NPCs are overpowered, so you are not on a level playing field. It takes a lot of skill to take down NPCs, a lot of coordination and planning. In FPS you are the same as other players, you just run around and shoot people, it's trivial and boring. Games that require some thought are interesting, FPS are for 10 year olds who run around screaming headshot and have no planning or logical capabilities.
Well, with the current MMO AI that isnt 100% true. To evolve MMOs we need npcs that act more like humans.
MMO NPCs are incredible stupid. You can't tank a human player, npcs just do the egular scripted thing everytime you meet them. There is a lot of potential in MMORPGs and I don't think MMOFPS will win the day in the long run.
MMOs today have 2 problems as I see it:
1. Stupid AI. Makes the game more easy than it should be. The AI is exactly the same in every game (besides Guildwars) since EQ. It must be greatly improved to make the games more fun and challenging. Just giving the bosses loads of HPs doesn't make the game more fun.´a Good AI is when you have hard to tell who is another player and who is a npc.
2. Boring combat system. Eqs old combat system is getting really old now, we need something new. But FPS style attacks with one or 2 strikes suck even more. Maybe it is time to make a MMORPG on the Wii. You could do all kinds of cool attacks with a Wii controler while still keeping the game a RPG.
Maybe the MMO NPCs in games you've played are stupid. The fact is, that software isn't as primitive as you think. An NPC has access to all of your stats, all of your HP, mana, classes, what all the players are casting at any one time. They could just use that if they wanted to make encounters more challenging. They don't tho, because it would be impossible for anyone to beat their content if they used that kind of thing.
I wouldn't call the AI primitive, we're way past the point where its capable of NPCs being smart. As I said, no one would play the games if NPCs were any more intelligent. Imagine what raid NPCs would do, they would go 1 round ur clerics regardless of your taunt. The whole concept of MMORPGs would be fucked, your abilities would be pretty much worthless if they had enough "AI".
I think the raids should be more unpredictable but I think making NPCs smarter in certain ways would make MMORPGs unplayable.
When you play an FPS game online, you play with and against other people. ALL THE TIME.
When you play an "MMO", you run around alone most of the time. I could also add that FPS multiplayer is generally 16 vs 16 up to 64 vs 64 and so beats the number of players in the same group as well as generally having better teamplayers, more intelligent people (flame suit on) and more action. I predict a future where future FPS games take over the MMO market. The MMO companies will continue to make WOW clones forever, and continue to fail, while companies like DICE and Infinity Ward continues to make games that are bigger and better, closing in on what we would call "MMO"s in functionality.
FPS games lack skill. They are usually just running around and killing/dying and respawning. I don't like FPS because it's just like you are shooting other players all the time, and NPCs tend to have more intelligence and are difficult to kill as opposed to players. If I play FPS games, they tend to get boring after 20 minutes of continuous play. They are total garbage.
And what is wrong with being alone in an MMORPG? Maybe I don't want to be with other people all of the time when I'm in an MMORPG. Some people just want to explore things. What is there to explore in trashy FPS games.
"NPCs tend to have more intelligence and are difficult to kill as opposed to players." You really did NOT just claim that.
Sir, you must be dense, because claiming that an MMO requires MORE skill than an FPS is utterly ridiculous. As much as I like MMOs they are at the same level of FPS's as far as PvP goes, but PvE is mind numbingly easy, boring, and repetitive. The AI in any game will never be more clever or as you said "intelligent" than a living, breathing, human.
NPCs are overpowered, so you are not on a level playing field. It takes a lot of skill to take down NPCs, a lot of coordination and planning. In FPS you are the same as other players, you just run around and shoot people, it's trivial and boring.
Games that require some thought are interesting, FPS are for 10 year olds who run around screaming headshot and have no planning or logical capabilities.
Oh yeah because in an FPS game all you have to do is tab lock them and just shoot to kill without having to aim properly, and enemies never side step to make you lose aim.
Enemies never take cover, they never pick up grenades you've thrown at them and toss it back at you, oh and they never shoot back do they?
There's no strategy involved in shooters like when you're spotting they call an armored tank your way to gun you down, enemies never group up to protect their numbers and they never use health packs...0o
Enemies never set up land mines and traps all over a narrow area while they're sitting at the other end behind turret guns.
They never aim for your head, they never use rocket launchers to one-shot you, shotgun groups don't try to flush you out while enemy snipers try to pick you off from a hidden location when you try to run.
You'll never find an weaker enemy try to bait you out and make you chase him into a dozen of his shotgun and chainsaw wielding friends around a corridor.
All enemies do in FPS games is stand in one place unable to spot you outside of a 10yard aggro range and continuesly walk back and forth back and forth unaware that just 20 yards from them you're teabagging one of their own even though you guys are in plane sight....oh and MMOs are nothing like that...lol
MMOs are soooo advanced in their AI, and FPS games are just sooo simply retarded..huh?
I mean am I right?? Or maybe you're just bias against FPS games and simply talking out of you're own ass?
Listen, FPS games are reflex based. You learn what goes on, then u figure out what actions to take. You don't really think that much in an FPS as compared to MMORPGs.
Aiming for the head, does that require strategy? Or using more powerful weapons? Lol.
FPS games are simple compared to MMORPGs. How is playing against other players even challenging? People used to play MMORPGs because the raid content was fun and challenging. If FPS had an ounce of challenge in them people might enjoy them.
