One of the most important issue for a game like DF is the quality of the community. DF does not provide much room for enjoyment in soloing. To make a game, you need to interact with ppl. You need ppl to PVP with, you need to deal with ppl who would inevitably come in your way when you pve. The game makes or breaks by the community.
This is what basically stops me from considering buying this game, as I expect a lot of jerks there. Actually you mentioned that the game design encourages jerks. Does this translate into a game world in which ppl would be as nasty as they want to be? I have enuf dealing with ppl I do not like, in RL dealings. In the cyber world, for a break after work, I rather not see these jerks anymore. I wish you can someday update your review with more specific information on social relations and the community at large.
Orthedos, I say this honestly. Darkfall may not be your game at this point in time. Roaming gangs abound looking for the easy kill. New player starting zones are often targeted. Are these players terrible people? No. They are playing the game within the rules of the game. After 4+ years of WOW-ish hand-holding by the MMO industry where defeat by an enemy gives no consequence except a bruised ego (EvE being the exception), many players have used Darkfall as a catharctic release of rage.
I wager it will tone down after a while. Killing newbies only to find the only loot is a loaf of bread will grow old. A month or two down the road, people will be more interested in city assaults and naval battles.
As I said in the review, this isnt 'Darkfall Online', its 'Darfur online'. This is an ugly world and might makes right.
Dont be dragged in by other posters claim of Internet Machismo "You are all carebears if you cant hack Darkfall". If this game isnt enjoyable, then you'd be silly to play it. There are plenty of games who have a great community even while fighting eachother. DAOC, WAR, AoC, EVE to name a few.
I will add that there are jerks in the chat channels, and there are very helpful people in chat. IN the end, just as with RL, the playerbase is a mixture of good and bad. The darkfall playerbase needs time to mature a bit, just like the game itself does.
I gotta say, Czzarre, that was my favorite review so far. I learned some things I didn't know about the game, and the overall review was very balanced, in my opinion. What you brought up about the gold sellers was intriguing, but I guess all games have those. I wonder if AV will be up to the task to combat their type.
Well done!
It's a proven historical fact that beer saved humankind.
Orthedos, I say this honestly. Darkfall may not be your game at this point in time. Roaming gangs abound looking for the easy kill. New player starting zones are often targeted. Are these players terrible people? No. They are playing the game within the rules of the game. After 4+ years of WOW-ish hand-holding by the MMO industry where defeat by an enemy gives no consequence except a bruised ego (EvE being the exception), many players have used Darkfall as a catharctic release of rage. I wager it will tone down after a while. Killing newbies only to find the only loot is a loaf of bread will grow old. A month or two down the road, people will be more interested in city assaults and naval battles. As I said in the review, this isnt 'Darkfall Online', its 'Darfur online'. This is an ugly world and might makes right. Dont be dragged in by other posters claim of Internet Machismo "You are all carebears if you cant hack Darkfall". If this game isnt enjoyable, then you'd be silly to play it. There are plenty of games who have a great community even while fighting eachother. DAOC, WAR, AoC, EVE to name a few. I will add that there are jerks in the chat channels, and there are very helpful people in chat. IN the end, just as with RL, the playerbase is a mixture of good and bad. The darkfall playerbase needs time to mature a bit, just like the game itself does.
Hope this helps
Cool tyvm, very helpful and cool-headed discussion. We need discussions like this, not the average hate and hype insult slinging in DF forums.
May I elaborate a bit. I do not hate DF, I never played it. I love PVP, but only when I want it. DAoC and SWG are my all time favourite till ToA and CU/NGE. Many will know why ToA and CU ruins the day.
But I want PVP only when I want to, not when I am chatting with my wife, or teaching her how the screen looks. If I zone into the frontier and got my ass handed to me by a bunch of stealthies I smile. If I log on as level 1 and immediately I find myself surrounded by 25 geared players waiting for me, its not funny. That is my style of gameplay.
I also place some weight on the quality of community. There are always jerks, but in normal gameplay I can ignore them mostly. They cannot affect my gameplay when I do not play with them. In FFA PVP, these jerks can always come over and ruin my day if they wish, and I believe many jerk will do so just for the sake of ruining my day. I do not want to pay for a game in which I am feeding these jerks. Maybe if they pay me, I do not mind loggin in and let them trash me. Frankly, even as a job, I pick tasks in which I am not a prey to a bad tempered client.
