My logic doesn't have to make sense to you, as it's obviously from someone who is less concerned with a GAME's now corrected issue than anything having to do with RL. The world is not gonna end, nor will it bring world hunger.
I already mentioned I sympathize, but I just don't let this things like that get to me. I play EVE, and have been playing mmo's for 9 yrs now. Logic is only a system used to justify or condemn...conviction will overrule logic any day of the week because it is subjective, but those without the use of wisdom, can believe something flawed and still use logic to bolster their claim.
My logic is this: It's a game. You can either enjoy it or leave with this news. Actions speak louder than words.
I can yell out "Damn we need cleaner air ppl. Rise up and fight the corps!" all I want, but if I do nothing else but that, how can I expect change?
If you still don't understand my logic, then there's nothing else I can say. I'm not trying to convince you of anything, only that what you see as a truth is not what I see. I'm in no way negating your feelings, but maybe you should try to ascertain where they stem from, and what really the issue is? If it's really the game, then maybe a new perspective on life is needed.
Dude, of course those are my feelings only related to a game. That's why I am probably posting this frustration on a gaming forum, sharing it with other gamers. But, in your case, probably posting on a gaming forum and saying "it's only a game, get over it" is not the most wisest as this is what these forums are for, a place for gamers to share their knowledge and experience with other gamers.
Now, if someone got so upset over this exploit that it affected his/her daily life and relations with people irl, then I agree with you, that person needs to sort his priorities.
I agree these forums are for the sharing of information, and their opinions, and I respect yours...truly I do.
It's very hard here on MMORPG or other forums, those threads that are simply sharing, or just trolling and/or fanboism at work.
Like I said, I wasn't trying to to negate or belittle your views, but it can be a feeding ground for trolls and I for one, would prefer a reasonable debate as oppsed to name calling or blatant lying about stuff.
I agree these forums are for the sharing of information, and their opinions, and I respect yours...truly I do. It's very hard here on MMORPG or other forums, those threads that are simply sharing, or just trolling and/or fanboism at work. Like I said, I wasn't trying to to negate or belittle your views, but it can be a feeding ground for trolls and I for one, would prefer a reasonable debate as oppsed to name calling or blatant lying about stuff. No offense was intended, truly.
No offence was taken ^^
I am hoping for a good discussion about the implications of this scandal on EvE here, as it is becoming increasingly difficult to have a discussion about it on official forums because CCP has been closing, deleting any thread related to this issue at the moment save for one big thread where it is impossible to have all the related concerns discussed due to the having all concerns+trolls+bullshit piled into one huge thread. But, that's CCP for you
The impact might be huge, it might not. Nobody knows at this point.
From what i could gather from my more reliable sources (no, someone posting bullshit on shc or caod is not a reliable source), i can draw a few conclusions:
a) No old and major alliance was involved. I'm saying this because usually in these alliances there are a lot of people managing pos and reactions. The reactions were most likely done in lowsec by small (alt)corps. The moneyflow of those small corps might have gone to larger alliances, but tbh. i doubt it went to established ones. Those are usually not in financial troubles at all. Sorry to disapoint you guys, Bob probably got their titans through legal means.
b) The 4 years rumour is most likely bullshit. From looking at prices, the impact started probably around late march, early april. If someone silently used the exploit before i can't say of course, but any real impact was probably done in spring this year.
c) Alliance leaders banned...well, i have a lot of them in my addressbook, and i saw them online.
So, how much impact did this actually do? I don't know. Hope the CSM can do something there. CCP better releases some infos quickly..
From what I've read, CCP does not have the monolopy on mass deleting/banning on an issue of exploitation or showing major flaws ingame. Won't mention anyone since it has no relevance and will only iritate some here, but it's a real shame companies feel the need to 'cover up' issues that might be true.
tbh, I only just started EvE though I have played it for some length about 2 yrs ago. For the most part, I don't really see it as affecting my gameplay, even if it takes longer for me to acquire the same stuff, I enjoy the ride.
I guess for those who are more competitive, I can see the frustration in those players having that advantage over them. However, if CCP does what it has said, and done, and continues to rectify the situation, I don't see that things couldn't get back to normal.
It's like the SOE fiasco going on now with the microtranactions thing. Until there's proof that they'll actually replace items earned or crafted, it shouldn't affect the gameplay as nothing's changed but having things others won't pay real money for. I mean, it's not like those buying that pet is forcing anyone else to dish out money. If those that won't pay for it complain that they should get it ingame, it's just a case of "the grass is greener over there" syndrome and get over it.
