Those some people would not happen to be yourself? lol
Age of Conan is the biggest failure in the history of MMO's.
So, Asherons Call 2, Auto Assault and Tabula Rasa fared better?
Give me a break.
Look at THOSE games to see what failure is. AoC is not even close to that. Also, Funcom never had to take it's employees to the parking lot to fire them, unlike Sigil. I think you need to redefine failure if you think AoC is worse than these examples.
Originally posted by WargPest Originally posted by Scaredgirl Originally posted by WargPest Those some people would not happen to be yourself? lol
Actually many people think that, myself included. Both Vanguard and AoC failed big time but AoC was hyped up 10 times more and it was so far from what they promised that in my book it's the bigger failure. Age of Conan is the biggest failure in the history of MMO's.
lol. Ohh really..lol. Hey make another post about that Einstein.
What did you expect from WoW player .. check his post history and you will see what i mean .. he trolls in all other forums too and praise the almighty WoW.
Jackdog have some valid arguments and sometimes goes over the line with dying game etc..
Unfortunately the most damage is done by AoC fanbois with posts how everything is in order how servers are packed etc..
That kind attitude only feed the trolls..
Personally i really enjoy AoC and yes end game is rather lacking, current crafting system is ... , itemization is quite crappy, loot tables are .. etc...
On the other hand it have plenty of great things .. beside digital boobies .
PvE endgame wise I dont see AoC as good as LOTRO for at least a year.
I must say that story line, quests and dungeons from level 1 to 70 are really great however AoC major problem is its too SOLO friendly and people dont wanna hassle if they dont wanna group however that can leads to loneliness and bordem quickly. ( especially for those that dont even read the quest text etc.. )
The recent quests changes and quest they added really made a big impact on the game ..
Just a hint to maximize your leveling fun your really need group as much as possible.
So, Asherons Call 2, Auto Assault and Tabula Rasa fared better? Give me a break. Look at THOSE games to see what failure is. AoC is not even close to that. Also, Funcom never had to take it's employees to the parking lot to fire them, unlike Sigil. I think you need to redefine failure if you think AoC is worse than these examples.
You and I just define failure differently.
Using your logic the biggest MMO failure in the history was some game nobody has ever even heard of because it was shut down after 2 weeks of development.
I think AoC is the biggest failure because it was supposed to be this revolutionary "WoW killer". Instead it was unfinished, boring and same old mediocre MMO.
Also I believe no MMO in history has had 700k subs at launch, and then 90% of those players quit after a couple of months.
Pretty big failure in my books.
----------------------------- Originally posted by Frobner "Massive sieges" "mounted combat" and "spellweaving" are just few words that spring to mind when I hear the word AOC.... But the word FAILURE will always top the list.
Using your logic the biggest MMO failure in the history was some game nobody has ever even heard of because it was shut down after 2 weeks of development.
I think AoC is the biggest failure because it was supposed to be this revolutionary "WoW killer". Instead it was unfinished, boring and same old mediocre MMO.
Also I believe no MMO in history has had 700k subs at launch, and then 90% of those players quit after a couple of months.
Pretty big failure in my books.
My logic says that Vanguard, touted as the Everquest 2 that should have been made, is like a game in development for two weeks and failing?
As to "WoW killer", the only ones who stated AoC was to be a WoW killer were fanbois only (I am far from that). Yet, I have the skills to read the real information. Funcom never said this, and based on the specs needed for the game, and the type of game (Mature), no one would have been stupid to think AoC could beat a game that is made for kids as well as adults (with WoW garnering a larger kid population than most any other MMO), and can run on my Commodore 64.
As to the 90% loss statement, this is again anecdotal, with no real proof of just how many subs were lost. This is personal opinion, and until you can prove this with cold hard facts, I disagree. The best data we have is a 60% loss. That makes sense. And believe me, I have seen many other games lose this much or more after launch. There is no doubt servers are empty, but we also see sales ARE taking place, and as of today, a jump in play times and number of players on Xfire has been noted.
I still feel AC2, Vanguard are bigger failures. As a matter of fact, I would go so far as to call Tabula Rasa the biggest MMO failure. With over 6+ years in development, spending twice as much in development costs as AoC, and with the backing of a gaming legend, this game made Richard Garriott a laughing stock...so much so, he left the gaming business.
That is what we call failure. AoC is far from that.
The best data we have is a 60% loss. That makes sense. And believe me, I have seen many other games lose this much or more after launch.
After you say something like this, it's really hard for me to take you seriously. I guess you weren't there when the mass exodus started.
I wouldn't be surprised if 95% of original players have left.
----------------------------- Originally posted by Frobner "Massive sieges" "mounted combat" and "spellweaving" are just few words that spring to mind when I hear the word AOC.... But the word FAILURE will always top the list.
The best data we have is a 60% loss. That makes sense. And believe me, I have seen many other games lose this much or more after launch.
After you say something like this, it's really hard for me to take you seriously. I guess you weren't there when the mass exodus started.
I wouldn't be surprised if 95% of original players have left.
Yet, we are to take you seriously when you say that the game has a total of...30k players left? Again, my information is based on ACTUAL data, yours is based on ...opinion.
Until you can provide real evidence, I think my information is just a little more accurate as it is based on real evidence.
I'm glad things are looking better for AoC. I'm so tired of this constant bashing and "Failcom" shit.
I havn't played the game since launch, but I'll probably resub sometime in the near future to check it out, or if we're lucky they'll give out some free play-time, like some companies have been doing lately.
Yet, we are to take you seriously when you say that the game has a total of...30k players left? Again, my information is based on ACTUAL data, yours is based on ...opinion. Until you can provide real evidence, I think my information is just a little more accurate as it is based on real evidence. Try again when you have hard facts.
There is no "real evidence" about AoC subscription numbers.