I played FPS games, rainbow 6, counter strike, fear, etc. They just aren't as fun as MMORPGs, and get repetitive after 10 minutes
When you play an FPS game online, you play with and against other people. ALL THE TIME.
When you play an "MMO", you run around alone most of the time. I could also add that FPS multiplayer is generally 16 vs 16 up to 64 vs 64 and so beats the number of players in the same group as well as generally having better teamplayers, more intelligent people (flame suit on) and more action. I predict a future where future FPS games take over the MMO market. The MMO companies will continue to make WOW clones forever, and continue to fail, while companies like DICE and Infinity Ward continues to make games that are bigger and better, closing in on what we would call "MMO"s in functionality.
FPS games lack skill. They are usually just running around and killing/dying and respawning. I don't like FPS because it's just like you are shooting other players all the time, and NPCs tend to have more intelligence and are difficult to kill as opposed to players. If I play FPS games, they tend to get boring after 20 minutes of continuous play. They are total garbage.
And what is wrong with being alone in an MMORPG? Maybe I don't want to be with other people all of the time when I'm in an MMORPG. Some people just want to explore things. What is there to explore in trashy FPS games.
"NPCs tend to have more intelligence and are difficult to kill as opposed to players." You really did NOT just claim that.
Sir, you must be dense, because claiming that an MMO requires MORE skill than an FPS is utterly ridiculous. As much as I like MMOs they are at the same level of FPS's as far as PvP goes, but PvE is mind numbingly easy, boring, and repetitive. The AI in any game will never be more clever or as you said "intelligent" than a living, breathing, human.
NPCs are overpowered, so you are not on a level playing field. It takes a lot of skill to take down NPCs, a lot of coordination and planning. In FPS you are the same as other players, you just run around and shoot people, it's trivial and boring.
Games that require some thought are interesting, FPS are for 10 year olds who run around screaming headshot and have no planning or logical capabilities.
Oh yeah because in an FPS game all you have to do is tab lock them and just shoot to kill without having to aim properly, and enemies never side step to make you lose aim.
Enemies never take cover, they never pick up grenades you've thrown at them and toss it back at you, oh and they never shoot back do they?
There's no strategy involved in shooters like when you're spotting they call an armored tank your way to gun you down, enemies never group up to protect their numbers and they never use health packs...0o
Enemies never set up land mines and traps all over a narrow area while they're sitting at the other end behind turret guns.
They never aim for your head, they never use rocket launchers to one-shot you, shotgun groups don't try to flush you out while enemy snipers try to pick you off from a hidden location when you try to run.
You'll never find an weaker enemy try to bait you out and make you chase him into a dozen of his shotgun and chainsaw wielding friends around a corridor.
All enemies do in FPS games is stand in one place unable to spot you outside of a 10yard aggro range and continuesly walk back and forth back and forth unaware that just 20 yards from them you're teabagging one of their own even though you guys are in plane sight....oh and MMOs are nothing like that...lol
MMOs are soooo advanced in their AI, and FPS games are just sooo simply retarded..huh?
I mean am I right?? Or maybe you're just bias against FPS games and simply talking out of you're own ass?
Listen, FPS games are reflex based. You learn what goes on, then u figure out what actions to take. You don't really think that much in an FPS as compared to MMORPGs.
Aiming for the head, does that require strategy? Or using more powerful weapons? Lol.
FPS games are simple compared to MMORPGs. How is playing against other players even challenging? People used to play MMORPGs because the raid content was fun and challenging. If FPS had an ounce of challenge in them people might enjoy them.
I played FPS games, rainbow 6, counter strike, fear, etc. They just aren't as fun as MMORPGs, and get repetitive after 10 minutes
...blah blah blah...that's all I hear man...I'm sorry.
Saying MMOs have more strategy completely throws your credibility out the window in my eyes, right now you sound like an obtuse WoW fanboi...0o
>>
If you were to argue that RTS games require more strategy that would have been a different story since they're the only genre I've seen to surpass the level of strategy that you find FPS games.
But MMOs are made for grind even the simplest mind is capable of going from level 1-endgame.
Simply put I stopped here " You don't really think that much in an FPS as compared to MMORPGs," can't tell you how many times I've been in PvP or in an end game raid while watching TV and talking on the phone at the same time....and that's the best MMOs have to offer....0o
"NPCs tend to have more intelligence and are difficult to kill as opposed to players." You really did NOT just claim that.
Sir, you must be dense, because claiming that an MMO requires MORE skill than an FPS is utterly ridiculous. As much as I like MMOs they are at the same level of FPS's as far as PvP goes, but PvE is mind numbingly easy, boring, and repetitive. The AI in any game will never be more clever or as you said "intelligent" than a living, breathing, human.
"NPCs tend to have more intelligence and are difficult to kill as opposed to players." You really did NOT just claim that.
Sir, you must be dense, because claiming that an MMO requires MORE skill than an FPS is utterly ridiculous. As much as I like MMOs they are at the same level of FPS's as far as PvP goes, but PvE is mind numbingly easy, boring, and repetitive. The AI in any game will never be more clever or as you said "intelligent" than a living, breathing, human.
Superior? As in charging fees per month? As in the RPG aspect? As in getting new gear/items/skills/abilities as you level up?
So Crimecraft, Huxley, gunz, among others, are all the type of FPS mmo games you are referring to? And are doing so well?
Or do you mean Call of Duty 10 will be better than MMO xx10?
