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Final Thoughts
Sub expires 16th and i think i won't buy another month. I'll probably screw around Guild Wars or some non internet game untile i figure out what i want to play next.
I've leveled an assassin to 37, a spiritmaster to 24, a sorcerer to 22 and every other class at least to 10. I just keep losing interest in my characters and the game itself.
I think this game is long overdue for a patch. Not to adress the leveling curve specificly, just adress, i dunno, something.
As for me i liked it while it lasted. That's as long as it did though.
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Comments
Ok I guess to add to the OP. Here are my views. Aion is entertaining untill you pass the first few levels after that you get to kill the same mobs over and over again just stronger versions of them. I was a 36 chanter and level 33 assasin both classes became boring. I was willing to stay subbed and give them time to add content, but was banned for as of yet still do not know the reason. There are bots everywhere and a lot of people get banned without even a GM even asking if you are there and why you are killing same mobs. Well Im killing same mobs because its a Korean grind fest thank you very much. After repeated e-mails and waiting 1 week in between them I have stopped trying. NCSOFT customer service is subpar compared to other games I have played. So If your considering playing you will have fun untill probably level 20 if you don't get baned so I would suggest don't waste your time.
As I stated in previous post, you all have ADD, I am not saying you must get into the game, I just still am unable to grasp the idea of the grind you guys are talking about, for all the damn alts you made one might wonder why you just didn't take a toon to 50 and start grouping with some folks. The grind is there to weed out the babies who get mad because it takes them 3 weeks to level to max instead of one week. Get over it already! When I play mmo's, I watch TV, I rarely listen to the sound and find the journey relaxing, big deal it takes some time
Classic..hillarious even, your accusing people of having ADD, and then point out that you yourself, have to watch TV whilst playing the game..
I agree...nothing new or exciting has been released since launch. Aion is in desperate need of a patch.
my final thought about aion is.......i want my money back......
"Classic..hillarious even, your accusing people of having ADD, and then point out that you yourself, have to watch TV whilst playing the game.."
There hasn't been an mmo ever that I would actually sit there and be vested in, really, I mean at least in a shooter I have other people trying to kill me constantly in an mmo 80% of the time I am fighting boring npc who do the same action regardless, but the fact is Aion has more button smashing period.
The ADD comparison is due to people complaining about grinding but having many toons but not one level cap, if you are going to dog a game, do so when you have hit max level, participated in the end game or pvp rush and then comment. Don't give me that crap that grinding prevents you from getting to the end, its a bullshiz excuse!
So yeah if you cant even make it to the end, you have multiple toons, and you are bitching about grinding, you have ADD, but in defense of TV, most of the people I know can walk and chew gum at the same time! Can you? Its a game not a musical instrumnet people. Little brains say it with me, games distract the mind, they never improve the mind, in the case of WOW it made people even dumber!
Lets just hope you have some crazy multitasking skills otherwise that comment speaks volumes about the challenges of the game.
Really, really, really people we are talking about MMO's where auto attack is the norm! Really crazy multi tasking, go talk to my friends in Iraq I am sure they can shed some light on that word. I will tell you this, if you think its crazy multi tasking to play a game, your hopeless, really!
I feel sorry for you... you clearly dont grasp and or have experienced the concept of IMMERSION. It is not about getting to max level or the need to do it quickly... rather the lack of a enjoyable journey to that point, where might i remind you, is where you actually get to enjoy normal pvp which has its own slew of problems.
Yes the game is a grind. Grind by definition is a forced playstyle (not optional) which makes up the core design of the game. In WoW, grind is left optional for faction points. Thats the secret, OPTIONAL, its still a time sink but it does not carry the entire game. IN Aion, the entire core concept is based on forced work/grind just to experience the features they left at the end of the game.
And yes.. i do have an active Aion account... but for how much longer I do not know. Aion is horribly designed and in a recent interview, an NCsoft developer said they intended for casual players to make up most of the population with a small number of hardcore players at the top (pvp ladder). They also stated that their design problems are due to a large percentage of inexperienced developers they hired for AION.