Time will tell if there are any reverberations of these actions, but I will enjoy it until then.
The impact might be huge, it might not. Nobody knows at this point. From what i could gather from my more reliable sources (no, someone posting bullshit on shc or caod is not a reliable source), i can draw a few conclusions: a) No old and major alliance was involved. I'm saying this because usually in these alliances there are a lot of people managing pos and reactions. The reactions were most likely done in lowsec by small (alt)corps. The moneyflow of those small corps might have gone to larger alliances, but tbh. i doubt it went to established ones. Those are usually not in financial troubles at all. Sorry to disapoint you guys, Bob probably got their titans through legal means. I find that hard to believe. b) The 4 years rumour is most likely bullshit. From looking at prices, the impact started probably around late march, early april. If someone silently used the exploit before i can't say of course, but any real impact was probably done in spring this year. Maybe, It does not help that once again it was a player not CCP who seems to have brought this to the publics attention. Peoples initial reaction given the past is acceptable. c) Alliance leaders banned...well, i have a lot of them in my addressbook, and i saw them online.
So, how much impact did this actually do? I don't know. Hope the CSM can do something there. CCP better releases some infos quickly.. Might help calm things down alittle faster. Doubt anything detailed to that extent will be out in the open, unless it's coming from the community. They will just give the " we are handling this situation and everythings being taken care of".
It does not help that once again it was a player not CCP who seems to have brought this to the publics attention.
Incorrect. I saw (and read, german is my native language) the first thread about it from someone who got banned on a german forum.
Read: He posted after he got banned for it, not when he found the bug, and he obviously did not alert ccp about it. The first appearance of that exploit mentioned in apublic forum was by a cought buguser.
Tbh. i have absolutely zero sympathy with people who abuse bugs, especially if they pretend that they had informed anyone. These are just liars, trying to claim a higher moral ground. "I informed ccp so it was totally okay that i abused this bug as much as i wanted", yeah right..
It does not help that once again it was a player not CCP who seems to have brought this to the publics attention.
Incorrect. I saw (and read, german is my native language) the first thread about it from someone who got banned on a german forum.
Read: He posted after he got banned for it, not when he found the bug, and he obviously did not alert ccp about it. The first appearance of that exploit mentioned in apublic forum was by a cought buguser.
Tbh. i have absolutely zero sympathy with people who abuse bugs, especially if they pretend that they had informed anyone. These are just liars, trying to claim a higher moral ground. "I informed ccp so it was totally okay that i abused this bug as much as i wanted", yeah right..
I think you misunderstood what I meant.
It was a player who came forth with the exploit information Doesn't matter if it was before or after he was banned. Had CCP been the first source of information it would have helped with their credibility a lot given past incidents.
Any exploit in an environment like Eve's is generally a big deal. All the more reason for the company (CCP) to be forth coming as soon as information like this arises. It will lessen the impact (by building trust) such an event has on the community.
I assume it was the player who came forward first. Atleast that is the impression I got from the Eve- O forums.
ccp normally dont release exploits ever, they will say "fixed some exploits" and thats about it. that is a good way to handle it. you really expect them to describe each and every exploit they fix?
ccp normally dont release exploits ever, they will say "fixed some exploits" and thats about it. that is a good way to handle it. you really expect them to describe each and every exploit they fix?
bloody hell you didnt think that through.
No. It doesn't say or imply specifics.
You have to take into consideration how T20 unfolded.
Simple terms
Kungu: "looky. "
CCP: " nothing to see here everything is being taken care of and has been all along."
Kungu: " looky"
CCP: .. doh ...shit.
Community: "rawr!"
In simple terms for ya.
It should have been CCP to bring it to peoples attention. Which it doesn't seem like it was once again.
I assume it was the player who came forward first. Atleast that is the impression I got from the Eve- O forums.
And from what i read and saw, he is simply a liar. The player did not inform ccp, he just continued to exploit the bug until he got his arse busted, and then went all emo on the forums.
I haven't yet found a serious exploit in the game myself, but as i'm lurking around the test server a lot, i know how fast ccp can be regarding even relatively harmless exploits. I highly doubt that if they had known of the reaction bug they would have let it slip.
It all comes down to the players. If they encounter a bug that generates ressources out of thin air, then it's imho their responsibility to make sure that bug gets fixed asap, which means mailing / bugreporting it to ccp. As this has apparently not been done, it's fairly obvious to me that anyone claiming he reported that bug is simply a liar.
And so far i have not seen any proof of anyone that he reported this bug. Show me one and i will gladly eat my words..
