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Putting yourself out there......

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  • LeKinKLeKinK Member Posts: 899
    Originally posted by asdar


    I don't see anyone that steadfastly claims that Darkfall will be the best game ever. Just people that want the features that it claims to offer. Every Darkfall fan I've talked to has a grasp of reality and most expected the delay that came in January.
    On the other hand I see a lot of people that post in this forum just to claim that everything about Darkfall is bad. They even go so far as to claim that a separate site reporting on the game is fake and giving false reports.
    There's plenty of reason for someone who's a fan to come here, but no sane reason for someone that doesn't like the game to come here. It's not the the same on both sides.
    If I don't like a band I don't go to their concert to boo them, no matter how much I think their fans are jerks.

    I wanted to write an essay to follow this but instead I will only tell you that I can think of several reason other then bashing this game to be here..

  • asdarasdar Member UncommonPosts: 662
    Originally posted by LeKinK

    Originally posted by asdar


    I don't see anyone that steadfastly claims that Darkfall will be the best game ever. Just people that want the features that it claims to offer. Every Darkfall fan I've talked to has a grasp of reality and most expected the delay that came in January.
    On the other hand I see a lot of people that post in this forum just to claim that everything about Darkfall is bad. They even go so far as to claim that a separate site reporting on the game is fake and giving false reports.
    There's plenty of reason for someone who's a fan to come here, but no sane reason for someone that doesn't like the game to come here. It's not the the same on both sides.
    If I don't like a band I don't go to their concert to boo them, no matter how much I think their fans are jerks.

    I wanted to write an essay to follow this but instead I will only tell you that I can think of several reason other then bashing this game to be here..



     

    I welcome people, even skeptical people. I try not to be and hope I'm not rude to anyone here. If you have any interest in Darkfall, then you should come here.

    I come here occassionally because I'd like to discuss the game. People that are excited about the game have ideas about what they think it'll be like that might be exagerated. I can deal with that by not posting there. I don't have too much of a problem with that. On the other hand every single thread on the front page is dominated by people that hate the game.

    You can't post a thread about what you'd like to do in game without it being turned by haters telling you the game won't launch. Hate the people that are overly exuberent, but leave those of us that just want to discuss the game alone for a bit so we can. (not you personally, just the haters)

    Asdar

  • WSIMikeWSIMike Member Posts: 5,564
    Originally posted by Adigiron


    to chime in on a point, one thing that particularly frustrated me with the "fanbois" more than the "haters" is there were (probably still are somewhere in the depths of the pages) posts in OTHER game forums about why SWG vets should play Darkfall, or why people shouldn't be interested in earthrise or fallen earth, but instead be interested in Darkfall.  Then of course with Mortal Online as well, but this one is at least the most similar to Darkfall it seems.  
    But why are peopling moving their soapbox to other forums?  If they come to this site they've undoubtedly seen the "most recent posts" or whatever or have at least seen the similar Darkfall boasting threads that have hit the General Discussion boards too.  If you traverse forums, you've heard about the game most likely, the hype & drama behind it is huge.
     

    Someone promoted DF on the FFXI forums some time back, saying that if players wanted "real PvP", they should check out DF...

    Mind you... while FFXI does have a few very "isolated" PvP type activities there's no one I've ever met, known or read about who plays that game looking for PvP.

    It's like going to a restaurant for vegetarians to advertise a steak house opening up down the road.

    Yet, someone went in there and posted a promotion for DF anyway.

    As another example, I originally learned of DF through someone posting to promote it on another MMO's forums.

    So yeah, there's certainly been evangelizing of the game going on on other games' forums.

