OP obviously! the game is in closed payed beta, its good that people won't be trying it in its current pathetic state and waiting for later.
I mean its not horrible atm and things are getting better, but its certainly not an acceptable product. Wait for a real release and hopefully the game will be like... professional. If not there's always MO, though they won't have large wars nor territorial conflicts (at launch)
Not horrible but things are getting better. That could describe what ive been hearing and in some cases seeing about, this game, AOC, Warhammer and about everything else that has been released in the last year or so. I can understand a few bug issues but unfinished games are unacceptable. Hopefully somebody, someday is going to realize if they wait until its right before release they will make more money in the long run instead of super hyping the product and grabbing what they can from box sales. Its not just MMO's either. I do not buy a single player game on release anymore, i wait a few months until its patched and even then its a crapshoot. Sorry for the rant but i needed it .
No. The reason why some people won't be trying it out is because there is no trial yet. With a trial you don't give a shit about what others say about the game, especially when trolls are rampant thanks to Ed, you will simply download the game and try and see it for yourself. Currently you can only support your logical arguments against the game because you say you have been a beta player or a player that didn't resub, and the only way for one to know if its true or not would be to offer a trial.
Yes, true. Many people wont buy it before there is a trial.
Tasos "PR" skills dont help either but a lot of players wants to try a MMO before buying it. And many players suspect that agame that have no free trial have something to hide and wait with the trial until they have the buggs ironed out, like AoC did.
I bet you a dime that free trial won't happen for a while. Not because of hardware limitations alone.
Tasos almost ordered the assassination of Zit over 2/10. Over 1 review. What will happen if he open up a free trial? Do you think he does not know 90% of those thru the free trial will slam his uber product? He will have a hard time buying enough bullets to shoot every disgruntled free-trial-gamers.
Come to think of it, Tasos won't even hand out an account for another review, this time by a much more reputable reviewer. What makes you think he dare let in another player? He opens the shop only because he run out of things to pawn and he got bills to pay.
I spent a few hours at my friend's house playing/watching Darkfall (he loves the game). I would not call darkfall garbage, but I personally think it's some way off of being an acceptable product, especially in today's market. Even though there are people who play and enjoy this, I think it's mostly because they're yearning, starving for something new and different and would play any such game. Darkfall provides it. I think that, like my friend, they're very easy to please. It is lacking in most aspects, but provides a seamless world, full looting upon death, and twitched based combat. "What more could you want" I hear you ask? well quite a bit more actually. That's nice and all but I think people enjoying the game would discard all other elements just to have said features.
Good graphics? "game doesn't need gfx. Graphics don't mean !@#$! " Good PvE/AI? "game doesn't need pve, it's a ffa pvp game afterall!" Good music/sound? "game doesn't need this. just mute everything and play your own music!" Easy/Accessible controls? "game doesn't need them. You'll get the hang of it after playing for 2 days!" Nice/Clean User Interface? "It might be clunky, but it's functional!" Good amount of content? "game doesn't need content, besides its the players who are going to create and build the content!!" Good amount of Polish? "All MMO releases are like that!" Fluid animations/spell effects/movement? "Graphics whore!" Nice/Immersive Lore? "Lore? is this a joke? gamers dont give a !@#$ about lore." etc. These are just examples, not stereotype answers or anything, but it's in this vein generally. Most fans are just happy with what they have.
Fact is DF is not a quality product. And this is understandable as it's Aventurine's first game, they had a pretty low budget, no experience, had to release early etc. I personally did not really expect more from the game tbh.
The question I want to ask: Do you think it's OK to sacrifice all these features and components and more for the sake of the things I mentioned? I can understand why the fans are desperate for something new, but there's a limit IMO. Anyway that's my opinion. When I play any game, I yearn for quality and polish at the very least. A smooth experience. I know I'm not alone in this.
Do not hate us. We're just different!
Ahem..: I hope the future is rosy for Darkfall fans, I wish the game well as the idea is certainly a step in the right direction, I pray for the devs to be up to the task. I don't want to take anything away from the people who are enjoying the game, more power to them.
