Here's my challenge for you. Go get 10-15 talented buddies of yours, start a new company, and, with no previous experience whatsoever; try to make a niche MMORPG. I'll be surprised if you can even create a decent enough plan for it to get an investor.
After that, work for 7-8 years on minimal wages to conserve resources, knowing all to well that you'll barely have enough money to even have one decent server at launch IF you get there. traverse through the unimaginably complex and tricky world of coding a MONUFUCKINGMENTAL game, then, FINALLY, have EIGHT years, try to release it; only to be meant with twenty times the amount of traffic you had expected (becase you never advertised, kept a low profile, etc...) and have everyone attack you because you can't afford the absolute best of the best in server technology for your billing and processing partners.
When you do that, you can talk. Until then, shut your clueless fucking hole. You paid 53$. That's nothing. That's fucking chump change for the effort they've put into this. The idea that you can't support an indie company because they've had a rough start, like even the BIGGEST companies have when launching an MMORPG, is ridiculous.
Not true, Aion launch was flawless and they had ten's of thousands more peeps and servers (12) on launch day than DF did.
By your comments you sound like you are vested or have stock in AV. Get a clue bro.
ncsoft has odne it many times over already and has way more money and personel
This is a smooth launch, let's think about how much fail GOA pulled out with Warhammer. That was long epic fight. At least Aventurine as a small company tries it's best to pull this off.
Hrm no? I'll wait some time for them to work out a launch, now that servers are up (the lag was minimal) they just need some tweaking to become stable, Granted, this launch is terrible, no doubt. But to disregaurd a good game because a bad launch (common in MMORPGs) is stupid. Give it more then 20mins before everyone cries cancle.
You're entitled to do as you wish.
This thread is for those who can see the writing on the wall without needing the ceiling to fall on them first.
you have no idea do you the game is just fine there doign teh schedule maintiance now sevrer will be up for the most part today i would say
More conjecture? Id say after Feb 25th your conjecture should be considered worthless at best. You really think theyre gonna bang out the shit ton of problems theyre having with such a small team? I predicted this years ago. Perhaps they should have their AI "testers" have a go at fixing some problems.
wghats problems the sync issue is fixed prett ymuch now hence whyt he server where going down the first fe whours because they was fixing that there isnt a hsit ton of problem iw as jsut talkignt o people on ts that was ing ame before maint. started the game was running fine.
the pre orders not beign chartged and account not being acitvated is more of an issue than the game it self so meh
Originally posted by Zorvan "game is feature complete and ready for release" "game is in better shape than any other mmo at this point" "we use the pre-orders to know exactly how many people to expect so we are ready" "we've already got publishing and billing taken care of"
So, although I might normally agree with you when it comes to indy devs, Aventurine ( through Tasos ) shot themselves in the ass and can expect no sympathy from me., and should expect none from anyone else.
I agree with you 110%, the problem is DF's community which happens to be full of tween's and immature young adults are in denial and unable to see the truth of a broken product due to 'fanboy'ism'.
The amount of l33t speak in the local chat's during beta was more than enough to note DF's community not to mention the gank'fest it will become should the game ever go live this year!
Originally posted by Zorvan "game is feature complete and ready for release" "game is in better shape than any other mmo at this point" "we use the pre-orders to know exactly how many people to expect so we are ready" "we've already got publishing and billing taken care of"
So, although I might normally agree with you when it comes to indy devs, Aventurine ( through Tasos ) shot themselves in the ass and can expect no sympathy from me., and should expect none from anyone else.
I agree with you 110%, the problem is DF's community which happens to be full of tween's and immature young adults are in denial and unable to see the truth of a broken product due to 'fanboy'ism'.
The amount of l33t speak in the local chat's during beta was more than enough to note DF's community not to mention the gank'fest it will become should the game ever go live this year!
a broken game wtf are you talking about? and i didnt see leet speak or a whole lot of it whya re you making shit up?
I'm supprised how much slack you peeps are cutting for AV...What does this tell the rest of the gaming companies.
Funny you bitch about the other game launches but in regards to AV you cut them slack because there "indy". ROLF. What does being an indy have anything to do with it. Its all about the product and how you deliver it.