My "real evidence" is based on what I've personally seen on EU servers and the fact that about 95% of Xfire users who have played AoC, don't play it anymore. I find it highly unlike that only Xfire users hate AoC while others love it.
What is your "real evidence"? Just a guess?
I said 95% of original players left. This is believe is the truth or very close to it. During the last 2 months some of them came back and I estimate AoC has about 70k subs at the moment.
AoC is a niche game and can probably survive with 50-70k subs but it will never get to 200k+ again.
----------------------------- Originally posted by Frobner "Massive sieges" "mounted combat" and "spellweaving" are just few words that spring to mind when I hear the word AOC.... But the word FAILURE will always top the list.
The sales numbers don't lie. Go check Amazon's PC sales list and you'll see that AOC is not even in the top 100!!!! EB Games:#176 LOL. 176. Yeah sales are brisk at EB games like some tool said earlier!! LOL Wal Mart: Not even in the top 50 (they only track the top 50 on their site)
Oh yeah, AOC is just flying off the shelves LOL!
Kind of like LOTRO...oh wait...#32 on Play.com and can we even find it on Amazon? Yet, no one is screaming it is closing?
Last year (2007) sales tracking showed LOTRO selling just a 1/3 of what AoC sold in 1 month.
The fact it is still selling, and the game has made leaps and bounds in it's stability and content means that overall it has more of a chance of holding on than most give it credit for.
People should sometimes just let the mistake go if the company makes strides to fix the main issues (unlike LOTRO which has made no strides to fix the major complaints so many have)...
I am impressed with the steps they have taken, and will be ready to load back up when DX10 and merges kick in.
Nice strawman argument there, open.
In case you don't know why I say that... Here's a hint: We're not discussing LoTRO here.
Though, with your long-lasting and beyond obsessive dislike of that game (even now, all this time later it seems), I'm not at all surprised that you're the one to introduce it to this thread.
Regardless... how well LoTRO is or isn't doing has nothing to do with AoC.
"If you just step away for a sec you will clearly see all the pot holes in the road, and the cash shop selling asphalt..." - Mimzel on F2P/Cash Shops
I'm glad things are looking better for AoC. I'm so tired of this constant bashing and "Failcom" shit. I havn't played the game since launch, but I'll probably resub sometime in the near future to check it out, or if we're lucky they'll give out some free play-time, like some companies have been doing lately.
I know aren't we all. But things are looking good though, it's pretty much just Scaredgrl and the other facets of this posters personalities that's still at it. I recently had 7 guys I played WOW like a year back to signing up for AoC. Intentse fun. I advice you to get hold of a friend and start this game. It's fun.
I know aren't we all. But things are looking good though, it's pretty much just Scaredgrl and the other facets of this posters personalities that's still at it. I recently had 7 guys I played WOW like a year back to signing up for AoC. Intentse fun. I advice you to get hold of a friend and start this game. It's fun.
Again with the conspiracy theories. If someone dislikes AoC he must have multiple forum accounts or something, right? I mean, it couldn't be that someone dislikes the game because the game sucks, right?
I wouldn't recommend AoC to any of my friends. I did it a launch and got 4 of my friends to play. All of them quit because of boring pvp and went back to Guild Wars. I doubt they will ever listen to my recommendations again
It's funny how some of our regular posters always finish their post with "Go and buy the game please, it's fun!!"
----------------------------- Originally posted by Frobner "Massive sieges" "mounted combat" and "spellweaving" are just few words that spring to mind when I hear the word AOC.... But the word FAILURE will always top the list.
I know aren't we all. But things are looking good though, it's pretty much just Scaredgrl and the other facets of this posters personalities that's still at it. I recently had 7 guys I played WOW like a year back to signing up for AoC. Intentse fun. I advice you to get hold of a friend and start this game. It's fun.
Again with the conspiracy theories. If someone dislikes AoC he must have multiple forum accounts or something, right? I mean, it couldn't be that someone dislikes the game because the game sucks, right?
I wouldn't recommend AoC to any of my friends. I did it a launch and got 4 of my friends to play. All of them quit because of boring pvp and went back to Guild Wars. I doubt they will ever listen to my recommendations again
It's funny how some of our regular posters always finish their post with "Go and buy the game please, it's fun!!"
Sure, what ever Donald. People post stuff like this..
I know aren't we all. But things are looking good though, it's pretty much just Scaredgrl and the other facets of this posters personalities that's still at it. I recently had 7 guys I played WOW like a year back to signing up for AoC. Intentse fun. I advice you to get hold of a friend and start this game. It's fun.
Again with the conspiracy theories. If someone dislikes AoC he must have multiple forum accounts or something, right? I mean, it couldn't be that someone dislikes the game because the game sucks, right?
I wouldn't recommend AoC to any of my friends. I did it a launch and got 4 of my friends to play. All of them quit because of boring pvp and went back to Guild Wars. I doubt they will ever listen to my recommendations again
It's funny how some of our regular posters always finish their post with "Go and buy the game please, it's fun!!"
Sure, what ever Donald. People post stuff like this..
because you know what this game is seriously no fun at all. lol
And if you look at the TR and VG forums, you will see 'players' posting the same thing. " OMG, this game is so awesome, they fixed everything... please come back and give it a try". How many 'petitions' have we seeon on the TR forums begging someone to buy the game because it is so good and has such a loyal (and stable) playerbase. There are always fanbois who go down with the ship.
The truth is in the servers. There are 4 servers in NA that have a decent population. None of those 'good' servers consistently have more than one instance of any zone.
Yes, you can run around and take really pretty screenshots (just don't use anything that includes animations). That does not mean anything about the game being good or that players are coming.
And Famine can lead those 40-50k subscribers to 'vote' on obscure polls and maybe even win them. They can start 10 threads a week on these forums saying " come back and give it another try". But the proof is in the servers. 4 servers with players, none packed.