An exploit announced 11th of December by CCP relating to functions within POS Reaction chain, which allowed expensive material to be created without any base elements utilized has caused uproar within the EVE community. This exploit effectively allowed infinite amount of isk to be printed with little effort or cost by malicious members of the community.
While CCP has released an early estimate of the number of accounts, corporations and alliances involved in this exploit their policy does not permit releasing the names of the people involved granting them the privilege of anonymity.
Maltroc of AMT Corporation of EV0KE alliance, former member of Asgard Schiffswerften (ASW) of Dusk and Dawn Alliance (D2) & G Alliance – you have no such privilege.
Quote:
Originally Posted by CCP
On December 7th 2008, a date which will live in infamy, a petition from a concerned player alerted us to a serious problem with Starbase reactors. The petition had been filed five days earlier, a far longer waiting time than we can accept with our current queue status and we have now taken measures to fix that. We immediately started investigating the issue and found that there was indeed a problem and that it was being exploited to gain unfair advantages.
We discovered seven corporations with multiple Starbases set up for the express purpose of exploiting the issue. Three of those corporations were members of two alliances. We took immediate action against the offenders and banned over 70 accounts and destroyed all the Starbases run by the corporations in question. All the offending corporations are now effectively inactive as a result of our actions.
erstmal nur folgende nachricht, einige accounts von einigen spielern wurden gebanned
After the next downtime, some accounts of some players will be banned.
Quote:
Originally Posted by AMT - Maltroc
Ja .. Grund ist uns bekannt. Stellungnahme kommt nach .
Yes the reason why is known to us. Statement will come later.
Quote:
Originally Posted by AMT - Maltroc
SO.
Der Tag ist da wo ich mich von den Fesseln in Eve befreit wurde.
Ich möchte mich hiermit offiziel aus dem Evoke Lead und dem Amt Lead zurückziehen.
Desweiteren wird es mir nicht mehr möglich sein EvE zu spielen.
Es sind einige Dinge vorgefallen wo ich euch nicht mit hineinziehen möchte.
Daher werde ich diesen Schritt tun.
Es war eine tolle Zeit und mir eine Ehre mit euch dieses Spiel spielen zu dürfen.
Doch nun ist es besser mich von EvE zu distanzieren.
Mit den Gründen habt ihr nichts zu tun.
Daher wünsche ich euch noch viel Spass in Eve.
Euer Maltroc
SO.
Today I become freed from my chains in EvE. I hereby official retire from Evoke and AMT leadership. As it will not be possible for me to play EvE anymore. Some thing happeneds which I do not want to drag you into. So I have to take this decision (step).
I had a fun time playing EvE with you guys. But it's better for me to leave EvE now. You guys are not the reason.
I wish you a lot of fun in EvE.
Your Maltroc
Quote:
Originally Posted by AMT - Arela Xen
Hat das eine was mit dem anderen zu tun?
Unabhängig davon ists natürlich ein großer Verlust. Soweit ich das beurteilen kann warst du immer einer, der direkt auf Leute zugegangen ist und mit ihnen gesprochen/verhandelt hat.
Has it got anything to do with the others?
Apart from that it's ofcourse a big loss. As far I can tell you you were one of those guys that always talked to people and played with them. (was social).
Quote:
Originally Posted by AMT - Maltroc
Danke. Aber im Moment ist es nicht gut für Evoke wenn ich aktiv dabei bin.
Aber ich finde du machst deine Sache richtig gut. Sei einfach immer ehrlich zu den Leuten und sag was du denkst.
Somit wirst du dir eine Lobby schaffen die auch im Notfall hinter dir steht .
Thank you. But atm it's not good for Evoke when I'm involved in that.
I think you approached it the right way. Always be honest to people and say what you think.
This way you create a group of people that also support when an emergency happens.
The impact might be huge, it might not. Nobody knows at this point. From what i could gather from my more reliable sources (no, someone posting bullshit on shc or caod is not a reliable source), i can draw a few conclusions: a) No old and major alliance was involved. I'm saying this because usually in these alliances there are a lot of people managing pos and reactions. The reactions were most likely done in lowsec by small (alt)corps. The moneyflow of those small corps might have gone to larger alliances, but tbh. i doubt it went to established ones. Those are usually not in financial troubles at all. Sorry to disapoint you guys, Bob probably got their titans through legal means. b) The 4 years rumour is most likely bullshit. From looking at prices, the impact started probably around late march, early april. If someone silently used the exploit before i can't say of course, but any real impact was probably done in spring this year. c) Alliance leaders banned...well, i have a lot of them in my addressbook, and i saw them online. So, how much impact did this actually do? I don't know. Hope the CSM can do something there. CCP better releases some infos quickly..