     

     

    "If you just step away for a sec you will clearly see all the pot holes in the road,
    and the cash shop selling asphalt..."
    - Mimzel on F2P/Cash Shops

    image

  • Shoko_LiedShoko_Lied Member UncommonPosts: 2,193

    Good thread OP, I only wish I had made it myself, I had always gotton that same exact feeling. Honestly, there is no point in all the biast remarks that have been picking up lately. Although I don't mind some skepticism, because like you said, its good to remain realistic. I would probably consider myself a "fanboi" of the concepts of DF. But I will still wait to see once I actaully play it whether or not It will be worth my time

    Regardless one of the things I will NEVER understand is why there are so many blatent haters for the game, I mean comeon honsestly, did darkfall ever sleep with your mom or something? No. So hate is pointless. Either you end up liking the game or you end up disliking it, but just because it's not your game and you dislike it, does not mean you "hate it". Its just sad that all the outrageous fanbois and haters just don't realise how badly reading their crap lowers the average humans IQ.

     

  • Shoko_LiedShoko_Lied Member UncommonPosts: 2,193
    Originally posted by WSIMike

    Originally posted by Adigiron


    to chime in on a point, one thing that particularly frustrated me with the "fanbois" more than the "haters" is there were (probably still are somewhere in the depths of the pages) posts in OTHER game forums about why SWG vets should play Darkfall, or why people shouldn't be interested in earthrise or fallen earth, but instead be interested in Darkfall.  Then of course with Mortal Online as well, but this one is at least the most similar to Darkfall it seems.  
    But why are peopling moving their soapbox to other forums?  If they come to this site they've undoubtedly seen the "most recent posts" or whatever or have at least seen the similar Darkfall boasting threads that have hit the General Discussion boards too.  If you traverse forums, you've heard about the game most likely, the hype & drama behind it is huge.
     

    Someone promoted DF on the FFXI forums some time back, saying that if players wanted "real PvP", they should check out DF...

    Mind you... while FFXI does have a few very "isolated" PvP type activities there's no one I've ever met, known or read about who plays that game looking for PvP.

    It's like going to a restaurant for vegetarians to advertise a steak house opening up down the road.

    Yet, someone went in there and posted a promotion for DF anyway.

     

     



     

    Well I too played FFXI and loved it, but if I saw that kind of post I honeslty wouldn't mind. He could have advertised DF a little less arrogantly, and said something along the lines of "If you are looking for a sandbox pvp game", not "A real PVP game", because that just makes him look really stupid.  But I don't mind actaully getting the games word out in its own, but you are right, some people use absolutely no common sense.

  • teknicianteknician Member UncommonPosts: 270

    Personally I could care less about whether or not the game releases.  It would be nice if it did, and I would definitely try it, but I'm not going to be incredibly disappointed if it doesn't.

    IMO trolling and fanboyism is just a form of PvP in the forums. It is just big game while waiting for the real game.

  • harmonicaharmonica Member Posts: 339
    Originally posted by andmiller


    Maybe I should look at it a different way.
    I guess from a different perspective, it takes courage to be so steadfast about something that you have not experienced yourself.  It is similar to religion.  I've never really grasped the whold concept of religion, that you could be so sure of something you cannot possibly back-up with any type of evidence or first hand experience.  But I can also respect someone who says this is my belief, this is why, and I will not be swayed.
    The people in that category are intriguing.  While I am on the opposite side of the coin, neither one of us are zealots about the stance and can respect the other.  It's when you step beyond that spectrum that I lose all respect and understanding.  The guy who stands outside the abortion clinic with a sign.  The guy who stands on the corner with a massive sign yelling about Jesus Saves.  And on the opposite side, the a-hole atheists who go to congress to have Christmas banned.  To take the pledge of allegiance out of public schools.
    And while I have strayed far outside the topic of MMOs, the people who have followed Darkfall are easily lumped into these categories.  There are hundreds of threads on here with the guy's holding up the Darkfall Saves sign and spouting line after line of nonsense.  All logic has left them, and they support everything about the game 100% without using any type of judgement.  I'm not saying you have to experience something first hand to have an opinion on it, I just don't get at what point you take up the sign?  The sword cuts both ways of course, like the threads on here asking the MMORPG staff to ban the game and threads about the game from this site.
    But I ask you, at what point do you put yourself so far out there?  I guess it's easy for some of you, because this is anonymous forum, but I just don't get it.  I love the concepts of the game as much as any of the hardcore zealot fans (after all I played Shadowbane with all of it's horrible flaws), and if the threads were about the "concepts", that would be one thing, but most of them are not.  So I ask you, team Zealot, what exactly is it that makes you put yourself so far out there?  You can set the sign down for a minute if using your hands will express your opinion better for you.....I'm sure you have a buddy next to you who can hold two of them for a minute while you respond.
    ---The middle signing off......

