I can't figure out why you have people like Recant that will make up any argument they can. I mean- what do you expect us to do?
Maybe this - "Omg Recant that argument you posted was so wonderfully crafted. I was so wrong for wanting something different and fresh! From this day forth I vow to only play WoW clones and love them to death!"
Sorry! I firmly believe there should be different games for different people. Some people want a casual MMO. Give them that. Some want a Casual sandbox MMO. Give them that. Others want MMOFPS, MMORTS, and so forth. Cool.
That's really all there is to it. I'd like to see many different types of games to play. Not just straight up WoW clones
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Now about the poll. Hmm... I dunno most of those games are so similar. Never played Vanguard retail so can't comment on that one. I think most of those games usually do one or two things right which kept my attention. Problem is after 1 or 2 themeparks it all gets kinda redundant and sameness. Really want something different. That's why I've been playing EVE Online for so long. Because it was at least totally different from the rest. No disrespect to themeparks but CCP is one of the few devs that had the balls to be creative and do something different
So a 'sandbox' game, is not really a game? When is a game, not a game? What do you think MMORPG is an acronymn for? Do you actually know what you want? Or are you just blasting games like WoW because it's the cool thing to do these days? And stop reinventing the English language to suit your arguments.
Wow Recant. First of all, don't change the subject to the English language or I will be forced to point out your gross misuse of comma rules and tense shifts. Abrahmm is completely destroying your argument and all you can do is point out his grammar mistakes? This is a discussion about the difference between a "linear" and "sandbox" MMO (even though we have completely highjacked the thread in doing so).
Point being, you clearly have no idea what defines a sandbox MMO. How can you honestly say that WoW is a sandbox game when there is clearly only one direction you can advance your character in? I think it was paulscott who asked the question, "Can you ignore combat(purely headbashing kind) and still evovle your character, and to what if any extent?" No. You cannot. So WoW is not a sandbox game.
Then you accuse sandbox games of not actually being games at all. Obviously a sandbox game is a game if multitudes of people play it and enjoy themselves doing so. Pointless argument. However, I will humor you with a proverbial saying we have about sanbox MMOs: "A linear MMO is just a game, a sandbox MMO is a world."
Your rage is misdirected, I was not pointing out his grammar mistakes at all. If you actually read the post, you would understand we were actually debating semantics - but the definition of the word 'game' doesn't change just because you put sandbox in front of it, it's merely being more specific.
As for completely destroying my arguments, not even close. You don't even know what the argument is about, so how would you know? Go troll elsewhere, or stay relevant to the discussion.
Forgive my brashness. You're correct about the English language remark so I'm sorry about that. That doesn't mean that I have no idea what the argument is about though, all I have to do is read the thread. However, your argument still holds no water.
Of course the definition of the word "game" does not change when you put sandbox in front of it, but, as you said, it becomes a more specific phrase. A sandbox game and a game are both games. Hopefully you understand that, in the English language, the meaning of a phrase is not merely a combination of the words making up that phrase. There are multitudes of expressions and implied meanings that alter the definition. For instance, a "lost cause" is not a cause that you have misplaced, nor a cause that has wandered off with no knowledge of its location.
My point is that you can't base the definition of a "sandbox game" on what the two words mean by themselves. The community has defined what a sandbox game is, and you obviously do not understand it. If you want me to I will send you a private message outlining my understanding of a sandbox game because you apparently have no idea what it is.
A sandbox game is summed up as a game that has multiable paths of progression, even the ability to forgo typical progression paths and still have fun. The quickest and dirtiest test for a sandbox game is: can you ignore combat(purely headbashing kind) and still evovle your character, and to what if any extent?
Thank you. Thats about as clear as you can put it. MMOs that we call linear or theme park don't meet that requirement...period. No matter how you want to look at it, an MMO like WoW doesn't have the content, and expecially not the features, to support alternative paths of progression.
Comments
I can't figure out why you have people like Recant that will make up any argument they can. I mean- what do you expect us to do?
Maybe this - "Omg Recant that argument you posted was so wonderfully crafted. I was so wrong for wanting something different and fresh! From this day forth I vow to only play WoW clones and love them to death!"
Sorry! I firmly believe there should be different games for different people. Some people want a casual MMO. Give them that. Some want a Casual sandbox MMO. Give them that. Others want MMOFPS, MMORTS, and so forth. Cool.
That's really all there is to it. I'd like to see many different types of games to play. Not just straight up WoW clones
----------------------
Now about the poll. Hmm... I dunno most of those games are so similar. Never played Vanguard retail so can't comment on that one. I think most of those games usually do one or two things right which kept my attention. Problem is after 1 or 2 themeparks it all gets kinda redundant and sameness. Really want something different. That's why I've been playing EVE Online for so long. Because it was at least totally different from the rest. No disrespect to themeparks but CCP is one of the few devs that had the balls to be creative and do something different
Wow Recant. First of all, don't change the subject to the English language or I will be forced to point out your gross misuse of comma rules and tense shifts. Abrahmm is completely destroying your argument and all you can do is point out his grammar mistakes? This is a discussion about the difference between a "linear" and "sandbox" MMO (even though we have completely highjacked the thread in doing so).
Point being, you clearly have no idea what defines a sandbox MMO. How can you honestly say that WoW is a sandbox game when there is clearly only one direction you can advance your character in? I think it was paulscott who asked the question, "Can you ignore combat(purely headbashing kind) and still evovle your character, and to what if any extent?" No. You cannot. So WoW is not a sandbox game.
Then you accuse sandbox games of not actually being games at all. Obviously a sandbox game is a game if multitudes of people play it and enjoy themselves doing so. Pointless argument. However, I will humor you with a proverbial saying we have about sanbox MMOs: "A linear MMO is just a game, a sandbox MMO is a world."
Your rage is misdirected, I was not pointing out his grammar mistakes at all. If you actually read the post, you would understand we were actually debating semantics - but the definition of the word 'game' doesn't change just because you put sandbox in front of it, it's merely being more specific.
As for completely destroying my arguments, not even close. You don't even know what the argument is about, so how would you know? Go troll elsewhere, or stay relevant to the discussion.
Forgive my brashness. You're correct about the English language remark so I'm sorry about that. That doesn't mean that I have no idea what the argument is about though, all I have to do is read the thread. However, your argument still holds no water.
Of course the definition of the word "game" does not change when you put sandbox in front of it, but, as you said, it becomes a more specific phrase. A sandbox game and a game are both games. Hopefully you understand that, in the English language, the meaning of a phrase is not merely a combination of the words making up that phrase. There are multitudes of expressions and implied meanings that alter the definition. For instance, a "lost cause" is not a cause that you have misplaced, nor a cause that has wandered off with no knowledge of its location.
My point is that you can't base the definition of a "sandbox game" on what the two words mean by themselves. The community has defined what a sandbox game is, and you obviously do not understand it. If you want me to I will send you a private message outlining my understanding of a sandbox game because you apparently have no idea what it is.
Bah, forum ate my post
Thank you. Thats about as clear as you can put it. MMOs that we call linear or theme park don't meet that requirement...period. No matter how you want to look at it, an MMO like WoW doesn't have the content, and expecially not the features, to support alternative paths of progression.