These are the reasons why I think some elaborations on the community helps. DF is too young a game for the community to mature. Maybe 1 year down the road we will know. It takes some years b4 Eve gets to it current stage, and even now its evolving. One hint however, from the forums we found quite a number of handles who proclaim they are playing and who talks in very dictatorial, unpleasant, unreasonable manners. Unless these handles (login names) all belong to the same person, or that they are lying about playing DF, it occurs to me that there are quite some annoying ppl in that game, and given only 5k or 10k total subs, this is disturbing. WoW has 12M subs, and there are bound to be enough nice ppl for me to interact with. With only 5k-10k and enough jerks, there is a chance that I will not even find enough nice ppl to hang around with during the odd hours I log on.
Orthedos, I say this honestly. Darkfall may not be your game at this point in time. Roaming gangs abound looking for the easy kill. New player starting zones are often targeted. Are these players terrible people? No. They are playing the game within the rules of the game. After 4+ years of WOW-ish hand-holding by the MMO industry where defeat by an enemy gives no consequence except a bruised ego (EvE being the exception), many players have used Darkfall as a catharctic release of rage. I wager it will tone down after a while. Killing newbies only to find the only loot is a loaf of bread will grow old. A month or two down the road, people will be more interested in city assaults and naval battles. As I said in the review, this isnt 'Darkfall Online', its 'Darfur online'. This is an ugly world and might makes right. Dont be dragged in by other posters claim of Internet Machismo "You are all carebears if you cant hack Darkfall". If this game isnt enjoyable, then you'd be silly to play it. There are plenty of games who have a great community even while fighting eachother. DAOC, WAR, AoC, EVE to name a few. I will add that there are jerks in the chat channels, and there are very helpful people in chat. IN the end, just as with RL, the playerbase is a mixture of good and bad. The darkfall playerbase needs time to mature a bit, just like the game itself does.
Hope this helps
Cool tyvm, very helpful and cool-headed discussion. We need discussions like this, not the average hate and hype insult slinging in DF forums.
May I elaborate a bit. I do not hate DF, I never played it. I love PVP, but only when I want it. DAoC and SWG are my all time favourite till ToA and CU/NGE. Many will know why ToA and CU ruins the day.
But I want PVP only when I want to, not when I am chatting with my wife, or teaching her how the screen looks. If I zone into the frontier and got my ass handed to me by a bunch of stealthies I smile. If I log on as level 1 and immediately I find myself surrounded by 25 geared players waiting for me, its not funny. That is my style of gameplay.
I also place some weight on the quality of community. There are always jerks, but in normal gameplay I can ignore them mostly. They cannot affect my gameplay when I do not play with them. In FFA PVP, these jerks can always come over and ruin my day if they wish, and I believe many jerk will do so just for the sake of ruining my day. I do not want to pay for a game in which I am feeding these jerks. Maybe if they pay me, I do not mind loggin in and let them trash me. Frankly, even as a job, I pick tasks in which I am not a prey to a bad tempered client.
These are the reasons why I think some elaborations on the community helps. DF is too young a game for the community to mature. Maybe 1 year down the road we will know. It takes some years b4 Eve gets to it current stage, and even now its evolving. One hint however, from the forums we found quite a number of handles who proclaim they are playing and who talks in very dictatorial, unpleasant, unreasonable manners. Unless these handles (login names) all belong to the same person, or that they are lying about playing DF, it occurs to me that there are quite some annoying ppl in that game, and given only 5k or 10k total subs, this is disturbing. WoW has 12M subs, and there are bound to be enough nice ppl for me to interact with. With only 5k-10k and enough jerks, there is a chance that I will not even find enough nice ppl to hang around with during the odd hours I log on.
Couple of last talking points. It is true that a few jarks can make you feel like the entire player population of a game are jerks. Obviously this is incorrect. Just like judging a game by the forum posters. Those who post on this forum are often radicalized (Both pro and con) and the true measure of the game's players fall well into the middle. Also, the best way to play Darkfall (some say the only way) is to join a clan. My experience is that life in Darkfall becomes a lot more pleasant when you have friends with large polearms at your side, making jokes and watching eachother's back.
By your description of what you like in PvP, have you considered WAR or AoC? Both are new. WAR is more popular but AoC is having a resurgance after a poor launch.
"This game is not for everyone": means nothing for MMORPG's subscribers. We're all old players, played and tried and beta tested many and many games and mmorpgs since years
In fan's "dictionary and vocabulary", this only means: "unfinished, bugged and so on, pay for a beta and shut up".
Last time fanboys told a game wasn't for everyone it was for... VANGUARD (then for AOC) at release. Now the game is empty. you can think about it. A game IS for everyone. It's not a job but a game.
