will tax dollars really start going towards abortions? i havent really kept up with whats going on.
Mandatory abortion coverage is in HR3200.
It's in the Family Planning section, I think Section 1920. It's not expressly described as abortion. It requires much going back and forth to see certain meanings in different sections. It is not described one way or the other, and if it is not expressly stated either way, it is essentially mandated.
It doesn't explicitly restrict certain abortion coverages, it just leaves it in the open under "Family Planning", and if it is not restricted in any way in the bill, (which it isn't) then it will fall under what "Family Planning" means according to the Dept. of Health or what have you.
That means it doesn't discriminate between Therapeutic or Elective abortion. The former being the "emergency" procedure and the latter being the "choice" procedure.
Unless amended, it will just fund either way, because it will default to the "Essential Benefits Package".
Obama really needs sane arguements and critics to check him and his policies. With the fruitbaskets they have it would be a wonder if any sound arguements and improvements will actually make it in.
will tax dollars really start going towards abortions? i havent really kept up with whats going on.
Mandatory abortion coverage is in HR3200.
I am very curious where you found that in HR3200.
-It will requier health care plans to cover Essential Benefits-
Essential Benefits seems to equal Mandatory Abortion Coverage according to some folks out there.
Until it is expressly excluded in the bill, or set to restrictions of therapeutic abortions for complications... All abortion will be funded, including elective (choice) abortion. Simply because it is not expressly stated otherwise, it can fall under the Essential Benefits Package for Family Planning, In-Patient, Out-Patient, Physician Services, whatever.
Originally posted by Earthgirl I am very curious where you found that in HR3200.
Because many Democrats, including Obama, Pelosi, Reid, and many others, consider an abortion an "essential benefit" and the language for "essential benefit" is so broad within the bill.
You're quite the naive one if you cannot put that together.
will tax dollars really start going towards abortions? i havent really kept up with whats going on.
Mandatory abortion coverage is in HR3200.
I am very curious where you found that in HR3200.
-It will requier health care plans to cover Essential Benefits-
Essential Benefits seems to equal Mandatory Abortion Coverage according to some folks out there.
What this Healthcare plan does NOT do is solve the core issues, ensure that all people get the best care possible, allow doctors to uphold their oaths and treat first ask questions later, or truly drive the costs down. Saying that is impossible is a lie. There are real plans being offered that actually give the best care to everyone without bankrupting this country. Obamas claim it will not increase the deficit is a blatent lie. I am tired of people supporting lies.
I want these problems to be solved, but they will not as long as we put insurance companies, the AMA, and Pharmaceutical companies before the loss in human lives.
ALL this plan is is an expanded version of our current corrupt system. They are making it more corrupt, not less and it will be at the costs of American lives. The insurance companies need to be done away with, the AMA needs to be replaced with the IADMD, and the pharmaceutical companies need to be charged criminally for their crimes against humanity if they do not stop with the sadistic treatment of human beings.
will tax dollars really start going towards abortions? i havent really kept up with whats going on.
Mandatory abortion coverage is in HR3200.
I am very curious where you found that in HR3200.
-It will requier health care plans to cover Essential Benefits-
Essential Benefits seems to equal Mandatory Abortion Coverage according to some folks out there.
What this Healthcare plan does NOT do is solve the core issues, ensure that all people get the best care possible, allow doctors to uphold their oaths and treat first ask questions later, or truly drive the costs down. Saying that is impossible is a lie. There are real plans being offered that actually give the best care to everyone without bankrupting this country. Obamas claim it will not increase the deficit is a blatent lie. I am tired of people supporting lies.
This would take the clueless supporters of HR3200 to realize this is not about providing high-quality care and coverage for everyone, but instead a power grab by the Democrats.
Originally posted by aeroplane22 Originally posted by popinjay
Originally posted by Zindaihas
Originally posted by popinjay
Sad thing is.. they are probably all able to carry guns and vote, lol. I wouldn't trust them with a driver's license.
Uh huh. And did you attack those who compared Bush to Hitler and the Joker with equal ferver? I guess when you do it Bush it's patriotism, but when you do it to Obama it's racism.
I'll say "Yes, I did" just to see where you are going with this.
And thank you. You, Zindaihas were the FIRST person in nine posts to accuse these people of racism, or even utter the word. Or even suggest in any way they are racist or think someone else could. You also used the word Hitler as a link invoking Godwin's Law. You get double points for showing just how you mind really works here.
You certainly showed everyone what YOU see and what angle you've been come from here. I and a few others simply see nutbags holding stupid signs.
You assume by the pictures there's a racial tone implied or that one can be drawn.
Sigh, I'm tired of your "Godwin's Law" crap. In case you didn't realize, the pictures you posted contain an Obama with a Hitler mustache. Also, it was pretty damn common for people to compare Bush to Hitler. It's not very common with Obama, to be honest. Yet you posted a picture with someone portraying Obama as Hitler, and then you try to rail on someone for mentioning Bush and Hitler...
