where you heard the word emission?
So here is your chance to prove us wrong. Point us to a wiki or similar device where it explains how Funcom can be saved by using emissions. Please.. plaster inn us with your knowlege LOL
No it is quite simple you see. An emission on the stockexchange is when a company decide put more stocks out for sale at the market. FC already has 52 000 000 stocks out. If FC put out another 52 000 000 out on the market for lets say a conservative price of 4.00 NOK they gonna have another 20 Mill USD at their disposal. This is the way it really happens, look it up instead of dropping idiotic car emission statements around.
You don't think a company can file for bankruptcy because it is listed on the stock market? Have you not been watching the US stock market at all the past two weeks? Again, you are using financial terms, but using them totally out of context. Reminds me of that line from the Princess Bride " I don't think that word means what you think it means".
Dude you keep saying bankrupcy too much only, thats why I start to suspect that you don't know about Emission which is the typical way to refinance companies out of cash.
And yes I have been watching the stockmarket but with a smile, because my pennies are in the bank. Anyway, stockmarket is down doesn't mean all companies are bankrupt. Stock market is down partially becasue of bankrupcy in the bank sector, but that is something else. Anyway hope you and your stocks are fine, but gamingwise AoC is fine. I'll join in on a discussion like this again summer 2009:)
I have no clue what Emission is either. Again, I think you heard the word somewhere and are now trying to use it in a sentence... which seems to be similar to what you do with most of your financial 'words'. All I know is if there was the secret 'emission' program going on.. companies like Lehman brothers would have known enough to use it instead of filing for bankruptcy.
Have you had your car inspected recently? Maybe that is where you heard the word emission?
So here is your chance to prove us wrong. Point us to a wiki or similar device where it explains how Funcom can be saved by using emissions. Please.. plaster inn us with your knowlege LOL
No it is quite simple you see. An emission on the stockexchange is when a company decide put more stocks out for sale at the market. FC already has 52 000 000 stocks out. If FC put out another 52 000 000 out on the market for lets say a conservative price of 4.00 NOK they gonna have another 20 Mill USD at their disposal. This is the way it really happens, look it up instead of dropping idiotic car emission statements around.
Wouldn't doubling the number of shares availible result in a massive drop of the share price probably down to half it's current level? they wouldn't have a chance in hell of selling 52mill shares today at 4NOK, not to mention that if they need to do this because they are out of money then I as said before that means they are losing multiple millions a month and no one in their right mind would buy those shares.
Surely doing like this is to bring in funds you need to do something, or because you expect things to change shortly not to hold off bankrupsy for a few more months?
also the OP was not right, he said the only way is up and that was not and is still not the case, if it was you'd be buying shares but you arn't because you know there is massive risk involved,
edit - wouldn't you need the current stock holders to agree to this too, don't the stock holders in essence own the company?
You don't think a company can file for bankruptcy because it is listed on the stock market? Have you not been watching the US stock market at all the past two weeks? Again, you are using financial terms, but using them totally out of context. Reminds me of that line from the Princess Bride " I don't think that word means what you think it means".
Dude you keep saying bankrupcy too much only, thats why I start to suspect that you don't know about Emission which is the typical way to refinance companies out of cash.
And yes I have been watching the stockmarket but with a smile, because my pennies are in the bank. Anyway, stockmarket is down doesn't mean all companies are bankrupt. Stock market is down partially becasue of bankrupcy in the bank sector, but that is something else. Anyway hope you and your stocks are fine, but gamingwise AoC is fine. I'll join in on a discussion like this again summer 2009:)
I have no clue what Emission is either. Again, I think you heard the word somewhere and are now trying to use it in a sentence... which seems to be similar to what you do with most of your financial 'words'. All I know is if there was the secret 'emission' program going on.. companies like Lehman brothers would have known enough to use it instead of filing for bankruptcy.
Have you had your car inspected recently? Maybe that is where you heard the word emission?
So here is your chance to prove us wrong. Point us to a wiki or similar device where it explains how Funcom can be saved by using emissions. Please.. plaster inn us with your knowlege LOL
No it is quite simple you see. An emission on the stockexchange is when a company decide put more stocks out for sale at the market. FC already has 52 000 000 stocks out. If FC put out another 52 000 000 out on the market for lets say a conservative price of 4.00 NOK they gonna have another 20 Mill USD at their disposal. This is the way it really happens, look it up instead of dropping idiotic car emission statements around.
Wouldn't doubling the number of shares availible result in a massive drop of the share price probably down to half it's current level? they wouldn't have a chance in hell of selling 52mill shares today at 4NOK, not to mention that if they need to do this because they are out of money then I as said before that means they are losing multiple millions a month and no one in their right mind would buy those shares.
Surely doing like this is to bring in funds you need to do something, or because you expect things to change shortly not to hold off bankrupsy for a few more months?
also the OP was not right, he said the only way is up and that was not and is still not the case, if it was you'd be buying shares but you arn't because you know there is massive risk involved,
edit - wouldn't you need the current stock holders to agree to this too, don't the stock holders in essence own the company?
20 Mill is a new game or two AoC expansion packs in case you don't understand the amounts we are talking about. But you are right about one thing. Emission reduce stockprice. But again stockprice means little for how a company operates other than EE's wallet goes empty.
No it is quite simple you see. An emission on the stockexchange is when a company decide put more stocks out for sale at the market.
So I guess the term you are looking for is "Secondary offering"?
I am not sure about norwegian but the danish word aktieemission is just that: Secondary offering.
As for seeing FC make a large secondary offering with it's current market value... I think THAT would be a surprise and a risky bet at best.
We dont need casuals in our games!!! Errm... Well we DO need casuals to fund and populate our games - But the games should be all about "hardcore" because: We dont need casuals in our games!!! (repeat ad infinitum)
You don't think a company can file for bankruptcy because it is listed on the stock market? Have you not been watching the US stock market at all the past two weeks? Again, you are using financial terms, but using them totally out of context. Reminds me of that line from the Princess Bride " I don't think that word means what you think it means".
Dude you keep saying bankrupcy too much only, thats why I start to suspect that you don't know about Emission which is the typical way to refinance companies out of cash.
And yes I have been watching the stockmarket but with a smile, because my pennies are in the bank. Anyway, stockmarket is down doesn't mean all companies are bankrupt. Stock market is down partially becasue of bankrupcy in the bank sector, but that is something else. Anyway hope you and your stocks are fine, but gamingwise AoC is fine. I'll join in on a discussion like this again summer 2009:)
I have no clue what Emission is either. Again, I think you heard the word somewhere and are now trying to use it in a sentence... which seems to be similar to what you do with most of your financial 'words'. All I know is if there was the secret 'emission' program going on.. companies like Lehman brothers would have known enough to use it instead of filing for bankruptcy.