A game that is entirely based off connection, reaction times, and "skill" will not enter into the MMO sort of level. But than again, there is no skill in an MMO. Which is why you can't join WoW, or War, and be the best there is in that game instantly right?
When you play an FPS game online, you play with and against other people. ALL THE TIME.
When you play an "MMO", you run around alone most of the time. I could also add that FPS multiplayer is generally 16 vs 16 up to 64 vs 64 and so beats the number of players in the same group as well as generally having better teamplayers, more intelligent people (flame suit on) and more action. I predict a future where future FPS games take over the MMO market. The MMO companies will continue to make WOW clones forever, and continue to fail, while companies like DICE and Infinity Ward continues to make games that are bigger and better, closing in on what we would call "MMO"s in functionality.
Think about it. . It's like saying Pizza will beat Tacos, and therefore Tacos will disappear.
The FPS mmo, with headshots= criticals, defenately would work as E sport, and the eye-hand coordination gamestyle would support a inverioment where you truly could talk about skilled ( ie fast reactions) players. But suchs game would at the same time, be The Horror for older mature MMO geeks - they wouldnt stand a chance when all the sugar doped 14 years old Counterstrike mutants enter the scene.
The FPS mmo, with headshots= criticals, defenately would work as E sport, and the eye-hand coordination gamestyle would support a inverioment where you truly could talk about skilled ( ie fast reactions) players. But suchs game would at the same time, be The Horror for older mature MMO geeks - they wouldnt stand a chance when all the sugar doped 14 years old Counterstrike mutants enter the scene.
Well maybe the genre needs to be shaken up a bit considering how much of a borefest MMOs have become. My god if I see another MMO come out that's been hyped to hell or considered a sleeper and fail after the first month I'm becoming a full blown MMO hater and troll from then on.
I'll just hop on these forums to inform you all how awesome CoD:MW2 or Mass Effect 2 are and lol while asking how you're genre is doing.
Right now I have 10 different FPS games I'm looking forward to coming out in the next six months, do you know how many MMOs there are?
Zero.
The way MMOs are going MO will suck, APB will suck and so will ToR...and those games are not even guaranteed to come out for another year or so.
All that time wasted just to realize maybe I should have never left WoW if I'm really that much of an MMO enthusiast.
The FPS mmo, with headshots= criticals, defenately would work as E sport, and the eye-hand coordination gamestyle would support a inverioment where you truly could talk about skilled ( ie fast reactions) players. But suchs game would at the same time, be The Horror for older mature MMO geeks - they wouldnt stand a chance when all the sugar doped 14 years old Counterstrike mutants enter the scene.
Well maybe the genre needs to be shaken up a bit considering how much of a borefest MMOs have become. My god if I see another MMO come out that's been hyped to hell or considered a sleeper and fail after the first month I'm becoming a full blown MMO hater and troll from then on.
I'll just hop on these forums to inform you all how awesome CoD:MW2 or Mass Effect 2 are and lol while asking how you're genre is doing.
Right now I have 10 different FPS games I'm looking forward to coming out in the next six months, do you know how many MMOs there are?
Zero.
The way MMOs are going MO will suck, APB will suck and so will ToR...and those games are not even guaranteed to come out for another year or so.
All that time wasted just to realize maybe I should have never left WoW if I'm really that much of an MMO enthusiast.
Now that's pathetic...>>
Then don't play MMORPGs, play First Person Shooter games.
FPS games already have a major advantage over most MMOs on the market in that they are free to play once you own the software. But I have to agree, FPS games are starting to behave more like RPGs. Just look at CoD4 and TF2 with the achievements and unlocks. It's almost like loot rewards. And character progression. And story driven plots (ala Left 4 Dead).
Vault-Tec analysts have concluded that the odds of worldwide nuclear armaggeddon this decade are 17,143,762... to 1.
The only thing i see coming is that FPS games will soon start charging a subscription.
And the best pizza in the world (im thinking baked in a traditional wood oven and with fresh pressed olio, a margherita obviously, although you could have some mozzarella di bufala and prosciutto on the side) will never beat authentic gaonera style steak and cheese tacos.
Just to make things clear... I speak for myself and no one else, unless i state otherwise mine is just an opinion. A fact is something that can be independently verified, you may challenge such but with proof. You have every right to disagree with me through sound argument, i believe in constructive debate, but baseless aggression will warrant an unkind response.
(..)But I have to agree, FPS games are starting to behave more like RPGs. Just look at CoD4 and TF2 with the achievements and unlocks. It's almost like loot rewards. And character progression. And story driven plots (ala Left 4 Dead).
Counterstrike mods with xp gain and superpower rewards have shown me that you prolly have to go a whole new way, if you want to combine Hack n Slash and RPG with Shooters. The games have a fundament; you enter a game with a certain mindset ( in danish you would say that a game have a Præmis, but cant find a decent english word...), so if you enter a shooter, you expect that all players are more or less on equel ground at start, and is here to compete in aiming and fast reactions. Surprise , surprise, when someone throw a `nade your direction and you and all your teammates blow up - because u know, that wasnt a nade, it was Superlevel10nuke, which you can equip when you have played that server for 7 hours. It just feel akward and unfair.
That said i think there have been some pretty decent experiments with Fallout 3 as the absolute best in singleplayer, and Tabula Rasa as a decent mmo shooter.
When you play an FPS game online, you play with and against other people. ALL THE TIME.
