But the fact remains that no-one else has even attempted to do what WWIIoL has done - not even close.
Considering the tiny playerbase this game has always had, why would anyone try? WW2online is part of a niche genre and there's little money to be made from it. Hardcore sims are not doing well. Maybe if the learning curve was more inclusive and the graphics more inviting you could have Modern Warfare or Halo level player numbers. But the game isn't going to change enough to ever get to that level, at least not with the present management and resources.
I think there is a maket for hardcore sims
There are a heap of WWII-dogfight-with-everything sims out there and more are released every day.
Then there are companies releasing games like this
Of course there is a market for ww2sim - just remember the players numbers back in days of pre TOEs - there was a lot more active players than nowadays.
Fine, Hairog, that devs pleased you, but don´t you think they also should consider how many players left over the years?
It seems, that the majority have left the game and just a hardcore minority still remaining - for how long might be the question.
Even when thinking about the bugs back several years ago - there was by far a greater number of players than now, when the "game is improved and better than ever before" - how does that fit together.
Boredom, same old same old, Same map. The grass is always greener etc.
How many other MMOs have lasted this long with such a small player base. Maybe it's not massive anymore but it still is viable.
I disagree with many things the Rats have done but again show me something better and then there is the ever present hope that the next new upgrade will be enough to keep you going for another 3 months ... and for me it has been.
Name calling, confrontational, sophomoric, tirades on forums will change nothing.
Even when thinking about the bugs back several years ago - there was by far a greater number of players than now, when the "game is improved and better than ever before" - how does that fit together.
Because lot's of other games have been released over that time.
How may players were palying WWIIoL but really wanted to be an Elf in tights? o_0
That explains the pop decrease on the Axis side anyway...
But the fact remains that no-one else has even attempted to do what WWIIoL has done - not even close.
Considering the tiny playerbase this game has always had, why would anyone try? WW2online is part of a niche genre and there's little money to be made from it. Hardcore sims are not doing well. Maybe if the learning curve was more inclusive and the graphics more inviting you could have Modern Warfare or Halo level player numbers. But the game isn't going to change enough to ever get to that level, at least not with the present management and resources.
Thank god for that! We don't need another Halo or Modern Warfare.
I'm fine with steady progress and great game play over graphics any day and the way they have done their business model appears to be working or else they would have been out of business long ago. I guess slow and steady progress and not taking out a massive loan works in this realm.
Curious how some want to see massive changes and arcade like play while others deride any changes in game play. Can;t please everyone all the time I guess. So far they've pleased me and that's what counts to me.
Enjoy your ever decreasing player numbers. I expect "Boredom, same old same old, Same map and the grass is always greener" to continue to whittle away at the already dwindling player base. I concede the game is one of a kind in scope. I just find it less fun than it used to be due to player numbers and game mechanics.
Same old, same old eh....Me thinks not and the game is a foot. Well not really a foot. More like a boot.
Written by RAFTER
Monday, 30 August 2010 10:56
We're in the last stretch of summer here in Texas- home of the Cornered Rats. This has been quite a year and we're focused on bringing 2010 to a close with another big effort resulting in some significant upgrades to the game.
2010 had us deep in the bowels of WWII Online systems with wholesale changes to our graphics and terrain engine. 1.31 was born in June after more than a year of work by all members of our team. We succeeded in bringing several cool new features (weather, new capture, rag doll & more) to the game but the majority of the work was done in modernizing the engine so that our graphics, effect and objects were on par in the MMO marketplace. This was key to keeping the game relevant and sustaining new player growth. Anytime that we spend scarce resources on overhauling "core" systems it's hard for players to really see quick improvements and 1.31 was no different. We are proud of the final product and the reaction from new players and those that have been with us for years has been very, very positive. We also hope we don't have any more 18 month dev cycles HAHA! [Soooo not funny. - MM]
Alongside the development cycle for 1.31, we continued support for our partner in China who has launched a separate, commercial version of the game exclusively for that market. We dedicated a lot of time and effort to ensure the necessary changes and localization issues were delivered to give them the best chance for success. With major marketing in China still to come, we continue to support our partner though much of the "heavy lifting" for our dev and production team has ended.
With a only a few months left in 2010 (a blink of an eye in dev terms) we're firmly locked down to a rapid delivery of 1.32 which will include Player-Placed Objects and Bail-out for aircraft. The best news we can pass along is that 1.32 went into closed Beta testing last week and we are anticipating a very short stint of closed testing followed by immediate open testing and live release. We aren't setting a release date yet but you can bet on our best efforts to bring 1.32 as soon as possible.
Later this week, if everything goes to plan, we will be unveiling part of our 1.33 plan. Our team is working at a break-neck pace to have two major live releases during the last four months of 2010. Only time will tell if we succeed or if we slip into 2011. We have an extremely aggressive schedule that we will continue working to complete.
We're also looking into 2011 and talking about many things that need attention and features including tools for map management, improved newbie experience, enhanced squad tools/play and a long "wish list" representing all aspects of play.
It's an exciting time to be part of the WWII Online project and community and though bumps and bruises come with the territory, we continue to deliver one of the the most unique offerings in online gaming and the amazing support of the players who recognize the special nature of the game- something not found anywhere but WWII Online.
Strap in for a great last few months of 2010 and enjoy the ride!
Yes NA would be the next logical step and I have been waiting for years myself ever since they teased us with some examples and an Italian soldier.
The following is just an excerpt as to how you might go about getting answers for your questions and suggestions. I believe that these developers are hands above the normal corporate goons in responding to their customers. By using non-confrontational language they are more likely to answer.