Velika: City of Wheels: Among the mortal races, the humans were the only one that never built cities or great empires; a curse laid upon them by their creator, Gidd, forced them to wander as nomads for twenty centuries...
and the people that got to play this morning said the game was working fine except the lil sync issue theyw as having which is pretty much fixed now
Give it a rest, that BS an't flying no more.
Velika: City of Wheels: Among the mortal races, the humans were the only one that never built cities or great empires; a curse laid upon them by their creator, Gidd, forced them to wander as nomads for twenty centuries...
I'm supprised how much slack you peeps are cutting for AV...What does this tell the rest of the gaming companies. Funny you bitch about the other game launches but in regards to AV you cut them slack because there "indy". ROLF. What does being an indy have anything to do with it. Its all about the product and how you deliver it.
we bicth about broken buggy games not a rough launch
I'm supprised how much slack you peeps are cutting for AV...What does this tell the rest of the gaming companies. Funny you bitch about the other game launches but in regards to AV you cut them slack because there "indy". ROLF. What does being an indy have anything to do with it. Its all about the product and how you deliver it.
I show a ton of slack towards indie companies. I show little to large ones though, because they have the experience, manpower and finances to avoid stuff like this happening.
i figure i will waste my time as im bored senseless anywho
you know what i truely hope for?
That someday in the near future people will learn to make there own opinions for things after they have first hand experience with it.
Hell lets go one step further, that individuals will actually research and try things out before putting their own egotistical illogical self serving nonsense out there for everyone to see.
Personally i know this will never happen as people are completely happy to just jump on a band wagon filled with people who state their own illogical unnecessary bs without ever attempting to try things out or find out whats true and make their own decisions FOR THEMSELVES.
What most people do not realize is that half the shit that gets passed around is baseless rumors and unproven hearsay.
Does anyone actually take the time to read and find out if things are true before they decide to believe it to be true? (for example hackers are their videos out proving it?) (they say you can find hacks but are you sure they are not just virus's with keyloggers ?)
and no im not saying that darkfalls horrid launch is a rumor it is indeed fact that its in a bad spot .
Servers are finally opening up after a 12 hour delay. Processing the pre-orders took much longer than the original estimate we were given, and we caught a bug at the last minute that we didn’t want to launch with. We apologize for the long delay and we hope you enjoy your first day in Darkfall
We have extended the free month of play to 33 days to thank you for your patience and to try to begin making up for the inconvenience.
--------------there all you whiney girl trolls can leave now-- -------------
I do not believe this to be a good suggestion at all. The game is having a rough lauch with is expected. I have hardly ever been in a good lauch even if there was big stress test beforehand and million pumped into the game. So expecting a small indi company would as good as any of those companies would have been foolish.
Well, to be fair, other companies that had similar issues (too many people) generally expected many more than AV.
From what I can gather, AV was expecting a few tens of thousands, which seems odd considering 1) how long it was in development (people naturally expect something epic after that long a time), and 2) how much they hyped the game as being FFA PvP, revolutionary, etc. Now maybe much of the hype was community generated, but AV certainly planted the seeds of expectation. Then when they finally saw how much anticipation there was, uttered a collective 'UH-OH' and are scrambling to get it to work.
And they seem to be having issues with pretty much everything.
It'll be interesting to see how the server(s) react once they truly open them up.
Servers are finally opening up after a 12 hour delay. Processing the pre-orders took much longer than the original estimate we were given, and we caught a bug at the last minute that we didn’t want to launch with. We apologize for the long delay and we hope you enjoy your first day in Darkfall We have extended the free month of play to 33 days to thank you for your patience and to try to begin making up for the inconvenience. --------------there all you whiney girl trolls can leave now-- -------------
the funny thing is they are all playing the game...