It is precisely because such a comparison or reference may sometimes be appropriate, Godwin has argued,[4] that overuse of Nazi and Hitler comparisons should be avoided, because it robs the valid comparisons of their impact.
Read it. Learn it. Love it.
This is not Bush talk. This is Obama talk. Keep on the issue.
Originally posted by olddaddy Originally posted by popinjay
This picture is my favorite one of the bunch! Way out there on the right is a guy in a green baseball style cap carrying a sign which indicates that he is opposed to the use of HIS tax dollars to pay for health care. Seeing as he is of approximately Medicare age, I wonder if he refuses to allow MY taxes to pay for HIS Medicare health care costs? Or is he only opposed to using HIS taxes to pay for MY Medicare health care costs? I can see why certain candidates from a certain political alignment who have extra marital affairs while expousing family values can continue to get elected, and re-elected. There really is a double standard, isn't there?
Good point old.
The even MORE interesting thing about that guy is he's wearing a Veteran's hat.
So he's getting Medicare, Medicaid AND Veteran's health benefits. Talk about irony.
I wish there was a way those healthcare benefits gave logic courses with the coverage so he could take part in them.
You would think some of you conservatives would want the health care bill passed. After all, if it's as evil and doomsday bringing as you say it is, it won't last a year before being removed. Then any and all arguments for a reform like it wouldn't happen for another 50 years.
Scared it might work? You can't tell me you fear for the well-being of citizens, because there are 40+ million citizens without health care that you don't seem to care about. Don't give me cost either, the cost per person in pretty much every proposed bill is lower than the average person pays now.
Or is it just fear of the government and change in general? That at least is a somewhat valid argument, a bit insane imo, but at least valid.
You would think some of you conservatives would want the health care bill passed. After all, if it's as evil and doomsday bringing as you say it is, it won't last a year before being removed. Then any and all arguments for a reform like it wouldn't happen for another 50 years. Scared it might work? You can't tell me you fear for the well-being of citizens, because there are 40+ million citizens without health care that you don't seem to care about. Don't give me cost either, the cost per person in pretty much every proposed bill is lower than the average person pays now.
Or is it just fear of the government and change in general? That at least is a somewhat valid argument, a bit insane imo, but at least valid.
That is what you don;t seem to understand. It is not about deomcrats, republicans, liberals or conservatives. This is too important to be messed up. If they are going to fix it, they need to fix it right, and fix the core issues rather than just expanding the current corrupt system. That is all this bill does. It does not remove the parties preying on the sick and injured, it does not hold them accountable for crimes against humanity, it does not improve the quality of care received by all. It doesn;t even ensure everyone gets medical treatment they need. No, people these days cannot even afford their co pays, so even those with insurance do not get the treatment they need due to the corrupt system.
This plan does not effectively reduce costs by removing the 3rd party paracites, no instead it puts them in control, giving them more profit and power instead. This plan caters to the insurance companies, which are at the core here with driving up costs and preventing everyone from being treated in the first place with the best care.
Do you seriously think that anyone who opposes this plan wants people to be without care, or are uneducated as to what is at stake here? All of the nonsense being thrown back and forth does not allow for real discussion of true universal care and what is the best plan of action. The core issues in our systemn need to be fixed properly and I do not see either side willing to address those issues.
It is like this. If a patient has cancer, instead of treating the cancer you treat their irratble bowl syndrome instead. It doesn;t solve the real issues, it only says here I am not going to help you with the terrible problem, I am just going to make you a bit more comforatable. The real issues Must be solved, and unless they accomplish that with this bill it is disasterous to our people.
Why are there so many people who want every president impeached? I'm not sure these people even know what the grounds are for impeachment.
I've noticed that that's almost become SOP for some on both sides. It seems that the first tactic for the side that loses is to try to drive the president's poll numbers down as far and as fast as possible. Thus making the president as ineffective as possible. The liberal media relished in announcing Bush's low approval rating. It would never let the American public forget how unpopular he was at the end of his presidency. And then comes the inevitable calls for impeachment, even if there are no grounds for it.
Well I'm a conservative, but I have to admit that many people on the right, particularly Sean Hannity, are beating their audiences over the head with Obama's sinking poll numbers. It's all done to render the president they oppose impotent. To be honest, I'm not very happy when either side does it. Let the poll numbers go, with the internet today anybody can learn a politician's approval rating with a few keystrokes.
I know there are already some kooks who are calling for Obama to be impeached, but so far no one who holds a position of power. There were when Bush was president. Those people made fools of themselves, imo. If any of Obama's opponents in government try to do it, they too will look like idiots. Unless, of course, he does something to warrant it.
You would think some of you conservatives would want the health care bill passed. After all, if it's as evil and doomsday bringing as you say it is, it won't last a year before being removed. Then any and all arguments for a reform like it wouldn't happen for another 50 years. Scared it might work? You can't tell me you fear for the well-being of citizens, because there are 40+ million citizens without health care that you don't seem to care about. Don't give me cost either, the cost per person in pretty much every proposed bill is lower than the average person pays now.
Or is it just fear of the government and change in general? That at least is a somewhat valid argument, a bit insane imo, but at least valid.