Just a few thoughts 1) How will you prevent items being placed on one another or on invalid items (other berms, structures etc) and communicate a build space - not within x of x? (thinking of a classic grid overlay or blueprint for the item here) [There are a bunch of checks donw in realtime as you try and place an object. There will also be an on-screen representation with pass/fail feedback -Rafter]
44 Monday, 02 August 2010 14:41
Peter
and 2) If a structure is placed accidentally in the wrong place are they removable and/or editable? For example can they be rotated around point z before being placed or is it just placed in the direction you're looking? [Placed in the direction/orientation you are looking. -Rafter]
45 Monday, 02 August 2010 16:51
blitz
"As one of our longest standing requests from pilots, bailing out from aircraft has remained an elusive feature." Every other war game has had this for eons, and yet it remains elusive for us. Go figure. [This is not your father's flight sim -Rafter]
46 Monday, 02 August 2010 21:23
Wesreidau
If a pilot manages to land his aircraft in a field without it receiving critical damage, can he then bail out or despawn to somehow get a recovered airframe? [No changes to current functionality in this regard -Rafter]
47 Tuesday, 03 August 2010 00:49
Jaybo
this all sounds awesome!.. another idea, (probably been mentioned) an engineer class, specializing in support weapons and repair tool to fix broken tracks of vehicles in the field.. [Engineer class infantry are definately in the planning -Rafter]
48 Tuesday, 03 August 2010 05:00
Klemzig
Gun Emplacement (GE)!!!! How sweet will this be defending FB's? Certainly will enhance the FB fights I feel. Or even near the CP's.
49 Tuesday, 03 August 2010 11:47
Radar17
The Bailout sounds awesome. No more despawning 109s that you don't get the kill on. The pilot can jump and we can get the kill. Everyone is happy. Nice job Rats.
50 Tuesday, 03 August 2010 16:19
Peter
Will there be a random element of camouflage (radial clutter etc) to them to make them not so immediately noticeable, as the current static emplacements are immediately noticeable due to their generic shape. [Undetermined at this time. We have a design goal to make them blend into the existing terrain and we have a few ideas on how that might be done. -Rafter]
51 Tuesday, 03 August 2010 16:22
Peter
Will there be various damaged states for the cover? Such as with the current fb's and what happens when a position is destroyed - are all inf or guns also killed? and are they repairable. [The GEs are designed to take damage and be destoyed. No level of visible damage is currently included. The GE and any guns present are treated as seperate objects WRT to damage -Rafter]
52 Tuesday, 03 August 2010 23:11
wetwater
So, when one ejects will it be a first person view as you fall out of the cockpit? Will there be cool effects of the canopy opening or will it be like jumping out of a c47/ju52? [In development version has a third -person camera looking at your avatar with a chute much like the current despawn camera for vehicles. -Rafter]
53 Tuesday, 03 August 2010 23:39
RiffRaff
Can a Rifle mens weapons kill these IFPs and GEs? also when ya think the Navel can be upgrade? Subs *cough* [Expect sachel charges to have an effect on GEs -Rafter]
54 Wednesday, 04 August 2010 09:59
Zakk
I don't understand why you spend precious coding time on bailing as planned. It seems just a useless eye-candy feature. Despawning in mid-air should provide same results. [Not the same. Re-read the feature description -Rafter]
The following is just an excerpt as to how you might go about getting answers for your questions and suggestions. I believe that these developers are hands above the normal corporate goons in responding to their customers. By using non-confrontational language they are more likely to answer.
......
And the responses to the comments are equalizing that since 4th of july no official statements of CRS was shown at motorpool?
Btw. since the last statement there - another 48 topics and hundreds of post are made in motorpool by players without any answer from rats.
The example you´ve postet is more an exception than an example. Just creating a kind of illusion, that devs will communicate as shown in the comments by rafter in all other topics too is plain wrong. Better not to create such an expectation at (potential) new players - it won´t last long.
But i agree, in specific cases (where devs like to comunicate) they CAN respond in an outstanding way - but if they don´t like to communicate, they´re deaf.
Or did you say, that more than 40 topics and several hundred posts in motorpool are confrontial? (i bet you are aware of the redicolous censorship by mod-guards/gods)
About the use of "confrontial words" - there are not only posters (subscribers) there with english as their first language - some may have choosen their words a bit unlucky and therefore it may have a somewhat agressive attitude, but keep in mind, that it goes both ways and some statements of devs also can be missunderstood (not the devs fault) - regardless, the "tone" is counting at both sides - at players as well as devs.
What can I say you don't like the Rats. I think they are doing pretty well for 10 guys and not much money.
You can sometimes get off the wrong foot with people. I'm banned from another website and I don't even know what I did the last time. The guy who owns it just banned me and didn't give me a reason. We've had many discussions and completely disagree about politics but that's what the board was about. Hopefully someday I'll get an explaination but I guess it's his website.
Did you know that web masters can changed your post at their whim? Amazing what some of them will stoop to. Anyway will just have to agree to disagree.
What can I say you don't like the Rats. I think they are doing pretty well for 10 guys and not much money.
Hm, you may be right - i cannot say that i like rats very much atm. But I can explain it - it wasn´t the case (that i disliked them) in the past, instead, it was quite the oposite before. They created the greatest game i´ve ever played. (Was ranking on # 2 of top 100 on TOM, changed my job for getting more time to play, risked to loose my family for playing BGE)
But over the time passing by, with mostly every patch they changed something in "silence", took variety from the game away (AOs, TOEs, creating AWS, reducing RDP-war to rubble and all that other stuff i described in that topic) PLUS if getting a responce it was (agreed moreso in the past, but not lately) filled with sometimes arrogant attitudes, which was discouraging to keep further conversations.
And what´s the result of that former superb game - a dwindling numbers of players. Sry, therefore i do not accept an excuse of "small team", because its to a good share a "home-made" problem - because when statements of players (who mostly already have left the game) was answered in core like :"Take it or leave it - its our game!" or "If you bought a car, you cannot complain about it - why did you bought it?" (fine then, but don´t expect that customers will by another car from that company)
Keeping in mind all that facts, i think its understandable that likeing rats is asked a bit too much atm. - Okay, we all (including rats) are human and mistakes will be made by all of us - that was also a reason, why i´ve got a builders account; the game (and the devs) are worth to give them a chance (and time) to overlook their changes they´ve made and rethink them. It would be a great second start, if they would have the backbone and say, that something (what) went wrong - or implementing didn´t had the desired result. This at least would show, that they are aware - something was done wrong.