You pointed out alot of the issues I have with mmo gamers just to play something different we tend to put up with bad quality product releases which is just insane to me.I hope the game does well too and adds alot of the elements you mentioned above but I can say with a fair amount of certainty this game wouldn't see any of my money for a year or so after release.
but yeah, to call this game Fantastic is like calling Twilight the Godfather of vampire movies....
...provides a seamless world, ... and twitched based combat. ... Good graphics? "game doesn't need gfx. Graphics don't mean !@#$! " Good PvE/AI? "game doesn't need pve, it's a ffa pvp game afterall!" .... Nice/Immersive Lore? "Lore? is this a joke? gamers dont give a !@#$ about lore." etc. ...
...
1. In Darkfall, you can spot someone farther away if they wear metal, because light glints off of it.
2. The graphics are integrated into the concept of hiding and stealth (There is no "hide" skill).
...
As well, you complained about the sound. What really threw me off was your comments about music. My friend, in Darkfall, if you are listening to music, you are probably not playing the game. I have played the game and I can tell you that most people I communicate with wear headphones to determine which directions sounds are coming from.
See, here's the problem. In darkfall, the direction of a sound can save your life. I recall once when I was mining ore the soft sound of hooves in the distance. When you wear headphones, you can turn your character in the direction of those hooves to figure out where they are coming from. ... Those hooves are likely to be raiders and you quickly learn where to hide based on the direction of the thread.
So...music? No way. Darkfall sounds are extremely important to stealth and surviveability. ...
...
I have done a lot of <clip> in the posts above. The reason is back to the OPs question:
The question I want to ask: Do you think it's OK to sacrifice all these features and components and more for the sake of the things I mentioned? I can understand why the fans are desperate for something new,....
The thing is it's not new.
All the stuff I left in the quotes above is equally true in a PvP MMO which has been out for 7+ YEARS.
World War II on line offers a seamless world (much bigger than Darkfall's I might add), PvP, RvR, naval combat, true stealth play based on your ability to hide (not items and / or magic) sound that is critical to survival, etc, etc.
It has been out for more than 7 years.
People who are serious PvPers are playing it or have already played it. IIRC there is a city in DF belonging to Sturmgrenadier? Where do you think they came from? That Guild was created in WWIIoL.
What Darkfall offers that WWIIoL does NOT offer is a Goblin/Orc/Elf Medieval/Magic type setting, player owned cities, crafting, and full loot.
And that's fine... but the thing that interests me is that DF Fanbois don't (mostly) say that this is why they play DF?
They claim it's for the PvP?
But, as I say, that game already exists and has for some time.
Anyway, is it okay to sacrifice some features for a PvP game?
Yes.
WWIIoL did it.
But then again, WWIIoL is 7 years old, what was acceptable then is no longer 'cutting edge' or industry standard.
My main reason for not touching this title? The sheer amount of drama revolving around it.
Honestly speaking here (and I have not touched the game once): If review sites, fans, and the development company are at odds, publicly (and repeatedly), about what the game can/cannot do, what it is 'supposed to be' or whether or not it meets expectations; just walk away. It just is not worth the risk. There are more titles out there to try.
I spent a few hours at my friend's house playing/watching Darkfall (he loves the game). I would not call darkfall garbage, but I personally think it's some way off of being an acceptable product, especially in today's market. Even though there are people who play and enjoy this, I think it's mostly because they're yearning, starving for something new and different and would play any such game. Darkfall provides it. I think that, like my friend, they're very easy to please. It is lacking in most aspects, but provides a seamless world, full looting upon death, and twitched based combat. "What more could you want" I hear you ask? well quite a bit more actually. That's nice and all but I think people enjoying the game would discard all other elements just to have said features.
