That is like saying Warhammer Online startet development in 1983. It's still the same name and some things carried over, right ? And it's 6 years, not 5.
Actually its been in development for 9 years. And they didn't start the game over in 2003. At the end of 2003, they said beta was about to start. At the begining of 2004, they said beta was about to start. In the middle of 2004 , they said beta was about to start.
So it is clear that they didn't start over. Thats just nonsense.
Well, all the information indicates that they did actually almost start all over; check the older DF map at Warcry. They redesigned the entire world for one, and they modified the game engine. That's almost like starting over.
I guess they kept many minor - but time-consuming - details alright.
hah that made me smile, not recognising you from previous posts I could not tell whether that was sarcasm or not lol.
When Pol understood that there actually were a DF beta in existance, his mind clicked and he now running around as a reborn fanboi. He is quite insane of course...so stay away and do not feed him.
--- And when we got more women on the team, it was like No, no, no. We need puppies and horses in there. John Smedley, SOE
Originally posted by Xris375 Originally posted by Enigma Originally posted by Lonewolf They are an independent company, funded by independent investors, did you think it would be smooth sailing for them Every company starts somewhere, Aventurine is no different its just a shame that it happened to take so long for the production of the game, and thus the silly amount of vaporware and critiques appearing from people in the gaming world
CCP was an indie company when they developed EVE. That's no excuse to give them that reason of why Aventurine have taken 8 years to develop and so many issues to date. Compared to CCP, Aventurine is just doing everything wrong. Even for a small company.
5 years, not 8 years. Thought you would have learned the lore by now Enigma Edit: 6 years
I know the lore very damned well thank you...its over 8 years now
That is like saying Warhammer Online startet development in 1983. It's still the same name and some things carried over, right ? And it's 6 years, not 5.
Actually its been in development for 9 years. And they didn't start the game over in 2003. At the end of 2003, they said beta was about to start. At the begining of 2004, they said beta was about to start. In the middle of 2004 , they said beta was about to start.
So it is clear that they didn't start over. Thats just nonsense.
Well, all the information indicates that they did actually almost start all over; check the older DF map at Warcry. They redesigned the entire world for one, and they modified the game engine. That's almost like starting over.
I guess they kept many minor - but time-consuming - details alright.
I dont' have to check Warcry, I have been registered on Dark-n-Fail forums since they were Razorwax and no they did not "start over". That is BS. They rewrote some code but the basic ideas and design have been around and under development since before Razorwax ever brought up a website. Therefore the development cycle is closer to 14 years!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
As to the world / map. Go look at the original world shown by Razorwax. It is the same damn world just without any detail. The shape and location of the land masses are the same.
Hell if I really cared to waste my time I would bet I could overlay the two maps in Photoshop and they would line right up.
This game has been a sham for years and shows no sign of changing. I hope some of the investors are reading what is being said all over the web about this POS fraud and start demanding results or Taco's head on a platter.
Greek's like Turks have their own way to mete out justice, maybe they will give old Taco some of it.
EDIT: here take a look at the land of Darkfall circa 2002 at the link below:
That is like saying Warhammer Online startet development in 1983. It's still the same name and some things carried over, right ? And it's 6 years, not 5.
Actually its been in development for 9 years. And they didn't start the game over in 2003. At the end of 2003, they said beta was about to start. At the begining of 2004, they said beta was about to start. In the middle of 2004 , they said beta was about to start.
So it is clear that they didn't start over. Thats just nonsense.
Well, all the information indicates that they did actually almost start all over; check the older DF map at Warcry. They redesigned the entire world for one, and they modified the game engine. That's almost like starting over.
I guess they kept many minor - but time-consuming - details alright.
According to Claus they changed very little.
I guess I'm going to go with believing an actual Dev. on this one, and a non-Tasos Dev. at that.
Edit:
" Claus: Very little has changed. We have stayed true to the original design, and kept almost all of the features promised when we launched the Darkfall site two years ago. "
I guess I'm going to go with believing an actual Dev. on this one, and a non-Tasos Dev. at that.
