After about a week into it, many opted back to WoW... although Aion was great on paper, it lacked something that truly made it intriguing.
I find this hard to believe. WoW is the shallowest game in existence. I don't see how its possible for Aion to be less intriguing than WoW unless you're given max level and all your gear and a cinematic that explores all the locations for you in the first five hours.
Don't get me wrong, I'm all for Aion's success. I was a little disappointed myself when I heard from OBT players that it wasn't really addicting. Now, I'm sure Aion's endgame is great, but that's the exact same feeling I got about WAR... except I couldn't get past level 20 out of complete boredom. What WoW did right was how it captivated users to spend endless hours leveling to 60/70 and have endgame to strive for (wheather it be pvp rank, gear, raid bosses, trade skills, etc.)
Also, you have to take into account that a lot of the comments I heard were coming off WoW players, which to me is pretty important. Filtering out all the fanboys, a critical review of Aion through a WoW players perspective, the game does NOT deliver. Add to the fact that most likely, the majority of beta testers of Aion were coming off from Lineage II userbase, it comes to no surprise that the game continued strong to 250k silmutaneous connections... even if the WoW players opted out. Couple that with continuous TV advertisement bombardment (after every commercial while watching SC matches), the game in all respect, should have continuously grown throughout OBT.
Overall, to truly see Aion's potential, we'll have to see how the game actually fairs after its official launch tomorrow. However, even this is biased as the userbase (and expectations) are different from both the U.S. and Korea (WoW vs Lineage fans).
Also, did they open everything up in the open beta? Because the abyss is supposed to be a big part of this game and if it wasnt open during the OB then surely everyone would have something to look foward to.
After about a week into it, many opted back to WoW... although Aion was great on paper, it lacked something that truly made it intriguing.
I find this hard to believe. WoW is the shallowest game in existence. I don't see how its possible for Aion to be less intriguing than WoW unless you're given max level and all your gear and a cinematic that explores all the locations for you in the first five hours.
Don't get me wrong, I'm all for Aion's success. I was a little disappointed myself when I heard from OBT players that it wasn't really addicting. Now, I'm sure Aion's endgame is great, but that's the exact same feeling I got about WAR... except I couldn't get past level 20 out of complete boredom. What WoW did right was how it captivated users to spend endless hours leveling to 60/70 and have endgame to strive for (wheather it be pvp rank, gear, raid bosses, trade skills, etc.)
Also, you have to take into account that a lot of the comments I heard were coming off WoW players, which to me is pretty important. Filtering out all the fanboys, a critical review of Aion through a WoW players perspective, the game does NOT deliver. Add to the fact that most likely, the majority of beta testers of Aion were coming off from Lineage II userbase, it comes to no surprise that the game continued strong to 250k silmutaneous connections... even if the WoW players opted out. Couple that with continuous TV advertisement bombardment (after every commercial while watching SC matches), the game in all respect, should have continuously grown throughout OBT.
Overall, to truly see Aion's potential, we'll have to see how the game actually fairs after its official launch tomorrow. However, even this is biased as the userbase (and expectations) are different from both the U.S. and Korea (WoW vs Lineage fans).
Also, did they open everything up in the open beta? Because the abyss is supposed to be a big part of this game and if it wasnt open during the OB then surely everyone would have something to look foward to.
Im looking forward to the Abyss as well! However, I sure hope there's much more end-game content in store for us... I mean, think about doing AV's all day... or scenario's and RvR in WAR. IMO a great mmo should have a great PvE follow up.
What worries me is if I'll last until I see endgame content. With a weak quest/storyline, I find it hard to level without drugging myself with painkillers and aspirin first. I'm in a situation now where I'm debating if I should buy the WotLK expac ($20 + $15 1 month) or try out Aion ($20 for 1 month).
I found myself doing a simple quest, minding my own busness when all of a sudden a group of 6 elyos pop through a rift near me. Complete madness commenced because there was nothing but soloers in the area, We got are asses kicked until we where able to get a group made to take them on. I would say 20 soloers died in that incounter (I died twice) before we could crush them. So much for questing for that day Things like this has happen to me in OBT alot, either 1v1 or getting smoked by a well excuted group. There is so much more to offer because i don't know korean and i'm missing tons of info.
I have never had so much fun in an mmo as this game, but this is just me and it might not be your type of game. If its not I hope you find what your looking for.....because its all about finding a game that is fun to play for you.
My chanter:
Velika: City of Wheels: Among the mortal races, the humans were the only one that never built cities or great empires; a curse laid upon them by their creator, Gidd, forced them to wander as nomads for twenty centuries...
WoW you have to have a cell phone and text messaging to be able to play the game? That sucks IMO Yes i'm a dinosaur i know. I don't have a cell phone and have desire to run out and buy one just to be able to play the game.
NO
Velika: City of Wheels: Among the mortal races, the humans were the only one that never built cities or great empires; a curse laid upon them by their creator, Gidd, forced them to wander as nomads for twenty centuries...
I would have to agree with you Stay... I had loads of fun in KOBT. My overall expectations were far exceeded. Which is saying a lot due to everything being in Korean. Although the english patch did help a bit... well.. made it more tolerable anyway.
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WoW you have to have a cell phone and text messaging to be able to play the game? That sucks IMO Yes i'm a dinosaur i know. I don't have a cell phone and have desire to run out and buy one just to be able to play the game.
NO
Winter: You have to understand that there's a big cultural difference... in terms of telecommunications, 7 year old elementary kids, 80 year old grandparents, and sure as hell gamers in their teens~30s age group all have cell phones. Plus, text messaging here is about 20 won or about ~2 cents per txt sent (receiving is free btw).
With that said, you won't have to worry once the game arrives in U.S. shores as I'm pretty sure NC won't require its subscribers to have a cell phone, or txt messaging service for the matter.
WoW you have to have a cell phone and text messaging to be able to play the game? That sucks IMO Yes i'm a dinosaur i know. I don't have a cell phone and have desire to run out and buy one just to be able to play the game.
I had a cell phone for about a year but got rid of it....people think it makes their lives more convenient but in reality many become a slave to it..... I havent missed it one iota......I am one of the rare people that actually likes to get away from the phone when I leave the house........I have friends that pay 2-3 hundred dollars a month for their plans and often go over their minutes even with that ....... If a game requires its users to have cell phones to play they will actually lose some customers believe it or not.......
WoW you have to have a cell phone and text messaging to be able to play the game? That sucks IMO Yes i'm a dinosaur i know. I don't have a cell phone and have desire to run out and buy one just to be able to play the game.
I had a cell phone for about a year but got rid of it....people think it makes their lives more convenient but in reality many become a slave to it..... I havent missed it one iota......I am one of the rare people that actually likes to get away from the phone when I leave the house........I have friends that pay 2-3 hundred dollars a month for their plans and often go over their minutes even with that ....... If a game requires its users to have cell phones to play they will actually lose some customers believe it or not.......
Heh, I had a cell phone. I was determined that noone would have the number who I didn't want to talk to at any given moment of the day. After 2 months, the only people who had my cell phone number were my daughter and the cell provider. So I got rid of it.
I guess i'm gonna have to make it a little more clear. No you will not need a cell phone or text msg inorder to play this game.