Well your first assumption has already been proven wrong. Evoke has pretty much fallen apart and that post on Kug's forums has some pretty substantial evidence proving Evoke was behind at least some of this.
The 4 year rumor may or may not be bullshit. We still have to see. Maybe some people were using it for the past 4 years but not until recently that it was being used on a massive scale. Evoke, although being a named player, is not exactly a massive alliance and could have been doing this for years very quietly.
Alliance leaders have nothing to do with this. Why would they ban the accounts of alliance leaders? If you are doing something that you know is in fact an exploit, or that it was at least not intended like this bug was, would you use the account your main was on? Hell would you even use a corp within the alliance? Some alliances come to mind when I first heard about this bug. There are plenty of alliances that do not have access to a massive quanity of T2 bpos and are sitting on crap space and yet have massive cap/super cap fleets. I've scratched my head as to why that is and this bug/expliot seems to explain why they are so rich happened.
------------------- If ever there was a time to rise if ever there was a time to join hands with our brothers that time is now. At this exact junction in history we have within our grasp the means to loosen our tormentors hold and win freedom for our kin. Opportunities are there to be taken.
There are plenty of alliances that do not have access to a massive quanity of T2 bpos and are sitting on crap space and yet have massive cap/super cap fleets. I've scratched my head as to why that is and this bug/expliot seems to explain why they are so rich happened.
Name some.
It has been hinted at rawr (my alliance), and mostly harmless.
I'd say, the mostly harmless stuff is unlikely, but i don't know mh too much.
From my perspective of a semi-grunt in rawr, i can tell you that any alliance that has been sitting in its space for a long, long time (several years in fact), will have such an efficent pos network, built over the years. Just fly around major 0.0 regions that have been held for a long time, like providence, delve, tribute. The pos networks are insanely huge, and the corps have extreme industrial capabilities, and often maintain moon miners in the surrounding regions or even in totally different areas of the galaxy. If you have the bpos, the pos network, and the industrial capacity, you will make a load of cash, exploiting or not.
The Evoke-thing. Mh. Came unexpected to me. I wouldn't really call them an established alliance, though (because by established i mean spaceholding). We're now looking for the last corp involved in an alliance after evokes outing, and i still doubt that it will be one of the major players in spaceholding. I know how the logistics and industrial side in them work. There's no need for exploits if you have worked years to perfect your production pipelines, you can still shit capitals very efficiently.
What Hakera said is spot on. The directives for claim reimbursement that CCP has given the GM team is the most fair based on the tools available. To be honest, most companies have a zero reimbursement policy, so EVE is a bit more free than the others.
Kieron could you check your email (I know you receive loads and are quite busy because our corp suffered from POS exploit some time ago. We petioned the event with quite a bit of evidence (fraps, howto).
The GM closed the petition while providing another "solution" for the events. This caused a lot of frustration. Their solution isn't possible the given game mechanics. A second unanswered petition is still going this ages without answer while the first was lost...
Now some days ago the same exploit happened again with another G POS.
Well you can guess that we are a bit frustrated since we provided information how it happened while we get told something that doesn't even work.
</understatement>
PS: I won't go into the details because it would just get the thread locked.
Now you see this is how EVE works. I read that as something that doesn't work and the GM gave them a work around which was no good. Now people in EVE are passing this off as proof of an exploit when it doesn't even read like one.
I was going to see if someone jumped on this as proof and went into an emo rage and then point out the obvious. The reason being people think what they want to think and see what they want to see, seriously make up your own mind after a bit of research and reasoning. It's not what happened that matters its how CCP deal with it.
Well, I still like my cheap T2 so I'm grabbing pretty much everything I can get my dirty little hands on.
I think I've spent approx. 750M in the last 24 hours on mass quantities of the T2 stuff I use on a regular basis. I know pretty much everyone with any significant amount of ISK in their wallet is doing the same - the markets will be picked clean before too much longer.
I was saving for a snake set, but they'll still be there (and at the same price) when this is all over.
I assume it was the player who came forward first. Atleast that is the impression I got from the Eve- O forums.
And from what i read and saw, he is simply a liar. The player did not inform ccp, he just continued to exploit the bug until he got his arse busted, and then went all emo on the forums.
I haven't yet found a serious exploit in the game myself, but as i'm lurking around the test server a lot, i know how fast ccp can be regarding even relatively harmless exploits. I highly doubt that if they had known of the reaction bug they would have let it slip.