There is no "real evidence" about AoC subscription numbers.
Correct. This is why your estimation of 95% left the game is YOUR opinion.
My "real evidence" is based on what I've personally seen on EU servers and the fact that about 95% of Xfire users who have played AoC, don't play it anymore. I find it highly unlike that only Xfire users hate AoC while others love it.
Again, you state 95% of Xfire players. So, if we take their current ratings on Xfire, and compare it to say...Tabula Rasa, this means Tabula Rasa had a 200%+ loss...can you possibly tell me how this math works?
What is your "real evidence"? Just a guess?
The ONLY data we have, which is the last report from Funcom on subscribers. Even if we take that and half it, we still have 200k users. AGAIN this is not 90 or 95%. So, still your data is "opinion" and mine is based on last known data. As well, we again see on Xfire a rise in users, and according to the original OP here, play.com has shown the game selling well thanks to their discount.
I said 95% of original players left. This is believe is the truth or very close to it. During the last 2 months some of them came back and I estimate AoC has about 70k subs at the moment.
This is usually called "random math" We can all make up numbers to our hearts desire, but we will never be precise. Instead I will take the current information I have based on real world mathematics, and not Scaredgirl math, and estimate maybe 100-200k players...but, really, NO ONE knows for sure. But, based on the last report, and calculations using Xfire compared to other titles and their subscriber numbers, I have a feeling that all servers have more than you are giving credit for.
AoC is a niche game and can probably survive with 50-70k subs but it will never get to 200k+ again.
EvE is a niche game, City of Heroes is niche and LOTRO is niche...do you believe based on your math skills that they ALSO have 50-70k players? Or can we use better data, like NCSoft has listed CoH at around 150k+ players.
The FACT is you do not know if AoC can ever reach 200k again. YOUR opinion is it will not.
In case you don't know why I say that... Here's a hint: We're not discussing LoTRO here. Actually we were, as a statement was made that now that AoC is 9.99, it is doomed to fail, yet the argument was that LOTRO did EXACTLY the same thing (and I know of no other game to do this yet, so the reason for the LOTRO mention), thus, the comparison was for two niche games that after 6 months went down to 9.99 Regardless... how well LoTRO is or isn't doing has nothing to do with AoC. Actually, LOTRO was not the only game mentioned, but you seem to have made this an LOTRO argument. Tabula Rasa, Vanguard, Auto Assault, Asherons Call 2, DDO, and many others have all been mentioned here. Why no argument for these titles being mentioned? The fact remains, many "niche" titles continue to live to this day, and a mark down to 9.99 does not equal death . Of course, a mark down to .96 cents DOES equal death (Tabula Rasa hit that price point on Amazon a month before the closure announcement)
We are staying on topic, so please try not to derail the thread...
In case you don't know why I say that... Here's a hint: We're not discussing LoTRO here. Actually we were, as a statement was made that now that AoC is 9.99, it is doomed to fail, yet the argument was that LOTRO did EXACTLY the same thing (and I know of no other game to do this yet, so the reason for the LOTRO mention), thus, the comparison was for two niche games that after 6 months went down to 9.99 Regardless... how well LoTRO is or isn't doing has nothing to do with AoC. Actually, LOTRO was not the only game mentioned, but you seem to have made this an LOTRO argument. Tabula Rasa, Vanguard, Auto Assault, Asherons Call 2, DDO, and many others have all been mentioned here. Why no argument for these titles being mentioned? The fact remains, many "niche" titles continue to live to this day, and a mark down to 9.99 does not equal death . Of course, a mark down to .96 cents DOES equal death (Tabula Rasa hit that price point on Amazon a month before the closure announcement)
We are staying on topic, so please try not to derail the thread...
Thanks
Yes, let's stick to the point that the OP used some obscure website that nobody ever heard of to point to a top 20 showing for AOC when every other mainstream site hasn't showed AOC in the top 100 since May.
Yes, let's stick to the point that the OP used some obscure website that nobody ever heard of to point to a top 20 showing for AOC when every other mainstream site hasn't showed AOC in the top 100 since May. http://www.amazon.com/gp/bestsellers/videogames/229575/ref=pd_zg_hrsr_vg_1_2 Amazon currently has it as the #1642 best-selling video game last week
I dunno.. I don't buy my computer games at amazon either.
Does Best Buy or EBGames/Gamestop keep a ranking?
I wanted to list Frys as part of that question but then remembered when I lived on the east coast we didn't have any.
Nah, nobody else really has a top 100 list except Amazon and B&N. Occassionally NPD's weekly charts get released, which are supposed to be 'all retailers' but they only include the top 10.
Walmart has a top #50 (no AOC) also on their website.. but not sure if it is internet orders or in-store purchases. It's nearly identical to amazons for at least the top 25.
Yes, let's stick to the point that the OP used some obscure website that nobody ever heard of to point to a top 20 showing for AOC when every other mainstream site hasn't showed AOC in the top 100 since May. http://www.amazon.com/gp/bestsellers/videogames/229575/ref=pd_zg_hrsr_vg_1_2 Amazon currently has it as the #1642 best-selling video game last week
Ah yes, a narrow minded US citizen approach. Play.com is NOT "obscure".
Play.com is the EU equivalent of an online Fry's, Best Buy, etc,
To give you an idea of traffic for Play.com, they actually have an average of 269k USA visitors per month. So, how do you think the EU data looks? (averages based on Quantcast at http://www.quantcast.com/play.com#traffic )
And overall, this is NOT the point. The point is, if AoC goes on sale, people would buy it. And believe it or not, people are still interested no matter how much people wish others were not....