"This game is not for everyone": means nothing for MMORPG's subscribers. We're all old players, played and tried and beta tested many and many games and mmorpgs since years
In fan's "dictionary and vocabulary", this only means: "unfinished, bugged and so on, pay for a beta and shut up". Last time fanboys told a game wasn't for everyone it was for... VANGUARD (then for AOC) at release. Now the game is empty. you can think about it. A game IS for everyone. It's not a job but a game.
I disagree. Not for everyone is not equal to 'unfinished, bugged, etc'
EvE online is well matured, established, with only a few remaining issues. We all know that not everyone will like that game
LOTRO is beautiful and well polished ...but it is not for a PvP oriented player.
'NOt for everyone' in Darkfall's case isnt because of the bugs (which I mention) nor the fact that its raw / unfinished (I mention this too). The fact that you can lose everything, face unfair odds repeatedly, have to go back and start over and over from scratch is what will be the biggest issue to the average MMO player. As I said, I wager 8 out of 10 players will not stick with this game, largly because of this (and the cumbersom user interface).
Comments
Great review, I hate the game snd still found your review interesting. Thats how you know you did a good job.
One of the most important issue for a game like DF is the quality of the community. DF does not provide much room for enjoyment in soloing. To make a game, you need to interact with ppl. You need ppl to PVP with, you need to deal with ppl who would inevitably come in your way when you pve. The game makes or breaks by the community.
This is what basically stops me from considering buying this game, as I expect a lot of jerks there. Actually you mentioned that the game design encourages jerks. Does this translate into a game world in which ppl would be as nasty as they want to be? I have enuf dealing with ppl I do not like, in RL dealings. In the cyber world, for a break after work, I rather not see these jerks anymore. I wish you can someday update your review with more specific information on social relations and the community at large.
Orthedos, I say this honestly. Darkfall may not be your game at this point in time. Roaming gangs abound looking for the easy kill. New player starting zones are often targeted. Are these players terrible people? No. They are playing the game within the rules of the game. After 4+ years of WOW-ish hand-holding by the MMO industry where defeat by an enemy gives no consequence except a bruised ego (EvE being the exception), many players have used Darkfall as a catharctic release of rage.
I wager it will tone down after a while. Killing newbies only to find the only loot is a loaf of bread will grow old. A month or two down the road, people will be more interested in city assaults and naval battles.
As I said in the review, this isnt 'Darkfall Online', its 'Darfur online'. This is an ugly world and might makes right.
Dont be dragged in by other posters claim of Internet Machismo "You are all carebears if you cant hack Darkfall". If this game isnt enjoyable, then you'd be silly to play it. There are plenty of games who have a great community even while fighting eachother. DAOC, WAR, AoC, EVE to name a few.
I will add that there are jerks in the chat channels, and there are very helpful people in chat. IN the end, just as with RL, the playerbase is a mixture of good and bad. The darkfall playerbase needs time to mature a bit, just like the game itself does.
Hope this helps
Torrential: DAOC (Pendragon)
Awned: World of Warcraft (Lothar)
Torren: Warhammer Online (Praag)
I gotta say, Czzarre, that was my favorite review so far. I learned some things I didn't know about the game, and the overall review was very balanced, in my opinion. What you brought up about the gold sellers was intriguing, but I guess all games have those. I wonder if AV will be up to the task to combat their type.
Well done!
It's a proven historical fact that beer saved humankind.
"If graphics are important to you, DO NOT play Darkfall. "
Thanks for that tidbit. Now I know not to play.
Cool tyvm, very helpful and cool-headed discussion. We need discussions like this, not the average hate and hype insult slinging in DF forums.
May I elaborate a bit. I do not hate DF, I never played it. I love PVP, but only when I want it. DAoC and SWG are my all time favourite till ToA and CU/NGE. Many will know why ToA and CU ruins the day.
But I want PVP only when I want to, not when I am chatting with my wife, or teaching her how the screen looks. If I zone into the frontier and got my ass handed to me by a bunch of stealthies I smile. If I log on as level 1 and immediately I find myself surrounded by 25 geared players waiting for me, its not funny. That is my style of gameplay.
I also place some weight on the quality of community. There are always jerks, but in normal gameplay I can ignore them mostly. They cannot affect my gameplay when I do not play with them. In FFA PVP, these jerks can always come over and ruin my day if they wish, and I believe many jerk will do so just for the sake of ruining my day. I do not want to pay for a game in which I am feeding these jerks. Maybe if they pay me, I do not mind loggin in and let them trash me. Frankly, even as a job, I pick tasks in which I am not a prey to a bad tempered client.
