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Question about EVE...
qweniden
Member Posts: 151
Hi,
EVE looks very appealing to me, but I have a question that Im hopping you guys can answer...
In many PVP games it seems like one guild/alliance always gets so dominate that no other group can help to topple them and it makes it less fun for everyone elese. Does EVE have this problem? If not, how do the game mechanics avoid this situation?
Also, Ive seen that the few times a dominant guild gets toppled (usually through sabotage of an insider) , the members of that guild get so discouraged that they all quit because they lost so many man-hours of work. It sucks to loose that many competitive and knowledgeable players at once. Does EVE have this problem? If not, how do the game mechanics avoid this situation?
Thanks!
Comments
EVE has the same problem..
Big alliances / corp dominate the important and most fun areas.
However a big corp or an alliance can easily be infiltrated and thus shift the balance of power.. Big alliances has collapsed because of this. Sabotage from within the alliance either a whole corp turn out bad or a few induviduals give away key information to the opponents.
Helps having the possiblity to have alts when you play EVE , for spying, sabotage and stealing.
In short EVE looks nice but don't be suprised when you get pwned without knowing what hit you takes very little to kill off a new person venturing into low sec systems.
Another sad fact is that GM's are ruining the game not sure how it is with that situation right now since I quit playing it but GM's favoured their "friends" in many circumstances some alliances/corps got special priviliges when it came to fighting desinated clusters so their team wouldn't exprience lag when they other team had to suffer.
So if you're looking for a fair game EVE is not the game for you. You will be screwed over and over again. If enjoy harming others or play bad guy EVE rewards you for that and it's a safe bet.
If you decide to try it as a new player you would most likely want to join a corp to learn about the game before you get screwed.
Corps ingame will help explain what is dangerous and what to do or not to do that is if you find a corp who hires a new player.
Good luck
Played eve for about a year now.
For your questions:
Eve corp/alliance size pvp is typically dominated by alliances/coalitions of thousands of people. These coalitions/alliances do rise and fall. The game has currently went through two "Dominating" alliances(BOB and MOO) that I know of since its inception and is currently on a third(Goonswarm.) Short of belonging to one of them or forming your own coalition(and finding thousands of ppl to fight) you will have a hard time accomplishing anything of note. Not to say that it prevents pvp as you are still perfectly able to run around ganking them or doing small fleet warfare. But when it comes to space sovereignity, POS warfare, or holding space, EVE is all about the gank.
To the second question, yes, EVE is fornicating with betrayal, deception, theft, spies disbanding your alliance, etc. Scamming money out of people in EVE is a legitmate practice that the devs do nothing about. It's easy to avoid scamming, but as for the rest of it, be really frakking careful who you trust.
Aye forgot to mention scamming is very frequent and the best way into the game is if you have friends already playing it so they can help you avoid being scammed.
Thanks for the response.
What is POS mean?
Also, if over 5 years there have only been three major alliances and there is little chance of someone like me (comming late to the game) ever getting really powerful, doesnt that take away alot of the fun of the game?
A POS is a Player Owned Station, it's modules you can set up near moons to act as stations.
And, even if you may never be as powerful as the vets, you will always have a chance. You could be the one who starts the alliance who challenges the major powerblocks, and pushes them back to kindergarden.
Edit:
Here's the sov map:
go-dl1.eve-files.com/media/corp/Verite/influence.png
It's updated daily.
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There is nothing stopping you from becoming powerful. Also, what's your definition of power?
Some people have upwards of 100 billion isk, and are financially powerful.
Some people fly titans, and can decimate whole fleets at the call of a fleet commander, they are no doubt powerful.
Maybe your definition of power is becoming a leader of an alliance and making strategic decisions and engaging in diplomacy.
Well let me tell you, there's nothing stopping a new player from getting power. They just have to meet the right people and get a little lucky (that's generally how power happens even in real life). Eve is a VERY established community, and there are people who have been playing since '03, but use that to your advantage! Get into a good corp and find good mentors and you'll be at their level in no time.