AmazingAveryAge of Conan AdvocateMemberUncommonPosts: 7,188
Originally posted by Azrile
Originally posted by openedge1
Originally posted by WSIMike
In case you don't know why I say that... Here's a hint: We're not discussing LoTRO here. Actually we were, as a statement was made that now that AoC is 9.99, it is doomed to fail, yet the argument was that LOTRO did EXACTLY the same thing (and I know of no other game to do this yet, so the reason for the LOTRO mention), thus, the comparison was for two niche games that after 6 months went down to 9.99 Regardless... how well LoTRO is or isn't doing has nothing to do with AoC. Actually, LOTRO was not the only game mentioned, but you seem to have made this an LOTRO argument. Tabula Rasa, Vanguard, Auto Assault, Asherons Call 2, DDO, and many others have all been mentioned here. Why no argument for these titles being mentioned? The fact remains, many "niche" titles continue to live to this day, and a mark down to 9.99 does not equal death . Of course, a mark down to .96 cents DOES equal death (Tabula Rasa hit that price point on Amazon a month before the closure announcement)
We are staying on topic, so please try not to derail the thread...
Thanks
Yes, let's stick to the point that the OP used some obscure website that nobody ever heard of to point to a top 20 showing for AOC when every other mainstream site hasn't showed AOC in the top 100 since May.
Amazon currently has it as the #1642 best-selling video game last week
Play.com services UK / France / Germany amongst other countries in Europe. Before I moved to Canada I ordered all my games from there. It has been around 10 yrs. No doubt N.A friends have not heard of the site just like I never heard of Target, best buy, future shop, circuit city etc etc before moving here. You also have to get clued up that individual countries have their extension at the end of Amazon. Most of the people I played with in European guilds brought from play.com too as they offer free shipping.
"Amazon.co.uk" shows:
Amazon.co.uk Sales Rank: 942 in PC & Video Games (See Bestsellers in PC & Video Games)
Popular in this category: #15 in PC & Video Games > PC & Macintosh > Games > Role Playing
WoW, Guild Wars and EQ2 in that top 50 (no Warhammer or LOTRO either...)
So, overall, the lists mean nothing except to note that out of all oddities, AoC is selling well in the EU and in the US for some reason people still are buying Fable 1 at Walmart...
Yes, let's stick to the point that the OP used some obscure website that nobody ever heard of to point to a top 20 showing for AOC when every other mainstream site hasn't showed AOC in the top 100 since May. http://www.amazon.com/gp/bestsellers/videogames/229575/ref=pd_zg_hrsr_vg_1_2 Amazon currently has it as the #1642 best-selling video game last week
Ah yes, a narrow minded US citizen approach. Play.com is NOT "obscure".
Play.com is the EU equivalent of an online Fry's, Best Buy, etc,
To give you an idea of traffic for Play.com, they actually have an average of 269k USA visitors per month. So, how do you think the EU data looks? (averages based on Quantcast at http://www.quantcast.com/play.com#traffic )
And overall, this is NOT the point. The point is, if AoC goes on sale, people would buy it. And believe it or not, people are still interested no matter how much people wish others were not....
I agree AoC has come a long way from the initial launch. In regards to sales, you have WoW and others. AoC continues to generate interest because of the quality of the graphics engine as well as the reactive play style.
In regards to xfile, Wrath has nearly 5 mill in sales so far but only accounts for less than 10% of WoW users on xfire? Xfire users are folks who tend to be willing to allow spyware on their machine in return for a very minimal bonus playtime. The numbers thus will be highly skewed towards lower income brackets.
Well, I visited the VG forums every now and then and VG does have new players joining every day so it isnt just a monthly charge.
I was in Target store a week ago and saw AoC in the clearence bin for $9.98, which would put it as the same price as VG. I look at the comparison between VG and AoC like this:
Vanguard went from 240k subs to 50k subs in about 6 months. That would come out to be roughly 1 out of every 5 players stayed with the game.
AoC went from 800k to 50k-150k in about 6 months. That would come out to be roughly 1 out of every 10 players stayed with the game.
If we look at it that way it would seem that AoC failed even more than VG. You may not agree with me,and thats alright, but FC is just as bad as SOE and both companies are looked upon as "game-killers" in the MMO industry.
In pretty much every aspect, AoC is just as bad as Vanguard.
Coming up on the 2 year aniversary for VG and the game is still around the 40K sub mark. That is still about a 20% retention rate from Launch.
AoC is currently at about a 10% retention rate from their Launch numbers.
Some people may even say that AoC has fared more badly than VG ever did.
I'm actually one of those new people that have joined. If you want to buy the game in store I believe the game is $20, but if you have the paticence to download the game (takes about 4hrs) you only pay $16/mo which is the monthly fee.
I don't disagree with you entirely, execpt that AoC was hyped up, VG not so much because sony took it over.
I'm actually one of those new people that have joined. If you want to buy the game in store I believe the game is $20, but if you have the paticence to download the game (takes about 4hrs) you only pay $16/mo which is the monthly fee.
I don't disagree with you entirely, execpt that AoC was hyped up, VG not so much because sony took it over.
Gamespy awarded Vanguard the "Biggest Disappointment" award for 2007
Vanguard also won the awards in the categories for "Least Fun", "Most Desolate" and "Lamest Launch" in the MMORPG.com MMOWTF Awards for the worst games of 2007
The fact that most Everquest players considered Vanguard the "true" EQ2, yea...we are talking major hype here.
There is no doubt, comparisons will exist. My difference is, progress has already been made on AoC in 6 months..Vanguard took almost 2 years.