Edit:
" Claus: Very little has changed. We have stayed true to the original design, and kept almost all of the features promised when we launched the Darkfall site two years ago. "
Another pointless irrelevant ignorant hate filled wall of text rant by a WoW carebear, Darkfall is feature complete and has been fully tested, and is ready for release, Tasos told us, he knows not you. Tasos is delaying the full release by a month purely for the benefit of the community so that the full release will have no problems and the game will be the best ever. Pre orders have only been begrudgingly made available after the over whelming demand from the followers for them against Tasos's best intentions. Tasos is only allowing preorders purely to help stage the release of the game and to determine demand more accurately, but only to ensure that the full release is flawless, you should be thanking him for allowing you the privilege of preordering this revolutionary groundbreaking advanced game. Tasos is committed to only launching Darkfall when it is perfect and polished, which is why he agreed to the community's wishes to delay the full launch until the 25th of February, you should be thanking Tasos for delaying the game again so its everything you've ever wanted when its released.
Tasos says this, Tasos said that, Tasos is only concerned with the community, Tasos is a giving person, Tasos loves us....
good grief man.
Fanboism - They tie their ego and heart to the game and therefore must defend it at all cost. Any criticism must be met with vicious reprisal. Any evidence that threatens the ego must be ignored. History is of no concern because this time will be different.
The guys are probably crapping their pants as the success of Darkfall is critical to their livelihoods and the ability to feed their children
A severe exaggeration...
If someone owns a company or is an industry leading programmer and they haven't got any savings to their name and never thought "im in a niche industry, my job isn't always secure" then they're pretty stupid.
-- Note: PlayNC will refuse to allow you access to your account if you forget your password and can't provide a scanned image of the product key for the first product you purchased..... LOL
Sometimes you just gotta take risk in order to make money. Sometimes playing it safe will get you know where.
Velika: City of Wheels: Among the mortal races, the humans were the only one that never built cities or great empires; a curse laid upon them by their creator, Gidd, forced them to wander as nomads for twenty centuries...
I believe Darkfall is in serious trouble. I think there is a strong possibility that the game may be released, but I also have a strong suspicion that if it is it will be revealed as the Emperor with No Clothes. There are a number of reasons I've come to this conclusion. Here is how I have interpreted today's announcement on top of the scan clues that have been provided over the past few weeks.
* Within the last few months they shifted from the Blizzard-like "when it's ready" stance to a finite date. This usually is a precursor to running out of financing. * One of the most prominent public appearances of the game in recent weeks has been at a fundraising effort, expressing the game's merits to investors, apparently who likely have very little experience in the gaming industry. It's almost desperate, but I wouldn't fault anyone for finding funding if they can find it. * Little information at all has been available within the last few weeks about the state of the game, other than some very controlled experiences released by exceptionally biased and friendly people. Classic damage control and spin. * Tasos has clearly laid out that "Darkfall’s partners (distribution, billing, account management, support, etc.) entered into the game at a late date and we needed more time than expected to integrate properly." Billing, account management, and support are enterin late? Billing? My god...this has to be one of the most important aspects of running a business as can be imagined...how can this be listed as a late entry to a successful business model? * A shift from the "no pre-orders" stance to "A pre-order will be made available mid-February" with the incentive of "pre-orders will also get priority for the game launch if we have to go to a staged release." An extremely clear sign that they are running out of money and need funding...this time, from prospective customers rather than outside investors. Investors eventually start demanding revenue be a portion of the operating expense...and that has clearly begun to happen. * An apparent acknowledgement that they are not prepared to handle with their infrastructure the apparently demand for their service, which is confirmed by: "Demand for Darkfall at launch could be much higher than expected. If this is the case, we need a different process to better handle the demand." This is extremely alarming, since Tasos has touted the 200,000+ gamers that have registered for the game. It cannot possibly be a surprise that a fair portion of those 200,000+ gamers might actually want to play it...causing infastructure demand. But they clearly cannot handle the load....this is a dillema. * A total lack of stress testing is absurdly alarming, and should have anyone who is a devotee of this game crying foul. In Tasos' own words: "We want as many players as possible in the game before the launch and we haven’t had the chance to stress test our servers with live players yet.". Let me reiterate: "we haven't had the chance to stress test our servers with live players yet." Even if you extend their deadline to the end of February, that's a frightening statement. I firmly believe they have a good multiplayer game, based on the reports from the extremely select group of playtesters that have been allowed to talk about it. But a good multipler game is definitely not a MMOG, and a MMOG is exponentially more complicated and expensive to run than a multiplayer game. It appears to me that Aventurine is running out of money and running out of time. I speculate that the game isn't capable of handling 10's of thousands of users, and even if the game was capable of it they don't have the clerical and bureaucratic infrastructure to handle it. All of it promises, even with the very best of intentions, an absolute mess. I've said it before, and I'll repeat it again: I want Darkfall to succeed. Every success in the MMOG industry continues to perpetuate the entertainment of the future. It is an inevitable future, and the more diverse it is the better. I want them to succeed, but I also am tired of stomaching the ecstatic delusions of devotees who refuse to learn from the painful lessons of previous experience. All this being said...let's see how this all turns out. No doubt this post will be sliced and diced by the partisans...have fun with it.