You can disagree with me, but the devs pretty much layed it out on the table for everyone.
My thought on Aion.
It is a fun game. But, I'm more invested socially and time-wise with WoW.
So, I don't play Aion, not because I didn't enjoy it, but because I'm having more fun elsewhere.
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Now thats understandable, I had plenty of fun times in wow myself
smiles
I feel sorry for you... you clearly dont grasp and or have experienced the concept of IMMERSION. It is not about getting to max level or the need to do it quickly... rather the lack of a enjoyable journey to that point, where might i remind you, is where you actually get to enjoy normal pvp which has its own slew of problems.
Yes the game is a grind. Grind by definition is a forced playstyle (not optional) which makes up the core design of the game. In WoW, grind is left optional for faction points. Thats the secret, OPTIONAL, its still a time sink but it does not carry the entire game. IN Aion, the entire core concept is based on forced work/grind just to experience the features they left at the end of the game.
And yes.. i do have an active Aion account... but for how much longer I do not know. Aion is horribly designed and in a recent interview, an NCsoft developer said they intended for casual players to make up most of the population with a small number of hardcore players at the top (pvp ladder). They also stated that their design problems are due to a large percentage of inexperienced developers they hired for AION.
You can disagree with me, but the devs pretty much layed it out on the table for everyone.
there is no immersion in any mmo, what planet do you live on. No matter how you sugar coat it, its all a grind. There are two paths in any mmo to gain levels, quest or grind, each strives to not be the other but in reality there both the same. I rather just sit in an area for 3 hours and gain xp, questing folks prefer to run all over the place. mindless killing, mindless questing its all a grind! No matter how many time you say it isn't every action is just a repeat of the previous action.
side note, if it wasn't about getting to max level so quickly, why is it possible to roll to 80 in wow in a few days.
so im a lvl 40 sorc,i still love this game, no ifs ands or buts, i agree i needed a small break, but the only way to ENJOY any MMO is to find friends or an Alliance who are there with you, Talking on Vent about random stuff with guild mates helps you stay attached to the game because its something more then the grind of most MMOS, but i dont think AION has a "grind" i mean lvl 1-30 is EZ mode like seriously i did that in the first like week, lvl 30-40 was much harder but guess what it makes since, now that im lvl 40 its getting really hard.. once again it makes since
Im almost at CAP level which means every level should continue to be harder than the last, IMO the very last level should equal all the EXP you`ve needed to get to that level, so 49-50 should be equal EXP from 1-49, being cap level should be a decent advantage in my opinion, and i feel Aion does a pretty good job of capturing the power of leveling and the difficulty that should be obtained by each level
Immersion can not be obtained by Play alone, MMOs are ment to give you hundreds of hours of play time, impossible that the game itself should immerse you 100% compared to a Console game that shoots for a maximum of 60 hours of game play, and not to mention out of that 60 hours only like 20-30 are story mode.
point is, unless you go out and look for a way to enjoy yourself you not gonna find it. just yesterday on triniel we had a 300 vs 300 Battle that was just insane the battle lasted an hour and a half with both sides pushing one side back and vice versa constantly, now i only gained like 1k AP and no exp, but it was amazingly fun, MMO`s cannot be about EXP all the time or you will burn yourself out and not want to play
I feel sorry for you... you clearly dont grasp and or have experienced the concept of IMMERSION. It is not about getting to max level or the need to do it quickly... rather the lack of a enjoyable journey to that point, where might i remind you, is where you actually get to enjoy normal pvp which has its own slew of problems.
Yes the game is a grind. Grind by definition is a forced playstyle (not optional) which makes up the core design of the game. In WoW, grind is left optional for faction points. Thats the secret, OPTIONAL, its still a time sink but it does not carry the entire game. IN Aion, the entire core concept is based on forced work/grind just to experience the features they left at the end of the game.