You only needed a cell phone and or a bank account info inorder to play in the KOREAN OBT (KOBT is over so its a mute point now), This does not have any effect on players in NA, EU, CN, or any other country outside korea.
Velika: City of Wheels: Among the mortal races, the humans were the only one that never built cities or great empires; a curse laid upon them by their creator, Gidd, forced them to wander as nomads for twenty centuries...
I guess i'm gonna have to make it a little more clear. No you will not need a cell phone or text msg inorder to play this game. You only needed a cell phone and or a bank account info inorder to play in the KOREAN OBT (KOBT is over so its a mute point now), This does not have any effect on players in NA, EU, CN, or any other country outside korea.
Thanks for clearing that up. A bit late here (well actually early) so i don't claim to be 100% here.
To the person comparing WoW endgame to Aion.... You can't actually say anything tangible until the Korean release. The max level for OBT was 30.
And most mmos are more 'magical' or imaginative then WoW. Blizzard is only good at one thing: make things work smoothly. They have no concept of what an original idea is.
To the person comparing WoW endgame to Aion.... You can't actually say anything tangible until the Korean release. The max level for OBT was 30. And most mmos are more 'magical' or imaginative then WoW. Blizzard is only good at one thing: make things work smoothly. They have no concept of what an original idea is.
Was this directed towards me? I never compared Aion's endgame to WoW's, moreless anything remotely close to criticizing it. It's a given that endgame wasn't accessible during OBT... you make it sound as if I thought otherwise. What I did say was I'm concerned about Aion's leveling up process and HOPE the Abyss turns out to be a fantastic finish line through the grueling ordeal.
And by all means, if making things 'work smoothly' generates 11 million subscribers and crowns itself as the king of p2p MMO, I sure hope Aion follows Blizzard's approach. Who needs creativity? amirite??!? (sarcasm)
The whole thing about originality and whatnot is getting old! It's like with Apple and their immensely popular keyboard design on their macbooks. Innovative? Not really, the design was actually first introduced by Sony's x505 notebooks in 2004, but the dumazzez didn't see the potential and scrapped the design. Can't relate? Think Blizzard = Apple. Just like how Apple had the vision to see greatness in the design (and thus applying it to their macbooks), so did Blizzard in copying the things that worked in other MMOs while dropping/tweaking the things that didn't. Result? WoW is now a benchmark for many emerging titles and it actually became the standard.
So what does this all translate to? I want Aion to be successful as much as anyone else here... but in order for it to be successful, I'm also hoping NC did something to emulate WoW. I mean really, unless you're a total fanboy, you can't deny that WoW pulled off SOMETHING good to become what it is today. There's a lesson to be had for other MMOs, and so far, WAR and AoC miserably failed. I just wish NC did learn a thing or two from Blizz's success and applied it to Aion.
To the person comparing WoW endgame to Aion.... You can't actually say anything tangible until the Korean release. The max level for OBT was 30. And most mmos are more 'magical' or imaginative then WoW. Blizzard is only good at one thing: make things work smoothly. They have no concept of what an original idea is.
Was this directed towards me? I never compared Aion's endgame to WoW's, moreless anything remotely close to criticizing it. It's a given that endgame wasn't accessible during OBT... you make it sound as if I thought otherwise. What I did say was I'm concerned about Aion's leveling up process and HOPE the Abyss turns out to be a fantastic finish line through the grueling ordeal.
And by all means, if making things 'work smoothly' generates 11 million subscribers and crowns itself as the king of p2p MMO, I sure hope Aion follows Blizzard's approach. Who needs creativity? amirite??!? (sarcasm)
The whole thing about originality and whatnot is getting old! It's like with Apple and their immensely popular keyboard design on their macbooks. Innovative? Not really, the design was actually first introduced by Sony's x505 notebooks in 2004, but the dumazzez didn't see the potential and scrapped the design. Can't relate? Think Blizzard = Apple. Just like how Apple had the vision to see greatness in the design (and thus applying it to their macbooks), so did Blizzard in copying the things that worked in other MMOs while dropping/tweaking the things that didn't. Result? WoW is now a benchmark for many emerging titles and it actually became the standard.
So what does this all translate to? I want Aion to be successful as much as anyone else here... but in order for it to be successful, I'm also hoping NC did something to emulate WoW. I mean really, unless you're a total fanboy, you can't deny that WoW pulled off SOMETHING good to become what it is today. There's a lesson to be had for other MMOs, and so far, WAR and AoC miserably failed. I just wish NC did learn a thing or two from Blizz's success and applied it to Aion.
I would compare WoW to Microsoft than to mac.
WoW didnt take the best things from MMOGS; sorry they just to took the easyiest and blandest features that most mmogs had and ran with it.
Marketing is the reason for WoWs sucess. Blizzard had a big following before WoW and there games always sold big. When WoW was announced everyone knew it was going to hit big. Its what blizzard games do.
If WoW was made by a different company with a different IP but exactly the same it would have the same subs as most mmorpgs out.
To me blizzard has always retarded any genre they touch.
Diablo ( loved the 1st one hated the rest) gave birth to the hack/slash era. I remeber one rpg that was in developemnt that was copying Fallout, but it went under as diablo clones flooded the market. In the past years companys have finaly started to focus on the RP part of that genre. But with Diablo 3 im sure that will all go down hill
Warcraft/starcraft (loved warcraft 1and 2 couldnt stand starcraft) Quick and easy fun but nothing compared to the more complex RTSs out. Warcraft 3 was even more dumb downed.
Blizard always attracts the masses only because they dumb everything down for the masses.
Anyway back on subject how was the world? Was it big and spaced out or was it cramped and themeparkish.
Anyway back on subject how was the world? Was it big and spaced out or was it cramped and themeparkish.
The begining maps are kinda cramped, But when you get to around lvl20 or so it really starts to open up. Going from one large map to another island or land mass via the teleporter you can see the areas are quite large, and you can still see monsters that are the same lvl as in the other map. So you don't have to wait until your a certin lvl in order to explore other areas.
Here are two maps: Map detail and info gets filled in as you explore the area's
Velika: City of Wheels: Among the mortal races, the humans were the only one that never built cities or great empires; a curse laid upon them by their creator, Gidd, forced them to wander as nomads for twenty centuries...
Velika: City of Wheels: Among the mortal races, the humans were the only one that never built cities or great empires; a curse laid upon them by their creator, Gidd, forced them to wander as nomads for twenty centuries...
this video is just amazing,,makes me wanna play even more...details,vast world,its just unbelievable... excuse my enthusiasm but i got used to wow graphics so this is quite shock for me
To the person comparing WoW endgame to Aion.... You can't actually say anything tangible until the Korean release. The max level for OBT was 30. And most mmos are more 'magical' or imaginative then WoW. Blizzard is only good at one thing: make things work smoothly. They have no concept of what an original idea is.
Was this directed towards me? I never compared Aion's endgame to WoW's, moreless anything remotely close to criticizing it. It's a given that endgame wasn't accessible during OBT... you make it sound as if I thought otherwise. What I did say was I'm concerned about Aion's leveling up process and HOPE the Abyss turns out to be a fantastic finish line through the grueling ordeal.