In case you don't know why I say that... Here's a hint: We're not discussing LoTRO here. Actually we were, as a statement was made that now that AoC is 9.99, it is doomed to fail, yet the argument was that LOTRO did EXACTLY the same thing (and I know of no other game to do this yet, so the reason for the LOTRO mention), thus, the comparison was for two niche games that after 6 months went down to 9.99 Regardless... how well LoTRO is or isn't doing has nothing to do with AoC. Actually, LOTRO was not the only game mentioned, but you seem to have made this an LOTRO argument. Tabula Rasa, Vanguard, Auto Assault, Asherons Call 2, DDO, and many others have all been mentioned here. Why no argument for these titles being mentioned? The fact remains, many "niche" titles continue to live to this day, and a mark down to 9.99 does not equal death . Of course, a mark down to .96 cents DOES equal death (Tabula Rasa hit that price point on Amazon a month before the closure announcement)
We are staying on topic, so please try not to derail the thread...
Thanks
Yes, let's stick to the point that the OP used some obscure website that nobody ever heard of to point to a top 20 showing for AOC when every other mainstream site hasn't showed AOC in the top 100 since May.
Amazon currently has it as the #1642 best-selling video game last week
Play.com services UK / France / Germany amongst other countries in Europe. Before I moved to Canada I ordered all my games from there. It has been around 10 yrs. No doubt N.A friends have not heard of the site just like I never heard of Target, best buy, future shop, circuit city etc etc before moving here. You also have to get clued up that individual countries have their extension at the end of Amazon. Most of the people I played with in European guilds brought from play.com too as they offer free shipping.
"Amazon.co.uk" shows:
Amazon.co.uk Sales Rank: 942 in PC & Video Games (See Bestsellers in PC & Video Games)
Popular in this category: #15 in PC & Video Games > PC & Macintosh > Games > Role Playing
Number 2 website behind Amazon.co.uk is no obscurity, ranked 15th in role play and 942 in games.
Amazon.co.uk has it for £7.99 as well a move dictated by play.com dropping the price for holiday sale
You notice something odd about where AOC is listed? > games> adventure Funny that Warhammer, WOW, LOTRO are all in a different catagory. So if you go by the overall listing.. it is ranked #942 on amazon.com.uk and ranked #1600 on the USA Amazon.com and is substantially behind both LOTRO and Warhammer, which are substantially behind even Vanilla WOW.
I"m not sure why AOC is the only MMORPG not listed with the rest of them.
Comments
Age of Conan is the biggest failure in the history of MMO's.
So, Asherons Call 2, Auto Assault and Tabula Rasa fared better?
Give me a break.
Look at THOSE games to see what failure is. AoC is not even close to that. Also, Funcom never had to take it's employees to the parking lot to fire them, unlike Sigil. I think you need to redefine failure if you think AoC is worse than these examples.
Actually many people think that, myself included.
Both Vanguard and AoC failed big time but AoC was hyped up 10 times more and it was so far from what they promised that in my book it's the bigger failure.
Age of Conan is the biggest failure in the history of MMO's.
lol. Ohh really..lol. Hey make another post about that Einstein.
What did you expect from WoW player .. check his post history and you will see what i mean .. he trolls in all other forums too and praise the almighty WoW.
Jackdog have some valid arguments and sometimes goes over the line with dying game etc..
Unfortunately the most damage is done by AoC fanbois with posts how everything is in order how servers are packed etc..
That kind attitude only feed the trolls..
Personally i really enjoy AoC and yes end game is rather lacking, current crafting system is ... , itemization is quite crappy, loot tables are .. etc...
On the other hand it have plenty of great things .. beside digital boobies
.
PvE endgame wise I dont see AoC as good as LOTRO for at least a year.
I must say that story line, quests and dungeons from level 1 to 70 are really great however AoC major problem is its too SOLO friendly and people dont wanna hassle if they dont wanna group however that can leads to loneliness and bordem quickly. ( especially for those that dont even read the quest text etc.. )
The recent quests changes and quest they added really made a big impact on the game ..
Just a hint to maximize your leveling fun your really need group as much as possible.
Futilez[Do You Have What It Takes ?]
You and I just define failure differently.
Using your logic the biggest MMO failure in the history was some game nobody has ever even heard of because it was shut down after 2 weeks of development.
I think AoC is the biggest failure because it was supposed to be this revolutionary "WoW killer". Instead it was unfinished, boring and same old mediocre MMO.
Also I believe no MMO in history has had 700k subs at launch, and then 90% of those players quit after a couple of months.
Pretty big failure in my books.
-----------------------------
Originally posted by Frobner
"Massive sieges" "mounted combat" and "spellweaving" are just few words that spring to mind when I hear the word AOC.... But the word FAILURE will always top the list.
You and I just define failure differently.
Using your logic the biggest MMO failure in the history was some game nobody has ever even heard of because it was shut down after 2 weeks of development.
I think AoC is the biggest failure because it was supposed to be this revolutionary "WoW killer". Instead it was unfinished, boring and same old mediocre MMO.
Also I believe no MMO in history has had 700k subs at launch, and then 90% of those players quit after a couple of months.
Pretty big failure in my books.
My logic says that Vanguard, touted as the Everquest 2 that should have been made, is like a game in development for two weeks and failing?
As to "WoW killer", the only ones who stated AoC was to be a WoW killer were fanbois only (I am far from that). Yet, I have the skills to read the real information. Funcom never said this, and based on the specs needed for the game, and the type of game (Mature), no one would have been stupid to think AoC could beat a game that is made for kids as well as adults (with WoW garnering a larger kid population than most any other MMO), and can run on my Commodore 64.
As to the 90% loss statement, this is again anecdotal, with no real proof of just how many subs were lost. This is personal opinion, and until you can prove this with cold hard facts, I disagree. The best data we have is a 60% loss. That makes sense. And believe me, I have seen many other games lose this much or more after launch. There is no doubt servers are empty, but we also see sales ARE taking place, and as of today, a jump in play times and number of players on Xfire has been noted.
