On the other hand could certain posters here been clearer: What do you like about the game, what is the best parts?
Yap, this is the part im talking about. If you like the game and come here telling other players, it will be better to say which part you like about it. Maybe Mythic have add a new system that other players like and will join, or even come back.
And thus also help to promote the game...
Than you wont be accuse of being fanbois and a bashing war follows...
Just not for me ( can also see my thread history )
peace...
The game isn't perfect... but anyone claiming it's all bad must not have played it much, or simply doesn't like MMOs. There are issues of motivation, and keep sieges are all exactly the same because keeps are all exactly the same... but the RvR in the game is fun and abundant. Quests are plentiful and fairly rewarding. Itemization is pretty decent, graphics are passable.
I just don't see any reason to accuse someone of being a shill just because they say they enjoy the game.
Blatant advertising by a low count poster back up by a 2nd low count poster.
What does post count have to do with game enjoyment? I''m sure I have more game time than you! If you have fun playing it doesn't matter how many posts you have. That's just...dumb.
Maybe you can let us know which part of the game you enjoy.... exactly. Else It may seems to others that you are just 1 of Mythic employers etc....
Just my opinion...
I appreciate your opinion my point is there is no correlation between # posts on mmorpg.com and how much someone enjoys a game. I enjoy most parts of the game, except maybe crafting. That's a bit weak to me but that's not why I play the game so it doesn't matter to me. The part I enjoy most? PvP engagement. Not knowing what your opponent will do next. Trying to be one step ahead of your advesary. And when you're successful dealing the death blow.
Warhammer was fun until the novelty wore off. In retrospect it appears to me as though Mythic tried to make an improved WOW with a heavy PVP bias. Unfortunately WOW do PVE pretty well and PVP so so, but Warhammer doesn't do either that well, throwing 50 or more people into a virtual field and saying get on with it gets really tedious really quickly. I don't know what they did right with DAoC because I never played it, but somewhere down the line it went missing with Warhammer.
I've been a WAR player since open beta. Despite the issues, I'm having a great time playing WAR. Actually, I don't notice them much. I play the game to have fun and don't get carried away with who's OP and such. I get on, find a group, and smashface. WAAAAGH!
Yep its a blast. There is some minor issues. Only time I ever have lag is when I am on High Graphics and get two full warband trying to take something.
haha unbalanced classes is the least of issues... how about massive LAG?! For a game that advertised massive open RvR battles servers are surprisingly bad at handling it. How about rubbish endgame? Or how about the fact that for an RvR game is has a shitload of PvE that has to be done? City siege is suppose to be the crown of the game... and its another lagfest with oh surprise lots of PvE. Skirmish is the only thing playable... keeps are rubbish (well, defended keeps that is.... but undefended keeps is PvE so ye great fun), forts are another lagfest. Oh I remember back when Mark Jacobs said "this game will pretty much have no CC coz losing control of your character sux" <---wtf? This game has more CC then any I've played. And now instead of doing something about shitty servers and coding etc to try and get ppl into _massive oRvR_, they are working on implementing a system that will teleport ppl away from the heat of battle of its too much work for the servers (read CRASH INC). After 7 months live they cant balance classes, they have no idea how they want oRvR to play, they are constantly changing endgame coz it sucked at release and still does etc... really what's the plan for WAR I wonder....
edit: its not all bad. you are free to enjoy it ofc. and sometimes its amazingly fun. its just that... those fun times are far apart. really really far.
WAR is such a terribly done game, I'd have to think the only way someone could enjoy it is if they had never played an MMO before and seen what one can be like.
Well, you would be incorrect there. I started with Lineage 2 and played for over 4 years. I currently reside in Lord of the Rings online since closed beta. I've tried (for curiosity's sake) practically every mainstream or notable mmo out there. Even if it was just to get the feel for them.
Warhammer is made to be more like a game than a virtual world. This is acceptable to me as I'm not looking to live another life. Just like the game play in guild wars is acceptable.
I think players sometimes have a hard time understanding that not everything is going to be the same.
Chess is a great game and so is Monopoly. And so is Perfection while we are at it. Yet I'm not always in the mood for one and might be in the mood for another.