When you play an "MMO", you run around alone most of the time. I could also add that FPS multiplayer is generally 16 vs 16 up to 64 vs 64 and so beats the number of players in the same group as well as generally having better teamplayers, more intelligent people (flame suit on) and more action. I predict a future where future FPS games take over the MMO market. The MMO companies will continue to make WOW clones forever, and continue to fail, while companies like DICE and Infinity Ward continues to make games that are bigger and better, closing in on what we would call "MMO"s in functionality.
FPS games lack skill. They are usually just running around and killing/dying and respawning. I don't like FPS because it's just like you are shooting other players all the time, and NPCs tend to have more intelligence and are difficult to kill as opposed to players. If I play FPS games, they tend to get boring after 20 minutes of continuous play. They are total garbage.
And what is wrong with being alone in an MMORPG? Maybe I don't want to be with other people all of the time when I'm in an MMORPG. Some people just want to explore things. What is there to explore in trashy FPS games.
"NPCs tend to have more intelligence and are difficult to kill as opposed to players." You really did NOT just claim that.
Sir, you must be dense, because claiming that an MMO requires MORE skill than an FPS is utterly ridiculous. As much as I like MMOs they are at the same level of FPS's as far as PvP goes, but PvE is mind numbingly easy, boring, and repetitive. The AI in any game will never be more clever or as you said "intelligent" than a living, breathing, human.
NPCs are overpowered, so you are not on a level playing field. It takes a lot of skill to take down NPCs, a lot of coordination and planning. In FPS you are the same as other players, you just run around and shoot people, it's trivial and boring.
Games that require some thought are interesting, FPS are for 10 year olds who run around screaming headshot and have no planning or logical capabilities.
Wow, I have to come back to this post, it's just so retarded I enjoyed tearing into it the first time I feel like doing it again..=D
MMOs require skills to take on NPCs? Yeah I know just like all those times I'd aggro a group by mistake, my PC would crash, I'd log on to find my avatar took them all out with auto attack...HAHA, that's strategy and skill alright!
You know maybe the reason you think FPS games are for retards is because you play like a retard in FPS games....just stay away from the Halo crowd and trust me you'll find just how much more advanced combat in FPS games are compared to MMO.
I'd go as far as to say that the reason most MMOs these days are failing is that they don't clone WoW enough. They always try and cater for counterstrike players who will never play anything but counterstike anyway.
What the difference beetween massively multiplayer online, multiplayer and online game?
That day a FPS online game beats an MMO game would that need to make it into an MMO game in first place. Are you not just saying that a MMO game you like is better than a MMO game you don't like?
IMO its two different genres so one will never overtake the other, there probably will be some games that merge both genres into an awesome gaming experience (I hope borderlands will be kind of a preview to what an MMOFPS can be like) but like others have said, its comparing apples and oranges.
Now for the guy that said MMOs take more skill the FPS'....you sir are so dense I'd rather have a conversation with a 4 year old who talks about pillows and dog shit then listen to you. I can only assume every FPS you have played you've only done deathmatches and have had autoaim on from the start.
I've played EQ, UO, FFXI, WoW, EVE and plenty of other MMOs and I have never ever had to think about how to take out NPCs with a strategy its always the same thing no matter what game, spam your highest dmg spell or ability and occasionally cure yourself: wash, rinse, repeat.
Now with the many FPS' I've played, I dont even count halo that much unless its CTF or Assault, games like CoD4 that I play with a group of friends, there is a lot of talking going on between all of us and we still donminate, even while we talk about random things like the last bengals game or the next new console game coming out. So the socializing is still there just like any GOOD MMO (WoW is such a lonely game sometimes)
Then there will always be strategy and thinking when playing headquarters or search and destroy in CoD. What base to take because they will be easy to defend, or having these bases will make them respawn in a horrible vantage point, who defends what with what weapon, so on and so forth...so just stop fanboying and play against hardcore fps fans that arent 14 year old screaming children on halo and you will find plenty of strategy and skill.
Now back to playing FFXI while I wait for FF14, Borderlands, Dragon Age, CoD MW2, and Demon Souls
The FPS mmo, with headshots= criticals, defenately would work as E sport, and the eye-hand coordination gamestyle would support a inverioment where you truly could talk about skilled ( ie fast reactions) players. But suchs game would at the same time, be The Horror for older mature MMO geeks - they wouldnt stand a chance when all the sugar doped 14 years old Counterstrike mutants enter the scene.
Well maybe the genre needs to be shaken up a bit considering how much of a borefest MMOs have become. My god if I see another MMO come out that's been hyped to hell or considered a sleeper and fail after the first month I'm becoming a full blown MMO hater and troll from then on.
I'll just hop on these forums to inform you all how awesome CoD:MW2 or Mass Effect 2 are and lol while asking how you're genre is doing.
Right now I have 10 different FPS games I'm looking forward to coming out in the next six months, do you know how many MMOs there are?
Zero.
The way MMOs are going MO will suck, APB will suck and so will ToR...and those games are not even guaranteed to come out for another year or so.
All that time wasted just to realize maybe I should have never left WoW if I'm really that much of an MMO enthusiast.
I honestly wish you were right man but you’re not.
FPS games are for a breed of players and then, within that breed, a handfull are superior to the rest.
The issue here is that most players are yes, indeed pub style players that can have incredible matches among each other, then anomaly such as me or other much better player then me, will come in and swiftly turn the battle around with nothing more then a pistol.