That is what you don;t seem to understand. It is not about deomcrats, republicans, liberals or conservatives. This is too important to be messed up. If they are going to fix it, they need to fix it right, and fix the core issues rather than just expanding the current corrupt system. That is all this bill does. It does not remove the parties preying on the sick and injured, it does not hold them accountable for crimes against humanity, it does not improve the quality of care received by all. It doesn;t even ensure everyone gets medical treatment they need. No, people these days cannot even afford their co pays, so even those with insurance do not get the treatment they need due to the corrupt system.
This plan does not effectively reduce costs by removing the 3rd party paracites, no instead it puts them in control, giving them more profit and power instead. This plan caters to the insurance companies, which are at the core here with driving up costs and preventing everyone from being treated in the first place with the best care.
Do you seriously think that anyone who opposes this plan wants people to be without care, or are uneducated as to what is at stake here? All of the nonsense being thrown back and forth does not allow for real discussion of true universal care and what is the best plan of action. The core issues in our systemn need to be fixed properly and I do not see either side willing to address those issues.
It is like this. If a patient has cancer, instead of treating the cancer you treat their irratble bowl syndrome instead. It doesn;t solve the real issues, it only says here I am not going to help you with the terrible problem, I am just going to make you a bit more comforatable. The real issues Must be solved, and unless they accomplish that with this bill it is disasterous to our people.
I know the real issue must be solved, and I think this bill is a step in the right direction. I think it's the only thing some of the conservatives out there can at least learn to accept, and with time, we can move from it to a fully public system. This bill (even though there are multiple) is a product of trying to appease the conservative senators. In all the effort put forward to make them at least consider it, they completely missed the point of the whole thing. I think the conservative senators know that. They know that the bill goes far enough for the right to complain, and not far enough for the left to be happy. They're hoping everyone hates it so they can go on their merry way not dealing with healt care at all. So I say fuck them, pass it through, and gradually evolve it into a better public system.
If it were possible to throw a bill out there right now with a fully public system, I'd take that anyday over this bill, but I seriously think mini wars would break out if a bill like that was being pushed through. So we have to take it slow.
You would think some of you conservatives would want the health care bill passed. After all, if it's as evil and doomsday bringing as you say it is, it won't last a year before being removed. Then any and all arguments for a reform like it wouldn't happen for another 50 years. Scared it might work? You can't tell me you fear for the well-being of citizens, because there are 40+ million citizens without health care that you don't seem to care about. Don't give me cost either, the cost per person in pretty much every proposed bill is lower than the average person pays now.
Or is it just fear of the government and change in general? That at least is a somewhat valid argument, a bit insane imo, but at least valid.
That is what you don;t seem to understand. It is not about deomcrats, republicans, liberals or conservatives. This is too important to be messed up. If they are going to fix it, they need to fix it right, and fix the core issues rather than just expanding the current corrupt system. That is all this bill does. It does not remove the parties preying on the sick and injured, it does not hold them accountable for crimes against humanity, it does not improve the quality of care received by all. It doesn;t even ensure everyone gets medical treatment they need. No, people these days cannot even afford their co pays, so even those with insurance do not get the treatment they need due to the corrupt system.
This plan does not effectively reduce costs by removing the 3rd party paracites, no instead it puts them in control, giving them more profit and power instead. This plan caters to the insurance companies, which are at the core here with driving up costs and preventing everyone from being treated in the first place with the best care.
Do you seriously think that anyone who opposes this plan wants people to be without care, or are uneducated as to what is at stake here? All of the nonsense being thrown back and forth does not allow for real discussion of true universal care and what is the best plan of action. The core issues in our systemn need to be fixed properly and I do not see either side willing to address those issues.
It is like this. If a patient has cancer, instead of treating the cancer you treat their irratble bowl syndrome instead. It doesn;t solve the real issues, it only says here I am not going to help you with the terrible problem, I am just going to make you a bit more comforatable. The real issues Must be solved, and unless they accomplish that with this bill it is disasterous to our people.
I know the real issue must be solved, and I think this bill is a step in the right direction. I think it's the only thing some of the conservatives out there can at least learn to accept, and with time, we can move from it to a fully public system. This bill (even though there are multiple) is a product of trying to appease the conservative senators. In all the effort put forward to make them at least consider it, they completely missed the point of the whole thing. I think the conservative senators know that. They know that the bill goes far enough for the right to complain, and not far enough for the left to be happy. They're hoping everyone hates it so they can go on their merry way not dealing with healt care at all. So I say fuck them, pass it through, and gradually evolve it into a better public system.
If it were possible to throw a bill out there right now with a fully public system, I'd take that anyday over this bill, but I seriously think mini wars would break out if a bill like that was being pushed through. So we have to take it slow.