And by all means, if making things 'work smoothly' generates 11 million subscribers and crowns itself as the king of p2p MMO, I sure hope Aion follows Blizzard's approach. Who needs creativity? amirite??!? (sarcasm)
The whole thing about originality and whatnot is getting old! It's like with Apple and their immensely popular keyboard design on their macbooks. Innovative? Not really, the design was actually first introduced by Sony's x505 notebooks in 2004, but the dumazzez didn't see the potential and scrapped the design. Can't relate? Think Blizzard = Apple. Just like how Apple had the vision to see greatness in the design (and thus applying it to their macbooks), so did Blizzard in copying the things that worked in other MMOs while dropping/tweaking the things that didn't. Result? WoW is now a benchmark for many emerging titles and it actually became the standard.
So what does this all translate to? I want Aion to be successful as much as anyone else here... but in order for it to be successful, I'm also hoping NC did something to emulate WoW. I mean really, unless you're a total fanboy, you can't deny that WoW pulled off SOMETHING good to become what it is today. There's a lesson to be had for other MMOs, and so far, WAR and AoC miserably failed. I just wish NC did learn a thing or two from Blizz's success and applied it to Aion.
I would compare WoW to Microsoft than to mac.
WoW didnt take the best things from MMOGS; sorry they just to took the easyiest and blandest features that most mmogs had and ran with it.
Marketing is the reason for WoWs sucess. Blizzard had a big following before WoW and there games always sold big. When WoW was announced everyone knew it was going to hit big. Its what blizzard games do.
If WoW was made by a different company with a different IP but exactly the same it would have the same subs as most mmorpgs out.
To me blizzard has always retarded any genre they touch.
Diablo ( loved the 1st one hated the rest) gave birth to the hack/slash era. I remeber one rpg that was in developemnt that was copying Fallout, but it went under as diablo clones flooded the market. In the past years companys have finaly started to focus on the RP part of that genre. But with Diablo 3 im sure that will all go down hill
Warcraft/starcraft (loved warcraft 1and 2 couldnt stand starcraft) Quick and easy fun but nothing compared to the more complex RTSs out. Warcraft 3 was even more dumb downed.
Blizard always attracts the masses only because they dumb everything down for the masses.
Anyway back on subject how was the world? Was it big and spaced out or was it cramped and themeparkish.
Sorry to break it to you but none of Blizzard's pre-WoW games even came close to the record numbers it has reached today. I admit though, Blizzard did have a big following when the game was first launched, however, that alone does not explain the exponential growth it has gained among new audiences to the genre. Hell, I log on and see school teachers, police officers, and even parents immersed in the game with no prior gaming background.
To say that following and marketing is the only factor that produces a successful title is an understatement. Take WAR for example... it's following was incredible and it was the best selling game of 2008 prior to WotLK xpac. Not to mention Mythic had successful titles in the past as well(DAoC anyone?). What the hell happened? WAR turned out to be completely unpolished, boring, and felt like a pvp grind... I never really felt immersed in WAR's lore or gameplay. Games must have quality for it to succeed, and yes, it does depend on a variety of factors (including marketing).
I would also like to briefly argue your point about the game being 'dumbed' down. What Blizzard ultimately succeeded in was to be able to gather hardcore and casual gamers alike. You can't be casual and achieve 2200 arena rating, raid Black Temple, or gather those precious materials to forge Stormherald... likewise, the game was also able to accomodate casual players that logged on to do Kara, a couple BGs, or even arenas (albeit their ratings would be sub-1200s.) All in all, Blizz did a fantastic job crossing over a wide spectrum of players. If any game forced me to dedicate 10 hrs a day just to stay competitive, you can count me out.
There are obviously people that dislike Blizzard and find every way to bash their games... but plz don't go into denial. Give out proper respects when it's warranted.
No one's denying's WoW's success or that they did a lot to make MMOs more accessible, for every one not just experienced gamers. However I find none of their ideas to be worth my time. And that's my personal choice. I almost choked when they announced the Wrath of the Witch King, I mean Lich King.
Also Blizzard does a fantastic job of ignoring the role players. One of the major reasons I can't get into it. Also popular doesn't equate substance, take Britney Spears, Paris Hilton. I'm just saying. Yes they are accessible and pretty to look at and not too hard to understand and many would like to be beside them.. But not everyone.
That may seem like a bash, but it is my honest view of WoW, it's fun, it caters to a certain demographic and it's great for first time MMOers, but to some people it leaves a lot to be desired. And that's why I'm here and not on the W forums. Also there's a large difference between taking the basic ideas of a fantasy setting and ripping off everyone around you. :S
Aion does take a few nods from that game while retaining some from L2. No it's not WoW with wings...
To the person comparing WoW endgame to Aion.... You can't actually say anything tangible until the Korean release. The max level for OBT was 30. And most mmos are more 'magical' or imaginative then WoW. Blizzard is only good at one thing: make things work smoothly. They have no concept of what an original idea is.
Was this directed towards me? I never compared Aion's endgame to WoW's, moreless anything remotely close to criticizing it. It's a given that endgame wasn't accessible during OBT... you make it sound as if I thought otherwise. What I did say was I'm concerned about Aion's leveling up process and HOPE the Abyss turns out to be a fantastic finish line through the grueling ordeal.
And by all means, if making things 'work smoothly' generates 11 million subscribers and crowns itself as the king of p2p MMO, I sure hope Aion follows Blizzard's approach. Who needs creativity? amirite??!? (sarcasm)
The whole thing about originality and whatnot is getting old! It's like with Apple and their immensely popular keyboard design on their macbooks. Innovative? Not really, the design was actually first introduced by Sony's x505 notebooks in 2004, but the dumazzez didn't see the potential and scrapped the design. Can't relate? Think Blizzard = Apple. Just like how Apple had the vision to see greatness in the design (and thus applying it to their macbooks), so did Blizzard in copying the things that worked in other MMOs while dropping/tweaking the things that didn't. Result? WoW is now a benchmark for many emerging titles and it actually became the standard.
So what does this all translate to? I want Aion to be successful as much as anyone else here... but in order for it to be successful, I'm also hoping NC did something to emulate WoW. I mean really, unless you're a total fanboy, you can't deny that WoW pulled off SOMETHING good to become what it is today. There's a lesson to be had for other MMOs, and so far, WAR and AoC miserably failed. I just wish NC did learn a thing or two from Blizz's success and applied it to Aion.
I would compare WoW to Microsoft than to mac.
WoW didnt take the best things from MMOGS; sorry they just to took the easyiest and blandest features that most mmogs had and ran with it.
Marketing is the reason for WoWs sucess. Blizzard had a big following before WoW and there games always sold big. When WoW was announced everyone knew it was going to hit big. Its what blizzard games do.
If WoW was made by a different company with a different IP but exactly the same it would have the same subs as most mmorpgs out.
To me blizzard has always retarded any genre they touch.
Diablo ( loved the 1st one hated the rest) gave birth to the hack/slash era. I remeber one rpg that was in developemnt that was copying Fallout, but it went under as diablo clones flooded the market. In the past years companys have finaly started to focus on the RP part of that genre. But with Diablo 3 im sure that will all go down hill
Warcraft/starcraft (loved warcraft 1and 2 couldnt stand starcraft) Quick and easy fun but nothing compared to the more complex RTSs out. Warcraft 3 was even more dumb downed.
Blizard always attracts the masses only because they dumb everything down for the masses.