It all comes down to the players. If they encounter a bug that generates ressources out of thin air, then it's imho their responsibility to make sure that bug gets fixed asap, which means mailing / bugreporting it to ccp. As this has apparently not been done, it's fairly obvious to me that anyone claiming he reported that bug is simply a liar.
And so far i have not seen any proof of anyone that he reported this bug. Show me one and i will gladly eat my words..
you mean like all the major alliances which took advantage of the complex bugs which everyone knew about and which was conveniently ignored until *proof* was presented?
yeah, when the devs stop cheating, the players will stop cheating.
could we please get correspondent writers and moderators, on the eve forum at mmorpg.com, who are well-versed on eve-online and aren't just passersby pushing buttons? pretty please?
Comments
My logic doesn't have to make sense to you, as it's obviously from someone who is less concerned with a GAME's now corrected issue than anything having to do with RL. The world is not gonna end, nor will it bring world hunger.
I already mentioned I sympathize, but I just don't let this things like that get to me. I play EVE, and have been playing mmo's for 9 yrs now. Logic is only a system used to justify or condemn...conviction will overrule logic any day of the week because it is subjective, but those without the use of wisdom, can believe something flawed and still use logic to bolster their claim.
My logic is this: It's a game. You can either enjoy it or leave with this news. Actions speak louder than words.
I can yell out "Damn we need cleaner air ppl. Rise up and fight the corps!" all I want, but if I do nothing else but that, how can I expect change?
If you still don't understand my logic, then there's nothing else I can say. I'm not trying to convince you of anything, only that what you see as a truth is not what I see. I'm in no way negating your feelings, but maybe you should try to ascertain where they stem from, and what really the issue is? If it's really the game, then maybe a new perspective on life is needed.
Dude, of course those are my feelings only related to a game. That's why I am probably posting this frustration on a gaming forum, sharing it with other gamers. But, in your case, probably posting on a gaming forum and saying "it's only a game, get over it" is not the most wisest as this is what these forums are for, a place for gamers to share their knowledge and experience with other gamers.
Now, if someone got so upset over this exploit that it affected his/her daily life and relations with people irl, then I agree with you, that person needs to sort his priorities.
Another MMO that is pointless now by definition.
Oh dear, how sad.
Kris.Kringle@greenland.com
I agree these forums are for the sharing of information, and their opinions, and I respect yours...truly I do.
It's very hard here on MMORPG or other forums, those threads that are simply sharing, or just trolling and/or fanboism at work.
Like I said, I wasn't trying to to negate or belittle your views, but it can be a feeding ground for trolls and I for one, would prefer a reasonable debate as oppsed to name calling or blatant lying about stuff.
No offense was intended, truly.
Case in point.
No offence was taken ^^
I am hoping for a good discussion about the implications of this scandal on EvE here, as it is becoming increasingly difficult to have a discussion about it on official forums because CCP has been closing, deleting any thread related to this issue at the moment save for one big thread where it is impossible to have all the related concerns discussed due to the having all concerns+trolls+bullshit piled into one huge thread. But, that's CCP for you
go join SHC to talk about eve with knowledgeable people tbh.
also, speculators have now inflated prices of moon minerals, expect prices of tech 2 goods to peak in about a week.
The impact might be huge, it might not. Nobody knows at this point.
From what i could gather from my more reliable sources (no, someone posting bullshit on shc or caod is not a reliable source), i can draw a few conclusions:
a) No old and major alliance was involved. I'm saying this because usually in these alliances there are a lot of people managing pos and reactions. The reactions were most likely done in lowsec by small (alt)corps. The moneyflow of those small corps might have gone to larger alliances, but tbh. i doubt it went to established ones. Those are usually not in financial troubles at all. Sorry to disapoint you guys, Bob probably got their titans through legal means.
b) The 4 years rumour is most likely bullshit. From looking at prices, the impact started probably around late march, early april. If someone silently used the exploit before i can't say of course, but any real impact was probably done in spring this year.
c) Alliance leaders banned...well, i have a lot of them in my addressbook, and i saw them online.
So, how much impact did this actually do? I don't know. Hope the CSM can do something there. CCP better releases some infos quickly..
From what I've read, CCP does not have the monolopy on mass deleting/banning on an issue of exploitation or showing major flaws ingame. Won't mention anyone since it has no relevance and will only iritate some here, but it's a real shame companies feel the need to 'cover up' issues that might be true.
tbh, I only just started EvE though I have played it for some length about 2 yrs ago. For the most part, I don't really see it as affecting my gameplay, even if it takes longer for me to acquire the same stuff, I enjoy the ride.