Have you had your car inspected recently? Maybe that is where you heard the word emission?
So here is your chance to prove us wrong. Point us to a wiki or similar device where it explains how Funcom can be saved by using emissions. Please.. plaster inn us with your knowlege LOL
No it is quite simple you see. An emission on the stockexchange is when a company decide put more stocks out for sale at the market. FC already has 52 000 000 stocks out. If FC put out another 52 000 000 out on the market for lets say a conservative price of 4.00 NOK they gonna have another 20 Mill USD at their disposal. This is the way it really happens, look it up instead of dropping idiotic car emission statements around.
Wouldn't doubling the number of shares availible result in a massive drop of the share price probably down to half it's current level? they wouldn't have a chance in hell of selling 52mill shares today at 4NOK, not to mention that if they need to do this because they are out of money then I as said before that means they are losing multiple millions a month and no one in their right mind would buy those shares.
Surely doing like this is to bring in funds you need to do something, or because you expect things to change shortly not to hold off bankrupsy for a few more months?
also the OP was not right, he said the only way is up and that was not and is still not the case, if it was you'd be buying shares but you arn't because you know there is massive risk involved,
edit - wouldn't you need the current stock holders to agree to this too, don't the stock holders in essence own the company?
20 Mill is a new game or two AoC expansion packs in case you don't understand the amounts we are talking about. But you are right about one thing. Emission reduce stockprice. But again stockprice means little for how a company operates other than EE's wallet goes empty.
as you've done in most of the thread You skipped over all of my points instead choseing to inform me how much money 20 mill is, I understand that thanks, my point is funcom could not get 20 mill from doing what you describe, if they double the ammount of shares and that ends up halving the share price then people arn't going to pay 4 nok for them are they? if the company was in the position to need to do this to prevent imminent bankrupcy then the share price wouldn't be 4 nok either.
you also skipped over the question about weather they would need the current share holders to agree to this as well as the fact that companys that do this are not ones losing multiple millions a month with no hope of turning it around, funcom might do it for instance if the secret world was ready and they had no money to release it but if they are out of money and losing it each month and there is nothing in the near future likely to change that then people wouldn't buy the newly released shares, certainly not at the price you are suggesting.
First off, can you admit you are wrong about the word 'emission'. You can go through several pages of google searches and not find any reference at all to the term as related to stocks. The phrase you are looking for is 'secondary offering'. I don't know where you came up with Emission, but it isn't related to what you are talking about (which is usually the case with the terms you use).
And wow.. if you think Funcom EVER has a chance to do a secondary offering.. you are really showing your ignorance of the stock market. When a company does a secondary offering, it is usually only for about 5% of the entire companies capitalization.. because like a previous poster pointed out.. doing a secondary offering reduces the value of the current stocks outstanding. Companies can NEVER do a secondary offering when the stock is falling.. a secondary offering only happens when the stock is near it's peak because that way current investors can 'deal' with a small drop in their stock value. It's impossible for a company to do a secondary offering as a way to avoid bankruptcy.
In fact, if you read back to my posts back in June/July along with Litigator's post.. we even said back then that the drop in the stock price does not really cause any particular hardships for Funcom (it's an indication of the failure, not a cause of it).. but we did say that one of the ways a stock drop does influence a company is that it prevents that company from doing a secondary offering and raising capital.
Funcom could never do a secondary offering because who in the heck would buy it? The stock is so low that nobody is buying it now.. and now you think people are going to pay for a stock with a diluted value?
Just please please stop posting about financial matters. Nevermind.. I guess we need you to 'plaster inn' your definition of emissions so everyone understand it.
First off, can you admit you are wrong about the word 'emission'. You can go through several pages of google searches and not find any reference at all to the term as related to stocks. The phrase you are looking for is 'secondary offering'. I don't know where you came up with Emission, but it isn't related to what you are talking about (which is usually the case with the terms you use). And wow.. if you think Funcom EVER has a chance to do a secondary offering.. you are really showing your ignorance of the stock market. When a company does a secondary offering, it is usually only for about 5% of the entire companies capitalization.. because like a previous poster pointed out.. doing a secondary offering reduces the value of the current stocks outstanding. Companies can NEVER do a secondary offering when the stock is falling.. a secondary offering only happens when the stock is near it's peak because that way current investors can 'deal' with a small drop in their stock value. It's impossible for a company to do a secondary offering as a way to avoid bankruptcy. In fact, if you read back to my posts back in June/July along with Litigator's post.. we even said back then that the drop in the stock price does not really cause any particular hardships for Funcom (it's an indication of the failure, not a cause of it).. but we did say that one of the ways a stock drop does influence a company is that it prevents that company from doing a secondary offering and raising capital. Funcom could never do a secondary offering because who in the heck would buy it? The stock is so low that nobody is buying it now.. and now you think people are going to pay for a stock with a diluted value? Just please please stop posting about financial matters. Nevermind.. I guess we need you to 'plaster inn' your definition of emissions so everyone understand it.
Dude, I did not read all your text when you actually do not know what a share emission is. When I said look it up I did not mean go to wikipedia! Look it up in a real book. Also typing "share emission" in google would give you example material on the topic. Look this is just getting to stupid, go calculate gearing, D/E, D/A... also have a look on P/S, P/E while you are at it. Once you have done that you would understand why FC went up
+34% Today!!!
To OP, you were spot on while other financial experts in this forum was not so right.
First off, can you admit you are wrong about the word 'emission'. You can go through several pages of google searches and not find any reference at all to the term as related to stocks. The phrase you are looking for is 'secondary offering'. I don't know where you came up with Emission, but it isn't related to what you are talking about (which is usually the case with the terms you use). And wow.. if you think Funcom EVER has a chance to do a secondary offering.. you are really showing your ignorance of the stock market. When a company does a secondary offering, it is usually only for about 5% of the entire companies capitalization.. because like a previous poster pointed out.. doing a secondary offering reduces the value of the current stocks outstanding. Companies can NEVER do a secondary offering when the stock is falling.. a secondary offering only happens when the stock is near it's peak because that way current investors can 'deal' with a small drop in their stock value. It's impossible for a company to do a secondary offering as a way to avoid bankruptcy. In fact, if you read back to my posts back in June/July along with Litigator's post.. we even said back then that the drop in the stock price does not really cause any particular hardships for Funcom (it's an indication of the failure, not a cause of it).. but we did say that one of the ways a stock drop does influence a company is that it prevents that company from doing a secondary offering and raising capital. Funcom could never do a secondary offering because who in the heck would buy it? The stock is so low that nobody is buying it now.. and now you think people are going to pay for a stock with a diluted value? Just please please stop posting about financial matters. Nevermind.. I guess we need you to 'plaster inn' your definition of emissions so everyone understand it.