Anyway back on subject how was the world? Was it big and spaced out or was it cramped and themeparkish.
Sorry to break it to you but none of Blizzard's pre-WoW games even came close to the record numbers it has reached today. I admit though, Blizzard did have a big following when the game was first launched, however, that alone does not explain the exponential growth it has gained among new audiences to the genre. Hell, I log on and see school teachers, police officers, and even parents immersed in the game with no prior gaming background.
To say that following and marketing is the only factor that produces a successful title is an understatement. Take WAR for example... it's following was incredible and it was the best selling game of 2008 prior to WotLK xpac. Not to mention Mythic had successful titles in the past as well(DAoC anyone?). What the hell happened? WAR turned out to be completely unpolished, boring, and felt like a pvp grind... I never really felt immersed in WAR's lore or gameplay. Games must have quality for it to succeed, and yes, it does depend on a variety of factors (including marketing).
I would also like to briefly argue your point about the game being 'dumbed' down. What Blizzard ultimately succeeded in was to be able to gather hardcore and casual gamers alike. You can't be casual and achieve 2200 arena rating, raid Black Temple, or gather those precious materials to forge Stormherald... likewise, the game was also able to accomodate casual players that logged on to do Kara, a couple BGs, or even arenas (albeit their ratings would be sub-1200s.) All in all, Blizz did a fantastic job crossing over a wide spectrum of players. If any game forced me to dedicate 10 hrs a day just to stay competitive, you can count me out.
There are obviously people that dislike Blizzard and find every way to bash their games... but plz don't go into denial. Give out proper respects when it's warranted.
Starcraft sold alot of boxes so did WC3 and diablos. All of em hit big in there genre.
WAR never hit that big on the hype meter. And DAoC wasnt the big hit of its day. Plus Mythic didnt start WAR they picked it up as the last company left it. Only fanbois thought it would get a huge following.
WoW isnt hardcore. The early days of EQ had hardcore pve, Nothing in WoW is hard.
WoW = Disney land
While yes Disney land might have brought some adults and children together. I still wouldnt call it great entertainment.
I dont owe WoW anything It didnt help me or the genre. Didnt bring anything new, and dumb down whatever they could steal from everyone else. All they did was bring more money to the market. Which as you can tell didnt help devs with there creativity. Just made them more greedy.
To the person comparing WoW endgame to Aion.... You can't actually say anything tangible until the Korean release. The max level for OBT was 30. And most mmos are more 'magical' or imaginative then WoW. Blizzard is only good at one thing: make things work smoothly. They have no concept of what an original idea is.
Was this directed towards me? I never compared Aion's endgame to WoW's, moreless anything remotely close to criticizing it. It's a given that endgame wasn't accessible during OBT... you make it sound as if I thought otherwise. What I did say was I'm concerned about Aion's leveling up process and HOPE the Abyss turns out to be a fantastic finish line through the grueling ordeal.
And by all means, if making things 'work smoothly' generates 11 million subscribers and crowns itself as the king of p2p MMO, I sure hope Aion follows Blizzard's approach. Who needs creativity? amirite??!? (sarcasm)
The whole thing about originality and whatnot is getting old! It's like with Apple and their immensely popular keyboard design on their macbooks. Innovative? Not really, the design was actually first introduced by Sony's x505 notebooks in 2004, but the dumazzez didn't see the potential and scrapped the design. Can't relate? Think Blizzard = Apple. Just like how Apple had the vision to see greatness in the design (and thus applying it to their macbooks), so did Blizzard in copying the things that worked in other MMOs while dropping/tweaking the things that didn't. Result? WoW is now a benchmark for many emerging titles and it actually became the standard.
So what does this all translate to? I want Aion to be successful as much as anyone else here... but in order for it to be successful, I'm also hoping NC did something to emulate WoW. I mean really, unless you're a total fanboy, you can't deny that WoW pulled off SOMETHING good to become what it is today. There's a lesson to be had for other MMOs, and so far, WAR and AoC miserably failed. I just wish NC did learn a thing or two from Blizz's success and applied it to Aion.
I would compare WoW to Microsoft than to mac.
WoW didnt take the best things from MMOGS; sorry they just to took the easyiest and blandest features that most mmogs had and ran with it.
Marketing is the reason for WoWs sucess. Blizzard had a big following before WoW and there games always sold big. When WoW was announced everyone knew it was going to hit big. Its what blizzard games do.
If WoW was made by a different company with a different IP but exactly the same it would have the same subs as most mmorpgs out.
To me blizzard has always retarded any genre they touch.
Diablo ( loved the 1st one hated the rest) gave birth to the hack/slash era. I remeber one rpg that was in developemnt that was copying Fallout, but it went under as diablo clones flooded the market. In the past years companys have finaly started to focus on the RP part of that genre. But with Diablo 3 im sure that will all go down hill
Warcraft/starcraft (loved warcraft 1and 2 couldnt stand starcraft) Quick and easy fun but nothing compared to the more complex RTSs out. Warcraft 3 was even more dumb downed.
Blizard always attracts the masses only because they dumb everything down for the masses.
Anyway back on subject how was the world? Was it big and spaced out or was it cramped and themeparkish.
Okay, so marketing is all you need to make a smash hit MMO. Age of Conan followed that formula, and their ever-increasing subscriber base and soaring stock prices attest to the success that can be garnered by marketing and more marketing.
What about Mythic? Marketing blitz. Their 8 million subscribers have resulted in them becoming the second most popular MMO, drawing nearly 20% of WoW's subscriber base away. It's pretty evident they'll become the dominant MMO on the market.
Yes, I see your point. Marketing is all you need, Diablo and Starcraft were simplistic terrible games that were just well hyped.
(This guy HAS to work for Funcom, right?)
In every country and in every age, the priest has been hostile to liberty. He is always in alliance with the despot, abetting his abuses in return for protection to his own.
In defense of starcraft, when it was released, it was pretty revolutionary-at least as far as mainstream RTS went-and i've played a LOT of RTS(look at profile-couldnt fit it all in either due to 1000 char limit) Three races all of which could be played skillfully and were fairly balanced(yes balanced) but so unique that each race shares maybe one or 2 strategies in common. Not only that, it was easy to pick up and play and it is a VERy low requirement game meaning anyone with a fifteen year old computer can run it.
Now as far as WoW being based completely off of fanbase and marketing, you'd be surprised by the number of players in WC3 and Diablo 2 who can't stand WoW, I'd say that the majority of D2 players and half or more WC3 players never made the jump-and don't want to, and i've been active on Bnet for many years(despite keeping active on the two dozen other games i currently play)
WoW did EXACTLY what starcraft did, it took basic elements of existing MMOs, simplified them, made other parts easier, then added the Warcraft "Lore" and released it all bundled up. What does that mean? it means that anyone can play it, "hardcore" players, casual gamers, Rpers, any age, any gender. Not only that, but it's accessable by most computers these days-so you've got an 8 year old computer? NO PROB! Play WoW. You've got a mac? NO PROB! Play WoW.
So, WoW isn't a HORRIBLE game, and i've played some bad games. However, it's not all that special either. Back to the RTS genre, Starcraft had many revolutionary features, but there are several other RTS games which you might take note of.
HOMEWORLD- The first RTS with a PURELY 3D game engine, released a mere year and a half after starcraft.
