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Sandbox or Theme-park?
Xnxax
Member Posts: 73
Theme-park games are the overwhelming majority of titles today. While these games give you unique attractions, mainly large dungeon raids and instanced PvP, the player has no control over the world around him and can only do what the game gives him to do. Thus, if the title does not continuely come out with expansions with new dungeons and a higher lvl cap, the game becomes boring. Of course there are those that leave the title inspite of any new expansions because by nature these type of games are repetitive. It is my opinion that newer gamers are attracted to these type of games because they are easy to jump in to and understand, allowing people to have fun right away. An interesting note about theme-parks, correct me if im wrong, but damn near every one goes with the class system, while sandbox's lean more toward skill trees because it allows for more freedom and that is what sandbox games are all about.(Good Theme-park title: World of Warcraft)
Sandbox games, in my opinion, have had only two decent titles: EvE Online and the golden days of pre-cu SWG. I find that alot of "Hardcore" or "Veteran" gamers lean towards sandbox games because they have been playing MMO's a while and have gotten tired of the same old thing. Sandbox games where created to allow more freedom to the players to sculpt the world/server and to increase player to player interaction. Features in sandbox games that you often do not find in theme park games are things like player housing, player cities, guild/clan wars, indepth crafting systems, skill tree's, very little instancing, and a far better pvp experience. I may have missed a few but the point is to give players more freedom and increase player to player interaction. These type of games last longer and get rid of the need for constant expansions to keep that masses apeased.(Good Sandbox title: EvE Online)
Well that is my opinion on the matter, obviously i think Sandbox games are superior. What is your opinion?
Tried: EvE, DnD Online, LotRO, WAR, AoC,
Played: UO, SWG(pre-cu), GuildWars, FFXI, WoW
Liked: UO, SWG, GuildWars
Disliked: WoW, FFXI
Comments
For me it does not matter whether if its a Sandbox or a Theme Park. I just want a good game thats keeps me comming back for more.
Sandbox with themepark please. Im getting sick of this absolute chosing for one thing or the other in these stupid polls.
One doesnt have to exclude the other.
PreCU SWG with a lot of current NGE SWG content would have been a far more complete product. Its just stupid to limit your choices.
Besides, apart from the character development, current SWG offers far more diversity then preCU in the forms of crafting, playercities and space. With upcoming chronicles and droid engineer update it gets even better.
For me the ideal situation would be preCU professions combined with NGE new features and content. To bad that those limited thinking precu vets who confuse nostalgia for a game feature, wont see this.
Anyway, wont matter. I see very little chance for a new MMO with as many features and freedom as in SWG (all features old and new combined) or UO. Except some failed attempts from Indie developers, who dont make it because of impatient player hate and lack of funds.
I cant choose that. I want a fun game that is innovative and don't feel like anything else I played. If that game is a sandbox, themepark or something else doesn't matter.
I don't want to grind and grind, but the type of the game doesn't matter.
2 games I have my eyes on right now is TOR (Wouldn't call it a themepark, more a MMO since you choose your path yourself there, it kinda kills of the "get on the ride" feeling themepark games have) and WoDO which is a sandbox game.
And I will keep playing the one that is most fun to play of those.
You have to choose one or the other. Yes giving a sandbox game theme-park qualities still makes it a sandbox it doesnt change the classification. Elaborating on the detail of adding theme-park qualites is good, just dont complain about the lack of choices because there are only two choices and..your a stupid poll.....meanie
Edit: Happy Independence Day! Kaboom Pow....pow..pow...........BOOOM!
Tried: EvE, DnD Online, LotRO, WAR, AoC,
Played: UO, SWG(pre-cu), GuildWars, FFXI, WoW
Liked: UO, SWG, GuildWars
Disliked: WoW, FFXI
THANK YOU
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If thats the only two whats Everquest 1? Full blown Chaos?
I'd consider Everquest Classic a sandbox. Although it was limited on what you could do besides crafting and combat, it was in the hands of players.