Take planetside for example, my buddies and I played that game for maybe 3 or 4 months. We had an average of over 3000 kills and less then 50 deaths. Our teamwork, tactics, aim and such were much more superior than some of the highest levels in the game. We didn’t use the epic high end gear, all we used were the little default assault rifles and medium armor lol.
The reason MMOs are like how they are today is to enforce a balance. The balance is made through skills and stats and it’s basicaly, who can get the best gear first. Sure you’ll probably find a few tactics here and there but don’t expect much more. Even Darkfall is borderline moer based on stats then player skills.
You want to see how good you would do in an FPS mmo?
www.quakelive.com
go play against the league players and let me know how you did.
I honestly wish you were right man but youre not. FPS games are for a breed of players and then, within that breed, a handfull are superior to the rest. The issue here is that most players are yes, indeed pub style players that can have incredible matches among each other, then anomaly such as me or other much better player then me, will come in and swiftly turn the battle around with nothing more then a pistol. Take planetside for example, my buddies and I played that game for maybe 3 or 4 months. We had an average of over 3000 kills and less then 50 deaths. Our teamwork, tactics, aim and such were much more superior than some of the highest levels in the game. We didnt use the epic high end gear, all we used were the little default assault rifles and medium armor lol. The reason MMOs are like how they are today is to enforce a balance. The balance is made through skills and stats and its basicaly, who can get the best gear first. Sure youll probably find a few tactics here and there but dont expect much more. Even Darkfall is borderline moer based on stats then player skills. You want to see how good you would do in an FPS mmo? www.quakelive.com go play against the league players and let me know how you did.
Im sorry, but i dont think i understand you... are you saying that an MMO from established fps-games developers would fail because some players are better than others? lol?
Ive played Quake on and off since Quake 1 btw. Quake 2 on a competitive worldclass level.
Comments
Well, with the current MMO AI that isnt 100% true. To evolve MMOs we need npcs that act more like humans.
MMO NPCs are incredible stupid. You can't tank a human player, npcs just do the egular scripted thing everytime you meet them. There is a lot of potential in MMORPGs and I don't think MMOFPS will win the day in the long run.
MMOs today have 2 problems as I see it:
1. Stupid AI. Makes the game more easy than it should be. The AI is exactly the same in every game (besides Guildwars) since EQ. It must be greatly improved to make the games more fun and challenging. Just giving the bosses loads of HPs doesn't make the game more fun.´a Good AI is when you have hard to tell who is another player and who is a npc.
2. Boring combat system. Eqs old combat system is getting really old now, we need something new. But FPS style attacks with one or 2 strikes suck even more. Maybe it is time to make a MMORPG on the Wii. You could do all kinds of cool attacks with a Wii controler while still keeping the game a RPG.
Maybe the MMO NPCs in games you've played are stupid. The fact is, that software isn't as primitive as you think. An NPC has access to all of your stats, all of your HP, mana, classes, what all the players are casting at any one time. They could just use that if they wanted to make encounters more challenging. They don't tho, because it would be impossible for anyone to beat their content if they used that kind of thing.
I wouldn't call the AI primitive, we're way past the point where its capable of NPCs being smart. As I said, no one would play the games if NPCs were any more intelligent. Imagine what raid NPCs would do, they would go 1 round ur clerics regardless of your taunt. The whole concept of MMORPGs would be fucked, your abilities would be pretty much worthless if they had enough "AI".
I think the raids should be more unpredictable but I think making NPCs smarter in certain ways would make MMORPGs unplayable.
FPS games lack skill. They are usually just running around and killing/dying and respawning. I don't like FPS because it's just like you are shooting other players all the time, and NPCs tend to have more intelligence and are difficult to kill as opposed to players. If I play FPS games, they tend to get boring after 20 minutes of continuous play. They are total garbage.
And what is wrong with being alone in an MMORPG? Maybe I don't want to be with other people all of the time when I'm in an MMORPG. Some people just want to explore things. What is there to explore in trashy FPS games.
"NPCs tend to have more intelligence and are difficult to kill as opposed to players." You really did NOT just claim that.
Sir, you must be dense, because claiming that an MMO requires MORE skill than an FPS is utterly ridiculous. As much as I like MMOs they are at the same level of FPS's as far as PvP goes, but PvE is mind numbingly easy, boring, and repetitive. The AI in any game will never be more clever or as you said "intelligent" than a living, breathing, human.
NPCs are overpowered, so you are not on a level playing field. It takes a lot of skill to take down NPCs, a lot of coordination and planning. In FPS you are the same as other players, you just run around and shoot people, it's trivial and boring.
Games that require some thought are interesting, FPS are for 10 year olds who run around screaming headshot and have no planning or logical capabilities.
Oh yeah because in an FPS game all you have to do is tab lock them and just shoot to kill without having to aim properly, and enemies never side step to make you lose aim.
Enemies never take cover, they never pick up grenades you've thrown at them and toss it back at you, oh and they never shoot back do they?
There's no strategy involved in shooters like when you're spotting they call an armored tank your way to gun you down, enemies never group up to protect their numbers and they never use health packs...0o
Enemies never set up land mines and traps all over a narrow area while they're sitting at the other end behind turret guns.
They never aim for your head, they never use rocket launchers to one-shot you, shotgun groups don't try to flush you out while enemy snipers try to pick you off from a hidden location when you try to run.
You'll never find an weaker enemy try to bait you out and make you chase him into a dozen of his shotgun and chainsaw wielding friends around a corridor.