Dude, I did not read all your text when you actually do not know what a share emission is. When I said look it up I did not mean go to wikipedia! Look it up in a real book. Also typing "share emission" in google would give you example material on the topic. Look this is just getting to stupid, go calculate gearing, D/E, D/A... also have a look on P/S, P/E while you are at it. Once you have done that you would understand why FC went up
+34% Today!!!
To OP, you were spot on while other financial experts in this forum was not so right.
I don't know why we bother discussing things with you, you continually skip over things and try to derail things. You said so many incorrect things in this thread and when challenged just ignore it and post something else. you say on the other thead you don't want people to call you a shill, you don't want people to try and discredit you, you want people to argue you fairly with logic, that would be fair enough but you make that impossible as you steadfastly refuse to argue fairly.
There has been multiple things put to you to show why funcom couldn't raise 20 mill through a new share offering, instead of answering those queries you chose to argue about it's name.
Secondly the OP is not right and neither were we wrong, neither Azrile nore myself said the stock would not rise in fact both of us said it could. The OP's comment that the only way for the stocks to go was up was wrong and is still wrong despite a very nice day for the stocks today.
It's like me saying here is a coin there is only one possible way it can land and thats heads. you say no way dude it could be heads or tails, I toss it in the air it comes down heads, there you go I say I was right the only way for the coin to land was heads. thats what you've just done, it's completly wrong, the coin could have gone either way and the same is true of the stocks. It was a very good day for the stock and congrats to anyone who made any money but it still is simply not true that the stocks can only go up from here.
First off, can you admit you are wrong about the word 'emission'. You can go through several pages of google searches and not find any reference at all to the term as related to stocks. The phrase you are looking for is 'secondary offering'. I don't know where you came up with Emission, but it isn't related to what you are talking about (which is usually the case with the terms you use). And wow.. if you think Funcom EVER has a chance to do a secondary offering.. you are really showing your ignorance of the stock market. When a company does a secondary offering, it is usually only for about 5% of the entire companies capitalization.. because like a previous poster pointed out.. doing a secondary offering reduces the value of the current stocks outstanding. Companies can NEVER do a secondary offering when the stock is falling.. a secondary offering only happens when the stock is near it's peak because that way current investors can 'deal' with a small drop in their stock value. It's impossible for a company to do a secondary offering as a way to avoid bankruptcy. In fact, if you read back to my posts back in June/July along with Litigator's post.. we even said back then that the drop in the stock price does not really cause any particular hardships for Funcom (it's an indication of the failure, not a cause of it).. but we did say that one of the ways a stock drop does influence a company is that it prevents that company from doing a secondary offering and raising capital. Funcom could never do a secondary offering because who in the heck would buy it? The stock is so low that nobody is buying it now.. and now you think people are going to pay for a stock with a diluted value? Just please please stop posting about financial matters. Nevermind.. I guess we need you to 'plaster inn' your definition of emissions so everyone understand it.
Dude, I did not read all your text when you actually do not know what a share emission is. When I said look it up I did not mean go to wikipedia! Look it up in a real book. Also typing "share emission" in google would give you example material on the topic. Look this is just getting to stupid, go calculate gearing, D/E, D/A... also have a look on P/S, P/E while you are at it. Once you have done that you would understand why FC went up
+34% Today!!!
To OP, you were spot on while other financial experts in this forum was not so right.
I don't know why we bother discussing things with you, you continually skip over things and try to derail things. You said so many incorrect things in this thread and when challenged just ignore it and post something else. you say on the other thead you don't want people to call you a shill, you don't want people to try and discredit you, you want people to argue you fairly with logic, that would be fair enough but you make that impossible as you steadfastly refuse to argue fairly.
There has been multiple things put to you to show why funcom couldn't raise 20 mill through a new share offering, instead of answering those queries you chose to argue about it's name.
Secondly the OP is not right and neither were we wrong, neither Azrile nore myself said the stock would not rise in fact both of us said it could. The OP's comment that the only way for the stocks to go was up was wrong and is still wrong despite a very nice day for the stocks today.
It's like me saying here is a coin there is only one possible way it can land and thats heads. you say no way dude it could be heads or tails, I toss it in the air it comes down heads, there you go I say I was right the only way for the coin to land was heads. thats what you've just done, it's completly wrong, the coin could have gone either way and the same is true of the stocks. It was a very good day for the stock and congrats to anyone who made any money but it still is simply not true that the stocks can only go up from here.
I see your comments and not answering on them does not mean I disagree or ignore them (so please chill down a bit). I gonna be the last person to say that refinancing and share emmison is a trivial matter. I agree to some of your points, while I at the same time think other points are very much dramatised. Emmision can be done at any point by any stockholding company whenever there is need for more cash or equity in the company. Usually will an emission be associated with a new project and/or business plan for a major project (Such a project can be anything from drilling an oilwell to make AoC into an noninstanced world). The business plan will present the risk in form of P10,P50 and P90 values and also present expected NPV. If the public think this look good, the new shares will have owners in less than a day. If not, maybe only half of the shares will be signed for.
I could have spoken more on this before if it was not for your special friend that also post his funny comments in the category of "Ohh yeahh share emision is BS because I looked it up in wikipedia and only CO2 emmision came up". I kind of felt that his comments were in more immediate need of help than yours. Anyway, I also asked some questions to you, what do you think of FC performance indicators like gearing, D/E, D/A,P/E and others... That is the real question if you want to discuss the stock itself. I think, looking at these indicators, that FC is very cheap now (which obviously other people also think considering the increase today). I am anyways not advicing anybody to purchase stocks in this market as it is just too chaotic. However, OP's question is fitting to FC situation right now, "Is the only way up now?".