Dawn of War/Company of Heroes- Both made by relic, great graphics and an interesting resource system coupled with tactics and realistic damage systems.
Shogun/Medievel/Rome/Medieval2 Total War- Man, i could go on about these for days, but suffice to say they have the most realistic massive scale battles in any game ever created. The graphics are great, and the single player is by far from weak, only problem is finding a computer good enough to handle the more recent ones.
Total War, Company of Heroes, Homeworld. All great games/series, all with revolutionary concepts, and yet, Starcraft remains the most popular RTS game in the world. Why? because it is player friendly. It suits hardcore and casual players alike and anyone can play it.
This is no different than WoW-or Halo(1) for that matter.
It's almost 2010, and I am just not wiling to tolerate clunky graphics while being told that "gameplay is more important than graphics". That excuse won't wash with me any more. I expect my games to have both good graphics and good gameplay. -Quote Isoke(VN boards)
Comments
I find this hard to believe. WoW is the shallowest game in existence. I don't see how its possible for Aion to be less intriguing than WoW unless you're given max level and all your gear and a cinematic that explores all the locations for you in the first five hours.
Don't get me wrong, I'm all for Aion's success. I was a little disappointed myself when I heard from OBT players that it wasn't really addicting. Now, I'm sure Aion's endgame is great, but that's the exact same feeling I got about WAR... except I couldn't get past level 20 out of complete boredom. What WoW did right was how it captivated users to spend endless hours leveling to 60/70 and have endgame to strive for (wheather it be pvp rank, gear, raid bosses, trade skills, etc.)
Also, you have to take into account that a lot of the comments I heard were coming off WoW players, which to me is pretty important. Filtering out all the fanboys, a critical review of Aion through a WoW players perspective, the game does NOT deliver. Add to the fact that most likely, the majority of beta testers of Aion were coming off from Lineage II userbase, it comes to no surprise that the game continued strong to 250k silmutaneous connections... even if the WoW players opted out. Couple that with continuous TV advertisement bombardment (after every commercial while watching SC matches), the game in all respect, should have continuously grown throughout OBT.
Overall, to truly see Aion's potential, we'll have to see how the game actually fairs after its official launch tomorrow. However, even this is biased as the userbase (and expectations) are different from both the U.S. and Korea (WoW vs Lineage fans).
Also, did they open everything up in the open beta? Because the abyss is supposed to be a big part of this game and if it wasnt open during the OB then surely everyone would have something to look foward to.
Deimos
I find this hard to believe. WoW is the shallowest game in existence. I don't see how its possible for Aion to be less intriguing than WoW unless you're given max level and all your gear and a cinematic that explores all the locations for you in the first five hours.
Don't get me wrong, I'm all for Aion's success. I was a little disappointed myself when I heard from OBT players that it wasn't really addicting. Now, I'm sure Aion's endgame is great, but that's the exact same feeling I got about WAR... except I couldn't get past level 20 out of complete boredom. What WoW did right was how it captivated users to spend endless hours leveling to 60/70 and have endgame to strive for (wheather it be pvp rank, gear, raid bosses, trade skills, etc.)
Also, you have to take into account that a lot of the comments I heard were coming off WoW players, which to me is pretty important. Filtering out all the fanboys, a critical review of Aion through a WoW players perspective, the game does NOT deliver. Add to the fact that most likely, the majority of beta testers of Aion were coming off from Lineage II userbase, it comes to no surprise that the game continued strong to 250k silmutaneous connections... even if the WoW players opted out. Couple that with continuous TV advertisement bombardment (after every commercial while watching SC matches), the game in all respect, should have continuously grown throughout OBT.
Overall, to truly see Aion's potential, we'll have to see how the game actually fairs after its official launch tomorrow. However, even this is biased as the userbase (and expectations) are different from both the U.S. and Korea (WoW vs Lineage fans).
Also, did they open everything up in the open beta? Because the abyss is supposed to be a big part of this game and if it wasnt open during the OB then surely everyone would have something to look foward to.
Im looking forward to the Abyss as well! However, I sure hope there's much more end-game content in store for us... I mean, think about doing AV's all day... or scenario's and RvR in WAR. IMO a great mmo should have a great PvE follow up.
What worries me is if I'll last until I see endgame content. With a weak quest/storyline, I find it hard to level without drugging myself with painkillers and aspirin first. I'm in a situation now where I'm debating if I should buy the WotLK expac ($20 + $15 1 month) or try out Aion ($20 for 1 month).
I found myself doing a simple quest, minding my own busness when all of a sudden a group of 6 elyos pop through a rift near me. Complete madness commenced because there was nothing but soloers in the area, We got are asses kicked until we where able to get a group made to take them on. I would say 20 soloers died in that incounter (I died twice) before we could crush them. So much for questing for that day
Things like this has happen to me in OBT alot, either 1v1 or getting smoked by a well excuted group. There is so much more to offer because i don't know korean and i'm missing tons of info.
I have never had so much fun in an mmo as this game, but this is just me and it might not be your type of game. If its not I hope you find what your looking for.....because its all about finding a game that is fun to play for you.
My chanter:
Velika: City of Wheels: Among the mortal races, the humans were the only one that never built cities or great empires; a curse laid upon them by their creator, Gidd, forced them to wander as nomads for twenty centuries...
WoW you have to have a cell phone and text messaging to be able to play the game? That sucks IMO
Yes i'm a dinosaur i know. I don't have a cell phone and have desire to run out and buy one just to be able to play the game.
NO
Velika: City of Wheels: Among the mortal races, the humans were the only one that never built cities or great empires; a curse laid upon them by their creator, Gidd, forced them to wander as nomads for twenty centuries...
I would have to agree with you Stay... I had loads of fun in KOBT. My overall expectations were far exceeded. Which is saying a lot due to everything being in Korean. Although the english patch did help a bit... well.. made it more tolerable anyway.
We are recruiting... Want to learn more? Click here.
NO
Winter: You have to understand that there's a big cultural difference... in terms of telecommunications, 7 year old elementary kids, 80 year old grandparents, and sure as hell gamers in their teens~30s age group all have cell phones. Plus, text messaging here is about 20 won or about ~2 cents per txt sent (receiving is free btw).
With that said, you won't have to worry once the game arrives in U.S. shores as I'm pretty sure NC won't require its subscribers to have a cell phone, or txt messaging service for the matter.
I had a cell phone for about a year but got rid of it....people think it makes their lives more convenient but in reality many become a slave to it..... I havent missed it one iota......I am one of the rare people that actually likes to get away from the phone when I leave the house........I have friends that pay 2-3 hundred dollars a month for their plans and often go over their minutes even with that ....... If a game requires its users to have cell phones to play they will actually lose some customers believe it or not.......
I had a cell phone for about a year but got rid of it....people think it makes their lives more convenient but in reality many become a slave to it..... I havent missed it one iota......I am one of the rare people that actually likes to get away from the phone when I leave the house........I have friends that pay 2-3 hundred dollars a month for their plans and often go over their minutes even with that ....... If a game requires its users to have cell phones to play they will actually lose some customers believe it or not.......
Heh, I had a cell phone. I was determined that noone would have the number who I didn't want to talk to at any given moment of the day. After 2 months, the only people who had my cell phone number were my daughter and the cell provider. So I got rid of it.