I still feel AC2, Vanguard are bigger failures. As a matter of fact, I would go so far as to call Tabula Rasa the biggest MMO failure. With over 6+ years in development, spending twice as much in development costs as AoC, and with the backing of a gaming legend, this game made Richard Garriott a laughing stock...so much so, he left the gaming business.
That is what we call failure. AoC is far from that.
After you say something like this, it's really hard for me to take you seriously. I guess you weren't there when the mass exodus started.
I wouldn't be surprised if 95% of original players have left.
-----------------------------
Originally posted by Frobner
"Massive sieges" "mounted combat" and "spellweaving" are just few words that spring to mind when I hear the word AOC.... But the word FAILURE will always top the list.
After you say something like this, it's really hard for me to take you seriously. I guess you weren't there when the mass exodus started.
I wouldn't be surprised if 95% of original players have left.
Yet, we are to take you seriously when you say that the game has a total of...30k players left? Again, my information is based on ACTUAL data, yours is based on ...opinion.
Until you can provide real evidence, I think my information is just a little more accurate as it is based on real evidence.
Try again when you have hard facts.
I'm glad things are looking better for AoC. I'm so tired of this constant bashing and "Failcom" shit.
I havn't played the game since launch, but I'll probably resub sometime in the near future to check it out, or if we're lucky they'll give out some free play-time, like some companies have been doing lately.
There is no "real evidence" about AoC subscription numbers.
My "real evidence" is based on what I've personally seen on EU servers and the fact that about 95% of Xfire users who have played AoC, don't play it anymore. I find it highly unlike that only Xfire users hate AoC while others love it.
What is your "real evidence"? Just a guess?
I said 95% of original players left. This is believe is the truth or very close to it. During the last 2 months some of them came back and I estimate AoC has about 70k subs at the moment.
AoC is a niche game and can probably survive with 50-70k subs but it will never get to 200k+ again.
-----------------------------
Originally posted by Frobner
"Massive sieges" "mounted combat" and "spellweaving" are just few words that spring to mind when I hear the word AOC.... But the word FAILURE will always top the list.
Kind of like LOTRO...oh wait...#32 on Play.com and can we even find it on Amazon? Yet, no one is screaming it is closing?
Last year (2007) sales tracking showed LOTRO selling just a 1/3 of what AoC sold in 1 month.
The fact it is still selling, and the game has made leaps and bounds in it's stability and content means that overall it has more of a chance of holding on than most give it credit for.
People should sometimes just let the mistake go if the company makes strides to fix the main issues (unlike LOTRO which has made no strides to fix the major complaints so many have)...
I am impressed with the steps they have taken, and will be ready to load back up when DX10 and merges kick in.
Nice strawman argument there, open.
In case you don't know why I say that... Here's a hint: We're not discussing LoTRO here.
Though, with your long-lasting and beyond obsessive dislike of that game (even now, all this time later it seems), I'm not at all surprised that you're the one to introduce it to this thread.
Regardless... how well LoTRO is or isn't doing has nothing to do with AoC.
and the cash shop selling asphalt..." - Mimzel on F2P/Cash Shops
I know aren't we all. But things are looking good though, it's pretty much just Scaredgrl and the other facets of this posters personalities that's still at it. I recently had 7 guys I played WOW like a year back to signing up for AoC. Intentse fun. I advice you to get hold of a friend and start this game. It's fun.
Again with the conspiracy theories. If someone dislikes AoC he must have multiple forum accounts or something, right? I mean, it couldn't be that someone dislikes the game because the game sucks, right?
I wouldn't recommend AoC to any of my friends. I did it a launch and got 4 of my friends to play. All of them quit because of boring pvp and went back to Guild Wars. I doubt they will ever listen to my recommendations again
It's funny how some of our regular posters always finish their post with "Go and buy the game please, it's fun!!"
-----------------------------
Originally posted by Frobner
"Massive sieges" "mounted combat" and "spellweaving" are just few words that spring to mind when I hear the word AOC.... But the word FAILURE will always top the list.
Again with the conspiracy theories. If someone dislikes AoC he must have multiple forum accounts or something, right? I mean, it couldn't be that someone dislikes the game because the game sucks, right?
I wouldn't recommend AoC to any of my friends. I did it a launch and got 4 of my friends to play. All of them quit because of boring pvp and went back to Guild Wars. I doubt they will ever listen to my recommendations again
It's funny how some of our regular posters always finish their post with "Go and buy the game please, it's fun!!"
Sure, what ever Donald. People post stuff like this..
forums-eu.ageofconan.com/showthread.php
forums-eu.ageofconan.com/showthread.php
because you know what this game is seriously no fun at all. lol
Again with the conspiracy theories. If someone dislikes AoC he must have multiple forum accounts or something, right? I mean, it couldn't be that someone dislikes the game because the game sucks, right?
I wouldn't recommend AoC to any of my friends. I did it a launch and got 4 of my friends to play. All of them quit because of boring pvp and went back to Guild Wars. I doubt they will ever listen to my recommendations again
It's funny how some of our regular posters always finish their post with "Go and buy the game please, it's fun!!"
Sure, what ever Donald. People post stuff like this..
forums-eu.ageofconan.com/showthread.php
forums-eu.ageofconan.com/showthread.php
because you know what this game is seriously no fun at all. lol
And if you look at the TR and VG forums, you will see 'players' posting the same thing. " OMG, this game is so awesome, they fixed everything... please come back and give it a try". How many 'petitions' have we seeon on the TR forums begging someone to buy the game because it is so good and has such a loyal (and stable) playerbase. There are always fanbois who go down with the ship.
The truth is in the servers. There are 4 servers in NA that have a decent population. None of those 'good' servers consistently have more than one instance of any zone.
Yes, you can run around and take really pretty screenshots (just don't use anything that includes animations). That does not mean anything about the game being good or that players are coming.