And yes.. i do have an active Aion account... but for how much longer I do not know. Aion is horribly designed and in a recent interview, an NCsoft developer said they intended for casual players to make up most of the population with a small number of hardcore players at the top (pvp ladder). They also stated that their design problems are due to a large percentage of inexperienced developers they hired for AION.
You can disagree with me, but the devs pretty much layed it out on the table for everyone.
there is no immersion in any mmo, what planet do you live on. No matter how you sugar coat it, its all a grind. There are two paths in any mmo to gain levels, quest or grind, each strives to not be the other but in reality there both the same. I rather just sit in an area for 3 hours and gain xp, questing folks prefer to run all over the place. mindless killing, mindless questing its all a grind! No matter how many time you say it isn't every action is just a repeat of the previous action.
side note, if it wasn't about getting to max level so quickly, why is it possible to roll to 80 in wow in a few days.
It is illogical for you to make the claim "there is no such thing as immersion" in a mmorpg. Can you say that there is no such thing as immersion in cinema? If that statement is true then there is no point to cinema, there is no point to watching 3D flicks much less normal ones. Here's how it works, the narrative in cinema along with good acting and directing creates something called immersion, it is opposite of alienation.
Games also have immersion. I am sorry you are in such denial about it. You must think you are so much more experienced than everyone else, hey maybe even more so than designers who focus purely on immersion.
You dont understand what the word grind actually means that much is clear. Its not grind if you do not notice the actions as being as such, this is pretty much the most basic rule of thumb when it comes to looking at "grind" as a word which connotes meaning.
You cannot logically tell me games like EVE and Vanguard for example have no element of immersion.
Regarding the max level in WoW, the leveling was paced along with the content to eliminate the need for mindless grind, while promoting all the alternate forms of play including pvp and goals beyond just a level. A good rpg isnt just about level, its about actions and the actions as well as options for those actions count. WoW was a very well paced game that gave its players a balance of all forms of content from beginning to end, pvp, dungeons, crafting, zones...ect
You have much to learn.
I feel sorry for you... you clearly dont grasp and or have experienced the concept of IMMERSION. It is not about getting to max level or the need to do it quickly... rather the lack of a enjoyable journey to that point, where might i remind you, is where you actually get to enjoy normal pvp which has its own slew of problems.
Yes the game is a grind. Grind by definition is a forced playstyle (not optional) which makes up the core design of the game. In WoW, grind is left optional for faction points. Thats the secret, OPTIONAL, its still a time sink but it does not carry the entire game. IN Aion, the entire core concept is based on forced work/grind just to experience the features they left at the end of the game.
And yes.. i do have an active Aion account... but for how much longer I do not know. Aion is horribly designed and in a recent interview, an NCsoft developer said they intended for casual players to make up most of the population with a small number of hardcore players at the top (pvp ladder). They also stated that their design problems are due to a large percentage of inexperienced developers they hired for AION.
You can disagree with me, but the devs pretty much layed it out on the table for everyone.
there is no immersion in any mmo, what planet do you live on. No matter how you sugar coat it, its all a grind. There are two paths in any mmo to gain levels, quest or grind, each strives to not be the other but in reality there both the same. I rather just sit in an area for 3 hours and gain xp, questing folks prefer to run all over the place. mindless killing, mindless questing its all a grind! No matter how many time you say it isn't every action is just a repeat of the previous action.
side note, if it wasn't about getting to max level so quickly, why is it possible to roll to 80 in wow in a few days.
It is illogical for you to make the claim "there is no such thing as immersion" in a mmorpg. Can you say that there is no such thing as immersion in cinema? If that statement is true then there is no point to cinema, there is no point to watching 3D flicks much less normal ones. Here's how it works, the narrative in cinema along with good acting and directing creates something called immersion, it is opposite of alienation.
Games also have immersion. I am sorry you are in such denial about it. You must think you are so much more experienced than everyone else, hey maybe even more so than designers who focus purely on immersion.