I agree something needs to be done, but I strongly disagree that this is a step in the right direction at all. It gives the people causing the problems more power. It actually puts the 3rd party paracites in charge of this. I disagree that doing something, even if it is wrong, is better than doing nothing. Have you read the IADMD's plan? Doctors have the ability to provide better free healthcare than our government, in fact without them none of the free clinics that currently exist in this country would even exist. What I cannot understand is why people will not listen to the doctors who have been dealing with this on the front lines instead of the insurance comapnies. The doctors in this country have already been treating the uninsured for years, are currently treating them as we speak, and will continue to treat anyone whether they have insurance and cannot afford co pays, have no insurance.. it doesn;t matter to them they just treat whoever needs it as it is. Why is it their plans are not even being considered, publicized or debated in this ?
You would think some of you conservatives would want the health care bill passed. After all, if it's as evil and doomsday bringing as you say it is, it won't last a year before being removed. Then any and all arguments for a reform like it wouldn't happen for another 50 years. Scared it might work? You can't tell me you fear for the well-being of citizens, because there are 40+ million citizens without health care that you don't seem to care about. Don't give me cost either, the cost per person in pretty much every proposed bill is lower than the average person pays now.
Or is it just fear of the government and change in general? That at least is a somewhat valid argument, a bit insane imo, but at least valid.
That is what you don;t seem to understand. It is not about deomcrats, republicans, liberals or conservatives. This is too important to be messed up. If they are going to fix it, they need to fix it right, and fix the core issues rather than just expanding the current corrupt system. That is all this bill does. It does not remove the parties preying on the sick and injured, it does not hold them accountable for crimes against humanity, it does not improve the quality of care received by all. It doesn;t even ensure everyone gets medical treatment they need. No, people these days cannot even afford their co pays, so even those with insurance do not get the treatment they need due to the corrupt system.
This plan does not effectively reduce costs by removing the 3rd party paracites, no instead it puts them in control, giving them more profit and power instead. This plan caters to the insurance companies, which are at the core here with driving up costs and preventing everyone from being treated in the first place with the best care.
Do you seriously think that anyone who opposes this plan wants people to be without care, or are uneducated as to what is at stake here? All of the nonsense being thrown back and forth does not allow for real discussion of true universal care and what is the best plan of action. The core issues in our systemn need to be fixed properly and I do not see either side willing to address those issues.
It is like this. If a patient has cancer, instead of treating the cancer you treat their irratble bowl syndrome instead. It doesn;t solve the real issues, it only says here I am not going to help you with the terrible problem, I am just going to make you a bit more comforatable. The real issues Must be solved, and unless they accomplish that with this bill it is disasterous to our people.
I know the real issue must be solved, and I think this bill is a step in the right direction. I think it's the only thing some of the conservatives out there can at least learn to accept, and with time, we can move from it to a fully public system. This bill (even though there are multiple) is a product of trying to appease the conservative senators. In all the effort put forward to make them at least consider it, they completely missed the point of the whole thing. I think the conservative senators know that. They know that the bill goes far enough for the right to complain, and not far enough for the left to be happy. They're hoping everyone hates it so they can go on their merry way not dealing with healt care at all. So I say fuck them, pass it through, and gradually evolve it into a better public system.
If it were possible to throw a bill out there right now with a fully public system, I'd take that anyday over this bill, but I seriously think mini wars would break out if a bill like that was being pushed through. So we have to take it slow.
I agree something needs to be done, but I strongly disagree that this is a step in the right direction at all. It gives the people causing the problems more power. It actually puts the 3rd party paracites in charge of this. I disagree that doing something, even if it is wrong, is better than doing nothing. Have you read the IADMD's plan? Doctors have the ability to provide better free healthcare than our government, in fact without them none of the free clinics that currently exist in this country would even exist. What I cannot understand is why people will not listen to the doctors who have been dealing with this on the front lines instead of the insurance comapnies. The doctors in this country have already been treating the uninsured for years, are currently treating them as we speak, and will continue to treat anyone whether they have insurance and cannot afford co pays, have no insurance.. it doesn;t matter to them they just treat whoever needs it as it is. Why is it their plans are not even being considered, publicized or debated in this ?
The free clinics aren't treating everyone and everything. They can't, there just simply aren't enough of them. Not enough people donate, not enough doctors take the job.
Originally posted by olddaddy Seeing as he is of approximately Medicare age, I wonder if he refuses to allow MY taxes to pay for HIS Medicare health care costs?
This is the type of thinking that critics are worried about. You assume since he is elderly that he is on medicare. How many other assumptions will be made of the elderly? They're too old to work? They're too old to provide coverage? They're an unnecessary burden?
I'm not saying these are YOUR assumptions, but they are valid concerns that have been brushed aside.
Originally posted by olddaddy Seeing as he is of approximately Medicare age, I wonder if he refuses to allow MY taxes to pay for HIS Medicare health care costs?
This is the type of thinking that critics are worried about. You assume since he is elderly that he is on medicare. How many other assumptions will be made of the elderly? They're too old to work? They're too old to provide coverage? They're an unnecessary burden?
I'm not saying these are YOUR assumptions, but they are valid concerns that have been brushed aside.
At age 65 all Americans must register for Medicare Part A. If they do not register, they may never receive medicare.