These are the reasons why I think some elaborations on the community helps. DF is too young a game for the community to mature. Maybe 1 year down the road we will know. It takes some years b4 Eve gets to it current stage, and even now its evolving. One hint however, from the forums we found quite a number of handles who proclaim they are playing and who talks in very dictatorial, unpleasant, unreasonable manners. Unless these handles (login names) all belong to the same person, or that they are lying about playing DF, it occurs to me that there are quite some annoying ppl in that game, and given only 5k or 10k total subs, this is disturbing. WoW has 12M subs, and there are bound to be enough nice ppl for me to interact with. With only 5k-10k and enough jerks, there is a chance that I will not even find enough nice ppl to hang around with during the odd hours I log on.
Cool tyvm, very helpful and cool-headed discussion. We need discussions like this, not the average hate and hype insult slinging in DF forums.
May I elaborate a bit. I do not hate DF, I never played it. I love PVP, but only when I want it. DAoC and SWG are my all time favourite till ToA and CU/NGE. Many will know why ToA and CU ruins the day.
But I want PVP only when I want to, not when I am chatting with my wife, or teaching her how the screen looks. If I zone into the frontier and got my ass handed to me by a bunch of stealthies I smile. If I log on as level 1 and immediately I find myself surrounded by 25 geared players waiting for me, its not funny. That is my style of gameplay.
I also place some weight on the quality of community. There are always jerks, but in normal gameplay I can ignore them mostly. They cannot affect my gameplay when I do not play with them. In FFA PVP, these jerks can always come over and ruin my day if they wish, and I believe many jerk will do so just for the sake of ruining my day. I do not want to pay for a game in which I am feeding these jerks. Maybe if they pay me, I do not mind loggin in and let them trash me. Frankly, even as a job, I pick tasks in which I am not a prey to a bad tempered client.
These are the reasons why I think some elaborations on the community helps. DF is too young a game for the community to mature. Maybe 1 year down the road we will know. It takes some years b4 Eve gets to it current stage, and even now its evolving. One hint however, from the forums we found quite a number of handles who proclaim they are playing and who talks in very dictatorial, unpleasant, unreasonable manners. Unless these handles (login names) all belong to the same person, or that they are lying about playing DF, it occurs to me that there are quite some annoying ppl in that game, and given only 5k or 10k total subs, this is disturbing. WoW has 12M subs, and there are bound to be enough nice ppl for me to interact with. With only 5k-10k and enough jerks, there is a chance that I will not even find enough nice ppl to hang around with during the odd hours I log on.
Couple of last talking points. It is true that a few jarks can make you feel like the entire player population of a game are jerks. Obviously this is incorrect. Just like judging a game by the forum posters. Those who post on this forum are often radicalized (Both pro and con) and the true measure of the game's players fall well into the middle. Also, the best way to play Darkfall (some say the only way) is to join a clan. My experience is that life in Darkfall becomes a lot more pleasant when you have friends with large polearms at your side, making jokes and watching eachother's back.
By your description of what you like in PvP, have you considered WAR or AoC? Both are new. WAR is more popular but AoC is having a resurgance after a poor launch.
Torrential: DAOC (Pendragon)
Awned: World of Warcraft (Lothar)
Torren: Warhammer Online (Praag)
"This game is not for everyone": means nothing for MMORPG's subscribers. We're all old players, played and tried and beta tested many and many games and mmorpgs since years
In fan's "dictionary and vocabulary", this only means: "unfinished, bugged and so on, pay for a beta and shut up".
Last time fanboys told a game wasn't for everyone it was for... VANGUARD (then for AOC) at release. Now the game is empty. you can think about it. A game IS for everyone. It's not a job but a game.
I disagree. Not for everyone is not equal to 'unfinished, bugged, etc'
EvE online is well matured, established, with only a few remaining issues. We all know that not everyone will like that game
LOTRO is beautiful and well polished ...but it is not for a PvP oriented player.
'NOt for everyone' in Darkfall's case isnt because of the bugs (which I mention) nor the fact that its raw / unfinished (I mention this too). The fact that you can lose everything, face unfair odds repeatedly, have to go back and start over and over from scratch is what will be the biggest issue to the average MMO player. As I said, I wager 8 out of 10 players will not stick with this game, largly because of this (and the cumbersom user interface).
Torrential: DAOC (Pendragon)
Awned: World of Warcraft (Lothar)
Torren: Warhammer Online (Praag)