You dont understand what the word grind actually means that much is clear. Its not grind if you do not notice the actions as being as such, this is pretty much the most basic rule of thumb when it comes to looking at "grind" as a word which connotes meaning.
You cannot logically tell me games like EVE and Vanguard for example have no element of immersion.
Regarding the max level in WoW, the leveling was paced along with the content to eliminate the need for mindless grind, while promoting all the alternate forms of play including pvp and goals beyond just a level. A good rpg isnt just about level, its about actions and the actions as well as options for those actions count. WoW was a very well paced game that gave its players a balance of all forms of content from beginning to end, pvp, dungeons, crafting, zones...ect
You have much to learn.
There is more immersion in my wii games then there has been in any mmos released, including the ones you speak of. As for the games that had it, Vanilla WOW, EQ1, Ultimate Online, & EvE Online. Outside of that no.
I feel captured by a movie sometimes as part of it, but I never really feel like I am a feral druid prancing through a forest, hmm nope! The problem with all of this bs is that you are trying to make something more complicated it is. Every mmo, regardless of the action you are performing is the same damn action.
tap tap a few keystrokes wait for CD indicator to dwrindle down smack macro shift control alt 5, rinse and repeat. So no matter what you say this action provides nothing. I play mmo to have an alternative arena to hang with my friends. However I do not cry about a game merely on the idea that the grind is more cumbersome. Or it is harder to get to the end, its nonsense!
Now just in case you didnt know. It use to take some time to roll to 60 in Vanilla WOW your perceived thought on the matter shows how new to WOW you are.
The first time in WOW you would jam with you friends maybe a couple of your buddies would play all night, but the next day you still had the same level. People grouped with out LFG interface, they ran SFK, WC, RFD and all of the low tier dungeons quite frequently. there were no raid marker and there was a presence and a life to wow.
Then you cry babies started crying that it took to long to re roll. Raid leaders were unfair, 40 man raids were to big, not becuase it was a bad idea or the current player base loved every minute of it, no it was because you ADD people were unaccostmed to paying for a game and having to wait or be part of a team to get them shinies. Guilds in Vanialla WOW were remarkable and you would actually try and do what you needed to get into a good guild.
The orginal Gladiator ranking in PVP WoW with world kills calcualted was the best PVP system ever. Its really a tiring argument, but hey I like Aion and either way none of you idots have put forth anything but the objection to the grind.
You know there were not always flying mounts in wow either you know?
I agree with this guy. Aion is a young game and even with its flaws it manages to be one of the better MMO's. The game can only get better from here and as shown by NCsoft they intend on making the game great. As far as the *grind* is concerned I'm really tired of people bring this up. If you decide that you don't want to quest and go *grind* mobs for xp, that is your chose. If you get bored then you made yourself bored. Don't go blaming your boredom on the game. Grinding solo is bound to make anyone bored. Make friend do things together and make a group to do something. An MMO is a prime expample the old saying, you only get what you put into it. You put nothing you get that back.
I agree with this guy. Aion is a young game and even with its flaws it manages to be one of the better MMO's. The game can only get better from here and as shown by NCsoft they intend on making the game great. As far as the *grind* is concerned I'm really tired of people bring this up. If you decide that you don't want to quest and go *grind* mobs for xp, that is your chose. If you get bored then you made yourself bored. Don't go blaming your boredom on the game. Grinding solo is bound to make anyone bored. Make friend do things together and make a group to do something. An MMO is a prime expample the old saying, you only get what you put into it. You put nothing you get that back.
Exactly, the only folks complaining of a grind in Aion are the ones that want to reach max level asap. Or the ones coming from games like WoW or LOTRO that give way to many quests to begin with...Theres plenty of quests available in Aion atm. My main is 35 (4 other 30ish alts) and she has a journal packed with quests, along with 2 other camps I cant pick up quests from because I don't have room..lol. Aion's far from a grind if you take your time and enjoy the ride. In fact, Aion is hella fun. One of the best MMOs I've played in my 5-6 years of playing mmorpgs. My prediction is AIon will be one of top MMOs in 2010-2011 if NCsoft keeps the updates coming.