Excellent write up. I agree with almost everything you said, and pray that it works out well for them. I know they have to have so much put into this project outside of just financial investment. I am sure it has consumed their lives for the last 8 years and would hate to see it fail.
I really do wonder if they'll get picked up by a major distributor.
Probably not because this game won't ever sell millions in 1 area. Seems to me only WoW clones get picked up by major distubters anymore. Shame really. But who knows, maybe they'll be lucky.
It wasn't horrendous. The launches for Anarchy Online and Horizons were horrendous. WOW had a lot of problems on launch, but it was playable (provided you didn't mind the heavy lag during peak hours and hour-long wait queues).
People do tend to forget, though, that WOW wasn't a flawless launch.
wow, on the hyjal server, was horrendous at launch and for the better part of 6 months following the launch.
could we please get correspondent writers and moderators, on the eve forum at mmorpg.com, who are well-versed on eve-online and aren't just passersby pushing buttons? pretty please?
Don't be silly Tasos has said time and time again the servers have been tested by advanced AI bots and paid professional testers. Tasos never lies so how could the servers not be ready?
taking it out of context...
no, that's pretty much in context, it's his reasoning of why no one should worry that they haven't had a large closed beta and that they don't really need an open beta.
could we please get correspondent writers and moderators, on the eve forum at mmorpg.com, who are well-versed on eve-online and aren't just passersby pushing buttons? pretty please?
Vanguard, AoC, WAR, and soon DF.....and the trend continues. As long as people keep buying unfinished products, they'll keep selling them.
QFT.
I made that mistake with AoC and got my fingers burnt. Never again. Unfortunately some people never learn.
Name one finished product upon launch that is an MMORPG? You can't, because that's what an MMO is. This isn't some defense against Darkfall, because DF is not my cup of tea. But let's be serious here, do you have any idea what your talking about? I can run down a huge list of "unifinished" MMORPG's as you claim, but what really is "unifinished" to you? Thinking before posting might help. Until PC's are like consoles, you will NEVER see this dreamed product of yours. Sorry for the de-rail, but this post sounded like someone who's never played an MMORPG before.
mmorpg's are not supposed to be released unfinished; but they do, because people are stupid enough to buy them.
now, a game evolving, growing, etc, is NOT a game becoming "more finished"; otherwise we would be calling EXPANSION packs "a little more finished" pack. yes?
a game announcing all sorts of features, then releasing and those features don't work -- that's unfinished.
a game cutting back a LOT of announced features, right before retail -- that's unfinished.
a game releasing with all of it's announced features, and then steadily expanding upon that foundation every few months post-retail -- that's finished and them expanding upon the base game.
just because a LOT of people have been foolish enough to pay for unfinished products -- does NOT mean that anyone has to accept an unfinished product, NOR that the acceptable norm should be lowered to accepting unfinished garbage.
it doesn't.
could we please get correspondent writers and moderators, on the eve forum at mmorpg.com, who are well-versed on eve-online and aren't just passersby pushing buttons? pretty please?
Another pointless irrelevant ignorant hate filled wall of text rant by a WoW carebear, Darkfall is feature complete and has been fully tested, and is ready for release, Tasos told us, he knows not you. Tasos is delaying the full release by a month purely for the benefit of the community so that the full release will have no problems and the game will be the best ever. Pre orders have only been begrudgingly made available after the over whelming demand from the followers for them against Tasos's best intentions. Tasos is only allowing preorders purely to help stage the release of the game and to determine demand more accurately, but only to ensure that the full release is flawless, you should be thanking him for allowing you the privilege of preordering this revolutionary groundbreaking advanced game. Tasos is committed to only launching Darkfall when it is perfect and polished, which is why he agreed to the community's wishes to delay the full launch until the 25th of February, you should be thanking Tasos for delaying the game again so its everything you've ever wanted when its released.
i honestly hope the quoted is 100% sarcasm; because if it's not...
could we please get correspondent writers and moderators, on the eve forum at mmorpg.com, who are well-versed on eve-online and aren't just passersby pushing buttons? pretty please?