All enemies do in FPS games is stand in one place unable to spot you outside of a 10yard aggro range and continuesly walk back and forth back and forth unaware that just 20 yards from them you're teabagging one of their own even though you guys are in plane sight....oh and MMOs are nothing like that...lol
MMOs are soooo advanced in their AI, and FPS games are just sooo simply retarded..huh?
I mean am I right?? Or maybe you're just bias against FPS games and simply talking out of you're own ass?
Listen, FPS games are reflex based. You learn what goes on, then u figure out what actions to take. You don't really think that much in an FPS as compared to MMORPGs.
Aiming for the head, does that require strategy? Or using more powerful weapons? Lol.
FPS games are simple compared to MMORPGs. How is playing against other players even challenging? People used to play MMORPGs because the raid content was fun and challenging. If FPS had an ounce of challenge in them people might enjoy them.
I played FPS games, rainbow 6, counter strike, fear, etc. They just aren't as fun as MMORPGs, and get repetitive after 10 minutes
FPS games lack skill. They are usually just running around and killing/dying and respawning. I don't like FPS because it's just like you are shooting other players all the time, and NPCs tend to have more intelligence and are difficult to kill as opposed to players. If I play FPS games, they tend to get boring after 20 minutes of continuous play. They are total garbage.
And what is wrong with being alone in an MMORPG? Maybe I don't want to be with other people all of the time when I'm in an MMORPG. Some people just want to explore things. What is there to explore in trashy FPS games.
"NPCs tend to have more intelligence and are difficult to kill as opposed to players." You really did NOT just claim that.
Sir, you must be dense, because claiming that an MMO requires MORE skill than an FPS is utterly ridiculous. As much as I like MMOs they are at the same level of FPS's as far as PvP goes, but PvE is mind numbingly easy, boring, and repetitive. The AI in any game will never be more clever or as you said "intelligent" than a living, breathing, human.
NPCs are overpowered, so you are not on a level playing field. It takes a lot of skill to take down NPCs, a lot of coordination and planning. In FPS you are the same as other players, you just run around and shoot people, it's trivial and boring.
Games that require some thought are interesting, FPS are for 10 year olds who run around screaming headshot and have no planning or logical capabilities.
Oh yeah because in an FPS game all you have to do is tab lock them and just shoot to kill without having to aim properly, and enemies never side step to make you lose aim.
Enemies never take cover, they never pick up grenades you've thrown at them and toss it back at you, oh and they never shoot back do they?
There's no strategy involved in shooters like when you're spotting they call an armored tank your way to gun you down, enemies never group up to protect their numbers and they never use health packs...0o
Enemies never set up land mines and traps all over a narrow area while they're sitting at the other end behind turret guns.
They never aim for your head, they never use rocket launchers to one-shot you, shotgun groups don't try to flush you out while enemy snipers try to pick you off from a hidden location when you try to run.
You'll never find an weaker enemy try to bait you out and make you chase him into a dozen of his shotgun and chainsaw wielding friends around a corridor.
All enemies do in FPS games is stand in one place unable to spot you outside of a 10yard aggro range and continuesly walk back and forth back and forth unaware that just 20 yards from them you're teabagging one of their own even though you guys are in plane sight....oh and MMOs are nothing like that...lol
MMOs are soooo advanced in their AI, and FPS games are just sooo simply retarded..huh?
I mean am I right?? Or maybe you're just bias against FPS games and simply talking out of you're own ass?
Listen, FPS games are reflex based. You learn what goes on, then u figure out what actions to take. You don't really think that much in an FPS as compared to MMORPGs.
Aiming for the head, does that require strategy? Or using more powerful weapons? Lol.
FPS games are simple compared to MMORPGs. How is playing against other players even challenging? People used to play MMORPGs because the raid content was fun and challenging. If FPS had an ounce of challenge in them people might enjoy them.
I played FPS games, rainbow 6, counter strike, fear, etc. They just aren't as fun as MMORPGs, and get repetitive after 10 minutes
...blah blah blah...that's all I hear man...I'm sorry.
Saying MMOs have more strategy completely throws your credibility out the window in my eyes, right now you sound like an obtuse WoW fanboi...0o
>>
If you were to argue that RTS games require more strategy that would have been a different story since they're the only genre I've seen to surpass the level of strategy that you find FPS games.
But MMOs are made for grind even the simplest mind is capable of going from level 1-endgame.
Simply put I stopped here " You don't really think that much in an FPS as compared to MMORPGs," can't tell you how many times I've been in PvP or in an end game raid while watching TV and talking on the phone at the same time....and that's the best MMOs have to offer....0o
"NPCs tend to have more intelligence and are difficult to kill as opposed to players." You really did NOT just claim that.
Sir, you must be dense, because claiming that an MMO requires MORE skill than an FPS is utterly ridiculous. As much as I like MMOs they are at the same level of FPS's as far as PvP goes, but PvE is mind numbingly easy, boring, and repetitive. The AI in any game will never be more clever or as you said "intelligent" than a living, breathing, human.
http://kairosnews.org/russian-chess-master-vs-computer-ends-in-draw
It beat him 2 times...it was more intelligent.
"NPCs tend to have more intelligence and are difficult to kill as opposed to players." You really did NOT just claim that.