Most corporate health plans now only cover workers. Retirees can elect to be covered under the corporate health plan if they pay their own premiums. At age 65, if they continue to pay the premiums from the corporate health plan rather than registering and taking Medicare part A they are damn fools.
Are you saying the guy with the sign is a damn fool? Or are you implying that he looks under 65 to you? If so, I probably look 25 to you. Don't get a job in "fool the guesser" at the local carnival, you'll give out too many prizes.
He's over 65. And the guy in the other picture that Baff and I are exchanging jokes about is obese.
You want politically correct flowery words from someone, don't look at me. I call it the way I see it.
'nuff said.
EDIT: My boss wants to send me for sensitivity training. She popped into a meeting I was in yesterday, I told her I could hear her phone ringing, that she better run and answer it. She said she just wanted to hear what we were talking about, and get some candy out of the jar. I told her to take the whole jar of candy and head back to her office. Somehow, she didn't appreciate that offer. (shrug).
Comments
This guy supports free health care....he's working on his coronary bypass surgery and diabites claims.
Th company that makes his belt really know what they are doing.
........and his clothes are original designs by Jamaal the Tentmaker.
will tax dollars really start going towards abortions? i havent really kept up with whats going on.
gamertag - Swaffle House
Mandatory abortion coverage is in HR3200.
Why are there so many people who want every president impeached? I'm not sure these people even know what the grounds are for impeachment.
Mandatory abortion coverage is in HR3200.
It's in the Family Planning section, I think Section 1920. It's not expressly described as abortion. It requires much going back and forth to see certain meanings in different sections. It is not described one way or the other, and if it is not expressly stated either way, it is essentially mandated.
It doesn't explicitly restrict certain abortion coverages, it just leaves it in the open under "Family Planning", and if it is not restricted in any way in the bill, (which it isn't) then it will fall under what "Family Planning" means according to the Dept. of Health or what have you.
That means it doesn't discriminate between Therapeutic or Elective abortion. The former being the "emergency" procedure and the latter being the "choice" procedure.
Unless amended, it will just fund either way, because it will default to the "Essential Benefits Package".
/sigh
Obama really needs sane arguements and critics to check him and his policies. With the fruitbaskets they have it would be a wonder if any sound arguements and improvements will actually make it in.
Mandatory abortion coverage is in HR3200.
I am very curious where you found that in HR3200.
-It will requier health care plans to cover Essential Benefits-
Essential Benefits seems to equal Mandatory Abortion Coverage according to some folks out there.
Mandatory abortion coverage is in HR3200.
I am very curious where you found that in HR3200.
-It will requier health care plans to cover Essential Benefits-
Essential Benefits seems to equal Mandatory Abortion Coverage according to some folks out there.
Until it is expressly excluded in the bill, or set to restrictions of therapeutic abortions for complications... All abortion will be funded, including elective (choice) abortion. Simply because it is not expressly stated otherwise, it can fall under the Essential Benefits Package for Family Planning, In-Patient, Out-Patient, Physician Services, whatever.
Because many Democrats, including Obama, Pelosi, Reid, and many others, consider an abortion an "essential benefit" and the language for "essential benefit" is so broad within the bill.
You're quite the naive one if you cannot put that together.
Mandatory abortion coverage is in HR3200.
I am very curious where you found that in HR3200.
-It will requier health care plans to cover Essential Benefits-
Essential Benefits seems to equal Mandatory Abortion Coverage according to some folks out there.
What this Healthcare plan does NOT do is solve the core issues, ensure that all people get the best care possible, allow doctors to uphold their oaths and treat first ask questions later, or truly drive the costs down. Saying that is impossible is a lie. There are real plans being offered that actually give the best care to everyone without bankrupting this country. Obamas claim it will not increase the deficit is a blatent lie. I am tired of people supporting lies.
I want these problems to be solved, but they will not as long as we put insurance companies, the AMA, and Pharmaceutical companies before the loss in human lives.
ALL this plan is is an expanded version of our current corrupt system. They are making it more corrupt, not less and it will be at the costs of American lives. The insurance companies need to be done away with, the AMA needs to be replaced with the IADMD, and the pharmaceutical companies need to be charged criminally for their crimes against humanity if they do not stop with the sadistic treatment of human beings.
Mandatory abortion coverage is in HR3200.
I am very curious where you found that in HR3200.
-It will requier health care plans to cover Essential Benefits-
Essential Benefits seems to equal Mandatory Abortion Coverage according to some folks out there.
What this Healthcare plan does NOT do is solve the core issues, ensure that all people get the best care possible, allow doctors to uphold their oaths and treat first ask questions later, or truly drive the costs down. Saying that is impossible is a lie. There are real plans being offered that actually give the best care to everyone without bankrupting this country. Obamas claim it will not increase the deficit is a blatent lie. I am tired of people supporting lies.
This would take the clueless supporters of HR3200 to realize this is not about providing high-quality care and coverage for everyone, but instead a power grab by the Democrats.
Uh huh. And did you attack those who compared Bush to Hitler and the Joker with equal ferver?