Good graphics? "game doesn't need gfx. Graphics don't mean !@#$! " Good PvE/AI? "game doesn't need pve, it's a ffa pvp game afterall!" Good music/sound? "game doesn't need this. just mute everything and play your own music!" Easy/Accessible controls? "game doesn't need them. You'll get the hang of it after playing for 2 days!" Nice/Clean User Interface? "It might be clunky, but it's functional!" Good amount of content? "game doesn't need content, besides its the players who are going to create and build the content!!" Good amount of Polish? "All MMO releases are like that!" Fluid animations/spell effects/movement? "Graphics whore!" Nice/Immersive Lore? "Lore? is this a joke? gamers dont give a !@#$ about lore." etc. These are just examples, not stereotype answers or anything, but it's in this vein generally. Most fans are just happy with what they have.
Fact is DF is not a quality product. And this is understandable as it's Aventurine's first game, they had a pretty low budget, no experience, had to release early etc. I personally did not really expect more from the game tbh.
The question I want to ask: Do you think it's OK to sacrifice all these features and components and more for the sake of the things I mentioned? I can understand why the fans are desperate for something new, but there's a limit IMO. Anyway that's my opinion. When I play any game, I yearn for quality and polish at the very least. A smooth experience. I know I'm not alone in this.
Do not hate us. We're just different!
Ahem..: I hope the future is rosy for Darkfall fans, I wish the game well as the idea is certainly a step in the right direction, I pray for the devs to be up to the task. I don't want to take anything away from the people who are enjoying the game, more power to them.
Greetings and thanks for your opinion.
My friend, I don't hate you, but I also don't get the impression you actually played the game. Perhaps you are correct that a company with more money could have created a more flawless implemenation and initiation process to market, but I disagree with some of your comments. Markedly, they seemed to overgeneralize Darkfall.
The graphics behind Darkfall: if we truly want to discuss this than we're opening a huge debate. You see, it's fundamentally true that Age of Conan has the best graphics quality, but at the same time, Age of Conan is not considered a great game. Furthermore, Age of Conan has proven that cutting edge graphics mean fewer people can play. I believe, ultimately, that you are welcome to complain about the graphics, but there are a few important points with Darkfall that should be give credit.
1. In Darkfall, you can spot someone farther away if they wear metal, because light glints off of it.
2. The graphics are integrated into the concept of hiding and stealth (There is no "hide" skill).
Darkfall is doing pretty well on this front, and I've noticed graphic updates in patches. So, what I'm basically eluding to is that a good game is not one with awesome graphics, but one that is graphically consistant. Why? Because graphics are consistantly being changed in every game.
As well, you complained about the sound. What really threw me off was your comments about music. My friend, in Darkfall, if you are listening to music, you are probably not playing the game. I have played the game and I can tell you that most people I communicate with wear headphones to determine which directions sounds are coming from.
See, here's the problem. In darkfall, the direction of a sound can save your life. I recall once when I was mining ore the soft sound of hooves in the distance. When you wear headphones, you can turn your character in the direction of those hooves to figure out where they are coming from. This is absolutely not possible when music is playing. Those hooves are likely to be raiders and you quickly learn where to hide based on the direction of the thread.
So...music? No way. Darkfall sounds are extremely important to stealth and surviveability. This is the main reason I'm not sure you actually tried out the game.
In some ways you are correct. Darkfall has a ways to go. Me personally, I haven't had a problem with the game. I knew upon subscription that they were a small company with little money...that they were the small kids on the block. But, if you think about it, few games continue on without problems.
The impression you are putting out is one that I see from a lot of people who do not like the game. They set higher expectations for Darkfall than they would for Blizzard, Funcom, et al. And when Darkfall has issues, they use those moments to ridicule the company and call it a failure. Perhaps in time, you will see that every company has ups and downs and no one is perfect. The only thing I can tell you is that out of all the games I have played, Darkfall is currently the most intensely riveting of them.
Ask funcom if they truly feel they are being cut a break, that game was roasted until the public simply stopped caring they surely aren't increasing sub numbers by leaps and bounds it's just that people have started to realize what alot of detractors said was true it has graphics and little else going for it.
