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New copy protection technology outrages gamers

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  • SabiancymSabiancym Member UncommonPosts: 3,150

    I will gladly admit to pirating PC games, and even a few console game.

     

    But, they are games that I would have never spent a dime on otherwise and never would have gotten to play.  Some games persuaded me enough to buy them (Fallout 3 is one big example) others not only got me to buy them, but kept me interested in the series (I pirated the original Mass Effect, beat it, bought it, and when ME2 was announced I pre-ordered a collectors edition).

     

    So I'm torn on the whole issue.  On one hand I think some people probably go too far and pirate every game and never buy one, but on the other hand games that may not have ever had a chance might have become reasonable successes due to people trying them out before hand.

  • JosherJosher Member Posts: 2,818

     Very aggravating for all of those who actually purchase games and believe in rewarding the effort it takes to entertain you for 8 hrs or 100 hrs.   Anyone who pirates should DIAF though.  Pure scum.  Its theft.  Just because its code and its in the safety of your little basement doesn't mean its any different than walking into a store and shoving a box under your shirt.  Its the same exact thing.   One day there will be a way to nail people in larger numbers and I'll LOL as they're being dragged away in handcuffs to go spend a little time with BUBBA in jail.  

    All this does is piss off the legit users.  The pirates are going to pirate no matter what.  The cracks will end up on torrent sites within days and all the little losers will brag about thier free games.  But the day the game doesn't work due to my connection or THEIR connection is the day they won't see a dime from me.  

  • sacredcow4sacredcow4 Member UncommonPosts: 249

    I hope to god UbiSoft is reading this thread.  Games like Assassin's Creed I will always buy on my playstation.  Games like FarCry I will now always pirate so I can play offline.  When the original FarCry came out on PC I purchased it with no hesitation.  One other friend did too.  Sure we passed the disks around at a lan so we could have a big assault tournament, but no one pirated the software.  If this "copy protection" was in place then we would have been sharing an ISO, not a game disk.

     I've been here a while...
  • RobsolfRobsolf Member RarePosts: 4,607
    Originally posted by Ichmen

    Originally posted by drbaltazar

    Originally posted by Robsolf

    Originally posted by alkarionlog



    only reason we don't want this is we don't want to be bound to a will of a 3rd party after I paid for something,



    This is my major issue with this.  I think it will encourage law abiding customers to find a crack for their legitimately purchased games, which makes them more vulnerable to viruses, which then in turn negatively effects us all.

    It's at odds with the American ideal of OWNERSHIP, which is, when I buy something, I OWN it.  I buy a cd, and it works until it breaks, which is determined by how I treat it.  Same with a car.  If I buy a game DVD and 3 months from now, their server goes offline and I can't play, there's a problem.

    If buying an Ubisoft game means I don't own it, I'm not gonna buy it.

    yep f2p has been having this same problem with american market!its like golum in the movie lotr

    ITS MINE ,MY OWN ,MY PRECIOUS!grin!

    they have stated on the UBIsoft website related to this issue, that IF they shut their service they will offer a patch that will allow you to run SP offline.... BUT i dont get why they dont offer that to begin with... offer online service and offline service. which inturn would lower the piracy/hacking of their game.

     

    less reason to get a hack for the cheat protection

     

    ...for those who haven't seen what promises are normally kept by a company when it goes bankrupt. Lemme give you a hint:  they keep NONE.  Let me give you another hint:

    If you or someone else files a lawsuit against the company for making the game unplayable, you will have to show up AT the trial to get compensation.  Ready to fly to <insert city here> to get your 59.99 back?  Hope you kept your receipt... also hope you read your ToS.

     

  • mklinicmklinic Member RarePosts: 2,014
    Originally posted by Robsolf
    If you or someone else files a lawsuit against the company for making the game unplayable, you will have to show up AT the trial to get compensation.  Ready to fly to <insert city here> to get your 59.99 back?  Hope you kept your receipt... also hope you read your ToS.

     

    Just for the sake of argument: Wouldn't a class action status, which would seem likely for something that would affect so many customers, effectively allow the attorney to represent the group of customers without them being physically present? 

    Aside from that, what good would a lawsuit be if a company went bankrupt? I mean, reminds of the saying about getting blood from a stone right? Perhaps it's still feasible, but sorta defies logic.