In internet time I think I'm really late to this threads party. But here goes...
The problem isn't that WAR isn't too bad of a game, the problem is in your terms we were told we were going to get Risk and ended up getting Sorry. Everytime those big bad "customers" want to fight other "customers", the Devs told us 'Sorry' you can't. Just like AoC promised crazy sieges, and PvP. WAR promised large scale PvP, let's really not get on the point about how it's not RvR in the DAoC sense. It seems to me to the best idea is to view the progress of development from the sidelines, rather than pay to be part of the stumbling blocks they've created.
The War forums thread really says it all. The tried to address the "population" imbalanced servers and merged. Only to force caps on Forts, then Keeps, then ORvR in general? Mythic created the problem, and it's their responsibility to fix it or continue to drive their customers away. Does anyone not see the pains they are going through to get people to the RvR lakes, and away from scenarios? It's due to the much better performanced while smaller groups have instanced content. Let be honest, I'm not hearing a lot of feedback about how great the landscape is during the ride back from being ported. People want action, and it seems more often Mythic is looking at instancing to solve their problems. I couldn't believe that the entire city seige was instanced. I knew the king fight would be, but to think the city would also be City Instance 34553 is just another sad joke.
Blatant advertising by a low count poster back up by a 2nd low count poster.
Ok here is my view. I started the free trial and i too am having a lot of fun. I enjoy the public quests. Level cap for the trial is 10 so my question is... is there enough to do to warrant the purchase of the game after level 10?
Blatant advertising by a low count poster back up by a 2nd low count poster.
Ok here is my view. I started the free trial and i too am having a lot of fun. I enjoy the public quests. Level cap for the trial is 10 so my question is... is there enough to do to warrant the purchase of the game after level 10?
its the exact same thing for the other 3 tiers...just diffrent scenery. EXACT I say!
If you like how WoW opperates, you should enjoy the rest of WoWhammer should you decide to subscribe.
Notice the correct spelling that Mythic can't seem to get right..
Ok here is my view. I started the free trial and i too am having a lot of fun. I enjoy the public quests. Level cap for the trial is 10 so my question is... is there enough to do to warrant the purchase of the game after level 10?
its the exact same thing for the other 3 tiers...just diffrent scenery. EXACT I say!
If you like how WoW opperates, you should enjoy the rest of WoWhammer should you decide to subscribe.
Notice the correct spelling that Mythic can't seem to get right..
If you like 1-10, you'll like 11-40. The content is similar. Can't compare to WoW tho - WAR and WoW are two different animals. Except the fact they are boh fantasy MMO's and they involve leveling. That's about the only comparison you can make. They are different games. I've tried WoW on two different occasions, it just didn't click with me. WAR, on the other hand, is amazing.
I've been a WAR player since open beta. Despite the issues, I'm having a great time playing WAR. Actually, I don't notice them much. I play the game to have fun and don't get carried away with who's OP and such. I get on, find a group, and smashface. WAAAAGH!
You don't notice them much? Are you Stevie Wonder?
I like the range of classes and that they don't really go together but they are all thrown together, I like the fast paced fights and how, if played well, fights can turn from one outcome to another.
I am upset because they cut out so many of the good classes from the game, only Witchhunter remains....
I mean, Freelance is such a fun class in the RPG and would have worked well in the game. Templar had they watered down. And of course they cut out the whole idea that you start as a loser class ("rat catcher" anyone? or "tomb robber"?) and then got a good one later.
In then pen and paper RPG you kinda have to to do several classes before you got the good one, and therefore most characters had different backgrounds and skills even if they were witchhunters at the end. It gave the characters a more unique feeling and you were very proud to be a templar or Judical champion.
Still, some of the classes are still in the Warhammer feeling.
I wonder if that would have resulted in compelling gameplay. I can see and appreciate the humor but for players to spend to much time as a rat catcher might turn them off a bit. Especially if those skills don't translate to the later levels.
I think there is a notable difference between pen and paper games and the audience for them and mmo's and their audience.
With Pen and Paper games you get people who like stats and nitty gritty. Character sheets, history sheets, matrices for skills and dice rolls, etc.