I think DF is going the same route but the one thing I think people can't discount is the devs I don't know if it comes from the fact that most devs were the "nerds" of the school but nowadays they speak much like the American republican party as if just because they are given a forum to speak and use it people are going to believe the drivel they put out and put up with the imperialist attitudes and lack of true honest communication that these people offer.
In short everyone who would possibly read what Tasos says is a potential customer and what truly successful company would speak to a customer the way he does as if you don't like what they are doing you can go to hell.Look even if that's his opinion he can be smart enough not to state it so obviously to the point that there are people who won't try the game simply because of him and his attitude.
but yeah, to call this game Fantastic is like calling Twilight the Godfather of vampire movies....
My main reason for not touching this title? The sheer amount of drama revolving around it. Honestly speaking here (and I have not touched the game once): If review sites, fans, and the development company are at odds, publicly (and repeatedly), about what the game can/cannot do, what it is 'supposed to be' or whether or not it meets expectations; just walk away. It just is not worth the risk. There are more titles out there to try.
There isnt any more or less drama of fans saying I wished for this or that this is great or review sites saying its a nice move forward or it seems like more of the same. . .that cant be found with many released mmo's,really.
I'm afrad that if you rely soly on other peoples opinions, which you've allluded to, of which there is a wide variety of pros and cons like any mmo, and cant ascertain what kind of platform, game-play, ecosystem, etc. that your looking for, you probably fall into the category of sheep. Those that can make an honest arguement for or against something, I'll listen to all day as long as the arguement/opinion has honest and believable support.
My main reason for not touching this title? The sheer amount of drama revolving around it. Honestly speaking here (and I have not touched the game once): If review sites, fans, and the development company are at odds, publicly (and repeatedly), about what the game can/cannot do, what it is 'supposed to be' or whether or not it meets expectations; just walk away. It just is not worth the risk. There are more titles out there to try.
There isnt any more or less drama of fans saying I wished for this or that this is great or review sites saying its a nice move forward or it seems like more of the same. . .that cant be found with many released mmo's,really.
I'm afrad that if you rely soly on other peoples opinions, which you've allluded to, of which there is a wide variety of pros and cons like any mmo, and cant ascertain what kind of platform, game-play, ecosystem, etc. that your looking for, you probably fall into the category of sheep. Those that can make an honest arguement for or against something, I'll listen to all day as long as the arguement/opinion has honest and believable support.
Not really RELY on others, but reading up and making judgment.
A game that receives unanimous acclaim in one area scores good, say LOTRo, no one complains about stability issues or bugs or smoothness. Now that is a score.
If almost everyone says DF sucks with ... (endless list), that is a warning. If the developer comes in, and the fans resort to personal assults, that adds more to the warning. This is what I understand from Soldarith's writing, and I fully agree.
I might have missed the best game of a lifetime by skipping DF, but 1 chance to a million. More likely than not, I save myself a few hours of exposure to insanity.
Comments
Not horrible but things are getting better. That could describe what ive been hearing and in some cases seeing about, this game, AOC, Warhammer and about everything else that has been released in the last year or so. I can understand a few bug issues but unfinished games are unacceptable. Hopefully somebody, someday is going to realize if they wait until its right before release they will make more money in the long run instead of super hyping the product and grabbing what they can from box sales. Its not just MMO's either. I do not buy a single player game on release anymore, i wait a few months until its patched and even then its a crapshoot. Sorry for the rant but i needed it .
Yes, true. Many people wont buy it before there is a trial.
Tasos "PR" skills dont help either but a lot of players wants to try a MMO before buying it. And many players suspect that agame that have no free trial have something to hide and wait with the trial until they have the buggs ironed out, like AoC did.
I bet you a dime that free trial won't happen for a while. Not because of hardware limitations alone.
Tasos almost ordered the assassination of Zit over 2/10. Over 1 review. What will happen if he open up a free trial? Do you think he does not know 90% of those thru the free trial will slam his uber product? He will have a hard time buying enough bullets to shoot every disgruntled free-trial-gamers.