I believe Darkfall is in serious trouble. I think there is a strong possibility that the game may be released, but I also have a strong suspicion that if it is it will be revealed as the Emperor with No Clothes. There are a number of reasons I've come to this conclusion. Here is how I have interpreted today's announcement on top of the scan clues that have been provided over the past few weeks.
* Within the last few months they shifted from the Blizzard-like "when it's ready" stance to a finite date. This usually is a precursor to running out of financing.
* One of the most prominent public appearances of the game in recent weeks has been at a fundraising effort, expressing the game's merits to investors, apparently who likely have very little experience in the gaming industry. It's almost desperate, but I wouldn't fault anyone for finding funding if they can find it.
* Little information at all has been available within the last few weeks about the state of the game, other than some very controlled experiences released by exceptionally biased and friendly people. Classic damage control and spin.
Lack of Major MMO sites reviewing the game or there hand on experience of the game is indeed not good
* Tasos has clearly laid out that "Darkfall’s partners (distribution, billing, account management, support, etc.) entered into the game at a late date and we needed more time than expected to integrate properly." Billing, account management, and support are enterin late? Billing? My god...this has to be one of the most important aspects of running a business as can be imagined...how can this be listed as a late entry to a successful business model?
Agreed one of the most important business function was not sorted out
* A shift from the "no pre-orders" stance to "A pre-order will be made available mid-February" with the incentive of "pre-orders will also get priority for the game launch if we have to go to a staged release." An extremely clear sign that they are running out of money and need funding...this time, from prospective customers rather than outside investors. Investors eventually start demanding revenue be a portion of the operating expense...and that has clearly begun to happen.
I disagree here .Preorders can be cancelled and the money is refunded .Also in theorey they have said beta launch on Jan 22nd.there will be thousands of players.
So by mid Feb we will know what state the game is in i.e if the betaa launch takes place and thousands of players are let in .At this stage pre order would be needed to gauge the demand for the game and be prepared for it .
* An apparent acknowledgement that they are not prepared to handle with their infrastructure the apparently demand for their service, which is confirmed by: "Demand for Darkfall at launch could be much higher than expected. If this is the case, we need a different process to better handle the demand." This is extremely alarming, since Tasos has touted the 200,000+ gamers that have registered for the game. It cannot possibly be a surprise that a fair portion of those 200,000+ gamers might actually want to play it...causing infastructure demand. But they clearly cannot handle the load....this is a dillema.
Fully agree .What is 200K for a MMO launch peanuts .Infrastructure demand in problem can be serious
* A total lack of stress testing is absurdly alarming, and should have anyone who is a devotee of this game crying foul. In Tasos' own words: "We want as many players as possible in the game before the launch and we haven’t had the chance to stress test our servers with live players yet.". Let me reiterate: "we haven't had the chance to stress test our servers with live players yet." Even if you extend their deadline to the end of February, that's a frightening statement.
Usually stress testing is more to tweak the servers to make them run more effecientely ,But yes so late in the game a stress test is absolutely alarming.I mean the assumption they have it only cosmetic bugs will emerge which can be fixed in a week or 2.What if there are game breaking issues that needs months to solve.again push back retail date.
I firmly believe they have a good multiplayer game, based on the reports from the extremely select group of playtesters that have been allowed to talk about it. But a good multipler game is definitely not a MMOG, and a MMOG is exponentially more complicated and expensive to run than a multiplayer game.
It appears to me that Aventurine is running out of money and running out of time. I speculate that the game isn't capable of handling 10's of thousands of users, and even if the game was capable of it they don't have the clerical and bureaucratic infrastructure to handle it. All of it promises, even with the very best of intentions, an absolute mess.
Aventurine seems to behave as an amateur when it comes to handling MMO business , Can understand there business logic of limited advertising and let the word of mouth make sales for them.If it is good game people will come in droves .
There lack of business handling clearly shows but all the same I hope ( for me too ) the game does deliver and offers what it promised .
I've said it before, and I'll repeat it again:
I want Darkfall to succeed.
Amen to that
Every success in the MMOG industry continues to perpetuate the entertainment of the future. It is an inevitable future, and the more diverse it is the better. I want them to succeed, but I also am tired of stomaching the ecstatic delusions of devotees who refuse to learn from the painful lessons of previous experience.