MMO's do away with a bit of that as so much of that stuff is handled by the program. This is not to say that there aren't people who want to know the math behind the game but I think with the ever expanding audience for mmo's making these games more mainstream, we are getting more people who want to jump into the action. Any action. They want clear cut goals so they know how they are going to spend their time since it is limited.
Telling them that they will be something low grade until they can get to the type of class they want might not be so attractive.
I dont think Loke666 was neccessarily referring to all the detailed stats of the Warhammer Fantasy Roleplaying game. He was referring to the large variety of "jobs" in the original rpg game which lead up to the player becoming who they want to be. The result is that several players could end up becoming a witchhunter and yet be very different from each other with a large selection of varied skills. WAR however has stripped out everything that makes the original rpg interesting and gives the player very little choice in how they grow their character. It ends up with everyone playing a certain class being identical to each other which is extremely dull. Everyone of each level has the same skills and they all look the same too.
If Mythic had put some effort into putting some detail into the game (like an actual roleplaying game) and perhaps stuck a LOT closer to the original Games Workshop product then it would be a lot more popular. Instead they tried to simplify it as much as possible to the point where there is hardly any decision making in the game at all.
You say you think there is a big difference between people who like PnP roleplaying games and those who like computer games. You might be correct but I dont really agree. People who play computer games like to use their brains as well. They like to have choices. If WAR was a more detailed and complex game (as opposed to the simplistic and tedious game that it is) then I think the game would be a lot more popular. Sure there are lots of kids and dumb people who play games but that doesnt mean Mythic had to design their game with those players in mind.
I've been a WAR player since open beta. Despite the issues, I'm having a great time playing WAR. Actually, I don't notice them much. I play the game to have fun and don't get carried away with who's OP and such. I get on, find a group, and smashface. WAAAAGH!
You don't notice them much? Are you Stevie Wonder?
It seems some of the biggest problems are in T4 city sieges. I've only played thru T3. That's the content I enjoy. I'll get to T4 one day and with any luck those problems will be fixed.
Thru T3 the game rocks. My biggest complaint right now is the game geometry - like getting stuck on things, and having barricades pop on top of you at a battlefield objective then getting stuck. That is frustrating. There have been other issues since release which have been addressed and overall the game is very enjoyable. It's a work in progress.
I guess I've been brainwashed cause I can't get enough. Maybe Mythic put some subliminal stuff in there...
Blatant advertising by a low count poster back up by a 2nd low count poster.
Check my join date dude - been on here alot longer than you may think - the number of posts is not a reflection on the quality.
Neither is my join date really but im proving that ive been around the block a few times.
What he said. I've been around for a long time now, and I enjoy to read a lot instead of just posting. I mean, cmon, there are a lot of ppl that just post things that doesnt even make sense to get their post count high... those count hunters... rly.... lol.
I go through all games boards every single day. My post count is extremely low, does that reflect in my opinion or my right to be respected?
I like the range of classes and that they don't really go together but they are all thrown together, I like the fast paced fights and how, if played well, fights can turn from one outcome to another.
I am upset because they cut out so many of the good classes from the game, only Witchhunter remains....
I mean, Freelance is such a fun class in the RPG and would have worked well in the game. Templar had they watered down. And of course they cut out the whole idea that you start as a loser class ("rat catcher" anyone? or "tomb robber"?) and then got a good one later.
In then pen and paper RPG you kinda have to to do several classes before you got the good one, and therefore most characters had different backgrounds and skills even if they were witchhunters at the end. It gave the characters a more unique feeling and you were very proud to be a templar or Judical champion.
Still, some of the classes are still in the Warhammer feeling.
I wonder if that would have resulted in compelling gameplay. I can see and appreciate the humor but for players to spend to much time as a rat catcher might turn them off a bit. Especially if those skills don't translate to the later levels.
I think there is a notable difference between pen and paper games and the audience for them and mmo's and their audience.
With Pen and Paper games you get people who like stats and nitty gritty. Character sheets, history sheets, matrices for skills and dice rolls, etc.
MMO's do away with a bit of that as so much of that stuff is handled by the program. This is not to say that there aren't people who want to know the math behind the game but I think with the ever expanding audience for mmo's making these games more mainstream, we are getting more people who want to jump into the action. Any action. They want clear cut goals so they know how they are going to spend their time since it is limited.