I guess i'm gonna have to make it a little more clear. No you will not need a cell phone or text msg inorder to play this game.
You only needed a cell phone and or a bank account info inorder to play in the KOREAN OBT (KOBT is over so its a mute point now), This does not have any effect on players in NA, EU, CN, or any other country outside korea.
Velika: City of Wheels: Among the mortal races, the humans were the only one that never built cities or great empires; a curse laid upon them by their creator, Gidd, forced them to wander as nomads for twenty centuries...
Thanks for clearing that up. A bit late here (well actually early) so i don't claim to be 100% here.
Thanks for the impressions.
So basically any complaints made have to be from "WoW carebears" :P Cant possibly be other MMO players :O
and wannabe darkfall players
To the person comparing WoW endgame to Aion.... You can't actually say anything tangible until the Korean release. The max level for OBT was 30.
And most mmos are more 'magical' or imaginative then WoW. Blizzard is only good at one thing: make things work smoothly. They have no concept of what an original idea is.
(,,,)=^__^=(,,,)
Was this directed towards me? I never compared Aion's endgame to WoW's, moreless anything remotely close to criticizing it. It's a given that endgame wasn't accessible during OBT... you make it sound as if I thought otherwise. What I did say was I'm concerned about Aion's leveling up process and HOPE the Abyss turns out to be a fantastic finish line through the grueling ordeal.
And by all means, if making things 'work smoothly' generates 11 million subscribers and crowns itself as the king of p2p MMO, I sure hope Aion follows Blizzard's approach. Who needs creativity? amirite??!? (sarcasm)
The whole thing about originality and whatnot is getting old! It's like with Apple and their immensely popular keyboard design on their macbooks. Innovative? Not really, the design was actually first introduced by Sony's x505 notebooks in 2004, but the dumazzez didn't see the potential and scrapped the design. Can't relate? Think Blizzard = Apple. Just like how Apple had the vision to see greatness in the design (and thus applying it to their macbooks), so did Blizzard in copying the things that worked in other MMOs while dropping/tweaking the things that didn't. Result? WoW is now a benchmark for many emerging titles and it actually became the standard.
So what does this all translate to? I want Aion to be successful as much as anyone else here... but in order for it to be successful, I'm also hoping NC did something to emulate WoW. I mean really, unless you're a total fanboy, you can't deny that WoW pulled off SOMETHING good to become what it is today. There's a lesson to be had for other MMOs, and so far, WAR and AoC miserably failed. I just wish NC did learn a thing or two from Blizz's success and applied it to Aion.
Was this directed towards me? I never compared Aion's endgame to WoW's, moreless anything remotely close to criticizing it. It's a given that endgame wasn't accessible during OBT... you make it sound as if I thought otherwise. What I did say was I'm concerned about Aion's leveling up process and HOPE the Abyss turns out to be a fantastic finish line through the grueling ordeal.
And by all means, if making things 'work smoothly' generates 11 million subscribers and crowns itself as the king of p2p MMO, I sure hope Aion follows Blizzard's approach. Who needs creativity? amirite??!? (sarcasm)
The whole thing about originality and whatnot is getting old! It's like with Apple and their immensely popular keyboard design on their macbooks. Innovative? Not really, the design was actually first introduced by Sony's x505 notebooks in 2004, but the dumazzez didn't see the potential and scrapped the design. Can't relate? Think Blizzard = Apple. Just like how Apple had the vision to see greatness in the design (and thus applying it to their macbooks), so did Blizzard in copying the things that worked in other MMOs while dropping/tweaking the things that didn't. Result? WoW is now a benchmark for many emerging titles and it actually became the standard.
So what does this all translate to? I want Aion to be successful as much as anyone else here... but in order for it to be successful, I'm also hoping NC did something to emulate WoW. I mean really, unless you're a total fanboy, you can't deny that WoW pulled off SOMETHING good to become what it is today. There's a lesson to be had for other MMOs, and so far, WAR and AoC miserably failed. I just wish NC did learn a thing or two from Blizz's success and applied it to Aion.
I would compare WoW to Microsoft than to mac.
WoW didnt take the best things from MMOGS; sorry they just to took the easyiest and blandest features that most mmogs had and ran with it.
Marketing is the reason for WoWs sucess. Blizzard had a big following before WoW and there games always sold big. When WoW was announced everyone knew it was going to hit big. Its what blizzard games do.
If WoW was made by a different company with a different IP but exactly the same it would have the same subs as most mmorpgs out.
To me blizzard has always retarded any genre they touch.
Diablo ( loved the 1st one hated the rest) gave birth to the hack/slash era. I remeber one rpg that was in developemnt that was copying Fallout, but it went under as diablo clones flooded the market. In the past years companys have finaly started to focus on the RP part of that genre. But with Diablo 3 im sure that will all go down hill
Warcraft/starcraft (loved warcraft 1and 2 couldnt stand starcraft) Quick and easy fun but nothing compared to the more complex RTSs out. Warcraft 3 was even more dumb downed.
Blizard always attracts the masses only because they dumb everything down for the masses.
Anyway back on subject how was the world? Was it big and spaced out or was it cramped and themeparkish.
Anyway back on subject how was the world? Was it big and spaced out or was it cramped and themeparkish.
The begining maps are kinda cramped, But when you get to around lvl20 or so it really starts to open up. Going from one large map to another island or land mass via the teleporter you can see the areas are quite large, and you can still see monsters that are the same lvl as in the other map. So you don't have to wait until your a certin lvl in order to explore other areas.
Here are two maps: Map detail and info gets filled in as you explore the area's
Velika: City of Wheels: Among the mortal races, the humans were the only one that never built cities or great empires; a curse laid upon them by their creator, Gidd, forced them to wander as nomads for twenty centuries...
here is a video of the the size of the land mass given to obt players.
www.jeuxonline.info/video/1309/elysea-environnement
Velika: City of Wheels: Among the mortal races, the humans were the only one that never built cities or great empires; a curse laid upon them by their creator, Gidd, forced them to wander as nomads for twenty centuries...
Is it just this area or are all the areas tunnels?
Looks like a dungeon map to me.
this video is just amazing,,makes me wanna play even more...details,vast world,its just unbelievable... excuse my enthusiasm but i got used to wow graphics so this is quite shock for me
Was this directed towards me? I never compared Aion's endgame to WoW's, moreless anything remotely close to criticizing it. It's a given that endgame wasn't accessible during OBT... you make it sound as if I thought otherwise. What I did say was I'm concerned about Aion's leveling up process and HOPE the Abyss turns out to be a fantastic finish line through the grueling ordeal.
And by all means, if making things 'work smoothly' generates 11 million subscribers and crowns itself as the king of p2p MMO, I sure hope Aion follows Blizzard's approach. Who needs creativity? amirite??!? (sarcasm)
The whole thing about originality and whatnot is getting old! It's like with Apple and their immensely popular keyboard design on their macbooks. Innovative? Not really, the design was actually first introduced by Sony's x505 notebooks in 2004, but the dumazzez didn't see the potential and scrapped the design. Can't relate? Think Blizzard = Apple. Just like how Apple had the vision to see greatness in the design (and thus applying it to their macbooks), so did Blizzard in copying the things that worked in other MMOs while dropping/tweaking the things that didn't. Result? WoW is now a benchmark for many emerging titles and it actually became the standard.