All this being said...let's see how this all turns out. No doubt this post will be sliced and diced by the partisans...have fun with it.
I found it refreshingly honest. They don't sound super professional. But that second to last paragraph made no bones about that. They said they want a good game with a tight community and that there is a lot of hype around the game.
I guess the problem is most people are really bad at managing a project yet they think they are good at it. These guys making this game are basically normal. Good management is actually quite rare.
You know what you are getting. This is not AoC. It might be unplayable I have no idea. But they have made it quite plain how they are operating and what their goals are.
You can really fault them if they wind up with 100k or 200k subs. They are not like WAR and thinking they will get 1 million. In fact they seem surprised that they have 200k apps.
I totally agree with your points and the continued scaremongering which continues to hit these boards will be irrelevant come relaease because many who are posting their doom and gloom will still try the game they are just kidding them selfs, hence why they continue to post here about it, otherwise why would they waste their time here?
I am a big boy and can make a judgement for my self and if I buy the game and it again fails to meet my expectations then I will do as I have the other times I have been let down, cancel, unistall and bin and then move on with RL again. It is only a matter of time until I finally find the game which meets my style of play but until I find that game I will continue to invest. However during that time I will not use propaganda to posion other peoples dreams when any product has not seen the light of day and nor should anyone else.
I dont' have to check Warcry, I have been registered on Dark-n-Fail forums since they were Razorwax and no they did not "start over". That is BS. They rewrote some code but the basic ideas and design have been around and under development since before Razorwax ever brought up a website. Therefore the development cycle is closer to 14 years!!!!!!!!!!!!!! As to the world / map. Go look at the original world shown by Razorwax. It is the same damn world just without any detail. The shape and location of the land masses are the same. Hell if I really cared to waste my time I would bet I could overlay the two maps in Photoshop and they would line right up. This game has been a sham for years and shows no sign of changing. I hope some of the investors are reading what is being said all over the web about this POS fraud and start demanding results or Taco's head on a platter. Greek's like Turks have their own way to mete out justice, maybe they will give old Taco some of it.
I dare you to to take some time to make overlay in photoshop so we can end this discussion. You can make a new thread "I own Dark`n fail map" to prove it.
If you don`t manage to make them a perfect overlap I call YOU a fraud, lier thief and someone who make Tasos look like jesus.
You know, when Age of Conan was on the hype wave i had a feeling it was gonna suck major balls until it releases and proves the contrary. It released and flopped, and i was happy that i didn't screw myself with 50 bucks.
Now, difference is that i kept my fucking mouth shut instead of acting as a concerned forum crusader trying to save people from A FUCKING VIDEO GAME.
My 2 cents.
"The hammer of the gods will drive our ships to new lands, To fight the horde, singing and crying: Valhalla, I am coming! On we sweep with threshing oar, our only goal will be the western shore."
Comments
Actually its been in development for 9 years. And they didn't start the game over in 2003. At the end of 2003, they said beta was about to start. At the begining of 2004, they said beta was about to start. In the middle of 2004 , they said beta was about to start.
So it is clear that they didn't start over. Thats just nonsense.
Well, all the information indicates that they did actually almost start all over; check the older DF map at Warcry. They redesigned the entire world for one, and they modified the game engine. That's almost like starting over.
I guess they kept many minor - but time-consuming - details alright.
hah that made me smile, not recognising you from previous posts I could not tell whether that was sarcasm or not lol.
When Pol understood that there actually were a DF beta in existance, his mind clicked and he now running around as a reborn fanboi. He is quite insane of course...so stay away and do not feed him.
---
And when we got more women on the team, it was like No, no, no. We need puppies and horses in there.
John Smedley, SOE
I remember people naysaying CCP and EVE when it first came out as well. EVE is still here though, and doing pretty well.
CCP was an indie company when they developed EVE. That's no excuse to give them that reason of why Aventurine have taken 8 years to develop and so many issues to date.
Compared to CCP, Aventurine is just doing everything wrong. Even for a small company.
5 years, not 8 years. Thought you would have learned the lore by now Enigma
Edit: 6 years
I know the lore very damned well thank you...its over 8 years now
Actually its been in development for 9 years. And they didn't start the game over in 2003. At the end of 2003, they said beta was about to start. At the begining of 2004, they said beta was about to start. In the middle of 2004 , they said beta was about to start.