For the small team, it cannot be fixed in a short time - i think this is very understandable, nobody is asking for a small team doing same work as a large crew in the same time; but on the other hand - there should be at least signs about concerning what made players left this game before it might be too late.
Each reader of this forum will remember, that the 1.31 patch was praised as a kind of magical patch (which would have brought back players in droves) - while i don´t doubt, that devs put a lot faith into the outcome of 1.31, concerns and suggestions was blown in the wind. Now, that devs are realising, that 1.31 doesn´t did the desired drawing players back (and keeping the subscribers as well) - they will notice now, that ppl. are voting with their feets.
Nothing, absolutly nothing will be gained, if only statements of positive critics and positive feedback is allowed. Of course it is always good to read positives and it is always disliked to read negatives - but on the other hand, whats the use of not using "confrontational words" and saying all is fine, while subscribers numbers tells otherwise.
Just tell me what is more fair to rats - telling them that everything is fine and leaving in silence or open the mouth and speaking out what makes leaving the game?
Oh and btw. i never received a ban on their forums
Good to hear you never got banned. I advise staying away from politics in forums expecially if you have facts, reason and logic in your favor. They seem to hate that.
This is true for a supposedly political subforum. Some people can't handle the truth I guess.
Here is just one statement from BGE forum - of course in a topic where no Rats is showing up:
--------------------------
Zitat:
Zitat von sg1
I do give credit for the rest of you finally understanding and catching up on this issue. My man greyzone has seen first hand what true refined squad play brings to this game vs your current deal-a-flag mess The system that has also left people with far less caliber of leadership actually running the game and this awful soft capping mess
Those of you who like the toe/hc/ao systems are seriously the minority at this point. For every person that plays the game today you have atleast another 5 people who dont because of what these systems have done to the game. I have suggested mutliple times to put a server up with the classic supply in each military facilty system void of hc to prove my point but its apparently too painful to talk about. Lets talk about free rifle accounts some more ffs....
Its one thing to make a niche game the way you want and quite another to end up with 200 peak server numbers. To carry on with things like ppo's, wonderful new outfits/animations, weather, ragdolls, clouds etc. without addressing the fundemental breakdown of supply, play, leadership and squad play in your game is just about as disconnected as one could be. Its not like this is a new phenomenon either and just started happening last year. These systems were explained previously to their introduction to be highly flawed by people who lead hundreds of squadmates daily
The key to this games success is giving players back control of the game and fixing the supply system. Having the ability for any player to rally people, select a target and plan an operation is critical. The stiffling hc system has eradicated true leadership development and chased away most of the games proven leaders because its terrible. I'm not asking some friggin noob for an AO, explaining what I'm doing, negotiating, waiting etc. and todays leadership is almost non existent in comparison to the pre toe/hc/ao era
The current supply system is so bad thats its not even in my interest to even attack anything with the goal of actually taking it. Why the hell would I waste 50 peoples time attacking something that fresh supply of ridicoulous levels can be cycled into. Talk about boring uninteresting play. When the game as a whole has been reduced to a one fight flashing box of this that resembles cat herding you have totally lost me and many others. Todays players are actually conditioned to this P1 herding and anything out of the box is almost like taboo at this point, it disgusts me. Squads use to fight together with plans and at multiple targets on the map. Todays one box jamboree has seriously cheated the game of much of its potential
Blah blah blah...I'm sure a few of you can tell who wrote that :P
Love
OJ
We all said this 100+ times when they were planning to implement these ridiculous things like TOEs, HC and AOs. The threads were deleted and we were promptly told to go F our selves and that WE were what was wrong with the game. Well as I have said before the TOES/HC/AOs that were supposed to give the game a FLOOD of new players as well as bring back ALL the old players did the exact opposite. It has bled the game dry of its players.
We are now at a turning point. The point we (the anti TOE/HC/AO players) said the game would arrive at if these things were implemented. The player base is a HUSK of what it once was. And we STILL do not have the things we actually have been asking for for over 9 years. Bazookas, jeeps, semi-auto rifles and so on. We were told those things were not needed but we DID need TOES and all the other GARBAGE that went with it.
---------------------------
It seems, there are much more players who don´t like the implementations of TOEs than they will do - (it is mentioned above something like 5:1 who disagree with the TOEs!
Oh, and atm there are 76 statements in this topic - without any Rats responce!
Secondly understand this is the ONLY game of it type or scope on the planet and then have some respect for the makers of that game for providing something this differant and awesome that is NOT .....WOW
With that said ....Yes there is ALOT of broken stuff in game (as to be expected in such a giant project as this one) But even when adding them up DOES NOT takes away from the OVERALL experiance that is ww2online
If you think it does ....your not paying attention to what is the game
CRS DOES CARE about their project or they would have given up a long time ago .....they havent as this is nearing the 10 year mark of this games existence
This game is at its heart a FPS ...name 1 that has been a 24/7 ongoing game from launch ...ALL WITHOUT ASKING FOR A SINGLE DIME EXTRA for patches( call them expansion packs in other games)
WELL you cant cause there is NONE
Instead of being so critical about the game (that you seem to NOT understand) how about examining HOW lucky WE are to have game devs that not only have provided such a diffrent game than WOW and ON every level but still care enough to listen to their playerbase at this stage of the game ?
If that aint enough maybe examine how the game makers (CRS) have been hands on and intouch with their playerbase (even when called every name in the book) all in an attempt to improve the product (something that DONT happen with other MMO's EVER)
I Think the game can allways improve on it self (so do the DEVs) does that mean they have a crappy product ......well NO it dont (9 years strong and still going) it JUST means that everyone involved UNDERSTANDS that a great undertaking such as this one requires some patience
Just one of the things you lack
In my opinion (and their is usually a 14 day free trial around if ya wanna judge for yourself) there is NO game IN SCOPE ...or in attention to detail or PASSION of the DEVELOPERS that EVEN comes CLOSE to this MMO *(ive played them all from UO to warcraft and back again)
If I was on an island and could only BRING 1 mmo with me ......ww2online (renamed "battleground europe") would be my clear hands down, no regrets ,no thinking about it ,..........1st choice
Hey Pauker did you copy and paste that from the WWII forums? It was my post originally. Not that I care I am just saying. WWII online forum name is Solitaer.