And Famine can lead those 40-50k subscribers to 'vote' on obscure polls and maybe even win them. They can start 10 threads a week on these forums saying " come back and give it another try". But the proof is in the servers. 4 servers with players, none packed.
There is no "real evidence" about AoC subscription numbers.
Correct. This is why your estimation of 95% left the game is YOUR opinion.
My "real evidence" is based on what I've personally seen on EU servers and the fact that about 95% of Xfire users who have played AoC, don't play it anymore. I find it highly unlike that only Xfire users hate AoC while others love it.
Again, you state 95% of Xfire players. So, if we take their current ratings on Xfire, and compare it to say...Tabula Rasa, this means Tabula Rasa had a 200%+ loss...can you possibly tell me how this math works?
What is your "real evidence"? Just a guess?
The ONLY data we have, which is the last report from Funcom on subscribers. Even if we take that and half it, we still have 200k users. AGAIN this is not 90 or 95%. So, still your data is "opinion" and mine is based on last known data. As well, we again see on Xfire a rise in users, and according to the original OP here, play.com has shown the game selling well thanks to their discount.
I said 95% of original players left. This is believe is the truth or very close to it. During the last 2 months some of them came back and I estimate AoC has about 70k subs at the moment.
This is usually called "random math" We can all make up numbers to our hearts desire, but we will never be precise. Instead I will take the current information I have based on real world mathematics, and not Scaredgirl math, and estimate maybe 100-200k players...but, really, NO ONE knows for sure. But, based on the last report, and calculations using Xfire compared to other titles and their subscriber numbers, I have a feeling that all servers have more than you are giving credit for.
AoC is a niche game and can probably survive with 50-70k subs but it will never get to 200k+ again.
EvE is a niche game, City of Heroes is niche and LOTRO is niche...do you believe based on your math skills that they ALSO have 50-70k players? Or can we use better data, like NCSoft has listed CoH at around 150k+ players.
The FACT is you do not know if AoC can ever reach 200k again. YOUR opinion is it will not.
All we can REALLY do is wait and see.
We are staying on topic, so please try not to derail the thread...
Thanks
We are staying on topic, so please try not to derail the thread...
Thanks
Yes, let's stick to the point that the OP used some obscure website that nobody ever heard of to point to a top 20 showing for AOC when every other mainstream site hasn't showed AOC in the top 100 since May.
http://www.amazon.com/gp/bestsellers/videogames/229575/ref=pd_zg_hrsr_vg_1_2
Amazon currently has it as the #1642 best-selling video game last week
I dunno.. I don't buy my computer games at amazon either.
Does Best Buy or EBGames/Gamestop keep a ranking?
I wanted to list Frys as part of that question but then remembered when I lived on the east coast we didn't have any.
Nah, nobody else really has a top 100 list except Amazon and B&N. Occassionally NPD's weekly charts get released, which are supposed to be 'all retailers' but they only include the top 10.
Walmart has a top #50 (no AOC) also on their website.. but not sure if it is internet orders or in-store purchases. It's nearly identical to amazons for at least the top 25.
Ah yes, a narrow minded US citizen approach. Play.com is NOT "obscure".
Play.com is the EU equivalent of an online Fry's, Best Buy, etc,
To give you an idea of traffic for Play.com, they actually have an average of 269k USA visitors per month. So, how do you think the EU data looks? (averages based on Quantcast at http://www.quantcast.com/play.com#traffic )
And overall, this is NOT the point. The point is, if AoC goes on sale, people would buy it. And believe it or not, people are still interested no matter how much people wish others were not....
We are staying on topic, so please try not to derail the thread...
Thanks
Yes, let's stick to the point that the OP used some obscure website that nobody ever heard of to point to a top 20 showing for AOC when every other mainstream site hasn't showed AOC in the top 100 since May.
http://www.amazon.com/gp/bestsellers/videogames/229575/ref=pd_zg_hrsr_vg_1_2
Amazon currently has it as the #1642 best-selling video game last week
Play.com services UK / France / Germany amongst other countries in Europe. Before I moved to Canada I ordered all my games from there. It has been around 10 yrs. No doubt N.A friends have not heard of the site just like I never heard of Target, best buy, future shop, circuit city etc etc before moving here. You also have to get clued up that individual countries have their extension at the end of Amazon. Most of the people I played with in European guilds brought from play.com too as they offer free shipping.
"Amazon.co.uk" shows:
Amazon.co.uk Sales Rank: 942 in PC & Video Games (See Bestsellers in PC & Video Games)
Popular in this category: #15 in PC & Video Games > PC & Macintosh > Games > Role Playing
In Germany:
Amazon.de Verkaufsrang: #1.598 in Games (Die Bestseller Games)
Beliebt in diesen Kategorien:
#20 in Games > Computerspiele > Adventures & Rollenspiele > Online Rollenspiele > Spiele
#66 in Games > Computerspiele > Adventures & Rollenspiele > Rollenspiele
In France:
Classement parmi les ventes Amazon.fr : 99.384 en Livres (Voir les Meilleures Ventes dans la rubrique Livres)
Et très apprécié dans ces rubriques :
n°6 dans la rubrique Livres > Informatique et Internet > Jeux > Solutions
n°25 dans la rubrique Livres > Informatique et Internet > Jeux > Informatique
n°34 dans la rubrique Livres > Informatique et Internet > Internet > Guides
Play.com is no obscurity, just because you don't know nothing about it doesn't make it obscure.
From this time last year:
The strong figures confirm industry predictions of a bumper online Christmas. IMRG, the online retailers' association, estimates that online sales over December could hit around £7bn. Some £84m was spent online on Christmas Day alone, the IMRG said. Play.com is a rare survivor of the dotcom boom, having been founded in 1998. The privately-owned company is now the second largest site in the UK after Amazon.co.uk, owned by US giant Amazon.com.