Come to think of it, Tasos won't even hand out an account for another review, this time by a much more reputable reviewer. What makes you think he dare let in another player? He opens the shop only because he run out of things to pawn and he got bills to pay.
You pointed out alot of the issues I have with mmo gamers just to play something different we tend to put up with bad quality product releases which is just insane to me.I hope the game does well too and adds alot of the elements you mentioned above but I can say with a fair amount of certainty this game wouldn't see any of my money for a year or so after release.
but yeah, to call this game Fantastic is like calling Twilight the Godfather of vampire movies....
...
1. In Darkfall, you can spot someone farther away if they wear metal, because light glints off of it.
2. The graphics are integrated into the concept of hiding and stealth (There is no "hide" skill).
...
As well, you complained about the sound. What really threw me off was your comments about music. My friend, in Darkfall, if you are listening to music, you are probably not playing the game. I have played the game and I can tell you that most people I communicate with wear headphones to determine which directions sounds are coming from.
See, here's the problem. In darkfall, the direction of a sound can save your life. I recall once when I was mining ore the soft sound of hooves in the distance. When you wear headphones, you can turn your character in the direction of those hooves to figure out where they are coming from. ... Those hooves are likely to be raiders and you quickly learn where to hide based on the direction of the thread.
So...music? No way. Darkfall sounds are extremely important to stealth and surviveability. ...
...
I have done a lot of <clip> in the posts above. The reason is back to the OPs question:
The question I want to ask: Do you think it's OK to sacrifice all these features and components and more for the sake of the things I mentioned? I can understand why the fans are desperate for something new,....
The thing is it's not new.
All the stuff I left in the quotes above is equally true in a PvP MMO which has been out for 7+ YEARS.
World War II on line offers a seamless world (much bigger than Darkfall's I might add), PvP, RvR, naval combat, true stealth play based on your ability to hide (not items and / or magic) sound that is critical to survival, etc, etc.
It has been out for more than 7 years.
People who are serious PvPers are playing it or have already played it. IIRC there is a city in DF belonging to Sturmgrenadier? Where do you think they came from? That Guild was created in WWIIoL.
What Darkfall offers that WWIIoL does NOT offer is a Goblin/Orc/Elf Medieval/Magic type setting, player owned cities, crafting, and full loot.
And that's fine... but the thing that interests me is that DF Fanbois don't (mostly) say that this is why they play DF?
They claim it's for the PvP?
But, as I say, that game already exists and has for some time.
Anyway, is it okay to sacrifice some features for a PvP game?
Yes.
WWIIoL did it.
But then again, WWIIoL is 7 years old, what was acceptable then is no longer 'cutting edge' or industry standard.
Nothing says irony like spelling ideot wrong.
My main reason for not touching this title? The sheer amount of drama revolving around it.
Honestly speaking here (and I have not touched the game once): If review sites, fans, and the development company are at odds, publicly (and repeatedly), about what the game can/cannot do, what it is 'supposed to be' or whether or not it meets expectations; just walk away. It just is not worth the risk. There are more titles out there to try.
Greetings and thanks for your opinion.
My friend, I don't hate you, but I also don't get the impression you actually played the game. Perhaps you are correct that a company with more money could have created a more flawless implemenation and initiation process to market, but I disagree with some of your comments. Markedly, they seemed to overgeneralize Darkfall.
The graphics behind Darkfall: if we truly want to discuss this than we're opening a huge debate. You see, it's fundamentally true that Age of Conan has the best graphics quality, but at the same time, Age of Conan is not considered a great game. Furthermore, Age of Conan has proven that cutting edge graphics mean fewer people can play. I believe, ultimately, that you are welcome to complain about the graphics, but there are a few important points with Darkfall that should be give credit.
1. In Darkfall, you can spot someone farther away if they wear metal, because light glints off of it.
2. The graphics are integrated into the concept of hiding and stealth (There is no "hide" skill).
Darkfall is doing pretty well on this front, and I've noticed graphic updates in patches. So, what I'm basically eluding to is that a good game is not one with awesome graphics, but one that is graphically consistant. Why? Because graphics are consistantly being changed in every game.