I guess when you do it Bush it's patriotism, but when you do it to Obama it's racism.
I'll say "Yes, I did" just to see where you are going with this.
And thank you. You, Zindaihas were the FIRST person in nine posts to accuse these people of racism, or even utter the word. Or even suggest in any way they are racist or think someone else could. You also used the word Hitler as a link invoking Godwin's Law. You get double points for showing just how you mind really works here.
You certainly showed everyone what YOU see and what angle you've been come from here. I and a few others simply see nutbags holding stupid signs.
You assume by the pictures there's a racial tone implied or that one can be drawn.
Sigh, I'm tired of your "Godwin's Law" crap. In case you didn't realize, the pictures you posted contain an Obama with a Hitler mustache. Also, it was pretty damn common for people to compare Bush to Hitler. It's not very common with Obama, to be honest. Yet you posted a picture with someone portraying Obama as Hitler, and then you try to rail on someone for mentioning Bush and Hitler...
Just, stop... with the Godwin's Law.
That's why it brings it in question.
Godwin's law
Read it. Learn it. Love it.
This is not Bush talk. This is Obama talk. Keep on the issue.
"TO MICHAEL!"
This picture is my favorite one of the bunch!
Way out there on the right is a guy in a green baseball style cap carrying a sign which indicates that he is opposed to the use of HIS tax dollars to pay for health care.
Seeing as he is of approximately Medicare age, I wonder if he refuses to allow MY taxes to pay for HIS Medicare health care costs?
Or is he only opposed to using HIS taxes to pay for MY Medicare health care costs?
I can see why certain candidates from a certain political alignment who have extra marital affairs while expousing family values can continue to get elected, and re-elected. There really is a double standard, isn't there?
Good point old.
The even MORE interesting thing about that guy is he's wearing a Veteran's hat.
So he's getting Medicare, Medicaid AND Veteran's health benefits. Talk about irony.
I wish there was a way those healthcare benefits gave logic courses with the coverage so he could take part in them.
"TO MICHAEL!"
Mandatory abortion coverage is in HR3200.
LMAO all the bampot Catholics will be waging Jihad then.
The Pope says teenage women must give birth!
It's good to see the Dark Ages never ended. Look out for bubonic plagues.
You would think some of you conservatives would want the health care bill passed. After all, if it's as evil and doomsday bringing as you say it is, it won't last a year before being removed. Then any and all arguments for a reform like it wouldn't happen for another 50 years.
Scared it might work? You can't tell me you fear for the well-being of citizens, because there are 40+ million citizens without health care that you don't seem to care about. Don't give me cost either, the cost per person in pretty much every proposed bill is lower than the average person pays now.
Or is it just fear of the government and change in general? That at least is a somewhat valid argument, a bit insane imo, but at least valid.
The Official God FAQ
What's humorous is how liberal you recall it, use it and defend it as it is a true scientific law and not a satire.
That is what you don;t seem to understand. It is not about deomcrats, republicans, liberals or conservatives. This is too important to be messed up. If they are going to fix it, they need to fix it right, and fix the core issues rather than just expanding the current corrupt system. That is all this bill does. It does not remove the parties preying on the sick and injured, it does not hold them accountable for crimes against humanity, it does not improve the quality of care received by all. It doesn;t even ensure everyone gets medical treatment they need. No, people these days cannot even afford their co pays, so even those with insurance do not get the treatment they need due to the corrupt system.
This plan does not effectively reduce costs by removing the 3rd party paracites, no instead it puts them in control, giving them more profit and power instead. This plan caters to the insurance companies, which are at the core here with driving up costs and preventing everyone from being treated in the first place with the best care.
Do you seriously think that anyone who opposes this plan wants people to be without care, or are uneducated as to what is at stake here? All of the nonsense being thrown back and forth does not allow for real discussion of true universal care and what is the best plan of action. The core issues in our systemn need to be fixed properly and I do not see either side willing to address those issues.
It is like this. If a patient has cancer, instead of treating the cancer you treat their irratble bowl syndrome instead. It doesn;t solve the real issues, it only says here I am not going to help you with the terrible problem, I am just going to make you a bit more comforatable. The real issues Must be solved, and unless they accomplish that with this bill it is disasterous to our people.
I've noticed that that's almost become SOP for some on both sides. It seems that the first tactic for the side that loses is to try to drive the president's poll numbers down as far and as fast as possible. Thus making the president as ineffective as possible. The liberal media relished in announcing Bush's low approval rating. It would never let the American public forget how unpopular he was at the end of his presidency. And then comes the inevitable calls for impeachment, even if there are no grounds for it.
Well I'm a conservative, but I have to admit that many people on the right, particularly Sean Hannity, are beating their audiences over the head with Obama's sinking poll numbers. It's all done to render the president they oppose impotent. To be honest, I'm not very happy when either side does it. Let the poll numbers go, with the internet today anybody can learn a politician's approval rating with a few keystrokes.
I know there are already some kooks who are calling for Obama to be impeached, but so far no one who holds a position of power. There were when Bush was president. Those people made fools of themselves, imo. If any of Obama's opponents in government try to do it, they too will look like idiots. Unless, of course, he does something to warrant it.