The major alliances don't own all the space that is capable of being owned. There are a number of smaller alliances that claim space sovereignty all over the 0.0 map. Admiteddly these days you really do need to be allied into power blocs but I would imagine there are at least 20 or 30 sovereignty claiming alliances (haven't physically counted them though so could be far fewer or more than that.
Additionally there is a thriving sub-culture making their way in low-sec space as well as plenty of hi-sec industrial and mission-running activity. There are also a number of mercenary alliances that don't claim space but are still involved in 0.0 politics if only because they're hired by other alliances to annoy their enemies. There are people who make roaming excursions into other people's claimed space in the hope of a quick fight.
In short, having a few large alliances takes no fun away from anybody unless they want to instantly be the leader of a similar sort of force. As long as your expectaions remain realistic or you have the wherewithal and stamina to build a large alliance from nothing there's still plenty in the game for you to enjoy. Find your niche and enjoy yourself within it.
Interesting, thanks. Seems like alot of groups have pretty sizable chunks.
There must be something inherent in the game mechanics that keep one group from completly dominating.
I guess in this context I was talking about poltical/military power
Could you please expand on that?
Also, another question if I can be indulged:
Does Eve have an WoW-style auction house or is it more like UO where people set up stores (vendors)?
The market is region-wise and involves multiple systems. The market is different in every region. So it's not like either of the two examples. It's hard to explain, I'd say, but try it out.
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theres a lot of misinformation in this thread IMO, theres no such thing as an unassailable group in EVE. GMs dont favour their friends (theres a bloody watchdog department to prevent this for gods sake).
Small alliances can and DO claim space, recent example: System Shock Initiative [SHOCK] were a group of the most entertainingly bad players I've ever had the misfortune to meet, they claimed some empty space near Providence and aligned themselves to the powers in the area (CVA + pets). There were only 500 or so of them making them a small alliance, but they claimed sov in 5 systems and built an outpost in KW. If they can do it, then anyone can.
Since EVE launched there have been major powerblocks come and go, no one alliance can control all of the space, but each area has its big boys and its little guys, ASCN, ISS, IAC, MoO at one time all were big players and now they are all dead. Look at the south, big players are AAA, Kenzoku, Goonswarm and then compare that to the north and the big players of MM, Razor, and the rest of the northernnapfest. Saying that any one group can control that is just daft.
EvEs market system is similar to how we buy things in Real life. markets are regional and prices change from system to system.
Imagine If your in the market for system Memory and you goto best buy they have 4 gigs of ram for 99 bucks, then you find out that staples has the same memory for 79 bucks but its in a bad area next to the projects.
Do you buy the expensive memory in the safe area or get the awesome deal and risk getting acap in ur ass?
Thats basically Eves market.
Playing: EvE, Ryzom
Interesting, thanks. Seems like alot of groups have pretty sizable chunks.
There must be something inherent in the game mechanics that keep one group from completly dominating.
The sheer size of space and the logistics needed to control what they have combined with other alliances ambitions to control space as well. All these things prevent any one group from being "TOO" large. Sure we have larger alliances that control a sizable portion of space but there is no way even somoene like BoB could have ever controled all of Eve, hell they couldn't even control more than a 3rd.
Does this help ?
To the OP while some of what this guy said is true most of it is simply misperception and misdirection on his part.
Just to set some facts straight.
The "GMs favor their friends" bit is pure bull - nothing else. There was a single incident years back where a GM cheated the company and gave himself some stuff. When this was discovered the things were deleted and he lost all GM rights. Also they created a department internally in the company (CCP) to prevent cheating. They monitor all actions taken by GM or dev staffmembers.