One last comment that should be of interest to you. The volumes traded while the stock went down over the last months are very small, meaning mostly amateurs were selling and buying. This again means that the stocks available on the market are limited and that the moment a bigger investor start shopping, the price will get a very rapid surge. Minor positive signs might also have the same effect. FC is in a very volatile situation right now and may not only have a slow rise over time but in fact have a dramatic increase in the matter of days. That's why I don't agree with your doom profecies. It is always good to have a realistic and pessimistic backing in what you do but you can't forget that you trade risk for reward.
First off, can you admit you are wrong about the word 'emission'. You can go through several pages of google searches and not find any reference at all to the term as related to stocks. The phrase you are looking for is 'secondary offering'. I don't know where you came up with Emission, but it isn't related to what you are talking about (which is usually the case with the terms you use). And wow.. if you think Funcom EVER has a chance to do a secondary offering.. you are really showing your ignorance of the stock market. When a company does a secondary offering, it is usually only for about 5% of the entire companies capitalization.. because like a previous poster pointed out.. doing a secondary offering reduces the value of the current stocks outstanding. Companies can NEVER do a secondary offering when the stock is falling.. a secondary offering only happens when the stock is near it's peak because that way current investors can 'deal' with a small drop in their stock value. It's impossible for a company to do a secondary offering as a way to avoid bankruptcy. In fact, if you read back to my posts back in June/July along with Litigator's post.. we even said back then that the drop in the stock price does not really cause any particular hardships for Funcom (it's an indication of the failure, not a cause of it).. but we did say that one of the ways a stock drop does influence a company is that it prevents that company from doing a secondary offering and raising capital. Funcom could never do a secondary offering because who in the heck would buy it? The stock is so low that nobody is buying it now.. and now you think people are going to pay for a stock with a diluted value? Just please please stop posting about financial matters. Nevermind.. I guess we need you to 'plaster inn' your definition of emissions so everyone understand it.
Dude, I did not read all your text when you actually do not know what a share emission is. When I said look it up I did not mean go to wikipedia! Look it up in a real book. Also typing "share emission" in google would give you example material on the topic. Look this is just getting to stupid, go calculate gearing, D/E, D/A... also have a look on P/S, P/E while you are at it. Once you have done that you would understand why FC went up
+34% Today!!!
To OP, you were spot on while other financial experts in this forum was not so right.
Nice to see, I have to admit I'm not very educated with how the stock market functions.
But I do have a gut feeling, and I have been convinced all the way that Funcom is in the business for more than the revenue, that they have a passion for gaming.
I'll be the first to admit I was dissappointed when I started playing at launch. I knew there was gonna be bugs, but I felt like the zones were small, and alot of things just felt unfinished and rushed.
I got the collectors edition, and one thing I noticed, on the soundtrack cd there was no titles on the songs, just numbers. Not important to the game ofc, but an indication that they were in a hurry.
I think Godager and Funcom did 2 big mistakes:
1.- They rushed the game, perhaps because of their economy, or perhaps because they didn't wan't to launch with warhammer. They should have taken the time to polish more.
2.- They tried to rose-color things, when players were experiencing otherwise. They knew that bad press could be devastating, but didn't take into account that lack of trust is just as devastating.
Now I'm pretty confident in their intentions, so I forgave them the hype, but alot of others and haters got the feeling they couldn't trust Funcom at all, and that therefore no improvements would be done.
Wether one likes it or not, AoC has got something going, it's not just a WoW-clone or just a hype. That's why I'm still supporting it, and have been subscribing all the way from early access.
They are trying to be innovative, they tried with AO and they tried with AoC, and when people pioneer you can't expect that everyone will perform perfect, very few does. Most people make mistakes when going into something new, trying to create or master something new. But then they get better at it.
Can Funcom go bankrupt? Sure, like every other company.
But I think Funcom and AoC can ride through the storm because of their willing to be innovative, - which is after all daring in a business were success and failure is pretty close - and that they have more silent supporters than people are aware of.
So with this flaming speech I will leave you guys to your financial discussions, which is interesting to follow, so ty.
I'm sorry to say this but this game can just as easily, if not more easily, get even worse before getting better. AoC really doesn't have too bright of a future, no matter how many fixes they can make.
I reckon this would be a good time to buy some stocks, I don't really see anything that could make it plunge any lower. Except the index going down on overall, but I think AoC would be stabilized by now. My impression is that there was alot of confused people that fell into a hype, and those people would probably not have played AoC anyway if they had been a bit more determined. So I don't really feel sorry for all the haters that left, - everyone had the chance to wait for reviews and let the game "mature" before trying it. Anyway, seems like the playerbase is more "fit" to the game now, and the vision of the game and the developers.
Can't really reccomend you to buy any stocks in anything right now.
One of the big problem with AoC is that it released 6 months to early, also it is not wow with prettier graphics as many thought. I hope the number goes up but stuff like that is always hard to guess.
I don't see it drop much more players anyaways unless FC do something really stupid.
Looking on the Purchase Orders at the end of today (9000 shares for sale vs close to 100000 in demand) I know FC will have another rocket performance on the market tomorrow. Lets see at the end of the day.
I reckon this would be a good time to buy some stocks, I don't really see anything that could make it plunge any lower. Except the index going down on overall, but I think AoC would be stabilized by now. My impression is that there was alot of confused people that fell into a hype, and those people would probably not have played AoC anyway if they had been a bit more determined. So I don't really feel sorry for all the haters that left, - everyone had the chance to wait for reviews and let the game "mature" before trying it. Anyway, seems like the playerbase is more "fit" to the game now, and the vision of the game and the developers.
Can't get any lower ? lol
Funcom is bankrupt. They will have to finance short term outstanding loans for millions of dollars in the coming months. And if you havn't noticed it - we are in middle of financeal crysis.
Its over. Its only a question of time now. I think the playerbase of 10k ppl fits the game - but it doesnt fit the debts. Its that simple.
How can you know the financial state of any company? Are you the accountant of Funcom or something??
How can you know the financial state of any company? Are you the accountant of Funcom or something??
He knows Funcom is bankrupt due to the company's financial reports. They are not hard to read if you have ever invested (properly) or have a finance/accounting background.
Funcom stock has went up on incredibly low volume. When a stock is trading dead that means the only people who generally own it are founders and employees. Hence, they aren't trading it all. What other outstanding stock that is available can then fluctuate the price dramatically.
In other words, as few as 10-20 people/firms decided to pick up 10,000 shares ($10k US roughly) shares of this and that by itself increased the stock price from the mid 4's to the mid 6's.
Comments
Again.. you just don't know the basics of accounting.