I almost was faked out, but there it was, the "Anti-WoW"... And to top it off, the pro-SWG-PreCUblah blah blah...
This thread can fit in the SWG "Vets" forum or the WoW forum...then again, we have read this all before...
Don't like a game...DON'T PLAY IT...I know some people might not get that but holy moley...that spelled right?
Do we really need another WoW sucks and Pre-CU/NGE SWG was awesome thread?
That Guild Wars 2 login screen knocked up my wife. Must be the second coming!
I agree Sandbox with Themepark.
I'm sick of sandbox mmorpgs with no content and people defending it that you make your own content when you can't. So instead you end up standing around all day complaining on the forums that the devs are taking too long to add cotnent.
Theme park ftw.
I think the gamescape... The gamescape of MMO's has changed for better or for worse since the launch of World of Warcraft.
I am an old UO/early EQ player. Those are the games I was introduced to and they, at the time, ruled.
I am not the same person I was when those games launched. I would totally love a well crafted sandbox game, I just do not know if I could devote the time to it. Having said that, I do not mind the so-called "theme-park" games as well.
Give me something that when I have the time I can immerse myself, yet when I need a quick hit I can jump in and jump back out...
That alone is why I enjoy WoW and, well, DID, enjoy SWG.
That Guild Wars 2 login screen knocked up my wife. Must be the second coming!
Sand-Park. 60% sand and 40% park, roughly.
"Many nights, my friend... Many nights I've put a blade to your throat while you were sleeping. Glad I never killed you, Steve. You're alright..."
Chavez y Chavez
What i like about sandbox games is that there's no pressure on you to do things, like everytime i log into a "themepark" i know what im suppose to be doing, which can be to raid/grind/pvp endlessly to get something while in a sandbox i have the freedom to do whatever im feeling like rather than having to put up with things. Themepark games also to me lack in other things to do, as defined a themepark game has a set path for you to follow and beside following that path theres nothing else to do. Well there's raids or dungeons but to me that just feels like having to grind them to get gear for the pvp part of the game and well thats about all they have to them. A usual themepark also gets boring for me after i hit the level cap as i have all the skills and good gear and all left for me to do is grind while in a sandbox there really isnt any end game. I still enjoy and do play themepark games but thats because i havent found a good sandbox for my taste.
Care to elaborate what some of the things you can do freely in sandbox games are?
I will take a sandbox, themepark, both or neither, so long as a game is fun for me. Once a game stops being fun, I will go and find another one I enjoy.
In short, I don't really care about the type of game, I just care whether it is fun for me to play.
My basic I-Heart-Sandboxes thing, the last one I played and really got into, was Star Wars Galaxies.
I'm a crafting junkie, so it was big with me for that reason, too, but the main, basic thing I really enjoyed was the fact that my careful, conscientious crafting made it so that I could afford to hire people to take me to new places and find new things. I went far and wide, with hired goons protecting my non-combat ass, to find new materials with different qualities. I eventually got to the point where I knew what qualities were better and worse than others for certain items, so I could craft up some -awfully- scary things that ordinarily would only be worth a quick look. Sell them relatively cheap, get oodles and oodles of kickback XP, and then hire more folks, go more places, find more things.
The exploration and the usefulness of said exploration was HUGE for me.
I agree with people who want a mixture of both. Sandbox games can be ass, too. Regardless of what it is, it just must be a good game.
I think the two should co-exist , what makes World of Warcraft boring after playing it so long (besides the fact that they ruined the game) is that the game feels so static no matter how much content you add to it, a mmorpg that will include both will really be the ultimate mmorpg but it will be hard to create.
World of Warcraft is a proof that MMORPG quality should affect schedule/budget and not the other way around.