So what does this all translate to? I want Aion to be successful as much as anyone else here... but in order for it to be successful, I'm also hoping NC did something to emulate WoW. I mean really, unless you're a total fanboy, you can't deny that WoW pulled off SOMETHING good to become what it is today. There's a lesson to be had for other MMOs, and so far, WAR and AoC miserably failed. I just wish NC did learn a thing or two from Blizz's success and applied it to Aion.
I would compare WoW to Microsoft than to mac.
WoW didnt take the best things from MMOGS; sorry they just to took the easyiest and blandest features that most mmogs had and ran with it.
Marketing is the reason for WoWs sucess. Blizzard had a big following before WoW and there games always sold big. When WoW was announced everyone knew it was going to hit big. Its what blizzard games do.
If WoW was made by a different company with a different IP but exactly the same it would have the same subs as most mmorpgs out.
To me blizzard has always retarded any genre they touch.
Diablo ( loved the 1st one hated the rest) gave birth to the hack/slash era. I remeber one rpg that was in developemnt that was copying Fallout, but it went under as diablo clones flooded the market. In the past years companys have finaly started to focus on the RP part of that genre. But with Diablo 3 im sure that will all go down hill
Warcraft/starcraft (loved warcraft 1and 2 couldnt stand starcraft) Quick and easy fun but nothing compared to the more complex RTSs out. Warcraft 3 was even more dumb downed.
Blizard always attracts the masses only because they dumb everything down for the masses.
Anyway back on subject how was the world? Was it big and spaced out or was it cramped and themeparkish.
Sorry to break it to you but none of Blizzard's pre-WoW games even came close to the record numbers it has reached today. I admit though, Blizzard did have a big following when the game was first launched, however, that alone does not explain the exponential growth it has gained among new audiences to the genre. Hell, I log on and see school teachers, police officers, and even parents immersed in the game with no prior gaming background.
To say that following and marketing is the only factor that produces a successful title is an understatement. Take WAR for example... it's following was incredible and it was the best selling game of 2008 prior to WotLK xpac. Not to mention Mythic had successful titles in the past as well(DAoC anyone?). What the hell happened? WAR turned out to be completely unpolished, boring, and felt like a pvp grind... I never really felt immersed in WAR's lore or gameplay. Games must have quality for it to succeed, and yes, it does depend on a variety of factors (including marketing).
I would also like to briefly argue your point about the game being 'dumbed' down. What Blizzard ultimately succeeded in was to be able to gather hardcore and casual gamers alike. You can't be casual and achieve 2200 arena rating, raid Black Temple, or gather those precious materials to forge Stormherald... likewise, the game was also able to accomodate casual players that logged on to do Kara, a couple BGs, or even arenas (albeit their ratings would be sub-1200s.) All in all, Blizz did a fantastic job crossing over a wide spectrum of players. If any game forced me to dedicate 10 hrs a day just to stay competitive, you can count me out.
There are obviously people that dislike Blizzard and find every way to bash their games... but plz don't go into denial. Give out proper respects when it's warranted.
Easy tiger!
No one's denying's WoW's success or that they did a lot to make MMOs more accessible, for every one not just experienced gamers. However I find none of their ideas to be worth my time. And that's my personal choice. I almost choked when they announced the Wrath of the Witch King, I mean Lich King.
Also Blizzard does a fantastic job of ignoring the role players.
One of the major reasons I can't get into it. Also popular doesn't equate substance, take Britney Spears, Paris Hilton. 
I'm just saying. Yes they are accessible and pretty to look at and not too hard to understand and many would like to be beside them.. But not everyone.
That may seem like a bash, but it is my honest view of WoW, it's fun, it caters to a certain demographic and it's great for first time MMOers, but to some people it leaves a lot to be desired. And that's why I'm here and not on the W forums. Also there's a large difference between taking the basic ideas of a fantasy setting and ripping off everyone around you. :S
Aion does take a few nods from that game while retaining some from L2. No it's not WoW with wings...
(,,,)=^__^=(,,,)
Was this directed towards me? I never compared Aion's endgame to WoW's, moreless anything remotely close to criticizing it. It's a given that endgame wasn't accessible during OBT... you make it sound as if I thought otherwise. What I did say was I'm concerned about Aion's leveling up process and HOPE the Abyss turns out to be a fantastic finish line through the grueling ordeal.
And by all means, if making things 'work smoothly' generates 11 million subscribers and crowns itself as the king of p2p MMO, I sure hope Aion follows Blizzard's approach. Who needs creativity? amirite??!? (sarcasm)
The whole thing about originality and whatnot is getting old! It's like with Apple and their immensely popular keyboard design on their macbooks. Innovative? Not really, the design was actually first introduced by Sony's x505 notebooks in 2004, but the dumazzez didn't see the potential and scrapped the design. Can't relate? Think Blizzard = Apple. Just like how Apple had the vision to see greatness in the design (and thus applying it to their macbooks), so did Blizzard in copying the things that worked in other MMOs while dropping/tweaking the things that didn't. Result? WoW is now a benchmark for many emerging titles and it actually became the standard.
So what does this all translate to? I want Aion to be successful as much as anyone else here... but in order for it to be successful, I'm also hoping NC did something to emulate WoW. I mean really, unless you're a total fanboy, you can't deny that WoW pulled off SOMETHING good to become what it is today. There's a lesson to be had for other MMOs, and so far, WAR and AoC miserably failed. I just wish NC did learn a thing or two from Blizz's success and applied it to Aion.
I would compare WoW to Microsoft than to mac.
WoW didnt take the best things from MMOGS; sorry they just to took the easyiest and blandest features that most mmogs had and ran with it.
Marketing is the reason for WoWs sucess. Blizzard had a big following before WoW and there games always sold big. When WoW was announced everyone knew it was going to hit big. Its what blizzard games do.
If WoW was made by a different company with a different IP but exactly the same it would have the same subs as most mmorpgs out.
To me blizzard has always retarded any genre they touch.
Diablo ( loved the 1st one hated the rest) gave birth to the hack/slash era. I remeber one rpg that was in developemnt that was copying Fallout, but it went under as diablo clones flooded the market. In the past years companys have finaly started to focus on the RP part of that genre. But with Diablo 3 im sure that will all go down hill
Warcraft/starcraft (loved warcraft 1and 2 couldnt stand starcraft) Quick and easy fun but nothing compared to the more complex RTSs out. Warcraft 3 was even more dumb downed.
Blizard always attracts the masses only because they dumb everything down for the masses.
Anyway back on subject how was the world? Was it big and spaced out or was it cramped and themeparkish.
Sorry to break it to you but none of Blizzard's pre-WoW games even came close to the record numbers it has reached today. I admit though, Blizzard did have a big following when the game was first launched, however, that alone does not explain the exponential growth it has gained among new audiences to the genre. Hell, I log on and see school teachers, police officers, and even parents immersed in the game with no prior gaming background.
To say that following and marketing is the only factor that produces a successful title is an understatement. Take WAR for example... it's following was incredible and it was the best selling game of 2008 prior to WotLK xpac. Not to mention Mythic had successful titles in the past as well(DAoC anyone?). What the hell happened? WAR turned out to be completely unpolished, boring, and felt like a pvp grind... I never really felt immersed in WAR's lore or gameplay. Games must have quality for it to succeed, and yes, it does depend on a variety of factors (including marketing).