Secondly understand this is the ONLY game of it type or scope on the planet and then have some respect for the makers of that game for providing something this differant and awesome that is NOT .....WOW
With that said ....Yes there is ALOT of broken stuff in game (as to be expected in such a giant project as this one) But even when adding them up DOES NOT takes away from the OVERALL experiance that is ww2online
If you think it does ....your not paying attention to what is the game
CRS DOES CARE about their project or they would have given up a long time ago .....they havent as this is nearing the 10 year mark of this games existence
This game is at its heart a FPS ...name 1 that has been a 24/7 ongoing game from launch ...ALL WITHOUT ASKING FOR A SINGLE DIME EXTRA for patches( call them expansion packs in other games)
WELL you cant cause there is NONE
Instead of being so critical about the game (that you seem to NOT understand) how about examining HOW lucky WE are to have game devs that not only have provided such a diffrent game than WOW and ON every level but still care enough to listen to their playerbase at this stage of the game ?
If that aint enough maybe examine how the game makers (CRS) have been hands on and intouch with their playerbase (even when called every name in the book) all in an attempt to improve the product (something that DONT happen with other MMO's EVER)
I Think the game can allways improve on it self (so do the DEVs) does that mean they have a crappy product ......well NO it dont (9 years strong and still going) it JUST means that everyone involved UNDERSTANDS that a great undertaking such as this one requires some patience
Just one of the things you lack
In my opinion (and their is usually a 14 day free trial around if ya wanna judge for yourself) there is NO game IN SCOPE ...or in attention to detail or PASSION of the DEVELOPERS that EVEN comes CLOSE to this MMO *(ive played them all from UO to warcraft and back again)
If I was on an island and could only BRING 1 mmo with me ......ww2online (renamed "battleground europe") would be my clear hands down, no regrets ,no thinking about it ,..........1st choice
Play it awhile and you will think so too
Different or one-of-a-kind doesn't necessarily equate to being good or even good enough. I believe if a game is truly a good one it will have both a large following and positive critical reviews. This game has neither. I've played non-stop from 2001 through 2005 and then I've revisited it a couple of times a year since then. I've been patient. Back in the old days we all kept subscribing because we believed what the game could become. We all looked forward to the day when the graphics would be as good as the gameplay. The irony is we've got the graphics finally, but lost the great gameplay along the way.
Secondly understand this is the ONLY game of it type or scope on the planet and then have some respect for the makers of that game for providing something this differant and awesome that is NOT .....WOW
With that said ....Yes there is ALOT of broken stuff in game (as to be expected in such a giant project as this one) But even when adding them up DOES NOT takes away from the OVERALL experiance that is ww2online
If you think it does ....your not paying attention to what is the game
CRS DOES CARE about their project or they would have given up a long time ago .....they havent as this is nearing the 10 year mark of this games existence ......
I never expected that Rats will respond here - but one of the major reasons to talk about disliked issues in another forum than Rats own forum is nothing else but their "censorship". Hardly to see how the progress of the game will enroll into a direction many players would like to see, when mostly the "Yay-sayers" are heared in their forums, while critical voices (with or without ideas to improve the game) simply are getting ignored in PS (PS says it perfectly = Playschool forum). Any suggestions, critics (even in a constructive way) are mostly left uncommented by Rats. Check out the motorpool - its like a desert and slowly dying same as harbour. Pretty cynical to read on mainpage about Rats donation to somewhere else and reading excuses by them to have not enough resources for bringing new models into the game. Okay, its THEIR business and it belongs to them how to manage their resources - i absolutly have no intention to judge that, but it smells a bit curious to read "Sorry no resources and on the other hand - look at our donations"
A conclussion may be - they would be able to do the changes for bringing dissapointed players back into game (and also implement new models/vehicles), but they aren´t willing to do so. What takes them to redoing the desert camo of tanks? What takes them to change brigade/HQ placement rules and change the supply-timers (different for brigades and HQs) to get tank vs. tank fights far away from towns back into the game? It much easier to just lock such postings or simply don´t reply to them. They simply don´t care about what makes players left the game (at least i don´t see any "official" post in that direction).
The existance of the game is only because of the unbeaten, outstanding game idea - but NOT what they have done to the game. Claiming, that most players in PS is agreeing to all the changes is just a quarter of the whole coin - three quarters have left the game and don´t have active accounts - therefore they don´t post in PS anymore. Maybe its easier to keep new players satisfied for a while than working on bringing long term players back into the game.
Firstly about official forum. One big mistake which could be made, it is made. I mean, c'mon really! I haven't never ever seen so crappy marketing move - restriction of interested and potential customers even from VIEWING of most important parts of forum. As i see, game owners don't understand that "simmers" is at some degree "freaks", really. They need see numbers, grades of armours, disputes of same "freaks". Then they maybe will get hooked.
What they see now? Is it really forum of populous game (even MMO)? No. Is there to see some perspective? No. Is there to see some debates of experienced simmers? No. Then why someone hopes, that they will put its hands, legs and money into this game? This is atleast my lesson with peoples, to whom i have suggested game. Therefore i haven't anymore questions about, why in game is so few green tags..
Also big mistake was the loss of a niche of game. I understand why the owner of the game is doing everything to attract players shoot-run-shoot. But. Again. In parallel, the game has great potential as a versatile simulator of WWII. And where does all of this? Where is logistics, where is restrictions on the tonnage of bridges, where many jobs for the rear, intelligence, etc.? Then what is the meaning of the vast unused areas and persistent campaigns? It makes no sense, especially since you can change side several times per a day.
Instead is now FRU. Ok. Itself it is not bad. Though now are wiped out almost all "front line - rear area" in game. And almost all battles is from-all-direction-campfest. Again i repeat - frontline (with its restrictions) is needed into game as fresh air.