    -mklinic

    "Do something right, no one remembers.
    Do something wrong, no one forgets"
    -from No One Remembers by In Strict Confidence

  • RobsolfRobsolf Member RarePosts: 4,607
    Originally posted by mklinic

    Originally posted by Robsolf
    If you or someone else files a lawsuit against the company for making the game unplayable, you will have to show up AT the trial to get compensation.  Ready to fly to <insert city here> to get your 59.99 back?  Hope you kept your receipt... also hope you read your ToS.

     

    Just for the sake of argument: Wouldn't a class action status, which would seem likely for something that would affect so many customers, effectively allow the attorney to represent the group of customers without them being physically present? 

    Aside from that, what good would a lawsuit be if a company went bankrupt? I mean, reminds of the saying about getting blood from a stone right? Perhaps it's still feasible, but sorta defies logic.

     

    While my real life situation isn't the same, I think I can offer a pretty educated guess that... it's highly unlikely.

    In the 90's I was PART of a company that declared bankruptcy, and everything including the employees handbook indicated that I had every right to receive my vacation pay if I quit, the company folded, etc.  I was DENIED the right to take vacation time throughout my time there on a majority of the times I requested it. 

    That's bad enough.

    When the company went bankrupt, I COULD claim my vacation time, but the only way I could claim that vacation that I was denied was to travel to Stamford Connecticut and STAY there throughout the hearings.  Which, to no ones surprise, would cost far more than I would have received had I gotten my deserved cash settlement for the vacation I had EARNED.

    Now, if you think that a CONSUMER has more rights than an employee in a bankruptcy, you're either wrong, or you're right and that the labor system in America needs a SERIOUS GOING OVER...

     

  • cl0vercl0ver Member Posts: 122

    I always have internet where I live.

    FU UBISOFT@@!!!111!

    I dont pirate anything.  Im not gonna buy anymore of your bullshit games.  So in an attempt to earn my money, you have effectively  lost out on 1000 dollars.... a rough estimate of my video game purchases from you company over the course of my lifetime.

     

    Aint the free market a bitch?    I hope every honest consumer bans ubisoft and every pirate steals their games.

  • mklinicmklinic Member RarePosts: 2,014
    Originally posted by Robsolf


    Now, if you think that a CONSUMER has more rights than an employee in a bankruptcy, you're either wrong, or you're right and that the labor system in America needs a SERIOUS GOING OVER...


    Heh, well it goes without saying some serious review might be in order, but the scenraio you explained was a labor dispute and would nI'm not sure if that'd have class action status or not. My response was more about the idea that you (the customer) would need to show up at the court house if there were an issue. I believe that either a class action suit, or maybe even something like granting power of attorney for the proceeding, would get around that requirement.

    As my second paragraph pointed out, the viability of a lawsuit against a company that has no money might leave a bit to be desired.

    -mklinic

    "Do something right, no one remembers.
    Do something wrong, no one forgets"
    -from No One Remembers by In Strict Confidence

  • heartlessheartless Member UncommonPosts: 4,993

    I'm not a big fan of copy protection. It only serves to treat legitimate customers like criminals and imposes limitations on them. Ironically, pirates, who the copy protection is suppose to stop, don't have those issues because when the game is pirated, the release groups either remove, bypass or turn off the copy protection.

    Essentially the pirates are getting a much better product for free, while the rest of us have to deal with limited installs, online activations, CD-keys and root kits like Starforce.

    Ubisoft can keep Assassin's Creed 2. I will not support a company which treats legitimate customers like criminals. I'm sick and tired of jumping through hoops just to play games I paid for.

    image

  • heartlessheartless Member UncommonPosts: 4,993

    A little update on the new Ubisoft protection scheme. Silent Hunter 5, which uses the same protection as Assassin's Creed 2, has been cracked and released by group called SKIDROW.

    Epic DRM fail or a slap in the face of legitimate customers?

    image

  • bumfmanbumfman Member Posts: 276

    I have learned ( a long time ago ) that you cannot stop a thief from stealing, the verry best you can do is slow them down. But Ubisoft is overstepping logic in my oppinion. Its like they are taking the tires off of their car to keep it from being stolen instead of just locking the car and turning on an alarm. lol

    Just a thought that bounced around in my head when reading the posts.