Here's my challenge for you. Go get 10-15 talented buddies of yours, start a new company, and, with no previous experience whatsoever; try to make a niche MMORPG. I'll be surprised if you can even create a decent enough plan for it to get an investor. After that, work for 7-8 years on minimal wages to conserve resources, knowing all to well that you'll barely have enough money to even have one decent server at launch IF you get there. traverse through the unimaginably complex and tricky world of coding a MONUFUCKINGMENTAL game, then, FINALLY, have EIGHT years, try to release it; only to be meant with twenty times the amount of traffic you had expected (becase you never advertised, kept a low profile, etc...) and have everyone attack you because you can't afford the absolute best of the best in server technology for your billing and processing partners. When you do that, you can talk. {mod edit} You paid 53$. That's nothing. That's fucking chump change for the effort they've put into this. The idea that you can't support an indie company because they've had a rough start, like even the BIGGEST companies have when launching an MMORPG, is ridiculous.
I do lack the leaderships capibility to do this. I also lack the programming skills right now. However hopefully in a few years I will be able to have the programming skills and maybe even the leadership skills. Also you really did not read my answer of even have read and history of my answer before you started to personal attack me and that make you look kinda foolish.
It is not my fault that they are not capible of releasing this game as they should and should we accept that? Becouse they are an indi company? Becouse they decide to chew on more then they can eat? NO! As a company you should know your limitations, work with you limitations and produces something great and not something with sounds great and have to give a lot up. This is what they had to do, with is a shame.
I really find this type of attacks funny as it is a last resort type one. The fact that I have not expirienced something does not mean I can not have an opinion about buisiness ethics and how I believe might be the most efficient way of dealing with this. I believe they did it the wrong way, if you disagree by all means tell me how they did it is right?
The staged release, that is actualy something they did right. They saw there limitation and work with it. That is good, that is visionary and that is what a company and especialy an indi company needs to function well. Anyhow next time read what I write down. All I said was that Tasos made mistakes by claiming things with where clearly untrue and that a small company will have an hard time expecting to have a perfect launch....infact....we agree with each other. I only as a paying costumers (or potential one) find it wierd that we as costumers find this normal, not only from indi companies, but even from bigger companies.
Here's my challenge for you. Go get 10-15 talented buddies of yours, start a new company, and, with no previous experience whatsoever; try to make a niche MMORPG. I'll be surprised if you can even create a decent enough plan for it to get an investor. After that, work for 7-8 years on minimal wages to conserve resources, knowing all to well that you'll barely have enough money to even have one decent server at launch IF you get there. traverse through the unimaginably complex and tricky world of coding a MONUFUCKINGMENTAL game, then, FINALLY, have EIGHT years, try to release it; only to be meant with twenty times the amount of traffic you had expected (becase you never advertised, kept a low profile, etc...) and have everyone attack you because you can't afford the absolute best of the best in server technology for your billing and processing partners. When you do that, you can talk. {mod edit} You paid 53$. That's nothing. That's fucking chump change for the effort they've put into this. The idea that you can't support an indie company because they've had a rough start, like even the BIGGEST companies have when launching an MMORPG, is ridiculous.
I do lack the leaderships capibility to do this. I also lack the programming skills right now. However hopefully in a few years I will be able to have the programming skills and maybe even the leadership skills. Also you really did not read my answer of even have read and history of my answer before you started to personal attack me and that make you look kinda foolish.
It is not my fault that they are not capible of releasing this game as they should and should we accept that? Becouse they are an indi company? Becouse they decide to chew on more then they can eat? NO! As a company you should know your limitations, work with you limitations and produces something great and not something with sounds great and have to give a lot up. This is what they had to do, with is a shame.
I really find this type of attacks funny as it is a last resort type one. The fact that I have not expirienced something does not mean I can not have an opinion about buisiness ethics and how I believe might be the most efficient way of dealing with this. I believe they did it the wrong way, if you disagree by all means tell me how they did it is right?
The staged release, that is actualy something they did right. They saw there limitation and work with it. That is good, that is visionary and that is what a company and especialy an indi company needs to function well. Anyhow next time read what I write down. All I said was that Tasos made mistakes by claiming things with where clearly untrue and that a small company will have an hard time expecting to have a perfect launch....infact....we agree with each other. I only as a paying costumers (or potential one) find it wierd that we as costumers find this normal, not only from indi companies, but even from bigger companies.
Great, so can I have your contact information? I want to send this to you when your game fails.
You obviously know nothing about what it actually takes to make a video game. I'll give you a hint: look at the credits for every 'blockbuster' MMO and count how many people it took to make the game. You can also use any AAA console game for this experiment.