So it is clear that they didn't start over. Thats just nonsense.
Well, all the information indicates that they did actually almost start all over; check the older DF map at Warcry. They redesigned the entire world for one, and they modified the game engine. That's almost like starting over.
I guess they kept many minor - but time-consuming - details alright.
I dont' have to check Warcry, I have been registered on Dark-n-Fail forums since they were Razorwax and no they did not "start over". That is BS. They rewrote some code but the basic ideas and design have been around and under development since before Razorwax ever brought up a website. Therefore the development cycle is closer to 14 years!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
As to the world / map. Go look at the original world shown by Razorwax. It is the same damn world just without any detail. The shape and location of the land masses are the same.
Hell if I really cared to waste my time I would bet I could overlay the two maps in Photoshop and they would line right up.
This game has been a sham for years and shows no sign of changing. I hope some of the investors are reading what is being said all over the web about this POS fraud and start demanding results or Taco's head on a platter.
Greek's like Turks have their own way to mete out justice, maybe they will give old Taco some of it.
EDIT: here take a look at the land of Darkfall circa 2002 at the link below:
web.archive.org/web/20030215203044/www.darkfallonline.com/features/world/
Actually its been in development for 9 years. And they didn't start the game over in 2003. At the end of 2003, they said beta was about to start. At the begining of 2004, they said beta was about to start. In the middle of 2004 , they said beta was about to start.
So it is clear that they didn't start over. Thats just nonsense.
Well, all the information indicates that they did actually almost start all over; check the older DF map at Warcry. They redesigned the entire world for one, and they modified the game engine. That's almost like starting over.
I guess they kept many minor - but time-consuming - details alright.
According to Claus they changed very little.
I guess I'm going to go with believing an actual Dev. on this one, and a non-Tasos Dev. at that.
Edit:
" Claus: Very little has changed. We have stayed true to the original design, and kept almost all of the features promised when we launched the Darkfall site two years ago. "
8-03-2003 forums.darkfallonline.com/showthread.php
According to Claus they changed very little.
I guess I'm going to go with believing an actual Dev. on this one, and a non-Tasos Dev. at that.
Edit:
" Claus: Very little has changed. We have stayed true to the original design, and kept almost all of the features promised when we launched the Darkfall site two years ago. "
8-03-2003 forums.darkfallonline.com/showthread.php
It that a quote from 2003 ? And they didn't change the game since then ?
---
And when we got more women on the team, it was like No, no, no. We need puppies and horses in there.
John Smedley, SOE
Tasos says this, Tasos said that, Tasos is only concerned with the community, Tasos is a giving person, Tasos loves us....
good grief man.
Fanboism - They tie their ego and heart to the game and therefore must defend it at all cost. Any criticism must be met with vicious reprisal. Any evidence that threatens the ego must be ignored. History is of no concern because this time will be different.
you missed his avatar. It was a joke post
Games:
Currently playing:Nothing
Will play: Darkfall: Unholy Wars
Past games:
Guild Wars 2 - Xpiher Duminous
Xpiher's GW2
GW 1 - Xpiher Duminous
Darkfall - Xpiher Duminous (NA) retired
AoC - Xpiher (Tyranny) retired
Warhammer - Xpiher
A severe exaggeration...
If someone owns a company or is an industry leading programmer and they haven't got any savings to their name and never thought "im in a niche industry, my job isn't always secure" then they're pretty stupid.
--
Note: PlayNC will refuse to allow you access to your account if you forget your password and can't provide a scanned image of the product key for the first product you purchased..... LOL
Sometimes you just gotta take risk in order to make money. Sometimes playing it safe will get you know where.
Velika: City of Wheels: Among the mortal races, the humans were the only one that never built cities or great empires; a curse laid upon them by their creator, Gidd, forced them to wander as nomads for twenty centuries...
Excellent write up. I agree with almost everything you said, and pray that it works out well for them. I know they have to have so much put into this project outside of just financial investment. I am sure it has consumed their lives for the last 8 years and would hate to see it fail.
I really do wonder if they'll get picked up by a major distributor.
Probably not because this game won't ever sell millions in 1 area. Seems to me only WoW clones get picked up by major distubters anymore. Shame really. But who knows, maybe they'll be lucky.