Yeah what I loved about SWG pre cu was I advanced my character because I wanted to and not because I had to. When I wanted to learn new skills I did so because playing another profession was fun and not because I've maxed out my character and I'm bored cause theres nothing else to do. When I did quests I did them because they were fun and not because I wanted to get to end level so I could PVP. You play the game at your pace and you go through content because it is fun. You can login and be playing with the veterans right away and not like WoW where you have to grind to 80 before you can play with other people cause the world is dead so you're forced to solo. I really love how theres always someone doing some content because theres no order to do it in. So the world is never dead like WoW because people are too higher level to do it.
I just wished SWG had more content in it Pre CU like if it was based in WoW's World but everything else was from SWG then it would be perfect.
I enjoyed LoTRO, Horizons (Istaria), World of Warcraft, Dark Age of Camelot a lot more than Eve Online.
Eve Online is PvP focused and I prefer PvE.
I disagree that Eve does not have classes. The different types of ships are the Eve equivalent of classes and there are particular skill sets which go with each ship type. Many of the ship types actually have fairly standard equivalents. For example you have your pet classes (drone ships), long range damage classes, and in close damage classes. Nevertheless, the illusion of being different from the D&D archetypes makes the game a pleasant change.
I have yet to see a a sandbox that is a good PvE game.
The best games take the best from both sandbox and Theme Park, rather than limiting the developer's toolbox. In the end, all the matters is whether the game is fun to play.
I actually voted for theme-park because yes, I have preference for that, but after reading through the other posts in this thread, I have to agree that it would be a good idea to combine the two. What I love about the theme-park games is that there is always something for me to do to contribute to the storyline, and it gives me the drive to actually continue to play the game because of the achivements I get. Plus, more likely that not, I woud get completely lost in a sandbox game.
However, I do love the idea of a theme park/sandbox game mix. It seems that there would be even more things to do, because in addition to quests, you have your crafting, your pvp, your choice in chosing the type of skills that you want to devote to... it would take a lot more brainwork than just a theme-park game, but with the theme-park elements... yes, I can see myself playing such a game.
Main characters:
Jinn Gone Quiet (Guild Wars)
Princess Pudding (Guild Wars)
I agree. I think a sandbox might be fun, but not without a polished themepark included. I don't know if a sandbox would really be fun or not, since both the games listed in the OP are flawed IMO.
Well, perhaps EVE is not flawed, but just not by cup of tea. I don't want to be a spaceship, so it really doesn't matter if it's a sandbox or themepark, and I also don't like the progression method in EVE, which isn't a feature that makes it a sandbox. Basically I don't like EVE, but not because it's a sandbox so hard to use it to judge sandbox games.
SWG was also flawed with the whole Jedi thing. Grind every skill to become Jedi? Ewwww. No thanks. Also the RvR was not fully developed, and there was a lack of content in many areas.
So far my favorite has been DAoC. So if that's considered a themepark, I'll stick with themeparks until a more polished or more attractive sandbox is developed than EVE or SWG pre-NGE.
I'm a fan of Sandbox games, but with a theme-park feel. Games like Oblivion, Mass Effectm, and KotOR come to mind. These games had an obvious linear story to them, but they allowed you to go about doing the quests in your own way.
My favorite part of the sanbox feel was I got to customise my skills and powers. This was in wow too, but not really... KotOR I could be a jedi that didn't use a LS or in Mass Effect were I could blast people with shotguns or sniper rifles or even stick with Biotic powers, and Oblivion it was anything you want from mages to warriors.
Alright, so the majority of us want a mixture of sandbox and themepark.
Devs, read this ^
I am playing EVE and it's alright... level V skills are a bit much.
You all need to learn to spell.
I wouldnt mind a mixture of sandbox [70%] and themepark [30%] as i see advantages to both systems.
As for EvE yes it is a sandbox game But i personally think the devs can add more themepark stuff in the PvE area and if done right will create a nice mix which i think will be good for the industry. I will just add tho that with player avitars coming within the next year or so this may one day happen if its not already comming.
Another great example of Moore's Law. Give people access to that much space (developers and users alike) and they'll find uses for it that you can never imagine. "640K ought to be enough for anybody" - Bill Gates 1981