I've been reading forums and to my surprise - many people are whining about PVP in mmorpgs. They actualy say that some games in development should not be "heavily PVP based"...they bring WOW as example Now...i even forgot that such thing as PVE servers exist Without PVP this game (or others) just do not make sense. People who want "static" content should play offline games and get a lot more graphics/quality/story etc. But my point is - i can easily see how PVE half of AOC players could get bored quickly and start whining. I played AOC for 3 months now i think. If i had only PVE part of it i'd quit in 3 days at most. "PVE only" is beyound my understanding so i won't even ask, but question is - do you think that AOC failed mostly as PVE game and first wave of unhappy players came from PVE servers? I've only seen increase in activity on my PVP server (wildsoul) during last couple of months.. Could somebody give an example of MMORPG with good PVE content so i'd have something to compare AOC with?
I think you are part of the new wave of MMORPGers, who joined the genre with WoW, maybe you are missing a bit of history of MMORPG.
Although in the pass we had some good PvP based MMO like UO and EvE, some decent ones like Shadowbane, DAOC and Lineage 2, the real core of the MMORPG market has always been PvE centered games (Everquest, EQ2, SWG, WoW, AC, FFXI, just to mention few)
PvE is not "static" as you seems to consider it, since in order to achieve things in PvE you have to group with other players, both for dungeons and raids (in some cases quests too).
You look a bit naive to think that a PvP only game can be a succesful MMORPG, same mistakes made by Funcom and Mythic.
I tell you what a only PvP MMORPG is.............it is just a glorified Multiplayer game, just bigger, but with no real world the comunity can relate to, which is what makes a MMORPG
That's where AoC and WAR got it wrong, they are more like GW except GW is free...........
A PvE MMO can survive without PvP, whilst a PvP MMO cannot survive without PvE (Fury is a brilliant example)
Even a PvP centered game needs to have a good PvE in order to keep the majority of players hooked for more than few months.
A PvE MMO can survive without PvP, whilst a PvP MMO cannot survive without PvE (Fury is a brilliant example)
Even a PvP centered game needs to have a good PvE in order to keep the majority of players hooked for more than few months.
Guild Wars did survive. And not only that it's doing really well. Sure it has pve also, but most people play pvp only. Removing pve from the game wouldn't kill GW.
I don't think the problem with Fury was "no pve" related. Fury just plain old SUCKED. Good concept but they failed to deliver. Too bad, I think I would have liked that game.
I can help you out here. I play AoC as well as I have played other PvE games, and right away I can say AoC has the best PvE content out there. I have multiple alts and really enjoy doing the Quests. AoC has it's own ability to just suck you into the plot of the game. I think it's the music, the graphics and the atmosphere that separates AoC from other games. Also, are you aware of that PvE servers in AoC has PvP. There are PvP minigames on PvE servers. I have been doing some of that too, and it's cool enough and if you do a lot of that you can get PvP gear and gain PvP levels..
I would disagree. While the music is good, the visuals are pretty dull in my opinion. More than that, however, the quests are of the same variety you'll find in any other game - perhaps even slightly less imaginitive than in some other games. Additionally, there is a lack of overall content in the game, and the endgame is seriously lacking (both in the fact that there isn't enough of it, it's simplistic, and that what there is of it is very broken/bugged right now).
I wouldn't say it has great PvE based on what it might have in the future. If FC adds a lot to it, and improves what it already has, I think it will at least be average. But not until then.
As it is now, PvE in Age of Conan is less than adequate. Hopefully, it will improve.
Are we talking about the same game? I talk about AoC, the way I just played it 30 min ago.
Yes, we're talking about the same game. PvE in Age of Conan is pretty standard fare as far as questing and zones are concerned, though it lacks content, and the endgame raids are extremely buggy/exploitable (both of which FC has acknowledged).
The little arrows that point you toward your quest objectives, where X marks the spot, makes AoC seem like "Questing for Dummies".
Are you sure you're playing AoC?
I would be interested in hearing what PVE in other MMOs you did find to be good? Specific examples please. Also, you said the graphics were dull. Again, what MMOs do you find the graphics to be good?
I could ask the same of you, since you've stated that you think that AoC has the best PvE experience in any current MMO, but I won't. It would be pointless, given the high degree of subjectivity involved in trying to answer.
Same thing with the graphics. A lot of people have awarded AoC the "Best Graphics Ever" award, and believe it's beyond dispute, based on detail, polygon count... whatever. You'll note I said visuals in my statement above, and by that I mean the art direction and style of what is being presented, more than an award for technical achievement. High detail does not always equate to good art. Of course, this is also subjective.
With either topic, with any game I could mention, you could respond with a "nuh-uh, I think X is better", which would be just as valid as my opinion (and at the same time, not invalidating mine). In effect, it's pointless.
Well, but you see by not stating what games have better "visuals" and "art direction" and have better PVE, it gives you the advantage, because you can always say "well I've seen better." If you are so confident in your opinion, surely you can give a few examples. You already know that I like PVE in AoC, now tell me what MMO has some PVE that you like, along with visuals. Then I can see where you are coming from and we can have friendly debate, or don't, I care not but I don't think it's too much to ask for some examples. It's not pointless at all, we can talk back and forth, exchange opinions, who knows you may even sway me or I you.
I agree that AOC graphics (art) style should've been darker. They try to hit both audiences with it... But looking at awful graphics of most MMORPGs out there i'd say AOC did a good job anyway
Ok, not only i must admit that PVE in AOC is good, i'd also say that PVP is becoming boring quickly. Even with all PVP experience awards. Maybe it's just me and i can't change myself since EVE was my first mmorpg, but i just getting tired quickly of trying to catch/fight people for nothing. It's not anywhere near the adrinaline rush you feel in EVE.