Sir, you must be dense, because claiming that an MMO requires MORE skill than an FPS is utterly ridiculous. As much as I like MMOs they are at the same level of FPS's as far as PvP goes, but PvE is mind numbingly easy, boring, and repetitive. The AI in any game will never be more clever or as you said "intelligent" than a living, breathing, human.
http://kairosnews.org/russian-chess-master-vs-computer-ends-in-draw
It beat him 2 times...it was more intelligent.
Good show, but then again when was the the last time you saw that level of AI in an MMO....=/
I dunno, im only level 20 in Aion so I will let you know as soon as possible.
Superior? As in charging fees per month? As in the RPG aspect? As in getting new gear/items/skills/abilities as you level up?
So Crimecraft, Huxley, gunz, among others, are all the type of FPS mmo games you are referring to? And are doing so well?
Or do you mean Call of Duty 10 will be better than MMO xx10?
A game that is entirely based off connection, reaction times, and "skill" will not enter into the MMO sort of level. But than again, there is no skill in an MMO. Which is why you can't join WoW, or War, and be the best there is in that game instantly right?
Think about it. . It's like saying Pizza will beat Tacos, and therefore Tacos will disappear.
The FPS mmo, with headshots= criticals, defenately would work as E sport, and the eye-hand coordination gamestyle would support a inverioment where you truly could talk about skilled ( ie fast reactions) players. But suchs game would at the same time, be The Horror for older mature MMO geeks - they wouldnt stand a chance when all the sugar doped 14 years old Counterstrike mutants enter the scene.
Well maybe the genre needs to be shaken up a bit considering how much of a borefest MMOs have become. My god if I see another MMO come out that's been hyped to hell or considered a sleeper and fail after the first month I'm becoming a full blown MMO hater and troll from then on.
I'll just hop on these forums to inform you all how awesome CoD:MW2 or Mass Effect 2 are and lol while asking how you're genre is doing.
Right now I have 10 different FPS games I'm looking forward to coming out in the next six months, do you know how many MMOs there are?
Zero.
The way MMOs are going MO will suck, APB will suck and so will ToR...and those games are not even guaranteed to come out for another year or so.
All that time wasted just to realize maybe I should have never left WoW if I'm really that much of an MMO enthusiast.
Now that's pathetic...>>
Well maybe the genre needs to be shaken up a bit considering how much of a borefest MMOs have become. My god if I see another MMO come out that's been hyped to hell or considered a sleeper and fail after the first month I'm becoming a full blown MMO hater and troll from then on.
I'll just hop on these forums to inform you all how awesome CoD:MW2 or Mass Effect 2 are and lol while asking how you're genre is doing.
Right now I have 10 different FPS games I'm looking forward to coming out in the next six months, do you know how many MMOs there are?
Zero.
The way MMOs are going MO will suck, APB will suck and so will ToR...and those games are not even guaranteed to come out for another year or so.
All that time wasted just to realize maybe I should have never left WoW if I'm really that much of an MMO enthusiast.
Now that's pathetic...>>
Then don't play MMORPGs, play First Person Shooter games.
FPS games already have a major advantage over most MMOs on the market in that they are free to play once you own the software. But I have to agree, FPS games are starting to behave more like RPGs. Just look at CoD4 and TF2 with the achievements and unlocks. It's almost like loot rewards. And character progression. And story driven plots (ala Left 4 Dead).
Vault-Tec analysts have concluded that the odds of worldwide nuclear armaggeddon this decade are 17,143,762... to 1.
The only thing i see coming is that FPS games will soon start charging a subscription.
And the best pizza in the world (im thinking baked in a traditional wood oven and with fresh pressed olio, a margherita obviously, although you could have some mozzarella di bufala and prosciutto on the side) will never beat authentic gaonera style steak and cheese tacos.
Just to make things clear...
I speak for myself and no one else, unless i state otherwise mine is just an opinion. A fact is something that can be independently verified, you may challenge such but with proof. You have every right to disagree with me through sound argument, i believe in constructive debate, but baseless aggression will warrant an unkind response.
AI in games isn't designed to make the player feel like an idiot. That's not its purpose.
"What is truly revealing is his implication that believing something to be true is the same as it being true. [continue]" -John Oliver
Counterstrike mods with xp gain and superpower rewards have shown me that you prolly have to go a whole new way, if you want to combine Hack n Slash and RPG with Shooters. The games have a fundament; you enter a game with a certain mindset ( in danish you would say that a game have a Præmis, but cant find a decent english word...), so if you enter a shooter, you expect that all players are more or less on equel ground at start, and is here to compete in aiming and fast reactions. Surprise , surprise, when someone throw a `nade your direction and you and all your teammates blow up - because u know, that wasnt a nade, it was Superlevel10nuke, which you can equip when you have played that server for 7 hours. It just feel akward and unfair.
That said i think there have been some pretty decent experiments with Fallout 3 as the absolute best in singleplayer, and Tabula Rasa as a decent mmo shooter.
Of course now we have games like Fallen Earth, an MMORPGFPS. Oh no what will we do now.
Venge Sunsoar
FPS games lack skill. They are usually just running around and killing/dying and respawning. I don't like FPS because it's just like you are shooting other players all the time, and NPCs tend to have more intelligence and are difficult to kill as opposed to players. If I play FPS games, they tend to get boring after 20 minutes of continuous play. They are total garbage.
And what is wrong with being alone in an MMORPG? Maybe I don't want to be with other people all of the time when I'm in an MMORPG. Some people just want to explore things. What is there to explore in trashy FPS games.
"NPCs tend to have more intelligence and are difficult to kill as opposed to players." You really did NOT just claim that.