"I play Tera for the gameplay"
that's a shame
good luck in finding an mmorpg that you will like
March on! - Lets Invade Pekopon
I think you need to self check that ego of yours a bit buddy, it sounds like you think that whatever your experience has been, is what EVERYONE'S experience has been. If you have never experienced immersion in an mmo before, I feel sorry for you, because it sure as hell does exist, and just because you haven't had it, doesn't mean it's impossible for anyone else to. And I definitely did NOT experience immersion in Aion or Wow when I tried those games, but some of the old school mmos and even newer games (sometimes) do have a great deal of immersion.
I think you need to self check that ego of yours a bit buddy, it sounds like you think that whatever your experience has been, is what EVERYONE'S experience has been. If you have never experienced immersion in an mmo before, I feel sorry for you, because it sure as hell does exist, and just because you haven't had it, doesn't mean it's impossible for anyone else to. And I definitely did NOT experience immersion in Aion or Wow when I tried those games, but some of the old school mmos and even newer games (sometimes) do have a great deal of immersion.
While I agree with you I think the sad truth here is that you will not find much immersion in pretty much any of the newer MMO's. I mean there may be an exception, I just haven't found it.
In UO was great and really immersive but I personally haven't found anything else like it. I have a bit of hope for SW:TOR because it's made by Bioware and there single player games are killer on story and immersion. But unless that does it 1 MMO in like 13ish years has been immersive in my eyes.
Without that immersion all I really want to do is long in and have the ability to kill mobs for awhile while solo or in a group and have some fun. If I can't make my own story and if the game doesn't have a good immersive story then I would rather just kill stuff mainly lol.
Each individuals experience may differ though, this is just my opinion.
Regarding the ADD comment: Maybe i have it. Whatever the reason Aion could not hold my attention because it got to the point where i was doin the same thing, pussing buttons in the same pattern, for hours without noticing anything changing. Not my level, not my money, not my gear; nothing. At that point i started rolling alts in hopes of breaking the monotony which worked until i reached the same point and that method grew les and less effective because i was doing the same zones over and over.
Regarding the immersion comment: I think it's just a fancy work for how long you actually play. Right now it's 2 am here and i've been playing Lotro for at least 3 hours. I reaslise just now i have food to attend to and to me this "back to reality" thing is a sign of immersion. When i was grinding xp in Aion i was moslty listening to the radio not paying attention to the game and dying because of it. I actually liked the radio more than the game.
Some people have different playstyles and will have more success with Aion than me. More power to them. Aion just wasn't for me.
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There you go assuming again:
Lets get right to the point and address what you have just said:
1. First you claim that no mmorpg has immersion, then you admit to 4 games having it. Hypocrite much? You also go on to saying that none of the games I mentioned have had it. Hmmmm I seem to see EVE in there, which I mentioned. Guess this not only proves you are a hypocrite, but were unable to actually read the post you are now replying to.
2. You confuse immersion with role playing. When someone plays a video game, immersion isnt what decides if you believe you are an elf, or an orc, rather if you looked at the definition of the word you would realize its about the condition of the viewer and or player. You might not have realized it yet but there is academic study and theory regarding both film and game immersion. Yes it does exist and no its not role playing. I suggest doing some study.
3. You go on to talk about "the same action" but totally ignore the aspect of perceived action. Studying behavioral science would reveal that perception is key to understanding not just the advanced state of immersion but also how humans act and react and therefore define their actions and reactions. No one can logically or rationally claim its all the same action. If you told that to a game designer, they would laugh at you. You know what a game designers job is right?
4a) First you claim that it takes a long time to get to 60 in vanilla WoW and because you believe that you claim i am a "newbie" to WoW.
Fact: I was playing WoW since beta. I was one of the first lvl 60 druids on my server and the guild I was in was the first Alliance guild to complete Molten Core in vanilla.