The only downside to EVE is the company behind it - they were some years ago so pressed for cash they didn't enforce their rules about a 3rd party utility/hack that Goonswarm alliance had made and used. They should have permanent banned around 2000 accounts, but since that's bad business they built in the stuff the hack did so they wouldn't need to use the 3rd party hack anymore.
(A way to tell friends from foes in the userlist/chatwindow).
Interesting, thanks. Seems like alot of groups have pretty sizable chunks.
There must be something inherent in the game mechanics that keep one group from completly dominating.
The sheer size of space and the logistics needed to control what they have combined with other alliances ambitions to control space as well. All these things prevent any one group from being "TOO" large. Sure we have larger alliances that control a sizable portion of space but there is no way even somoene like BoB could have ever controled all of Eve, hell they couldn't even control more than a 3rd.
Does this help ?
EVE has a 5+ year history with no corporation ever completely dominating 0.0 space, even when some were accused of getting assistance from the Devs. (which actually had little long term impact)
As you see in the influence map, many alliances are fighting for dominance and they certainly haven't given up in the struggle.
OP, it is entirely possible for you to join the game today and one day be leading a major alliance. Not saying you will, the road is very long and hard, but if that was your goal, its still possible.
But even for those of us with less lofty goals, there's still a lot of good fun to have in the game and I recommend you take the plunge.
There are times you will love it and times you will rage at your PC. You may get scammed (I lost 750M ISK recently) and you may do the scamming.
Its entirely up to you. But one thing is for sure, there is few similar game "worlds" like it out there, and its a unique experience.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
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Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
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"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Alliances rise and fall all the time. Not sure how anyone in their right mind can say that these powerblocs never falter. The influence map changes CONSTANTLY. Half the names on that map weren't there a year ago.
Thanks for all the feedback.
Sounds like EVE is the ONLY game to really deliver on the promise of real player created /controlled "lands" and have it work in a sustainable and balanced fasion.
EVE universe is too large to be dominated by 1 alliance, you always need allies. Everything depends on diplomacy, leadership and co-operation.
In EVE you fight for your own existence, no matter how large your alliance is.
Could you be more specific? What keeps one alliance from just getting so big and powerful that they control everything?
It's not misinformation am I afraid and there was a big issue about GM's giving advantage and CCP did admitt that some GM's lost their position because of this. As I said I don't know how it is now but it has occured that GM's abuse their power.
I've fought on the side that was granted special rights.
Could you be more specific? What keeps one alliance from just getting so big and powerful that they control everything?
Logistics! Several POS's (player owned stations) are needed to claim control over a single system. Some systems will need at least 30 poses to securley claim. There are many thousands of systems in eve. I am a member of goonswarm (the largest alliance in the game) and do quite a bit of logistics within. Just in the two regions we currently occupy, we have 119 systems and over 1000 POSs... all of which require time and resources to maintain. POSs burn fuel at a constant rate (not just one type of fuel either, many elements go into POS fueling, and different POSs require different fuel) and must be kept up in order for them to keep online. Furthurmore, each POS with all of the elements you can add to it can cost beyond 1 billion isk (in-game currency), so fully taking a single region of space can potentially cost trillions (not to mention the cost in lost ships taking the region by force).
If once alliance were to take over all of the space, it would take literally thousands of players doing nothing but spending hours traveling all over the galaxy fueling and maintaining an undefensible empire. There is litterally only so fast you can move around the eve univerise, and if you were fighting a front on one side of the expansive galaxy, it would be very difficult to optimally defend the other side.
It's not misinformation am I afraid and there was a big issue about GM's giving advantage and CCP did admitt that some GM's lost their position because of this. As I said I don't know how it is now but it has occured that GM's abuse their power.
I've fought on the side that was granted special rights.
While this was true, this specific incident was more than a few years ago, and since then CCP has created a wathdog body to prevent such things happening in the future. While there have been occasional claims of unfairness since then (namely the renaming of band of brothers) it has generally been due to oversight rather than foul intent and has been very quickly fixed.