Telling them that they will be something low grade until they can get to the type of class they want might not be so attractive.
I dont think Loke666 was neccessarily referring to all the detailed stats of the Warhammer Fantasy Roleplaying game. He was referring to the large variety of "jobs" in the original rpg game which lead up to the player becoming who they want to be. The result is that several players could end up becoming a witchhunter and yet be very different from each other with a large selection of varied skills. WAR however has stripped out everything that makes the original rpg interesting and gives the player very little choice in how they grow their character. It ends up with everyone playing a certain class being identical to each other which is extremely dull. Everyone of each level has the same skills and they all look the same too.
If Mythic had put some effort into putting some detail into the game (like an actual roleplaying game) and perhaps stuck a LOT closer to the original Games Workshop product then it would be a lot more popular. Instead they tried to simplify it as much as possible to the point where there is hardly any decision making in the game at all.
You say you think there is a big difference between people who like PnP roleplaying games and those who like computer games. You might be correct but I dont really agree. People who play computer games like to use their brains as well. They like to have choices. If WAR was a more detailed and complex game (as opposed to the simplistic and tedious game that it is) then I think the game would be a lot more popular. Sure there are lots of kids and dumb people who play games but that doesnt mean Mythic had to design their game with those players in mind.
To be honest I don't really think I answered him thoroughly.
So besides what I posted, I don't really think players would be all that enamored of starting out as a rat catcher.
As far as the classes, there is no reason to believe they won't be added at some point in the future.
As far as the difference between people who play PnP games and mmo's I do think there is a difference. Not because one type of game "only" attracts one type of person, but PnP games can have a type of depth that doesn't really transfer well to a video game.
I can't speak for the Warhammer PnP game as I've never played it but let's take Dungeons and Dragons.
Dungeons and Dragons can have layers of tedium with all its charts and stats and dice rolling.
That's one thing my friends and I had to eliminate when playing it as it was just bogging down any excitement and momentum to an actual adventure.
Video games need to be fluid. This is not to say that one can't have depth but one can have too much depth.
If a player is spending too much time over stats and charts then that will only drive away players who desire more immediate action. And it has nothing to do with intelligence.
Just because a person can dive into charts and stats doesn't make him any more intelligent than a gymnast. They are two different types of intelligence at work here, one more analytical and one more physical. Except one might be more enamored of the type of depth that a PnP game can have and the other "not so much".
I think what mythic did was try to walk the fine line between a game that Warhammer fans would love and a game where regular mmo players would love. Perhaps that was their undoing as it doesn't seem attractive to die hard Warhammer players who are serious about Warhammer and it doesn't really speak to the die hard pvp players.
I think they took a gamble with their game design and didn't come up with the outcome they were hoping.
I personally think the PvE is horrible. I love the scenarios and I love the RvR when players are dedicated to the outcome and not just flipping the forts and battlefield objectives.
I do like my swordmaster class very much.
It's a fun game for people who want a fun and light game. If a player is looking for great depth or a great Warhammer experience then probably not so much.
Still, they have decent subs. 300,000k is nothing to sneeze at. That is a pretty solid playerbase. Heck, Lineage 2 had significantly less (in the west) and is still going.
Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb."
I've been a WAR player since open beta. Despite the issues, I'm having a great time playing WAR. Actually, I don't notice them much. I play the game to have fun and don't get carried away with who's OP and such. I get on, find a group, and smashface. WAAAAGH!
Still having fun playing war. Still only see minor issues with the game which they fix.
Comments
Yap, this is the part im talking about. If you like the game and come here telling other players, it will be better to say which part you like about it. Maybe Mythic have add a new system that other players like and will join, or even come back.
And thus also help to promote the game...
Than you wont be accuse of being fanbois and a bashing war follows...
Just not for me ( can also see my thread history )
peace...
The game isn't perfect... but anyone claiming it's all bad must not have played it much, or simply doesn't like MMOs. There are issues of motivation, and keep sieges are all exactly the same because keeps are all exactly the same... but the RvR in the game is fun and abundant. Quests are plentiful and fairly rewarding. Itemization is pretty decent, graphics are passable.