I guess for those who are more competitive, I can see the frustration in those players having that advantage over them. However, if CCP does what it has said, and done, and continues to rectify the situation, I don't see that things couldn't get back to normal.
It's like the SOE fiasco going on now with the microtranactions thing. Until there's proof that they'll actually replace items earned or crafted, it shouldn't affect the gameplay as nothing's changed but having things others won't pay real money for. I mean, it's not like those buying that pet is forcing anyone else to dish out money. If those that won't pay for it complain that they should get it ingame, it's just a case of "the grass is greener over there" syndrome and get over it.
Time will tell if there are any reverberations of these actions, but I will enjoy it until then.
Incorrect. I saw (and read, german is my native language) the first thread about it from someone who got banned on a german forum.
Read: He posted after he got banned for it, not when he found the bug, and he obviously did not alert ccp about it. The first appearance of that exploit mentioned in apublic forum was by a cought buguser.
Tbh. i have absolutely zero sympathy with people who abuse bugs, especially if they pretend that they had informed anyone. These are just liars, trying to claim a higher moral ground. "I informed ccp so it was totally okay that i abused this bug as much as i wanted", yeah right..
Incorrect. I saw (and read, german is my native language) the first thread about it from someone who got banned on a german forum.
Read: He posted after he got banned for it, not when he found the bug, and he obviously did not alert ccp about it. The first appearance of that exploit mentioned in apublic forum was by a cought buguser.
Tbh. i have absolutely zero sympathy with people who abuse bugs, especially if they pretend that they had informed anyone. These are just liars, trying to claim a higher moral ground. "I informed ccp so it was totally okay that i abused this bug as much as i wanted", yeah right..
I think you misunderstood what I meant.
It was a player who came forth with the exploit information Doesn't matter if it was before or after he was banned. Had CCP been the first source of information it would have helped with their credibility a lot given past incidents.
Any exploit in an environment like Eve's is generally a big deal. All the more reason for the company (CCP) to be forth coming as soon as information like this arises. It will lessen the impact (by building trust) such an event has on the community.
I assume it was the player who came forward first. Atleast that is the impression I got from the Eve- O forums.
what?
ccp normally dont release exploits ever, they will say "fixed some exploits" and thats about it. that is a good way to handle it. you really expect them to describe each and every exploit they fix?
bloody hell you didnt think that through.
No. It doesn't say or imply specifics.
You have to take into consideration how T20 unfolded.
Simple terms
Kungu: "looky. "
CCP: " nothing to see here everything is being taken care of and has been all along."
Kungu: " looky"
CCP: .. doh ...shit.
Community: "rawr!"
In simple terms for ya.
It should have been CCP to bring it to peoples attention. Which it doesn't seem like it was once again.
well, it was. in the patch notes is a line at the bottom saying "fixed a number of exploits making new eden a better place for everyone"
A bit too vague given reactions on their main site. =P But hey whatever, fair enough.
And from what i read and saw, he is simply a liar. The player did not inform ccp, he just continued to exploit the bug until he got his arse busted, and then went all emo on the forums.
I haven't yet found a serious exploit in the game myself, but as i'm lurking around the test server a lot, i know how fast ccp can be regarding even relatively harmless exploits. I highly doubt that if they had known of the reaction bug they would have let it slip.
It all comes down to the players. If they encounter a bug that generates ressources out of thin air, then it's imho their responsibility to make sure that bug gets fixed asap, which means mailing / bugreporting it to ccp. As this has apparently not been done, it's fairly obvious to me that anyone claiming he reported that bug is simply a liar.
And so far i have not seen any proof of anyone that he reported this bug. Show me one and i will gladly eat my words..
EV0KE DIR: "Today I become freed from my chains in EVE"
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
An exploit announced 11th of December by CCP relating to functions within POS Reaction chain, which allowed expensive material to be created without any base elements utilized has caused uproar within the EVE community. This exploit effectively allowed infinite amount of isk to be printed with little effort or cost by malicious members of the community.
While CCP has released an early estimate of the number of accounts, corporations and alliances involved in this exploit their policy does not permit releasing the names of the people involved granting them the privilege of anonymity.
Maltroc of AMT Corporation of EV0KE alliance, former member of Asgard Schiffswerften (ASW) of Dusk and Dawn Alliance (D2) & G Alliance – you have no such privilege.