     

    Actually, I think it's you who looks a little nutty posting this. Who would give this much of a shit about what other people think of a videogame?

    Also, keep it in context. A lot of young kids post here and are overly excited about a videogame. It happens to a lot of kids when they want something really bad.

    I personally am looking forward to trying the game and am reserving judgement until I've played it. There's not enough evidence out there to say whether it's a piece of shit or a piece of gold. Or somewhere inbetween.

    At the end of the day, I could care less about the weirdos who troll emphatically for or against a game they've never played. And if they're young kids, I just chalk it up to expected, normal behavior.

     

  • WizardryWizardry Member LegendaryPosts: 19,332

    It is no 2 sided coin with me,i guess i must have a cheat coin lol,mine is 3 sided,or one sided i guess.

    I never go to either extreme,i try to look at each games aspect that the topic entails,and critique to best of my ability.Sometimes i am just too tired to properly get my point across,so i may step on some feet,but i try not to.To make a valid point you have to compare that aspect to another game,it really is the only way.

    An example is comparing FFXI when i talk about combat/battle systems,why?because i think FFXI has gone through the most effort and is the most intriguing,so all other games get judged by it.

    When i compare PVP ,i compare it to UT99,because i believe that WAS the ultimate PVP challenge,the MOST skillful ever laid out in a PVP game,mainly because it covers ALL aspects of PVP not just one.Originally the best player in that game was ultimately only a 56k player up against the best high bandwidth players the internet had to offer and he owned them,that takes AMAZING skill,unlike what i see in most MMO's.So all PVP games get judged by that game.I guess if a PVP game was to impress me,it would have to be designed good enough to allow a fully skilled[thinking mans player]the ability to beat an opponent who he should lose to 90% of the time.The icons in your hotbar or the gear yo uwear ,should never be the determining factor in PVP,cheap games do it that way.

    Crafting i use Everquest,not really because i think it is VERY good,but mainly because i think it does it sort of the way it should be ,it involves harvesting,crafting of pieces to make the main piece[all realistic],it could have been taken A LOT futher no question about it.Crafting is one of the parts of MMO's that i find has not been taken seriously enough yet.I also like the fact that EQ uses tiers in crafting,witch again is much more realsitic,since nothing in real life is ever equal or exactly the same.

    Visual ,for now i sort of use Vanguard,to judge other games by,i don't think i need to go into much more detail ,since it is graphics,some or many know all the parts that go into that aspect.

    There is of course other aspects that go into making a game great,i have mentioned a few,there is story line,LORE,Role playing,content, geesh there is tons.

    SO you can see i do not become a fanbois or a hater,i just use other well done games and use those to judge other games,i do not take sides and i can easily admit to mistakes even by my favourite games,i just try to give an honest opinion never going WAY out there o neither side.

    Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.

  • admriker4admriker4 Member Posts: 1,070
    Originally posted by EbonHawk


    Nicely said "andmiller".  I completely concur with your perspective.  however the one major point that really boggles my mind is the vehemence both side take regarding...   ...ready for it...   A GAME
    At the end of the day that's all this really is, a coded programme made for our entertainment.  People who get so f'ing worked up over this one way or the other really need to take a step away from the keyboard for a bit and take a gander out at what's actually happening in the real world and maybe just maybe realize that if the game succeeds or fails it's just a microscopic occurrence in the big picture of things.



     

    Its a game to normal folks but to a fanboi its much much more. Fanbois lock their hearts, minds, and ego's into a product. Therefore when a post is critical of the product a fanboi reacts as though personally attacked. They dont respond to logic or evidence.