I'll help you get started with your experiment by writing your hypothesis for you.
Hypothesis: my small team of people can make an MMORPG that's better than Darkfall
Great, so can I have your contact information? I want to send this to you when your game fails. You obviously know nothing about what it actually takes to make a video game. I'll give you a hint: look at the credits for every 'blockbuster' MMO and count how many people it took to make the game. You can also use any AAA console game for this experiment. I'll help you get started with your experiment by writing your hypothesis for you. Hypothesis: my small team of people can make an MMORPG that's better than Darkfall
I am not going to make a game becouse I am aware I am not capible of doing so. I am aware what goes around in the ICT world and I know that only 20% of the project actualy release with all features and working as it should and about 40% do not even get released. I believe this is bad and should be unacceptable!
Sorry for not being easily happy or accepting certain things. I pay for a product and expect it to work as advertised. I am no chef, but that does not mean I should not expect a proper meal when I go to a resturant and not something not rightly baked. I would not just eat it if they told me it was made by an intern. I would still want a new one, but would accapt it aswell. Stuff like it happens.
Getting fucking pissed about this. I am only saying that we can not expect a good lauch from an indi game developer like AV and I am right...unless you consider this a good lauch ><
It is a boon to the gaming industry seeing MMORPG staff and long time community memners supporting teaching Tasos a lesson by doing chargebacks to the company he works for.
Comments
lol thats true
Then again I cant recall an MMO as of late that you couldnt so much as play on launch day. Anyone else know of one?
Here's my challenge for you. Go get 10-15 talented buddies of yours, start a new company, and, with no previous experience whatsoever; try to make a niche MMORPG. I'll be surprised if you can even create a decent enough plan for it to get an investor.
After that, work for 7-8 years on minimal wages to conserve resources, knowing all to well that you'll barely have enough money to even have one decent server at launch IF you get there. traverse through the unimaginably complex and tricky world of coding a MONUFUCKINGMENTAL game, then, FINALLY, have EIGHT years, try to release it; only to be meant with twenty times the amount of traffic you had expected (becase you never advertised, kept a low profile, etc...) and have everyone attack you because you can't afford the absolute best of the best in server technology for your billing and processing partners.
When you do that, you can talk. Until then, shut your clueless fucking hole. You paid 53$. That's nothing. That's fucking chump change for the effort they've put into this. The idea that you can't support an indie company because they've had a rough start, like even the BIGGEST companies have when launching an MMORPG, is ridiculous.
Not true, Aion launch was flawless and they had ten's of thousands more peeps and servers (12) on launch day than DF did.
By your comments you sound like you are vested or have stock in AV. Get a clue bro.
ncsoft has odne it many times over already and has way more money and personel
This is a smooth launch, let's think about how much fail GOA pulled out with Warhammer. That was long epic fight. At least Aventurine as a small company tries it's best to pull this off.
img385.imageshack.us/img385/4622/vnp1jkwq9.jpg
You're entitled to do as you wish.
This thread is for those who can see the writing on the wall without needing the ceiling to fall on them first.
you have no idea do you the game is just fine there doign teh schedule maintiance now sevrer will be up for the most part today i would say
More conjecture? Id say after Feb 25th your conjecture should be considered worthless at best. You really think theyre gonna bang out the shit ton of problems theyre having with such a small team? I predicted this years ago. Perhaps they should have their AI "testers" have a go at fixing some problems.
wghats problems the sync issue is fixed prett ymuch now hence whyt he server where going down the first fe whours because they was fixing that there isnt a hsit ton of problem iw as jsut talkignt o people on ts that was ing ame before maint. started the game was running fine.
the pre orders not beign chartged and account not being acitvated is more of an issue than the game it self so meh
lol thats true
Then again I cant recall an MMO as of late that you couldnt so much as play on launch day. Anyone else know of one?
vanguard.
I agree with you 110%, the problem is DF's community which happens to be full of tween's and immature young adults are in denial and unable to see the truth of a broken product due to 'fanboy'ism'.
The amount of l33t speak in the local chat's during beta was more than enough to note DF's community not to mention the gank'fest it will become should the game ever go live this year!