Look at the second quarter numbers. There are 3 lines I want you to find
Cash at beginning of period (march 1) 52M
Cash at end of period (june 30) 36M
Change in cash and cash equivalents - -18M
You see, you keep making a basic mistake of relating that 36M to revenues or profits. That 36M has NOTHING to do with revenues or profits. That 36M is ALL ABOUT CASHFLOW.
Funcom had negative cashflow of 18M in the second quarter.. which means they spent 18M of their bank. Now at the end of this period, they only had 36M left.. and they have been spending about 6M per month more then they have been bringing in. 36 divided by 6 = 6 month of cashflow left (from June 30th). Funcom will completely spend that bank by January.
Again, Revenues and profits only indirectly relate to that 36M .. if you want to follow what is happening to that 36M, you have to look at that -18M in cashflow that Funcom had in the second quarter.
I don't think Cobra/Orion/Ilovefuncom has any connection to Funcom.
If you read Avery, GG, or EE's posts, you can see that they know what they are talking about. The numbers that GG and EE used were factual, but misleading... and they used proper english. There was a certain intelligence about their spin.
Cobra/Orion/Ilovefuncom is more like the guy who just keeps yelling louder than everyone else thinking that means 'he won'. What he actually is saying doesn't make sense or in no way shows a thought process.. he just hopes that if he yells it enough times someone will pay attention to him.
It's all good though.. Just like the 'ILOVEFUNCOM' alt disappeared as soon as the PVP patch caused no real bump in subscribers.. cobra/orion will leave soon enough, and he'll come back with a new alt that has some other big 'reason' that AOC will grow.
Ohh my god YOU just don't know what you are talking about. -5.7(or your number -7) is the only one that mean anything as long as remaining cash that was used was turned into assets for the company. 32 M is still a tremendous amount of liquidity... Dude you talk like YOU don't know what you are talking about. You need Balance Sheet, Cashflow and Profit and losses to know what's going on. P&L on Q3 told us that result for FC in that quarter (which by the way they got any sub from) was -5.7 (or your number if you like). What you post above simply mean cash was transferred from Cash to fixed assets or inventory in the balance sheet. Stop it man, you are not fooling anyone here. As fare as your numbers 52 and 36 I don't remember if they are correct but still you stetements are wrong regardless of the numbers you call.
Give the guy a break. CobraSolidus asked his colleague at Funcom, who works in accounting, and clearly misunderstood what he said.
Don't give up, Cobra. There are still plenty of suckers out there. Just keep feeding them that propaganda about how AoC has become amazing in a couple of weeks and how you had some many unfortunate technical problems with WAR. Good luck.
Oops, I did it again. Another personal attack. I really hope I don't get banned for this...
Dude, Azrile and team decided to do the accountant test on someone that is familiar with it, thats all. There is no need to back down on something that I know quite a bit about (well I am sure there are people that know way more, but we are just touching on basics here).
So Einsteins.. What do you think about USD to NOK ratio went up from 5.0 to 6.4 since July. Let's see, thats is like a 28% rise. What do you think about that?
Also let me ask you what do you think happen when a company registered on the stock exchange market run out of cash? You monotonically say over and over again bankrupcy, bankrupcy.. which is idiotic really, FC is registered on the stock exchange market. Your word should rather be Emission, Emission.. Let me hear you talk some about that if you can. One thing is for sure, AoC gamers will never feel any of this even though you guys want to paint doom for the sake of trolling. I belive AoC has a great future and I see little reason to change on that view till possibly after all launches are done and Lionsgate Conan movie is out Q2 2009.
You don't think a company can file for bankruptcy because it is listed on the stock market? Have you not been watching the US stock market at all the past two weeks?
Again, you are using financial terms, but using them totally out of context. Reminds me of that line from the Princess Bride " I don't think that word means what you think it means".
Dude you keep saying bankrupcy too much only, thats why I start to suspect that you don't know about Emission which is the typical way to refinance companies out of cash.
And yes I have been watching the stockmarket but with a smile, because my pennies are in the bank. Anyway, stockmarket is down doesn't mean all companies are bankrupt. Stock market is down partially becasue of bankrupcy in the bank sector, but that is something else. Anyway hope you and your stocks are fine, but gamingwise AoC is fine. I'll join in on a discussion like this again summer 2009:)
Dude you keep saying bankrupcy too much only, thats why I start to suspect that you don't know about Emission which is the typical way to refinance companies out of cash.
And yes I have been watching the stockmarket but with a smile, because my pennies are in the bank. Anyway, stockmarket is down doesn't mean all companies are bankrupt. Stock market is down partially becasue of bankrupcy in the bank sector, but that is something else. Anyway hope you and your stocks are fine, but gamingwise AoC is fine. I'll join in on a discussion like this again summer 2009:)
I don't know what emission means in the context you are using it (you are welcome to educate me, a google search just brings up results based on my normal understanding of emision that has nothing to do with finance) but if funcom burn through the 36mill in cash and are losing a couple of mill a month with no realistic hope of turning that around then refinancing is not a solution, that will just mean they lose more money and be back in the same situation again slightly later.
Dude you keep saying bankrupcy too much only, thats why I start to suspect that you don't know about Emission which is the typical way to refinance companies out of cash.
And yes I have been watching the stockmarket but with a smile, because my pennies are in the bank. Anyway, stockmarket is down doesn't mean all companies are bankrupt. Stock market is down partially becasue of bankrupcy in the bank sector, but that is something else. Anyway hope you and your stocks are fine, but gamingwise AoC is fine. I'll join in on a discussion like this again summer 2009:)
I have no clue what Emission is either. Again, I think you heard the word somewhere and are now trying to use it in a sentence... which seems to be similar to what you do with most of your financial 'words'. All I know is if there was the secret 'emission' program going on.. companies like Lehman brothers would have known enough to use it instead of filing for bankruptcy.
Have you had your car inspected recently? Maybe that is where you heard the word emission?
So here is your chance to prove us wrong. Point us to a wiki or similar device where it explains how Funcom can be saved by using emissions. Please.. plaster inn us with your knowlege LOL
Dude you keep saying bankrupcy too much only, thats why I start to suspect that you don't know about Emission which is the typical way to refinance companies out of cash.
And yes I have been watching the stockmarket but with a smile, because my pennies are in the bank. Anyway, stockmarket is down doesn't mean all companies are bankrupt. Stock market is down partially becasue of bankrupcy in the bank sector, but that is something else. Anyway hope you and your stocks are fine, but gamingwise AoC is fine. I'll join in on a discussion like this again summer 2009:)
I have no clue what Emission is either. Again, I think you heard the word somewhere and are now trying to use it in a sentence... which seems to be similar to what you do with most of your financial 'words'. All I know is if there was the secret 'emission' program going on.. companies like Lehman brothers would have known enough to use it instead of filing for bankruptcy.