    Work hard Play Harder

  • therain93therain93 Member UncommonPosts: 2,039

    So, less than 24 hours and apparently the DRM has been hacked out of Silent Hunter 5.

    http://www.computerandvideogames.com/article.php?id=237630

    Interestingly, Ubisoft claims that anyone using the crack won't have a complete version.  Sounds like they're suggesting some content is left on the servers.  I'm sure we'll know for sure soon enough ( ' ;

     

  • nickster29nickster29 Member Posts: 486

    This is actually a horrible way to try to prevent piracy, and I can already see a way around it...

    The game has to check with the Ubisoft's server constantly... so you just trick the game.  You make it believe that it is in contact with the Ubisoft server when it has actually just been rewritten to contact some file on the local machine.

    That, or find a way to disable the actual verification system.

     

    I am in no way promoting piracy, in fact, I look down on piracy quite seriously.  However, these measures only hurt the consumer who actually pays for the product.  Really, I have been more careful in my purchases lately... having felt VERY VERY burned lately, MW2 / Aion / Global Agenda (it is okay, but not worth the purchase price) / Mass Effect 2 (great fun... very short).  I can see how people might want to turn to piracy.  If you pirate a game to try it, and you enjoy it, purchase the game and support the developer and their employees.  If you do not enjoy it, delete it.

    Only games I have bought lately that actually FEEL like I spent my money well was Dragon Age and Battlefield: BC2.

    Oh, and I am never purchasing any single player games for Steam again.  >.>

  • WizardryWizardry Member LegendaryPosts: 19,332
    Originally posted by heartless


    A little update on the new Ubisoft protection scheme. Silent Hunter 5, which uses the same protection as Assassin's Creed 2, has been cracked and released by group called SKIDROW.
    Epic DRM fail or a slap in the face of legitimate customers?

    Another game was hacked as well,witch proves WHY they are so adamant about stopping people from cheating and stealing their games.It is not the fault of the developer,it is the fault of the abusers.Quite a long time ago ,probably the first to do it was Quake,you had to phone in,to get your product authenticated,this was 10-15 years ago,so there has been a huge problem with stealing for many years,about time someone is trying to stop them,more should do it.

    There should be way bigger penalties towards the hackers,the ramifications are huge,millions of dollars,and effects the player base in a huge way.Just the fact that so many are outraged,shows it is costing the developer even more money yet.

    One thing i might note,apparently the hacks are not complete,they will not play the game.This should not be about Ubisoft what so ever,it should be about the pathetic abusers who ruin it for everyone.

     

    Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.

  • therain93therain93 Member UncommonPosts: 2,039
    Originally posted by Wizardry

    Originally posted by heartless


    A little update on the new Ubisoft protection scheme. Silent Hunter 5, which uses the same protection as Assassin's Creed 2, has been cracked and released by group called SKIDROW.
    Epic DRM fail or a slap in the face of legitimate customers?

    Another game was hacked as well,witch proves WHY they are so adamant about stopping people from cheating and stealing their games.It is not the fault of the developer,it is the fault of the abusers.Quite a long time ago ,probably the first to do it was Quake,you had to phone in,to get your product authenticated,this was 10-15 years ago,so there has been a huge problem with stealing for many years,about time someone is trying to stop them,more should do it.

    There should be way bigger penalties towards the hackers,the ramifications are huge,millions of dollars,and effects the player base in a huge way.Just the fact that so many are outraged,shows it is costing the developer even more money yet.

    One thing i might note,apparently the hacks are not complete,they will not play the game.This should not be about Ubisoft what so ever,it should be about the pathetic abusers who ruin it for everyone.

     

    Hate to break it to you but, games were getting pirated about a decade before quake was around ( ' ;   BBS's were offering lots of games for download illegally.  Various types of copy protection were used back then including looking up information in a manual, special code wheels, and even special codes printed in colored ink that would only be revealed if you had the plastic sheet to screen out everything but the code.  Here's a fun read on it: http://www.vintagecomputing.com/index.php/archives/174

     

  • Thomas2006Thomas2006 Member RarePosts: 1,152
    Originally posted by Wizardry

    Originally posted by heartless


    A little update on the new Ubisoft protection scheme. Silent Hunter 5, which uses the same protection as Assassin's Creed 2, has been cracked and released by group called SKIDROW.
    Epic DRM fail or a slap in the face of legitimate customers?