As well, you complained about the sound. What really threw me off was your comments about music. My friend, in Darkfall, if you are listening to music, you are probably not playing the game. I have played the game and I can tell you that most people I communicate with wear headphones to determine which directions sounds are coming from.
See, here's the problem. In darkfall, the direction of a sound can save your life. I recall once when I was mining ore the soft sound of hooves in the distance. When you wear headphones, you can turn your character in the direction of those hooves to figure out where they are coming from. This is absolutely not possible when music is playing. Those hooves are likely to be raiders and you quickly learn where to hide based on the direction of the thread.
So...music? No way. Darkfall sounds are extremely important to stealth and surviveability. This is the main reason I'm not sure you actually tried out the game.
In some ways you are correct. Darkfall has a ways to go. Me personally, I haven't had a problem with the game. I knew upon subscription that they were a small company with little money...that they were the small kids on the block. But, if you think about it, few games continue on without problems.
The impression you are putting out is one that I see from a lot of people who do not like the game. They set higher expectations for Darkfall than they would for Blizzard, Funcom, et al. And when Darkfall has issues, they use those moments to ridicule the company and call it a failure. Perhaps in time, you will see that every company has ups and downs and no one is perfect. The only thing I can tell you is that out of all the games I have played, Darkfall is currently the most intensely riveting of them.
Ask funcom if they truly feel they are being cut a break, that game was roasted until the public simply stopped caring they surely aren't increasing sub numbers by leaps and bounds it's just that people have started to realize what alot of detractors said was true it has graphics and little else going for it.
I think DF is going the same route but the one thing I think people can't discount is the devs I don't know if it comes from the fact that most devs were the "nerds" of the school but nowadays they speak much like the American republican party as if just because they are given a forum to speak and use it people are going to believe the drivel they put out and put up with the imperialist attitudes and lack of true honest communication that these people offer.
In short everyone who would possibly read what Tasos says is a potential customer and what truly successful company would speak to a customer the way he does as if you don't like what they are doing you can go to hell.Look even if that's his opinion he can be smart enough not to state it so obviously to the point that there are people who won't try the game simply because of him and his attitude.
but yeah, to call this game Fantastic is like calling Twilight the Godfather of vampire movies....
There isnt any more or less drama of fans saying I wished for this or that this is great or review sites saying its a nice move forward or it seems like more of the same. . .that cant be found with many released mmo's,really.
I'm afrad that if you rely soly on other peoples opinions, which you've allluded to, of which there is a wide variety of pros and cons like any mmo, and cant ascertain what kind of platform, game-play, ecosystem, etc. that your looking for, you probably fall into the category of sheep. Those that can make an honest arguement for or against something, I'll listen to all day as long as the arguement/opinion has honest and believable support.
There isnt any more or less drama of fans saying I wished for this or that this is great or review sites saying its a nice move forward or it seems like more of the same. . .that cant be found with many released mmo's,really.
I'm afrad that if you rely soly on other peoples opinions, which you've allluded to, of which there is a wide variety of pros and cons like any mmo, and cant ascertain what kind of platform, game-play, ecosystem, etc. that your looking for, you probably fall into the category of sheep. Those that can make an honest arguement for or against something, I'll listen to all day as long as the arguement/opinion has honest and believable support.
Not really RELY on others, but reading up and making judgment.
A game that receives unanimous acclaim in one area scores good, say LOTRo, no one complains about stability issues or bugs or smoothness. Now that is a score.
If almost everyone says DF sucks with ... (endless list), that is a warning. If the developer comes in, and the fans resort to personal assults, that adds more to the warning. This is what I understand from Soldarith's writing, and I fully agree.
I might have missed the best game of a lifetime by skipping DF, but 1 chance to a million. More likely than not, I save myself a few hours of exposure to insanity.