So what does this show? It shows that not only is it childish to assume I am new to WoW because I point out where you are wrong, but also just completely illogical. It says that you most likely dont think you know as much as you think you know and try to cover it up by assuming everyone else is some how "noob" and you are there fore uber "experienced".
So going by the information I have shared with you... lets get into:
4b) Getting to 60 did NOT take forever, it was NOT a grind and in all honesty it was very easy. The difference being, in Vanilla WoW there was actually a thing called "world pvp". Yes, this means in every zone there were constant battles raging on. Players would often distract themselves or get interrupted from questing by pvpers. This goes on to show that you couldnt quest without paying attention or else you would have had a rogue corpse camping you after a quick and sudden death.
I like what you say at the end. Since you were not playing the game as long as i was, i'll let you in on a little secret. Since the NDA is long since been dropped, those in early beta actually saw flying. Yes, flying was in WoW at one point. Amazing right? Azeroth wasnt made for it though and it was not part of the game until an expansion. Heres another piece of info you probably didnt know, we knew about player and guild housing. In fact you can still see the portals Blizzard planned for it in the game. I still remember when shaman skills were actually part of the druid class. Do you? I doubt it.
The lesson for today is, dont assume you think you know everything about a game, and especially about a person. For all you know, you might be attempting (poorly) at belittling a game developer or an industry professional. You could be attempting to talk down someone with a much broader education and experience than you. Whether you feel humbled or not is of little importance, but what you should do is keep an open mind, and less epeen waving.
that's a shame
good luck in finding an mmorpg that you will like
This response to the OP is full of win. Anything else is really just an arguement of opinion. Not only does that OP not realize that there have been patches to the game (even regarding the xp curve which spawned double xp weekends) is a testament to how much people do not pay attention to the game they are playing. If your going to make a post about how you don't like a game and then mention something that's already been addressed (several time) then maybe the game is not for you.
I feel sorry for you... you clearly dont grasp and or have experienced the concept of IMMERSION. It is not about getting to max level or the need to do it quickly... rather the lack of a enjoyable journey to that point, where might i remind you, is where you actually get to enjoy normal pvp which has its own slew of problems.
Yes the game is a grind. Grind by definition is a forced playstyle (not optional) which makes up the core design of the game. In WoW, grind is left optional for faction points. Thats the secret, OPTIONAL, its still a time sink but it does not carry the entire game. IN Aion, the entire core concept is based on forced work/grind just to experience the features they left at the end of the game.
And yes.. i do have an active Aion account... but for how much longer I do not know. Aion is horribly designed and in a recent interview, an NCsoft developer said they intended for casual players to make up most of the population with a small number of hardcore players at the top (pvp ladder). They also stated that their design problems are due to a large percentage of inexperienced developers they hired for AION.
You can disagree with me, but the devs pretty much layed it out on the table for everyone.
there is no immersion in any mmo, what planet do you live on. No matter how you sugar coat it, its all a grind. There are two paths in any mmo to gain levels, quest or grind, each strives to not be the other but in reality there both the same. I rather just sit in an area for 3 hours and gain xp, questing folks prefer to run all over the place. mindless killing, mindless questing its all a grind! No matter how many time you say it isn't every action is just a repeat of the previous action.
side note, if it wasn't about getting to max level so quickly, why is it possible to roll to 80 in wow in a few days.
Maybe this is the situation just in games you play. Also you miss the another form of gaining levels grind quests. Solution of this can be : make the game skill based and make it fun.
In general its up to you to find the fun your self or choose the path of grind.
ADVICE: If you feel the game grindy and cannot think about anything you can change in the way you play the game that mean this game is not for you.
Where themepark games try to hide that they are copying WOW, games like Mortal Online and Darkfall make no attempt to hide their inspiration
______\m/_____
LordOfDarkDesire
If I find I'm playing a game with the sound off and the TV on, it usually means I'm just not that into it, certainly not enough to pay a monthly sub. And saying the grind is there to "weed out babies" is a pretty cheap shot, I call it not having enough content.