I have hear something about a new timer...People, you really think, that players come in game to sit and to watch timers? Is it simulator of fetishists of watches or timer's? If you really want that the player will spend time, for "capping or something" instead of to enter into game the new timer, give them any activity that will demand physically time.
I even don't touched problems of multi/polycrewing, many features of in-game voicechat, funneh AAA etc. etc...
It is a little about the graphic. From the first screenshots with 1,31 it seemed, something new has come on game. Great wood, an underbrush, a grass etc. Some patches later seems now that I too many hoping. It not as was promised grasses and woods. And poor infantry again, as flies on a table.IMHO.
About big cities. Yep, new houses was added. But fighting in those cities is boring as hell. If you are as single defender in last cp in city and you know, that soon here come enemies, then yes - you have some adrenaline. But otherwise nothing.
There is no other solution than to allow players to divide a city during battle on "us" and "enemy" part, with playerplaced hedgerows, sandbags etc..
And yet one, those cities don't leave the impression, that it is european cities. In "Sniper elite" with very outdated graphics you have feeling about war, you see streets, parks etc. It is clear that there is no simple decision, but the big cities need more mm..love?..
From a 10 year player here. Play the game you might enjoy it. But dont expect much if your into war Sims its degraded into a poor mans FPS these days with a price of 17.99/month if you dont join one of there locked in payment programs for 6-12 months.
It's a really open environment - the game offers and delivers in return what you put into it.
Sadly as of lately people have not put too much into it, and don't get the awesome game in return that it can be.
I wish i could say this where true but its not. The game has tuned into a insta action gank feast. No tactics nothing grand in scale. They sold out to get subs from the COD/CS pie and lost there loyal player base in the process. So like I said if you enjoy quake online then this game may be for you but keep in mind it does not have the eye candy to match other FPS. If your a war sim guy then hang up the gloves on this one they went away from that path years ago.
Comments
I think there is a maket for hardcore sims
There are a heap of WWII-dogfight-with-everything sims out there and more are released every day.
Then there are companies releasing games like this
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HzMfWTd8z-A
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ozF4F6oXjpY
This comapny actually makes modern tank simulation software for the Ukrainian military and the games are an offshoot of that
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KKoxqG6S3yQ
So there is definately a market there. And 'niche' now (with global marketing) doesn't have to mean small.
Even 1% of a market measured in the hundreds of millions is a pretty big number IF you can provide something they want.
Nothing says irony like spelling ideot wrong.
Steel Fury is wonderful but it's a sandbox shooter against AI.
The other two seem to be filled with great graphics but are 3rd person.
They all just don't fit the bill I'm looking for.
True. Those games are good and offer 'realistic' ballastic models - but they are single player games.
They don't offer the scope that WWIIoL offers.
My point was that WWII Military Sims still have a market.
Nothing says irony like spelling ideot wrong.
Of course there is a market for ww2sim - just remember the players numbers back in days of pre TOEs - there was a lot more active players than nowadays.
Fine, Hairog, that devs pleased you, but don´t you think they also should consider how many players left over the years?
It seems, that the majority have left the game and just a hardcore minority still remaining - for how long might be the question.
Even when thinking about the bugs back several years ago - there was by far a greater number of players than now, when the "game is improved and better than ever before" - how does that fit together.
Boredom, same old same old, Same map. The grass is always greener etc.
How many other MMOs have lasted this long with such a small player base. Maybe it's not massive anymore but it still is viable.
I disagree with many things the Rats have done but again show me something better and then there is the ever present hope that the next new upgrade will be enough to keep you going for another 3 months ... and for me it has been.
Name calling, confrontational, sophomoric, tirades on forums will change nothing.
Because lot's of other games have been released over that time.
How may players were palying WWIIoL but really wanted to be an Elf in tights? o_0
That explains the pop decrease on the Axis side anyway...
Nothing says irony like spelling ideot wrong.
Enjoy your ever decreasing player numbers. I expect "Boredom, same old same old, Same map and the grass is always greener" to continue to whittle away at the already dwindling player base. I concede the game is one of a kind in scope. I just find it less fun than it used to be due to player numbers and game mechanics.
Same old, same old eh....Me thinks not and the game is a foot. Well not really a foot. More like a boot.
Written by RAFTER
Monday, 30 August 2010 10:56
We're in the last stretch of summer here in Texas- home of the Cornered Rats. This has been quite a year and we're focused on bringing 2010 to a close with another big effort resulting in some significant upgrades to the game.
Alongside the development cycle for 1.31, we continued support for our partner in China who has launched a separate, commercial version of the game exclusively for that market. We dedicated a lot of time and effort to ensure the necessary changes and localization issues were delivered to give them the best chance for success. With major marketing in China still to come, we continue to support our partner though much of the "heavy lifting" for our dev and production team has ended.
With a only a few months left in 2010 (a blink of an eye in dev terms) we're firmly locked down to a rapid delivery of 1.32 which will include Player-Placed Objects and Bail-out for aircraft. The best news we can pass along is that 1.32 went into closed Beta testing last week and we are anticipating a very short stint of closed testing followed by immediate open testing and live release. We aren't setting a release date yet but you can bet on our best efforts to bring 1.32 as soon as possible.
Later this week, if everything goes to plan, we will be unveiling part of our 1.33 plan. Our team is working at a break-neck pace to have two major live releases during the last four months of 2010. Only time will tell if we succeed or if we slip into 2011. We have an extremely aggressive schedule that we will continue working to complete.
We're also looking into 2011 and talking about many things that need attention and features including tools for map management, improved newbie experience, enhanced squad tools/play and a long "wish list" representing all aspects of play.
It's an exciting time to be part of the WWII Online project and community and though bumps and bruises come with the territory, we continue to deliver one of the the most unique offerings in online gaming and the amazing support of the players who recognize the special nature of the game- something not found anywhere but WWII Online.
Strap in for a great last few months of 2010 and enjoy the ride!
When is the North Africa expansion coming out?
Yes NA would be the next logical step and I have been waiting for years myself ever since they teased us with some examples and an Italian soldier.