Quote:
Originally Posted by CCP
On December 7th 2008, a date which will live in infamy, a petition from a concerned player alerted us to a serious problem with Starbase reactors. The petition had been filed five days earlier, a far longer waiting time than we can accept with our current queue status and we have now taken measures to fix that. We immediately started investigating the issue and found that there was indeed a problem and that it was being exploited to gain unfair advantages.
We discovered seven corporations with multiple Starbases set up for the express purpose of exploiting the issue. Three of those corporations were members of two alliances. We took immediate action against the offenders and banned over 70 accounts and destroyed all the Starbases run by the corporations in question. All the offending corporations are now effectively inactive as a result of our actions.
The exploit has been widely cowered on eve-o (http://myeve.eve-online.com/ingamebo...hreadID=945010) and Scrapheap (http://www.scrapheap-challenge.com/v...ic.php?t=21941) after first whistleblower released complete details of this on the german eve-o forums.
Ev0ke Director Forums
WTF? 9, 10 December 2008
Quote:
Originally Posted by Schneiderr
erstmal nur folgende nachricht, einige accounts von einigen spielern wurden gebanned
After the next downtime, some accounts of some players will be banned.
Quote:
Originally Posted by AMT - Maltroc
Ja .. Grund ist uns bekannt. Stellungnahme kommt nach .
Yes the reason why is known to us. Statement will come later.
Quote:
Originally Posted by AMT - Maltroc
SO.
Der Tag ist da wo ich mich von den Fesseln in Eve befreit wurde.
Ich möchte mich hiermit offiziel aus dem Evoke Lead und dem Amt Lead zurückziehen.
Desweiteren wird es mir nicht mehr möglich sein EvE zu spielen.
Es sind einige Dinge vorgefallen wo ich euch nicht mit hineinziehen möchte.
Daher werde ich diesen Schritt tun.
Es war eine tolle Zeit und mir eine Ehre mit euch dieses Spiel spielen zu dürfen.
Doch nun ist es besser mich von EvE zu distanzieren.
Mit den Gründen habt ihr nichts zu tun.
Daher wünsche ich euch noch viel Spass in Eve.
Euer Maltroc
SO.
Today I become freed from my chains in EvE. I hereby official retire from Evoke and AMT leadership. As it will not be possible for me to play EvE anymore. Some thing happeneds which I do not want to drag you into. So I have to take this decision (step).
I had a fun time playing EvE with you guys. But it's better for me to leave EvE now. You guys are not the reason.
I wish you a lot of fun in EvE.
Your Maltroc
Quote:
Originally Posted by AMT - Arela Xen
Hat das eine was mit dem anderen zu tun?
Unabhängig davon ists natürlich ein großer Verlust. Soweit ich das beurteilen kann warst du immer einer, der direkt auf Leute zugegangen ist und mit ihnen gesprochen/verhandelt hat.
Has it got anything to do with the others?
Apart from that it's ofcourse a big loss. As far I can tell you you were one of those guys that always talked to people and played with them. (was social).
Quote:
Originally Posted by AMT - Maltroc
Danke. Aber im Moment ist es nicht gut für Evoke wenn ich aktiv dabei bin.
Aber ich finde du machst deine Sache richtig gut. Sei einfach immer ehrlich zu den Leuten und sag was du denkst.
Somit wirst du dir eine Lobby schaffen die auch im Notfall hinter dir steht .
Thank you. But atm it's not good for Evoke when I'm involved in that.
I think you approached it the right way. Always be honest to people and say what you think.
This way you create a group of people that also support when an emergency happens.
The thread is gone from the ev0ke forums...
To be continued...
Taken from http://www.kugutsumen.com/showthread.php?t=3428
Well your first assumption has already been proven wrong. Evoke has pretty much fallen apart and that post on Kug's forums has some pretty substantial evidence proving Evoke was behind at least some of this.
The 4 year rumor may or may not be bullshit. We still have to see. Maybe some people were using it for the past 4 years but not until recently that it was being used on a massive scale. Evoke, although being a named player, is not exactly a massive alliance and could have been doing this for years very quietly.
Alliance leaders have nothing to do with this. Why would they ban the accounts of alliance leaders? If you are doing something that you know is in fact an exploit, or that it was at least not intended like this bug was, would you use the account your main was on? Hell would you even use a corp within the alliance? Some alliances come to mind when I first heard about this bug. There are plenty of alliances that do not have access to a massive quanity of T2 bpos and are sitting on crap space and yet have massive cap/super cap fleets. I've scratched my head as to why that is and this bug/expliot seems to explain why they are so rich happened.