Sir, you must be dense, because claiming that an MMO requires MORE skill than an FPS is utterly ridiculous. As much as I like MMOs they are at the same level of FPS's as far as PvP goes, but PvE is mind numbingly easy, boring, and repetitive. The AI in any game will never be more clever or as you said "intelligent" than a living, breathing, human.
NPCs are overpowered, so you are not on a level playing field. It takes a lot of skill to take down NPCs, a lot of coordination and planning. In FPS you are the same as other players, you just run around and shoot people, it's trivial and boring.
Games that require some thought are interesting, FPS are for 10 year olds who run around screaming headshot and have no planning or logical capabilities.
Wow, I have to come back to this post, it's just so retarded I enjoyed tearing into it the first time I feel like doing it again..=D
MMOs require skills to take on NPCs? Yeah I know just like all those times I'd aggro a group by mistake, my PC would crash, I'd log on to find my avatar took them all out with auto attack...HAHA, that's strategy and skill alright!
You know maybe the reason you think FPS games are for retards is because you play like a retard in FPS games....just stay away from the Halo crowd and trust me you'll find just how much more advanced combat in FPS games are compared to MMO.
/wink
Indeed.
I'd go as far as to say that the reason most MMOs these days are failing is that they don't clone WoW enough. They always try and cater for counterstrike players who will never play anything but counterstike anyway.
What the difference beetween massively multiplayer online, multiplayer and online game?
That day a FPS online game beats an MMO game would that need to make it into an MMO game in first place. Are you not just saying that a MMO game you like is better than a MMO game you don't like?
I'm so broke. I can't even pay attention.
"You have the right not to be killed"
Indeed.
I'd go as far as to say that the reason most MMOs these days are failing is that they don't clone WoW enough.
Wow, you're really in for a lot of flaming with that remark....0o
Anyways I also want to state I'm not even supporting the OP.
MMOFPS is a genre I think would do well if it's ever done right, but it won't replace MMOs.
Now that's another extreme in stupidity I can do nothing but laugh at.
IMO its two different genres so one will never overtake the other, there probably will be some games that merge both genres into an awesome gaming experience (I hope borderlands will be kind of a preview to what an MMOFPS can be like) but like others have said, its comparing apples and oranges.
Now for the guy that said MMOs take more skill the FPS'....you sir are so dense I'd rather have a conversation with a 4 year old who talks about pillows and dog shit then listen to you. I can only assume every FPS you have played you've only done deathmatches and have had autoaim on from the start.
I've played EQ, UO, FFXI, WoW, EVE and plenty of other MMOs and I have never ever had to think about how to take out NPCs with a strategy its always the same thing no matter what game, spam your highest dmg spell or ability and occasionally cure yourself: wash, rinse, repeat.
Now with the many FPS' I've played, I dont even count halo that much unless its CTF or Assault, games like CoD4 that I play with a group of friends, there is a lot of talking going on between all of us and we still donminate, even while we talk about random things like the last bengals game or the next new console game coming out. So the socializing is still there just like any GOOD MMO (WoW is such a lonely game sometimes)
Then there will always be strategy and thinking when playing headquarters or search and destroy in CoD. What base to take because they will be easy to defend, or having these bases will make them respawn in a horrible vantage point, who defends what with what weapon, so on and so forth...so just stop fanboying and play against hardcore fps fans that arent 14 year old screaming children on halo and you will find plenty of strategy and skill.
Now back to playing FFXI while I wait for FF14, Borderlands, Dragon Age, CoD MW2, and Demon Souls
Well maybe the genre needs to be shaken up a bit considering how much of a borefest MMOs have become. My god if I see another MMO come out that's been hyped to hell or considered a sleeper and fail after the first month I'm becoming a full blown MMO hater and troll from then on.
I'll just hop on these forums to inform you all how awesome CoD:MW2 or Mass Effect 2 are and lol while asking how you're genre is doing.
Right now I have 10 different FPS games I'm looking forward to coming out in the next six months, do you know how many MMOs there are?
Zero.
The way MMOs are going MO will suck, APB will suck and so will ToR...and those games are not even guaranteed to come out for another year or so.
All that time wasted just to realize maybe I should have never left WoW if I'm really that much of an MMO enthusiast.
Now that's pathetic...>>
Hahahahaha!
/end thread tbh, and i made the damn thread. LOL.
I honestly wish you were right man but you’re not.
FPS games are for a breed of players and then, within that breed, a handfull are superior to the rest.
The issue here is that most players are yes, indeed pub style players that can have incredible matches among each other, then anomaly such as me or other much better player then me, will come in and swiftly turn the battle around with nothing more then a pistol.
Take planetside for example, my buddies and I played that game for maybe 3 or 4 months. We had an average of over 3000 kills and less then 50 deaths. Our teamwork, tactics, aim and such were much more superior than some of the highest levels in the game. We didn’t use the epic high end gear, all we used were the little default assault rifles and medium armor lol.
The reason MMOs are like how they are today is to enforce a balance. The balance is made through skills and stats and it’s basicaly, who can get the best gear first. Sure you’ll probably find a few tactics here and there but don’t expect much more. Even Darkfall is borderline moer based on stats then player skills.
You want to see how good you would do in an FPS mmo?
www.quakelive.com
go play against the league players and let me know how you did.
Ive played Quake on and off since Quake 1 btw. Quake 2 on a competitive worldclass level.