    Another game was hacked as well,witch proves WHY they are so adamant about stopping people from cheating and stealing their games.It is not the fault of the developer,it is the fault of the abusers.Quite a long time ago ,probably the first to do it was Quake,you had to phone in,to get your product authenticated,this was 10-15 years ago,so there has been a huge problem with stealing for many years,about time someone is trying to stop them,more should do it.

    There should be way bigger penalties towards the hackers,the ramifications are huge,millions of dollars,and effects the player base in a huge way.Just the fact that so many are outraged,shows it is costing the developer even more money yet.

    One thing i might note,apparently the hacks are not complete,they will not play the game.This should not be about Ubisoft what so ever,it should be about the pathetic abusers who ruin it for everyone.

     

     

    If you believe Ubisoft's PR then they say its not complete.  But the truth is its the full 100% version of the game. Exactly the same as what comes on the DVD minus that you do not have to have a active connection to play the game with the crack.

    People like to come around and also certain parts of the industry likes to make claims that they are loseing millions each year to pirates.  When the truth of the matter is that some pirates where never going to buy the game to start with. It's simply a way for them to try out a game to see if it was any good. With the amount of CRAP that the industry turns out every year can you really blame them for wanting to try the game before they buy it?

    I also know a good number of pirates that will buy the games if they turn out to be good. If for nothing more then to support the development team and to have a backup copy of the game with packaging.

    But when it comes to DRM it doesn't matter WHAT the producers or developers do its going to be cracked. Heck they could require the game to be streamed to the computer as the player is playing the game and it will still be cracked and the people that crack the game will get a much better play experience.

    DRM like Ubisofts is only hurting there own customers at the end of the day. Let us make you require a active connection to the internet so we can save your games on our servers and we can send and receive ANY type of information we want with out always open internet connection to your computer.  Who's to say UBISoft isn't using this new DRM as a way to spy on you to see what kind of things you are doing on your computer?

    I have no issues buying games. Heck I buy atleast 1 or 2 games a week on a weekly basis. But I also crack 70% of them games simply because of stupid DRM that requires you to have a connection to the internet or a dvd to be in the drive or something else that is stupid and tends to break more things then it fix's.

    My advice to developers is stop wasteing MILLIONS of these stupid DRM systems that will NEVER work. Instead take them millions and spend them on improving said game instead. Make good quality games people want to play and you won't have as large of issues with pirates since they will be more then glad to buy the game and support you.  Show us you care about your games and not about your bottom line and we will show you the support you need.

  • Loke666Loke666 Member EpicPosts: 21,441

    Really idiotic thing, what if my line is down or I like to play the game on the train? It should be enough to jack in once a month at least if not just when you install it.

    For games you play online it is fine but for games like settlers it is just stupid. When I travel by train I usually have CIV or something on the computer.

    If CIV 5 used this kind of protection I would actually get a pirate version instead of buying it (a good game should always be bought to reward the devs for making it instead of something boring). No copy protection will stop pirates, it will just slow them down a few days.

  • mklinicmklinic Member RarePosts: 2,014
    Originally posted by drbaltazar

    the chance you hit a server down because of outage is almost nil

     

    You are totally right. I mean, what are the chances there would be a problem? Oh..wait:

    www.joystiq.com/2010/03/07/ubisoft-drm-authentification-server-is-down-assassins-creed-2/

    So now, not only has the DRM been cracked, but (from the article):

    "Ubisoft's DRM authentification servers have crashed, forcing some players to suffer lengthy login periods when booting up Assassin's Creed 2, and locking some folks out of the game entirely."

    I'm not pretending to be an expert, but this doesn't really seem to be paying off too well for them just yet...

     

    -mklinic

    "Do something right, no one remembers.
    Do something wrong, no one forgets"
    -from No One Remembers by In Strict Confidence

  • therain93therain93 Member UncommonPosts: 2,039

    Well, apparently hackers have taken a new tact.  not only has the game been hacked but now denial of service attacks are being made against the servers...thus causing no one to be able to play.  Now the protests get interesting.

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