I would also like to briefly argue your point about the game being 'dumbed' down. What Blizzard ultimately succeeded in was to be able to gather hardcore and casual gamers alike. You can't be casual and achieve 2200 arena rating, raid Black Temple, or gather those precious materials to forge Stormherald... likewise, the game was also able to accomodate casual players that logged on to do Kara, a couple BGs, or even arenas (albeit their ratings would be sub-1200s.) All in all, Blizz did a fantastic job crossing over a wide spectrum of players. If any game forced me to dedicate 10 hrs a day just to stay competitive, you can count me out.
There are obviously people that dislike Blizzard and find every way to bash their games... but plz don't go into denial. Give out proper respects when it's warranted.
Starcraft sold alot of boxes so did WC3 and diablos. All of em hit big in there genre.
WAR never hit that big on the hype meter. And DAoC wasnt the big hit of its day. Plus Mythic didnt start WAR they picked it up as the last company left it. Only fanbois thought it would get a huge following.
WoW isnt hardcore. The early days of EQ had hardcore pve, Nothing in WoW is hard.
WoW = Disney land
While yes Disney land might have brought some adults and children together. I still wouldnt call it great entertainment.
I dont owe WoW anything It didnt help me or the genre. Didnt bring anything new, and dumb down whatever they could steal from everyone else. All they did was bring more money to the market. Which as you can tell didnt help devs with there creativity. Just made them more greedy.
Was this directed towards me? I never compared Aion's endgame to WoW's, moreless anything remotely close to criticizing it. It's a given that endgame wasn't accessible during OBT... you make it sound as if I thought otherwise. What I did say was I'm concerned about Aion's leveling up process and HOPE the Abyss turns out to be a fantastic finish line through the grueling ordeal.
And by all means, if making things 'work smoothly' generates 11 million subscribers and crowns itself as the king of p2p MMO, I sure hope Aion follows Blizzard's approach. Who needs creativity? amirite??!? (sarcasm)
The whole thing about originality and whatnot is getting old! It's like with Apple and their immensely popular keyboard design on their macbooks. Innovative? Not really, the design was actually first introduced by Sony's x505 notebooks in 2004, but the dumazzez didn't see the potential and scrapped the design. Can't relate? Think Blizzard = Apple. Just like how Apple had the vision to see greatness in the design (and thus applying it to their macbooks), so did Blizzard in copying the things that worked in other MMOs while dropping/tweaking the things that didn't. Result? WoW is now a benchmark for many emerging titles and it actually became the standard.
So what does this all translate to? I want Aion to be successful as much as anyone else here... but in order for it to be successful, I'm also hoping NC did something to emulate WoW. I mean really, unless you're a total fanboy, you can't deny that WoW pulled off SOMETHING good to become what it is today. There's a lesson to be had for other MMOs, and so far, WAR and AoC miserably failed. I just wish NC did learn a thing or two from Blizz's success and applied it to Aion.
I would compare WoW to Microsoft than to mac.
WoW didnt take the best things from MMOGS; sorry they just to took the easyiest and blandest features that most mmogs had and ran with it.
Marketing is the reason for WoWs sucess. Blizzard had a big following before WoW and there games always sold big. When WoW was announced everyone knew it was going to hit big. Its what blizzard games do.
If WoW was made by a different company with a different IP but exactly the same it would have the same subs as most mmorpgs out.
To me blizzard has always retarded any genre they touch.
Diablo ( loved the 1st one hated the rest) gave birth to the hack/slash era. I remeber one rpg that was in developemnt that was copying Fallout, but it went under as diablo clones flooded the market. In the past years companys have finaly started to focus on the RP part of that genre. But with Diablo 3 im sure that will all go down hill
Warcraft/starcraft (loved warcraft 1and 2 couldnt stand starcraft) Quick and easy fun but nothing compared to the more complex RTSs out. Warcraft 3 was even more dumb downed.
Blizard always attracts the masses only because they dumb everything down for the masses.
Anyway back on subject how was the world? Was it big and spaced out or was it cramped and themeparkish.
Okay, so marketing is all you need to make a smash hit MMO. Age of Conan followed that formula, and their ever-increasing subscriber base and soaring stock prices attest to the success that can be garnered by marketing and more marketing.
What about Mythic? Marketing blitz. Their 8 million subscribers have resulted in them becoming the second most popular MMO, drawing nearly 20% of WoW's subscriber base away. It's pretty evident they'll become the dominant MMO on the market.
Yes, I see your point. Marketing is all you need, Diablo and Starcraft were simplistic terrible games that were just well hyped.
(This guy HAS to work for Funcom, right?)
In every country and in every age, the priest has been hostile to liberty. He is always in alliance with the despot, abetting his abuses in return for protection to his own.
-Thomas Jefferson
In defense of starcraft, when it was released, it was pretty revolutionary-at least as far as mainstream RTS went-and i've played a LOT of RTS(look at profile-couldnt fit it all in either due to 1000 char limit) Three races all of which could be played skillfully and were fairly balanced(yes balanced) but so unique that each race shares maybe one or 2 strategies in common. Not only that, it was easy to pick up and play and it is a VERy low requirement game meaning anyone with a fifteen year old computer can run it.
Now as far as WoW being based completely off of fanbase and marketing, you'd be surprised by the number of players in WC3 and Diablo 2 who can't stand WoW, I'd say that the majority of D2 players and half or more WC3 players never made the jump-and don't want to, and i've been active on Bnet for many years(despite keeping active on the two dozen other games i currently play)
WoW did EXACTLY what starcraft did, it took basic elements of existing MMOs, simplified them, made other parts easier, then added the Warcraft "Lore" and released it all bundled up. What does that mean? it means that anyone can play it, "hardcore" players, casual gamers, Rpers, any age, any gender. Not only that, but it's accessable by most computers these days-so you've got an 8 year old computer? NO PROB! Play WoW. You've got a mac? NO PROB! Play WoW.
So, WoW isn't a HORRIBLE game, and i've played some bad games. However, it's not all that special either. Back to the RTS genre, Starcraft had many revolutionary features, but there are several other RTS games which you might take note of.
HOMEWORLD- The first RTS with a PURELY 3D game engine, released a mere year and a half after starcraft.
Dawn of War/Company of Heroes- Both made by relic, great graphics and an interesting resource system coupled with tactics and realistic damage systems.
Shogun/Medievel/Rome/Medieval2 Total War- Man, i could go on about these for days, but suffice to say they have the most realistic massive scale battles in any game ever created. The graphics are great, and the single player is by far from weak, only problem is finding a computer good enough to handle the more recent ones.
Total War, Company of Heroes, Homeworld. All great games/series, all with revolutionary concepts, and yet, Starcraft remains the most popular RTS game in the world. Why? because it is player friendly. It suits hardcore and casual players alike and anyone can play it.
This is no different than WoW-or Halo(1) for that matter.
It's almost 2010, and I am just not wiling to tolerate clunky graphics while being told that "gameplay is more important than graphics". That excuse won't wash with me any more. I expect my games to have both good graphics and good gameplay.
-Quote Isoke(VN boards)