The following is just an excerpt as to how you might go about getting answers for your questions and suggestions. I believe that these developers are hands above the normal corporate goons in responding to their customers. By using non-confrontational language they are more likely to answer.
Just a few thoughts 1) How will you prevent items being placed on one another or on invalid items (other berms, structures etc) and communicate a build space - not within x of x? (thinking of a classic grid overlay or blueprint for the item here) [There are a bunch of checks donw in realtime as you try and place an object. There will also be an on-screen representation with pass/fail feedback -Rafter]
44 Monday, 02 August 2010 14:41
Peter
and 2) If a structure is placed accidentally in the wrong place are they removable and/or editable? For example can they be rotated around point z before being placed or is it just placed in the direction you're looking? [Placed in the direction/orientation you are looking. -Rafter]
45 Monday, 02 August 2010 16:51
blitz
"As one of our longest standing requests from pilots, bailing out from aircraft has remained an elusive feature." Every other war game has had this for eons, and yet it remains elusive for us. Go figure. [This is not your father's flight sim
46 Monday, 02 August 2010 21:23
Wesreidau
If a pilot manages to land his aircraft in a field without it receiving critical damage, can he then bail out or despawn to somehow get a recovered airframe? [No changes to current functionality in this regard -Rafter]
47 Tuesday, 03 August 2010 00:49
Jaybo
this all sounds awesome!.. another idea, (probably been mentioned) an engineer class, specializing in support weapons and repair tool to fix broken tracks of vehicles in the field.. [Engineer class infantry are definately in the planning -Rafter]
48 Tuesday, 03 August 2010 05:00
Klemzig
Gun Emplacement (GE)!!!! How sweet will this be defending FB's? Certainly will enhance the FB fights I feel. Or even near the CP's.
49 Tuesday, 03 August 2010 11:47
Radar17
The Bailout sounds awesome. No more despawning 109s that you don't get the kill on. The pilot can jump and we can get the kill. Everyone is happy. Nice job Rats.
50 Tuesday, 03 August 2010 16:19
Peter
Will there be a random element of camouflage (radial clutter etc) to them to make them not so immediately noticeable, as the current static emplacements are immediately noticeable due to their generic shape. [Undetermined at this time. We have a design goal to make them blend into the existing terrain and we have a few ideas on how that might be done. -Rafter]
51 Tuesday, 03 August 2010 16:22
Peter
Will there be various damaged states for the cover? Such as with the current fb's and what happens when a position is destroyed - are all inf or guns also killed? and are they repairable. [The GEs are designed to take damage and be destoyed. No level of visible damage is currently included. The GE and any guns present are treated as seperate objects WRT to damage -Rafter]
52 Tuesday, 03 August 2010 23:11
wetwater
So, when one ejects will it be a first person view as you fall out of the cockpit? Will there be cool effects of the canopy opening or will it be like jumping out of a c47/ju52? [In development version has a third -person camera looking at your avatar with a chute much like the current despawn camera for vehicles. -Rafter]
53 Tuesday, 03 August 2010 23:39
RiffRaff
Can a Rifle mens weapons kill these IFPs and GEs? also when ya think the Navel can be upgrade? Subs *cough* [Expect sachel charges to have an effect on GEs -Rafter]
54 Wednesday, 04 August 2010 09:59
Zakk
I don't understand why you spend precious coding time on bailing as planned. It seems just a useless eye-candy feature. Despawning in mid-air should provide same results. [Not the same. Re-read the feature description -Rafter]
And the responses to the comments are equalizing that since 4th of july no official statements of CRS was shown at motorpool?
Btw. since the last statement there - another 48 topics and hundreds of post are made in motorpool by players without any answer from rats.
The example you´ve postet is more an exception than an example. Just creating a kind of illusion, that devs will communicate as shown in the comments by rafter in all other topics too is plain wrong. Better not to create such an expectation at (potential) new players - it won´t last long.
But i agree, in specific cases (where devs like to comunicate) they CAN respond in an outstanding way - but if they don´t like to communicate, they´re deaf.
Or did you say, that more than 40 topics and several hundred posts in motorpool are confrontial? (i bet you are aware of the redicolous censorship by mod-guards/gods)
About the use of "confrontial words" - there are not only posters (subscribers) there with english as their first language - some may have choosen their words a bit unlucky and therefore it may have a somewhat agressive attitude, but keep in mind, that it goes both ways and some statements of devs also can be missunderstood (not the devs fault) - regardless, the "tone" is counting at both sides - at players as well as devs.
What can I say you don't like the Rats. I think they are doing pretty well for 10 guys and not much money.
You can sometimes get off the wrong foot with people. I'm banned from another website and I don't even know what I did the last time. The guy who owns it just banned me and didn't give me a reason. We've had many discussions and completely disagree about politics but that's what the board was about. Hopefully someday I'll get an explaination but I guess it's his website.
Did you know that web masters can changed your post at their whim? Amazing what some of them will stoop to. Anyway will just have to agree to disagree.
Hm, you may be right - i cannot say that i like rats very much atm. But I can explain it - it wasn´t the case (that i disliked them) in the past, instead, it was quite the oposite before. They created the greatest game i´ve ever played. (Was ranking on # 2 of top 100 on TOM, changed my job for getting more time to play, risked to loose my family for playing BGE)
But over the time passing by, with mostly every patch they changed something in "silence", took variety from the game away (AOs, TOEs, creating AWS, reducing RDP-war to rubble and all that other stuff i described in that topic) PLUS if getting a responce it was (agreed moreso in the past, but not lately) filled with sometimes arrogant attitudes, which was discouraging to keep further conversations.
And what´s the result of that former superb game - a dwindling numbers of players. Sry, therefore i do not accept an excuse of "small team", because its to a good share a "home-made" problem - because when statements of players (who mostly already have left the game) was answered in core like :"Take it or leave it - its our game!" or "If you bought a car, you cannot complain about it - why did you bought it?" (fine then, but don´t expect that customers will by another car from that company)
Keeping in mind all that facts, i think its understandable that likeing rats is asked a bit too much atm. - Okay, we all (including rats) are human and mistakes will be made by all of us - that was also a reason, why i´ve got a builders account; the game (and the devs) are worth to give them a chance (and time) to overlook their changes they´ve made and rethink them. It would be a great second start, if they would have the backbone and say, that something (what) went wrong - or implementing didn´t had the desired result. This at least would show, that they are aware - something was done wrong.