That is what you don;t seem to understand. It is not about deomcrats, republicans, liberals or conservatives. This is too important to be messed up. If they are going to fix it, they need to fix it right, and fix the core issues rather than just expanding the current corrupt system. That is all this bill does. It does not remove the parties preying on the sick and injured, it does not hold them accountable for crimes against humanity, it does not improve the quality of care received by all. It doesn;t even ensure everyone gets medical treatment they need. No, people these days cannot even afford their co pays, so even those with insurance do not get the treatment they need due to the corrupt system.
This plan does not effectively reduce costs by removing the 3rd party paracites, no instead it puts them in control, giving them more profit and power instead. This plan caters to the insurance companies, which are at the core here with driving up costs and preventing everyone from being treated in the first place with the best care.
Do you seriously think that anyone who opposes this plan wants people to be without care, or are uneducated as to what is at stake here? All of the nonsense being thrown back and forth does not allow for real discussion of true universal care and what is the best plan of action. The core issues in our systemn need to be fixed properly and I do not see either side willing to address those issues.
It is like this. If a patient has cancer, instead of treating the cancer you treat their irratble bowl syndrome instead. It doesn;t solve the real issues, it only says here I am not going to help you with the terrible problem, I am just going to make you a bit more comforatable. The real issues Must be solved, and unless they accomplish that with this bill it is disasterous to our people.
I know the real issue must be solved, and I think this bill is a step in the right direction. I think it's the only thing some of the conservatives out there can at least learn to accept, and with time, we can move from it to a fully public system. This bill (even though there are multiple) is a product of trying to appease the conservative senators. In all the effort put forward to make them at least consider it, they completely missed the point of the whole thing. I think the conservative senators know that. They know that the bill goes far enough for the right to complain, and not far enough for the left to be happy. They're hoping everyone hates it so they can go on their merry way not dealing with healt care at all. So I say fuck them, pass it through, and gradually evolve it into a better public system.
If it were possible to throw a bill out there right now with a fully public system, I'd take that anyday over this bill, but I seriously think mini wars would break out if a bill like that was being pushed through. So we have to take it slow.
The Official God FAQ
That is what you don;t seem to understand. It is not about deomcrats, republicans, liberals or conservatives. This is too important to be messed up. If they are going to fix it, they need to fix it right, and fix the core issues rather than just expanding the current corrupt system. That is all this bill does. It does not remove the parties preying on the sick and injured, it does not hold them accountable for crimes against humanity, it does not improve the quality of care received by all. It doesn;t even ensure everyone gets medical treatment they need. No, people these days cannot even afford their co pays, so even those with insurance do not get the treatment they need due to the corrupt system.
This plan does not effectively reduce costs by removing the 3rd party paracites, no instead it puts them in control, giving them more profit and power instead. This plan caters to the insurance companies, which are at the core here with driving up costs and preventing everyone from being treated in the first place with the best care.
Do you seriously think that anyone who opposes this plan wants people to be without care, or are uneducated as to what is at stake here? All of the nonsense being thrown back and forth does not allow for real discussion of true universal care and what is the best plan of action. The core issues in our systemn need to be fixed properly and I do not see either side willing to address those issues.
It is like this. If a patient has cancer, instead of treating the cancer you treat their irratble bowl syndrome instead. It doesn;t solve the real issues, it only says here I am not going to help you with the terrible problem, I am just going to make you a bit more comforatable. The real issues Must be solved, and unless they accomplish that with this bill it is disasterous to our people.
I know the real issue must be solved, and I think this bill is a step in the right direction. I think it's the only thing some of the conservatives out there can at least learn to accept, and with time, we can move from it to a fully public system. This bill (even though there are multiple) is a product of trying to appease the conservative senators. In all the effort put forward to make them at least consider it, they completely missed the point of the whole thing. I think the conservative senators know that. They know that the bill goes far enough for the right to complain, and not far enough for the left to be happy. They're hoping everyone hates it so they can go on their merry way not dealing with healt care at all. So I say fuck them, pass it through, and gradually evolve it into a better public system.
If it were possible to throw a bill out there right now with a fully public system, I'd take that anyday over this bill, but I seriously think mini wars would break out if a bill like that was being pushed through. So we have to take it slow.
I agree something needs to be done, but I strongly disagree that this is a step in the right direction at all. It gives the people causing the problems more power. It actually puts the 3rd party paracites in charge of this. I disagree that doing something, even if it is wrong, is better than doing nothing. Have you read the IADMD's plan? Doctors have the ability to provide better free healthcare than our government, in fact without them none of the free clinics that currently exist in this country would even exist. What I cannot understand is why people will not listen to the doctors who have been dealing with this on the front lines instead of the insurance comapnies. The doctors in this country have already been treating the uninsured for years, are currently treating them as we speak, and will continue to treat anyone whether they have insurance and cannot afford co pays, have no insurance.. it doesn;t matter to them they just treat whoever needs it as it is. Why is it their plans are not even being considered, publicized or debated in this ?