  • damian7damian7 Member Posts: 4,449
    Originally posted by miagisan


    well said. Both sides seem to have a holier than though attitude, and either refuses to beleive that the other has valid concerns or opinions. And the stereotyping is funny, you show a little criticism, you are a hater and dont belong on the forums, show a little love and you are a fanbois. Where is the middle ground? I see less and less of the middle ground posters, even I am thinking that the community in this game and forum arent worth it anymore. I was a rabid fanbois in 02-03, game got delayed and i was a fan in 06, game delayed again and i don't trust a word Tasos et crew says, but labeled IMMEDIATELY as a hater. It's almost sad that fans of this game are so savage towards others. Course you do have your legitimate trolls, that goes without saying.
    My favorite hypocrisy are those fans who shout from the rooftops, if you don't like darkfall, get out of our forums since you don't belong....yet they spill over into every other game touting the best features of XXX game is in DFO! (my favorite was one guy claimed the old school questing from EQ1 was in DFO....seriously....do you even know what darkfall is about?)
    Both sides stonewall each other, both blame each other, but remember, without one, you wouldn't have the other.



     

    a lot of the so-called haters are actually the middle-ground folks.

     

    but as far as fanbois - it's this way with every new game (and a lot of old games as well) -- some of it is kids that don't know any better and they're all wound up; others are adults that still don't know any better.  dunno.   it normally is the fanbois that draw the line that says "us vs. them" instead of "players vs bad games/lying devs".

     

     

     

    could we please get correspondent writers and moderators, on the eve forum at mmorpg.com, who are well-versed on eve-online and aren't just passersby pushing buttons? pretty please?

  • andmillerandmiller Member Posts: 374
    Originally posted by harmonica

    Originally posted by andmiller


    Maybe I should look at it a different way.
    I guess from a different perspective, it takes courage to be so steadfast about something that you have not experienced yourself.  It is similar to religion.  I've never really grasped the whold concept of religion, that you could be so sure of something you cannot possibly back-up with any type of evidence or first hand experience.  But I can also respect someone who says this is my belief, this is why, and I will not be swayed.
    The people in that category are intriguing.  While I am on the opposite side of the coin, neither one of us are zealots about the stance and can respect the other.  It's when you step beyond that spectrum that I lose all respect and understanding.  The guy who stands outside the abortion clinic with a sign.  The guy who stands on the corner with a massive sign yelling about Jesus Saves.  And on the opposite side, the a-hole atheists who go to congress to have Christmas banned.  To take the pledge of allegiance out of public schools.
    And while I have strayed far outside the topic of MMOs, the people who have followed Darkfall are easily lumped into these categories.  There are hundreds of threads on here with the guy's holding up the Darkfall Saves sign and spouting line after line of nonsense.  All logic has left them, and they support everything about the game 100% without using any type of judgement.  I'm not saying you have to experience something first hand to have an opinion on it, I just don't get at what point you take up the sign?  The sword cuts both ways of course, like the threads on here asking the MMORPG staff to ban the game and threads about the game from this site.
    But I ask you, at what point do you put yourself so far out there?  I guess it's easy for some of you, because this is anonymous forum, but I just don't get it.  I love the concepts of the game as much as any of the hardcore zealot fans (after all I played Shadowbane with all of it's horrible flaws), and if the threads were about the "concepts", that would be one thing, but most of them are not.  So I ask you, team Zealot, what exactly is it that makes you put yourself so far out there?  You can set the sign down for a minute if using your hands will express your opinion better for you.....I'm sure you have a buddy next to you who can hold two of them for a minute while you respond.
    ---The middle signing off......

     

    Actually, I think it's you who looks a little nutty posting this. Who would give this much of a shit about what other people think of a videogame?

    Also, keep it in context. A lot of young kids post here and are overly excited about a videogame. It happens to a lot of kids when they want something really bad.

    I personally am looking forward to trying the game and am reserving judgement until I've played it. There's not enough evidence out there to say whether it's a piece of shit or a piece of gold. Or somewhere inbetween.