For the small team, it cannot be fixed in a short time - i think this is very understandable, nobody is asking for a small team doing same work as a large crew in the same time; but on the other hand - there should be at least signs about concerning what made players left this game before it might be too late.
Each reader of this forum will remember, that the 1.31 patch was praised as a kind of magical patch (which would have brought back players in droves) - while i don´t doubt, that devs put a lot faith into the outcome of 1.31, concerns and suggestions was blown in the wind. Now, that devs are realising, that 1.31 doesn´t did the desired drawing players back (and keeping the subscribers as well) - they will notice now, that ppl. are voting with their feets.
Nothing, absolutly nothing will be gained, if only statements of positive critics and positive feedback is allowed. Of course it is always good to read positives and it is always disliked to read negatives - but on the other hand, whats the use of not using "confrontational words" and saying all is fine, while subscribers numbers tells otherwise.
Just tell me what is more fair to rats - telling them that everything is fine and leaving in silence or open the mouth and speaking out what makes leaving the game?
Oh and btw. i never received a ban on their forums
Good to hear you never got banned. I advise staying away from politics in forums expecially if you have facts, reason and logic in your favor. They seem to hate that.
This is true for a supposedly political subforum. Some people can't handle the truth I guess.
I love this game myself, I still have the "Big Box" I got a EB back in 99'
"the most two useless guns in game (Pak 36 and Flak30"
u serious bro?
zirzo- CL90 imp spy, Valcyn
oxirz- CL36 imp smuggler, Bria
Here is just one statement from BGE forum - of course in a topic where no Rats is showing up:
--------------------------
Zitat:
Zitat von sg1
I do give credit for the rest of you finally understanding and catching up on this issue. My man greyzone has seen first hand what true refined squad play brings to this game vs your current deal-a-flag mess
Those of you who like the toe/hc/ao systems are seriously the minority at this point. For every person that plays the game today you have atleast another 5 people who dont because of what these systems have done to the game. I have suggested mutliple times to put a server up with the classic supply in each military facilty system void of hc to prove my point but its apparently too painful to talk about. Lets talk about free rifle accounts some more ffs....
Its one thing to make a niche game the way you want and quite another to end up with 200 peak server numbers. To carry on with things like ppo's, wonderful new outfits/animations, weather, ragdolls, clouds etc. without addressing the fundemental breakdown of supply, play, leadership and squad play in your game is just about as disconnected as one could be. Its not like this is a new phenomenon either and just started happening last year. These systems were explained previously to their introduction to be highly flawed by people who lead hundreds of squadmates daily
The key to this games success is giving players back control of the game and fixing the supply system. Having the ability for any player to rally people, select a target and plan an operation is critical. The stiffling hc system has eradicated true leadership development and chased away most of the games proven leaders because its terrible. I'm not asking some friggin noob for an AO, explaining what I'm doing, negotiating, waiting etc. and todays leadership is almost non existent in comparison to the pre toe/hc/ao era
The current supply system is so bad thats its not even in my interest to even attack anything with the goal of actually taking it. Why the hell would I waste 50 peoples time attacking something that fresh supply of ridicoulous levels can be cycled into. Talk about boring uninteresting play. When the game as a whole has been reduced to a one fight flashing box of this that resembles cat herding you have totally lost me and many others. Todays players are actually conditioned to this P1 herding and anything out of the box is almost like taboo at this point, it disgusts me. Squads use to fight together with plans and at multiple targets on the map. Todays one box jamboree has seriously cheated the game of much of its potential
Blah blah blah...I'm sure a few of you can tell who wrote that :P
Love
OJ
We all said this 100+ times when they were planning to implement these ridiculous things like TOEs, HC and AOs. The threads were deleted and we were promptly told to go F our selves and that WE were what was wrong with the game. Well as I have said before the TOES/HC/AOs that were supposed to give the game a FLOOD of new players as well as bring back ALL the old players did the exact opposite. It has bled the game dry of its players.
We are now at a turning point. The point we (the anti TOE/HC/AO players) said the game would arrive at if these things were implemented. The player base is a HUSK of what it once was. And we STILL do not have the things we actually have been asking for for over 9 years. Bazookas, jeeps, semi-auto rifles and so on. We were told those things were not needed but we DID need TOES and all the other GARBAGE that went with it.
---------------------------
It seems, there are much more players who don´t like the implementations of TOEs than they will do - (it is mentioned above something like 5:1 who disagree with the TOEs!
Oh, and atm there are 76 statements in this topic - without any Rats responce!
Well forget CRS responding in here for starters
Secondly understand this is the ONLY game of it type or scope on the planet and then have some respect for the makers of that game for providing something this differant and awesome that is NOT .....WOW
With that said ....Yes there is ALOT of broken stuff in game (as to be expected in such a giant project as this one) But even when adding them up DOES NOT takes away from the OVERALL experiance that is ww2online
If you think it does ....your not paying attention to what is the game
CRS DOES CARE about their project or they would have given up a long time ago .....they havent as this is nearing the 10 year mark of this games existence
This game is at its heart a FPS ...name 1 that has been a 24/7 ongoing game from launch ...ALL WITHOUT ASKING FOR A SINGLE DIME EXTRA for patches( call them expansion packs in other games)
WELL you cant cause there is NONE
Instead of being so critical about the game (that you seem to NOT understand) how about examining HOW lucky WE are to have game devs that not only have provided such a diffrent game than WOW and ON every level but still care enough to listen to their playerbase at this stage of the game ?