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If ever there was a time to rise if ever there was a time to join hands with our brothers that time is now. At this exact junction in history we have within our grasp the means to loosen our tormentors hold and win freedom for our kin. Opportunities are there to be taken.
Brothers, we must rise.
-Malaetu Shakor
Name some.
It has been hinted at rawr (my alliance), and mostly harmless.
I'd say, the mostly harmless stuff is unlikely, but i don't know mh too much.
From my perspective of a semi-grunt in rawr, i can tell you that any alliance that has been sitting in its space for a long, long time (several years in fact), will have such an efficent pos network, built over the years. Just fly around major 0.0 regions that have been held for a long time, like providence, delve, tribute. The pos networks are insanely huge, and the corps have extreme industrial capabilities, and often maintain moon miners in the surrounding regions or even in totally different areas of the galaxy. If you have the bpos, the pos network, and the industrial capacity, you will make a load of cash, exploiting or not.
The Evoke-thing. Mh. Came unexpected to me. I wouldn't really call them an established alliance, though (because by established i mean spaceholding). We're now looking for the last corp involved in an alliance after evokes outing, and i still doubt that it will be one of the major players in spaceholding.
I know how the logistics and industrial side in them work. There's no need for exploits if you have worked years to perfect your production pipelines, you can still shit capitals very efficiently.
People in the know are pointing to this 2005 as an indication.
http://eve-search.com/thread/216634/page/2#47
Posted - 2005.09.01 16:30:00 - [47]
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Edited by: Maltroc on 01/09/2005 16:31:30
Originally by: kieron
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What Hakera said is spot on. The directives for claim reimbursement that CCP has given the GM team is the most fair based on the tools available. To be honest, most companies have a zero reimbursement policy, so EVE is a bit more free than the others.
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Kieron could you check your email (I know you receive loads and are quite busy
because our corp suffered from POS exploit some time ago. We petioned the event with quite a bit of evidence (fraps, howto).
The GM closed the petition while providing another "solution" for the events. This caused a lot of frustration. Their solution isn't possible the given game mechanics. A second unanswered petition is still going this ages without answer while the first was lost...
Now some days ago the same exploit happened again with another G POS.
Well you can guess that we are a bit frustrated since we provided information how it happened while we get told something that doesn't even work.
</understatement>
PS: I won't go into the details because it would just get the thread locked.
Now you see this is how EVE works. I read that as something that doesn't work and the GM gave them a work around which was no good. Now people in EVE are passing this off as proof of an exploit when it doesn't even read like one.
I was going to see if someone jumped on this as proof and went into an emo rage and then point out the obvious. The reason being people think what they want to think and see what they want to see, seriously make up your own mind after a bit of research and reasoning. It's not what happened that matters its how CCP deal with it.
hello guys... here iam
have a look at post #47 in this link and pay attention at the date^^
http://eve-search.com/thread/216634/page/2#47
edith say...hmpf the guy in 47 was faster^^
anyways its an important fact
'Exploits' like suicide ganking, nano abuse, dreads in high-sec and ghost training?
Oh yeah, CCP can be damn 'fast'...
Well, I still like my cheap T2 so I'm grabbing pretty much everything I can get my dirty little hands on.
I think I've spent approx. 750M in the last 24 hours on mass quantities of the T2 stuff I use on a regular basis. I know pretty much everyone with any significant amount of ISK in their wallet is doing the same - the markets will be picked clean before too much longer.
I was saving for a snake set, but they'll still be there (and at the same price) when this is all over.
And from what i read and saw, he is simply a liar. The player did not inform ccp, he just continued to exploit the bug until he got his arse busted, and then went all emo on the forums.
I haven't yet found a serious exploit in the game myself, but as i'm lurking around the test server a lot, i know how fast ccp can be regarding even relatively harmless exploits. I highly doubt that if they had known of the reaction bug they would have let it slip.
It all comes down to the players. If they encounter a bug that generates ressources out of thin air, then it's imho their responsibility to make sure that bug gets fixed asap, which means mailing / bugreporting it to ccp. As this has apparently not been done, it's fairly obvious to me that anyone claiming he reported that bug is simply a liar.
And so far i have not seen any proof of anyone that he reported this bug. Show me one and i will gladly eat my words..
you mean like all the major alliances which took advantage of the complex bugs which everyone knew about and which was conveniently ignored until *proof* was presented?
yeah, when the devs stop cheating, the players will stop cheating.
could we please get correspondent writers and moderators, on the eve forum at mmorpg.com, who are well-versed on eve-online and aren't just passersby pushing buttons? pretty please?