I just don't see any reason to accuse someone of being a shill just because they say they enjoy the game.
-----Zero Punctuation Eve Online Review-----
What does post count have to do with game enjoyment? I''m sure I have more game time than you! If you have fun playing it doesn't matter how many posts you have. That's just...dumb.
Maybe you can let us know which part of the game you enjoy.... exactly. Else It may seems to others that you are just 1 of Mythic employers etc....
Just my opinion...
I appreciate your opinion my point is there is no correlation between # posts on mmorpg.com and how much someone enjoys a game. I enjoy most parts of the game, except maybe crafting. That's a bit weak to me but that's not why I play the game so it doesn't matter to me. The part I enjoy most? PvP engagement. Not knowing what your opponent will do next. Trying to be one step ahead of your advesary. And when you're successful dealing the death blow.
Warhammer was fun until the novelty wore off. In retrospect it appears to me as though Mythic tried to make an improved WOW with a heavy PVP bias. Unfortunately WOW do PVE pretty well and PVP so so, but Warhammer doesn't do either that well, throwing 50 or more people into a virtual field and saying get on with it gets really tedious really quickly. I don't know what they did right with DAoC because I never played it, but somewhere down the line it went missing with Warhammer.
Yep its a blast.
There is some minor issues. Only time I ever have lag is when I am on High Graphics and get two full warband trying to take something. 
QFT
Well, you would be incorrect there. I started with Lineage 2 and played for over 4 years. I currently reside in Lord of the Rings online since closed beta. I've tried (for curiosity's sake) practically every mainstream or notable mmo out there. Even if it was just to get the feel for them.
Warhammer is made to be more like a game than a virtual world. This is acceptable to me as I'm not looking to live another life. Just like the game play in guild wars is acceptable.
I think players sometimes have a hard time understanding that not everything is going to be the same.
Chess is a great game and so is Monopoly. And so is Perfection while we are at it. Yet I'm not always in the mood for one and might be in the mood for another.
In internet time I think I'm really late to this threads party. But here goes...
The problem isn't that WAR isn't too bad of a game, the problem is in your terms we were told we were going to get Risk and ended up getting Sorry. Everytime those big bad "customers" want to fight other "customers", the Devs told us 'Sorry' you can't. Just like AoC promised crazy sieges, and PvP. WAR promised large scale PvP, let's really not get on the point about how it's not RvR in the DAoC sense. It seems to me to the best idea is to view the progress of development from the sidelines, rather than pay to be part of the stumbling blocks they've created.
The War forums thread really says it all. The tried to address the "population" imbalanced servers and merged. Only to force caps on Forts, then Keeps, then ORvR in general? Mythic created the problem, and it's their responsibility to fix it or continue to drive their customers away. Does anyone not see the pains they are going through to get people to the RvR lakes, and away from scenarios? It's due to the much better performanced while smaller groups have instanced content. Let be honest, I'm not hearing a lot of feedback about how great the landscape is during the ride back from being ported. People want action, and it seems more often Mythic is looking at instancing to solve their problems. I couldn't believe that the entire city seige was instanced. I knew the king fight would be, but to think the city would also be City Instance 34553 is just another sad joke.
Ok here is my view. I started the free trial and i too am having a lot of fun. I enjoy the public quests. Level cap for the trial is 10 so my question is... is there enough to do to warrant the purchase of the game after level 10?
Ok here is my view. I started the free trial and i too am having a lot of fun. I enjoy the public quests. Level cap for the trial is 10 so my question is... is there enough to do to warrant the purchase of the game after level 10?
its the exact same thing for the other 3 tiers...just diffrent scenery. EXACT I say!
If you like how WoW opperates, you should enjoy the rest of WoWhammer should you decide to subscribe.
Notice the correct spelling that Mythic can't seem to get right..
its the exact same thing for the other 3 tiers...just diffrent scenery. EXACT I say!
If you like how WoW opperates, you should enjoy the rest of WoWhammer should you decide to subscribe.
Notice the correct spelling that Mythic can't seem to get right..