Have you had your car inspected recently? Maybe that is where you heard the word emission?
So here is your chance to prove us wrong. Point us to a wiki or similar device where it explains how Funcom can be saved by using emissions. Please.. plaster inn us with your knowlege LOL
No it is quite simple you see. An emission on the stockexchange is when a company decide put more stocks out for sale at the market. FC already has 52 000 000 stocks out. If FC put out another 52 000 000 out on the market for lets say a conservative price of 4.00 NOK they gonna have another 20 Mill USD at their disposal. This is the way it really happens, look it up instead of dropping idiotic car emission statements around.
Finally, OP was right. FC is up 15% today.www.oslobors.no/markedsaktivitet/stockOverview
Dude you keep saying bankrupcy too much only, thats why I start to suspect that you don't know about Emission which is the typical way to refinance companies out of cash.
And yes I have been watching the stockmarket but with a smile, because my pennies are in the bank. Anyway, stockmarket is down doesn't mean all companies are bankrupt. Stock market is down partially becasue of bankrupcy in the bank sector, but that is something else. Anyway hope you and your stocks are fine, but gamingwise AoC is fine. I'll join in on a discussion like this again summer 2009:)
I have no clue what Emission is either. Again, I think you heard the word somewhere and are now trying to use it in a sentence... which seems to be similar to what you do with most of your financial 'words'. All I know is if there was the secret 'emission' program going on.. companies like Lehman brothers would have known enough to use it instead of filing for bankruptcy.
Have you had your car inspected recently? Maybe that is where you heard the word emission?
So here is your chance to prove us wrong. Point us to a wiki or similar device where it explains how Funcom can be saved by using emissions. Please.. plaster inn us with your knowlege LOL
No it is quite simple you see. An emission on the stockexchange is when a company decide put more stocks out for sale at the market. FC already has 52 000 000 stocks out. If FC put out another 52 000 000 out on the market for lets say a conservative price of 4.00 NOK they gonna have another 20 Mill USD at their disposal. This is the way it really happens, look it up instead of dropping idiotic car emission statements around.
Finally, OP was right. FC is up 15% today.www.oslobors.no/markedsaktivitet/stockOverview
Wouldn't doubling the number of shares availible result in a massive drop of the share price probably down to half it's current level? they wouldn't have a chance in hell of selling 52mill shares today at 4NOK, not to mention that if they need to do this because they are out of money then I as said before that means they are losing multiple millions a month and no one in their right mind would buy those shares.
Surely doing like this is to bring in funds you need to do something, or because you expect things to change shortly not to hold off bankrupsy for a few more months?
also the OP was not right, he said the only way is up and that was not and is still not the case, if it was you'd be buying shares but you arn't because you know there is massive risk involved,
edit - wouldn't you need the current stock holders to agree to this too, don't the stock holders in essence own the company?
Dude you keep saying bankrupcy too much only, thats why I start to suspect that you don't know about Emission which is the typical way to refinance companies out of cash.
And yes I have been watching the stockmarket but with a smile, because my pennies are in the bank. Anyway, stockmarket is down doesn't mean all companies are bankrupt. Stock market is down partially becasue of bankrupcy in the bank sector, but that is something else. Anyway hope you and your stocks are fine, but gamingwise AoC is fine. I'll join in on a discussion like this again summer 2009:)
I have no clue what Emission is either. Again, I think you heard the word somewhere and are now trying to use it in a sentence... which seems to be similar to what you do with most of your financial 'words'. All I know is if there was the secret 'emission' program going on.. companies like Lehman brothers would have known enough to use it instead of filing for bankruptcy.
Have you had your car inspected recently? Maybe that is where you heard the word emission?
So here is your chance to prove us wrong. Point us to a wiki or similar device where it explains how Funcom can be saved by using emissions. Please.. plaster inn us with your knowlege LOL
No it is quite simple you see. An emission on the stockexchange is when a company decide put more stocks out for sale at the market. FC already has 52 000 000 stocks out. If FC put out another 52 000 000 out on the market for lets say a conservative price of 4.00 NOK they gonna have another 20 Mill USD at their disposal. This is the way it really happens, look it up instead of dropping idiotic car emission statements around.
Finally, OP was right. FC is up 15% today.www.oslobors.no/markedsaktivitet/stockOverview
Wouldn't doubling the number of shares availible result in a massive drop of the share price probably down to half it's current level? they wouldn't have a chance in hell of selling 52mill shares today at 4NOK, not to mention that if they need to do this because they are out of money then I as said before that means they are losing multiple millions a month and no one in their right mind would buy those shares.
Surely doing like this is to bring in funds you need to do something, or because you expect things to change shortly not to hold off bankrupsy for a few more months?
also the OP was not right, he said the only way is up and that was not and is still not the case, if it was you'd be buying shares but you arn't because you know there is massive risk involved,
edit - wouldn't you need the current stock holders to agree to this too, don't the stock holders in essence own the company?
20 Mill is a new game or two AoC expansion packs in case you don't understand the amounts we are talking about. But you are right about one thing. Emission reduce stockprice. But again stockprice means little for how a company operates other than EE's wallet goes empty.
So I guess the term you are looking for is "Secondary offering"?
I am not sure about norwegian but the danish word aktieemission is just that: Secondary offering.
As for seeing FC make a large secondary offering with it's current market value... I think THAT would be a surprise and a risky bet at best.
We dont need casuals in our games!!! Errm... Well we DO need casuals to fund and populate our games - But the games should be all about "hardcore" because: We dont need casuals in our games!!!
(repeat ad infinitum)
Dude you keep saying bankrupcy too much only, thats why I start to suspect that you don't know about Emission which is the typical way to refinance companies out of cash.
And yes I have been watching the stockmarket but with a smile, because my pennies are in the bank. Anyway, stockmarket is down doesn't mean all companies are bankrupt. Stock market is down partially becasue of bankrupcy in the bank sector, but that is something else. Anyway hope you and your stocks are fine, but gamingwise AoC is fine. I'll join in on a discussion like this again summer 2009:)
I have no clue what Emission is either. Again, I think you heard the word somewhere and are now trying to use it in a sentence... which seems to be similar to what you do with most of your financial 'words'. All I know is if there was the secret 'emission' program going on.. companies like Lehman brothers would have known enough to use it instead of filing for bankruptcy.