Games:
Currently playing:Nothing
Will play: Darkfall: Unholy Wars
Past games:
Guild Wars 2 - Xpiher Duminous
Xpiher's GW2
GW 1 - Xpiher Duminous
Darkfall - Xpiher Duminous (NA) retired
AoC - Xpiher (Tyranny) retired
Warhammer - Xpiher
It wasn't horrendous. The launches for Anarchy Online and Horizons were horrendous. WOW had a lot of problems on launch, but it was playable (provided you didn't mind the heavy lag during peak hours and hour-long wait queues).
People do tend to forget, though, that WOW wasn't a flawless launch.
wow, on the hyjal server, was horrendous at launch and for the better part of 6 months following the launch.
could we please get correspondent writers and moderators, on the eve forum at mmorpg.com, who are well-versed on eve-online and aren't just passersby pushing buttons? pretty please?
taking it out of context...
no, that's pretty much in context, it's his reasoning of why no one should worry that they haven't had a large closed beta and that they don't really need an open beta.
could we please get correspondent writers and moderators, on the eve forum at mmorpg.com, who are well-versed on eve-online and aren't just passersby pushing buttons? pretty please?
QFT.
I made that mistake with AoC and got my fingers burnt. Never again. Unfortunately some people never learn.
Name one finished product upon launch that is an MMORPG? You can't, because that's what an MMO is. This isn't some defense against Darkfall, because DF is not my cup of tea. But let's be serious here, do you have any idea what your talking about? I can run down a huge list of "unifinished" MMORPG's as you claim, but what really is "unifinished" to you? Thinking before posting might help. Until PC's are like consoles, you will NEVER see this dreamed product of yours. Sorry for the de-rail, but this post sounded like someone who's never played an MMORPG before.
mmorpg's are not supposed to be released unfinished; but they do, because people are stupid enough to buy them.
now, a game evolving, growing, etc, is NOT a game becoming "more finished"; otherwise we would be calling EXPANSION packs "a little more finished" pack. yes?
a game announcing all sorts of features, then releasing and those features don't work -- that's unfinished.
a game cutting back a LOT of announced features, right before retail -- that's unfinished.
a game releasing with all of it's announced features, and then steadily expanding upon that foundation every few months post-retail -- that's finished and them expanding upon the base game.
just because a LOT of people have been foolish enough to pay for unfinished products -- does NOT mean that anyone has to accept an unfinished product, NOR that the acceptable norm should be lowered to accepting unfinished garbage.
it doesn't.
could we please get correspondent writers and moderators, on the eve forum at mmorpg.com, who are well-versed on eve-online and aren't just passersby pushing buttons? pretty please?
i honestly hope the quoted is 100% sarcasm; because if it's not...
could we please get correspondent writers and moderators, on the eve forum at mmorpg.com, who are well-versed on eve-online and aren't just passersby pushing buttons? pretty please?
I believe Darkfall is in serious trouble. I think there is a strong possibility that the game may be released, but I also have a strong suspicion that if it is it will be revealed as the Emperor with No Clothes. There are a number of reasons I've come to this conclusion. Here is how I have interpreted today's announcement on top of the scan clues that have been provided over the past few weeks.
* Within the last few months they shifted from the Blizzard-like "when it's ready" stance to a finite date. This usually is a precursor to running out of financing.
* One of the most prominent public appearances of the game in recent weeks has been at a fundraising effort, expressing the game's merits to investors, apparently who likely have very little experience in the gaming industry. It's almost desperate, but I wouldn't fault anyone for finding funding if they can find it.
* Little information at all has been available within the last few weeks about the state of the game, other than some very controlled experiences released by exceptionally biased and friendly people. Classic damage control and spin.
Lack of Major MMO sites reviewing the game or there hand on experience of the game is indeed not good
* Tasos has clearly laid out that "Darkfall’s partners (distribution, billing, account management, support, etc.) entered into the game at a late date and we needed more time than expected to integrate properly." Billing, account management, and support are enterin late? Billing? My god...this has to be one of the most important aspects of running a business as can be imagined...how can this be listed as a late entry to a successful business model?
Agreed one of the most important business function was not sorted out
* A shift from the "no pre-orders" stance to "A pre-order will be made available mid-February" with the incentive of "pre-orders will also get priority for the game launch if we have to go to a staged release." An extremely clear sign that they are running out of money and need funding...this time, from prospective customers rather than outside investors. Investors eventually start demanding revenue be a portion of the operating expense...and that has clearly begun to happen.