If you like 1-10, you'll like 11-40. The content is similar. Can't compare to WoW tho - WAR and WoW are two different animals. Except the fact they are boh fantasy MMO's and they involve leveling. That's about the only comparison you can make. They are different games. I've tried WoW on two different occasions, it just didn't click with me. WAR, on the other hand, is amazing.
You don't notice them much? Are you Stevie Wonder?
I am upset because they cut out so many of the good classes from the game, only Witchhunter remains....
I mean, Freelance is such a fun class in the RPG and would have worked well in the game. Templar had they watered down. And of course they cut out the whole idea that you start as a loser class ("rat catcher" anyone? or "tomb robber"?) and then got a good one later.
In then pen and paper RPG you kinda have to to do several classes before you got the good one, and therefore most characters had different backgrounds and skills even if they were witchhunters at the end. It gave the characters a more unique feeling and you were very proud to be a templar or Judical champion.
Still, some of the classes are still in the Warhammer feeling.
I wonder if that would have resulted in compelling gameplay. I can see and appreciate the humor but for players to spend to much time as a rat catcher might turn them off a bit. Especially if those skills don't translate to the later levels.
I think there is a notable difference between pen and paper games and the audience for them and mmo's and their audience.
With Pen and Paper games you get people who like stats and nitty gritty. Character sheets, history sheets, matrices for skills and dice rolls, etc.
MMO's do away with a bit of that as so much of that stuff is handled by the program. This is not to say that there aren't people who want to know the math behind the game but I think with the ever expanding audience for mmo's making these games more mainstream, we are getting more people who want to jump into the action. Any action. They want clear cut goals so they know how they are going to spend their time since it is limited.
Telling them that they will be something low grade until they can get to the type of class they want might not be so attractive.
I dont think Loke666 was neccessarily referring to all the detailed stats of the Warhammer Fantasy Roleplaying game. He was referring to the large variety of "jobs" in the original rpg game which lead up to the player becoming who they want to be. The result is that several players could end up becoming a witchhunter and yet be very different from each other with a large selection of varied skills. WAR however has stripped out everything that makes the original rpg interesting and gives the player very little choice in how they grow their character. It ends up with everyone playing a certain class being identical to each other which is extremely dull. Everyone of each level has the same skills and they all look the same too.
If Mythic had put some effort into putting some detail into the game (like an actual roleplaying game) and perhaps stuck a LOT closer to the original Games Workshop product then it would be a lot more popular. Instead they tried to simplify it as much as possible to the point where there is hardly any decision making in the game at all.
You say you think there is a big difference between people who like PnP roleplaying games and those who like computer games. You might be correct but I dont really agree. People who play computer games like to use their brains as well. They like to have choices. If WAR was a more detailed and complex game (as opposed to the simplistic and tedious game that it is) then I think the game would be a lot more popular. Sure there are lots of kids and dumb people who play games but that doesnt mean Mythic had to design their game with those players in mind.
You don't notice them much? Are you Stevie Wonder?
It seems some of the biggest problems are in T4 city sieges. I've only played thru T3. That's the content I enjoy. I'll get to T4 one day and with any luck those problems will be fixed.
Thru T3 the game rocks. My biggest complaint right now is the game geometry - like getting stuck on things, and having barricades pop on top of you at a battlefield objective then getting stuck. That is frustrating. There have been other issues since release which have been addressed and overall the game is very enjoyable. It's a work in progress.
I guess I've been brainwashed cause I can't get enough. Maybe Mythic put some subliminal stuff in there...
Check my join date dude - been on here alot longer than you may think - the number of posts is not a reflection on the quality.
Neither is my join date really but im proving that ive been around the block a few times.
What he said. I've been around for a long time now, and I enjoy to read a lot instead of just posting. I mean, cmon, there are a lot of ppl that just post things that doesnt even make sense to get their post count high... those count hunters... rly.... lol.
I go through all games boards every single day. My post count is extremely low, does that reflect in my opinion or my right to be respected?
I am upset because they cut out so many of the good classes from the game, only Witchhunter remains....
I mean, Freelance is such a fun class in the RPG and would have worked well in the game. Templar had they watered down. And of course they cut out the whole idea that you start as a loser class ("rat catcher" anyone? or "tomb robber"?) and then got a good one later.