If that aint enough maybe examine how the game makers (CRS) have been hands on and intouch with their playerbase (even when called every name in the book) all in an attempt to improve the product (something that DONT happen with other MMO's EVER)
I Think the game can allways improve on it self (so do the DEVs) does that mean they have a crappy product ......well NO it dont (9 years strong and still going) it JUST means that everyone involved UNDERSTANDS that a great undertaking such as this one requires some patience
Just one of the things you lack
In my opinion (and their is usually a 14 day free trial around if ya wanna judge for yourself) there is NO game IN SCOPE ...or in attention to detail or PASSION of the DEVELOPERS that EVEN comes CLOSE to this MMO *(ive played them all from UO to warcraft and back again)
If I was on an island and could only BRING 1 mmo with me ......ww2online (renamed "battleground europe") would be my clear hands down, no regrets ,no thinking about it ,..........1st choice
Play it awhile and you will think so too
Hey Pauker did you copy and paste that from the WWII forums? It was my post originally. Not that I care I am just saying. WWII online forum name is Solitaer.
Different or one-of-a-kind doesn't necessarily equate to being good or even good enough. I believe if a game is truly a good one it will have both a large following and positive critical reviews. This game has neither. I've played non-stop from 2001 through 2005 and then I've revisited it a couple of times a year since then. I've been patient. Back in the old days we all kept subscribing because we believed what the game could become. We all looked forward to the day when the graphics would be as good as the gameplay. The irony is we've got the graphics finally, but lost the great gameplay along the way.
I never expected that Rats will respond here - but one of the major reasons to talk about disliked issues in another forum than Rats own forum is nothing else but their "censorship". Hardly to see how the progress of the game will enroll into a direction many players would like to see, when mostly the "Yay-sayers" are heared in their forums, while critical voices (with or without ideas to improve the game) simply are getting ignored in PS (PS says it perfectly = Playschool forum). Any suggestions, critics (even in a constructive way) are mostly left uncommented by Rats. Check out the motorpool - its like a desert and slowly dying same as harbour. Pretty cynical to read on mainpage about Rats donation to somewhere else and reading excuses by them to have not enough resources for bringing new models into the game. Okay, its THEIR business and it belongs to them how to manage their resources - i absolutly have no intention to judge that, but it smells a bit curious to read "Sorry no resources and on the other hand - look at our donations"
A conclussion may be - they would be able to do the changes for bringing dissapointed players back into game (and also implement new models/vehicles), but they aren´t willing to do so. What takes them to redoing the desert camo of tanks? What takes them to change brigade/HQ placement rules and change the supply-timers (different for brigades and HQs) to get tank vs. tank fights far away from towns back into the game? It much easier to just lock such postings or simply don´t reply to them. They simply don´t care about what makes players left the game (at least i don´t see any "official" post in that direction).
The existance of the game is only because of the unbeaten, outstanding game idea - but NOT what they have done to the game. Claiming, that most players in PS is agreeing to all the changes is just a quarter of the whole coin - three quarters have left the game and don´t have active accounts - therefore they don´t post in PS anymore. Maybe its easier to keep new players satisfied for a while than working on bringing long term players back into the game.
Now pair billets from me.
Firstly about official forum. One big mistake which could be made, it is made. I mean, c'mon really! I haven't never ever seen so crappy marketing move - restriction of interested and potential customers even from VIEWING of most important parts of forum. As i see, game owners don't understand that "simmers" is at some degree "freaks", really. They need see numbers, grades of armours, disputes of same "freaks". Then they maybe will get hooked.
What they see now? Is it really forum of populous game (even MMO)? No. Is there to see some perspective? No. Is there to see some debates of experienced simmers? No. Then why someone hopes, that they will put its hands, legs and money into this game? This is atleast my lesson with peoples, to whom i have suggested game. Therefore i haven't anymore questions about, why in game is so few green tags..
Also big mistake was the loss of a niche of game. I understand why the owner of the game is doing everything to attract players shoot-run-shoot. But. Again. In parallel, the game has great potential as a versatile simulator of WWII. And where does all of this? Where is logistics, where is restrictions on the tonnage of bridges, where many jobs for the rear, intelligence, etc.? Then what is the meaning of the vast unused areas and persistent campaigns? It makes no sense, especially since you can change side several times per a day.
Instead is now FRU. Ok. Itself it is not bad. Though now are wiped out almost all "front line - rear area" in game. And almost all battles is from-all-direction-campfest. Again i repeat - frontline (with its restrictions) is needed into game as fresh air.
I have hear something about a new timer...People, you really think, that players come in game to sit and to watch timers? Is it simulator of fetishists of watches or timer's? If you really want that the player will spend time, for "capping or something" instead of to enter into game the new timer, give them any activity that will demand physically time.
I even don't touched problems of multi/polycrewing, many features of in-game voicechat, funneh AAA etc. etc...
It is a little about the graphic. From the first screenshots with 1,31 it seemed, something new has come on game. Great wood, an underbrush, a grass etc. Some patches later seems now that I too many hoping. It not as was promised grasses and woods. And poor infantry again, as flies on a table.IMHO.
About big cities. Yep, new houses was added. But fighting in those cities is boring as hell. If you are as single defender in last cp in city and you know, that soon here come enemies, then yes - you have some adrenaline. But otherwise nothing.
There is no other solution than to allow players to divide a city during battle on "us" and "enemy" part, with playerplaced hedgerows, sandbags etc..
And yet one, those cities don't leave the impression, that it is european cities. In "Sniper elite" with very outdated graphics you have feeling about war, you see streets, parks etc. It is clear that there is no simple decision, but the big cities need more mm..love?..
From a 10 year player here. Play the game you might enjoy it. But dont expect much if your into war Sims its degraded into a poor mans FPS these days with a price of 17.99/month if you dont join one of there locked in payment programs for 6-12 months.
It's a really open environment - the game offers and delivers in return what you put into it.
Sadly as of lately people have not put too much into it, and don't get the awesome game in return that it can be.
I wish i could say this where true but its not. The game has tuned into a insta action gank feast. No tactics nothing grand in scale. They sold out to get subs from the COD/CS pie and lost there loyal player base in the process. So like I said if you enjoy quake online then this game may be for you but keep in mind it does not have the eye candy to match other FPS. If your a war sim guy then hang up the gloves on this one they went away from that path years ago.