No loot, no real award, no death penalty..While combat system itself is good - i simply run out of motivation. I wonder if it's how it's always gonna be in most of the MMOs?
I agree that AOC graphics (art) style should've been darker. They try to hit both audiences with it... But looking at awful graphics of most MMORPGs out there i'd say AOC did a good job anyway Ok, not only i must admit that PVE in AOC is good, i'd also say that PVP is becoming boring quickly. Even with all PVP experience awards. Maybe it's just me and i can't change myself since EVE was my first mmorpg, but i just getting tired quickly of trying to catch/fight people for nothing. It's not anywhere near the adrinaline rush you feel in EVE. No loot, no real award, no death penalty..While combat system itself is good - i simply run out of motivation. I wonder if it's how it's always gonna be in most of the MMOs?
If Darkfall ever comes out, and it comes close to doing what it promises to do, you might find some of that same rush with it.
Comments
I think you are part of the new wave of MMORPGers, who joined the genre with WoW, maybe you are missing a bit of history of MMORPG.
Although in the pass we had some good PvP based MMO like UO and EvE, some decent ones like Shadowbane, DAOC and Lineage 2, the real core of the MMORPG market has always been PvE centered games (Everquest, EQ2, SWG, WoW, AC, FFXI, just to mention few)
PvE is not "static" as you seems to consider it, since in order to achieve things in PvE you have to group with other players, both for dungeons and raids (in some cases quests too).
You look a bit naive to think that a PvP only game can be a succesful MMORPG, same mistakes made by Funcom and Mythic.
I tell you what a only PvP MMORPG is.............it is just a glorified Multiplayer game, just bigger, but with no real world the comunity can relate to, which is what makes a MMORPG
That's where AoC and WAR got it wrong, they are more like GW except GW is free...........
A PvE MMO can survive without PvP, whilst a PvP MMO cannot survive without PvE (Fury is a brilliant example)
Even a PvP centered game needs to have a good PvE in order to keep the majority of players hooked for more than few months.
Guild Wars did survive. And not only that it's doing really well. Sure it has pve also, but most people play pvp only. Removing pve from the game wouldn't kill GW.
I don't think the problem with Fury was "no pve" related. Fury just plain old SUCKED. Good concept but they failed to deliver. Too bad, I think I would have liked that game.
I would disagree. While the music is good, the visuals are pretty dull in my opinion. More than that, however, the quests are of the same variety you'll find in any other game - perhaps even slightly less imaginitive than in some other games. Additionally, there is a lack of overall content in the game, and the endgame is seriously lacking (both in the fact that there isn't enough of it, it's simplistic, and that what there is of it is very broken/bugged right now).
I wouldn't say it has great PvE based on what it might have in the future. If FC adds a lot to it, and improves what it already has, I think it will at least be average. But not until then.
As it is now, PvE in Age of Conan is less than adequate. Hopefully, it will improve.
Are we talking about the same game? I talk about AoC, the way I just played it 30 min ago.
Yes, we're talking about the same game. PvE in Age of Conan is pretty standard fare as far as questing and zones are concerned, though it lacks content, and the endgame raids are extremely buggy/exploitable (both of which FC has acknowledged).
The little arrows that point you toward your quest objectives, where X marks the spot, makes AoC seem like "Questing for Dummies".
Are you sure you're playing AoC?
I would be interested in hearing what PVE in other MMOs you did find to be good? Specific examples please. Also, you said the graphics were dull. Again, what MMOs do you find the graphics to be good?
I could ask the same of you, since you've stated that you think that AoC has the best PvE experience in any current MMO, but I won't. It would be pointless, given the high degree of subjectivity involved in trying to answer.
Same thing with the graphics. A lot of people have awarded AoC the "Best Graphics Ever" award, and believe it's beyond dispute, based on detail, polygon count... whatever. You'll note I said visuals in my statement above, and by that I mean the art direction and style of what is being presented, more than an award for technical achievement. High detail does not always equate to good art. Of course, this is also subjective.
With either topic, with any game I could mention, you could respond with a "nuh-uh, I think X is better", which would be just as valid as my opinion (and at the same time, not invalidating mine). In effect, it's pointless.
Well, but you see by not stating what games have better "visuals" and "art direction" and have better PVE, it gives you the advantage, because you can always say "well I've seen better." If you are so confident in your opinion, surely you can give a few examples. You already know that I like PVE in AoC, now tell me what MMO has some PVE that you like, along with visuals. Then I can see where you are coming from and we can have friendly debate, or don't, I care not but I don't think it's too much to ask for some examples. It's not pointless at all, we can talk back and forth, exchange opinions, who knows you may even sway me or I you.
I agree that AOC graphics (art) style should've been darker. They try to hit both audiences with it... But looking at awful graphics of most MMORPGs out there i'd say AOC did a good job anyway
Ok, not only i must admit that PVE in AOC is good, i'd also say that PVP is becoming boring quickly. Even with all PVP experience awards. Maybe it's just me and i can't change myself since EVE was my first mmorpg, but i just getting tired quickly of trying to catch/fight people for nothing. It's not anywhere near the adrinaline rush you feel in EVE.
No loot, no real award, no death penalty..While combat system itself is good - i simply run out of motivation. I wonder if it's how it's always gonna be in most of the MMOs?
If Darkfall ever comes out, and it comes close to doing what it promises to do, you might find some of that same rush with it.
Hell hath no fury like an MMORPG player scorned.