I disagree here .Preorders can be cancelled and the money is refunded .Also in theorey they have said beta launch on Jan 22nd.there will be thousands of players.
So by mid Feb we will know what state the game is in i.e if the betaa launch takes place and thousands of players are let in .At this stage pre order would be needed to gauge the demand for the game and be prepared for it .
* An apparent acknowledgement that they are not prepared to handle with their infrastructure the apparently demand for their service, which is confirmed by: "Demand for Darkfall at launch could be much higher than expected. If this is the case, we need a different process to better handle the demand." This is extremely alarming, since Tasos has touted the 200,000+ gamers that have registered for the game. It cannot possibly be a surprise that a fair portion of those 200,000+ gamers might actually want to play it...causing infastructure demand. But they clearly cannot handle the load....this is a dillema.
Fully agree .What is 200K for a MMO launch peanuts .Infrastructure demand in problem can be serious
* A total lack of stress testing is absurdly alarming, and should have anyone who is a devotee of this game crying foul. In Tasos' own words: "We want as many players as possible in the game before the launch and we haven’t had the chance to stress test our servers with live players yet.". Let me reiterate: "we haven't had the chance to stress test our servers with live players yet." Even if you extend their deadline to the end of February, that's a frightening statement.
Usually stress testing is more to tweak the servers to make them run more effecientely ,But yes so late in the game a stress test is absolutely alarming.I mean the assumption they have it only cosmetic bugs will emerge which can be fixed in a week or 2.What if there are game breaking issues that needs months to solve.again push back retail date.
I firmly believe they have a good multiplayer game, based on the reports from the extremely select group of playtesters that have been allowed to talk about it. But a good multipler game is definitely not a MMOG, and a MMOG is exponentially more complicated and expensive to run than a multiplayer game.
It appears to me that Aventurine is running out of money and running out of time. I speculate that the game isn't capable of handling 10's of thousands of users, and even if the game was capable of it they don't have the clerical and bureaucratic infrastructure to handle it. All of it promises, even with the very best of intentions, an absolute mess.
Aventurine seems to behave as an amateur when it comes to handling MMO business , Can understand there business logic of limited advertising and let the word of mouth make sales for them.If it is good game people will come in droves .
There lack of business handling clearly shows but all the same I hope ( for me too ) the game does deliver and offers what it promised .
I've said it before, and I'll repeat it again:
I want Darkfall to succeed.
Amen to that
Every success in the MMOG industry continues to perpetuate the entertainment of the future. It is an inevitable future, and the more diverse it is the better. I want them to succeed, but I also am tired of stomaching the ecstatic delusions of devotees who refuse to learn from the painful lessons of previous experience.
All this being said...let's see how this all turns out. No doubt this post will be sliced and diced by the partisans...have fun with it.
I totally agree with your points and the continued scaremongering which continues to hit these boards will be irrelevant come relaease because many who are posting their doom and gloom will still try the game they are just kidding them selfs, hence why they continue to post here about it, otherwise why would they waste their time here?
I am a big boy and can make a judgement for my self and if I buy the game and it again fails to meet my expectations then I will do as I have the other times I have been let down, cancel, unistall and bin and then move on with RL again. It is only a matter of time until I finally find the game which meets my style of play but until I find that game I will continue to invest. However during that time I will not use propaganda to posion other peoples dreams when any product has not seen the light of day and nor should anyone else.
Asbo
Pretty bold statements from you in this post. The sad thing is, I can no longer see who is a lier, troll, fanboi, white border or grey border.
I did however belive you when you said the maps are the same.
Your map:
http://web.archive.org/web/20030215203044/www.darkfallonline.com/features/world/
DF new map:
http://www.bkbhq.com/images/dfmap/78900rs.jpg
I dare you to to take some time to make overlay in photoshop so we can end this discussion. You can make a new thread "I own Dark`n fail map" to prove it.
If you don`t manage to make them a perfect overlap I call YOU a fraud, lier thief and someone who make Tasos look like jesus.
You know, when Age of Conan was on the hype wave i had a feeling it was gonna suck major balls until it releases and proves the contrary. It released and flopped, and i was happy that i didn't screw myself with 50 bucks.
Now, difference is that i kept my fucking mouth shut instead of acting as a concerned forum crusader trying to save people from A FUCKING VIDEO GAME.
My 2 cents.
To fight the horde, singing and crying: Valhalla, I am coming!
On we sweep with threshing oar, our only goal will be the western shore."