10 print "go home"
20 goto 10
lol thats true
Then again I cant recall an MMO as of late that you couldnt so much as play on launch day. Anyone else know of one?
vanguard.
Incorrect I played for a while on launch day. It was horrendous, but I did "play" for lack of a better word.
I agree with you 110%, the problem is DF's community which happens to be full of tween's and immature young adults are in denial and unable to see the truth of a broken product due to 'fanboy'ism'.
The amount of l33t speak in the local chat's during beta was more than enough to note DF's community not to mention the gank'fest it will become should the game ever go live this year!
a broken game wtf are you talking about? and i didnt see leet speak or a whole lot of it whya re you making shit up?
lol thats true
Then again I cant recall an MMO as of late that you couldnt so much as play on launch day. Anyone else know of one?
vanguard.
Incorrect I played for a while on launch day. It was horrendous, but I did "play" for lack of a better word.
and the people that got to play this morning said the game was working fine except the lil sync issue theyw as having which is pretty much fixed now
I'm supprised how much slack you peeps are cutting for AV...What does this tell the rest of the gaming companies.
Funny you bitch about the other game launches but in regards to AV you cut them slack because there "indy". ROLF. What does being an indy have anything to do with it. Its all about the product and how you deliver it.
Velika: City of Wheels: Among the mortal races, the humans were the only one that never built cities or great empires; a curse laid upon them by their creator, Gidd, forced them to wander as nomads for twenty centuries...
lol thats true
Then again I cant recall an MMO as of late that you couldnt so much as play on launch day. Anyone else know of one?
vanguard.
Incorrect I played for a while on launch day. It was horrendous, but I did "play" for lack of a better word.
and the people that got to play this morning said the game was working fine except the lil sync issue theyw as having which is pretty much fixed now
Sorry to bother you Dr. down, but you're being paged: http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/post/2671785/thread/225333#2671785
and the people that got to play this morning said the game was working fine except the lil sync issue theyw as having which is pretty much fixed now
Give it a rest, that BS an't flying no more.
Velika: City of Wheels: Among the mortal races, the humans were the only one that never built cities or great empires; a curse laid upon them by their creator, Gidd, forced them to wander as nomads for twenty centuries...
we bicth about broken buggy games not a rough launch
and the people that got to play this morning said the game was working fine except the lil sync issue theyw as having which is pretty much fixed now
Give it a rest, that BS an't flying no more.
ok you think that i dont think my clan woud dlie to me or my friends lols
I show a ton of slack towards indie companies. I show little to large ones though, because they have the experience, manpower and finances to avoid stuff like this happening.
i figure i will waste my time as im bored senseless anywho
you know what i truely hope for?
That someday in the near future people will learn to make there own opinions for things after they have first hand experience with it.
Hell lets go one step further, that individuals will actually research and try things out before putting their own egotistical illogical self serving nonsense out there for everyone to see.
Personally i know this will never happen as people are completely happy to just jump on a band wagon filled with people who state their own illogical unnecessary bs without ever attempting to try things out or find out whats true and make their own decisions FOR THEMSELVES.
What most people do not realize is that half the shit that gets passed around is baseless rumors and unproven hearsay.
Does anyone actually take the time to read and find out if things are true before they decide to believe it to be true? (for example hackers are their videos out proving it?) (they say you can find hacks but are you sure they are not just virus's with keyloggers ?)
and no im not saying that darkfalls horrid launch is a rumor it is indeed fact that its in a bad spot .
Servers are finally opening up after a 12 hour delay. Processing the pre-orders took much longer than the original estimate we were given, and we caught a bug at the last minute that we didn’t want to launch with. We apologize for the long delay and we hope you enjoy your first day in Darkfall
We have extended the free month of play to 33 days to thank you for your patience and to try to begin making up for the inconvenience.
--------------there all you whiney girl trolls can leave now-- -------------
Well, to be fair, other companies that had similar issues (too many people) generally expected many more than AV.
From what I can gather, AV was expecting a few tens of thousands, which seems odd considering 1) how long it was in development (people naturally expect something epic after that long a time), and 2) how much they hyped the game as being FFA PvP, revolutionary, etc. Now maybe much of the hype was community generated, but AV certainly planted the seeds of expectation. Then when they finally saw how much anticipation there was, uttered a collective 'UH-OH' and are scrambling to get it to work.