In then pen and paper RPG you kinda have to to do several classes before you got the good one, and therefore most characters had different backgrounds and skills even if they were witchhunters at the end. It gave the characters a more unique feeling and you were very proud to be a templar or Judical champion.
Still, some of the classes are still in the Warhammer feeling.
I wonder if that would have resulted in compelling gameplay. I can see and appreciate the humor but for players to spend to much time as a rat catcher might turn them off a bit. Especially if those skills don't translate to the later levels.
I think there is a notable difference between pen and paper games and the audience for them and mmo's and their audience.
With Pen and Paper games you get people who like stats and nitty gritty. Character sheets, history sheets, matrices for skills and dice rolls, etc.
MMO's do away with a bit of that as so much of that stuff is handled by the program. This is not to say that there aren't people who want to know the math behind the game but I think with the ever expanding audience for mmo's making these games more mainstream, we are getting more people who want to jump into the action. Any action. They want clear cut goals so they know how they are going to spend their time since it is limited.
Telling them that they will be something low grade until they can get to the type of class they want might not be so attractive.
I dont think Loke666 was neccessarily referring to all the detailed stats of the Warhammer Fantasy Roleplaying game. He was referring to the large variety of "jobs" in the original rpg game which lead up to the player becoming who they want to be. The result is that several players could end up becoming a witchhunter and yet be very different from each other with a large selection of varied skills. WAR however has stripped out everything that makes the original rpg interesting and gives the player very little choice in how they grow their character. It ends up with everyone playing a certain class being identical to each other which is extremely dull. Everyone of each level has the same skills and they all look the same too.
If Mythic had put some effort into putting some detail into the game (like an actual roleplaying game) and perhaps stuck a LOT closer to the original Games Workshop product then it would be a lot more popular. Instead they tried to simplify it as much as possible to the point where there is hardly any decision making in the game at all.
You say you think there is a big difference between people who like PnP roleplaying games and those who like computer games. You might be correct but I dont really agree. People who play computer games like to use their brains as well. They like to have choices. If WAR was a more detailed and complex game (as opposed to the simplistic and tedious game that it is) then I think the game would be a lot more popular. Sure there are lots of kids and dumb people who play games but that doesnt mean Mythic had to design their game with those players in mind.
To be honest I don't really think I answered him thoroughly.
So besides what I posted, I don't really think players would be all that enamored of starting out as a rat catcher.
As far as the classes, there is no reason to believe they won't be added at some point in the future.
As far as the difference between people who play PnP games and mmo's I do think there is a difference. Not because one type of game "only" attracts one type of person, but PnP games can have a type of depth that doesn't really transfer well to a video game.
I can't speak for the Warhammer PnP game as I've never played it but let's take Dungeons and Dragons.
Dungeons and Dragons can have layers of tedium with all its charts and stats and dice rolling.
That's one thing my friends and I had to eliminate when playing it as it was just bogging down any excitement and momentum to an actual adventure.
Video games need to be fluid. This is not to say that one can't have depth but one can have too much depth.
If a player is spending too much time over stats and charts then that will only drive away players who desire more immediate action. And it has nothing to do with intelligence.
Just because a person can dive into charts and stats doesn't make him any more intelligent than a gymnast. They are two different types of intelligence at work here, one more analytical and one more physical. Except one might be more enamored of the type of depth that a PnP game can have and the other "not so much".
I think what mythic did was try to walk the fine line between a game that Warhammer fans would love and a game where regular mmo players would love. Perhaps that was their undoing as it doesn't seem attractive to die hard Warhammer players who are serious about Warhammer and it doesn't really speak to the die hard pvp players.
I think they took a gamble with their game design and didn't come up with the outcome they were hoping.
I personally think the PvE is horrible. I love the scenarios and I love the RvR when players are dedicated to the outcome and not just flipping the forts and battlefield objectives.
I do like my swordmaster class very much.
It's a fun game for people who want a fun and light game. If a player is looking for great depth or a great Warhammer experience then probably not so much.
Still, they have decent subs. 300,000k is nothing to sneeze at. That is a pretty solid playerbase. Heck, Lineage 2 had significantly less (in the west) and is still going.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
Still having fun playing war. Still only see minor issues with the game which they fix.