Number 2 website behind Amazon.co.uk is no obscurity, ranked 15th in role play and 942 in games.
Amazon.co.uk has it for £7.99 as well a move dictated by play.com dropping the price for holiday sale
And only has
WoW, Guild Wars and EQ2 in that top 50 (no Warhammer or LOTRO either...)
So, overall, the lists mean nothing except to note that out of all oddities, AoC is selling well in the EU and in the US for some reason people still are buying Fable 1 at Walmart...
Weird eh?
Ah yes, a narrow minded US citizen approach. Play.com is NOT "obscure".
Play.com is the EU equivalent of an online Fry's, Best Buy, etc,
To give you an idea of traffic for Play.com, they actually have an average of 269k USA visitors per month. So, how do you think the EU data looks? (averages based on Quantcast at http://www.quantcast.com/play.com#traffic )
And overall, this is NOT the point. The point is, if AoC goes on sale, people would buy it. And believe it or not, people are still interested no matter how much people wish others were not....
I agree AoC has come a long way from the initial launch. In regards to sales, you have WoW and others. AoC continues to generate interest because of the quality of the graphics engine as well as the reactive play style.
In regards to xfile, Wrath has nearly 5 mill in sales so far but only accounts for less than 10% of WoW users on xfire? Xfire users are folks who tend to be willing to allow spyware on their machine in return for a very minimal bonus playtime. The numbers thus will be highly skewed towards lower income brackets.
I'm actually one of those new people that have joined. If you want to buy the game in store I believe the game is $20, but if you have the paticence to download the game (takes about 4hrs) you only pay $16/mo which is the monthly fee.
I don't disagree with you entirely, execpt that AoC was hyped up, VG not so much because sony took it over.
Games:
Currently playing:Nothing
Will play: Darkfall: Unholy Wars
Past games:
Guild Wars 2 - Xpiher Duminous
Xpiher's GW2
GW 1 - Xpiher Duminous
Darkfall - Xpiher Duminous (NA) retired
AoC - Xpiher (Tyranny) retired
Warhammer - Xpiher
I'm actually one of those new people that have joined. If you want to buy the game in store I believe the game is $20, but if you have the paticence to download the game (takes about 4hrs) you only pay $16/mo which is the monthly fee.
I don't disagree with you entirely, execpt that AoC was hyped up, VG not so much because sony took it over.
Read this to get an idea of the hype for Vanguard
Wikipedia
Gamespy awarded Vanguard the "Biggest Disappointment" award for 2007
Vanguard also won the awards in the categories for "Least Fun", "Most Desolate" and "Lamest Launch" in the MMORPG.com MMOWTF Awards for the worst games of 2007
The fact that most Everquest players considered Vanguard the "true" EQ2, yea...we are talking major hype here.
There is no doubt, comparisons will exist. My difference is, progress has already been made on AoC in 6 months..Vanguard took almost 2 years.
We are staying on topic, so please try not to derail the thread...
Thanks
Yes, let's stick to the point that the OP used some obscure website that nobody ever heard of to point to a top 20 showing for AOC when every other mainstream site hasn't showed AOC in the top 100 since May.
http://www.amazon.com/gp/bestsellers/videogames/229575/ref=pd_zg_hrsr_vg_1_2
Amazon currently has it as the #1642 best-selling video game last week
Play.com services UK / France / Germany amongst other countries in Europe. Before I moved to Canada I ordered all my games from there. It has been around 10 yrs. No doubt N.A friends have not heard of the site just like I never heard of Target, best buy, future shop, circuit city etc etc before moving here. You also have to get clued up that individual countries have their extension at the end of Amazon. Most of the people I played with in European guilds brought from play.com too as they offer free shipping.
"Amazon.co.uk" shows:
Amazon.co.uk Sales Rank: 942 in PC & Video Games (See Bestsellers in PC & Video Games)
Popular in this category: #15 in PC & Video Games > PC & Macintosh > Games > Role Playing
In Germany:
Amazon.de Verkaufsrang: #1.598 in Games (Die Bestseller Games)
Beliebt in diesen Kategorien:
#20 in Games > Computerspiele > Adventures & Rollenspiele > Online Rollenspiele > Spiele
#66 in Games > Computerspiele > Adventures & Rollenspiele > Rollenspiele
In France:
Classement parmi les ventes Amazon.fr : 99.384 en Livres (Voir les Meilleures Ventes dans la rubrique Livres)
Et très apprécié dans ces rubriques :
n°6 dans la rubrique Livres > Informatique et Internet > Jeux > Solutions
n°25 dans la rubrique Livres > Informatique et Internet > Jeux > Informatique
n°34 dans la rubrique Livres > Informatique et Internet > Internet > Guides
Play.com is no obscurity, just because you don't know nothing about it doesn't make it obscure.
From this time last year:
The strong figures confirm industry predictions of a bumper online Christmas. IMRG, the online retailers' association, estimates that online sales over December could hit around £7bn. Some £84m was spent online on Christmas Day alone, the IMRG said. Play.com is a rare survivor of the dotcom boom, having been founded in 1998. The privately-owned company is now the second largest site in the UK after Amazon.co.uk, owned by US giant Amazon.com.
Number 2 website behind Amazon.co.uk is no obscurity, ranked 15th in role play and 942 in games.
Amazon.co.uk has it for £7.99 as well a move dictated by play.com dropping the price for holiday sale
You notice something odd about where AOC is listed? > games> adventure Funny that Warhammer, WOW, LOTRO are all in a different catagory. So if you go by the overall listing.. it is ranked #942 on amazon.com.uk and ranked #1600 on the USA Amazon.com and is substantially behind both LOTRO and Warhammer, which are substantially behind even Vanilla WOW.
I"m not sure why AOC is the only MMORPG not listed with the rest of them.