And they seem to be having issues with pretty much everything.
It'll be interesting to see how the server(s) react once they truly open them up.
the funny thing is they are all playing the game...
a game they have whined about for months.
I do lack the leaderships capibility to do this. I also lack the programming skills right now. However hopefully in a few years I will be able to have the programming skills and maybe even the leadership skills. Also you really did not read my answer of even have read and history of my answer before you started to personal attack me and that make you look kinda foolish.
It is not my fault that they are not capible of releasing this game as they should and should we accept that? Becouse they are an indi company? Becouse they decide to chew on more then they can eat? NO! As a company you should know your limitations, work with you limitations and produces something great and not something with sounds great and have to give a lot up. This is what they had to do, with is a shame.
I really find this type of attacks funny as it is a last resort type one. The fact that I have not expirienced something does not mean I can not have an opinion about buisiness ethics and how I believe might be the most efficient way of dealing with this. I believe they did it the wrong way, if you disagree by all means tell me how they did it is right?
The staged release, that is actualy something they did right. They saw there limitation and work with it. That is good, that is visionary and that is what a company and especialy an indi company needs to function well. Anyhow next time read what I write down. All I said was that Tasos made mistakes by claiming things with where clearly untrue and that a small company will have an hard time expecting to have a perfect launch....infact....we agree with each other. I only as a paying costumers (or potential one) find it wierd that we as costumers find this normal, not only from indi companies, but even from bigger companies.
I do lack the leaderships capibility to do this. I also lack the programming skills right now. However hopefully in a few years I will be able to have the programming skills and maybe even the leadership skills. Also you really did not read my answer of even have read and history of my answer before you started to personal attack me and that make you look kinda foolish.
It is not my fault that they are not capible of releasing this game as they should and should we accept that? Becouse they are an indi company? Becouse they decide to chew on more then they can eat? NO! As a company you should know your limitations, work with you limitations and produces something great and not something with sounds great and have to give a lot up. This is what they had to do, with is a shame.
I really find this type of attacks funny as it is a last resort type one. The fact that I have not expirienced something does not mean I can not have an opinion about buisiness ethics and how I believe might be the most efficient way of dealing with this. I believe they did it the wrong way, if you disagree by all means tell me how they did it is right?
The staged release, that is actualy something they did right. They saw there limitation and work with it. That is good, that is visionary and that is what a company and especialy an indi company needs to function well. Anyhow next time read what I write down. All I said was that Tasos made mistakes by claiming things with where clearly untrue and that a small company will have an hard time expecting to have a perfect launch....infact....we agree with each other. I only as a paying costumers (or potential one) find it wierd that we as costumers find this normal, not only from indi companies, but even from bigger companies.
Great, so can I have your contact information? I want to send this to you when your game fails.
You obviously know nothing about what it actually takes to make a video game. I'll give you a hint: look at the credits for every 'blockbuster' MMO and count how many people it took to make the game. You can also use any AAA console game for this experiment.
I'll help you get started with your experiment by writing your hypothesis for you.
Hypothesis: my small team of people can make an MMORPG that's better than Darkfall
yeah i hope you guys go ahead .
and get charge backs on your credit cards.
because when i get the game i don't wanna be fighting no whiney bitches
I am not going to make a game becouse I am aware I am not capible of doing so. I am aware what goes around in the ICT world and I know that only 20% of the project actualy release with all features and working as it should and about 40% do not even get released. I believe this is bad and should be unacceptable!
Sorry for not being easily happy or accepting certain things. I pay for a product and expect it to work as advertised. I am no chef, but that does not mean I should not expect a proper meal when I go to a resturant and not something not rightly baked. I would not just eat it if they told me it was made by an intern. I would still want a new one, but would accapt it aswell. Stuff like it happens.
Getting fucking pissed about this. I am only saying that we can not expect a good lauch from an indi game developer like AV and I am right...unless you consider this a good lauch ><
Do you like playing with yourself haha.
It is a boon to the gaming industry seeing MMORPG staff and long time community memners supporting teaching Tasos a lesson by doing chargebacks to the company he works for.
Good To The Last Drop.