    At the end of the day, I could care less about the weirdos who troll emphatically for or against a game they've never played. And if they're young kids, I just chalk it up to expected, normal behavior.

     

     

    Not sure what is "nutty" about my post, or why you think I give "this much of a sh*t" as you so eloquently put.  I find the whole thing an interesting social experiement.

    But ultimately the post has not been answered by any of the actual people it was aimed at.  Though the discussion I thought was pretty interesting....well until this post at least.  Nice to take the easy way out and say that everyone who makes a nutty post here is a young kid.

  • hidden1hidden1 Member UncommonPosts: 1,244
    Originally posted by andmiller

    Originally posted by harmonica

    Originally posted by andmiller


    Maybe I should look at it a different way.
    I guess from a different perspective, it takes courage to be so steadfast about something that you have not experienced yourself.  It is similar to religion.  I've never really grasped the whold concept of religion, that you could be so sure of something you cannot possibly back-up with any type of evidence or first hand experience.  But I can also respect someone who says this is my belief, this is why, and I will not be swayed.
    The people in that category are intriguing.  While I am on the opposite side of the coin, neither one of us are zealots about the stance and can respect the other.  It's when you step beyond that spectrum that I lose all respect and understanding.  The guy who stands outside the abortion clinic with a sign.  The guy who stands on the corner with a massive sign yelling about Jesus Saves.  And on the opposite side, the a-hole atheists who go to congress to have Christmas banned.  To take the pledge of allegiance out of public schools.
    And while I have strayed far outside the topic of MMOs, the people who have followed Darkfall are easily lumped into these categories.  There are hundreds of threads on here with the guy's holding up the Darkfall Saves sign and spouting line after line of nonsense.  All logic has left them, and they support everything about the game 100% without using any type of judgement.  I'm not saying you have to experience something first hand to have an opinion on it, I just don't get at what point you take up the sign?  The sword cuts both ways of course, like the threads on here asking the MMORPG staff to ban the game and threads about the game from this site.
    But I ask you, at what point do you put yourself so far out there?  I guess it's easy for some of you, because this is anonymous forum, but I just don't get it.  I love the concepts of the game as much as any of the hardcore zealot fans (after all I played Shadowbane with all of it's horrible flaws), and if the threads were about the "concepts", that would be one thing, but most of them are not.  So I ask you, team Zealot, what exactly is it that makes you put yourself so far out there?  You can set the sign down for a minute if using your hands will express your opinion better for you.....I'm sure you have a buddy next to you who can hold two of them for a minute while you respond.
    ---The middle signing off......

     

    Actually, I think it's you who looks a little nutty posting this. Who would give this much of a shit about what other people think of a videogame?

    Also, keep it in context. A lot of young kids post here and are overly excited about a videogame. It happens to a lot of kids when they want something really bad.

    I personally am looking forward to trying the game and am reserving judgement until I've played it. There's not enough evidence out there to say whether it's a piece of shit or a piece of gold. Or somewhere inbetween.

    At the end of the day, I could care less about the weirdos who troll emphatically for or against a game they've never played. And if they're young kids, I just chalk it up to expected, normal behavior.

     

     

    Not sure what is "nutty" about my post, or why you think I give "this much of a sh*t" as you so eloquently put.  I find the whole thing an interesting social experiement.

    But ultimately the post has not been answered by any of the actual people it was aimed at.  Though the discussion I thought was pretty interesting....well until this post at least.  Nice to take the easy way out and say that everyone who makes a nutty post here is a young kid.

    His response could have been less colorful, however, some of the words you've choosen, "team zealot"  "a-hole atheist"  "hardcore zealot"  Not to metion some of your religious analogies seemingly projected upon your intended targets. 

    It seems apparent that your intitial post is "colored" and "flavored" in a shall-we-say, spicy demeanor to put it mildly.  Instead of complaining about his "nutty" reference (and fecal comment withheld for obvious reasons as I prefer to take a more tasteful route), don't you think you deseve a few flames by the use of ur own choice of labels?  If you wanted a more objective response then perhaps your post should have had less colorful wording to begin with.

     

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