Have you had your car inspected recently? Maybe that is where you heard the word emission?
So here is your chance to prove us wrong. Point us to a wiki or similar device where it explains how Funcom can be saved by using emissions. Please.. plaster inn us with your knowlege LOL
No it is quite simple you see. An emission on the stockexchange is when a company decide put more stocks out for sale at the market. FC already has 52 000 000 stocks out. If FC put out another 52 000 000 out on the market for lets say a conservative price of 4.00 NOK they gonna have another 20 Mill USD at their disposal. This is the way it really happens, look it up instead of dropping idiotic car emission statements around.
Finally, OP was right. FC is up 15% today.www.oslobors.no/markedsaktivitet/stockOverview
Wouldn't doubling the number of shares availible result in a massive drop of the share price probably down to half it's current level? they wouldn't have a chance in hell of selling 52mill shares today at 4NOK, not to mention that if they need to do this because they are out of money then I as said before that means they are losing multiple millions a month and no one in their right mind would buy those shares.
Surely doing like this is to bring in funds you need to do something, or because you expect things to change shortly not to hold off bankrupsy for a few more months?
also the OP was not right, he said the only way is up and that was not and is still not the case, if it was you'd be buying shares but you arn't because you know there is massive risk involved,
edit - wouldn't you need the current stock holders to agree to this too, don't the stock holders in essence own the company?
20 Mill is a new game or two AoC expansion packs in case you don't understand the amounts we are talking about. But you are right about one thing. Emission reduce stockprice. But again stockprice means little for how a company operates other than EE's wallet goes empty.
as you've done in most of the thread You skipped over all of my points instead choseing to inform me how much money 20 mill is, I understand that thanks, my point is funcom could not get 20 mill from doing what you describe, if they double the ammount of shares and that ends up halving the share price then people arn't going to pay 4 nok for them are they? if the company was in the position to need to do this to prevent imminent bankrupcy then the share price wouldn't be 4 nok either.
you also skipped over the question about weather they would need the current share holders to agree to this as well as the fact that companys that do this are not ones losing multiple millions a month with no hope of turning it around, funcom might do it for instance if the secret world was ready and they had no money to release it but if they are out of money and losing it each month and there is nothing in the near future likely to change that then people wouldn't buy the newly released shares, certainly not at the price you are suggesting.
First off, can you admit you are wrong about the word 'emission'. You can go through several pages of google searches and not find any reference at all to the term as related to stocks. The phrase you are looking for is 'secondary offering'. I don't know where you came up with Emission, but it isn't related to what you are talking about (which is usually the case with the terms you use).
And wow.. if you think Funcom EVER has a chance to do a secondary offering.. you are really showing your ignorance of the stock market. When a company does a secondary offering, it is usually only for about 5% of the entire companies capitalization.. because like a previous poster pointed out.. doing a secondary offering reduces the value of the current stocks outstanding. Companies can NEVER do a secondary offering when the stock is falling.. a secondary offering only happens when the stock is near it's peak because that way current investors can 'deal' with a small drop in their stock value. It's impossible for a company to do a secondary offering as a way to avoid bankruptcy.
In fact, if you read back to my posts back in June/July along with Litigator's post.. we even said back then that the drop in the stock price does not really cause any particular hardships for Funcom (it's an indication of the failure, not a cause of it).. but we did say that one of the ways a stock drop does influence a company is that it prevents that company from doing a secondary offering and raising capital.
Funcom could never do a secondary offering because who in the heck would buy it? The stock is so low that nobody is buying it now.. and now you think people are going to pay for a stock with a diluted value?
Just please please stop posting about financial matters. Nevermind.. I guess we need you to 'plaster inn' your definition of emissions so everyone understand it.
Dude, I did not read all your text when you actually do not know what a share emission is. When I said look it up I did not mean go to wikipedia! Look it up in a real book. Also typing "share emission" in google would give you example material on the topic. Look this is just getting to stupid, go calculate gearing, D/E, D/A... also have a look on P/S, P/E while you are at it. Once you have done that you would understand why FC went up
+34% Today!!!
To OP, you were spot on while other financial experts in this forum was not so right.
Dude, I did not read all your text when you actually do not know what a share emission is. When I said look it up I did not mean go to wikipedia! Look it up in a real book. Also typing "share emission" in google would give you example material on the topic. Look this is just getting to stupid, go calculate gearing, D/E, D/A... also have a look on P/S, P/E while you are at it. Once you have done that you would understand why FC went up
+34% Today!!!
To OP, you were spot on while other financial experts in this forum was not so right.
I don't know why we bother discussing things with you, you continually skip over things and try to derail things. You said so many incorrect things in this thread and when challenged just ignore it and post something else. you say on the other thead you don't want people to call you a shill, you don't want people to try and discredit you, you want people to argue you fairly with logic, that would be fair enough but you make that impossible as you steadfastly refuse to argue fairly.
There has been multiple things put to you to show why funcom couldn't raise 20 mill through a new share offering, instead of answering those queries you chose to argue about it's name.
Secondly the OP is not right and neither were we wrong, neither Azrile nore myself said the stock would not rise in fact both of us said it could. The OP's comment that the only way for the stocks to go was up was wrong and is still wrong despite a very nice day for the stocks today.
It's like me saying here is a coin there is only one possible way it can land and thats heads. you say no way dude it could be heads or tails, I toss it in the air it comes down heads, there you go I say I was right the only way for the coin to land was heads. thats what you've just done, it's completly wrong, the coin could have gone either way and the same is true of the stocks. It was a very good day for the stock and congrats to anyone who made any money but it still is simply not true that the stocks can only go up from here.
Dude, I did not read all your text when you actually do not know what a share emission is. When I said look it up I did not mean go to wikipedia! Look it up in a real book. Also typing "share emission" in google would give you example material on the topic. Look this is just getting to stupid, go calculate gearing, D/E, D/A... also have a look on P/S, P/E while you are at it. Once you have done that you would understand why FC went up
+34% Today!!!
To OP, you were spot on while other financial experts in this forum was not so right.
I don't know why we bother discussing things with you, you continually skip over things and try to derail things. You said so many incorrect things in this thread and when challenged just ignore it and post something else. you say on the other thead you don't want people to call you a shill, you don't want people to try and discredit you, you want people to argue you fairly with logic, that would be fair enough but you make that impossible as you steadfastly refuse to argue fairly.