Good or bad, or just plain bad taste atleast these people are expressing themselves.
Who are we to say "these are patriots" or "these are nutters".
Really, it may seem extreme to us, but they obviously believe in something.
I don't bad mouth or really mock any kind of protest.
A protest is an outlet of anger that is non-violent.
It beats storming the Whitehouse.
That is what you don;t seem to understand. It is not about deomcrats, republicans, liberals or conservatives. This is too important to be messed up. If they are going to fix it, they need to fix it right, and fix the core issues rather than just expanding the current corrupt system. That is all this bill does. It does not remove the parties preying on the sick and injured, it does not hold them accountable for crimes against humanity, it does not improve the quality of care received by all. It doesn;t even ensure everyone gets medical treatment they need. No, people these days cannot even afford their co pays, so even those with insurance do not get the treatment they need due to the corrupt system.
This plan does not effectively reduce costs by removing the 3rd party paracites, no instead it puts them in control, giving them more profit and power instead. This plan caters to the insurance companies, which are at the core here with driving up costs and preventing everyone from being treated in the first place with the best care.
Do you seriously think that anyone who opposes this plan wants people to be without care, or are uneducated as to what is at stake here? All of the nonsense being thrown back and forth does not allow for real discussion of true universal care and what is the best plan of action. The core issues in our systemn need to be fixed properly and I do not see either side willing to address those issues.
It is like this. If a patient has cancer, instead of treating the cancer you treat their irratble bowl syndrome instead. It doesn;t solve the real issues, it only says here I am not going to help you with the terrible problem, I am just going to make you a bit more comforatable. The real issues Must be solved, and unless they accomplish that with this bill it is disasterous to our people.
I know the real issue must be solved, and I think this bill is a step in the right direction. I think it's the only thing some of the conservatives out there can at least learn to accept, and with time, we can move from it to a fully public system. This bill (even though there are multiple) is a product of trying to appease the conservative senators. In all the effort put forward to make them at least consider it, they completely missed the point of the whole thing. I think the conservative senators know that. They know that the bill goes far enough for the right to complain, and not far enough for the left to be happy. They're hoping everyone hates it so they can go on their merry way not dealing with healt care at all. So I say fuck them, pass it through, and gradually evolve it into a better public system.
If it were possible to throw a bill out there right now with a fully public system, I'd take that anyday over this bill, but I seriously think mini wars would break out if a bill like that was being pushed through. So we have to take it slow.
I agree something needs to be done, but I strongly disagree that this is a step in the right direction at all. It gives the people causing the problems more power. It actually puts the 3rd party paracites in charge of this. I disagree that doing something, even if it is wrong, is better than doing nothing. Have you read the IADMD's plan? Doctors have the ability to provide better free healthcare than our government, in fact without them none of the free clinics that currently exist in this country would even exist. What I cannot understand is why people will not listen to the doctors who have been dealing with this on the front lines instead of the insurance comapnies. The doctors in this country have already been treating the uninsured for years, are currently treating them as we speak, and will continue to treat anyone whether they have insurance and cannot afford co pays, have no insurance.. it doesn;t matter to them they just treat whoever needs it as it is. Why is it their plans are not even being considered, publicized or debated in this ?
The free clinics aren't treating everyone and everything. They can't, there just simply aren't enough of them. Not enough people donate, not enough doctors take the job.
What kind of plans are talking about exactly?
The Official God FAQ
This is the type of thinking that critics are worried about. You assume since he is elderly that he is on medicare. How many other assumptions will be made of the elderly? They're too old to work? They're too old to provide coverage? They're an unnecessary burden?
I'm not saying these are YOUR assumptions, but they are valid concerns that have been brushed aside.
This is the type of thinking that critics are worried about. You assume since he is elderly that he is on medicare. How many other assumptions will be made of the elderly? They're too old to work? They're too old to provide coverage? They're an unnecessary burden?
I'm not saying these are YOUR assumptions, but they are valid concerns that have been brushed aside.
At age 65 all Americans must register for Medicare Part A. If they do not register, they may never receive medicare.
Most corporate health plans now only cover workers. Retirees can elect to be covered under the corporate health plan if they pay their own premiums. At age 65, if they continue to pay the premiums from the corporate health plan rather than registering and taking Medicare part A they are damn fools.
Are you saying the guy with the sign is a damn fool? Or are you implying that he looks under 65 to you? If so, I probably look 25 to you. Don't get a job in "fool the guesser" at the local carnival, you'll give out too many prizes.
He's over 65. And the guy in the other picture that Baff and I are exchanging jokes about is obese.
You want politically correct flowery words from someone, don't look at me. I call it the way I see it.
'nuff said.
EDIT: My boss wants to send me for sensitivity training. She popped into a meeting I was in yesterday, I told her I could hear her phone ringing, that she better run and answer it. She said she just wanted to hear what we were talking about, and get some candy out of the jar. I told her to take the whole jar of candy and head back to her office. Somehow, she didn't appreciate that offer. (shrug).