There has been multiple things put to you to show why funcom couldn't raise 20 mill through a new share offering, instead of answering those queries you chose to argue about it's name.
Secondly the OP is not right and neither were we wrong, neither Azrile nore myself said the stock would not rise in fact both of us said it could. The OP's comment that the only way for the stocks to go was up was wrong and is still wrong despite a very nice day for the stocks today.
It's like me saying here is a coin there is only one possible way it can land and thats heads. you say no way dude it could be heads or tails, I toss it in the air it comes down heads, there you go I say I was right the only way for the coin to land was heads. thats what you've just done, it's completly wrong, the coin could have gone either way and the same is true of the stocks. It was a very good day for the stock and congrats to anyone who made any money but it still is simply not true that the stocks can only go up from here.
I see your comments and not answering on them does not mean I disagree or ignore them (so please chill down a bit). I gonna be the last person to say that refinancing and share emmison is a trivial matter. I agree to some of your points, while I at the same time think other points are very much dramatised. Emmision can be done at any point by any stockholding company whenever there is need for more cash or equity in the company. Usually will an emission be associated with a new project and/or business plan for a major project (Such a project can be anything from drilling an oilwell to make AoC into an noninstanced world). The business plan will present the risk in form of P10,P50 and P90 values and also present expected NPV. If the public think this look good, the new shares will have owners in less than a day. If not, maybe only half of the shares will be signed for.
I could have spoken more on this before if it was not for your special friend that also post his funny comments in the category of "Ohh yeahh share emision is BS because I looked it up in wikipedia and only CO2 emmision came up". I kind of felt that his comments were in more immediate need of help than yours. Anyway, I also asked some questions to you, what do you think of FC performance indicators like gearing, D/E, D/A,P/E and others... That is the real question if you want to discuss the stock itself. I think, looking at these indicators, that FC is very cheap now (which obviously other people also think considering the increase today). I am anyways not advicing anybody to purchase stocks in this market as it is just too chaotic. However, OP's question is fitting to FC situation right now, "Is the only way up now?".
One last comment that should be of interest to you. The volumes traded while the stock went down over the last months are very small, meaning mostly amateurs were selling and buying. This again means that the stocks available on the market are limited and that the moment a bigger investor start shopping, the price will get a very rapid surge. Minor positive signs might also have the same effect. FC is in a very volatile situation right now and may not only have a slow rise over time but in fact have a dramatic increase in the matter of days. That's why I don't agree with your doom profecies. It is always good to have a realistic and pessimistic backing in what you do but you can't forget that you trade risk for reward.
Dude, I did not read all your text when you actually do not know what a share emission is. When I said look it up I did not mean go to wikipedia! Look it up in a real book. Also typing "share emission" in google would give you example material on the topic. Look this is just getting to stupid, go calculate gearing, D/E, D/A... also have a look on P/S, P/E while you are at it. Once you have done that you would understand why FC went up
+34% Today!!!
To OP, you were spot on while other financial experts in this forum was not so right.
Nice to see, I have to admit I'm not very educated with how the stock market functions.
But I do have a gut feeling, and I have been convinced all the way that Funcom is in the business for more than the revenue, that they have a passion for gaming.
I'll be the first to admit I was dissappointed when I started playing at launch. I knew there was gonna be bugs, but I felt like the zones were small, and alot of things just felt unfinished and rushed.
I got the collectors edition, and one thing I noticed, on the soundtrack cd there was no titles on the songs, just numbers. Not important to the game ofc, but an indication that they were in a hurry.
I think Godager and Funcom did 2 big mistakes:
1.- They rushed the game, perhaps because of their economy, or perhaps because they didn't wan't to launch with warhammer. They should have taken the time to polish more.
2.- They tried to rose-color things, when players were experiencing otherwise. They knew that bad press could be devastating, but didn't take into account that lack of trust is just as devastating.
Now I'm pretty confident in their intentions, so I forgave them the hype, but alot of others and haters got the feeling they couldn't trust Funcom at all, and that therefore no improvements would be done.
Wether one likes it or not, AoC has got something going, it's not just a WoW-clone or just a hype. That's why I'm still supporting it, and have been subscribing all the way from early access.
They are trying to be innovative, they tried with AO and they tried with AoC, and when people pioneer you can't expect that everyone will perform perfect, very few does. Most people make mistakes when going into something new, trying to create or master something new. But then they get better at it.
Can Funcom go bankrupt? Sure, like every other company.
But I think Funcom and AoC can ride through the storm because of their willing to be innovative, - which is after all daring in a business were success and failure is pretty close - and that they have more silent supporters than people are aware of.
So with this flaming speech I will leave you guys to your financial discussions, which is interesting to follow, so ty.
I'm sorry to say this but this game can just as easily, if not more easily, get even worse before getting better. AoC really doesn't have too bright of a future, no matter how many fixes they can make.
Can't really reccomend you to buy any stocks in anything right now.
One of the big problem with AoC is that it released 6 months to early, also it is not wow with prettier graphics as many thought. I hope the number goes up but stuff like that is always hard to guess.
I don't see it drop much more players anyaways unless FC do something really stupid.
Looking on the Purchase Orders at the end of today (9000 shares for sale vs close to 100000 in demand) I know FC will have another rocket performance on the market tomorrow. Lets see at the end of the day.
Can't get any lower ? lol
Funcom is bankrupt. They will have to finance short term outstanding loans for millions of dollars in the coming months. And if you havn't noticed it - we are in middle of financeal crysis.
Its over. Its only a question of time now. I think the playerbase of 10k ppl fits the game - but it doesnt fit the debts. Its that simple.
How can you know the financial state of any company? Are you the accountant of Funcom or something??
Whatever
He knows Funcom is bankrupt due to the company's financial reports. They are not hard to read if you have ever invested (properly) or have a finance/accounting background.
Funcom stock has went up on incredibly low volume. When a stock is trading dead that means the only people who generally own it are founders and employees. Hence, they aren't trading it all. What other outstanding stock that is available can then fluctuate the price dramatically.
In other words, as few as 10-20 people/firms decided to pick up 10,000 shares ($10k US roughly) shares of this and that by itself increased the stock price from the mid 4's to the mid 6's.
These deadcat bounces don't last long.
LOL.. Well you cat just jumped
+60%
since beginning of the week. Pretty healty cat if you ask me.
Here is what the other guy was talking about:
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dead_cat_bounce
Do me a favor and read it. Oh, and lets see how healthy that cat is in a few months. Personally I think the FC-cat will look like this:
FC-cat 2009